Re: [OSM-talk] walking-papers hanging?

[Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists)]

Any particular part of the site? The site is accessible for me and I printed
off a sheet the other day. I haven't however uploaded a scan and I note the
last scan in the list on the site is 11 days ago now. Maybe that's your
problem?

Cheers

Andy 

>-Original Message-
>From: talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-
>boun...@openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Lukasz Stelmach
>Sent: 14 October 2009 1:12 AM
>To: talk@openstreetmap.org
>Subject: [OSM-talk] walking-papers hanging?
>
>Greetings.
>
>Is it only my impression or have the walking-pares stopped working over
>a week ago?
>
>--
>Bylo mi bardzo milo.   Czwarta pospolita kleska, [...]
>>Lukasz< Juz nie katolicka lecz zlodziejska.  (c)PP
>
>
>--
>Szukasz pracy? Chcesz lepiej zarabia?
>Sprawd oferty na http://link.interia.pl/f23ba


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Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (boundary=military)

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2009/10/14 Gilles Corlobé :
>> Joseph
> In my opinion, the tag "landuse=military" should only be used for specificly
> military activities, like those discribed in the wiki.
> Some of you have suggested to create 2 areas, covering the same place. I
> don't think this is correct. One of you said that's done every day. How can
> it be? There can't be a forest inside a residential area. The residential
> area stops where begins the forest (and the contrary).
> Gilles

might be true for residential and forest (still if it is a small
forest could IMHO be as well inside the residential area), but there
is other examples where e.g. forest or lake or railway-area or sth.
else is inside another landuse, thus being part of it. Think of parks,
a lake in the forest, a forest in a nature reserve, a forest in a
military area, ...

If it is not part of it, it has to be excluded by the use of a
multipolygon-relation.

cheers,
Martin

PS: What about continuing this discussion only in tagging-ML?

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Re: [OSM-talk] mapnik shelter rendering

[Andreas Labres]

Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
> How do you know that OSM-"shelter" is "Schutzhütte"? It could as well
> be "Unterstand"

Agreed. I think terms match closely:

English "shelter" is German "Unterstand" which is (wikipedia) "a basic
structure or building that provides cover", in German "ein überdachter
[offener] Platz als Schutz vor der Witterung". They at least have a
roof. That's it.
Fotos: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unterstand

"Schutzhütte" (i.t.o. "Berghütte", "Alpenvereinshütte") is an "alpine
hut" ("mountain hut") that at least partly is operated by a
"Hüttenwirt", you can get food and drink and mostly sleep there.
Fotos: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountain_hut
http://huetten.wandern-in-oesterreich.at/huetten.aspx

And these closely match Map_Features (amenity=shelter vs.
tourism=alpine_hut).

Of course it is correct in the figurative sense that you call an
Unterstand a Schutzhütte, but it mixes up things...

Best
- Andreas

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Re: [OSM-talk] OpenStreetBugs: shared database and translations

[Ed Avis]

I tend to use OpenStreetBugs when I spot something on the map that makes no
sense (such as one-way indications that leave you stuck in one place) or where
information is missing (as often when a road and cycleway cross, but there is
neither an explicit intersection nor an explicit layer tag to say they don't
intersect).  Usually this is when investigating a warning from
.

It's also useful to note a feature that should be surveyed and added to the map,
but where you don't have enough information to add it yourself.  For example you
might spot some missing streets from a car window as you drive past, but you
don't know how long they are or their exact position.

Adding a FIXME tag to the map is another way of marking these to-do items, but
that requires the feature to already exist.

Until now, when I have gone out to do mapping I have focused mainly on killing
the no-name highlights, and adding missing paths as a side effect.  But as inner
London is nearly complete now, in future I expect to go armed with a list of
bugs in an area and try to survey them.

-- 
Ed Avis 



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Re: [OSM-legal-talk] FW: Crown copyright dates ( OS Reference 72267)

[Barnett, Phillip]

Yes, I thought you were probably working along those lines, but I thought the 
quote I dug up was worth repeating, as it bears directly on the central point 
of the argument.

Re - erratic copyright notation - Crown copyright changed emphasis  with the 
1956 Crown Copyright Act,  so I guess they got more pro-active about putting 
dates on round about then. That's just a guess though - perhaps the Charles 
Close Society could tell us more. They also seemed very uncertain about all the 
styles of the 1:25000 maps during that period, changing formats every few 
years, so it's probably all part of that.
Bear in mind that they intended the range to be resurveyed fairly quickly as 
they were only done from old surveys anyway - so they probably assumed there 
wouldn't be any major reworking so the first publish date would suffice.

>Happy for you to lead the way here. 
OK, I'll try this angle with them and see where we get to.

Cheers

From: legal-talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org 
[legal-talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Andy Robinson 
(blackadder-lists) [ajrli...@googlemail.com]
Sent: 14 October 2009 00:45
To: 'Licensing and other legal discussions.'
Subject: Re: [OSM-legal-talk] FW: Crown copyright dates ( OS Reference 72267)

Phillip,

That's where I was coming from and specifically why I quoted the examples I
did. I certainly think its worth an appeal (but perhaps discussion with them
first) in line with what you say. I don't really know why the 1:25 first
services was so hit and miss with a printed (c). very few have them (mostly
a few in the 1950's). All the early editions just have the format as per my
examples but without the revision.

Incidentally the vast majority of these maps only have minor changes or
minor corrections. Just a handful have major changes.



Cheers

Andy

>-Original Message-
>From: legal-talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:legal-talk-
>boun...@openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Barnett, Phillip
>Sent: 13 October 2009 6:00 PM
>To: 'Licensing and other legal discussions.'
>Subject: Re: [OSM-legal-talk] FW: Crown copyright dates ( OS Reference
>72267)
>
>Andy,
>
>Crown copyright maps, and books, are reprinted all the time. Copyright
>dates stay the same, generally.
>The crux point is what triggers a new copyright date.
>
>Guidance notes from the OPSI -
>"A new edition of a published work which contains substantial revisions
>would normally qualify as a new copyright work. For example, if a
>department first published a document in 1997 and subsequently revised and
>reissued it in 2004, the notice in the revised version would indicate the
>copyright date of 2004, although it would be customary - and helpful - to
>state that an earlier version had been issued in 1997. A reprint or new
>impression without any substantial changes to the text would not constitute
>a new copyright work."
>
>The last sentence is the important one - of the examples that you sent to
>them below, all explicitly claim 'minor' changes to the work, and so the
>OPSI guidelines indicate that no copyright date change would be the case,
>which is presumably why the maps were never printed with a revised
>copyright date in the first place.
>
>'Reprinted with minor corrections 1960'
>'Reprinted with minor changes 1963.'
>'Reprinted with the addition of new major roads 1967.' - this one is
>possibly debateable as it contains the word 'major'  - substitute 'A roads'
>for 'major roads' and I contend it qualifies as minor changes.
>
>So the situation should be -
>A map published with a (c) date means the (c) date applies and if no (c)
>date printed then the FIRST publication date on the sheet applies.
>And we have plenty of examples collected of where the revision date is
>later than the explicitly printed copyright date, which rather proves my
>point. (eg my copy of SO13, Talgarth, (c) 1951, major road revisions 1976)
>
>Now, who's going to take this up with Tony Gray? (I'm happy to argue the
>point, if you don't mind my quoting your correspondence. Otherwise I'll
>just point him to the OPSI guidance)
>
>Cheers
>Phillip
>
>
>
>
>-Original Message-
>From: legal-talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:legal-talk-
>boun...@openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists)
>Sent: 13 October 2009 15:59
>To: 'Licensing and other legal discussions.'
>Subject: Re: [OSM-legal-talk] FW: Crown copyright dates ( OS Reference
>72267)
>
>I'm comfortable that the OS has spoken. A map published with a (c) date
>means the (c) date applies and if no (c) date printed then the last
>publication date on the sheet applies.
>
>At least we have a basis to move on though I think we could still appeal
>this latest FOIA response.
>
>Cheers
>
>Andy
>
>>-Original Message-
>>From: legal-talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:legal-talk-
>>boun...@openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Barnett, Phillip
>>Sent: 13 October 2009 3:47 PM
>>To: 'Licensing and other legal discussion

Re: [OSM-talk] walking-papers hanging?

[stlman]

"Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists)"  pisze:
>-Original Message-
>From: talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-
>boun...@openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Lukasz Stelmach
>Sent: 14 October 2009 1:12 AM
> >
> >Is it only my impression or have the walking-pares stopped working over
> >a week ago?
> Any particular part of the site? The site is accessible for me and I
> printed off a sheet the other day. I haven't however uploaded a scan
> and I note the last scan in the list on the site is 11 days ago now.
> Maybe that's your problem?

Yup. That's what I am talking about. I've tried to upload a scan yesterday.

-- 
>steelman<

--
Opony do 30% taniej, dostawa gratis!
http://link.interia.pl/f23c9



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[OSM-talk] How would you present OSM on a TV show?

[Ciprian Talaba]

Hi everybody,

Eddy Petrisor from the Romanian OSM community is close to get OSM on a
Romanian TV show, so in order to get the most from that appearance we tried
to get together some ideas. So the Media/TVShows wiki page was created. We
would like your help, so please tell us what would you like to hear on TV
about OSM. The page is available here:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Media/TVShows, any ideas are welcome.

Thanks,
Ciprian
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Re: [OSM-talk] How would you present OSM on a TV show?

[Andy Allan]

On Wed, Oct 14, 2009 at 2:39 PM, Ciprian Talaba  wrote:
> Hi everybody,
>
> Eddy Petrisor from the Romanian OSM community is close to get OSM on a
> Romanian TV show,

Cool - good luck Eddy!

A piece of advice I've always been given (and always forgotten to
actually do) is to "sell the benefits, not the features". So advice
would be to explain to people what the benefits of openstreetmap are,
rather than what the features are.

For example, OpenCycleMap lets you have more fun riding your bike,
have a safer route, makes it easier to find bike parking near your
office. Those are the benefits. OpenCycleMap is an international map
showing bike routes, bicycle parking and contour lines. Those are the
features. Of course, if you read any of the stuff I actually write
about OCM I'm always doing it wrong...

Cheers,
Andy

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Re: [OSM-talk] How would you present OSM on a TV show?

[bernhard]

hi
>
>
> Eddy Petrisor from the Romanian OSM community is close to get OSM on a 
> Romanian TV show, so in order to get the most from that appearance we 
> tried to get together some ideas. So the Media/TVShows wiki page was 
> created. We would like your help, so please tell us what would you 
> like to hear on TV about OSM. The page is available here: 
> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Media/TVShows, any ideas are welcome.
>
I was cycling in Romania this summer.

All the printed maps I found in book shops are bad quality compared to 
OSM. I also asked at many Petrol station for maps but couldn't get a 
street map.

Printed maps could be an excellent advertising media in Romania.
Tell the people how to print maps with OSM data.



Bernhard


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[OSM-talk] Looking for more opengeodata bloggers

[SteveC]

Hi

Love OpenStreetMap? Love blogging?

If anyone is interested in making opengeodata.org even more awesome  
please drop me a line for a account to blog with.

Yours &c.

Steve


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Re: [OSM-talk] RR8 - Possible International Vandal (assistance required in various countries)

[Richard Bullock]

> > Just a further heads up that this user appears to have posted to SABRE
> asking for a way to edit OSM privately. Any suggestions I should pass on
> to him? It should keep him from vandalising live data if it was possible.
>
Just a bit of a heads up really.

I've just spotted some random changing of road classificaions from old 
friend RR8 again. Some are definitely wrong.

Can people check local edits to check to see if anything has been 
incorrectly changed? 


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Re: [OSM-talk] walking-papers hanging?

[Michal Migurski]

Sorry, I had to give it another kick.

I'm going to set up a secondary processor for these things to have a  
fail over, wish I had the opportunity to give this thing the attention  
it deserves day to day.

-mike.

On Oct 14, 2009, at 11:22 AM, SteveC wrote:

>
>
> Begin forwarded message:
>
>> From: stl...@poczta.fm
>> Date: 14 October 2009 06:04:32 PDT
>> To: Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists) 
>> Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org
>> Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] walking-papers hanging?
>>
>>
>>
>> "Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists)"  pisze:
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-
>>> boun...@openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Lukasz Stelmach
>>> Sent: 14 October 2009 1:12 AM

 Is it only my impression or have the walking-pares stopped  
 working over
 a week ago?
>>> Any particular part of the site? The site is accessible for me and I
>>> printed off a sheet the other day. I haven't however uploaded a scan
>>> and I note the last scan in the list on the site is 11 days ago now.
>>> Maybe that's your problem?
>>
>> Yup. That's what I am talking about. I've tried to upload a scan  
>> yesterday.
>>
>> -- 
>>> steelman<
>>
>> --
>> Opony do 30% taniej, dostawa gratis!
>> http://link.interia.pl/f23c9
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>
> Yours &c.
>
> Steve
>
>


michal migurski- m...@stamen.com
  415.558.1610




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[OSM-talk] Changing the account that uploaded the TIGER data

[Dave Hansen]

So, I just noticed that this map:

http://matt.sandbox.cloudmade.com/?lat=45.528599&lng=-122.885771&zoom=15&layer=2

has my own street listed as unedited TIGER data.  I think someone is
just using "user==DaveHansen" as a test for edited vs. uneditied TIGER
data.

So, I changed the display name.  It is now DaveHansenTiger, with an
email of osm-ti...@sr71.net.  I created a new account 'DaveHansen' with
my regular d...@sr71.net email.  I promise not to use DaveHansenTiger
any more.  If I do a new upload, I'll use DaveHansenTiger2009 or
something.

Cool?

-- Dave


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Re: [OSM-talk] Changing the account that uploaded the TIGER data

[Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason]

On Wed, Oct 14, 2009 at 11:37 PM, Dave Hansen  wrote:
> So, I just noticed that this map:
>
> http://matt.sandbox.cloudmade.com/?lat=45.528599&lng=-122.885771&zoom=15&layer=2
>
> has my own street listed as unedited TIGER data.  I think someone is
> just using "user==DaveHansen" as a test for edited vs. uneditied TIGER
> data.
>
> So, I changed the display name.  It is now DaveHansenTiger, with an
> email of osm-ti...@sr71.net.  I created a new account 'DaveHansen' with
> my regular d...@sr71.net email.  I promise not to use DaveHansenTiger
> any more.  If I do a new upload, I'll use DaveHansenTiger2009 or
> something.

What people should be doing is checking for your UID which is 7168 for
DaveHansenTiger. That's what Potlatch does for instance when
highlighting unchanged TIGER data.

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Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (boundary=military)

[Russ Nelson]

Dave F. writes:
 > The "just go ahead & do it" philosophy that some advocate just puts 
 > errors into OSM that may not get fully removed, especially if they've 
 > been around for a while & have been copied by others.

Please go back to my proposed steps.  What "errors" do you see defined
there?  The only error that I see is to fail to document your use of a
tag in the wiki.  Because other, more serious errors, are averted by
your attempt to document it.  If it's already there, and has a
different meaning than the one you have chosen, there's your red flag
that proceeding would be an error.

Map it, tag it, and document it.  Worry less about making a misteak,
and map more.

-- 
--my blog is athttp://blog.russnelson.com
Crynwr supports open source software
521 Pleasant Valley Rd. | +1 315-323-1241
Potsdam, NY 13676-3213  | Sheepdog   

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