Re: [Talk-GB] More questions on Schools project

2016-01-08 Thread SK53 
On 8 January 2016 at 12:22, Stuart Reynolds <
stu...@travelinesoutheast.org.uk> wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> I have some questions about naming, and also the content of Edubase.
>
> ...
>
> If someone could also suggest how to tag one school split across two
> sites, I would be very happy!
>
> Many thanks
> Regards,
> Stuart
>
>
>
I'd also be interested in the one school / multiple sites issue.

These are becoming commoner as one school takes over another. The
particular problem is that each site will have a name and the school itself
will have a name. One example is the Nottingham Bluecoat School which has
two sites, the original main site, and the Wollaton Park Campus site
 (a 'failing' secondary school
taken over by Bluecoat, but now various functions are partitioned between
the sites). Perhaps something like campus_name might work for now: I find
the concatenation Bluecoat School - Wollaton Park Campus unwieldy and it's
not easy to identify these multi-campus institutions.

(A side note, this school also hosts churches at both sites: slightly
diffiicult in terms of locating the actual hall used for services &
debatable whether rented locations should be specifically marked as place
of worship, although in these cases both are signed outside the school).

Jerry
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Re: [Talk-GB] More questions on Schools project

2016-01-08 Thread Colin Smale 
Does anyone have information on the lifecycle of an Edubase ID? If a
school changes name, does the ID change? What about if it changes status
and becomes an academy? If a school splits, do both halves get a new ID
or does one half carry on with the old one? 

(GSS identifiers used to identify geographic areas such as local
government districts are immutable: if any boundary changes take place,
a new ID is issued for the modifed boundary. I.e. they are not as stable
as you might think...)

--colin 

On 2016-01-08 14:27, SK53 wrote:

> On 8 January 2016 at 12:22, Stuart Reynolds 
>  wrote:
> 
>> Hi All, 
>> 
>> I have some questions about naming, and also the content of Edubase. 
>> ... 
>> 
>> If someone could also suggest how to tag one school split across two sites, 
>> I would be very happy! 
>> 
>> Many thanks 
>> Regards, 
>> Stuart
> 
> I'd also be interested in the one school / multiple sites issue. 
> 
> These are becoming commoner as one school takes over another. The particular 
> problem is that each site will have a name and the school itself will have a 
> name. One example is the Nottingham Bluecoat School which has two sites, the 
> original main site, and the Wollaton Park Campus site [1] (a 'failing' 
> secondary school taken over by Bluecoat, but now various functions are 
> partitioned between the sites). Perhaps something like campus_name might work 
> for now: I find the concatenation Bluecoat School - Wollaton Park Campus 
> unwieldy and it's not easy to identify these multi-campus institutions.
> 
> (A side note, this school also hosts churches at both sites: slightly 
> diffiicult in terms of locating the actual hall used for services & debatable 
> whether rented locations should be specifically marked as place of worship, 
> although in these cases both are signed outside the school). 
> 
> Jerry 
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Links:
--
[1] http://www.openstreetmap.org/way/16487967
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Re: [Talk-GB] More questions on Schools project

2016-01-08 Thread Dan S 
2016-01-08 12:22 GMT+00:00 Stuart Reynolds :
> Hi All,
>
> I have some questions about naming, and also the content of Edubase.
>
> In Southend (SS postcode area) there are some schools which have
> “alternative” names by which they are more commonly known. One example is
> Leigh, where the school is always known locally as “Leigh North Street”. So
> should I adopt the Edubase name as the “name” or should I use the local
> name? If the former, what tag should I use to list the alternative?

OSM convention is to prefer "what is on the ground" - the "name" tag
should really be what is written on the sign outside the school. Then
you can use "loc_name" or "alt_name" for the alternative name as
described here:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Names#loc_name

> Of course, tagging with the Edubase reference will help to match, regardless
> of name - I have also used “&” where Edubase has “and”, which currently
> leads to Rob’s table not finding a match. Likewise with e.g. Westcliff High
> School for Boys Academy, where the “Academy” part adds nothing, so I have
> left it off (especially as the three other grammars, including the girls
> school next door, manage without it).
>
> Finally, on tagging, there appear to be some anomalies. The aforementioned
> Leigh is one - this used to be two schools, now merged to be Leigh Primary
> School. Edubase only has one entry, but names it Leigh Infant School. I
> assume that Edubase will catch up, eventually, but for now I will use the
> correct name for the school and tag it with the Infant School URN. The other
> one, which I am struggling with, is Thorpe Greenways. There is only one
> entry in Edubase - Thorpe Greenways Infant School. But according to their
> website (http://www.greenways.southend.sch.uk) the infant and junior schools
> are still two schools, but run as a federation called “The Federation of
> Greenways Schools”. Are they two schools? Or one? Given that they share
> leadership, governors, and budget I would assume one, as does Edubase,
> apparently. Any thoughts?
>
> If someone could also suggest how to tag one school split across two sites,
> I would be very happy!

I like the "site" relation but it's not as widely-used as I might like...
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Relation:site

Best
Dan

> Many thanks
> Regards,
> Stuart
>
>
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Re: [Talk-GB] More questions on Schools project

2016-01-08 Thread Stuart Reynolds 
Sorry - should have added a bit more to that!

Where I had this before, I could separate the grounds into two polygons. 
However, this one I can’t. So I’m thinking that I tag the buildings as 
amenity=school, name=*, ref:edubase=* and then put a boundary polygon in which 
I tag … amenity=school? Should I also name it? The schools are Hamstel Junior 
School and Hamstel Infants School, together known as Hamstel Schools (which is 
what the single node currently has in OSM).

Cheers
Stuart


On 8 Jan 2016, at 15:21, Stuart Reynolds 
> 
wrote:

…and two schools, one site?

Cheers
Stuart



On 8 Jan 2016, at 13:27, SK53 > 
wrote:

On 8 January 2016 at 12:22, Stuart Reynolds 
> 
wrote:
Hi All,

I have some questions about naming, and also the content of Edubase.

...

If someone could also suggest how to tag one school split across two sites, I 
would be very happy!

Many thanks
Regards,
Stuart



I'd also be interested in the one school / multiple sites issue.

These are becoming commoner as one school takes over another. The particular 
problem is that each site will have a name and the school itself will have a 
name. One example is the Nottingham Bluecoat School which has two sites, the 
original main site, and the Wollaton Park Campus 
site (a 'failing' secondary school 
taken over by Bluecoat, but now various functions are partitioned between the 
sites). Perhaps something like campus_name might work for now: I find the 
concatenation Bluecoat School - Wollaton Park Campus unwieldy and it's not easy 
to identify these multi-campus institutions.

(A side note, this school also hosts churches at both sites: slightly 
diffiicult in terms of locating the actual hall used for services & debatable 
whether rented locations should be specifically marked as place of worship, 
although in these cases both are signed outside the school).

Jerry

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Re: [Talk-GB] More questions on Schools project

2016-01-08 Thread Stuart Reynolds 
…and two schools, one site?

Cheers
Stuart



On 8 Jan 2016, at 13:27, SK53 > 
wrote:

On 8 January 2016 at 12:22, Stuart Reynolds 
> 
wrote:
Hi All,

I have some questions about naming, and also the content of Edubase.

...

If someone could also suggest how to tag one school split across two sites, I 
would be very happy!

Many thanks
Regards,
Stuart



I'd also be interested in the one school / multiple sites issue.

These are becoming commoner as one school takes over another. The particular 
problem is that each site will have a name and the school itself will have a 
name. One example is the Nottingham Bluecoat School which has two sites, the 
original main site, and the Wollaton Park Campus 
site (a 'failing' secondary school 
taken over by Bluecoat, but now various functions are partitioned between the 
sites). Perhaps something like campus_name might work for now: I find the 
concatenation Bluecoat School - Wollaton Park Campus unwieldy and it's not easy 
to identify these multi-campus institutions.

(A side note, this school also hosts churches at both sites: slightly 
diffiicult in terms of locating the actual hall used for services & debatable 
whether rented locations should be specifically marked as place of worship, 
although in these cases both are signed outside the school).

Jerry

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Re: [Talk-GB] More questions on Schools project

2016-01-08 Thread Andy Mabbett 
On 8 January 2016 at 12:35, Dan S  wrote:

> Then you can use "loc_name" or "alt_name" for the alternative name

Not forgetting old_name, too.

-- 
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

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