Re: [Talk-us] Proposed mechanical edit - remove objects that are not existing according to source of GNIS import that added them

[EthnicFood IsGreat]

Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2019 08:04:13 +0100 (CET)
From: Mateusz Konieczny 
Cc: Talk Us 
Subject: Re: [Talk-us] Proposed mechanical edit - remove objects that
are not existing according to source of GNIS import that added them



Mar 21, 2019, 4:46 AM by m...@rtijn.org:




On Mar 20, 2019, at 9:01 AM, Mateusz Konieczny <>> matkoni...@tutanota.com 
>> > wrote:

I plan to run an automated edit that will revert part of the GNIS
import that added them and delete objects that never had any reason to
appear in the OSM database in any form, at least according to GNIS data.

Please comment no matter what you think about this idea! I will not
make the edit without a clear support so please comment if you think
that it is a good idea and if you think that it should not be done.>>


Thanks for bringing the idea up. It actually did come up fairly recently on Slack > 
https://osmus.slack.com/archives/C029HV951/p1550176430103000 
>

My view is that we would be missing an opportunity to have mappers review these 
locations and update the areas concerned. These nodes exist mostly in 
‘undermapped' / remote areas that could use some human mapper attention. So I’d 
be in favor of trying to resolve this using some human driven cleanup first.


What is the benefit, during survey, of mapped places that are not existing 
anymore?

I encounter many during surveys (usually result of data getting outdated) and 
for me it was
always time sink (as I needed to check is it actually gone) and never useful in 
any way.

Note that it is not obvious, especially for beginner or data users, that all of 
this places
are not existing anymore.



Instead of deleting the features that don't exist anymore, couldn't they 
be moved over to OHM?


Mark



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Re: [Talk-us] Proposed mechanical edit - remove is_in:continent in USA

[EthnicFood IsGreat]

Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2019 08:03:04 +0100 (CET)
From: Mateusz Konieczny 
To: Talk Us 
Subject: [Talk-us] Proposed mechanical edit - remove is_in:continent
in USA

is_in:continent=* is subjective as both division Earth landmass into 
continents[1] and boundaries between continents[2] are mostly subjective. There 
are many competing ways to split world into continents and OSM is not proper 
place to record all of them or one selected system.

In rare cases where one desires to assign locations to continents it can be 
done using location data inherently included in OSM objects and explicit tags 
added to part of objects are not really useful anyway.

is_in:continent tag should be removed to avoid confusing newbies and discourage 
adding new instances of this undesirable tag.

I propose to run an automated edit restricted to USA that will remove all 
instances of this tag.

Please comment no matter what you think about this idea! I will not make the 
edit without a clear support so please comment if you think that it is a good 
idea and if you think that it should not be done.

[...]



I'm in favor.

Mark




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Re: [Talk-us] Rails-To-Trails data

[EthnicFood IsGreat]

Thanks Steve.

Mark



Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2019 10:00:20 -0800
From: OSM Volunteer stevea 
To: talk-us 
Subject: Re: [Talk-us] Rails-to-Trails data

While I'm not sure the email address from their website I used is exactly 
correct, I did make this request to RTC (and cc'd Richard).  I'll let people 
know here if or how they reply.

Cheers,
SteveA
California

On Mar 6, 2019, at 4:00 AM, Richard Fairhurst  wrote:

Hi all,

I see that Rails-to-Trails Conservancy donated their GIS data to Google:

https://www.railstotrails.org/our-work/trail-mapping-and-gis/

Anyone in the US fancy asking if they might do the same for OSM? Our coverage 
is good on the major trails (Katy Trail, Coeur d'Alenes, etc.), but often 
missing for smaller or less frequented trails, and I believe RTC have some 
metadata (surfaces etc.) it'd be good to have. Since most cycling apps and 
websites use OSM data it should be a win for RTC to have better data in OSM.

I'm happy to approach them if no-one else does, but it'd probably be better 
coming from, you know, someone on the same continent.

cheers
Richard



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Re: [Talk-us] Strange city boundary: Lee, Illinois

[EthnicFood IsGreat]

Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2018 14:46:48 +0100
From: wambac...@posteo.de
To: "talk-us@openstreetmap.org Openstreetmap"

Subject: [Talk-us] Strange city boundary: Lee, Illinois
Hi,

are there cities (admin level 8) in the USA which  part of two counties?

see: https://wambachers-osm.website/images/osm/snaps_2018/lee.png

left: Lee County

right: DeKalb County

there are some more, but i would like to know if that is ok. In Germany
this is impossible.

Regards

walter/Germany

--

My projects:

Admin Boundaries of the World 
Missing Boundaries

Emergency Map 
Postal Code Map (Germany only) 
Fools (QA for zipcodes in Germany) 
Postcode Boundaries of Germany 
-- next part --
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: 





I personally know of an example in Indiana.

Mark

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Re: [Talk-us] Planning an Import in Prince George's County, Maryland

[EthnicFood IsGreat]

Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2018 10:28:10 -0700
From: OSM Volunteer stevea 
To: talk-us 
Subject: Re: [Talk-us] Planning an Import in Prince George's County,
Maryland


Clifford Snow  wrote:
If you haven't already joined our US Slack community, please sign up at 
https://osmus-slack.herokuapp.com/. The community can help you with build your 
import plan.

Having met Clifford two summers ago, I admired, marveled at (and congratulated him upon!) his 
awesome community organization skills.  I have "done OSM" with him via talk-us, 
face-to-face (we briefly spoke at SOTM-US Seattle), email and wiki to better our map — all using 
these terrific relatively freely-available methods of communication — and none of them requiring 
that I accept a License Agreement.  To be clear:  I have great respect for both Clifford and the 
open-platform communication methods by which we (and many others) "do OSM" together.

At least once, Clifford invited me to join Slack as well.  However, after reading Slack's Terms of 
Service Agreement (a contract of adhesion, really), I could not and do not abide with the ways 
which Slack (and other proprietary, not-open-source/open-data communication platforms) divide our 
community into "those who Slack" and "those who don't."  Even as Clifford has 
acknowledged this issue in these posts, I feel compelled to speak up about this again whenever I 
see this invitation to Slack again and again.

I don't wish to throw rocks at the good process and results which happen because some of 
us collaborate on Slack.  I do wish to urge OSM volunteers to seriously (re-?)consider 
that there are well-established, perfectly useful communication methods (email, wiki, 
talk-us, face-to-face, meetups/Mapping Parties...) which do not require "shiny apps 
laden with hidden, commercial code" that ask us to cloak our communication into the 
private realm of a for-profit company.  As an open-source/open-data project, I remain 
puzzled why OSM volunteers do this.

Perhaps what I'm suggesting (again?  I seem to recall it has been brought up before) is 
that if OSM uses a "live-collaboration communication app" that we either 
develop our own or choose some open-source version of one without onerous License Terms 
that MANY (not just me) find offensive.

Is that possible?

Thanks for reading.  I mean this in the best interests of OSM longer-term.

SteveA
California
OSM Volunteer since 2009




+1

Mark


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Re: [Talk-us] Undiscussed mass-revert by user Nakaner-repair

[EthnicFood IsGreat]

As a member of the US community, I'm in favor of reverting the bad 
edits, even if it removes some good contributions.

Mark

-

Message: 1
Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 13:27:14 + (UTC)
From: Mikel Maron 
To: Michael Reichert ,  Talk-us

Subject: Re: [Talk-us] Undiscussed mass-revert by user Nakaner-repair
Message-ID: <232049907.3007698.1524317234...@mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

  blockquote, div.yahoo_quoted { margin-left: 0 !important; border-left:1px 
#715FFA solid !important; padding-left:1ex !important; background-color:white 
!important; } Nakaner
This is an epic effort and appreciated.
But there are two things that need to be cleared up.

  The choice was to either accept that OSM

is overrun by a army of sockpuppets who ignore us at all or to make the
time/money they invest into editing a waste of time/money by reverting their 
edits even if it removes good contributions. That's sad but what is the 
alternative?

It's not a binary choice. The alternative is to establish good dialogue with 
the communities you are monitoring (the US on this case), and make sure there 
is awareness and buy in to your proposed action. I don't think that would be 
difficult or time consuming but does take consideration of other mappers in OSM 
who you don't regularly communicate with.

  There is no formal policy yet but that doesn't mean that they can do what 
they want to do. If it is against the interests of the community, it's against 
the existing unwritten rules.

There is no such thing that gives anyone the right for large scale vigilante 
actions. There is enough justification to potentially take action (after 
discussion and with proper communication) -- sock puppets for one -- that you 
don't need to invoke organized editing.   If and when we do have a policy, we 
in the osmf will also need to develop clear guidance on how it is communicated 
and implemented.

Mikel

On Friday, April 20, 2018, 8:22 PM, Michael Reichert  
wrote:

Hi,

Am 20.04.2018 um 17:13 schrieb Ian Dees:

I noticed that user Nakaner-repair just reverted 1000+ changesets
throughout the United States without any discussion in the local community.
Nakaner-repair points to a thread in the German forum [0] that seems to
indicate that they think these edits were made by paid mappers. Having not
heard from those suspected paid mappers, they went ahead and reverted
without discussion from the local community.

TL;DR A group of mappers (presumeably from UTC+5) started adding
highway=service and doing wrong quality assurance on roads in Europe and
the U.S. in mid/end of March. British and later German mappers found
these strange edits last week, some German searched for more accounts,
SomeoneElse and myself wrote changeset comments and SomeoneElse (DWG)
blocked many on them.

Unfortunately, the 0-hour user blocks are not as useful as they are
usually (and I expected them to be). They have been ignored and they
continued editing or created sockpuppets. Longer blocks were ignored and
they continued editing after the block. Changeset comments were not
answered or the response did not answer the question.

Since this week, they don't do any QA on roads any more and only add
highway=service in the U.S. They create new accounts if their old
accounts are blocked. This pattern now repeats day by day and the last
resort was to revert their work because that causes financial damage (I
hope they get paid).

Please see some inline comments/responses on Ian's questions below.

-
The full story:

On 2018-03-29 Will Phillips writes to the Talk-gb mailing list that he
observed "a series of edits with users removing or changing access and
oneway tags". He describes the quality of these edits as "very poor". At
that time "none of them has yet responded to changeset comments".
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-gb/2018-March/021259.html

SomeoneElse suggests him to write an email to d...@osmfoundation.org
(the DWG).
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-gb/2018-March/021260.html

I am not subscribed to Talk-gb and did not notice it at that time.

On 2018-04-09 tux67 creates a new thread on the German forum because he
found two users (sri_harsha and Premsakhare) editing roads globally
without local knowledge. He asks other mappers to review their edits.
https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?pid=693849#p693849
(contains changeset links)

Premsakhare had received multiple (!) user blocks at that time. The
oldes block was created after the discussion on Talk-gb.
https://www.openstreetmap.org/user_blocks/1831
He had been blocked because he did not answer changeset comments asking
for the sources being used. The block was removed automatically when
Premsakhare read it. Premsakhare uploaded more changesets but did not
answer the 

Re: [Talk-us] Old Bing/ESRI satellite imagery?

[EthnicFood IsGreat]

Message: 1
Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2018 03:30:14 -0600 (CST)
From: Richard Fairhurst 
To: talk-us@openstreetmap.org
Subject: Re: [Talk-us] Old Bing/ESRI satellite imagery?


The previous ESRI imagery has just been restored to the imagery list (by
ESRI, so 100% legit) under the name “Clarity”.

Richard




Great!  I'm glad to hear that.  I use that imagery more than any other.  
Thanks for sharing that news.


Mark

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Re: [Talk-us] CrossCountryRoads.com

[EthnicFood IsGreat]

> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 4 Nov 2015 06:40:38 -0600
> From: Paul Johnson 
> To: Martijn van Exel 
> Cc: OSM US Talk 
> Subject: Re: [Talk-us] CrossCountryRoads.com

> On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 10:55 AM, Martijn van Exel  wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I was in touch with Tom Valazak who created and maintains
> crosscountryroads.com, a site somewhat similar to aaroads.com containing
> images and video footage for interstates and highways in more than 40 US
> states. He generously grants OSM permission to use the images on his site
> for mapping more freeway related information such as signposts, lane
> counts, speed limits. I created a wiki page for this:
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/CrossCountryRoads.com
>
> I hope you find it useful. If you do, please drop Tom a line through his
> web site, I am sure he would appreciate it.
>

> Wow, that's gonna be handy for my current interstates project.


Check out this e-mail I got from Alex Nitzman (webmas...@aaroads.com)
of aaroads.com.  The last paragraph is the important part.

Mark Bradley

* * * * * * * * * * * *

Hi Mark,

Thank you for writing and the compliments to our site. A lot of the
Indiana information comes from our contributor Thomas Decker, who
lives in Indianapolis. I appreciate the work you do as well, as I used
to work with GIS for Universal Map Group and still do GIS work on the
side.

The glossary section on state routes/highways/roads nomenclature comes
from a map created by a road enthusiast that outlined all of the terms
used by state on our highway forum. I followed that up with research
on what contributors added to Wikipedia. Being that I live in Florida,
I also am used to the term state road, as that it what FDOT uses as
well. Shall I update the glossary to reflect that state road is not
solely the term used in Indiana?

The shield gallery was originally created by Jake Bear. He used a
different set of terms and no longer runs the gallery. As it works
out, the term state highway tends to be trumped by state route by most
states.
At some point we will overhaul the Gallery and perhaps better specify
the difference. But my knowledge of PHP scripting is not fluid enough
to do it myself at this time.

Most of the glossary was compiled by Andy Field back in 2001 or 2002.
I was not aware of the surface street definition, and I think the
definition he gave is too vague. Perhaps the term should not be
referenced?

Excellent point on the added benefit to mileage based interchange
numbering. I shall amend the description to include that.

There are a number of forum members that also participate in updating
OpenStreetMap. My forum administration James Mast is one of them, and
I have supplied him with updates for Florida in the past. There is an
Open Street Map thread on the board as well. You have my permission to
use information/photos to help improve it.

Regards,

- Alex

-- 

Alex Nitzman
Webmaster - AARoads.com | Interstate-Guide.com
Blog: http://blog.aaroads.com
Forum: http://www.aaroads.com/forum

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[Talk-us] Moving historic railroad ways from OSM to OpenHistoricalMap

[EthnicFood IsGreat]

It's apparent to me that consensus will never be reached on whether or not
abandoned railroads belong in OSM (at least the way it is currently
configured), given the strong feelings on both sides of the issue.  That's
why I think moving them to OHM is a good compromise.  I don't like it, but
I would rather do that than see this data lost forever.  At least in OHM,
the data still lives, and can always be moved back to OSM later if a
solution to the problem of historic features can be found.

Mark
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