Re: [Xen-devel] Criteria / validation proposal: drop Xen
On Thu, 2019-07-11 at 14:19 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: > Yeah, that's where I was going to go next (there has already been a > thread about this this morning). If what we care about is that Fedora > boots on EC2, that's what we should have in the criteria, and what we > should test. While trying hard to avoid a "haha he would say that" response, I do genuinely believe that's a reasonable canary and could cover most of the use cases that various users even outside EC2 would care about. > IIRC, what we have right now is a somewhat vague setup where we just > have 'local', 'ec2' and 'openstack' columns. The instructions for > "Amazon Web Services" just say "Launch an instance with the AMI under > test". So we could probably stand to tighten that up a bit, and define > specific instance type(s) that we want to test/block on. I think we can define a set of instance types that would cover what it makes sense to test. Do we still care about actual PV guests or only HVM? I think it makes sense to test guests with Xen netback and blkback rather than only ENA and NVMe, but Fedora probably wants to test the latter two *anyway*. Do we want to do this by making sure you have free credits to run the appropriate tests directly... or is it better all round for us to just do this on nightly builds for ourselves? The latter brings me to a question that's been bugging me for a while — how in $DEITY's name *do* I launch the latest official Fedora AMI anyway? I can't find it through the normal GUI launch process and have to go to getfedora.org and click around for a while because I find the specific AMI ID for the that region, and then manually enter that to launch the instance. Can't we fix that so I can just select 'Fedora 30' with a single click? Whose heads do I have to bash together to make that work? smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature ___ test mailing list -- test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to test-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/test@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: [Xen-devel] Criteria / validation proposal: drop Xen
On Thu, 2019-07-11 at 21:43 +0100, Peter Robinson wrote: > > On Mon, 2019-07-08 at 09:11 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: > > > It's worth noting that at least part of the justification for the > > > criterion in the first place was that Amazon was using Xen for EC2, but > > > that is no longer the case, most if not all EC2 instance types no > > > longer use Xen. > > > > I don't know where you got that particular piece of information. It > > isn't correct. Most EC2 instance types still use Xen. The vast majority > > of EC2 instances, by volume, are Xen. > > Correct, it's only specific types of new hypervisors that use kvm > based, plus new HW like aarch64. > > That being said I don't believe testing we can boot on xen is actually > useful these days for the AWS use case, it's likely different enough > that the testing isn't useful, we'd be much better testing that cloud > images actually work on AWS than testing if it boots on xen. Yeah, that's where I was going to go next (there has already been a thread about this this morning). If what we care about is that Fedora boots on EC2, that's what we should have in the criteria, and what we should test. IIRC, what we have right now is a somewhat vague setup where we just have 'local', 'ec2' and 'openstack' columns. The instructions for "Amazon Web Services" just say "Launch an instance with the AMI under test". So we could probably stand to tighten that up a bit, and define specific instance type(s) that we want to test/block on. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net ___ test mailing list -- test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to test-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/test@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: [Xen-devel] Criteria / validation proposal: drop Xen
> On Mon, 2019-07-08 at 09:11 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: > > It's worth noting that at least part of the justification for the > > criterion in the first place was that Amazon was using Xen for EC2, but > > that is no longer the case, most if not all EC2 instance types no > > longer use Xen. > > I don't know where you got that particular piece of information. It > isn't correct. Most EC2 instance types still use Xen. The vast majority > of EC2 instances, by volume, are Xen. Correct, it's only specific types of new hypervisors that use kvm based, plus new HW like aarch64. That being said I don't believe testing we can boot on xen is actually useful these days for the AWS use case, it's likely different enough that the testing isn't useful, we'd be much better testing that cloud images actually work on AWS than testing if it boots on xen. Peter ___ test mailing list -- test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to test-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/test@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: [Xen-devel] Criteria / validation proposal: drop Xen
On Mon, 2019-07-08 at 09:11 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: > It's worth noting that at least part of the justification for the > criterion in the first place was that Amazon was using Xen for EC2, but > that is no longer the case, most if not all EC2 instance types no > longer use Xen. I don't know where you got that particular piece of information. It isn't correct. Most EC2 instance types still use Xen. The vast majority of EC2 instances, by volume, are Xen. smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature ___ test mailing list -- test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to test-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/test@lists.fedoraproject.org
Re: [Xen-devel] Criteria / validation proposal: drop Xen
On Thu, 2019-07-11 at 09:57 -0500, Doug Goldstein wrote: > On 7/8/19 11:11 AM, Adam Williamson wrote: > > On Tue, 2019-05-21 at 11:14 -0700, Adam Williamson wrote: > > > > > > > "The release must boot successfully as Xen DomU with releases > > > > > > > providing > > > > > > > a functional, supported Xen Dom0 and widely used cloud providers > > > > > > > utilizing Xen." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and change the 'milestone' for the test case - > > > > > > > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA:Testcase_Boot_Methods_Xen_Para_Virt > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > from Final to Optional. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thoughts? Comments? Thanks! > > > > > > I would prefer for it to remain as it is. > > > > > This is only practical if it's going to be tested, and tested > > > > > regularly > > > > > - not *only* on the final release candidate, right before we sign off > > > > > on the release. It needs to be tested regularly throughout the release > > > > > cycle, on the composes that are "nominated for testing". > > > > Would the proposal above work for you? I think it satisfies what you are > > > > looking for. We would also have someone who monitors these test results > > > > pro-actively. > > > In theory, yeah, but given the history here I'm somewhat sceptical. I'd > > > also say we still haven't really got a convincing case for why we > > > should continue to block the release (at least in theory) on Fedora > > > working in Xen when we don't block on any other virt stack apart from > > > our 'official' one, and we don't block on all sorts of other stuff we'd > > > "like to have working" either. Regardless of the testing issues, I'd > > > like to see that too if we're going to keep blocking on Xen... > > So, this died here. As things stand: I proposed removing the Xen > > criterion, Lars opposed, we discussed the testing situation a bit, and > > I said overall I'm still inclined to remove the criterion because > > there's no clear justification for it for Fedora any more. Xen working > > (or rather, Fedora working on Xen) is just not a key requirement for > > Fedora at present, AFAICS. > > > > It's worth noting that at least part of the justification for the > > criterion in the first place was that Amazon was using Xen for EC2, but > > that is no longer the case, most if not all EC2 instance types no > > longer use Xen. Another consideration is that there was a time when KVM > > was still pretty new stuff and VirtualBox was not as popular as it is > > now, and Xen was still widely used for general hobbyist virtualization > > purposes; I don't believe that's really the case any more. > > So I'll just point out this is false. Amazon very much uses Xen still > and is investing in Xen still. In fact I'm writing this email from the > XenSummit where Amazon is currently discussing their future development > efforts for the Xen Project. Sorry about that, it was just based on my best efforts at trying to figure it out; Amazon instance types don't all explicitly state exactly how they work. Which EC2 instance types still use Xen? -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net ___ test mailing list -- test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to test-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/test@lists.fedoraproject.org
