Version compatibility

[Geoff Lane]

Using The Bat! v1.62i on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1

I've been a satisfied TB users for a few years and suspect that it
may be time to upgrade from version 1! However, I'd like to trial the
latest version before committing, hence the following questions:

- Will using v3 on existing account files render them unusable in the
  1.62i?

- If I install v3 Professional over an existing 1.62i installation,
  is it possible to easily revert to 1.62i? If so, does the reversion
  just entail uninstalling v3, or do I have to go through a
  reinstallation and reconfiguration of 1.62i?

TIA,

-- 
Geoff Lane
Cornwall, UK



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Version compatibility

[Raymund Tump]

Hi Geoff,

> - Will using v3 on existing account files render them unusable in the
>   1.62i?

As far as I know, they changed the account files at some stage of
development.

> - If I install v3 Professional over an existing 1.62i installation,
>   is it possible to easily revert to 1.62i? If so, does the reversion
>   just entail uninstalling v3, or do I have to go through a
>   reinstallation and reconfiguration of 1.62i?

You can try the v3 in a separate directory with its own account
structure. There is a special command line parameter for it.

-- 
Regards,
Raymund



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Version compatibility

[Geoff Lane]

On 16 January 2005, 11:23, Raymund Tump wrote:

>> - Will using v3 on existing account files render them unusable in the
>>   1.62i?

> As far as I know, they changed the account files at some stage of
> development.

>> - If I install v3 Professional over an existing 1.62i installation,
>>   is it possible to easily revert to 1.62i? If so, does the reversion
>>   just entail uninstalling v3, or do I have to go through a
>>   reinstallation and reconfiguration of 1.62i?

> You can try the v3 in a separate directory with its own account
> structure. There is a special command line parameter for it.
~~~

Thanks, Raymund.

I was afraid of the change in account files.

I have a spare computer on which I can install TB3 for trial purposes.
Unfortunately, that'll only be feasible if I can think of some way of
testing it without corrupting my existing account files. I could back
up the account, try TB3, then restore the old account files.
Unfortunately, that would lose all messages sent and received while
working with TB3. I could export to .msg all messages sent/received in
TB3 but I have nearly a hundred folders and the export/import would
take too long.

I suspect the best way to do the trial would be to find a "throwaway"
freebie mail account that allowed POP3 access and sign up that account
to a mailing list or two ... unless someone else can think of a better
idea?

-- 
Geoff Lane
Cornwall, UK
--
Using The Bat! v1.62i on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1
Keyboard not connected. Think F1 to continue.



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Version compatibility

[Mary Bull]

Hello Geoff!

On Sunday, January 16, 2005, 8:42 AM, you wrote:

> I suspect the best way to do the trial would be to find a "throwaway"
> freebie mail account that allowed POP3 access and sign up that account
> to a mailing list or two ... unless someone else can think of a better
> idea?

I'm wondering what your goals are in this trial?

I myself would still be running v. 1.62 except that I wanted the
Smiley and Roguemoticon features that came with v. 2.xx.

Then I went on to 3.xx for the sake of the New Filter System and
because I wanted to be in on its further development and testing.

There are faults in v. 3.0.1.33 which were fixed in later betas. As
was recently noted here, also, the On-the-Fly-Encryption capability is
available only in a beta Professional edition.

A lot more things, especially in regard to IMAP and to spam filtering,
have been fixed and improved, as well as the New Filter System, in
these later betas. And we're promised (fingers crossed) a full release
of a more stable, better-functioning version--with no further cost to
those already running v. 3.xx--sometime in 2005.

Anyway, I guess my question is, why are you thinking about changing to
v. 3.xx from v. 1.62 just at this particular time?

-- 
Best regards,
Mary
The Bat! 3.0.2.10 on Windows XP 5.1 2600 Service Pack 2








Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Version compatibility

[Buiculescu Virgil]

Hello Geoff,

 While you're using TB3 you could leave the messages on the pop3
 server i guess, and when you'll go back to v1.62 you can just
 redownload them .

Sunday, January 16, 2005, 4:42:32 PM, you wrote:

> I could back
> up the account, try TB3, then restore the old account files.
> Unfortunately, that would lose all messages sent and received while
> working with TB3.



-- 
Best regards,
 Buiculescu Virgil   mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Version compatibility

[Geoff Lane]

On 16 January 2005, 15:17, Mary Bull wrote:

> Anyway, I guess my question is, why are you thinking about changing to
> v. 3.xx from v. 1.62 just at this particular time?
~~~

Several reasons:

1. There's a bug in either Windows or TB that keeps disassociating TB
   from the .eml extension, which means that I need to remake the
   association each time I reboot the computer. I know that it only
   takes one click to do, but it's annoying.

2. There's a bug in the message list pane on my main computer where
   bold text (indicating that a message is unread) varies in boldness
   from not much heavier than normal text to very heavy. This means
   that some unread messages look read in the message list.

3. I'm using SpamPal for anti-spam purposes. Unfortunately, I'm
   finding it keeps dumping ham into my spambin. I would like to relax
   the filters a little in SpamPal and do some extra filtering in my
   MUA. Hopefully, that will give me more flexibility and be easier to
   fine-tune. AIUI, TB! v 3 has spam filtering capabilities that 1.62
   has not.

4. Occasionally, I need to send HTML mail (i.e. when formatting of
   tables, lists, etc. is needed). v 1.62 can't send HTML natively, so
   I use a kludge that Allie described some time ago and alter the
   headers in a text editor.

5. My mail server has an available upgrade that provides IMAP to
   more-elegantly resolve my "client-server with occasional remote
   working" business model. At present, I keep account files on the
   server and TB is configured on each machine with account files at
   P:\Mail (where P: maps to the user's home folder on the network).
   When I'm remote working, I copy the account files to a local folder
   that I then use the SUBST command to map that folder to drive P:

   If my understanding of IMAP is correct, I should be able to specify
   certain key account folders to mirror locally and thus avoid the
   need for the manual copy.

Of course, I shall stay with v 1.62 if v 3 doesn't meet my
expectations, which is why I want to be sure I have a reversion path.

Thanks,

-- 
Geoff Lane
Cornwall, UK
--
Using The Bat! v1.62i on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Version compatibility

[Alexander S. Kunz]

Hello Geoff Lane & everyone else,

on 16-Jan-2005 at 15:42 you (Geoff Lane) wrote:

> I have a spare computer on which I can install TB3 for trial purposes.
> Unfortunately, that'll only be feasible if I can think of some way of
> testing it without corrupting my existing account files. I could back
> up the account, try TB3, then restore the old account files.

You can fully test everything when you back up your existing TB v1
installation with the built-in backup utility. You can then restore the
backup into the v3 installation. If you additionally set up the v3
installation to leave all messages on the server (as mentioned somewhere
else in this thread) you can later download them into your "life" v1
installation.

Take care however that the only thing that won't be backed up are your
filters. You can manually copy them over: they're in the "account.srx"
file(s) in your mail directory. TB v3 will, when you start it, convert the
"account.srx" files into the new "account.srb" files for the New Filtering
System (often referred to as "NFS" here, vs. "OFS" as in Old Filtering
System - the filtering system in TB v1 and v2).


You further wrote in mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ...

> 1. There's a bug in either Windows or TB that keeps disassociating TB
>from the .eml extension, which means that I need to remake the
>association each time I reboot the computer. I know that it only
>takes one click to do, but it's annoying.

That sounds like an interference with TB and another program. Are you using
any PIM software like Palm Desktop or something (that tries to reclaim its
file associations all the time) during Windows startup?


> 2. There's a bug in the message list pane on my main computer where
>bold text (indicating that a message is unread) varies in boldness
>from not much heavier than normal text to very heavy. This means
>that some unread messages look read in the message list.

Could be a character set problem. Are you receiving messages in different
code pages, ie. are the messages displayed in a different font in the
message list?


> 3. I'm using SpamPal for anti-spam purposes. Unfortunately, I'm
>finding it keeps dumping ham into my spambin. I would like to relax
>the filters a little in SpamPal and do some extra filtering in my
>MUA. Hopefully, that will give me more flexibility and be easier to
>fine-tune. AIUI, TB! v 3 has spam filtering capabilities that 1.62
>has not.

Its pretty boring to try and adapt the filter in TB to the new tricks that
spammers try all the time. Better go for a filter with Bayes analysis.
There's a plugin available for SpamPal, too (called "Bayesian").


> 4. Occasionally, I need to send HTML mail (i.e. when formatting of
>tables, lists, etc. is needed). v 1.62 can't send HTML natively, so
>I use a kludge that Allie described some time ago and alter the
>headers in a text editor.

That should work better with v3, though handling of HTML is still far from
perfect, especially when you try to forward/reply-to HTML messages and want
to preserve the formatting. :-/


>If my understanding of IMAP is correct, I should be able to specify
>certain key account folders to mirror locally and thus avoid the
>need for the manual copy.

Yes. However, TB's IMAP functionality depends on the IMAP server software
as well, there are numerous ways to tweak the behaviour of TB. For some
users TB works very good as IMAP client, for others its not working
satisfactory.


> Of course, I shall stay with v 1.62 if v 3 doesn't meet my
> expectations, which is why I want to be sure I have a reversion path.

v3 has a number of very good features (the NFS, common filters, etc.) that
make it really worth trying.


-- 
Best regards,
 Alexander (http://www.neurowerx.de - ICQ 238153981)

The development of Hydro-electric power in the desert of North America
awaits only the introduction of water. -- Statement in "Nuclear News"



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Version compatibility

[Mary Bull]

Hello Geoff!

On Sunday, January 16, 2005, 10:08 AM, you wrote:

> Of course, I shall stay with v 1.62 if v 3 doesn't meet my
> expectations, which is why I want to be sure I have a reversion path.

Thank you so very much for answering me at length as to your reasons
for wanting to try a trial upgrade to v. 3.0.1.33.

I encourage you to do this, therefore, using the back-up protection
measures others have posted to you here on tbudl, for reverting to v.
1.62 in case you are not pleased with v. 3.xx.

As Miguel just noted, the annoying column-width problem is not yet
fixed.

Some of the things that you want, IMAP and HTML capability, are
functioning much better in the latest beta than in v. 3.0.1.33.

That's the reason that I asked the question. After you get your trial
version of 3.0.1.33, I would like to encourage you to sign up as a
beta tester and download the latest beta--the one that I'm running. As
a beta tester myself, I could point you to a .rar download site for
this.

If you decide to join the beta testers, be sure to go to this site
first for registering, quoting from the TBBETA list footer:
==
IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first -
http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
==

I am, needless to say, very interested in your having a good
experience with v. 3.xx.

-- 
Best regards,
Mary
The Bat! 3.0.2.10 on Windows XP 5.1 2600 Service Pack 2








Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Version compatibility

[Roelof Otten]

Hallo Geoff,

On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 10:31:51 +GMT (16-1-2005, 11:31 +0100, where I
live), you wrote:

GL> - Will using v3 on existing account files render them unusable in the
GL>   1.62i?

No, the format for several files has changed, but so has their
extension, so when you go back to v1 then the original files are still
waiting for you.
Note that changes you make in your folder structure, filters and
account settings that you make with v3 won't be remembered by v1,
since they're made in different files.

GL> - If I install v3 Professional over an existing 1.62i installation,
GL>   is it possible to easily revert to 1.62i? If so, does the reversion
GL>   just entail uninstalling v3, or do I have to go through a
GL>   reinstallation and reconfiguration of 1.62i?

When you don't care about the software listed in the software panel of
your configuration screen, then you can revert back the easiest by
installing v1 over v3.
When I would do the testing, I'd save the registry settings for TB
before installing v3, in case I'd prefer to go back, I'd uninstall v3
(without wiping the message base), I'd load my old registry settings
and then I'd reinstall v1.

Though I'm convinced that this procedure works, the only guarantee
you'll get from me is that this messages takes space on your harddisk
and that making back-ups is proper procedure.

-- 
Groetjes, Roelof

As I feared, you have no sense of humor.

The Bat! 3.0.2.10
Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2
1 pop3 account, server on LAN



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Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
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Re: Version compatibility

[Roelof Otten]

Hallo Geoff,

On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 16:08:17 +GMT (16-1-2005, 17:08 +0100, where I
live), you wrote:

GL> 1. There's a bug in either Windows or TB that keeps disassociating TB
GL>from the .eml extension, which means that I need to remake the
GL>association each time I reboot the computer. I know that it only
GL>takes one click to do, but it's annoying.

That's neither a bug in TB or Windows, but it's another program that
keeps associating itself with .eml
You might get a clue by checking which program is associating itself
with the extension.

GL> 5. My mail server has an available upgrade that provides IMAP to
GL>more-elegantly resolve my "client-server with occasional remote
GL>working" business model. At present, I keep account files on the

Even in v3 IMAP isn't completely grown up. Your results may vary,
depending on the mail server you're using.

GL>If my understanding of IMAP is correct,

Yep.


-- 
Groetjes, Roelof

Cats are the proof of a higher purpose to the Universe

The Bat! 3.0.2.10
Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2
1 pop3 account, server on LAN



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Description: PGP signature

Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
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Re: Version compatibility

[Marek Mikus]

Hello all,
Sunday, January 16, 2005, Geoff Lane wrote:

> I've been a satisfied TB users for a few years and suspect that it
> may be time to upgrade from version 1! However, I'd like to trial the
> latest version before committing, hence the following questions:

> - Will using v3 on existing account files render them unusable in the
>   1.62i?

> - If I install v3 Professional over an existing 1.62i installation,
>   is it possible to easily revert to 1.62i? If so, does the reversion
>   just entail uninstalling v3, or do I have to go through a
>   reinstallation and reconfiguration of 1.62i?

There were many changes in file structure, there was changed account
configuration format (file changed from ACCOUNT.CFG to ACCOUNT.CFN),
format for storing folders structure (file changed from ACCOUNT.FLX to
ACCOUNT.FLB), format for storing filters (file changed from
ACCOUNT.SRX to ACCOUNT.SRB) etc. Format for storing messages
(MESSAGES.TBB) is unchanged from version 1.42, so they will not be
changed.

-- 

Bye

Marek Mikus
Czech support of The Bat!
http://www.thebat.cz

Using the best The Bat! 3.0.2.10
under Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1
Notebook Acer, Pentium4-M 2.2 GHz, 512 MB RAM, ADSL line

 



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Version compatibility

[Geoff Lane]

On 16 January 2005, 23:20, Roelof Otten wrote:

> That's neither a bug in TB or Windows, but it's another program that
> keeps associating itself with .eml
> You might get a clue by checking which program is associating itself
> with the extension.
~~~

Hi Roelof, and thanks.

There's a bug. If I reboot my computer and then, before starting TB,
check in My Computer->Folder Options for the settings for ".eml",
Windows reports that it is associated with The Bat!. When I start TB,
I get a message saying that TB is no longer associated with .eml files
and asking whether I want to remake the association.

-- 
Geoff Lane
Cornwall, UK
--
Using The Bat! v1.62i on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Version compatibility

[Geoff Lane]

On 16 January 2005, 23:46, Marek Mikus wrote:

> There were many changes in file structure, there was changed account
> configuration format (file changed from ACCOUNT.CFG to ACCOUNT.CFN),
> format for storing folders structure (file changed from ACCOUNT.FLX to
> ACCOUNT.FLB), format for storing filters (file changed from
> ACCOUNT.SRX to ACCOUNT.SRB) etc. Format for storing messages
> (MESSAGES.TBB) is unchanged from version 1.42, so they will not be
> changed.
~~~

Thanks.

Taking Marek and Roelof's posts together, it would appear that if I
install TB3 on another machine and use that with my live account
files, any changes to the message bases (TBB and TBI) will be
available in 1.62 provided that I don't change the filters, folder
structure, etc. TB3 will create some new files that I may want to
delete if I choose not to upgrade.

Because the account files are stored on the network, I can trial TB on
the spare machine while leaving 1.62 installed on my normal computer
and I can switch between the two provided that I don't make structural
etc. changes and I close TB on one machine before opening it on the
other.

Is that correct?

TIA,

-- 
Geoff Lane
Cornwall, UK
--
Using The Bat! v1.62i on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1
Do radioactive cats have 18 half-lives?



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html

Re: Version compatibility

[Roelof Otten]

Hallo Geoff,

On Mon, 17 Jan 2005 09:17:53 +GMT (17-1-2005, 10:17 +0100, where I
live), you wrote:

GL> Because the account files are stored on the network, I can trial TB on
GL> the spare machine while leaving 1.62 installed on my normal computer
GL> and I can switch between the two provided that I don't make structural
GL> etc. changes and I close TB on one machine before opening it on the
GL> other.

That's correct.

-- 
Groetjes, Roelof

WinErr: 010 Reserved for future mistakes by our developers

The Bat! 3.0.2.10
Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2
1 pop3 account, server on LAN



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Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
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Re: Version compatibility

[Roelof Otten]

Hallo Geoff,

On Mon, 17 Jan 2005 08:55:56 +GMT (17-1-2005, 9:55 +0100, where I
live), you wrote:

GL> There's a bug. If I reboot my computer and then, before starting TB,
GL> check in My Computer->Folder Options for the settings for ".eml",
GL> Windows reports that it is associated with The Bat!. When I start TB,
GL> I get a message saying that TB is no longer associated with .eml files
GL> and asking whether I want to remake the association.

That's odd. Can't remember that from my 1.62 days, though I never used
that with XP. What hasppens when you tell TB to stop checking whether
it's properly associated?

-- 
Groetjes, Roelof

AMIGA: A Merely Insignificant Game Addiction

The Bat! 3.0.2.10
Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 2
1 pop3 account, server on LAN



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Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
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Re: Version compatibility

[Geoff Lane]

On 17 January 2005, 11:48, Roelof Otten wrote:

GL>> There's a bug. If I reboot my computer and then, before starting TB,
GL>> check in My Computer->Folder Options for the settings for ".eml",
GL>> Windows reports that it is associated with The Bat!. When I start TB,
GL>> I get a message saying that TB is no longer associated with .eml files
GL>> and asking whether I want to remake the association.

> That's odd. Can't remember that from my 1.62 days, though I never used
> that with XP. What hasppens when you tell TB to stop checking whether
> it's properly associated?
~~~

Hi Roelof,

To be honest, I don't know what happens if I configure TB not to
check. I assume that the message would go away and, hopefully,
double-clicking an .eml file would open that file in TB.

FWIW, my computer stays on all the time notwithstanding rebooting once
per week as part of my "maintenance plan". I have a three-user
business license with TB installed on additional machines. All the
computers that have TB run XP SP1 but my workstation is the only that
exhibits this behaviour.

With all that said, it's a minor annoyance only, so I haven't given
any time to its resolution.

-- 
Geoff Lane
Cornwall, UK
--
Using The Bat! v1.62i on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1
Who is General Failure, and why is he reading my hard disk?



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
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Re: Version compatibility

[MFPA]

Hi

On Sunday 16 January 2005 at 5:01:38 PM, in
, Buiculescu Virgil wrote:


> (I assume you're using only one sent mail folder)

How do you do that?
TB! creates a sent mail folder for each account I create.


-- 
Best regards,
 
MFPAmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33 on Windows XP 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 1



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
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Re[2]: Version compatibility

[Buiculescu Virgil]

Hello Geoff,

Sunday, January 16, 2005, 6:11:48 PM, you wrote:

> Thanks for the suggestion.

> FWIW, I'd thought of doing as you suggest. However, that wouldn't save
> the sent messages, which would be available only in the TB3 account
> files, and so would need to be exported from TB3 and imported into
> 1.62.

For the sent messages you can create a filter (for outgoing mail ,
condition sender - contains - [EMAIL PROTECTED] )to forward them
back to yourself. When you receive them in TB 1.62 manually move
them to Sent Mail folder (I assume you're using only one sent mail
folder)

The only inconvenience i can think of is that you won't have the
original To: field, although it will be in the message text.

-- 
Best regards,
 Buiculescu Virgil   mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]



Current version is 3.0.1.33 | 'Using TBUDL' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html