Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 11 June 2010 15:36, John Henderson snow...@gmx.com wrote: I'm new to this digital photography thing, but I've photographed 7 different cavalettis and put them here: Thanks for going to so much effort, I was only expecting 1 or 2 shots of the same stile... http://www.flickr.com/photos/51019...@n07/ I haven't used flicker but you can tag images in such a way they they link to OSM objects... eg http://www.flickr.com/photos/frankieroberto/3396068360/ I presume you can just lift what you want from there. Yep: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:barrier%3Dhorse_stile ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 11/06/10 19:28, John Smith wrote: Thanks for going to so much effort, I was only expecting 1 or 2 shots of the same stile... No problem - just a pleasant bicycle ride along the BNT for a retiree. John H ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 10/06/10 15:08, John Smith wrote: As I said, it was just a stub page, feel free to extend it :) I've added In some countries, a horse stile might be more commonly called a cavaletti or a horse hop. John H ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
Jim Croft jim.cr...@gmail.com wrote: there is one near my place... will try and iPhone it this weekend... Could you perhaps take a photo of it instead? /camera snob -- Sam Couter | mailto:s...@couter.id.au OpenPGP fingerprint: A46B 9BB5 3148 7BEA 1F05 5BD5 8530 03AE DE89 C75C ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 10/06/10 10:33, John Smith wrote: On 10 June 2010 06:49, John Hendersonsnow...@gmx.com wrote: I'm more than happy to go with barrier=horse_stile, given that established usage. I'll change the cavalettis I've already tagged, and look at putting a note on the map features page when I take some photos. Can someone get a picture of one of these that we can use on the wiki? I'm new to this digital photography thing, but I've photographed 7 different cavalettis and put them here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/51019...@n07/ I presume you can just lift what you want from there. John H ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 9 June 2010 10:08, John Henderson snow...@gmx.com wrote: barrier=cattle_grid cattle_grid=cavaletti What about: barrier=horse_grid They aren't cattle grids, and they aren't proper cavalettis either from what I've seen, cavalettis seem to be horse jumps these barriers aren't meant to be jumped, in fact they make them large enough to dissuade a horse from crossing at all without a little extra encouragement. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 09/06/10 16:55, John Smith wrote: On 9 June 2010 10:08, John Hendersonsnow...@gmx.com wrote: barrier=cattle_grid cattle_grid=cavaletti What about: barrier=horse_grid They aren't cattle grids, and they aren't proper cavalettis either from what I've seen, cavalettis seem to be horse jumps these barriers aren't meant to be jumped, in fact they make them large enough to dissuade a horse from crossing at all without a little extra encouragement. There's plenty of evidence now that the correct term is cavaletti. I've also found a BNT area coordinator, and active horsewoman, referring to them by that term. horse_grid is potentially much more ambiguous. I feel that its being a barrier cavaletti and not a jump is completely and adequately given by the tag barrier=cavaletti. John H ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
Just found something, it seems the brits refer to them as horse stiles... like a turnstile but for horses... ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 9 June 2010 17:28, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: Just found something, it seems the brits refer to them as horse stiles... like a turnstile but for horses... And the americans call them horse hops... ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 9 June 2010 17:29, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: On 9 June 2010 17:28, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: Just found something, it seems the brits refer to them as horse stiles... like a turnstile but for horses... And the americans call them horse hops... They seem to be called horse stiles in NZ, or maybe it was a brit taking photos in NZ... http://picasaweb.google.com/vivdnz/WhitfordBeach#5233485378494600946 ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: They seem to be called horse stiles in NZ, or maybe it was a brit taking photos in NZ... I found the website of an Australian business, Town Country Maintenance Fencing, based in northern Adelaide. There's a clear picture and a description on this gallery page: http://townandcountryfences.com.au/index.php?mact=Album,mec8c1,default,1mec8c1albumid=5mec8c1returnid=104page=104 Right-hand column, 4th picture down, is described as Horse Stile for horse trails to prevent motorbikes being able to access horse trails. Direct link to picture: http://townandcountryfences.com.au/uploads/images/21032009008.jpg Regards, Simon. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On Wed, 9 Jun 2010, John Smith wrote: Can you post any links to where you've seen these fixed barriers referred to anything but jumps? because if you can't prove it to JS you'll be mincemeat on the wiki ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On Wed, 9 Jun 2010, Steve Bennett wrote: On Wed, Jun 9, 2010 at 7:14 AM, John Henderson snow...@gmx.com wrote: On trails which horses use, there's often a type of above-ground cattle grid called a cavaletti. Typically, it would consist of about 4 widely-spaced logs across the track at a height of about a half a metre. The idea is that a riderless horse will not cross this (and perhaps escape on to a road). Oh, is *that* what they're for. I have seen one or two of those around, like on a bridleway near Rowville, Vic: http://www.nearmap.com/?ll=-37.958364,145.26343z=22t=hnmd=20100416 They're pretty good at stopping mountain bikers too. :) Steve my quick search showed me that motorcyclists were one of their targets ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On Wed, 9 Jun 2010, Ben Last wrote: On 9 June 2010 12:47, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: Most aussie maps show dirt roads as a dashed line, but this might upset/confuse the Europeans... Is there no tag for paved with gold? b well we should make one it may have limited use ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 9 June 2010 20:04, Liz ed...@billiau.net wrote: well we should make one it may have limited use It'd be nice if there were some Australasian cartographers we could ask about these sorts of map design issues... ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On Wed, Jun 9, 2010 at 9:29 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.comwrote: On 9 June 2010 09:04, Franc Carter franc.car...@gmail.com wrote: One of the things I most wished for from my pre gps days was for maps to have turn restrictions marked. Is there a good way to do this without cluttering the map? Good question, my thought was little restriciton signs in the nagle between the affected streets. Not sure how much this would clutter things however cheers These have real value and should be displayed prominently on a map used for driving navigation, maybe OSM needs to start rendering more specialist maps for specific purposes, but this is a debate for a different list. -- Franc ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
Looks like someone else was asking for the same things to be included already: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Proposed_features/New_barrier_types#other_new_values ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 09/06/10 17:28, John Smith wrote: Just found something, it seems the brits refer to them as horse stiles... like a turnstile but for horses... Rather than a turnstile, more like the existing barrier=stile, which allows a walker to cross a fence using rudimentary stairs/steps to climb it. A very simple one in the top photo here: http://www.leapingstiles.co.uk/ I already use that tag for conventional stiles on walking tracks. Thanks for the horse_stile find, reinforced by Simon Biber's research. I'm more than happy to go with barrier=horse_stile, given that established usage. I'll change the cavalettis I've already tagged, and look at putting a note on the map features page when I take some photos. John H ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 10 June 2010 06:49, John Henderson snow...@gmx.com wrote: I'm more than happy to go with barrier=horse_stile, given that established usage. I'll change the cavalettis I've already tagged, and look at putting a note on the map features page when I take some photos. Can someone get a picture of one of these that we can use on the wiki? ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
there is one near my place... will try and iPhone it this weekend... jim On Thu, Jun 10, 2010 at 10:33 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: On 10 June 2010 06:49, John Henderson snow...@gmx.com wrote: I'm more than happy to go with barrier=horse_stile, given that established usage. I'll change the cavalettis I've already tagged, and look at putting a note on the map features page when I take some photos. Can someone get a picture of one of these that we can use on the wiki? ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au -- _ Jim Croft ~ jim.cr...@gmail.com ~ +61-2-62509499 ~ http://www.google.com/profiles/jim.croft 'A civilized society is one which tolerates eccentricity to the point of doubtful sanity.' - Robert Frost, poet (1874-1963) ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
Four messages in a row. Way to destroy a thread with verbal diarrhoea. *sigh* Steve On Wed, Jun 9, 2010 at 5:55 PM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: On 9 June 2010 17:29, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: On 9 June 2010 17:28, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: Just found something, it seems the brits refer to them as horse stiles... like a turnstile but for horses... And the americans call them horse hops... They seem to be called horse stiles in NZ, or maybe it was a brit taking photos in NZ... http://picasaweb.google.com/vivdnz/WhitfordBeach#5233485378494600946 ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 10 June 2010 11:10, Jim Croft jim.cr...@gmail.com wrote: there is one near my place... will try and iPhone it this weekend... Thanks, in the mean time I wrote a stub page: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:barrier%3Dhorse_stile ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 10/06/10 11:15, John Smith wrote: On 10 June 2010 11:10, Jim Croftjim.cr...@gmail.com wrote: there is one near my place... will try and iPhone it this weekend... Thanks, in the mean time I wrote a stub page: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:barrier%3Dhorse_stile Shouldn't the page header and text say horse_stile instead of horse stile (ie, with an underscore instead of a space)? And would it also be a good idea to mention cavalettis and horse hops, so that mappers searching for those thing would discover the horse_stile tag? John H ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 9 June 2010 09:07, John Henderson snow...@gmx.com wrote: Do I put it on the main international wiki, or just the Australian one? Map features page, but first I'd come up with a better name, even wikipedia couldn't find anything related to the 2 keywords you list below Just to make things more difficult, searching for a dictionary definition gives me alternative spellings: cavaletti and cavalletti. I guess I should try to determine which is more widely used, although my spell-checkers don't like either. Dictionary.com had this: A small, portable jump for schooling horses. Constructed of light poles, 4 to 6 ft long, resting on a cross of timber at each end so that the pole is 12 to 18 inches above the ground. Which doesn't seem like a permanent barrier type to me. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 9 June 2010 09:22, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: Dictionary.com had this: A small, portable jump for schooling horses. Constructed of light poles, 4 to 6 ft long, resting on a cross of timber at each end so that the pole is 12 to 18 inches above the ground. Sorry, wasn't dictionary.com was: Saunders Comprehensive Veterinary Dictionary 3rd Edition, by D.C. Blood, V.P. Studdert and C.C. Gay, Elsevier ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 9 June 2010 09:04, Franc Carter franc.car...@gmail.com wrote: One of the things I most wished for from my pre gps days was for maps to have turn restrictions marked. Is there a good way to do this without cluttering the map? These have real value and should be displayed prominently on a map used for driving navigation, maybe OSM needs to start rendering more specialist maps for specific purposes, but this is a debate for a different list. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 09/06/10 09:22, John Smith wrote: On 9 June 2010 09:07, John Hendersonsnow...@gmx.com wrote: Do I put it on the main international wiki, or just the Australian one? Map features page, but first I'd come up with a better name, even wikipedia couldn't find anything related to the 2 keywords you list below Just to make things more difficult, searching for a dictionary definition gives me alternative spellings: cavaletti and cavalletti. I guess I should try to determine which is more widely used, although my spell-checkers don't like either. Dictionary.com had this: A small, portable jump for schooling horses. Constructed of light poles, 4 to 6 ft long, resting on a cross of timber at each end so that the pole is 12 to 18 inches above the ground. Which doesn't seem like a permanent barrier type to me. The term gets used for both - the temporary horse training ones and the fixed barrier structures. The name is correct. I've found several references to the need to cross a cavaletti when walking or cycling a track. And I initially got the name from workmen constructing a new one on the BNT. John H ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
Best descriptive term I can think of is: barrier=horse_jump From the quick reading I did, and this picture: http://www.texashorsemansdirectory.com/cavalet.gif A cavaletti is only one type of horse jump, so: barrier=horse_jump horse_jump=cavaletti Might be more useful. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 09/06/10 09:40, John Smith wrote: The name might be correct, but I don't think it is a good choice for a name since it doesn't appear even in wikipedia, then again I can't seem to find anything better, nor any images of permanent installations. Almost completely obscured by cyclists, but you get the idea: http://members.pcug.org.au/~rmeurone/mtb/bacon03/bacon03-Pages/Image1.html It runs parallel to the left-hand fence, where the continuation of that fence is a cavaletti with parallel log-fence sides. John H ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 9 June 2010 10:08, John Henderson snow...@gmx.com wrote: might be a little better. But I don't see the problem in applying the correct technical term to it up front. It's hardly more obscure than some correct is pretty subjective when it comes to these things, since most answers will be biased by cultural, language etc... ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On Wed, Jun 9, 2010 at 7:14 AM, John Henderson snow...@gmx.com wrote: On trails which horses use, there's often a type of above-ground cattle grid called a cavaletti. Typically, it would consist of about 4 widely-spaced logs across the track at a height of about a half a metre. The idea is that a riderless horse will not cross this (and perhaps escape on to a road). Oh, is *that* what they're for. I have seen one or two of those around, like on a bridleway near Rowville, Vic: http://www.nearmap.com/?ll=-37.958364,145.26343z=22t=hnmd=20100416 They're pretty good at stopping mountain bikers too. :) Steve ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On Wed, Jun 9, 2010 at 6:58 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: Mapping a few things locally and noticed some things don't render, so I filed bugs about them: I'd really like golf course features to be rendered. I find it a bit ironic that Best of OpenStreetMap includes a golf course with bunkers mapped as beaches: http://bestofosm.org/?type=tilesathomelon=77.02036lat=10.91120zoom=17 I'd also like some basic surface information to be rendered. Dividing the surface universe into paved/untagged vs everything else would be a good start. Steve ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
One thing Id like to see tagged in some way, is railway ends. These are tagged as railway=buffer_stop, but dont have any indication on the rendered map. This makes it difficult sometimes to know if a track ends at the node, or if it simply hasnt been mapped any further. All it would need is a single black dot, or an X or something at the end of the line. How do we go about getting these ideas added to the map? Interestingly, my example of railway=buffer_stop isnt mentioned on the railway= page, but it is listed on the map features page. There are almost 1400 occurances according to osmdoc. David On Wed, 2010-06-09 at 06:58 +1000, John Smith wrote: Mapping a few things locally and noticed some things don't render, so I filed bugs about them: Rendering waterway=drain areas, these are now very mappable anywhere Nearmap has made imagery available, but only ways currently render: http://trac.openstreetmap.org/ticket/3041 Rendering operator=* tags if name=* is missing, currently nothing is rendered but operator shows up in JOSM http://trac.openstreetmap.org/ticket/3042 Generic shop icons, I think it's important that something renders on the map, even if it's just the name and a generic icon for points of interest like shops, currently on a select subset of shops are rendering http://trac.openstreetmap.org/ticket/3043 Does anyone else have any thoughts on what else should be rendered? ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 9 June 2010 11:24, Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com wrote: I'd also like some basic surface information to be rendered. Dividing I previously filed a bug for surface=sand to render the same as natural=beach for exactly this reason: http://trac.openstreetmap.org/ticket/2873 the surface universe into paved/untagged vs everything else would be a good start. Most aussie maps show dirt roads as a dashed line, but this might upset/confuse the Europeans... ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 9 June 2010 12:47, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: Most aussie maps show dirt roads as a dashed line, but this might upset/confuse the Europeans... Is there no tag for paved with gold? b -- Ben Last Development Manager (HyperWeb) NearMap Pty Ltd ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Things that would be nice if they rendered...
On 9 June 2010 14:14, David Murn da...@incanberra.com.au wrote: One thing Id like to see tagged in some way, is railway ends. These are tagged as railway=buffer_stop, but dont have any indication on the rendered map. This makes it difficult sometimes to know if a track ends at the node, or if it simply hasnt been mapped any further. All it would need is a single black dot, or an X or something at the end of the line. I'd suggest asking for it to render identically to barrier=bollard or you could point to a SVG image, not sure if the JOSM image is SVG or not. How do we go about getting these ideas added to the map? Interestingly, You go to http://trac.openstreetmap.org and click the 'login' link, then you search (top right) for similar terms to make sure there isn't another bug already, otherwise click on 'New Ticket', change the type from defect to enhancement, then change the 'Component' from 'admin' to 'mapnik' then you just need to type in a short description such as 'It'd be nice to render railway=buffer_stop' and then a slightly longer description below it on how you think it could be rendered etc. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
