Re: [Talk-us] How to get college students involved?
Hi Stefan, I did some work with students back when I was with cloudmade. There are a few details here: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Education I can pass along the power points I made if you like (although they are about a year out of date now). Just let me know. If anyone else wants them, I can also try and get them up on the wiki, or am happy for someone else to host them. Cheers, Sarah > Message: 3 > Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2010 13:00:48 -0400 > From: Stefan Brandle > To: talk-us@openstreetmap.org > Subject: [Talk-us] How to get college students involved? > Message-ID: <4c5c3fc0.1040...@cse.taylor.edu> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Hi. The following may be outside your time and interest scope, but I am > interested in hearing from anybody who is willing to nibble on my > requests. I have never actually done any mapping work, but joined this > list and lurked with the hope of starting to learn about the tools and > issues. > > I teach computer science at a university about half way between > Indianapolis and Ft. Wayne. I would love to have someone show us how to > get involved mapping precise data locally and submitting it to various > online data sets, or working on software that is helpful to OSM and > others. We have students who need senior projects, and also run the > occasional special topics class. > > If anybody is interested, I would like to start a dialog, or at least > get some pointers to the right direction. > > -- sb > > Stefan Brandle, Taylor University Computer Science and Engineering > sbran...@cse.taylor.edu, Telephone: 765-998-4685 FAX: 765-998-4940 > http://www.cse.taylor.edu/~sbrandle, http://www.facebook.com/TaylorCSE > > > > > > -- > > ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] How to get college students involved?
On Sun, Aug 8, 2010 at 9:03 PM, Richard Weait wrote: > On Sun, Aug 8, 2010 at 9:48 PM, Jeffrey Ollie wrote: >> On Sun, Aug 8, 2010 at 7:03 AM, Richard Weait wrote: >>> John, Paul and Stefan are all doing mapping on their campuses, and >>> they haven't given us links. Please show us your good work, gentlemen! >> >> Here's what I've done for the community college that I work for: >> >> http://osm.org/go/T_c5qPQUA- > > Nice stuff. Do you have any tips to offer new campus-mappers? I've been lucky to have recent (Apr 2009), high resolution (~0.4ft) aerial imagery available from the USGS so I've been able to get a lot done. So try and find an imagery source that you can use. Even with an imagery source you'll want to walk around campus a lot to verify all those details that can't be spotted from the air (is that dark blob a bench or a trash bin?). Other than that, just go out and JFDI. Don't wait around for permission, etc. In my case, I've just been doing this for personal reasons, so I haven't bothered the guys that maintain the official CAD drawings for campus. If this had been a class project or a official project for the college I would have been bugging them for all the data that they have on hand. > That is quite a sport complex north of campus. Yes it is. The community's quite proud of it, and I've had some fun mapping it as well as the rest of the town. It's around a mile from my house so it's pretty easy for me to get over there to verify the details that I can't see from the air. -- Jeff Ollie ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] How to get college students involved?
Rowan University, Glassboro, NJ: http://osm.org/go/ZciXY0xG Most of the data came right from our CAD data, so those buildings should be spot on. Links to what my students worked on: http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/johnjreiser Some of them really got into it, others did what was required. It's a good litmus test for when you need students for paid internships... I'm looking into Mapnik or CloudMade tiles without backgrounds to use as a annotation layer on top of high-res aerial photography for our official campus map. I think it'll look great and attract students to OSM via our program. John > Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2010 08:03:13 -0400 > From: Richard Weait > To: "talk-us@openstreetmap.org Openstreetmap" > > Subject: Re: [Talk-us] How to get college students involved? > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > John, Paul and Stefan are all doing mapping on their campuses, and > they haven't given us links. Please show us your good work, gentlemen! > ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Directional Prefix/Postfix Proposal
On Sun, Aug 8, 2010 at 12:37 AM, Alan Millar wrote: > How about this proposal for US streets: > > (1) Leave "name" unabbreviated > > (2) Put whatever form you want of abbreviated name in "name:en" I suggest not. We already have an expectation of having the real English name in name:en. I would argue that name:en should be the same as name. (Well, for most places in US, perhaps not all, we wouldn't translate "Los Angeles into "The Angels" would we?) If you wanted to render[1] an all English map of the world, you'd likely use name:en. You would likely be disappointed if the data there was something other than the actual English name. [1] I'm not talking about a specific renderer, but any renderer. In this case it could be text to speech software for turn-by-turn announcements, a paper map, tiles, anything where language choice is important. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] How to get college students involved?
On Sun, Aug 8, 2010 at 9:48 PM, Jeffrey Ollie wrote: > On Sun, Aug 8, 2010 at 7:03 AM, Richard Weait wrote: >> John, Paul and Stefan are all doing mapping on their campuses, and >> they haven't given us links. Please show us your good work, gentlemen! > > Here's what I've done for the community college that I work for: > > http://osm.org/go/T_c5qPQUA- Nice stuff. Do you have any tips to offer new campus-mappers? That is quite a sport complex north of campus. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] How to get college students involved?
On Sun, Aug 8, 2010 at 7:03 AM, Richard Weait wrote: > John, Paul and Stefan are all doing mapping on their campuses, and > they haven't given us links. Please show us your good work, gentlemen! Here's what I've done for the community college that I work for: http://osm.org/go/T_c5qPQUA- -- Jeff Ollie ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Fwd: Re: [OSM-talk] Mapquest launches site based on OSM!
> From: Paul Johnson > Perhaps Richard could shed some more light on this, but relations are > pretty much going to be necessary to properly render route shields given > the huge variety in highway networks in North America and the world. My company has a beta version of a renderer that displays the proper shield, be it interstate, U.S. highway, state, county, or whatnot, without using relations. To do so, it looks for the following tags on a way (i.e., /not/ on its relations): network:country[us]:interstate = 95 network:country[us]:unitedStatesHighway = 1 network:country[us]:state[md] = 99 It also does proper multi-shield rendering of multiplexed routes, be they of the same type... network:country[us]:unitedStatesHighway = 50;301 ...or disparate: network:country[us]:interstate = 70 network:country[us]:unitedStatesHighway = 40 ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Fwd: Re: [OSM-talk] Mapquest launches site based on OSM!
* Phil! Gold [2010-08-08 09:41 -0400]: > SELECT road.highway, route.network, route.ref > FROM planet_osm_line road > JOIN route_members ON road.osm_id = route_members.road_id > JOIN planet_osm_line route ON route_members.postgis_id = route.osm_id I was doing this from memory... Those JOINs should be LEFT JOINs, of course, because most roads are not members of route relations. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- PHP is a minor evil perpetrated and created by incompetent amateurs, whereas Perl is a great and insidious evil, perpetrated by skilled but perverted professionals. -- Jon Ribbens --- -- ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Fwd: Re: [OSM-talk] Mapquest launches site based on OSM!
On Sun, Aug 8, 2010 at 7:45 AM, Richard Weait wrote: > Let's do a "shields" BoF at Atlanta next weekend. I have some ideas > that make shields much easier and even solve shield concurrency. Hopefully your idea recognizes the silliness of rendering the individual state route shield designs, especially the ones that will either be huge or compress the text to an unreadable size :) ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Fwd: Re: [OSM-talk] Mapquest launches site based on OSM!
* Richard Weait [2010-08-08 07:45 -0400]: > Let's do a "shields" BoF at Atlanta next weekend. I have some ideas > that make shields much easier and even solve shield concurrency. I'm not going to SotM-US, so let me just mention what I've experimented with (unsuccessfully). What I'd like to see with shields is: If a road is a member of a US, Interstate, state, or county route relation, render an appropriately-sheped shield with the route number at zoom levels appropriate to the road's highway= tag. Road ref= tags should only be rendered if the road is not a member of any route relations. If a road is a member of multiple route relations for different routes, it should have all shields rendered, with reasonable spacing. If a road is a member of multiple route relations for the same route (this happens with the per-state relations and super-relations for Interstates and US highways), rendering should be the same as if it were only a member of one relation. (In other words, adding a super-relation shouldn't double the number of shields rendered.) I'm mostly focusing on rendering with Mapnik, since that's what most of the web-based slippy maps use, including the main one. Ignoring the roads' ref= tags completely and only rendering the shields from the route relations is one approach, but it then leaves roads without route relations (like a lot of state and couty roads) without shields, and it loses the ability to decide when to render the shields based on the roads' classifications; you would instead have to pick particular zoom levels at which to start each type of shield. On the other hand, if you render the shields from the route relations with the road information, you run into two main problems. One is that roads may be broken into almost arbitrarily-small pieces, which could result in diplicate shields very close together. The other, more important one, is that the information is now in two places in the PostGIS database, and I have yet to find an SQL query that doesn't get really slow trying to JOIN that information. My best effort has been to generate a link table that contains the OSM IDs of routes, the PostGIS IDs of those routes (just the OSM ID negated), and the OSM IDs of their member roads (which are also the PostGIS IDs). Then you do something like SELECT road.highway, route.network, route.ref FROM planet_osm_line road JOIN route_members ON road.osm_id = route_members.road_id JOIN planet_osm_line route ON route_members.postgis_id = route.osm_id Unfortunately, in my experience, those JOINs get really slow. I've tried working with the query planner to get speed improvements, but haven't achieved much. My next thought, for when I get back to working with shield rendering, is to try making a denormalized table that contains the information from the JOIN that I need. That approach will require some degree of modification to osm2pgsql in order to maintain that table through database updates, but it's the best way I can see forward. Once you have a query that gives you highway= from the road and route= and ref= from the relation, addressing almost everything from my "what I want" paragraph becomes really simple. (I haven't figured out a way to suppress shields from the super-relations yet.) While most of my thought about the actual rendering are basically "make separate images for each network shield for refs of one, two, and three characters long", I've been pondering how to use the symbol= tag on the route relations. Mapnik 1 simply can't, as far as I can tell; its shield images need to be configured statically. I haven't played much with Mapnik2, but apparently it has more dynamism in its renderings, so it might be able to use them, if it can fetch images from URLs (preferably only once; caching the downloads during a run). -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Don't have good ideas if you aren't willing to be responsible for them. -- Alan Perlis --- -- ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] How to get college students involved?
John, Paul and Stefan are all doing mapping on their campuses, and they haven't given us links. Please show us your good work, gentlemen! ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] How to get college students involved?
I made my advanced GIS students use JOSM to update a familiar area. Some just added a few POIs, while others mapped all the trails in a local park. It's a good way to expose them to other data constructs than the ESRI separate point-line-polygon concept. John > > Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2010 21:35:54 -0700 > From: Paul Johnson > To: talk-us@openstreetmap.org > Subject: Re: [Talk-us] How to get college students involved? > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > On Fri, 06 Aug 2010 13:00:48 -0400, Stefan Brandle wrote: > >> I teach computer science at a university about half way between >> Indianapolis and Ft. Wayne. I would love to have someone show us how to >> get involved mapping precise data locally and submitting it to various >> online data sets, or working on software that is helpful to OSM and >> others. We have students who need senior projects, and also run the >> occasional special topics class. > > On my campus, I lead by example. Folks spotted me mapping the campus, > and it spread to the rest of the city from there. > http://osm.org/go/CICAoLV@ > ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Fwd: Re: [OSM-talk] Mapquest launches site based on OSM!
On Sun, Aug 8, 2010 at 12:58 AM, Paul Johnson wrote: > On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 20:06:52 -0400, Phil! Gold wrote: > >> * Paul Johnson >> [2010-07-21 00:19 -0700]: >>> On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 07:15:18 -0400, Phil! Gold wrote: >>> > I what way does OpenCycleMap get this right? As far as I can tell, >>> > it doesn't render road shields at all. >>> >>> No, but it does render route relations. >> >> It's the shields I want, and they're harder than just rendering >> relations at all, because the information I need is split between the >> regular roads and the route relations. The relations have the data for >> the shields, but the roads have the highway= tag that indicates when the >> shields need to be rendered. I'd also prefer to be able to say "if this >> road has a ref=, but is not a member of a route relation, render the >> ref=", but that's a giant pain to do. > > Perhaps Richard could shed some more light on this, but relations are > pretty much going to be necessary to properly render route shields given > the huge variety in highway networks in North America and the world. Let's do a "shields" BoF at Atlanta next weekend. I have some ideas that make shields much easier and even solve shield concurrency. I'll see the the SotM-US organizers will put it on the program. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Abbreviation Police
On Sat, 07 Aug 2010 18:13:18 -0600, Kevin Atkinson wrote: > On Sat, 7 Aug 2010, Paul Johnson wrote: > >> On Tue, 03 Aug 2010 23:32:54 -0600, Kevin Atkinson wrote: >> >>> Rather than "United Stated Highway 29 Frontage Road" just "U.S. 29 >>> Frontage Road" or maybe "US 29 Frontage Road". Why. Because no will >>> say the formal out load. >>> >>> Rather than "Interstate 95 Frontage Road", just "I-95 Frontage Road". >>> Why? Even though some will say the formal, most just say the letter >>> I. >> >> You can do this in the renderer or text-to-speech system if you use the >> unabridged form. > > Hu? > > Can you please elaborate? Rather than tagging for the renderer, change the renderer for the data, so when it sees, say, "Interstate xxx", it abbreviates it to your liking. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
