Re: [Tagging] Proposed mechanical edit: surface=soil to surface=dirt (history (authors of changesets))

2015-09-07 Thread Ruben Maes 
Wednesday 02 September 2015 13:51:09, André Pirard:
> What policy, what purpose, that's unclear?
> Is OSM.org using that API to display the history on the screen illegal?
> Is Osmose using it to attribute errors to some user illegal?
> Yep, I suppose that making oneself a complete list of OSM users is 
> inappropriate.

No, the osm.org site doesn't use the API. Rather, it queries the database 
directly.

I think it's not about "illegal" in the sense of prohibited out of privacy 
concerns or the like, but about the fact that we don't have unlimited capacity 
and that mappers mapping should not be hindered by people that want to query 
the API for unrelated uses.

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Re: [Tagging] Proposed mechanical edit: surface=soil to surface=dirt (history (authors of changesets))

2015-09-02 Thread Mateusz Konieczny 
On Tue, 01 Sep 2015 23:55:14 +0200
"André Pirard"  wrote:

> On 2015-08-31 20:12, � wrote :
> > On Mon, 31 Aug 2015, Mateusz Konieczny wrote:
> >
> >> On Mon, 31 Aug 2015 12:55:27 +0200
> >> moltonel 3x Combo  wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 31/08/2015, Mateusz Konieczny  wrote:
>  Is there some method to automate finding who introduced tags?
>  Doing it manually would not be worth the effort. On the other
>  hand - running script to detect users (and/or relevant
>  changesets) may be a good idea.
> >>> curl -s
> >>> 'http://overpass-api.de/api/interpreter?data=%5Bout%3Ajson%5D%5Btimeout%3A25%5D%3B%0A%28%0A%20%20node%5B%22surface%22%3D%22soil%22%5D%3B%0A%20%20way%5B%22surface%22%3D%22soil%22%5D%3B%0A%20%20relation%5B%22surface%22%3D%22soil%22%5D%3B%0A%29%3B%0Aout%20meta%3B'
> >>> | grep user | sort| uniq -c
> >>>
> >>> or
> >>>
> >>> http://overpass-turbo.eu/?w=%22surface%22%3D%22soil%22+global
> >>> (and add 'meta' to the output to extract the user/changeset)
> >>>
> >>> These have the usual drawback that they only return who last
> >>> touched the object, not who introduced a particular tag. It gets
> >>> more complicated to do things exactly right, but this is a good
> >>> starting point.
> >> Getting latest person who edited object is really easy. The
> >> history is main problem - is there some API for getting old
> >> version for given objects with user/changeset that edited it?
> > At least the main API can give you the old versions of the object
> > in .osm using:
> >
> > http://www.openstreetmap.org/api/0.6/node/$i/$v
> 
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/api/0.6/node/3157502486/history
> 
> will return the complete list (history) of authors, changesets and
> dates for a given element.

Yes, this would work (some parsing still would be needed). Unfortunately
according to http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/API_usage_policy it is
not OK to use API for that purpose.

Who should be contacted to change rules to allow limited read-only or
to get exemption from this rules? DWG? OSMF? Open ticket on
https://github.com/openstreetmap/openstreetmap-website ?

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Re: [Tagging] Proposed mechanical edit: surface=soil to surface=dirt (history (authors of changesets))

2015-09-02 Thread André Pirard 

  
  
On 2015-09-02 08:34, Mateusz Konieczny
  wrote :


  On Tue, 01 Sep 2015 23:55:14 +0200
"André Pirard"  wrote:


  
On 2015-08-31 20:12, � wrote :


  On Mon, 31 Aug 2015, Mateusz Konieczny wrote:


  
On Mon, 31 Aug 2015 12:55:27 +0200
moltonel 3x Combo  wrote:



  On 31/08/2015, Mateusz Konieczny  wrote:

  
Is there some method to automate finding who introduced tags?
Doing it manually would not be worth the effort. On the other
hand - running script to detect users (and/or relevant
changesets) may be a good idea.

  
  curl -s
'http://overpass-api.de/api/interpreter?data="">'
| grep user | sort| uniq -c

or

http://overpass-turbo.eu/?w=%22surface%22%3D%22soil%22+global
(and add 'meta' to the output to extract the user/changeset)

These have the usual drawback that they only return who last
touched the object, not who introduced a particular tag. It gets
more complicated to do things exactly right, but this is a good
starting point.


Getting latest person who edited object is really easy. The
history is main problem - is there some API for getting old
version for given objects with user/changeset that edited it?

  
  At least the main API can give you the old versions of the object
in .osm using:

http://www.openstreetmap.org/api/0.6/node/$i/$v



http://www.openstreetmap.org/api/0.6/node/3157502486/history

will return the complete list (history) of authors, changesets and
dates for a given element.

  
  
Yes, this would work (some parsing still would be needed). Unfortunately
according to http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/API_usage_policy it is
not OK to use API for that purpose.


What policy, what purpose, that's unclear?
Is OSM.org using that API to display the history on the screen
illegal?
Is Osmose using it to attribute errors to some user illegal?
Yep, I suppose that making oneself a complete list of OSM users is
inappropriate.

Regarding the needed parsing:  use regex (as in perl again): it does
wonders!
If you need regex drill, install it in some editor like Advanced
Find/Replace plugin for gedit. Gorgeous.
(there are packages to handle xml more correctly but regex is OK for
that kind of predictable, repetitive data.)


  

  André.

  



  


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Re: [Tagging] Proposed mechanical edit: surface=soil to surface=dirt (history (authors of changesets))

2015-09-02 Thread moltonel 3x Combo 
On 02/09/2015, Mateusz Konieczny  wrote:
> On Tue, 01 Sep 2015 23:55:14 +0200
> "André Pirard"  wrote:
>> http://www.openstreetmap.org/api/0.6/node/3157502486/history
>>
>> will return the complete list (history) of authors, changesets and
>> dates for a given element.
>
> Yes, this would work (some parsing still would be needed). Unfortunately
> according to http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/API_usage_policy it is
> not OK to use API for that purpose.

I actually think using the API for that purpose is perfectly within
the usage policy:
* The ultimate goal is to edit OSM, by knowing who introduced a tag
and contacting him
* Contributors already do this all the time from within the editor,
only one object at a time
* Typical usage (on an ad-hoc basis and < 1000 objects) should be low
enough. While it can potentially be heavy enough to break the usage
policy, this is a separate issue of how the tool is used rather than
what the tool does.

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Re: [Tagging] Proposed mechanical edit: surface=soil to surface=dirt (history (authors of changesets))

2015-09-01 Thread André Pirard 
On 2015-08-31 20:12, � wrote :
> On Mon, 31 Aug 2015, Mateusz Konieczny wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 31 Aug 2015 12:55:27 +0200
>> moltonel 3x Combo  wrote:
>>
>>> On 31/08/2015, Mateusz Konieczny  wrote:
 Is there some method to automate finding who introduced tags? Doing
 it manually would not be worth the effort. On the other hand -
 running script to detect users (and/or relevant changesets) may be
 a good idea.
>>> curl -s
>>> 'http://overpass-api.de/api/interpreter?data=%5Bout%3Ajson%5D%5Btimeout%3A25%5D%3B%0A%28%0A%20%20node%5B%22surface%22%3D%22soil%22%5D%3B%0A%20%20way%5B%22surface%22%3D%22soil%22%5D%3B%0A%20%20relation%5B%22surface%22%3D%22soil%22%5D%3B%0A%29%3B%0Aout%20meta%3B'
>>> | grep user | sort| uniq -c
>>>
>>> or
>>>
>>> http://overpass-turbo.eu/?w=%22surface%22%3D%22soil%22+global (and add
>>> 'meta' to the output to extract the user/changeset)
>>>
>>> These have the usual drawback that they only return who last touched
>>> the object, not who introduced a particular tag. It gets more
>>> complicated to do things exactly right, but this is a good starting
>>> point.
>> Getting latest person who edited object is really easy. The history is
>> main problem - is there some API for getting old version for given
>> objects with user/changeset that edited it?
> At least the main API can give you the old versions of the object in .osm 
> using:
>
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/api/0.6/node/$i/$v

http://www.openstreetmap.org/api/0.6/node/3157502486/history

will return the complete list (history) of authors, changesets and dates
for a given element.

But I don't know an easy method to drop those users an e-mail.

I wrote quite a number of extremely simple perl programs like that.

Unfortunately, you will hear Osmose say that if someone who was falsely
(1) attributed an error it's not easy to let him request that the error
be re-attributed to the former author of the element.  Although it's
well known that everyone should make OSM modifications of things they
know, Osmose claim that anyone should obey their commands to correct
anything.
It may be the reason why you see overflowing Osmose error lists belong
to OSM nominees.
(1) most typical is making a benign change that happens to affect a
relation and you become the latest author not only of that relation but
maybe also of elements within.  And you know as little about them as
about the Acropolis walls.

Cheers

André.



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