Re: [OSM-talk] how are runways related to an airport/aerodrome
I'm curious about your uses for this. In what kind of situation would somebody know a runway code but not what airport? if you download OSM data (using the API) within a bounding box, you will get nodes, ways, and relations within that bounding box. One of the ways can be a runway. The airport node can be outside that bounding box. Now in order to know the airport name, the bounding box needs to padded up and the download API needs to be rerun. This is exactly what am doing right now. It's not bad either, because the second API call runs on my local OSM source which contains only the airports. I agree with your other notes. This is a very generic problem. Not sure how others have solved this issue with other entities you mentioned. Thanks Madhav -Original Message- From: Alan Millar [mailto:a...@bolis.com] Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 10:21 PM To: Madhav Vodnala Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: RE: [OSM-talk] how are runways related to an airport/aerodrome All that runway 'way' XML contains is one tag that says it's a runway. The problem is there is no easy way to correlate a runway to its airport. This is a generalized problem that reaches far beyond just runways. For any given way (of any kind), how do you associate it or characterize it as belonging to a larger area? An airport is a larger area, even if it has only be marked as a node in OSM; that is just a shortcut placeholder for the area. You certainly could use a relation. That seems like a lot of work to me. I would suggest looking at the ways other people have done it for other entities in OSM. How do you know a bike trail belongs to a park? How do you know a street belongs to a town? How do you know a foot path belongs to a university campus? The simple answer for all of them is the geometry. Short of that, the is_in tag is the most common one in use for this sort of thing. But really, matching geometry will be the simplest. You will pretty much always find the aerodrome area or node within 0.0020 degrees lat/lon of the runway, and most often within 0.0012 degrees, based on my experience in looking at them in OSM. It's not a visual problem, it's a math problem, and it's already been solved by others. Sort by distance, it becomes quite obvious which airport the runway belongs to. You can google for the calculations; you don't need to understand them to paste them into your script. (I don't understand the math, but it still works great for me.) For eg. Entering 30L in a search window should bring up SJC as the result. Note there can be multiple runways named 30L. Multiple? You bet. You're going to have a dozen or more. There are only 18 number sets to work with, plus L or R and sometimes C. If the runway is correctly named, it will be 12R/30L. 12R will always be the same runway as 30L. If you search for 30, you're likely to get a hundred matches or more. I've drawn or verified runways on about 3000 airports so far, and I think there are about 5000 or more airports listed in the English wikipedia. That's going to be a long search list. I'm curious about your uses for this. In what kind of situation would somebody know a runway code but not what airport? Perhaps there is other information or other ways to solve the problem that could help. Good luck on the project! - Alan ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] how are runways related to an airport/aerodrome
All that runway 'way' XML contains is one tag that says it's a runway. The problem is there is no easy way to correlate a runway to its airport. The wiki convention does not create any problem for visual map style applications, because they have spatial awareness. The problem is for non-visual applications, especially the one am working on. I created an OSM file/table that contains only runways in the world. Another OSM file contains only airports. Am looking for an easy locate the airport for a given runway. For eg. Entering 30L in a search window should bring up SJC as the result. Note there can be multiple runways named 30L. Hope that clarifies the issue. Thanks Madhav -Original Message- From: talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Alan Millar Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 1:26 AM To: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] how are runways related to an airport/aerodrome In this Mapping Features documentation page, it says add only http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:aeroway aeroway=runway tag to the way to denote it a runway http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:aeroway%3Drunway Does anybody have an alternative solution?. I think adding new relation can address this issue. Can you explain what exactly is the problem or issue you are concerned about? In the example you gave, it looked like two clearly marked runways. I don't see any problems with them. The aeroway=aerodrome tag can be used on either a node or an area. Most of the time it is a node placed near the center of the airport. When it is used on an area, it marks the grounds or boundary of the airport. For example: http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/5024354 I don't think it is a good idea to put the iata or icao codes on the runway, because they really apply to the whole place. They should go on the aeroway=aerodrome item (node or area) like the wiki says. - Alan ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] how are runways related to an airport/aerodrome
Hi Guys In this Mapping Features documentation page, it says add only http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:aeroway aeroway=runway tag to the way to denote it a runway http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:aeroway%3Drunway As a result, you will see runways as the following. I have not yet checked it out, but it looks like the only way is to traverse all the nodes. Does anybody have an alternative solution?. I think adding new relation can address this issue. way id=22874052 visible=true timestamp=2008-08-20T12:23:52Z version=4 changeset=336266 user=StellanL uid=28775 nd ref=245919583/ nd ref=14779/ nd ref=147555670/ nd ref=147555658/ nd ref=147564433/ nd ref=147555647/ nd ref=147555641/ nd ref=147564400/ nd ref=147555624/ nd ref=14764/ nd ref=272221974/ nd ref=272221770/ tag k=name v=30L/ tag k=created_by v=Potlatch 0.10b/ tag k=aeroway v=runway/ /way way id=22874055 visible=true timestamp=2008-08-20T12:21:56Z version=4 changeset=336266 user=StellanL uid=28775 nd ref=245919584/ nd ref=147555730/ nd ref=147555717/ nd ref=245808503/ nd ref=147555706/ nd ref=147555695/ nd ref=147555680/ nd ref=147555610/ nd ref=272221980/ nd ref=14791/ nd ref=272221768/ nd ref=272221769/ tag k=name v=30R/ tag k=created_by v=Potlatch 0.10b/ tag k=aeroway v=runway/ /way ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] how are runways related to an airport/aerodrome
This is a good idea. Is ICAO code same as the airport code as identified by US DOT?.US DOT provides a lot of useful information on the world airports. http://www.transtats.bts.gov/DL_SelectFields.asp?Table_ID=288DB_Short_Name=Aviation%20Support%20Tables relation definitely seems unnecessary here. On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 5:12 AM, OJ W ojwli...@googlemail.com wrote: in commercial nav data, the runways contain a tag with the airport's ICAO code ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] newbie question related to ele (elevation)
Thanks Tom. That explains it. On Mon, Jun 1, 2009 at 12:42 AM, Tom Hughes t...@compton.nu wrote: Madhav Vodnala wrote: There use to be ele tag for nodes. I exported a small area into an OSM file today and I do not see ele tag anymore. Is that removed?. Presumably because nobody felt like tagging any of the nodes in the area you downloaded with that tag. There are no restrictions on what tags you can add so it's entirely up to you whether you add an ele tag to something. I would only expect to see it on things like mountain peaks or other objects where the elevation is of some specific interest, so in most areas you download you probably won't see any. Tom -- Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu) http://www.compton.nu/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] R: newbie question related to ele (elevation)
FabrizioThanks. I think thats the right approach. Am going to look into it in detail. From the outside it looks the data format is somewhat complicated. --Madhav 2009/6/1 Fabrizio Carrai fabrizio.car...@gmail.com Not an expert, but wouldn't be a better approach to use the DEM data ? Maybe the accuracy wouldn't be great everywhere but the coverage should be more extended. F. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_elevation_model -Messaggio originale- *Da:* talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto: talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org]*per conto di *Madhav Vodnala *Inviato:* lunedì 1 giugno 2009 9.24 *A:* talk@openstreetmap.org *Oggetto:* [OSM-talk] newbie question related to ele (elevation) There use to be ele tag for nodes. I exported a small area into an OSM file today and I do not see ele tag anymore. Is that removed?. I saw some discussions around non usefulness of that tag. http://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=403 My interest in finding elevation of a given location (lat,lon). What is the best way to find that? Thanks Madhav ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] newbie question related to ele (elevation)
There use to be ele tag for nodes. I exported a small area into an OSM file today and I do not see ele tag anymore. Is that removed?. I saw some discussions around non usefulness of that tag. http://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=403 My interest in finding elevation of a given location (lat,lon). What is the best way to find that? Thanks Madhav ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
