Re: svn commit: r225937 - in head: . release release/amd64 release/i386 release/ia64 release/pc98 release/powerpc release/scripts release/sparc64 usr.sbin usr.sbin/sysinstall

2011-10-05 Thread Nathan Whitehorn 

On 10/04/11 23:02, Craig Rodrigues wrote:

Nathan,

I took at look at this page:

http://wiki.pcbsd.org/index.php/Creating_an_Automated_Installation_with_pc-sysinstall

and compared it to the man page for sysinstall:

http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=sysinstall&apropos=0&sektion=0&manpath=FreeBSD+8.2-RELEASE&arch=default&format=html


pc-sysinstall pretty much does all of the same stuff as sysinstall,
and even many of the variable names are the same.  pc-sysinstall
seems far superior to sysinstall.

In the timeframe before 10.0, do you think it is worth doing the following:

(1)  import pc-sysinstall into FreeBSD
(2)  make pc-sysinstall compatible with all the variables from the

*or* if it is not worth doing (2)

(3)  provide a document somewhere that guides users in migrating their
   old install.cfg syntax to pc-sysinstall (or bsdinstall).

bsdinstall and pc-sysinstall are really good improvements!


pc-sysinstall is already part of FreeBSD, and will be part of the 9.0 
release. A manual for migration would probably be a good idea.

-Nathan
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Re: svn commit: r225937 - in head: . release release/amd64 release/i386 release/ia64 release/pc98 release/powerpc release/scripts release/sparc64 usr.sbin usr.sbin/sysinstall

2011-10-04 Thread Craig Rodrigues 
Nathan,

I took at look at this page:

http://wiki.pcbsd.org/index.php/Creating_an_Automated_Installation_with_pc-sysinstall

and compared it to the man page for sysinstall:

http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=sysinstall&apropos=0&sektion=0&manpath=FreeBSD+8.2-RELEASE&arch=default&format=html


pc-sysinstall pretty much does all of the same stuff as sysinstall,
and even many of the variable names are the same.  pc-sysinstall
seems far superior to sysinstall.

In the timeframe before 10.0, do you think it is worth doing the following:

(1)  import pc-sysinstall into FreeBSD
(2)  make pc-sysinstall compatible with all the variables from the

*or* if it is not worth doing (2)

(3)  provide a document somewhere that guides users in migrating their
  old install.cfg syntax to pc-sysinstall (or bsdinstall).

bsdinstall and pc-sysinstall are really good improvements!
-- 
Craig Rodrigues
rodr...@crodrigues.org
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Re: svn commit: r225937 - in head: . release release/amd64 release/i386 release/ia64 release/pc98 release/powerpc release/scripts release/sparc64 usr.sbin usr.sbin/sysinstall

2011-10-04 Thread Doug Barton 
On 10/03/2011 16:32, Craig Rodrigues wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> If pc-sysinstall can be a drop-in replacement for sysinstall in
> "SCRIPT SYNTAX" mode, even better.  sysinstall needs to go...
> while people do use it, it has a lot of problems that aren't getting fixed,
> and it is clear that bsdinstall is the future for FreeBSD installation.

My initial point was not about installation, it was about
post-installation configuration. We don't have a new tool for that yet.

> Nathan is doing a good thing by forcing the issue by removing
> itthere is too much brokenness in sysinstall that is not getting
> fixed, and the sooner we can move to
> bsdinstall/pc-sysinstall, the better.
> 
> Since the sysinstall removal is happening only in HEAD/10.0, we have
> some time to fix the issues before 10.0 is released.

Sorry, that's backwards. Garrett was right.

I'll have no objection to sysinstall being gone in 10.0-RELEASE after
it's lived with the deprecated tag in 9.x, but the new functionality
needs to be feature complete first. And for the record, yes I am aware
that this problem is why sysinstall has lived so long in the first place.

I should also point out for the record that I don't see anything
malicious in Nathan's actions, my only concern is that they are premature.


Doug

-- 

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Re: svn commit: r225937 - in head: . release release/amd64 release/i386 release/ia64 release/pc98 release/powerpc release/scripts release/sparc64 usr.sbin usr.sbin/sysinstall

2011-10-04 Thread Nathan Whitehorn 

On 10/03/11 20:35, Daniel O'Connor wrote:

On 04/10/2011, at 8:41, Craig Rodrigues wrote:

Can bsdinstall be used as a drop-in replacement for
sysinstall when run with the "SCRIPT SYNTAX" batch mode?
If not, how much code would need to be added to bsdinstall?  Or, is there
some other utility, such as something from the PC-BSD suite of scripts,
that can be used as a drop-in replacement for sysinstall in "SCRIPT
SYNTAX" mode?

No it can't, but speaking as someone who used this feature in sysinstall… Good 
riddance :)

I wrote a shell script which does an install itself (i.e. no bsdinstall - which 
is just [mostly] a shell script).

It is 200 lines, a fair chunk of which is pre-canned stuff to go into rc.conf, 
loader.conf, etc..

http://www.gsoft.com.au/~doconnor/install-os.sh

I also modified the rc.local script the installer uses to add an option to call 
my script.



Although pc-sysinstall is probably the [much] better choice for 
scripting, there are facilities in bsdinstall to help writing of custom 
installers like this, and the regular installer is in fact an example of 
a scripted install. There's some more information in bsdinstall(8) for 
the curious.

-Nathan
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Re: svn commit: r225937 - in head: . release release/amd64 release/i386 release/ia64 release/pc98 release/powerpc release/scripts release/sparc64 usr.sbin usr.sbin/sysinstall

2011-10-04 Thread Daniel O'Connor 

On 04/10/2011, at 17:09, Craig Rodrigues wrote:
> However, I have seen at least two places which have written 
> Jumpstart/Kickstart
> based installers based on sysinstall.  This use case is not uncommon.
> For example, using an install.cfg was documented here, and people
> have followed it:
> http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/articles/pxe/article.html
> 
> 
> If in the 10.0 timeframe, if we can provide something (bsdinstall,
> pc-sysinstall, whatever) that has some compatibility with the old
> sysinstall scripted syntax, that would be nice for users who have
> built installers based on this stuff.
> 

I suspect this would be problematic because bsdinstall is architected 
differently to sysinstall and the later's scripting is based on calling various 
C functions :(

Also things like dist names are different..

Don't let me stop you writing it though ;)

--
Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer
for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au
"The nice thing about standards is that there
are so many of them to choose from."
  -- Andrew Tanenbaum
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Re: svn commit: r225937 - in head: . release release/amd64 release/i386 release/ia64 release/pc98 release/powerpc release/scripts release/sparc64 usr.sbin usr.sbin/sysinstall

2011-10-03 Thread Craig Rodrigues 
On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 6:35 PM, Daniel O'Connor  wrote:
>
> No it can't, but speaking as someone who used this feature in sysinstall… 
> Good riddance :)
>
> I wrote a shell script which does an install itself (i.e. no bsdinstall - 
> which is just [mostly] a shell script).
>
> It is 200 lines, a fair chunk of which is pre-canned stuff to go into 
> rc.conf, loader.conf, etc..
>
> http://www.gsoft.com.au/~doconnor/install-os.sh
>
> I also modified the rc.local script the installer uses to add an option to 
> call my script.

Hi,

Indeed, I have written my own Bourne shell based installers
for FreeBSD in two different companies I have worked for.
The path you went down to do this is not uncommon.many
people walk down the same path to write in their own installer in
shell scripts, and the results are often better than sysinstall.

However, I have seen at least two places which have written Jumpstart/Kickstart
based installers based on sysinstall.  This use case is not uncommon.
For example, using an install.cfg was documented here, and people
have followed it:
http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en/articles/pxe/article.html


If in the 10.0 timeframe, if we can provide something (bsdinstall,
pc-sysinstall, whatever) that has some compatibility with the old
sysinstall scripted syntax, that would be nice for users who have
built installers based on this stuff.

-- 
Craig Rodrigues
rodr...@crodrigues.org
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Re: svn commit: r225937 - in head: . release release/amd64 release/i386 release/ia64 release/pc98 release/powerpc release/scripts release/sparc64 usr.sbin usr.sbin/sysinstall

2011-10-03 Thread Daniel O'Connor 

On 04/10/2011, at 8:41, Craig Rodrigues wrote:
> Can bsdinstall be used as a drop-in replacement for
> sysinstall when run with the "SCRIPT SYNTAX" batch mode?
> If not, how much code would need to be added to bsdinstall?  Or, is there
> some other utility, such as something from the PC-BSD suite of scripts,
> that can be used as a drop-in replacement for sysinstall in "SCRIPT
> SYNTAX" mode?

No it can't, but speaking as someone who used this feature in sysinstall… Good 
riddance :)

I wrote a shell script which does an install itself (i.e. no bsdinstall - which 
is just [mostly] a shell script).

It is 200 lines, a fair chunk of which is pre-canned stuff to go into rc.conf, 
loader.conf, etc..

http://www.gsoft.com.au/~doconnor/install-os.sh

I also modified the rc.local script the installer uses to add an option to call 
my script.

> Thanks.
> -- 
> Craig Rodrigues
> rodr...@crodrigues.org
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--
Daniel O'Connor software and network engineer
for Genesis Software - http://www.gsoft.com.au
"The nice thing about standards is that there
are so many of them to choose from."
  -- Andrew Tanenbaum
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Re: svn commit: r225937 - in head: . release release/amd64 release/i386 release/ia64 release/pc98 release/powerpc release/scripts release/sparc64 usr.sbin usr.sbin/sysinstall

2011-10-03 Thread Craig Rodrigues 
Hi,

If pc-sysinstall can be a drop-in replacement for sysinstall in
"SCRIPT SYNTAX" mode, even better.  sysinstall needs to go...
while people do use it, it has a lot of problems that aren't getting fixed,
and it is clear that bsdinstall is the future for FreeBSD installation.

Nathan is doing a good thing by forcing the issue by removing
itthere is too much brokenness in sysinstall that is not getting
fixed, and the sooner we can move to
bsdinstall/pc-sysinstall, the better.

Since the sysinstall removal is happening only in HEAD/10.0, we have
some time to
fix the issues before 10.0 is released.
--
Craig Rodrigues
rodr...@crodrigues.org

On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 3:17 PM, Garrett Cooper  wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 3:11 PM, Craig Rodrigues  
> wrote:
>> On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 8:13 AM, Nathan Whitehorn  
>> wrote:
>>> Author: nwhitehorn
>>> Date: Mon Oct  3 15:13:09 2011
>>> New Revision: 225937
>>> URL: http://svn.freebsd.org/changeset/base/225937
>>>
>>> Log:
>>>  Farewall, sysinstall! You served us well for many years, but 10.0 is one
>>>  digit beyond your time.
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Wow, finally someone brave enough to put  the stake through the heart
>> of sysinstall. :)
>>
>> In the sysinstall man page, the "SCRIPT SYNTAX" documents how
>> to create a script file which can be passed as an argument to sysinstall
>> so that instead of running in an interactive menu system,
>> installation/configuration commands are run in batch mode.
>>
>> I have seen some places write customized FreeBSD installers
>> use this feature for doing unattended customized installs of FreeBSD.
>>
>> Can bsdinstall be used as a drop-in replacement for
>> sysinstall when run with the "SCRIPT SYNTAX" batch mode?
>> If not, how much code would need to be added to bsdinstall?  Or, is there
>> some other utility, such as something from the PC-BSD suite of scripts,
>> that can be used as a drop-in replacement for sysinstall in "SCRIPT
>> SYNTAX" mode?
>
> bsdinstall AFAIK isn't designed to do this. pc-sysinstall is a much
> better method to accomplish this task.
>
> That being said, pc-sysinstall integration is probably coming sometime
> in the next 1-2 years..
>
> -Garrett
>



-- 
Craig Rodrigues
rodr...@crodrigues.org
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Re: svn commit: r225937 - in head: . release release/amd64 release/i386 release/ia64 release/pc98 release/powerpc release/scripts release/sparc64 usr.sbin usr.sbin/sysinstall

2011-10-03 Thread Nathan Whitehorn 

On 10/03/11 15:54, Garrett Cooper wrote:

On Oct 3, 2011, at 1:52 PM, Doug Barton wrote:


On 10/03/2011 08:13, Nathan Whitehorn wrote:

Author: nwhitehorn
Date: Mon Oct  3 15:13:09 2011
New Revision: 225937
URL: http://svn.freebsd.org/changeset/base/225937

Log:
  Farewall, sysinstall! You served us well for many years, but 10.0 is one
  digit beyond your time.


sysinstall had (at least) 2 primary purposes, installation, and
post-install system configuration. The new installer is a good step
towards the first goal, but we currently have nothing to fulfill the
second role. For that reason I think this step is premature.

One could also make the case that this is exactly the kind of disruptive
change that the release engineer asked us not to do until the release is
done, but I'll leave that to them to deal with. :)


FWIW, I thought timeline between deprecation and deletion was at least 2 
releases too..
-Garrett


I had thought the intention was to let it remain in 9.0 indefinitely and 
then to remove it from 10 (which gives sysinstall a more than 20-year 
run). I brought this up early last week on the freebsd-sysinstall list, 
to no objections and some encouragement. It can be reverted, of course, 
if people would prefer that.

-Nathan
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Re: svn commit: r225937 - in head: . release release/amd64 release/i386 release/ia64 release/pc98 release/powerpc release/scripts release/sparc64 usr.sbin usr.sbin/sysinstall

2011-10-03 Thread Garrett Cooper 
On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 3:11 PM, Craig Rodrigues  wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 8:13 AM, Nathan Whitehorn  
> wrote:
>> Author: nwhitehorn
>> Date: Mon Oct  3 15:13:09 2011
>> New Revision: 225937
>> URL: http://svn.freebsd.org/changeset/base/225937
>>
>> Log:
>>  Farewall, sysinstall! You served us well for many years, but 10.0 is one
>>  digit beyond your time.
>
>
> Hi,
>
> Wow, finally someone brave enough to put  the stake through the heart
> of sysinstall. :)
>
> In the sysinstall man page, the "SCRIPT SYNTAX" documents how
> to create a script file which can be passed as an argument to sysinstall
> so that instead of running in an interactive menu system,
> installation/configuration commands are run in batch mode.
>
> I have seen some places write customized FreeBSD installers
> use this feature for doing unattended customized installs of FreeBSD.
>
> Can bsdinstall be used as a drop-in replacement for
> sysinstall when run with the "SCRIPT SYNTAX" batch mode?
> If not, how much code would need to be added to bsdinstall?  Or, is there
> some other utility, such as something from the PC-BSD suite of scripts,
> that can be used as a drop-in replacement for sysinstall in "SCRIPT
> SYNTAX" mode?

bsdinstall AFAIK isn't designed to do this. pc-sysinstall is a much
better method to accomplish this task.

That being said, pc-sysinstall integration is probably coming sometime
in the next 1-2 years..

-Garrett
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Re: svn commit: r225937 - in head: . release release/amd64 release/i386 release/ia64 release/pc98 release/powerpc release/scripts release/sparc64 usr.sbin usr.sbin/sysinstall

2011-10-03 Thread Craig Rodrigues 
On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 8:13 AM, Nathan Whitehorn  wrote:
> Author: nwhitehorn
> Date: Mon Oct  3 15:13:09 2011
> New Revision: 225937
> URL: http://svn.freebsd.org/changeset/base/225937
>
> Log:
>  Farewall, sysinstall! You served us well for many years, but 10.0 is one
>  digit beyond your time.


Hi,

Wow, finally someone brave enough to put  the stake through the heart
of sysinstall. :)

In the sysinstall man page, the "SCRIPT SYNTAX" documents how
to create a script file which can be passed as an argument to sysinstall
so that instead of running in an interactive menu system,
installation/configuration commands are run in batch mode.

I have seen some places write customized FreeBSD installers
use this feature for doing unattended customized installs of FreeBSD.

Can bsdinstall be used as a drop-in replacement for
sysinstall when run with the "SCRIPT SYNTAX" batch mode?
If not, how much code would need to be added to bsdinstall?  Or, is there
some other utility, such as something from the PC-BSD suite of scripts,
that can be used as a drop-in replacement for sysinstall in "SCRIPT
SYNTAX" mode?

Thanks.
-- 
Craig Rodrigues
rodr...@crodrigues.org
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Re: svn commit: r225937 - in head: . release release/amd64 release/i386 release/ia64 release/pc98 release/powerpc release/scripts release/sparc64 usr.sbin usr.sbin/sysinstall

2011-10-03 Thread Garrett Cooper 
On Oct 3, 2011, at 1:52 PM, Doug Barton wrote:

> On 10/03/2011 08:13, Nathan Whitehorn wrote:
>> Author: nwhitehorn
>> Date: Mon Oct  3 15:13:09 2011
>> New Revision: 225937
>> URL: http://svn.freebsd.org/changeset/base/225937
>> 
>> Log:
>>  Farewall, sysinstall! You served us well for many years, but 10.0 is one
>>  digit beyond your time.
> 
> sysinstall had (at least) 2 primary purposes, installation, and
> post-install system configuration. The new installer is a good step
> towards the first goal, but we currently have nothing to fulfill the
> second role. For that reason I think this step is premature.
> 
> One could also make the case that this is exactly the kind of disruptive
> change that the release engineer asked us not to do until the release is
> done, but I'll leave that to them to deal with. :)

FWIW, I thought timeline between deprecation and deletion was at least 2 
releases too..
-Garrett___
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Re: svn commit: r225937 - in head: . release release/amd64 release/i386 release/ia64 release/pc98 release/powerpc release/scripts release/sparc64 usr.sbin usr.sbin/sysinstall

2011-10-03 Thread Doug Barton 
On 10/03/2011 08:13, Nathan Whitehorn wrote:
> Author: nwhitehorn
> Date: Mon Oct  3 15:13:09 2011
> New Revision: 225937
> URL: http://svn.freebsd.org/changeset/base/225937
> 
> Log:
>   Farewall, sysinstall! You served us well for many years, but 10.0 is one
>   digit beyond your time.

sysinstall had (at least) 2 primary purposes, installation, and
post-install system configuration. The new installer is a good step
towards the first goal, but we currently have nothing to fulfill the
second role. For that reason I think this step is premature.

One could also make the case that this is exactly the kind of disruptive
change that the release engineer asked us not to do until the release is
done, but I'll leave that to them to deal with. :)


Doug

-- 

Nothin' ever doesn't change, but nothin' changes much.
-- OK Go

Breadth of IT experience, and depth of knowledge in the DNS.
Yours for the right price.  :)  http://SupersetSolutions.com/

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svn commit: r225937 - in head: . release release/amd64 release/i386 release/ia64 release/pc98 release/powerpc release/scripts release/sparc64 usr.sbin usr.sbin/sysinstall

2011-10-03 Thread Nathan Whitehorn 
Author: nwhitehorn
Date: Mon Oct  3 15:13:09 2011
New Revision: 225937
URL: http://svn.freebsd.org/changeset/base/225937

Log:
  Farewall, sysinstall! You served us well for many years, but 10.0 is one
  digit beyond your time.
  
  Various sysinstall dependencies (e.g. libftpio, libdisk, libodialog, etc.)
  will be cleaned up in coming days. Some will take longer than others due to
  a few other consumers (tzsetup and sade).

Deleted:
  head/release/Makefile.inc.docports
  head/release/Makefile.sysinstall
  head/release/amd64/boot_crunch.conf
  head/release/fixit.profile
  head/release/fixit.services
  head/release/i386/boot_crunch.conf
  head/release/i386/fixit_crunch.conf
  head/release/ia64/boot_crunch.conf
  head/release/pc98/boot_crunch.conf
  head/release/pc98/fixit-small_crunch.conf
  head/release/pc98/fixit_crunch.conf
  head/release/powerpc/boot_crunch.conf
  head/release/scripts/base-install.sh
  head/release/scripts/catpages-install.sh
  head/release/scripts/catpages-make.sh
  head/release/scripts/checkindex.pl
  head/release/scripts/chkINDEX
  head/release/scripts/commerce-install.sh
  head/release/scripts/dict-install.sh
  head/release/scripts/dict-make.sh
  head/release/scripts/doFS.sh
  head/release/scripts/doc-install.sh
  head/release/scripts/doc-make.sh
  head/release/scripts/games-install.sh
  head/release/scripts/info-install.sh
  head/release/scripts/info-make.sh
  head/release/scripts/info.sh
  head/release/scripts/kernels-install.sh
  head/release/scripts/lib32-install.sh
  head/release/scripts/manpages-install.sh
  head/release/scripts/manpages-make.sh
  head/release/scripts/mkpkghier
  head/release/scripts/mkpkgindex.sh
  head/release/scripts/package-split.py
  head/release/scripts/package-trees.sh
  head/release/scripts/ports-install.sh
  head/release/scripts/proflibs-install.sh
  head/release/scripts/proflibs-make.sh
  head/release/scripts/split-file.sh
  head/release/scripts/src-install.sh
  head/release/scripts/tar.sh
  head/release/scripts/xperimnt-install.sh
  head/release/sparc64/boot_crunch.conf
  head/usr.sbin/sysinstall/
Modified:
  head/MAINTAINERS
  head/Makefile.inc1
  head/ObsoleteFiles.inc
  head/UPDATING
  head/usr.sbin/Makefile

Modified: head/MAINTAINERS
==
--- head/MAINTAINERSMon Oct  3 14:23:00 2011(r225936)
+++ head/MAINTAINERSMon Oct  3 15:13:09 2011(r225937)
@@ -123,8 +123,6 @@ usr.sbin/zicedwin   Heads-up appreciat
maintained by a third party source.
 lib/libc/stdtime   edwin   Heads-up appreciated, since parts of this code
is maintained by a third party source.
-sysinstall randi   Please contact about any major changes so that
-   they can be co-ordinated.
 sbin/routedbms Pre-commit review; notify vendor at rhyolite.com
 
 Following are the entries from the Makefiles, and a few other sources.

Modified: head/Makefile.inc1
==
--- head/Makefile.inc1  Mon Oct  3 14:23:00 2011(r225936)
+++ head/Makefile.inc1  Mon Oct  3 15:13:09 2011(r225937)
@@ -1106,7 +1106,6 @@ build-tools:
 ${_aicasm} \
 usr.bin/awk \
 lib/libmagic \
-usr.sbin/sysinstall \
 usr.bin/mkesdb_static \
 usr.bin/mkcsmapper_static
${_+_}@${ECHODIR} "===> ${_tool} (obj,build-tools)"; \

Modified: head/ObsoleteFiles.inc
==
--- head/ObsoleteFiles.inc  Mon Oct  3 14:23:00 2011(r225936)
+++ head/ObsoleteFiles.inc  Mon Oct  3 15:13:09 2011(r225937)
@@ -38,6 +38,8 @@
 #   xargs -n1 | sort | uniq -d;
 # done
 
+# 20110930: sysinstall removed
+OLD_FILES+=usr/sbin/sysinstall usr/share/man/man8/sysinstall.8.gz
 # 20110915: rename congestion control manpages
 OLD_FILES+=usr/share/man/man4/cc.4.gz
 OLD_FILES+=usr/share/man/man9/cc.9.gz

Modified: head/UPDATING
==
--- head/UPDATING   Mon Oct  3 14:23:00 2011(r225936)
+++ head/UPDATING   Mon Oct  3 15:13:09 2011(r225937)
@@ -22,6 +22,9 @@ NOTE TO PEOPLE WHO THINK THAT FreeBSD 10
machines to maximize performance.  (To disable malloc debugging, run
ln -s aj /etc/malloc.conf.)
 
+20110930:
+   sysinstall has been removed
+
 20110923:
The stable/9 branch created in subversion.  This corresponds to the
RELENG_9 branch in CVS.

Modified: head/usr.sbin/Makefile
==
--- head/usr.sbin/Makefile  Mon Oct  3 14:23:00 2011(r225936)
+++ head/usr.sbin/Makefile  Mon Oct  3 15:13:09 2011(r225937)
@@ -290,8 +290,6 @@ SUBDIR+=praliases
 SUBDIR+=   sendmail
 .endif
 
-SUBDIR+=   sysinstall
-
 .if ${MK_TOOLC