Re: [Biofuel] 1 clear water pump
Todd posted a good reply to this question a few months ago. It's here: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/BIOFUEL/38094/ Date: 2004-09-03 From: Appal Energy Subject: Re: [biofuel] pump size Best wishes Keith I have a 1 clear water pump hooked up to an eighty gal hot water heater. I used all 1 plumbing for my manifold with 1 full port valves. The tank opening is still 3/4 but there should be ample pressure pushing the oil through the opening. How long should I have to run the processor to get full reaction? Thank you, Jeremy You're referring to this? Re: New method for the production of home made bio-diesel: snip I am building the Appleseed reactor and so far I have spent about $200 on lab gear (glass ware, pH meter, scale, etc.), and three steel 55 gal drums. Still looking for a suitable 50-60 gal water heater for which I will most likely spend $50 - $100 from a local used plumbing shop. If you have a recycled construction materials yard there that would likely be a good source for wood or steel for racks and frames as well as the plumbing supplies. I have decided to go new on the pump and vacuum pump since it would be difficult to determine the actual condition of used one. Beside, you may not know what it had been used for which might introduce contamination into your process Be aware that the 1 clear water pump usually recommended for these reactors is too small for that size water heater. Those pumps will handle at most a 25-gallon reactor. So you'll have to extend the processing time considerably to get a complete reaction, or use a bigger pump. Or at least try using the 1 clear water pump at its full 1 capacity, rather than stepping it down to 3/4, which will probably mean changing the fittings on the tank. Also be aware that the arrangements on these processors for draining the glycerine by-product do not achieve good separation and you're quite likely to get some glyc along with the biodiesel to be washed in the wash-tank, compounding the washing problems you'll have if the process isn't completed properly. So don't just blindly follow the instructions as it seems most people building these reactors do. Think about it yourself, figure it out, step by step. Best wishes Keith 80 gallons is definitely too big for that pump when it's fitted as recommended by the people who promote those processors, ie, stepped down to 3/4. I'd say it's also too big for it at 1, especially as you have a 3/4 inlet. I don't understand this: The tank opening is still 3/4 but there should be ample pressure pushing the oil through the opening. What's the difference between having the tank opening at 3/4 on the one hand, and having the pump itself stepped down to 3/4? Do you think giving the oil a head-start to build up some speed (and pressure?) in a length of 1 pipe will make any difference? I don't know (though I doubt it), I'm asking. How long should I have to run the processor to get full reaction? I don't think there's any formula that can tell you that, there are too many variables. For instance, we might tell you something that was correct for an 80-gallon tank using that pump that we happened to know of (though we don't), but if your tank had different dimensions (say short and fat rather than tall and thin) it probably wouldn't work. You'll have to find out by trial and error. Use these tests: Quality testing http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_vehicle.html#quality I'm not knocking the pump, by the way, we use one, for 60 litre batches, and it's great. I probably am knocking the people who recommended it for use with 200-litre tanks and more - and then kicked up huge unseemly smokescreens of denial and obfuscation when it was suggested here that it was too small for such a tank... only to admit it very blithely four months later on another list, as if it all the fuss they'd made here had never happened. Yuk. Too much ego, not enough of what makes people human, IMHO. Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] 1 clear water pump
as I understand it from talking to the plumbing folks even if you only have a 3/4 outlet you will still get a better flow rate on 1 plumbing (I made this mistake when upgrading the plumbing in my house). John Anti-Fossil wrote: Hello Jeremy, I am only asking this out of curiosity, but what was your reason for plumbing your system with 1 as opposed to 3/4 pipe? Is there some benefit to this set-up? Or was it a case of, I had 1 pipe, so that's what I used? AntiFossil Mike Krafka Minnesota USA - Original Message - From: Jeremy Tracy Longworth [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2005 10:49 PM Subject: [Biofuel] 1 clear water pump I have a 1 clear water pump hooked up to an eighty gal hot water heater. I used all 1 plumbing for my manifold with 1 full port valves. The tank opening is still 3/4 but there should be ample pressure pushing the oil through the opening. How long should I have to run the processor to get full reaction? Thank you, Jeremy ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] 1 clear water pump
What's the difference between having the tank opening at 3/4 on the one hand, and having the pump itself stepped down to 3/4? Do you think giving the oil a head-start to build up some speed (and pressure?) in a length of 1 pipe will make any difference? I don't know (though I doubt it), I'm asking. The difference is in the pressure drop along the length of pipe (50% difference). The 1 inch to 3/4 inch step down will create approximately the same pressure drop at the pump or the tank, but the friction in the pipe will change based on the size of the pipe and where it is. Andy On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 23:49:37 +0900, Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have a 1 clear water pump hooked up to an eighty gal hot water heater. I used all 1 plumbing for my manifold with 1 full port valves. The tank opening is still 3/4 but there should be ample pressure pushing the oil through the opening. How long should I have to run the processor to get full reaction? Thank you, Jeremy You're referring to this? Re: New method for the production of home made bio-diesel: snip I am building the Appleseed reactor and so far I have spent about $200 on lab gear (glass ware, pH meter, scale, etc.), and three steel 55 gal drums. Still looking for a suitable 50-60 gal water heater for which I will most likely spend $50 - $100 from a local used plumbing shop. If you have a recycled construction materials yard there that would likely be a good source for wood or steel for racks and frames as well as the plumbing supplies. I have decided to go new on the pump and vacuum pump since it would be difficult to determine the actual condition of used one. Beside, you may not know what it had been used for which might introduce contamination into your process Be aware that the 1 clear water pump usually recommended for these reactors is too small for that size water heater. Those pumps will handle at most a 25-gallon reactor. So you'll have to extend the processing time considerably to get a complete reaction, or use a bigger pump. Or at least try using the 1 clear water pump at its full 1 capacity, rather than stepping it down to 3/4, which will probably mean changing the fittings on the tank. Also be aware that the arrangements on these processors for draining the glycerine by-product do not achieve good separation and you're quite likely to get some glyc along with the biodiesel to be washed in the wash-tank, compounding the washing problems you'll have if the process isn't completed properly. So don't just blindly follow the instructions as it seems most people building these reactors do. Think about it yourself, figure it out, step by step. Best wishes Keith 80 gallons is definitely too big for that pump when it's fitted as recommended by the people who promote those processors, ie, stepped down to 3/4. I'd say it's also too big for it at 1, especially as you have a 3/4 inlet. I don't understand this: The tank opening is still 3/4 but there should be ample pressure pushing the oil through the opening. What's the difference between having the tank opening at 3/4 on the one hand, and having the pump itself stepped down to 3/4? Do you think giving the oil a head-start to build up some speed (and pressure?) in a length of 1 pipe will make any difference? I don't know (though I doubt it), I'm asking. How long should I have to run the processor to get full reaction? I don't think there's any formula that can tell you that, there are too many variables. For instance, we might tell you something that was correct for an 80-gallon tank using that pump that we happened to know of (though we don't), but if your tank had different dimensions (say short and fat rather than tall and thin) it probably wouldn't work. You'll have to find out by trial and error. Use these tests: Quality testing http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_vehicle.html#quality I'm not knocking the pump, by the way, we use one, for 60 litre batches, and it's great. I probably am knocking the people who recommended it for use with 200-litre tanks and more - and then kicked up huge unseemly smokescreens of denial and obfuscation when it was suggested here that it was too small for such a tank... only to admit it very blithely four months later on another list, as if it all the fuss they'd made here had never happened. Yuk. Too much ego, not enough of what makes people human, IMHO. Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
[Biofuel] 1 clear water pump
I have a 1 clear water pump hooked up to an eighty gal hot water heater. I used all 1 plumbing for my manifold with 1 full port valves. The tank opening is still 3/4 but there should be ample pressure pushing the oil through the opening. How long should I have to run the processor to get full reaction? Thank you, Jeremy ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] 1 clear water pump
Hello Jeremy, I am only asking this out of curiosity, but what was your reason for plumbing your system with 1 as opposed to 3/4 pipe? Is there some benefit to this set-up? Or was it a case of, I had 1 pipe, so that's what I used? AntiFossil Mike Krafka Minnesota USA - Original Message - From: Jeremy Tracy Longworth [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2005 10:49 PM Subject: [Biofuel] 1 clear water pump I have a 1 clear water pump hooked up to an eighty gal hot water heater. I used all 1 plumbing for my manifold with 1 full port valves. The tank opening is still 3/4 but there should be ample pressure pushing the oil through the opening. How long should I have to run the processor to get full reaction? Thank you, Jeremy ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
[Biofuel] 1 clear water pump
AntiFossil wrote, I am only asking this out of curiosity, but what was your reason for plumbing your system with 1 as opposed to 3/4 pipe? Is there some benefit to this set-up? Or was it a case of, I had 1 pipe, so that's what I used? AntiFossil I went with 1 pipe manifold because the pump was designed to be plumbed with 1 pipe. Reducing the size to 3/4 restricts the flow making the pump work harder to move the fluid. There are only 3 places where the fluid is restricted, 1. coming out of the tank 2. coming out of the pump I reduced to a 3/4 nipple which works as a king nipple to hook up to 1 ID clear mesh tubing(site tube). 3. Then back to 3/4 and 90's into tank. Jeremy ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] 1 clear water pump
That will depend upon how many gallons you put in your 80 gallon tank. Start at 24 hours and work your way backward or forward from there. - Original Message - From: Jeremy Tracy Longworth [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2005 11:49 PM Subject: [Biofuel] 1 clear water pump I have a 1 clear water pump hooked up to an eighty gal hot water heater. I used all 1 plumbing for my manifold with 1 full port valves. The tank opening is still 3/4 but there should be ample pressure pushing the oil through the opening. How long should I have to run the processor to get full reaction? Thank you, Jeremy ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] 1 clear water pump
I used all 1 plumbing for my manifold with 1 full port valves. The tank opening is still 3/4 but there should be ample pressure pushing the oil through the opening. How long should I have to run the processor to get full reaction? Thank you, Jeremy You're referring to this? Re: New method for the production of home made bio-diesel: snip I am building the Appleseed reactor and so far I have spent about $200 on lab gear (glass ware, pH meter, scale, etc.), and three steel 55 gal drums. Still looking for a suitable 50-60 gal water heater for which I will most likely spend $50 - $100 from a local used plumbing shop. If you have a recycled construction materials yard there that would likely be a good source for wood or steel for racks and frames as well as the plumbing supplies. I have decided to go new on the pump and vacuum pump since it would be difficult to determine the actual condition of used one. Beside, you may not know what it had been used for which might introduce contamination into your process Be aware that the 1 clear water pump usually recommended for these reactors is too small for that size water heater. Those pumps will handle at most a 25-gallon reactor. So you'll have to extend the processing time considerably to get a complete reaction, or use a bigger pump. Or at least try using the 1 clear water pump at its full 1 capacity, rather than stepping it down to 3/4, which will probably mean changing the fittings on the tank. Also be aware that the arrangements on these processors for draining the glycerine by-product do not achieve good separation and you're quite likely to get some glyc along with the biodiesel to be washed in the wash-tank, compounding the washing problems you'll have if the process isn't completed properly. So don't just blindly follow the instructions as it seems most people building these reactors do. Think about it yourself, figure it out, step by step. Best wishes Keith 80 gallons is definitely too big for that pump when it's fitted as recommended by the people who promote those processors, ie, stepped down to 3/4. I'd say it's also too big for it at 1, especially as you have a 3/4 inlet. I don't understand this: The tank opening is still 3/4 but there should be ample pressure pushing the oil through the opening. What's the difference between having the tank opening at 3/4 on the one hand, and having the pump itself stepped down to 3/4? Do you think giving the oil a head-start to build up some speed (and pressure?) in a length of 1 pipe will make any difference? I don't know (though I doubt it), I'm asking. How long should I have to run the processor to get full reaction? I don't think there's any formula that can tell you that, there are too many variables. For instance, we might tell you something that was correct for an 80-gallon tank using that pump that we happened to know of (though we don't), but if your tank had different dimensions (say short and fat rather than tall and thin) it probably wouldn't work. You'll have to find out by trial and error. Use these tests: Quality testing http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_vehicle.html#quality I'm not knocking the pump, by the way, we use one, for 60 litre batches, and it's great. I probably am knocking the people who recommended it for use with 200-litre tanks and more - and then kicked up huge unseemly smokescreens of denial and obfuscation when it was suggested here that it was too small for such a tank... only to admit it very blithely four months later on another list, as if it all the fuss they'd made here had never happened. Yuk. Too much ego, not enough of what makes people human, IMHO. Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
