Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Tagging in Wikidata

[Janko Mihelić]

2014-12-30 2:06 GMT+01:00 Kolossos :

>
> Perhaps you have a better example to let me re-think this topic.
> "cuisine=fastfood" is only used 12 times [2].
>

For example bike paths (Q221722), highway=path + bicycle=designated +
foot=designated + segregated=yes

Wind turbine (Q49833), power=generator + generator:source=wind

I can list all the other generator types here.

Reservoir (Q131681), natural=water + water=reservoir
plus all the other types of water.

man_made=tower +
tower:type=communication/climbing/bell_tower/cooling/lighting

Each one could have its Wikipedia page.

So, there are a lot. If you don't find a way to use multiple tags, I think
this will not be a serious project. Maybe there's a way to delimit strings
and use a format that can use n strings?

Janko Mihelić
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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Tagging in Wikidata

[Kolossos]

Ok, lets take the second example of Wind turbines:
power=generator + generator:source=wind

The first tag "power=generator" is a more general tag and you have the
specific tag "generator:source=wind". For the second tag you have a Wiki
page:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:generator:source%3Dwind
On this wiki-page you can find that the general tag "power=generator" is
obligatory. So this tag delivers no additional information, because it
exist in each case.

In my eyes the first general tag exist only for historical reasons and
for software/render-styles that are not very specific, they can work so
without an update after each creation of a new tag.

So please see the project as a project to link from Wikidata to OSM-Wiki
and taginfo, not as a project to register all combinations of tags.

Greetings Tim

Am 30.12.2014 um 11:29 schrieb Janko Mihelić:
> 
> 
> 2014-12-30 2:06 GMT+01:00 Kolossos  >:
> 
> 
> Perhaps you have a better example to let me re-think this topic.
> "cuisine=fastfood" is only used 12 times [2].
> 
> 
> For example bike paths (Q221722), highway=path + bicycle=designated +
> foot=designated + segregated=yes
> 
> Wind turbine (Q49833), power=generator + generator:source=wind
> 
> I can list all the other generator types here.
> 
> Reservoir (Q131681), natural=water + water=reservoir
> plus all the other types of water.
> 
> man_made=tower +
> tower:type=communication/climbing/bell_tower/cooling/lighting
> 
> Each one could have its Wikipedia page.
> 
> So, there are a lot. If you don't find a way to use multiple tags, I
> think this will not be a serious project. Maybe there's a way to delimit
> strings and use a format that can use n strings?
> 
> Janko Mihelić
> 
> 
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> 



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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Tagging in Wikidata

[Janko Mihelić]

Ok, you found a way to go around power=generator, but that's just a
loophole. How would you go around
highway=path+bicycle=designated+foot=designated+segregated=yes? If you
leave out just one of those tags, it changes the resulting meaning. What's
your solution? Just leave out Q221722 altogether? As OSM matures, number of
various combinations of tags with distinct meanings will only be higher.

Making a Wikidata list of tags without combinations is an OK reference, but
it will newer be complete.
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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Tagging in Wikidata

[Philip Barnes]

On Tue, 2014-12-30 at 02:06 +0100, Kolossos wrote:
> I would like to keep it as simple as possible and I don't want to
> replace the OSM-Wiki where all usefull combinations of tags are described.
> 
> You would not only destroy the URL to the OSM-Wiki you would also damage
> the format checking tools that we have in Wikidata[1].
> 
> Perhaps you have a better example to let me re-think this topic.
> "cuisine=fastfood" is only used 12 times [2].
> 
Fastfood is a method of service, not a cuisine.

Phil (trigpoint)



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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Tagging in Wikidata

[John F. Eldredge]

On 12/30/2014 03:00 PM, Philip Barnes wrote:

On Tue, 2014-12-30 at 02:06 +0100, Kolossos wrote:

I would like to keep it as simple as possible and I don't want to
replace the OSM-Wiki where all usefull combinations of tags are described.

You would not only destroy the URL to the OSM-Wiki you would also damage
the format checking tools that we have in Wikidata[1].

Perhaps you have a better example to let me re-think this topic.
"cuisine=fastfood" is only used 12 times [2].


Fastfood is a method of service, not a cuisine.

Phil (trigpoint)



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Agreed.  There are fast-food versions of many different cuisines.

--
John F. Eldredge -- j...@jfeldredge.com
"Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that.
Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that."
Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Tagging in Wikidata

[Janko Mihelić]

2014-12-30 23:36 GMT+01:00 John F. Eldredge :

> On 12/30/2014 03:00 PM, Philip Barnes wrote:
>
>> Fastfood is a method of service, not a cuisine.
>>
>>  Agreed.  There are fast-food versions of many different cuisines.
>

 Ok, but fastfood cuisine was not the point. The point is that tag
combinations have distinct meanings.
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Re: [OSM-talk] OSM-Tagging in Wikidata

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2014-12-29 11:55 GMT+01:00 Janko Mihelić :

> For example, in Wikidata you have an element "Fastfood restaurants"
> (Q1751429). How do you add "amenity=fastfood" and a combination of
> "amenity=restaurant + cuisine=fastfood"?
>
>


the combination of amenity=restaurant and cuisine=fastfood seems pointless
to me, fastfood is not a reasonable cuisine type when you look how cuisine
is used in osm (and fwiw, there are only 12 occurences of cuisine=fastfood
in the db, i.e. it's non-existent).

On the other hand, amenity=fastfood in osm might be more inclusive than
wikidatas "Fastfood restaurants" (Q1751429), so mapping them 1:1 might also
lead to some errors.

cheers,
Martin
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