Re: [Tango-L] Different feeling in tango
Myk, Your approach to tango seems a bit too naive and too literal, but that probably will change in time. So just a few corrections: 1. Passion is allowed among people regardless of conventional partnerships, if people they are not repressed. 2. Partnerships do not control passion and one does not have to pretend to be playing a role in order to justify sharing passion with someone other than his or her partner. 3, Milonga gay does not mean segregation of gay people. It means that the codes of conduct are relaxed in regards to the music, the gender roles, the invitation style, etc. But... if you are not familiar with these milongas in BsAs, you wouldn't have known it. And you see what I mean about the cultural stuff? All I have to do is throw out the word "milonga gay" to someone raised in the Western homophobic reactionary society and I get an instant response! Keep working on it, Myk. You're doing just fine. Nina At 08:47 PM 7/24/2008, Myk Dowling wrote: >Nina Pesochinsky wrote: >>Noticing the anatomical differences between genders is how >>3-year-olds learn that mommy and daddy are different. > >Actually, I think they recognise their different facial features. >Anatomical differences are way down the list. Human brains are >hard-wired to recognise and distinguish faces > >>The key words in Myk's post are "playing a role". Real dancers do >>not play a role. They dance who they are. If a woman can't quite >>figure out the power of her gender, she is in trouble, just as a >>man swimming in feminine energy. > >Sorry, Nina, but you're wrong. Dancers play a role, because a dance >is telling a story. A good dancer brings their self into the role. >People's psyche's are rarely so pure, and the story of the dance is >rarely reality. If you dance a passionate dance with someone who is >not your partner, you are play-acting, dancing a role. I'm not sure >why you want to be dismissive of this very powerful part of human >culture. Humans can empathise and communicate fiction. It's a >wonderful thing, deserving of great respect. > >>Why is it that the Argentines have no issues with gender >>roles? They dance as men and women, and, if those roles don't >>work, they go to some milonga gay. But they certainly do not try >>to justify abandoning traditional gender roles in the traditional milongas. > >Perhaps it's "traditional" homophobia? What you are describing is >called segregation, and it's something that I for one find quite >abhorrent in principle. Why should gay people have to go to separate milongas? > >>Actually, I am not against tango in energetic gender drag. I just >>want to know when and where it is happening, so that I can be prepared. :) > >"I got nothin' against them gay folk, I jes' don't want to see 'em >kissin' in front o' me!" > >Spend a moment considering the similarities of those two statements, >ignoring the obvious differences. > >-- >Myk Dowling ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
Re: [Tango-L] Different feeling in tango
- Original Message From: Sergio Vandekier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Tango-L List Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 9:52:21 AM Subject: [Tango-L] Different feeling in tango > > > Jack says: "Don't we talk a lot about the feeling of tango. > I know it's very important to me [understatement!] and the > feeling I have when I watch a man and a woman is completely > different to when I watch a man and a man. They can both > be fabulous and very enjoyable, but different." Here's perhaps another angle of looking at the questions of feeling in tango. I mentioned before that I have recently learned how to really enjoy dancing as a "follower." After some thinking about it (because all of this discussion has actually inspired me to do that) I have some clues as to what's going on. It seems to me that, in general, part of my attraction to tango is due to the fact that it allows me to express my sensuality safely. I think that in dancing as a follower I have allowed myself to let my feminine side express its own sensuality. I am rather enjoying the opportunities to express the feeling of beauty from a softer, warmer side of life. I am not sure I know how to explain this well, I am just exploring this whole idea as I write. I can tell that the man I often practice with (most often together with our female partners), when he follows, he does not allow himself that same feminine, expressive avenue. He still dances with masculine expressiveness being dominant which feels totally different to me then dancing with a woman -- it feels more like sparring. However, when we exchange roles, I let go of my masculine side and let the feminine flourish. Quite a nice feeling. And that has nothing to do with the fact I am dancing with a man. On the other hand, one of my female partners often likes to practice leading with me. I can tell that she does "all the right moves" but her energy is still predominantly feminine. Nothing wrong with that per se, but it is quite different. I am not a bisexual man by any means, but am a firm believer that each one of us has those two components in us and have learned to enjoy my own feminine in tango dance as much as I do my masculine. Does that make any sense? Is it still tango? I will let "the authorities" decide on that. I know that when there are opportunities for me to dance with women in traditional roles, I will take them. If there aren't, I will welcome an opportunity to dance as a follower with a good leader regardless of the gender of the leader. If there is masculine energy present so much the better because it is complementary to the feminine which makes the whole experience more complete and enjoyable. ...dubravko === seek, appreciate, and create beauty this life is not a rehearsal === ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
[Tango-L] Different feeling in tango
Jack says: "Don't we talk a lot about the feeling of tango. I know it's very important to me [understatement!] and the feeling I have when I watch a man and a woman is completely different to when I watch a man and a man. They can both be fabulous and very enjoyable, but different." Hi Jack, I totally agree with you. Precisely this is what I have been trying to explain : Tango may be danced in different ways, as there are different styles, which have different purposes. The music and the style (along with the place, available space, partner, general athmosphere, the way you are at the moment) provide changes in the way you feel. Dancing to Piazzola or to any music for instance: At the beginning most people prefer certain tango orchestras because they have a predictable beat. They know what to expect as they get familiar with the tango tempo. After a while they discover that some tango orchestras are easier than others to dance to. Are more regular, without extremes . Pretty soon they become conscious about the fact that tango has a beginning, a mid portion, a preparation for the ending and an ending. That it runs like a river, slowly and serene at times and fast like a torrent at other moments. This requires an artistic interpretation of the music through the dance, with changes in dynamics. You have to learn to dance with feeling, with fast or slow moves or pauses in order to synchronize with the music. The day arrives when you can dance to any tango orchestra with ease, they are all different and evoke different feeling which should be danced accordingly. You have been improvising, and now discover that to improvise to certain music could be very difficult, but if you know that music well enough you can find certain moves to correlate with it and then you choreograph for an exhibition to some strange music. (Piazzola for instance). You have to understand that there are many styles, they have different purpose (to dance socially, or to act on stage, or to surprise with unexpected moves, or to impress with elegance, or to bring back dancing forms from old times, etc.) . You concentrate in social dancing, develop musicality, connection and feeling, while others do it in stage tango, developing high degree of skill, elegance, and knowledge of the dance. Both are equally tango, they are different. One is not superior to the other, they have different purpose. Some tango dancers know only one aspect or style of tango (are totally ignorant about other styles and possibilities, they never saw a tango musical) to the point that when they see something different they doubt that that dance so different from theirs could also be tango. Their first reaction is "this is not tango", the second invariably is " this is not for social dancing". They are wrong both times, this is a different style of tango and given the right circumstances (mostly available space to dance) can be used for social dancing. Others are well versed in different styles that they use to adjust to different circumstances. Summary: if you are contented dancing milonguero, you do not need anything else. Those that dance on stage have connection, great skills, lead to perfection, have feeling, ...but those elements of tango are different, the feeling is different...very different... Best regards, Sergio _ Stay in touch when you're away with Windows Live Messenger. http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_messenger2_072008 ___ Tango-L mailing list Tango-L@mit.edu http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
