Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On 21 November 2013 07:12, Petr Schindler pschi...@redhat.com wrote: On Čt, 2013-11-21 at 07:57 +0200, Gilboa Davara wrote: On Tue, Nov 19, 2013 at 9:25 PM, James Patterson jamespatter...@operamail.com wrote: Hello, I noticed the new Fedora 20 wallpaper looks like a swastika. It would be great if it didn't for the final release, it would upset a few people. I filed a bug here under wallpapers, but moved it to distro since it's a policy decision: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1030643 Hi, I do see the swastika, but it you I doubt that I would have seen it unless I knew what I was looking for. In my view, given the fact that the image was never designed to resemble the swastika, there's no reason to change it. Hi, I'm trying to see swastika there but I haven't been able to do so. There is nothing what could be interpreted as swastika. Can someone draw it and send a picture? I think that this thread is totally insane and sad. But it is probably because people always tend to see things they don't like everywhere (like conspiracies). I'm not convinced having a copy with a swastika drawn on it floating around is a good solution to this problem. There are intersecting diagonal lines, it doesn't have the characteristic rotational symmetry (which made it such a common symbol before it was appropriated). If you stare at it long enough you can try and invent the necessary arms, but really if we've got lots of people looking at this trying to see something and failing then it's not there. Or you're going to have to ban diagonals from all future wallpapers. Not really seeing the H either. -- imalone http://ibmalone.blogspot.co.uk -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Nov 21, 2013, at 12:12 AM, Petr Schindler pschi...@redhat.com wrote: Can someone draw it and send a picture? I've done some image manipulation to significantly posterize the image and invert the colors in order to enhance what little contrast the image has, to try and find it. What I've got is still something totally unlike a swastika. If you consider each 'arm' as two line, total of 8 lines, the wall paper has only 6. But those six have different widths and lengths, and therefore not all of them equally qualify as arms. Two arms only have one line each, and need imaginary lines drawn to complete the required eight lines. I'm confident saying that everyone who sees a swastika is imagining it, because imagining two significant components is required, since they don't exist. And also the person would have to ignore the wrong ratios of the other elements. Chris Murphy -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
I think that it doesn't look like a swastika, but I can understand why some people think they see it in the picture. The orientation is wrong for the Nazi symbol. Since the context of fedora is about the absolute opposite of the Nazi philosophy and the old symbol is also a good one (the one the Nazi copied from) I don't see why we should not use this picture. I am a Jew and Israeli if it matters for the discussion. On Thu, Nov 21, 2013 at 12:39 PM, Ian Malone ibmal...@gmail.com wrote: On 21 November 2013 07:12, Petr Schindler pschi...@redhat.com wrote: On Čt, 2013-11-21 at 07:57 +0200, Gilboa Davara wrote: On Tue, Nov 19, 2013 at 9:25 PM, James Patterson jamespatter...@operamail.com wrote: Hello, I noticed the new Fedora 20 wallpaper looks like a swastika. It would be great if it didn't for the final release, it would upset a few people. I filed a bug here under wallpapers, but moved it to distro since it's a policy decision: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1030643 Hi, I do see the swastika, but it you I doubt that I would have seen it unless I knew what I was looking for. In my view, given the fact that the image was never designed to resemble the swastika, there's no reason to change it. Hi, I'm trying to see swastika there but I haven't been able to do so. There is nothing what could be interpreted as swastika. Can someone draw it and send a picture? I think that this thread is totally insane and sad. But it is probably because people always tend to see things they don't like everywhere (like conspiracies). I'm not convinced having a copy with a swastika drawn on it floating around is a good solution to this problem. There are intersecting diagonal lines, it doesn't have the characteristic rotational symmetry (which made it such a common symbol before it was appropriated). If you stare at it long enough you can try and invent the necessary arms, but really if we've got lots of people looking at this trying to see something and failing then it's not there. Or you're going to have to ban diagonals from all future wallpapers. Not really seeing the H either. -- imalone http://ibmalone.blogspot.co.uk -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On 20.11.2013 00:35, Adam Williamson wrote: On Tue, 2013-11-19 at 15:31 -0800, Richard Vickery wrote: On Tue, Nov 19, 2013 at 1:12 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote: On Tue, 2013-11-19 at 11:25 -0800, James Patterson wrote: Hello, I noticed the new Fedora 20 wallpaper looks like a swastika. It would be great if it didn't for the final release, it would upset a few people. I filed a bug here under wallpapers, but moved it to distro since it's a policy decision: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1030643 FWIW, it doesn't look remotely like one to me or anyone else currently discussing it in #fedora-devel. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net If anything looks even remotely like anything that brings up the horrors of Nazi Germany, including a swastika, it REALLY should be removed, lest we become fodder for some really nasty kickback from Jewish people. This decision to include such might encourage people like Bill Gates - who is also a political scientist, aside from abusing the public with his Microsoft stuff - fuel to kill our organisation - and perhaps Linux as a whole - via the courts. There really isn't any need for alarmism. We're talking about https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/File:F20-alpha-wallpaper-wide.png . No-one is getting sued into oblivion by Bill Gates or anyone else. Why do so many people seem to want to default to OMG PANIC! mode these days? Probably related to this: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/concern_troll Regards, Dennis -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
I don't perceive any swastikas in the current Heisenbug background, and I can fantasize from an ink plot better then the average bear. I would like to see something less boring, perhaps a rotation of high res pictures of celestial objects and NASA photos. Hopefully the quality will be sufficient to prevent artifacts from appearing on large screens. -- Chuck Forsberg WA7KGX c...@omen.com www.omen.com Developer of Industrial ZMODEM(Tm) for Embedded Applications Omen Technology Inc The High Reliability Software 10255 NW Old Cornelius Pass Portland OR 97231 503-614-0430 -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Nov 19, 2013, at 6:27 PM, Ed Greshko ed.gres...@greshko.com wrote: I see a closeup of 200 count Egyptian cotton weave. I could in no why, no matter how hard I tried or squinted, see anything close to a swastika. I thought about asking the OP for a tracing to make it easier for me to find. But after 4-5 minutes of looking at it, I definitely see a pizza… with the face of Jesus on it. And not the Jesus who puts food on the table, I mean the Jewish one. On Nov 19, 2013, at 10:13 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote: On Tue, 2013-11-19 at 23:00 -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote: While I do not want to overrule any decisions made, I would like to note that asking for self-selected opinions (in a not-the-most-diverse community) on whether an item is potentially offensive to a minority is a somewhat problematic methodology. (That we have done in the past for Beefy Miracle, so... I may be a hypocrite.) well, so far as I can tell, at least two of the people who've so far said they can't possibly make out a swastika are jewish, so… I'm a gay, gays were among the many victims of the Nazis. Do I somehow have better visual acuity to locate swastikas? Fine, I'll use my 21st century gay powers to put this issue to rest. You've now got two Jews and a homo saying they don't see this thing. Nevertheless, I think we really do need at least a 2nd and 3rd person, anyone, even Mr. Super White Straight non-Jew Male, see this thing also. It's either there or it isn't, and it's not like Nazism is exactly an ideology that works subliminally and subtly either. The context matters, and I see neither the context present nor its symbol. On Nov 20, 2013, at 5:36 AM, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn denni...@conversis.de wrote: Probably related to this: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/concern_troll I think we shouldn't accuse people of trolling unless they're clearly trolling. (i.e. don't resort to play ground name calling unless you've run out of logical arguments, and you can be funny rather than be a dick when resorting to it) Chris Murphy -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Wed, Nov 20, 2013 at 08:37:20AM -0800, Chuck Forsberg WA7KGX wrote: I don't perceive any swastikas in the current Heisenbug background, and I can fantasize from an ink plot better then the average bear. I'm Jewish, for what it's worth. I don't _think_ I would have noticed it had it not been mentioned, but after reading the list and finally having a look for myself, I saw where people might see a swastika in it. Now that it's been mentioned, I find that I can't help but notice, though I think that even had I noticed on my own, I would have figured it's just me and let it go. -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Wed, Nov 20, 2013 at 8:45 AM, Chris Murphy li...@colorremedies.comwrote: On Nov 19, 2013, at 6:27 PM, Ed Greshko ed.gres...@greshko.com wrote: I see a closeup of 200 count Egyptian cotton weave. I could in no why, no matter how hard I tried or squinted, see anything close to a swastika. I thought about asking the OP for a tracing to make it easier for me to find. But after 4-5 minutes of looking at it, I definitely see a pizza… with the face of Jesus on it. And not the Jesus who puts food on the table, I mean the Jewish one. On Nov 19, 2013, at 10:13 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote: On Tue, 2013-11-19 at 23:00 -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote: While I do not want to overrule any decisions made, I would like to note that asking for self-selected opinions (in a not-the-most-diverse community) on whether an item is potentially offensive to a minority is a somewhat problematic methodology. (That we have done in the past for Beefy Miracle, so... I may be a hypocrite.) well, so far as I can tell, at least two of the people who've so far said they can't possibly make out a swastika are jewish, so… I'm a gay, gays were among the many victims of the Nazis. Do I somehow have better visual acuity to locate swastikas? Fine, I'll use my 21st century gay powers to put this issue to rest. You've now got two Jews and a homo saying they don't see this thing. Nevertheless, I think we really do need at least a 2nd and 3rd person, anyone, even Mr. Super White Straight non-Jew Male, see this thing also. It's either there or it isn't, and it's not like Nazism is exactly an ideology that works subliminally and subtly either. The context matters, and I see neither the context present nor its symbol. On Nov 20, 2013, at 5:36 AM, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn denni...@conversis.de wrote: Probably related to this: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/concern_troll I think we shouldn't accuse people of trolling unless they're clearly trolling. (i.e. don't resort to play ground name calling unless you've run out of logical arguments, and you can be funny rather than be a dick when resorting to it) Chris Murphy -- I think I should retract my statement about removing it because of a swastika looking graphic. I made the comment in references in order to be kind to people. I strongly agree that it the resemblance to a Nazi symbol lacks any recognition, yet completely understand the reference. I'm sorry that I piped up. -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
2013/11/20 Scott Robbins scot...@nyc.rr.com On Wed, Nov 20, 2013 at 08:37:20AM -0800, Chuck Forsberg WA7KGX wrote: I don't perceive any swastikas in the current Heisenbug background, and I can fantasize from an ink plot better then the average bear. I'm Jewish, for what it's worth. I don't _think_ I would have noticed it had it not been mentioned, but after reading the list and finally having a look for myself, I saw where people might see a swastika in it. Now that it's been mentioned, I find that I can't help but notice, though I think that even had I noticed on my own, I would have figured it's just me and let it go. I think that for a sake of everyone who can see a swastika on this wallpaper, just change it to something else. Best regards, Michal http://eventhorizon.pl/ -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Wed, Nov 20, 2013 at 12:46 PM, Michał Piotrowski mkkp...@gmail.comwrote: 2013/11/20 Scott Robbins scot...@nyc.rr.com On Wed, Nov 20, 2013 at 08:37:20AM -0800, Chuck Forsberg WA7KGX wrote: I don't perceive any swastikas in the current Heisenbug background, and I can fantasize from an ink plot better then the average bear. I'm Jewish, for what it's worth. I don't _think_ I would have noticed it had it not been mentioned, but after reading the list and finally having a look for myself, I saw where people might see a swastika in it. Now that it's been mentioned, I find that I can't help but notice, though I think that even had I noticed on my own, I would have figured it's just me and let it go. I think that for a sake of everyone who can see a swastika on this wallpaper, just change it to something else. I think that for the sake of the 99.% who don't see a thing except a right-angled wallpaper pattern, just keep it. (This is probably one of the saddest Fedora threads I've run into in a while) -- Jason -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Wed, 20 Nov 2013 12:49:14 -0600 Chris Adams li...@cmadams.net wrote: Once upon a time, Michał Piotrowski mkkp...@gmail.com said: I think that for a sake of everyone who can see a swastika on this wallpaper, just change it to something else. I disagree. There will _always_ be somebody that can find fault with anything (especially something as subjective as artwork); you can't just throw away somebody's work because somebody sees something they don't like. I just see a slanted H, which I presume to be the intent. Agree, it's Pandora's Box, and no that's not sexist. -- Regards, Frank www.frankly3d.com -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Wed, Nov 20, 2013 at 10:49 AM, Chris Adams li...@cmadams.net wrote: Once upon a time, Michał Piotrowski mkkp...@gmail.com said: I think that for a sake of everyone who can see a swastika on this wallpaper, just change it to something else. I disagree. There will _always_ be somebody that can find fault with anything (especially something as subjective as artwork); you can't just throw away somebody's work because somebody sees something they don't like. I just see a slanted H, which I presume to be the intent. -- Chris Adams li...@cmadams.net -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test +1 -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
- Original Message - From: Chris Adams li...@cmadams.net To: test@lists.fedoraproject.org Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2013 1:49:14 PM Subject: Re: Fedora 20 Swastika Once upon a time, Michał Piotrowski mkkp...@gmail.com said: I think that for a sake of everyone who can see a swastika on this wallpaper, just change it to something else. I disagree. There will _always_ be somebody that can find fault with anything (especially something as subjective as artwork); you can't just throw away somebody's work because somebody sees something they don't like. I've been trying to remain quiet on this thread because it's reached a point of being asinine, but I have to take issue with your language. somebody sees something they don't like is a reference to a swastika; someone raised a concern and you were dismissive both toward the concern and toward the symbol. The swastika symbolizes a period when *millions* of people who died and tens of millions of people who had their lives completely uprooted because of the events of that era. It's not something [a person] didn't like so don't pin it on a single person raising an issue; that's not neither accurate nor appropriate. I am of Jewish descent, and had family members who were in camps during the Holocaust. I don't see a swastika in the wallpaper and don't really care as to whether the it stays or goes, but I just felt the need to point out the dismissive tone when someone had clearly raised an issue. I just see a slanted H, which I presume to be the intent. -- Chris Adams li...@cmadams.net -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Čt, 2013-11-21 at 07:57 +0200, Gilboa Davara wrote: On Tue, Nov 19, 2013 at 9:25 PM, James Patterson jamespatter...@operamail.com wrote: Hello, I noticed the new Fedora 20 wallpaper looks like a swastika. It would be great if it didn't for the final release, it would upset a few people. I filed a bug here under wallpapers, but moved it to distro since it's a policy decision: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1030643 Hi, I do see the swastika, but it you I doubt that I would have seen it unless I knew what I was looking for. In my view, given the fact that the image was never designed to resemble the swastika, there's no reason to change it. Hi, I'm trying to see swastika there but I haven't been able to do so. There is nothing what could be interpreted as swastika. Can someone draw it and send a picture? I think that this thread is totally insane and sad. But it is probably because people always tend to see things they don't like everywhere (like conspiracies). Petr Schindler ... Just to be safe, we can always add a small Israeli flag on the bottom right :P - Gilboa (Note: I'm Jewish and Israeli :)) -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Fedora 20 Swastika
Hello, I noticed the new Fedora 20 wallpaper looks like a swastika. It would be great if it didn't for the final release, it would upset a few people. I filed a bug here under wallpapers, but moved it to distro since it's a policy decision: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1030643 -- James Patterson jamespatter...@operamail.com -- http://www.fastmail.fm - Access all of your messages and folders wherever you are -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
Sorry, wrong list. I was looking for the test release list. Apologies. -- James Patterson jamespatter...@operamail.com On Tue, Nov 19, 2013, at 11:25 AM, James Patterson wrote: Hello, I noticed the new Fedora 20 wallpaper looks like a swastika. It would be great if it didn't for the final release, it would upset a few people. I filed a bug here under wallpapers, but moved it to distro since it's a policy decision: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1030643 -- James Patterson jamespatter...@operamail.com -- http://www.fastmail.fm - Access all of your messages and folders wherever you are -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test -- http://www.fastmail.fm - The way an email service should be -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Tue, 2013-11-19 at 11:25 -0800, James Patterson wrote: Hello, I noticed the new Fedora 20 wallpaper looks like a swastika. It would be great if it didn't for the final release, it would upset a few people. I filed a bug here under wallpapers, but moved it to distro since it's a policy decision: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1030643 FWIW, it doesn't look remotely like one to me or anyone else currently discussing it in #fedora-devel. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Tue, Nov 19, 2013 at 1:12 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.comwrote: On Tue, 2013-11-19 at 11:25 -0800, James Patterson wrote: Hello, I noticed the new Fedora 20 wallpaper looks like a swastika. It would be great if it didn't for the final release, it would upset a few people. I filed a bug here under wallpapers, but moved it to distro since it's a policy decision: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1030643 FWIW, it doesn't look remotely like one to me or anyone else currently discussing it in #fedora-devel. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net If anything looks even remotely like anything that brings up the horrors of Nazi Germany, including a swastika, it REALLY should be removed, lest we become fodder for some really nasty kickback from Jewish people. This decision to include such might encourage people like Bill Gates - who is also a political scientist, aside from abusing the public with his Microsoft stuff - fuel to kill our organisation - and perhaps Linux as a whole - via the courts. -- Richard -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Tue, 2013-11-19 at 15:31 -0800, Richard Vickery wrote: On Tue, Nov 19, 2013 at 1:12 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote: On Tue, 2013-11-19 at 11:25 -0800, James Patterson wrote: Hello, I noticed the new Fedora 20 wallpaper looks like a swastika. It would be great if it didn't for the final release, it would upset a few people. I filed a bug here under wallpapers, but moved it to distro since it's a policy decision: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1030643 FWIW, it doesn't look remotely like one to me or anyone else currently discussing it in #fedora-devel. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net If anything looks even remotely like anything that brings up the horrors of Nazi Germany, including a swastika, it REALLY should be removed, lest we become fodder for some really nasty kickback from Jewish people. This decision to include such might encourage people like Bill Gates - who is also a political scientist, aside from abusing the public with his Microsoft stuff - fuel to kill our organisation - and perhaps Linux as a whole - via the courts. There really isn't any need for alarmism. We're talking about https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/File:F20-alpha-wallpaper-wide.png . No-one is getting sued into oblivion by Bill Gates or anyone else. Why do so many people seem to want to default to OMG PANIC! mode these days? -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
Hi, If you suggest to someone that this wallpaper looks like a swastika - it might look so. When I look at this image and I don't think about swastika I don't see it. It's just a power of suggestion - nothing more from my POV. (And yeah, I live in country where we take such things seriously. There is only 24 km from my living place to Oświęcim https://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=Pisarzowickadaddr=O%C5%9Bwi%C4%99cim,+Polskahl=plie=UTF8ll=49.884681,19.115009spn=0.068355,0.169086sll=49.897731,19.139385sspn=0.068336,0.169086geocode=Fc8U-QIdXIUjAQ%3BFd52-wIdMh4lASkxTDhP4JQWRzG9bpcxIWscHgoq=o%C5%9Bwit=hmra=dmemrsp=0sz=13z=13 ) 2013/11/20 Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com On Tue, 2013-11-19 at 15:31 -0800, Richard Vickery wrote: On Tue, Nov 19, 2013 at 1:12 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote: On Tue, 2013-11-19 at 11:25 -0800, James Patterson wrote: Hello, I noticed the new Fedora 20 wallpaper looks like a swastika. It would be great if it didn't for the final release, it would upset a few people. I filed a bug here under wallpapers, but moved it to distro since it's a policy decision: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1030643 FWIW, it doesn't look remotely like one to me or anyone else currently discussing it in #fedora-devel. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net If anything looks even remotely like anything that brings up the horrors of Nazi Germany, including a swastika, it REALLY should be removed, lest we become fodder for some really nasty kickback from Jewish people. This decision to include such might encourage people like Bill Gates - who is also a political scientist, aside from abusing the public with his Microsoft stuff - fuel to kill our organisation - and perhaps Linux as a whole - via the courts. There really isn't any need for alarmism. We're talking about https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/File:F20-alpha-wallpaper-wide.png . No-one is getting sued into oblivion by Bill Gates or anyone else. Why do so many people seem to want to default to OMG PANIC! mode these days? -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test -- Best regards, Michal http://eventhorizon.pl/ -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Tue, Nov 19, 2013 at 3:35 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.comwrote: On Tue, 2013-11-19 at 15:31 -0800, Richard Vickery wrote: On Tue, Nov 19, 2013 at 1:12 PM, Adam Williamson awill...@redhat.com wrote: On Tue, 2013-11-19 at 11:25 -0800, James Patterson wrote: Hello, I noticed the new Fedora 20 wallpaper looks like a swastika. It would be great if it didn't for the final release, it would upset a few people. I filed a bug here under wallpapers, but moved it to distro since it's a policy decision: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1030643 FWIW, it doesn't look remotely like one to me or anyone else currently discussing it in #fedora-devel. -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net If anything looks even remotely like anything that brings up the horrors of Nazi Germany, including a swastika, it REALLY should be removed, lest we become fodder for some really nasty kickback from Jewish people. This decision to include such might encourage people like Bill Gates - who is also a political scientist, aside from abusing the public with his Microsoft stuff - fuel to kill our organisation - and perhaps Linux as a whole - via the courts. There really isn't any need for alarmism. We're talking about https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/File:F20-alpha-wallpaper-wide.png . No-one is getting sued into oblivion by Bill Gates or anyone else. Why do so many people seem to want to default to OMG PANIC! mode these days? -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net Sorry Adam, I didn't mean to sound alarmist. I just tend to think that Gates is abusively opportunistic. -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On 11/19/2013 05:35 PM, Adam Williamson wrote: There really isn't any need for alarmism. We're talking about https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/File:F20-alpha-wallpaper-wide.png . No-one is getting sued into oblivion by Bill Gates or anyone else. Why do so many people seem to want to default to OMG PANIC! mode these days? I kinda see the number 2. Sort of. But a swastika? Nope. TC -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On 11/19/2013 10:02 PM, Thomas Cameron wrote: On 11/19/2013 05:35 PM, Adam Williamson wrote: There really isn't any need for alarmism. We're talking about https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/File:F20-alpha-wallpaper-wide.png . No-one is getting sued into oblivion by Bill Gates or anyone else. Why do so many people seem to want to default to OMG PANIC! mode these days? I kinda see the number 2. Sort of. But a swastika? Nope. TC I see the H of Heisenbug :) -- Germán A. Racca Fedora Package Maintainer https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Skytux -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On 11/20/13 08:38, Germán A. Racca wrote: On 11/19/2013 10:02 PM, Thomas Cameron wrote: On 11/19/2013 05:35 PM, Adam Williamson wrote: There really isn't any need for alarmism. We're talking about https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/File:F20-alpha-wallpaper-wide.png . No-one is getting sued into oblivion by Bill Gates or anyone else. Why do so many people seem to want to default to OMG PANIC! mode these days? I kinda see the number 2. Sort of. But a swastika? Nope. TC I see the H of Heisenbug :) I see a closeup of 200 count Egyptian cotton weave. I could in no why, no matter how hard I tried or squinted, see anything close to a swastika. -- Getting tired of non-Fedora discussions and self-serving posts -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Tue, 19 Nov 2013 11:25:52 -0800 James Patterson jamespatter...@operamail.com wrote: Hello, I noticed the new Fedora 20 wallpaper looks like a swastika. It would be great if it didn't for the final release, it would upset a few people. Are you Jewish or German, serious question? If neither why do you presume they are all blind and deaf? When we hear from same it can then be removed. Please lets not tell others how they think -- Regards, Frank www.frankly3d.com -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Tue, 19 Nov 2013 23:00:30 -0500 Bill Nottingham nott...@redhat.com wrote: While I do not want to overrule any decisions made, I would like to note that asking for self-selected opinions (in a not-the-most-diverse community) on whether an item is potentially offensive to a minority is a somewhat problematic methodology. (That we have done in the past for Beefy Miracle, so... I may be a hypocrite.) Bill In Fedora as in life , someone is always going to take umbrage. Get a wider audience the user list, ask Fedora, etc.. -- Regards, Frank www.frankly3d.com -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
Re: Fedora 20 Swastika
On Tue, 2013-11-19 at 23:00 -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote: Adam Williamson (awill...@redhat.com) said: FWIW, it doesn't look remotely like one to me or anyone else currently discussing it in #fedora-devel. While I do not want to overrule any decisions made, I would like to note that asking for self-selected opinions (in a not-the-most-diverse community) on whether an item is potentially offensive to a minority is a somewhat problematic methodology. (That we have done in the past for Beefy Miracle, so... I may be a hypocrite.) well, so far as I can tell, at least two of the people who've so far said they can't possibly make out a swastika are jewish, so... -- Adam Williamson Fedora QA Community Monkey IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net http://www.happyassassin.net -- test mailing list test@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/test
