[biofuel] Re: Residual oil in BD.
Re: Paper Chromatography. Are there specific disclosure solutions for the glycerol, Esters and oil? I remember(many years ago) spraying an essentially invisible separation of esters/oil with some compound that disclosed the bands. Can't find a basic text book when you want one!! Regards Harry --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Aleksander lt;kac [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't really think this is true. Using 200ml methanol per liter of WVO is about a 60% molar excess (that is, 60% more methanol than is actually consumed in the transesterification). The excess helps to shift equilibrium in the desired direction, and I think we can expect something like 95% completion. Right. Combined processes need a little less meth, but still a 50% excess. When you start cheating on the methanol is when you start seeing more unconverted oil in the BD -- viscosity will be measurably higher as a result. -K You can observe your volumetric yield. With the right quantities of alcohol and catalyst the 95+ % conversion will give 100 to 103% volum. yield (measured at the same temp). The mass of the ester is actually somewhat lower and the volume is 3% higher, which should give at least 10% lower specific gravity (oil/fat vs. ester). Oh, and you can determine unreacted triglycs by chromatography. Titration isn't reliable. Cheers, Aleks Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Please do NOT send unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Re: Residual oil in BD.
Titration is working now, (batch 1) alkali only 10% oil (batch 2)acid then alkali 20% oil. Got the centrifuge working--no separation from batch 1---looks like good whisky. Batch 2 gave a solid deposit ~1/5th by volume liquid clear but dark. Tried the titration from the BD on the very top after 15min at 3500rpm--still came back 8%. Is this a zero error or is the oil/BD so well dissolved that the centrifuge does not separate them? Currently distilling 100mls from batch 1. Intend to titrate what should be pure BD. let you know!! Harry --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK What I intend is to attempt to : 1) Use bicarb soda to neutralise the acidic BD prior to titration. Hopefully this will give me a constant starting point PH wise. 2) Seperate about 5gms of both BD and Source oil (palm) by paper chromatography, ether extract fractions and weigh. Should give a standard oil residue to calibrate my titration. Where will the glycerol end up? I'll let you know!! 3) Boil off esters and weigh remainder. ( oil glycerol?) Bit of running around to do first, its 9.47 here I may get to it about 15.00. Thanks for the comments. Regards Harry. --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Ken Provost [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At best the reaction conditions we are using convert only a fraction of the WVO to ester. ( Configure the ammount of methanol into the equation for the reaction and you will see what I mean). The reaction involves equilibrium and as with a lot of organic chemistry reactions is not as straightforward as an inorganic reaction. So we can't just add more methanol and expect more ester. I don't really think this is true. Using 200ml methanol per liter of WVO is about a 60% molar excess (that is, 60% more methanol than is actually consumed in the transesterification). The excess helps to shift equilibrium in the desired direction, and I think we can expect something like 95% completion. When you start cheating on the methanol is when you start seeing more unconverted oil in the BD -- viscosity will be measurably higher as a result. -K Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Please do NOT send unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Re: Residual oil in BD.
OK What I intend is to attempt to : 1) Use bicarb soda to neutralise the acidic BD prior to titration. Hopefully this will give me a constant starting point PH wise. 2) Seperate about 5gms of both BD and Source oil (palm) by paper chromatography, ether extract fractions and weigh. Should give a standard oil residue to calibrate my titration. Where will the glycerol end up? I'll let you know!! 3) Boil off esters and weigh remainder. ( oil glycerol?) Bit of running around to do first, its 9.47 here I may get to it about 15.00. Thanks for the comments. Regards Harry. --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Ken Provost [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At best the reaction conditions we are using convert only a fraction of the WVO to ester. ( Configure the ammount of methanol into the equation for the reaction and you will see what I mean). The reaction involves equilibrium and as with a lot of organic chemistry reactions is not as straightforward as an inorganic reaction. So we can't just add more methanol and expect more ester. I don't really think this is true. Using 200ml methanol per liter of WVO is about a 60% molar excess (that is, 60% more methanol than is actually consumed in the transesterification). The excess helps to shift equilibrium in the desired direction, and I think we can expect something like 95% completion. When you start cheating on the methanol is when you start seeing more unconverted oil in the BD -- viscosity will be measurably higher as a result. -K Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Please do NOT send unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Re: Residual oil in BD.
I don't really think this is true. Using 200ml methanol per liter of WVO is about a 60% molar excess (that is, 60% more methanol than is actually consumed in the transesterification). The excess helps to shift equilibrium in the desired direction, and I think we can expect something like 95% completion. Right. Combined processes need a little less meth, but still a 50% excess. When you start cheating on the methanol is when you start seeing more unconverted oil in the BD -- viscosity will be measurably higher as a result. -K You can observe your volumetric yield. With the right quantities of alcohol and catalyst the 95+ % conversion will give 100 to 103% volum. yield (measured at the same temp). The mass of the ester is actually somewhat lower and the volume is 3% higher, which should give at least 10% lower specific gravity (oil/fat vs. ester). Oh, and you can determine unreacted triglycs by chromatography. Titration isn't reliable. Cheers, Aleks Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Please do NOT send unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
