Re: Distilling fuel ethanol - was Re: [biofuel] Tallow
Kirk, Very true. Yeast when first introduced to the wash where there is plenty of starch go into a breeding pattern until the oxygen is used up at which point they start producing ethanol and then dying as their numbers outgrow the food supply. This is why the amount of yeast introduced into a wash is important and should be sufficiently large enough so they quickly dominate. B.r., David - Original Message - From: kirk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Friday, May 18, 2001 4:04 AM Subject: RE: Distilling fuel ethanol - was Re: [biofuel] Tallow > A big difference in yeast bodies/ethanol yield ratio can be made by accurate > counts of innoculant. The organism has a replication time and you would like > the food used up just before a statistical replication if ethanol is the > objective rather than yeast bodies. > I read this probably 25 years ago in a book with the words Industrial > Alcohol in the title. The author had a Scottish name. Original publication > was pre 1920. Book was not available for loan. The library was the Millikan > Library on campus at CalTech. Thats all the info I can give except if memory > serves he said doing it properly could affect yeast bodies by a doubling and > that is a lot of lost ethanol. A microscope would be needed so you could > quantify your innoculant. Accurate temperature control is vital. Any biology > majors on this list? I'm electronics. > > Kirk Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: Distilling fuel ethanol - was Re: [biofuel] Tallow
A big difference in yeast bodies/ethanol yield ratio can be made by accurate counts of innoculant. The organism has a replication time and you would like the food used up just before a statistical replication if ethanol is the objective rather than yeast bodies. I read this probably 25 years ago in a book with the words Industrial Alcohol in the title. The author had a Scottish name. Original publication was pre 1920. Book was not available for loan. The library was the Millikan Library on campus at CalTech. Thats all the info I can give except if memory serves he said doing it properly could affect yeast bodies by a doubling and that is a lot of lost ethanol. A microscope would be needed so you could quantify your innoculant. Accurate temperature control is vital. Any biology majors on this list? I'm electronics. Kirk -Original Message- From: David Reid [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2001 5:04 AM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Distilling fuel ethanol - was Re: [biofuel] Tallow Ron, What you need to do is work out how much fuel you are going to use in a year and how much each month. Once you know this you can then work out how you are going to produce this. You then need to know how much time you are prepared to devote to distillation at anyone hit. Once you know this you can roughly work out how you are going to achieve this and what size still you require. What you will also need to figure out is what you are going to use for your fermentation stock and what you are going to use for the heat energy source for the distillation. Work these all out and get back to me and I will try to give you a hand. What you will need is probably a 3 or 4" column diameter still but before I can advise any further I need as much detail as possible. Also how are you going to ferment the fermentation stock and what size tanks are you going to use? If distilling for this amount of vehicles you will probably need a BATF permit. It generally tends to pay to stay on the right side of the law. B.r., David - Original Message - From: ronald miller sr <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2001 4:23 PM Subject: Re: Distilling fuel ethanol - was Re: [biofuel] Tallow > Thanks for your letter. I'm still trying to find the right size design for > what I have in mind. Maybe I've been thinking to small as to still size. I > have a 1993 corvette, a 2000 Isuzu Rodeo, a 1972 chevy chevelle, a > mitsubishi mirage, a riding lawn mower and a push mower. I'm paying US > $29.00 every 10 days for the corvette gasoline(petrol?), the chevelle eats > gas likes crazy, the rodeo and the mitsubishi aren't to bad but still use > fuel. (we have a big family) I would like to make enough ethanol to run the > family fleet but have no idea how large to make my still. Any hints would be > greatly appreciated as I know you are getting into the still business. If > there is someone who has good plans for the size still I need please let me > know. > Thanks to all, > Ron Miller Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.252 / Virus Database: 125 - Release Date: 5/9/2001 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.252 / Virus Database: 125 - Release Date: 5/9/2001 Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: Distilling fuel ethanol - was Re: [biofuel] Tallow
Ron, What you need to do is work out how much fuel you are going to use in a year and how much each month. Once you know this you can then work out how you are going to produce this. You then need to know how much time you are prepared to devote to distillation at anyone hit. Once you know this you can roughly work out how you are going to achieve this and what size still you require. What you will also need to figure out is what you are going to use for your fermentation stock and what you are going to use for the heat energy source for the distillation. Work these all out and get back to me and I will try to give you a hand. What you will need is probably a 3 or 4" column diameter still but before I can advise any further I need as much detail as possible. Also how are you going to ferment the fermentation stock and what size tanks are you going to use? If distilling for this amount of vehicles you will probably need a BATF permit. It generally tends to pay to stay on the right side of the law. B.r., David - Original Message - From: ronald miller sr <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2001 4:23 PM Subject: Re: Distilling fuel ethanol - was Re: [biofuel] Tallow > Thanks for your letter. I'm still trying to find the right size design for > what I have in mind. Maybe I've been thinking to small as to still size. I > have a 1993 corvette, a 2000 Isuzu Rodeo, a 1972 chevy chevelle, a > mitsubishi mirage, a riding lawn mower and a push mower. I'm paying US > $29.00 every 10 days for the corvette gasoline(petrol?), the chevelle eats > gas likes crazy, the rodeo and the mitsubishi aren't to bad but still use > fuel. (we have a big family) I would like to make enough ethanol to run the > family fleet but have no idea how large to make my still. Any hints would be > greatly appreciated as I know you are getting into the still business. If > there is someone who has good plans for the size still I need please let me > know. > Thanks to all, > Ron Miller Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: Distilling fuel ethanol - was Re: [biofuel] Tallow
Thanks for your letter. I'm still trying to find the right size design for what I have in mind. Maybe I've been thinking to small as to still size. I have a 1993 corvette, a 2000 Isuzu Rodeo, a 1972 chevy chevelle, a mitsubishi mirage, a riding lawn mower and a push mower. I'm paying US $29.00 every 10 days for the corvette gasoline(petrol?), the chevelle eats gas likes crazy, the rodeo and the mitsubishi aren't to bad but still use fuel. (we have a big family) I would like to make enough ethanol to run the family fleet but have no idea how large to make my still. Any hints would be greatly appreciated as I know you are getting into the still business. If there is someone who has good plans for the size still I need please let me know. Thanks to all, Ron Miller - Original Message - From: David Reid <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2001 3:27 PM Subject: Re: Distilling fuel ethanol - was Re: [biofuel] Tallow > Hi Ron, Keith, Steve, Aleks, et al, > At present I believe I > have solved a number of problems associated with small fuel ethanol stills, > and was about to bring a range of small stills out at the start of the year, > after spending the previous 18 months working almost full time on them in > between caring for my mother. I was hoping that these small stills would > help pay for further developments to get some of the slightly bigger still > experimental work finished and to a useable stage but have got somewhat > diverted with these by-pass oil and fuel filters which I see as a worthwhile > venture in their own right, whose use I would most definitely like to see > spread and become commonplace, and with trying to solve the distillation and > purification of glycerine, a by-product which widespread production and > purification to a reasonably high level would certainly help with the > manufacture and cost of biodiesel. Unfortunately the envolvement with the > by-pass filters has meant I need to concentrate on that at this stage as it > is taking every penny I have to keep it going with the result that work on > the stills has come to a grinding halt in the meantime. At present I could > get back and shortly intend to get back on to the production of stills but > really need about $20,000 to $30,000 to get them up and running. If there is > someone out there who is prepared to put up that sort of money in return for > a reasonable return on their money I am prepared to get back onto them but > in the meantime I need to pursue the course I have adopted. At this stage I > have thrown a lot of money at both projects although far more at the still > one and would eventually like to see a return on my money while at the same > time seeing these benefit people. Having spent the last 11 1/2 years of my > life looking after my folks I dont want to be in the same boat when it comes > to my old age. The plans are therefore not for sale but I hope it will not > be long before I get stills to market. > Ron if you are getting involved with ethanol production I would advise you > against involvement with a lot of the small alcohol stills out there for the > home distillation market as the majority of them were designed by people who > only have a limited knowledge of distillation with grossly inferior stills > resulting. (not to say that good quality stills will not come out of this > area eventually). Talk about Cowboys International. (probably not a good > thing to say to someone living in the States as I am sure there are many > hardworking, honest, and good cowboys there. In this part of the world the > word cowboy applied in this sense means something totally different: like > someone who is as rough as guts, takes no pride in his work, and in short is > a rip off artist). I suggest you download the two books Keith has on his > site and thoroughly read them. You will learn a lot from them in terms of > the basics. I would also search your local large city library with the help > of a good librarian who knows what she is doing. It is amazing what they can > turn up. They can also source books from other libraries. One good source > worth looking in is your local university Engineering School Dept. > B.r., David > > > > >Hi Hans, I'm From the US and would like info on who has the best still > > >design. I plan on building my own using stainless steel. I also want to > know > > >who has the best performing distillers yeast. I am planning on making > fuel > > >for my automobile and lawn equipment. So far I have downloaded The Home > > >Distillation Handbook " By Gert Strand. It's really good but lacks good > > >plans for a still. If you have any good info please let me know. I need > go
Re: Distilling fuel ethanol - was Re: [biofuel] Tallow
Hi Ron, Keith, Steve, Aleks, et al, At present I believe I have solved a number of problems associated with small fuel ethanol stills, and was about to bring a range of small stills out at the start of the year, after spending the previous 18 months working almost full time on them in between caring for my mother. I was hoping that these small stills would help pay for further developments to get some of the slightly bigger still experimental work finished and to a useable stage but have got somewhat diverted with these by-pass oil and fuel filters which I see as a worthwhile venture in their own right, whose use I would most definitely like to see spread and become commonplace, and with trying to solve the distillation and purification of glycerine, a by-product which widespread production and purification to a reasonably high level would certainly help with the manufacture and cost of biodiesel. Unfortunately the envolvement with the by-pass filters has meant I need to concentrate on that at this stage as it is taking every penny I have to keep it going with the result that work on the stills has come to a grinding halt in the meantime. At present I could get back and shortly intend to get back on to the production of stills but really need about $20,000 to $30,000 to get them up and running. If there is someone out there who is prepared to put up that sort of money in return for a reasonable return on their money I am prepared to get back onto them but in the meantime I need to pursue the course I have adopted. At this stage I have thrown a lot of money at both projects although far more at the still one and would eventually like to see a return on my money while at the same time seeing these benefit people. Having spent the last 11 1/2 years of my life looking after my folks I dont want to be in the same boat when it comes to my old age. The plans are therefore not for sale but I hope it will not be long before I get stills to market. Ron if you are getting involved with ethanol production I would advise you against involvement with a lot of the small alcohol stills out there for the home distillation market as the majority of them were designed by people who only have a limited knowledge of distillation with grossly inferior stills resulting. (not to say that good quality stills will not come out of this area eventually). Talk about Cowboys International. (probably not a good thing to say to someone living in the States as I am sure there are many hardworking, honest, and good cowboys there. In this part of the world the word cowboy applied in this sense means something totally different: like someone who is as rough as guts, takes no pride in his work, and in short is a rip off artist). I suggest you download the two books Keith has on his site and thoroughly read them. You will learn a lot from them in terms of the basics. I would also search your local large city library with the help of a good librarian who knows what she is doing. It is amazing what they can turn up. They can also source books from other libraries. One good source worth looking in is your local university Engineering School Dept. B.r., David > >Hi Hans, I'm From the US and would like info on who has the best still > >design. I plan on building my own using stainless steel. I also want to know > >who has the best performing distillers yeast. I am planning on making fuel > >for my automobile and lawn equipment. So far I have downloaded The Home > >Distillation Handbook " By Gert Strand. It's really good but lacks good > >plans for a still. If you have any good info please let me know. I need good > >details for construction purposes. > >Thanks, > >Ron Miller > >Mobile , Alabama > > Hello Ron > > The Home Distillation Handbook is really for drinkers more than > fuellers. You should do better with these (both full-text online, > free access): > > Mother Earth Alcohol Fuel > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/ethanol_motherearth/meToC.html > > The Manual for the Home and Farm Production of Alcohol Fuel > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/ethanol_manual/manual_ToC.html > > There's currently a shortage of a good fuel alcohol still, sorry to > say. The stills on offer are mostly for drink production and are too > small. But we're working on it and should have some results soon. > > Best wishes > > Keith Addison > Journey to Forever > Handmade Projects > Tokyo > http://journeytoforever.org/ > > > > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > To unsubscribe, send an email to: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Distilling fuel ethanol - was Re: [biofuel] Tallow
>Hi Hans, I'm From the US and would like info on who has the best still >design. I plan on building my own using stainless steel. I also want to know >who has the best performing distillers yeast. I am planning on making fuel >for my automobile and lawn equipment. So far I have downloaded The Home >Distillation Handbook " By Gert Strand. It's really good but lacks good >plans for a still. If you have any good info please let me know. I need good >details for construction purposes. >Thanks, >Ron Miller >Mobile , Alabama Hello Ron The Home Distillation Handbook is really for drinkers more than fuellers. You should do better with these (both full-text online, free access): Mother Earth Alcohol Fuel http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/ethanol_motherearth/meToC.html The Manual for the Home and Farm Production of Alcohol Fuel http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_library/ethanol_manual/manual_ToC.html There's currently a shortage of a good fuel alcohol still, sorry to say. The stills on offer are mostly for drink production and are too small. But we're working on it and should have some results soon. Best wishes Keith Addison Journey to Forever Handmade Projects Tokyo http://journeytoforever.org/ Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
