Re: [OSM-talk] Routing through access=delivery
Markus, Indeed, Mapzen (Valhalla) routing was processing motor_vehicle=delivery incorrectly. We have updated our servers with the latest code and we are no longer taking the service road as you described. Thank you for reporting this issue and let us know if you have additional issues. Thanks again. --Greg Knisely On Sat, Feb 13, 2016 at 7:00 AM, wrote: > Send talk mailing list submissions to > talk@openstreetmap.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > talk-requ...@openstreetmap.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of talk digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > >1. Routing through access=delivery (Markus Heidelberg) > > > -- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sat, 13 Feb 2016 10:13:45 +0100 > From: Markus Heidelberg > To: talk@openstreetmap.org > Subject: [OSM-talk] Routing through access=delivery > Message-ID: <5799001.Sx99Mkpynt@evo> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Hi, > > last week after missing the exit on a highway=motorway, a Garmin Nüvi > 300 with a Lambertus map tried to turn through a service road mapped > with motor_vehicle=delivery. This road connects the motorway directions > via service area on each side. > > I thought this might be a problem with mkgmap (which creates the Garmin > maps), but Mapzen and OSRM routing behave the same: > > https://www.openstreetmap.org/directions?engine=mapzen_car&route=49.31689%2C8.57541%3B49.31659%2C8.57453#map=17/49.31827/8.57205 > > Is this on purpose or do all three maps/routers ignore the > access=delivery tags wrongly? > > Additional info on an already existing note at the concerned location > (in German): > https://www.openstreetmap.org/note/238113 > > Markus > > > > > -- > > Subject: Digest Footer > > ___ > talk mailing list > talk@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk > > > -- > > End of talk Digest, Vol 138, Issue 12 > * > ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Routing through access=delivery
Am 16.02.16, 05:55:32 CET schrieb Gerd Petermann: > Hi Markus, > > access=destination doesn't mean that residents cannot reach their home, But it means bikers and pedestrians cannot be routed through, but will be routed around that street, which wouldn't be necessary if motor_vehicle=destination was meant. > my understanding is that access=delivery means you have to deliver > something to a location at that road to be allowed to use that road. That's mine, too. > So it means access=no for anybody else, doesn't it ? After having read some short articles about the German sign "Lieferverkehr frei" (free for delivery) I guess you are right. Then translating it to =no is more correct than to =destination for mkgmap within the limits of the Garmin access model. One kind of traffic has to be disadvantaged and I guess that should better be delivery than private traffic for the default style. > I am sure that some roads are only used for delivery, but > those should be highway=service roads, not residential. I don't think that's necessarily true, but don't have a feeling for how the number of delivery traffic signs divide between those street types. > Anyway, I'll try to find a set of rules to for mkgmap. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Routing through access=delivery
Hi Markus, access=destination doesn't mean that residents cannot reach their home, my understanding is that access=delivery means you have to deliver something to a location at that road to be allowed to use that road. So it means access=no for anybody else, doesn't it ? I am sure that some roads are only used for delivery, but those should be highway=service roads, not residential. Anyway, I'll try to find a set of rules to for mkgmap. Gerd Von: Markus Heidelberg Gesendet: Dienstag, 16. Februar 2016 04:31 An: talk@openstreetmap.org Cc: Gerd Petermann Betreff: Re: [OSM-talk] Routing through access=delivery Hi Gerd, Am 15.02.16, 21:29:59 CET schrieb Gerd Petermann: > Hi Markus, > > I agree that forestry should be handled like agricultural, I'll > try to create a patch for that. Thank you. > Reg. delivery I am a bit unsure because it seems that this this > value is very often used in invalid combinations, e.g. > highway=residential + access=delivery > without further access tags. In my eyes this tagging is wrong, > and my quick check showed > 50% of the access=delivery tag > was wrong like that. > I am not sure how to proceed here. Wrong data is nothing new. Did you compare with highway=residential + access=destination? There are way more streets tagged like this and this access restriction is in use already. I checked with Overpass turbo around Germany: 12000 vs. 300 ways. Someone commented on https://www.openstreetmap.org/note/238113 that OsmAnd interprets the delivery value. Markus ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Routing through access=delivery
Hi Gerd, Am 15.02.16, 21:29:59 CET schrieb Gerd Petermann: > Hi Markus, > > I agree that forestry should be handled like agricultural, I'll > try to create a patch for that. Thank you. > Reg. delivery I am a bit unsure because it seems that this this > value is very often used in invalid combinations, e.g. > highway=residential + access=delivery > without further access tags. In my eyes this tagging is wrong, > and my quick check showed > 50% of the access=delivery tag > was wrong like that. > I am not sure how to proceed here. Wrong data is nothing new. Did you compare with highway=residential + access=destination? There are way more streets tagged like this and this access restriction is in use already. I checked with Overpass turbo around Germany: 12000 vs. 300 ways. Someone commented on https://www.openstreetmap.org/note/238113 that OsmAnd interprets the delivery value. Markus ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Routing through access=delivery
Hi Markus, I agree that forestry should be handled like agricultural, I'll try to create a patch for that. Reg. delivery I am a bit unsure because it seems that this this value is very often used in invalid combinations, e.g. highway=residential + access=delivery without further access tags. In my eyes this tagging is wrong, and my quick check showed > 50% of the access=delivery tag was wrong like that. I am not sure how to proceed here. Gerd Von: Markus Heidelberg Gesendet: Montag, 15. Februar 2016 22:16 An: talk@openstreetmap.org Betreff: Re: [OSM-talk] Routing through access=delivery Hi Gerd Am 15.02.16, 01:24:31 CET schrieb Gerd Petermann: > If I got that right you talk about this way: > https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/10521868 Yes. > whch is tagged > description=Zufahrt Hockenheimring > highway=service > motor_vehicle=delivery > > I agree that routing software for cars should not route you through this > way. > > Reg. mkgmap: The evaluation of these tags is not hardcoded in the program, > it > depends on the so-called style, but the default style which is provided with > mkgmap > seems to ignore the tag. I am not sure what style you map used. I don't know which style Lambertus (http://garmin.openstreetmap.nl/) uses for the maps, but I could imagine that it is unchanged regarding the access configuration. > Please follow this thread on the mkgmap-dev list: > http://gis.19327.n5.nabble.com/motorvehicle-delivery-seems-to-be-ignored-tp5867658.html I would also suggest mapping the access value "delivery" to "destination" as Colin did on the mkgmap-dev list. Related to this topic: While looking at the mkgmap sources, I noticed that the word "forestry" cannot be found in the whole tree. access=forestry should probably be handled like access=agricultural. Markus ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Routing through access=delivery
Am 15.02.16, 07:57:26 CET schrieb Mateusz Konieczny: > On Sat, 13 Feb 2016 10:13:45 +0100 > Markus Heidelberg wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > last week after missing the exit on a highway=motorway, a Garmin Nüvi > > 300 with a Lambertus map tried to turn through a service road mapped > > with motor_vehicle=delivery. This road connects the motorway > > directions via service area on each side. > > > > I thought this might be a problem with mkgmap (which creates the > > Garmin maps), but Mapzen and OSRM routing behave the same: > > https://www.openstreetmap.org/directions?engine=mapzen_car&route=49.31689%2C8.57541%3B49.31659%2C8.57453#map=17/49.31827/8.57205 > > > > Is this on purpose or do all three maps/routers ignore the > > access=delivery tags wrongly? > > > > Additional info on an already existing note at the concerned location > > (in German): > > https://www.openstreetmap.org/note/238113 > > It is more likely that motor_vehicle tag is ignored. I had a look into the mkgmap sources before writing this mail. All *=delivery are unhandled. > > This road connects the motorway > > directions via service area on each side. > > Can you link it? It seems that maybe access=delivery may fit it. https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/10521868#map=18/49.31841/8.57378 access=delivery is not appropriate here, foot and bicycle are allowed. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Routing through access=delivery
Hi Gerd Am 15.02.16, 01:24:31 CET schrieb Gerd Petermann: > If I got that right you talk about this way: > https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/10521868 Yes. > whch is tagged > description=Zufahrt Hockenheimring > highway=service > motor_vehicle=delivery > > I agree that routing software for cars should not route you through this > way. > > Reg. mkgmap: The evaluation of these tags is not hardcoded in the program, > it > depends on the so-called style, but the default style which is provided with > mkgmap > seems to ignore the tag. I am not sure what style you map used. I don't know which style Lambertus (http://garmin.openstreetmap.nl/) uses for the maps, but I could imagine that it is unchanged regarding the access configuration. > Please follow this thread on the mkgmap-dev list: > http://gis.19327.n5.nabble.com/motorvehicle-delivery-seems-to-be-ignored-tp5867658.html I would also suggest mapping the access value "delivery" to "destination" as Colin did on the mkgmap-dev list. Related to this topic: While looking at the mkgmap sources, I noticed that the word "forestry" cannot be found in the whole tree. access=forestry should probably be handled like access=agricultural. Markus ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Routing through access=delivery
Sorry, I posted this reply as a PM instead of replying to the list: Hi Markus, If I got that right you talk about this way: https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/10521868 whch is tagged description=Zufahrt Hockenheimring highway=service motor_vehicle=delivery I agree that routing software for cars should not route you through this way. Reg. mkgmap: The evaluation of these tags is not hardcoded in the program, it depends on the so-called style, but the default style which is provided with mkgmap seems to ignore the tag. I am not sure what style you map used. Please follow this thread on the mkgmap-dev list: http://gis.19327.n5.nabble.com/motorvehicle-delivery-seems-to-be-ignored-tp5867658.html Gerd -- View this message in context: http://gis.19327.n5.nabble.com/Routing-through-access-delivery-tp5867583p5867751.html Sent from the General Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Routing through access=delivery
On Sat, 13 Feb 2016 10:13:45 +0100 Markus Heidelberg wrote: > Hi, > > last week after missing the exit on a highway=motorway, a Garmin Nüvi > 300 with a Lambertus map tried to turn through a service road mapped > with motor_vehicle=delivery. This road connects the motorway > directions via service area on each side. > > I thought this might be a problem with mkgmap (which creates the > Garmin maps), but Mapzen and OSRM routing behave the same: > https://www.openstreetmap.org/directions?engine=mapzen_car&route=49.31689%2C8.57541%3B49.31659%2C8.57453#map=17/49.31827/8.57205 > > Is this on purpose or do all three maps/routers ignore the > access=delivery tags wrongly? > > Additional info on an already existing note at the concerned location > (in German): > https://www.openstreetmap.org/note/238113 It is more likely that motor_vehicle tag is ignored. > This road connects the motorway > directions via service area on each side. Can you link it? It seems that maybe access=delivery may fit it. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Routing through access=delivery
Hi, last week after missing the exit on a highway=motorway, a Garmin Nüvi 300 with a Lambertus map tried to turn through a service road mapped with motor_vehicle=delivery. This road connects the motorway directions via service area on each side. I thought this might be a problem with mkgmap (which creates the Garmin maps), but Mapzen and OSRM routing behave the same: https://www.openstreetmap.org/directions?engine=mapzen_car&route=49.31689%2C8.57541%3B49.31659%2C8.57453#map=17/49.31827/8.57205 Is this on purpose or do all three maps/routers ignore the access=delivery tags wrongly? Additional info on an already existing note at the concerned location (in German): https://www.openstreetmap.org/note/238113 Markus ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
