Re: [OSM-talk] highway=stop
Gervase Markham wrote: Have these people not heard of Give Way/Yield or roundabouts? There are plenty of Yield and Roundabout intersections in the US. In fact, there are more (often unsigned) Yield intersections than any other type. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] highway=stop
Jo wrote: A stop sign is internationally a red octagonal sign with STOP written on it in white letters. It means that officially a full stop has to be made. In the US it's best to actually also do that, cause they are very strict about it. Not everywhere. There is a maneuver known as a 'California Stop' in which a driver at an intersection marked 'stop' slows to 5-10 mph, then continues through. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] highway=stop
On Jan 27, 2008 7:30 PM, Alex S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jo wrote: A stop sign is internationally a red octagonal sign with STOP written on it in white letters. It means that officially a full stop has to be made. In the US it's best to actually also do that, cause they are very strict about it. Not everywhere. There is a maneuver known as a 'California Stop' in which a driver at an intersection marked 'stop' slows to 5-10 mph, then continues through. That's a nasty rumor. ;-) It still means full stop, even in California. If you do that in front of an officer of the law, you will regret it... I've actually witnessed *bicyclists* ticketed for not stopping at a stop sign (on a dead still residential street, near the end of a 50 mile Multiple Sclerosis benefit ride, to boot). ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] highway=stop
On Jan 24, 2008 1:46 AM, Robert (Jamie) Munro [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We need a way to know where stop signs and give way (yield) signs are and which direction they face. It probably requires a relation between the node and the way they are on. I think we're going about this the wrong way: the stop signs are there because one road has right of way over the other. In NL there is a stop sign but mostly it's indicated by markings on the road (a sort of teeth marking). I don't think anyone is suggesting we put the road markings in OSM also? We should be marking which road has right-of-way and then users/renderers can infer the stop signs or whatever from there... Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] highway=stop
Even if we mark right-of-way, how do we know there's a stop and not just a give way? I would also prefer something simpler than using a relation but it seems that's the way to go. Renaud. On Jan 24, 2008 10:26 AM, Martijn van Oosterhout [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jan 24, 2008 1:46 AM, Robert (Jamie) Munro [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We need a way to know where stop signs and give way (yield) signs are and which direction they face. It probably requires a relation between the node and the way they are on. I think we're going about this the wrong way: the stop signs are there because one road has right of way over the other. In NL there is a stop sign but mostly it's indicated by markings on the road (a sort of teeth marking). I don't think anyone is suggesting we put the road markings in OSM also? We should be marking which road has right-of-way and then users/renderers can infer the stop signs or whatever from there... Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] highway=stop
Could someone explain the tag highway=stop provided by the 'Map Features' page ? I would expect that all tags approved and moved to this reference page are clearly described. I found a wiki page ( http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Mapping/Features/Junction) saying : Intersections with stop signs should be tagged highwayhttp://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Key:highway =stophttp://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php?title=Tag:highway%3Dstopaction=edit. Intersections with traffic signals should be tagged highwayhttp://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Key:highway =traffic_signalshttp://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php?title=Tag:highway%3Dtraffic_signalsaction=edit . But at the end of the page, an important note says: Should highway http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Key:highway=stophttp://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php?title=Tag:highway%3Dstopaction=editand highway http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Key:highway= traffic_signalshttp://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php?title=Tag:highway%3Dtraffic_signalsaction=editbe used to mark the intersection or where the physical stop sign/signal is? What about junctions where not all directions are signed/signaled? Well, fine, the foot note on the wiki page explains that the main description is a non-sens... Shall we put the node on the way where the sign is, a little bit before the intersection (and how much) ? or is it planned to use a relation ? or does it really help to tag such signs (I mean, it does not influence routing) ? or should we remove this tag from the approved Map features and create a proposal wiki page where a clear definition could be done ? Pieren ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] highway=stop
On Thu, January 24, 2008 12:46 am, Robert (Jamie) Munro wrote: Pieren Pieren wrote: | Could someone explain the tag highway=stop provided by the 'Map | Features' page ? | I would expect that all tags approved and moved to this reference page | are clearly described. [snip] | Well, fine, the foot note on the wiki page explains that the main | description is a non-sens... | Shall we put the node on the way where the sign is, a little bit before | the intersection (and how much) ? or is it planned to use a relation ? | or does it really help to tag such signs (I mean, it does not influence | routing) ? [snip] | or should we remove this tag from the approved Map features and create a | proposal wiki page where a clear definition could be done ? We need a way to know where stop signs and give way (yield) signs are and which direction they face. It probably requires a relation between the node and the way they are on. Does it require a relation, or just that the highway=stop be on a node a short distance back from the shared node at the intersection (except on a 4-way stop where the node at the intersection could be highway=stop)? I could make an argument that this scheme matches the physical world: the ways are aligned on the centreline of the roads (maybe?) and the stop sign is actually some distance back from the centreline of the road protected by the stop sign (at least in the UK) - do any countries have stop signs hanging above the centre of the intersection? -- David James ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] highway=stop
On 24/01/2008, Robert (Jamie) Munro [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: | Shall we put the node on the way where the sign is, a little bit before | the intersection (and how much) ? or is it planned to use a relation ? | or does it really help to tag such signs (I mean, it does not influence | routing) ? . | or should we remove this tag from the approved Map features and create a | proposal wiki page where a clear definition could be done ? We need a way to know where stop signs and give way (yield) signs are and which direction they face. It probably requires a relation between the node and the way they are on. possible a minor point, hopefully not too pedantic: we're not marking the signs on the map - the sign is only there to give information about some feature, which is what we should be doing. the presence or not of a (any) sign is irrelevant. signs can be wrong, mis-placed, missing or facing the wrong direction if we're going to mark highway=stop for a junction where a driver has to stop, it is the junction that needs marking, not some point further down the road ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] highway=stop
On Jan 23, 2008 5:15 PM, David James [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, January 24, 2008 12:46 am, Robert (Jamie) Munro wrote: Pieren Pieren wrote: | Could someone explain the tag highway=stop provided by the 'Map | Features' page ? | I would expect that all tags approved and moved to this reference page | are clearly described. [snip] | Well, fine, the foot note on the wiki page explains that the main | description is a non-sens... | Shall we put the node on the way where the sign is, a little bit before | the intersection (and how much) ? or is it planned to use a relation ? | or does it really help to tag such signs (I mean, it does not influence | routing) ? [snip] | or should we remove this tag from the approved Map features and create a | proposal wiki page where a clear definition could be done ? We need a way to know where stop signs and give way (yield) signs are and which direction they face. It probably requires a relation between the node and the way they are on. Does it require a relation, or just that the highway=stop be on a node a short distance back from the shared node at the intersection (except on a 4-way stop where the node at the intersection could be highway=stop)? I could make an argument that this scheme matches the physical world: the ways are aligned on the centreline of the roads (maybe?) and the stop sign is actually some distance back from the centreline of the road protected by the stop sign (at least in the UK) - do any countries have stop signs hanging above the centre of the intersection? -- David James Bad idea to add a node just for the stop, in addition to the intersection. The stop is topologically associated with the intersection, which is more important (and more logical) than the physical location. A relation would probably be the best method. Karl ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
