Re: t-and-f: ALL TIME FAVOTITE ARTICLES??
Mentioning The Runner magazine reminds me of one of my favorites: A laugh-out-loud article by Don Kardong on race directing which appeared in the very last issue of The Runner before it was bought out by Runner's World. Kardong has some of his articles republished in anthology books. I don't know if this article is in one such book but it should be. It should be mandatory reading for any athlete who has never seen what it takes to organize a roadrace or track field meet. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Randall Northam [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: posting [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Friday, October 20, 2000 7:50 AM Subject: t-and-f: ALL TIME FAVOTITE ARTICLES?? I think it was in The Runner and written by Rich (whose surname I forget - I may even have forgotten his first name!). Anyway it purported to be about a young Kenyan woman who was so good she could take a few minutes off the world marathon record but she was forced to stay at home and tend to the work. Beautifully written, terribly authentic and, in retrospect very funny, it turned out to be a spoof with the drops capitals of the paragrphs reading "April Fool" - or something like that. What makes it funny even now is that so many of the articles in the running and track and field press (and I hold up my hand here) are written in the same earnet vein. Brilliant Randall Northam
Re: t-and-f: Favorite Article
I believe that Moore's classic article in Sports Illustrated on his 4th place finish in the marathon in Munich is also reprinted in his book. An even earlier author of SI track/running articles was Hal Higdon. Some of these were republished in a paperback "On the Run From Dogs and People" published in 1971 and republished in 1995 by Roadrunner Press. It provides some humorous incite to the sport before the running boom hit the USA and is especially recommended to members of the list in their 20's and 30's. It even includes a chapter on racewalking. And the SI article on his trip to compete in the 1952 NCAA's (before there were divisions or even qualifying times) is a classic. I believe Hal Higdon has his own website from which you might be able to get the book ($14.95) if Amazon doesn't have it. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Eckmann, Drew [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Friday, October 20, 2000 5:17 PM Subject: t-and-f: Favorite Article I think my favorite track article ever is Kenny Moore's 'Walker-Bayi' piece in Sports Illustrated back in either '75,'76, or '77. It chronicled the world's two best milers who's paths didn't meet because of the African boycott in Montreal. A few of the lines that I remember are: Watching Bayi being paced by an athlete: 'who was so ugly as to be fascinating' Bayi and Moore going into a restaraunt and eating with their hands: 'In Tanzania it is not impolite to tell a waiter that you know where your hands have been but you can't be sure about his silverware' Walker at the beach wading 'They walk horses through salt water. it *has* to be good for your legs' Walker saying that: 'you see small children having Walker-Bayi races on the street' (Musta been a NZ thing) This is included in Moore's collection of stories along with a few other gems. I had the original, lent it to somebody and then got another copy years later. His Lindgren disappearance story is great too. /Drew I'm also a fan of a lot of Don Kardong's stories. Get his book 'Thirty Phone Booths to Boston' and you must get the story he wrote about me at the NYC marathon. The writing's so-so, but the subject is fascinating!!! /Drew
Re: t-and-f: Let's Kill All The Lawyers
We all know that Shakespeare was a pen name. What was he trying to cover-up! Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Bruce Glikin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TFMail List [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wednesday, October 04, 2000 1:43 PM Subject: FW: t-and-f: Let's Kill All The Lawyers bruce, a few points. Larry Eder, some counter points below your 'few points': 1. get off the kill all the lawyers stuff. Anyone who deals with lawyers, ie anyone who has their own business realizes that they keep you out of more trouble than they get you into. Also note that several of our prominent track geeks are lawyers. Shakespeare's words, not mine, Larry. I wish I'd have been clever enough to have authored them. They've endured through the ages because of their sharp ring of truth. Sure, there are good attorneys out there too. Most intelligent readers who don't take everything they read literally understand that. I narrowed my post down to three men, all in high positions of power, all trained as attorneys. It was their dogged adherence to that training that caused all three such problems. All attorneys would not have acted in the fashion that these three men did. Again, most of us with a pulse 'get' that. And the fact that 'several of our prominent track geeks are lawyers' as a deterrent to expressing my opinion? You've got the wrong guy, Larry. Save your fatherly advice advocating self censorship for those with thinner skins. My thoughts won't be suppressed by the fear of ruffling the feathers of anybody on this list, regardless of their position of power or 'prominence'. In my mind, all members on this list have equal status. 2. Also unless you have talked to Masback, and understand that if he talks that US law allows any athlete, guilty or not guilty to sue the USATF, the USOC and whoever else they want to the ends of the earth, then cut the slick comments. The Amateur Sports Act of 1977 is what Masback is talking about, and he had nothing to do with that. Blame the guy for stuff he is responsible for, not for something he was saddled with. Granted, he assumed an organization that was riddled with problems that he did not cause. But I can't ever recall him publicly coming out and stating such. Why not? Why didn't he seek help right from the get-go by going public if he knew his federation was unable to unilaterally handle its problems? Why not having gone public and sought some type of umbrella protection that would protect them from lawsuits? Perhaps Congress? If USATF does not have the resources to handle potential litigation, then they have to be melded into an organization that can. Otherwise we continue this charade and the problems multiply. 3. And in terms of how slick it was to offer that the World Drug agency handle drug testing for USATF, does ken stone actually think any USATF representative at the convention is going to fight giving up drug testing and the liability that it involves? Why not deal in that little place called reality. I don't know who Ken Stone is, or what you're alluding to, so I won't respond to this. 4. This is supposed to be a place where we exchange ideas, all I see is mudslinging. If track is so damn bad that you can only think of drug use anytime anyone breaks nine minutes for two miles, then join the PBA, I hear that they are going to start testing. You're way out on left field on this one, Larry. If you read my novel 'Slinger Sanchez Running Gun' you'd know how far off base you are. The book is an inspirational story about a clean kid, with immense talent, who gets to the top after fighting off unwarranted charges. The book is charged with passion, detailing the beauty of track running and competition. If all you can see is drug issues, that's your problem. If memory serves me correct, you have some vested interest in the track and field business too. Don't you, Larry? Bruce Glikin/author/'Slinger Sanchez Running Gun' http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0966345800
Re: t-and-f: Konstadinos Kenteris?
I was merely attempting a little humor, not suggesting anything else. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Uri Goldbourt [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: CORA KOCH [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Alan Shank [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Steven L. Brower [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Friday, September 29, 2000 12:49 PM Subject: RE: t-and-f: Konstadinos Kenteris? Kederis "bore" a much faster time (20.25) , relatively speaking, the Patoulido, and his progress to 20.09 in the Olympics is not without precedent. A certain fantastic American athlete progressed from 19.66 to 19.32 seconds, not long ago, in one leap. Last year in Seville, Obikwelu and the Pole Marczin Urbas exploded in the semi finals with sub-20.00 times, remember? Other examples abound. UG __ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of CORA KOCH Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2000 10:00 PM To: Alan Shank; Steven L. Brower Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: t-and-f: Konstadinos Kenteris? Given Kenteris and Paraskevi Patoulidou in 1992, the classic line should be changed to "Beware of Greeks bearing slow times." Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Alan Shank [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Steven L. Brower [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thursday, September 28, 2000 12:05 PM Subject: Re: t-and-f: Konstadinos Kenteris? "Steven L. Brower" wrote: Could anyone on this list shed some light on the background of this individual. Pr's, past rankings, ect In other words, what's the ticket with this? Someone named K. Kederis had a 20.25, 20th performer in 2000 list coming in, and was not among the 10 in T F News' predictions. I don't know whether that is the same guy as Kenteris, but Greece did not enter anyone named "Kederis." Cheers, Alan Shank
Re: t-and-f: Men's 200m - RESULTS INCLUDED
Yeah, and if Freeman was one of ours, we would have gotten a 7th in the Women's 200 even using the Australian system. But I guess if MG or MJ had flinched at the start there might have been a recall. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Justin Clouder [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'TF List' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thursday, September 28, 2000 9:12 AM Subject: t-and-f: Men's 200m - RESULTS INCLUDED Scroll down . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Oh dear USA. 7th, 8th and a losing semi-finalist at 200m. I guess this is what happens when you decide you can do without the reiging world and olympic champs (each of whom won their main event in Sydney). This is only going to get worse for you - the world is a bigger and more competitive place now. Question - when the "everyone gets an equal chance" approach starts costing medals and thus publicity and thus interest, what is more important? MG vs MJ would have been one of the highlights of the games, indeed of any games - even NBC would have realised that. Instead, they probably won't show the 200m final at all. A traditional power event for the USA, a key component of publicity which the sport so badly needs, thrown away. BTW I hate to mention it, but a few people need to take back some of the abuse thrown at Stephen Francis, who correctly predicted, to general US-sourced derision, that no American would be on the podium. And while we're here, someone should give a little talk to John Capel, reminding him that there are no prizes for fast qualifying times. A key moment came when he raced Campbell in one of the earlier rounds. He ran harder than he needed to so as to make sure he beat Campbell, then pranced around grandstanding for a few minutes. This after a first round heat remember. Campbell jogged through the line and carried on jogging right off the track and back home to prepare for the next race. Personally I really enjoy unearned arrogance being beaten out of someone, so please excuse a little schadenfreude as I peruse the results below: Men's 200m final: 1. Konstantinos Kenteris (GRE) 20.092. Darren Campbell (GBR) 20.143. Ato Boldon (TRI) 20.204. Obadele Thompson (BAR) 20.205. Christian Malcolm (GBR) 20.236. Claudinei Silva (BRA) 20.287. Coby Miller (USA) 20.358. John Capel Jr (USA) 20.49 Justin ** Privileged/Confidential Information may be contained in this message. If you are not the addressee indicated in the message (or responsible for the delivery of the message to such person), you may not copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by reply Email. Please advise immediately if you or your employer does not consent to Internet Email for messages of this kind. Opinions, conclusions and other information in this message that do not relate to the official business of Abbott Mead Vickers BBDO Ltd or its Group/Associated Companies shall be understood as neither given nor endorsed by them. Abbott Mead Vickers.BBDO Limited. Registered in England. Registered Number 1935786. Registered Office 151 Marylebone Rd, London NW1 5QE. Telephone 020 7616 3500. Email [EMAIL PROTECTED] **
Re: t-and-f: USATF response to McCaffrey
Also, you may want to read an AP article ("US Criticized for Drug
Monitoring") on the international politics involved. It is on many USA
newspaper websites on Wednesday, for example,
http://www.newsday.com/ap/sports/ap535.htm .
Ed Koch
-Original Message-
From: Bob Ramsak [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: tf list [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wednesday, September 27, 2000 2:53 PM
Subject: t-and-f: USATF response to McCaffrey
Hi All,
Just found this posted on the USATF website.
-
Contact: Jill M. Geer
Director of Communications
USA Track Field
In Sydney: 61-2-8113-0233
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Wednesday, September 27, 2000
USATF response to letter sent by General Barry R. McCaffrey
USA Track Field on Wednesday released the following response to General
Barry
R. McCaffreys letter of September 25.
September 26, 2000
Dear General McCaffrey:
Thank you for your letter of September 25th. USA Track Field
appreciates
the words of support from your office concerning our leadership role in the
fight against performance enhancing drugs. We agree that transparency is a
key
to strengthening the credibility of all drug testing programs. We welcome
moves
to make drug testing totally independent of all sports organizations. We
look
forward to continuing to work with you to improve our programs and to assist
you
in helping other organizations such as Major League Baseball, the NHL, and
the
NBA initiate comprehensive in and out-of-competition drug testing programs.
American law, USOC arbitration precedent, and our own rules require
that we
treat athletes as innocent until proven guilty and that we maintain the
confidentiality of our process. We consider the issues you raised very
important
and have met with international track authorities to address their concern
about
the small number of cases still in our process, and have demonstrated to
them
that:
1. the majority of the cases about which they had questions involved
substances for which athletes had medical waivers as permitted by IOC
regulations (for the treatment of asthma);
2. the next greatest number of unresolved matters involved so-called
"cold medicine" positives, which even if the athlete is found guilty will
only
result in a public warning to the athlete involved; and
3. the remaining cases will be adjudicated under our system as soon as
we
are provided with the necessary documentation and laboratory analysis by the
IOC
laboratories, the IAAF, or the USOC.
Like you, we are proud of our athletes -- members of the World's #1
Track
Field team. We are also proud that USA Track Field has tested more
athletes,
for more substances, for a longer period of time than any other sports
organization ... and that we have disciplined those who have broken the
rules.
Our Olympic Track team is the most tested team in history and we look
forward to
more great performances in Sydney.
Sincerely,
Craig A. Masback
CEO
cc: Patricia F. Rico
President
# # #
---
| Bob Ramsak
| OHIO Track Running Report
| http://www.trackprofile.com
| Cleveland, Ohio USA
| [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: t-and-f: 5 positive names from 1988
The appeals process is found in USATF Regulation 10. To read it, go to http://www.usatf.org and click on to the link for the USATF Governance Manual. USATF bashers may be surprised to see because of amendments passed last year, new doping hearings are now heard and decided by independent AAA arbitration. That is not the action an organization would take that is trying to protect guilty athletes. Regulation 10 does provide for confidentiality of proceedings until final. And yes, in one well publicized case, when a pending case was leaked to the press, USATF faced the threat of a defamation lawsuit even though all USATF individuals with knowledge denied doing any leaking and there were other non-USATF persons who could have been the leakers. It is not surprising, therefore that the USATF people with knowledge of the pending cases are kept to a minimum. (I, for example, have no first hand information on what has been reported in the press this week.) All of which makes it easy for critics to make charges of cover-ups. Maybe, we will see an Oliver Stone movie soon. One fact that does create suspicion and ammunition for critics is that the USA legal system requires an individual be given "due process" or in other words a fair hearing before a suspension. If USATF doesn't do this, it is almost a given that an athlete could haul USATF into court and get a restraining order pending resolution of the case. Other countries with lesser protections for individual rights may find this hard to accept. The IAAF certainly does. As for the comments on the list about 1988, I suggest attacking USATF now for what is alleged to have happened back then doesn't accomplish much. There is a different CEO, different staff, and only two of the twenty members of the USATF Executive Committee from back then are still on the Executive Committee (I looked it up - it is also before I became USATF Law Legislation Chair .) Since then, numerous individuals in USATF have spent countless hours trying to create a better doping control system. People seem to forget, for example, that USATF began out-of-competition testing. No system will ever be close to perfect, and there is always the possibility that cheaters will slip through. But to make blanket charges and advance conspiracy theories based on rumor is unfair to the many principled people in USATF who are honest. If you don't like Regulation 10, propose amendments next year and come to the USATF convention and vote. These comments and opinions are strictly my own and do not necessarily reflect those of USATF. List members active in USATF such as Bob Hersh, Bill Roe, and myself rarely talk about doping issues on the list because of the Regulation 10 confidentiality restrictions and the need for USATF to talk with one voice on matters that may involve litigation. But given some of the comments on the list, I felt something needed to be said. I am posting this in an attempt to give list members some general information and a better understanding of USATF procedures. I accept that it will not change the minds already made up, but as for the rest of you, I hope this gives you a more balanced view. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Dalton Foster [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tuesday, September 26, 2000 2:16 PM Subject: Re: t-and-f: 5 positive names from 1988 I still think it is a crock. If you test positive, then you test positive. How does the appeal process work anyway? I'm just curious. D "R.T." wrote: US court restrictions? This is new to me. What would they be? Release a name unnecessarily (before the appeals process is complete), and you get hauled into court to answer to defamation charges. The individual and the organization (USATF) could both be subject to huge penalties. There are lawyers on the list. They can probably explain it better than I. It has to do with due process. The canned statement issued out of Indy about their policy being 'no comment' is not a coverup- it is straight out of Lawyering 101 to protect yourself from suits. Any lawyer would advise: "say nothin' and you won't get yourself into trouble". RT -- Dalton Foster Ph.D. Post-Doctoral Research Associate Department of Medical Physiology Texas AM University HSC (409) 845-7990 Science without religion is lame; religion without science is blind. (Albert Einstein)
Re: t-and-f: Bob Costas's view of race walking
Believe it or not, FloJo said it once in an interview although she may have not been the first. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Monday, September 25, 2000 12:39 PM Subject: Re: t-and-f: Bob Costas's view of race walking In a message dated 9/25/2000 11:27:05 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: He said this last night and I thought it was funny. "Race walking, I don't understand it, Its like seeing who can wisper the loudest" Actually, that's been used before. Don't remember where or when I heard it but some Olympic commentator used it a while back. Hank Brown
Re: t-and-f: Insignificant Sports or Events in the Olympic Games
A basic problem is that popularity isn't constant. A hundred years ago, the walks were among the most popular events in our sport. Until Edwin Moses, the 400 hurdles was ignored by most. Before Altanta, Garry Hill sugested eliminating the 200 (among other events) from track meets aimed at spectators. I agree with those who say we have to trim the time length of many of our meets and not have every event at every meet. But I disagree that we should eliminate events altogether from the sport. One of our strengths is that we can always headline something different. Done right the variety can be useful on the publicity front. Who would have guessed, for example, that the women's vault would be such a crowd pleaser? Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Ed Dana Parrot [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Friday, September 22, 2000 5:55 PM Subject: Re: t-and-f: "Insignificant" Sports or Events in the Olympic Games After 3 years on this list I am finally going to enlighten all of you with some comments. I do not mean to offend anyone or demean any sport or event, but man you gotta be kidding me! A previous post by Matt Smith hits this on the head! One event that really gets to me is those gosh darn walking events. Competing in the NAIA for 4 years I was introduced to this since it was an event at the National meet. What a way to be an All-American! I mean are there more than 10 people who care? Get rid of this crap! And this goes for all those other events that make no sense. The problem is where do you draw the line? Does this mean the value of a sport is a direct correlation with the number of people who care about it? Why bother having any track events except the 100 meters and the mile (arguably the two most popular)? And who decides - you? Or maybe the argument is that some of these other sports don't make sense. I sometimes agree, but then again, the fiberglass pole vault (my favorite TF event) and the 16lb shot put don't either. By this definition, walking might even make more sense. After all, the development of the human race over the millenia owes a lot to the ability to walk quickly for hours or days and somewhat less to the ability to run 100 meters as quickly as possible. If you don't want to watch the other events, I'd suggest that you don't. It's too bad that something which should have no relevence to your ability to compete and/or be a fan seems to matter so much to you. - Ed Parrot [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: t-and-f: Ratings don't compare well with past Games
An interesting question is if the USA television ratings are perceived to decline because of the tape delays, will NBC in 2004 show the weekend events live in the afternoon ( USA afternoon = Europe evening) or still tape to show everything in prime time. The last comparable situation was the 1992 Olympics but I had triplecast. Does anybody know what they did in 1992? Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Kurt Bray [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Monday, September 18, 2000 8:16 PM Subject: Re: t-and-f: Ratings don't compare well with past Games Conway writes: And the worst thing is NBC seems to hold everything even longer trying to build drama or something .. I mean the big swimming finals didn't come on til somewhere close to 11pm Saturday night .. When the evening telecast had started at 7pm !!! I'm noticing a trend so far: NBC shows swimming finals in which Americans do not win the gold at around 8:00 PM, but if a US swimmer wins (or at least contends mightily) it is not shown until about 10:30 or 11:00 PM. We will probably see this same pattern for the track broadcasts, meaning that, even if we avoid reading results on the net, we can perhaps predict whether say Marion Jones wins gold number 1 or 2, etc. based on how long they delay it in the telecast. Kurt Bray PS: I haven't seen any comment, but I assume all US viewers have seen that great Nike ad featuring Suzy Hamilton running from a chain saw murderer. Look for it if you haven't - It's hilarious. _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com.
Re: t-and-f: Toughness, Nothing to Lose Thread
At least Marty got to run in the OLympics in 1968 (when he was too young to be a serious medal contender). Countless others have had injuries keep them out of the Olympics altogether. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: John Molvar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Send t-and-f [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sunday, September 17, 2000 10:21 AM Subject: t-and-f: Toughness, Nothing to Lose Thread Jim Gerweck of Running Times wrote: "Anyone remember Steve Ovett in LA - the guy probably should have been home in bed, but he ran the 800 1500, had to drop out of the final in the latter - leaving a bit of a tarnish on his racing image, but in my mind raising him much higher in the character department. Now THAT was someone who was TOUGH." Boy do I ever. First in the 800, he nearly killed himself running with the flu and barely got into the final. He even had a sense of humor immediately after the semi to go in front of the stands and do a mock imitation of himself falling apart in the last 50 meters. Then the guy comes back in the 1500, makes the final and is sicker than ever. Then in the final when Cram and Coe made their break, the crazy tough son of a gun goes after them and blows past Steve Scott and several others until he finally succumbed and collapsed and was taken off in a stretcher. Then you have bad luck Liquori. Ranks number one in the world in the 1500 in '73 and number one in the world in the 5000 in '77, so the '76 games should have been his big one. He severely tears a hamstring just prior to the trials. Did that stop him. Hell no! With a ham so bad that he had the ugly black reminder on the back of his leg he tries to run anyway at the trials with family and friends screaming and begging him to stop. It's not just toughness though, Ovett and Liquori both had nothing to lose. __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/
Re: t-and-f: Venus/rankings
Dick Enberg (sp?) made the comment. He did, of course, some track field announcing in the past including the 1987 World Championships. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sunday, September 10, 2000 3:20 PM Subject: t-and-f: Venus/rankings During the U.S. Open women's final, one of the commentators mentioned that he could see Venus Williams as a 200-meter runner. Also, note that the wonderfully objective computer rankings for tennis, still list her as No. 3 in the world (she missed tournaments early in the year with an injury). That's fair given that everyone knew how rankings were to be determined going into the season. But given Williams' 26 straight victories, including the Wimbledon and U.S. Open titles (beating No. 1 in the Open semis and No. 2 in the final), the computer rankings don't reflect reality. George McWilliams
Re: RE: t-and-f: Olympic Journalism Ban
What about undistinguished officials? In 1984, Peter Uberroth (sp?) couldn't find it in his budget to provide lodging for the track field competition officials and they had to pay for their own. They would have loved to be offered free housing in the Olympic Village. In 1996, competition officials were provided with free rooms at the Emory dorms (the Olympic Village was at newly built Georgia Tech dorms). I assume that by distinguished officials, you referto the senior IAAF folks. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Dave Carey [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wednesday, September 06, 2000 3:44 PM Subject: Re: RE: t-and-f: Olympic Journalism Ban If so, then distinguished officials should also be required to stay in the Village. Dave Carey On Wed, 6 Sep 2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: "famous" athletes haven't stayed in the Village for years. I think it ought to be a contingency for being allowed to compete in the Games. gh
Re: t-and-f: OC Bans Athletes From Net Storytelling
Of course in those days, there was the amateur issue. Was Cliff Blair being paid for his articles? Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Bruce Lehane [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Andrew Owusu [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Allen M James [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 10:45 AM Subject: Re: t-and-f: OC Bans Athletes From Net Storytelling Cliff Blair was a hammer thrower from Boston University who made the US team in 1956, went to Australia to compete at Melbourne. Majoring in jounalism, he arranged to send to the Boston Globe reports of his experience at the Games. He did so. He was then told that he had violated the rules regarding athletes serving as jounalists and was prohibited from throwing and sent back home. Local rival, Hal Connolly of BC, won the event. Why do I feel like I'm Ed Grant all of a sudden? Andrew Owusu wrote: - Original Message - From: Allen M James [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 6:52 AM Subject: t-and-f: OC Bans Athletes From Net Storytelling Hmmm i wonder if there are any jounalists who are also athletes competing at the games. I guess either your boss fires you for not capitalizing on the olympic experience or the IOC kicks you out of the village. Andrew snip Rule 59 states that an Olympic athlete is not permitted to record his thoughts of his Olympic experience and have it posted on the Internet. Doing so would be tantamount to an athlete acting as a journalist, the IOC has determined. And that is grounds for being thrown out of the Games.
Re: t-and-f: RE: Does college hurt our marathoners?
The Penn Relays had a marathon in the 1970's which was held on Monday or Tuesday of Penn Relays week. (This may have been in response to Drake having one.) It did not get huge numbers given that it was on a weekday and was before the 1970's roadrace boom had fully hit. It eventually was replaced by the Penn Relays 20 K which is held on the Sunday before the meet. While I was on the Penn team, I recall one or two teammates running the marathon but not anyone who might score in the Heptagonals or IC4A's in the following weeks. I believe most of the marathoners were post-collegians. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Linda Honikman [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: P.F.Talbot [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Track list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tuesday, September 05, 2000 6:25 PM Subject: t-and-f: RE: Does college hurt our marathoners? Paul, you make some good points. Can you be more specific about the following statement - Venues for college distance running have disappeared as well (eg., the Drake Relays Marathon--not a college event, but one in which some of the collegiate guys would run). Was there a time when college marathons were popular? I do know that the World University Games reduced their marathon to a half-marathon a few years ago. Perhaps having a few more half-marathons for college or recent graduates would be a good start. As you point out, most college age athletes aren't ready for a good marathon but training just for the 10K may not be the best preparation for future marathoners. Cheers, Linda Honikman, USATF RRIC and Running USA
Re: t-and-f: ESPN Coverage
I understand ESPN has to accept the European feed and doesn't control the camera angles. But if they ever do get control, the worst camera angle to me is the wide shot of the runners in staggered lane events on the back straight. A hard core fan may be able to pick out runners, but a casual observer is totally clueless except for the commentary. It would be better to interspace some closer shots of the favorites. In general, I thought the coverage was good and Larry always does a good job. My big concern in the future would be scheduling. For the same reason that the IAAF wants to have the Golden meets all on Fridays, it would be very helpful for audience building to have all of the ESPN cvoverage on Friday night same day coverage. Americans generally haven't seen the meet results and they can develop a viewing habit like they do for a network series (e.g. Monday Night Football on a smaller scale). It would be a time crunch for editing. So do them at 11 PM EDT on Fridays which gives a few more hours for editing and would hit the West Coast at Prime Time. Us East Coasters could stay up on a Friday night (or tape for Saturday AM viewing before reading the sports news). I would guess that an 11 PM start each week might be more possible for ESPN (or ESPN2) than east coast prime time every Friday. But the key is keeping it the same night every week so people don't have to go looking for it. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Ed Dana Parrot [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Saturday, September 02, 2000 10:45 AM Subject: Re: t-and-f: ESPN Coverage Has anyone been watching? Does anyone care? Did it hurt that three of the shows were delayed a day or two? Trust me, we're not looking for pats on the back if you liked the shows, but feedback, good and bad, is always welcome(at least the good feedback). I agree with another post which indicated that the coverage was generally good, but that the camera angles switched a little bit too much. As usual, there were a few comments that were way off base, most notably the statement that El G. had a much harder time winning the five events than the others did because it was a distance event. I'd actually say the distance runners have it the easiest - they can afford to make mistakes and still win. But overall, much better than the NBC or CBS coverage I have seen over the past few years - more action and less fluff. - Ed Parrot
Re: t-and-f: WAVA
I seem to recall a rule of thumb told me about masters competition some time ago that the average athlete who stays in shape can expect to lose 1% on their performance every year past age thirty. Perhaps, the lose of performance is slower for elite athletes or it starts later (35?). 10.99 is close to 5% slower than 10.49 (if you believe 10.49 is legit). I'd be curious to hear what Ken, Ed, or any masters on the list think. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Ed Dana Parrot [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Friday, September 01, 2000 12:46 AM Subject: t-and-f: WAVA You didn't ask, but Merlene's 10.99 at age 40 (into a slight wind) is worth 10.4 as an open mark on the WAVA Age-Graded Tables. Another way to appreciate Ottey's performance: Consider the M40 results at the USATF Masters nationals in Eugene. She would have taken second! Michael Rohl is right. Every time the age-graded tables tell us that an older athlete has dramatically outperformed the world record, they prove themselves wrong. The world record for open athletes represents the top achievement of the world's most talented athletes, training full-time and competing in optimal conditions. Where an age-graded masters record falls short of this mark, it should be assumed that either talent, effort, or competitive opportunity is lacking. Where an age-graded masters record exceeds the open world record, it shows only that we have underestimated the potential of athletes of that age, and the tables should be revised to rate the two performances equally. The tables do no one any good if they consistently overcorrect for the effects of age. You have to take the age graded tables for what they are - statistical likelihoods. They are based solely on the world records as of the early 1990's (that needs to be updated) and statistics from hundreds of thousands of masters performances. Perhaps the most significant flaw is that all open world records are determined to be of equal value as a starting point. But even without this problems, given the nature of the formulas, it would very unlikely NOT to have various performances that exceed the world records. Remember, the purpose of the age graded tables is to come up with equivalent performances for one age, sex, and event vs another age, sex, and event. A 10.99 for a 40-year old woman sure seems to me from a subjective standpoint to be pretty close to a 10.4-10.5. Last year the USATF/Connecticut grand prix added age graded scoring for all ages and sexes and open men claimed over half of the top ten places (masters men were the group with the largest participation, but only 2 places in the top 10), so I find it hard to conclude that the tables are radically skewed in favor of older runners. As a tool to compare a large number of runners of all ages and sexes at all distances, it is extremely valuable, if not perfect. The design of the WAVA formulas (based solely on statistical data) do make it likely that truly spectacular performances by runners over 35 will be valued a little too highly compared to open performances. - Ed Parrot
t-and-f: Re: Grote Wedding Bells
Something to look forward to: The recent news on the list means I may be refereeing Junior Olympic meets in a few years with little Grotes. My best wishes to the happy couple. Ed Koch -Original Message-From: Ryan Grote [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sam Alexander- My right hand man at Runners Pace, manned the operation last week whilst I honeymooned in Oregon. Filmed and bartended at my wedding.
Re: t-and-f: U.S. TV crticism--1976 style
The Commish is ageless. -Original Message-From: A.J. Craddock [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Ed Grant [EMAIL PROTECTED]; track net [EMAIL PROTECTED]Date: Monday, August 28, 2000 9:28 PMSubject: Re: t-and-f: U.S. TV crticism--1976 styleDidn't know that Bob Hersh was around 125 years old.Go Bob! No wonder MJ's 200M world record paperwork was a bit slow in being processed!Tony Craddock__At 07:34 PM 8/28/00 -0700, Ed Grant wrote: Netters: Rummaging through old copies of my NJ Track for a bit of statistical compilation, I came across this comment on the ABC coverage of the 1876 trials: "The steeplecahse final was a story in itself. The race was run while ABC was on "live" but the jerks who decide what goes on that show missed the most dramatic incident of the entire trials. (Mike) Roche was in a battle with Bob Timm for the third qualifying spot. Just as Mike went to pass on the final hurdle, he tripped and fell to his kness. Dazed, his knee hurt, he still took off in a frantic drive that caught Timm at the tape in 8:32.70." Other quotes that year include a scathing comment by the (now) "Commish," Bob hersh on a reported d/q of a NJ HS relay team because one runner's jersey had sleeves longer than his teammates and a comment by Harvard coach Bill McCurdy on the NCAA attempt to tell college athletes when and where they could compete. (Bill, was, of course, the coach who authorized one of his athletes to wear a Yale sweatshirt when he accepted his gold medal at an earlier NCAA indoor championship meet to show solidarity with Frank Shorter who was unable to compete (and win) there because his school was on probation due to the Jack Langer incident. Ed Grant
Re: t-and-f: 1500 metre s'chase?
2000 meters is the standard steeplechase distance for the World and USA Junior Championships as well as the USA Junior Olympics. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Rick Rountree [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thursday, August 24, 2000 1:07 AM Subject: Re: t-and-f: 1500 metre s'chase? I've thought about this before (10 milers can get really boring). The closest thing I've heard of is the 2000m steeplechase that is run in some US high school meets. Can't think of a world best for this event. Is there one? Was this a junior competition? If not, what's the point of a 1500m steeple. Just for fun? Anyway, I would like to know if people think a sub-4 mile equivalent 1500m (3:42 roughly, lets not get started on this thread again) could be done for an all out 1500 steeple? I don't think so. Water barriers would be too tough to deal with not to mention just plain fatigue from the other barriers. The stop and go would be killer, especially with some of the steeple form the Kenyans have. Afterall, they are just about the only ones capable of even thinking about running this fast over barriers. I could see 3:50 all out. Maybe a little faster, but not much. Rick Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
Re: t-and-f: New Olympic Relay Events
The athletes might like it provided the IAAF offers prize money as it does for other World Championships. It would give them visibility and allow them to represent their country in risk-free events that do not affect their individual rankings. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Wednesday, August 09, 2000 9:25 AM Subject: t-and-f: New Olympic Relay Events [EMAIL PROTECTED] New Olympic Relay Events Ed Koch writes: Replace the World Cup in the even-numbered years between Summer Olympics (i.e. 2002, 2006, etc.) with a World Relay Championship. Go with the standard relay events: 4x1, 4x2, 4x4, 4x8, 4x15, SMR, DMR, SHH. From a US standpoint this would be a great way to have the sport gain some attention (other than drug use). Americans, Tiger Woods aside, love team sports. Americans love international sports only if we win. If this meet was scored chances are the Americans would come out on top with opportunity to win 4 of the events for both M W - possibly more for the women. Hold it at Franklin Field with 40,000 screaming fans and you may even have a good TV show. Getting the athletes to buy into it might prove difficult however. Steve S.
Re: t-and-f: lane usage at Sacto?
In fact it is a tenth lane at Franklin Field on the first 200, and there are ten runners in the 100 and 110 hurdle races in the Penn Relays, but only nine teams in the 4x1, and 4x2 which are in lanes all the way around. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Saturday, August 05, 2000 11:47 AM Subject: Re: t-and-f: lane usage at Sacto? In a message dated 8/4/00 3:27:23 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Sacto is NOT a full 9 lane track. Lane 9 starts at the 200m line and runs to the finish. There is no lane 9 from the start to the 200m. I'd guess the reason for that is in case there is a tie in the 100 or 200 and they need to add a 9th athlete to the field. Sounds like the opposite of Franklin Field, where there is a 9th lane for the 1st half of the track (I suppose to allow a few more relay teams on the start line before they break on the backstretch) Jim Gerweck Running Times
Re: t-and-f: Larry Rawson's Day job
I think I read somewherethat Larry ran 4:09. Ed Koch -Original Message- From: Thomas Pinckney [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Pete [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tuesday, August 01, 2000 10:25 AM Subject: Re: t-and-f: Larry Rawson's Day job At 08:04 PM 7/31/2000 -0400, Pete wrote: http://espn.go.com/espninc/personalities/larryrawson.html "Rawson owns an investment company, Credit Research and Trading Corp., based in Greenwich, Conn." The link also states: Rawson is a 1963 Boston College graduate with bachelor of science degrees in business and English. A former New England college record holder in the mile, he is a member of the school's Athletic Hall of Fame. Larry, are you subscribed these days? What did you run for the mile? (and let me add my kudos for the Bislett broadcast -- a really fine job on the running events, tho a bit weak on field event presentation. Too bad the other Golden League meets will not be broadcast the same day). Coty Pinckney [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: t-and-f: Junior Olympics
Doctor Jabbour is doing a wonderful job as I am next door in the announcer's booth to his operation. I hope more meets not on TV are on his website in the future. One point, however. The Junior Olympics are arguably the world's largest championship meet, but is much smaller than the Penn Relays, of course, which has over double the athletes. And Dave Johnson might even argue that Penn is a championship meet given the "Championship of America" relays in it.I Ed Koch - Original Message - From: Dr Kamal Jabbour [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 26, 2000 12:34 PM Subject: t-and-f: Junior Olympics TrackMeets.com continues the live webcast of the USA Track and Field Junior Olympics from Buffalo, NY. Surfers can choose amongst four streams: 1 Mbps track stream, 500 kbps track stream, 500 kbps field stream and 28 kbps stadium announcer audio stream. With 6,700 athletes competing, this is arguably the world's largest track meet. DR KAMAL JABBOUR - Engineer, Educator, Runner, WriterO o 2-222 Center for Science and Technology /|\/ |\ Syracuse University, Syracuse NY 13244-4100 | | Phone 315-443-3000, Fax 315-443-2583 __/ \ \/ \ http://running.syr.edu/jabbour.html\ \
