Re: [Tagging] Dispute on highway=mini_roundabout
On Thu, 2012-05-10 at 17:43 -0400, Nathan Edgars II wrote: I've started tagging local mini_roundabouts with mountable=yes/no. Most have trees and are obviously not. But I'm not exactly sure where the line is. Should one with a low curb, more like a gutter, be considered a true mini-roundabout or not? For example, this one in Kissimmee: http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=enll=28.292105,-81.404818spn=0.004204,0.008256gl=ust=mz=18layer=ccbll=28.292041,-81.404739panoid=USYkfOYkh2zXnjx-zCLrKQcbp=12,122.16,,0,9.06 That looks like a mini-roundabout to me, it is certainly traversable. The kerbs just serve to 'encourage' drivers to go around, but a truck making a turn would have no problem getting over the island. Phil (trig222) ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Dispute on highway=mini_roundabout
As there seems to be a consensus approaching on the horizon, I'll continue to work on some examples (positive and negative) to prevent misinterpretation in the future. I already got some nice photos (but could also need some more) so I guess I can finish it quite soon. As usually I'll post a link to the examples then so they can be reviewed before the article is updated. However one thing that was already mentioned is still left: turning_circle . We have the same problem here as with mini_roundabout, as the tag should only be used if there is no island present but in fact it is also used in such cases. However we must admit that the implications for data consumers are somewhat smaller compared with mini_roundabout. To be really relevant for e.g. a router the destination(!) of a large(!) vehicle must be within a narrow(!) dead-end(!) street. That's a lot of prerequisites to be relevant. Also the term turning circle is not as widely used and precisely defined as mini-roundabout (please correct me if this is wrong). So how should we treat this case? To throw in my opinion as a starter: as relevance is much smaller, I would guess an additional tag like centre_island=yes/no or something similar should be sufficient. If it is not there it is simply unknown if there is an island or not, which in fact is the way data consumers have to treat turning_circle right now. Martin P.S: I worth seeing video was posted on a different mailing list: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzZHyTwjPug Yes, this in fact is a mini-roundabout, however a maxi one ;-) And yes, it was a regular junction a few days before. How I know that? Watch it! ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Dispute on highway=mini_roundabout
2012/5/11 Martin Vonwald imagic@gmail.com: However one thing that was already mentioned is still left: turning_circle . We have the same problem here as with mini_roundabout, as the tag should only be used if there is no island present but in fact it is also used in such cases. What are the minimum measurements of a turning circle, what is the maximum above which it is suggested to draw an area? IMHO this turning_circle node is an approximation anyway (if in doubt you can not deduct from it in its current form whether you will get problems with your large vehicle or not). It could of course be enhanced (shape, orientation, width, length, ...) but if you did this you'd be faster (and still more flexible and accurate and more intuitively refineable) by simply drawing it rather than inserting these parametrically. Cheers, Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Openstreetview or similar and JOSM integration
Thought I’d cc John McKerrell on this in case he wants to chime in. He is the guy behind OpenStreetView. - Laurence On 10 May 2012, at 13:59, Jaakko Helleranta.com wrote: Related project as in? I have geotagged survey-type photos that I'd love to upload to such service. As mentioned before OpenStreetView is not for survey-focused photos but rather kind of an Open equivalent of Panoramio. Cheers from Haiti, -Jaakko User:jaakkoh Sent from my BlackBerry® device from Digicel -- Mobile: +509-37-26 91 54, Skype/GoogleTalk: jhelleranta -Original Message- From: Martin Vonwald imagic@gmail.com Date: Thu, 10 May 2012 13:04:38 To: Tag discussion, strategy and related toolstagging@openstreetmap.org Reply-To: Tag discussion, strategy and related tools tagging@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [Tagging] Openstreetview or similar and JOSM integration Do not expect the JOSM developer to follow every mailing-list but rather open a ticket at josm.openstreetmap.de As soon as there is a project where photos can be uploaded for this purpose, I will do that. But right now josm.openstreetmap.de would be the wrong place in my opinion, because there is nothing to implement in JOSM yet. As this mailing list has a related tools in its description I thought it would be a good idea to ask here first. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
[Tagging] Two lane expressways
Hi, Two-lane expressways. I came across one of these when running an analysis on OSM data in Vermont, USA. I didn't even know they existed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-lane_expressway#United_States The one I looked at is tagged as motorway: http://osm.org/go/ZfEWG3GI-- http://osm.org/go/ZfUQxspO That feels right to me. Is it the convention to tag them as highway=motorway? Reason is I am running an analysis to detect trouble with the main road network. One trouble flag is highway=motorway without oneway tag, but that would flag this road here and it's perfectly OK. Another trouble flag is potential missing bridge or tunnel tags, my current query relies on two intersections between motorway and other way, and thus wouldn't catch instances where the motorway is just one line feature. -- martijn van exel http://oegeo.wordpress.com ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Two lane expressways
On 5/11/2012 4:23 PM, Martijn van Exel wrote: Hi, Two-lane expressways. I came across one of these when running an analysis on OSM data in Vermont, USA. I didn't even know they existed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-lane_expressway#United_States The one I looked at is tagged as motorway: http://osm.org/go/ZfEWG3GI-- http://osm.org/go/ZfUQxspO That feels right to me. Is it the convention to tag them as highway=motorway? Reason is I am running an analysis to detect trouble with the main road network. One trouble flag is highway=motorway without oneway tag, but that would flag this road here and it's perfectly OK. Since oneway=yes is the default for motorways (per the wiki, and apparently some routers), these should be tagged as oneway=no (as these two in fact are). It's somewhat more common to have a two-way motorway_link, which should also be tagged oneway=no. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Openstreetview or similar and JOSM integration
Why can't we use an existing service (like Flickr )? Just let apps upload pictures to Flickr with certain tags, so josm can download these. Maybe there are better platforms for this. But I would not like to upload pictures anyway, because they often contain people, and I don't want to harm their privacy. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Openstreetview or similar and JOSM integration
Flickr already has an OpenStreetMap 'machine tag' to link flickr photos to an OSM object[1]. So that's feasible. You need a pro account for flickr if you're going to make any kind of serious use of it though. How is this a tagging question by the way? [1] http://code.flickr.com/blog/2009/09/28/thats-maybe-a-bit-too-dorky-even-for-us/ On Fri, May 11, 2012 at 2:41 PM, Sander Deryckere sander...@gmail.com wrote: Why can't we use an existing service (like Flickr )? Just let apps upload pictures to Flickr with certain tags, so josm can download these. Maybe there are better platforms for this. But I would not like to upload pictures anyway, because they often contain people, and I don't want to harm their privacy. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging -- martijn van exel http://oegeo.wordpress.com ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Two lane expressways
On Fri, May 11, 2012 at 2:37 PM, Nathan Edgars II nerou...@gmail.com wrote: On 5/11/2012 4:23 PM, Martijn van Exel wrote: Hi, Two-lane expressways. I came across one of these when running an analysis on OSM data in Vermont, USA. I didn't even know they existed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-lane_expressway#United_States The one I looked at is tagged as motorway: http://osm.org/go/ZfEWG3GI-- http://osm.org/go/ZfUQxspO That feels right to me. Is it the convention to tag them as highway=motorway? Reason is I am running an analysis to detect trouble with the main road network. One trouble flag is highway=motorway without oneway tag, but that would flag this road here and it's perfectly OK. Since oneway=yes is the default for motorways (per the wiki, and apparently some routers), these should be tagged as oneway=no (as these two in fact are). It's somewhat more common to have a two-way motorway_link, which should also be tagged oneway=no. That's a good point. I can use that convention to improve my query. -- martijn van exel http://oegeo.wordpress.com ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Two lane expressways
On Fri, May 11, 2012 at 1:23 PM, Martijn van Exel m...@rtijn.org wrote: Hi, Two-lane expressways. I came across one of these when running an analysis on OSM data in Vermont, USA. I didn't even know they existed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-lane_expressway#United_States The one I looked at is tagged as motorway: http://osm.org/go/ZfEWG3GI-- http://osm.org/go/ZfUQxspO That feels right to me. Is it the convention to tag them as highway=motorway? I'd be strongly inclined to tag it as a trunk since it's not divided, and especially since it's fairly short, terminating in more trunks. Trunks can have motorway-like features, but I'm inclined to consider motorways with only one physical way and/or intersections as trunk. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Two lane expressways
Paul Johnson ba...@ursamundi.org wrote: On Fri, May 11, 2012 at 1:23 PM, Martijn van Exel m...@rtijn.org wrote: Hi, Two-lane expressways. I came across one of these when running an analysis on OSM data in Vermont, USA. I didn't even know they existed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-lane_expressway#United_States The one I looked at is tagged as motorway: http://osm.org/go/ZfEWG3GI-- http://osm.org/go/ZfUQxspO That feels right to me. Is it the convention to tag them as highway=motorway? I'd be strongly inclined to tag it as a trunk since it's not divided, and especially since it's fairly short, terminating in more trunks. Trunks can have motorway-like features, but I'm inclined to consider motorways with only one physical way and/or intersections as trunk. Major road repairs, such as repairing a bridge, or a point where a landslide has blocked one side of a motorway, sometimes require changing a section of the other side of the motorway into two-way traffic. Generally, a temporary concrete barrier will be erected to separate the two traffic flows, but I have seen emergency situations where the only separation was a row of reflector cones. In such a situation, would you recommend retagging that portion of the motorway as trunk instead of motorway? -- John F. Eldredge -- j...@jfeldredge.com Reserve your right to think, for even to think wrongly is better than not to think at all. -- Hypatia of Alexandria ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Two lane expressways
On May 11, 2012 2:41 PM, John F. Eldredge j...@jfeldredge.com wrote: Paul Johnson ba...@ursamundi.org wrote: On Fri, May 11, 2012 at 1:23 PM, Martijn van Exel m...@rtijn.org wrote: Hi, Two-lane expressways. I came across one of these when running an analysis on OSM data in Vermont, USA. I didn't even know they existed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-lane_expressway#United_States The one I looked at is tagged as motorway: http://osm.org/go/ZfEWG3GI-- http://osm.org/go/ZfUQxspO That feels right to me. Is it the convention to tag them as highway=motorway? I'd be strongly inclined to tag it as a trunk since it's not divided, and especially since it's fairly short, terminating in more trunks. Trunks can have motorway-like features, but I'm inclined to consider motorways with only one physical way and/or intersections as trunk. Major road repairs, such as repairing a bridge, or a point where a landslide has blocked one side of a motorway, sometimes require changing a section of the other side of the motorway into two-way traffic. Generally, a temporary concrete barrier will be erected to separate the two traffic flows, but I have seen emergency situations where the only separation was a row of reflector cones. In such a situation, would you recommend retagging that portion of the motorway as trunk instead of motorway? No, because that's a temporary situation. There are a few limited two-way one-road motorways, though construction and emergency situations are a poor example. A better example would be the Golden Gate Bridge or BC 7 at certain bridges that have lane control signals and aren't completely reversible. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
