Re: [Tango-L] bad nuevo
> Also, even "traditionals" use moves and techniques invented or at least > re-invented and popularized by nuevo teachers. I.e. even nuevos have discovered moves and techniques used by traditionals. Only through ignorance can discovery be mistaken for invention. > it enables dancers to invent new things It enabled dancers who were previously unable. Plenty of others were enabled to invent new things long before the Nuevo brand appeared. -- Chris ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
Re: [Tango-L] What Argentine Tango is, and what it is not
Huck Kennedy wrote: > That's when they ask me, "Oh, that sounds nice, how often do you > compete?," > The correct answer for many is, of course, "every time I write a post on tango-l". There's no lakc of competitive spirit and one- upmanship on this list ;). -- Alexis Cousein [EMAIL PROTECTED] Senior Systems Engineer/Solutions Architect SGI/Silicon Graphics -- ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
Re: [Tango-L] tweaking lower back
The majority of men I dance with are sitting back on their heels with their pelvis tucked under. They learn the correct posture and then five minutes later they go back to what I call 'midwestern couch slouch.' It's not possible to dance close embrace with these guys and stay on your own axis, because they are pulling you into their dance space. If you add the 'hand on the lower back pulling in' aspect it's a recipe for a week of back pain for me, from an hour of dancing. The men who DON'T dance with bad posture--the difference is as between night and day. It's very hard to teach someone a new way of holding their body--it involves fighting against years of body memory. I think some kind of exercise at the beginning of every beginner's lesson is necessary, and teachers should go around during practice and correct this repeatedly while the couples are dancing. It should not be on the follows to point it out to their partner. I can do this with my partner but he is a long-term partner from swing and salsa and ballroom and wants me to nag him about it. He says it's the hardest thing he's ever dealt with in any kind of dance. And, of course, women have corresponding posture issues, not supporting their own weight, tucking their pelvis under, hanging with their weight on the lead's right shoulder/arm. Keith wrote: > I'm surprised and yet I'm not surprised that so many people seem to have > lower > back problems attributed to Tango. I'm surprised because of my own personal > perspective. In my pre-Tango days I had lower back surgery twice for 3 > ruptured > discs - L3, L4 and L5. Even between and after the surgeries I had constant > niggling back pains despite numerous physio exercises. I still remember my > first > visit to BsAs in 1997 - I wore a back-support every day of the 6-weeks I was > there. But, since then, touch-wood, I've never had a back pain. To me, Tango > is like the perfect exercise for anyone with lower back problems. As Huck > says - > posture is the key and, for me, the disassociation between the upper and > lower > body resulting in the constant spiralling of the spine is like perfect > therapy for > the back. Add in the Tango walk - squeezing the thighs and buttocks and I can > almost feel my lower back being strengthened and stabalized. > > So, then, why am I also not surprised that many people do have lower back > pains attributed to Tango? It's posture. When I see guys with their head > projected forward, shoulders hunched forward or bending forward at the > waist, I think, my god - what are they doing to their back. IMHO, when > dancing Tango, the body should be straight but tilted forward, stomach in, > chest up and out and shoulders down. That's it. Oh yes, chest up and > shoulders down comes from a contraction of the big, mid-level back muscles > [trapezius?], which must be engaged. > > Keith, HK > > > On Thu Mar 13 10:51 , "Huck Kennedy" sent: > >> And while you yourself are no doubt past that stage, don't forget >> perhaps the biggest lower-back killer of all: Poor dance posture, >> particularly any inappropriate bending forward at the waist. >> >> Huck > > > ___ > Tango-L mailing list > Tango-L@mit.edu > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l > -- Carol Ruth Shepherd Arborlaw PLC Ann Arbor MI USA 734 668 4646 v 734 786 1241 f Arborlaw - a legal blog for entrepreneurs and small business http://arborlaw.com ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
[Tango-L] There is only tango...
There is no open or close embrace...no traditional or nuevo...no milonguero or salon... There is only tango... Make this your mantra... ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
Re: [Tango-L] There is only tango...
Alex <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > There is no open or close embrace...no traditional or nuevo...no milonguero > or salon... > > There is only tango... > > Make this your mantra... I found what would appear to be a couple of portenas on YouTube discussing your theory. http://tinyurl.com/2pc7lk They're talking a bit too fast for me to pick up most of it, apologies in advance if it gets too profane. :-) Huck ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
[Tango-L] tweaking lower back
"Back on their heels with their pelvis tucked under" -Carol I'm trying to picture this stance. Does it look like they are slightly bent forward from the waist? - pelvis in and under the chest? Shoulders slightly forward? ..hard to picture.. would you describe the 'better' stance? Is it; pelvis relaxed and whole body tipped forward and standing on the balls of the feet?? Chest further forward than everything below the chest?? .. more details, please.. - Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
Re: [Tango-L] space in close embrace
--- "Chris, UK" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > she doesn't extend the leg from the hip. she starts > under the rib cage. > > Girls, unless you too have had your hip joints surgically > raised by 20cm... > > ...keep in mind that region is employed equally by the > standing leg, > giving you groundedness that should not be compromised > for extra extension. Chris, There are two vertical halves of the body and two matching set of muscles. Hence, use one set for grounding and the other for extension. Also the muscles for the leg start way up in the spine. Actually, when posture is good, one only needs to inhale to raise the hip and free the leg. A nifty little trick leads can use in close-embrace. Trini PATangoS - Pittsburgh Argentine Tango Society Our Mission: To make Argentine Tango Pittsburghs most popular social dance! http://patangos.home.comcast.net/ Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
[Tango-L] Origin of Tandas
I couldn't find this discussed in the archives and am very curious: Back in the golden age, when you danced the entire night to one Orquesta Tipica, did they play 3 or 4 songs and then some rock 'n roll (or whatever)?? What was a night of tango like back then?? Where did the tanda system as we know it come from? Did they change partners every song? Or never? I am utterly clueless. Cheers, D. David Thorn _ Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail®-get your "fix". http://www.msnmobilefix.com/Default.aspx ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
Re: [Tango-L] Origin of Tandas
If the couple is new, and I'll assume so for the purposes of Tango etiquette described below..., the lady looks around the room for a leader she would like to dance with... If a leader sees a lady looking his way, and he would like to ask her to dance, they do a cabaceo... He nods his head while their eyes are locked., and she nods her's in return... The signal means it is ok for him to approach her. And as he does, she will usually rise and take a few steps to meet him part way. And they dance... And because it is a social dance where so many strangers dance with each other.., there needs to be a few guidelines to insure proper behaviour.. So... Tandas are groups of Tango tunes separated by Cortinas.., the 'rock 'n roll' you mentioned. Tandas run from 3 to 5 tunes, usually, and a couple usually stays together until they end. Tandas usually are all the same artist or at least the style of Tango. There are Biagi tandas, DiSarli tandas, Milonga tandas and Vals tandas, etc. Besides there just being a decent chance to dance.., there is a general understanding that a follower needs at least three tunes to learn a new leader's 'quirks' so to speak... :-)So it seems the theory is that she at least be given a chance to get to know him, before needing to part again. Not to mention of course that once a leader finds the music he's comfortable with, and the eye of a new lady he'd like to dance with, it wouldn't be nice to have the music changed out from under him while he's with her... When Tandas end, it is customary for both individuals to return to their *own* seats.It's basically a requirement that they do so. So that no leader can 'control' a follower for any longer than she knew she was committing to with the cabaceo... After they are both seated again, the leader may try to obtain her eyes again.., with another cabaceo, and she may be looking for him to do so. Or having enough of him she may also refuse to look his way... Floyd On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 17:36:36 -0600, you wrote: > >I couldn't find this discussed in the archives and am very curious: > >Back in the golden age, when you danced the entire night to one Orquesta >Tipica, did they play 3 or 4 songs and then some rock 'n roll (or whatever)?? >What was a night of tango like back then?? Where did the tanda system as we >know it come from? Did they change partners every song? Or never? I am >utterly clueless. > >Cheers, > >D. David Thorn > >_ >Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail®-get your >"fix". >http://www.msnmobilefix.com/Default.aspx >___ >Tango-L mailing list >Tango-L@mit.edu >http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l Buffalo Tango - Argentine Tango - How To Tango * * * * * * www.buffalotango.com * * * * * * ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
Re: [Tango-L] Origin of Tandas
I don't think you answered David's question. . . What you describe (quite nicely) is how the tanda system works now. But I believe the question was: what about in the beginning, when they presumably didn't have Biagi and DiSarli and who-knows-what-else all in one night, but rather had just one orchestra playing for them live? What was it like THEN? -Emily Floyd Baker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: . . . So... Tandas are groups of Tango tunes separated by Cortinas.., the 'rock 'n roll' you mentioned. Tandas run from 3 to 5 tunes, usually, and a couple usually stays together until they end. Tandas usually are all the same artist or at least the style of Tango. There are Biagi tandas, DiSarli tandas, Milonga tandas and Vals tandas, etc. Besides there just being a decent chance to dance.., there is a general understanding that a follower needs at least three tunes to learn a new leader's 'quirks' so to speak... :-)So it seems the theory is that she at least be given a chance to get to know him, before needing to part again. . . . On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 17:36:36 -0600, David wrote: > >I couldn't find this discussed in the archives and am very curious: > >Back in the golden age, when you danced the entire night to one Orquesta >Tipica, did they play 3 or 4 songs and then some rock 'n roll (or whatever)?? >What was a night of tango like back then?? Where did the tanda system as we >know it come from? Did they change partners every song? Or never? I am >utterly clueless. >Cheers, >D. David Thorn - Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
[Tango-L] Cafe de Los Maestros
A friend called me on Thursday morning to tell me about something special going on at 2:30pm at the Academia Nacional del Tango. I didn't have anything planned, so I decided to join her there for what we expected to be an homanaje for Anibal Arias. It turned out to be much more. As I arrived at the entrance on Avenida de Mayo, I realized that Alberto Podesta was only steps in front of me taking the elevator to the first floor. I commented to the young man at the door that one of the great singers of tango had just arrived. He had no idea who he was and couldn't have cared less. I realized that I had heard an announcement of this event on 2X4 radio, but I didn't catch the location. The who's who of tango were named, and I was soon to arrive at a by-invitation-only reception for them. Three years ago Gustavo Santaolalla decided to convince a number of tango musicians and singers to return to the recording studio and collaborate on a new project. He invited the greats of tango, a few of whom have since died. The project was called Cafe de los Maestros, which resulted in a two-CD set of 27 tracks and a book. It won the Latin Grammy for best tango album in 2006. The Latin Academy of Recording Arts and Sciences hosted a special ceremony at the Academia Nacional del Tango with Gustavo Santaolalla to present certificates to the musicians who participated in Cafe de los Maestros. The two heads of the Grammy awards came to Buenos Aires to take part in this presentation on March 13, 2008. Those present for the ceremony included Emilio Balcarce, Atilio Stampone, Osvaldo Berlinghieri, Leopoldo Federico, Virginia Luque, Alberto Podesta, Juan Carlos Godoy, Osvaldo Requena, Fernando Suarez Paz, Emilio de La Pena, Oscar Ferrari, Mariano Mores, Anibal Arias, Osvaldo Montes, Ernesto Baffa, and others--the who's who of tango. No one is under the age of 70; a few are past 90. A few have died since the project began in 2005. The wives of the late Carlos Garcia and Jose Libertella accepted certificates on their behalf. The event was held in the salon of the Museo del Tango with a preview of the 93-minute documentary Cafe de Los Maestros which premiered earlier this year at the Berlin Film Festival. It is scheduled for June 18 in Paris. When available on DVD, this will be a must-see for every tanguero. Each honored guest said a few words on stage after being presented with a certificate for participation. Atilio Stampone related how grateful he was to Carlos Garcia who gave him the money to buy his first piano. Many of these musicians and singers are still busy with their careers in tango. Anibal Arias (85) was in Japan last year. He and Osvaldo Montes played in Granada, Spain in early March. Arias continues to coach new musicians and always has ideas for new projects. As an aside, during my tango days in Chicago I went every Saturday night to a milonga at Tango nada mas. Bob Dronski always played an album of piano solos by Emilio de La Pena as we started to cleanup after all the dancers had gone home. I loved his arrangements and bought the album. Thursday afternoon I had the opportunity to personally thank Emilio de La Pena for his beautiful music. See their performance in Teatro Colon in August 2006: www.youtube.com/watch?v=nSXii0bkgEs http://music.aol.com/album/cafe-de-los-maestros/983442# Zivals Music Store in Buenos Aires has Cafe de Los Maestros (82 pesos). ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
Re: [Tango-L] Origin of Tandas
Yes... It looks like I misread that he didn't understand them at all 'now' as well.. But I did read Golden Age..., roughly from the mid 30's through to the mid 50's. And both DiSarli and Biagi as well as DiArenzo, Canaro, et al, were playing live and of course making recordings too at that time. I'm sorry I didn't exactly say it, but I believe the tanda, cortina, cabaceo, etc were all in place at that time.. It is how how people conducted themselves on the floor then too. The reasons being as I describe them... To the best of my knowledge. I'm sure they were worked out way before the Golden Age. But I wouldn't know exactly 'where and when' The cabaceo probably came to be used even before there was Tango. But if actual origination dates for tanda and cortina are known, it's not by me. Anyone else care to offer up those details? Btw... Another term I have read is "Idiota".An (idiot) would be someone who tries to dance to a cortina.:-) Hugs... Floyd On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 18:54:36 -0700 (PDT), you wrote: >I don't think you answered David's question. . . >What you describe (quite nicely) is how the tanda system works now. But I >believe the question was: what about in the beginning, when they presumably >didn't have Biagi and DiSarli and who-knows-what-else all in one night, but >rather had just one orchestra playing for them live? What was it like THEN? >-Emily > >Floyd Baker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >. . . >So... Tandas are groups of Tango tunes separated by Cortinas.., the >'rock 'n roll' you mentioned. Tandas run from 3 to 5 tunes, usually, >and a couple usually stays together until they end. Tandas usually >are all the same artist or at least the style of Tango. There are >Biagi tandas, DiSarli tandas, Milonga tandas and Vals tandas, etc. >Besides there just being a decent chance to dance.., there is a >general understanding that a follower needs at least three tunes to >learn a new leader's 'quirks' so to speak... :-)So it seems the >theory is that she at least be given a chance to get to know him, >before needing to part again. >. . . > >On Thu, 13 Mar 2008 17:36:36 -0600, David wrote: >> >>I couldn't find this discussed in the archives and am very curious: >> >>Back in the golden age, when you danced the entire night to one Orquesta >>Tipica, did they play 3 or 4 songs and then some rock 'n roll (or whatever)?? >> What was a night of tango like back then?? Where did the tanda system as we >>know it come from? Did they change partners every song? Or never? I am >>utterly clueless. > >>Cheers, >>D. David Thorn > > > > >- >Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. Buffalo Tango - Argentine Tango - How To Tango * * * * * * www.buffalotango.com * * * * * * ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
Re: [Tango-L] Why (going to/ or teaching) too many classes can be deadly
On Wed, 12 Mar 2008 22:44:38 EDT, you wrote: >The best dancers are the people who try to be them selves, >not Oscar and Tete wantabees. >I no longer go to as many workshops as I use to. 99% of them >are just dance steps anyway. The real problem I think is that women come to the workshops... They learn the patterns with the men. They forget they need to not know patterns... Floyd Buffalo Tango - Argentine Tango - How To Tango * * * * * * www.buffalotango.com * * * * * * ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
Re: [Tango-L] tweaking lower back
Carol, Wow, sounds like you have serious problems there. I know there are many ways of teaching Tango so, usually, I don't pontificate too much :-). But good posture is so fundamental to good Tango that every teacher should teach it from day one and every day thereafter. And it can be difficult because most young people nowadays have spent half their lives hunched over a computer and the other half slouched in front of the TV set. Often I start of by telling the guys that Tango is a manly dance and we stand like men - tall, straight and proud. I then demonstrate the wrong way - the slouch, before straightening up, with chest out. This gets things off to a light-hearted start and the girls love it. Usually they all agree that their boyfriends have horrible posture. So now the teacher has the girls on his side :-). But, I agree with you - the teacher must constantly remind and correct the guys' posture and it can take a long time. Keith, HK On Fri Mar 14 0:33 , Carol Shepherd sent: >The majority of men I dance with are sitting back on their heels with >their pelvis tucked under. They learn the correct posture and then five >minutes later they go back to what I call 'midwestern couch slouch.' ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
Re: [Tango-L] Why (going to/ or teaching) too many classes can be deadly
Floyd, I think the real problem is that many women [and men] go to workshops and forget why they're there - not to learn patterns but to learn how to dance better. Even worse, many women think they can already dance so they don't need to go to classes anymore. They're then stuck at whatever level they're at. Actually, if they have good leaders, some women do continue to improve, but an equal number go backwards. Keith, HK On Fri Mar 14 12:23 , Floyd Baker sent: >The real problem I think is that women come to the workshops... >They learn the patterns with the men. They forget they need to not >know patterns... > >Floyd ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
