Re: [tex-hyphen] Hyphenation in Albanian
Dear Arthur, I can certainly ask the student to allow distributing her thesis, but I believe it will not be of great utility, because, as I said, the thesis is in Italian, with very few stretches in Albanian, where the needed rare hyphen points were set by hand. All the best Claudio On 15/06/2020 21:40, Arthur Reutenauer wrote: Hi Claudio, On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 12:05:19AM +0200, Claudio Beccari wrote: Recently I assisted an Albanian student getting her degree in Italy, who wrote her thesi in Italian, bu with many stretches of text in Albanian; these parts where hyphenated by hand, because she could not use LaTeX, but the final printing was done from a LaTeX generated pdf file; the supervisors were very happy to see a well typeset thesis, that in humanities apparently is pretty uncommon. If that thesis is available somewhere, it would be very useful to be able to look at it :-) Best, Arthur
Re: [tex-hyphen] Hyphenation in Albanian
I would like to thank Claudio, Mojca and Arthur for their replies. I apologies but I had been not subscribed at the mailing list so I did not receive Claudio's email yesterday. Now everything is ok and for sure I will continue to work in this issue for the coming days. My to-do list for coming days will be: 1. Find a detailed grammatically theory of hyphenation in Albania. Since I am not a linguist, I have to ask help from a friend of mine, who is an expert in this filed. 2. Translate the rules in english and put the document at public domain using github. 3. Read the documentation wich Claudio, Mojca and Arthur recomend. 4. Create some patterns and test if are working correctly. I hope that this would be the begging of adding something that later My personal email is igi...@hotmail.com. I would like to thank you all again for your warm welcoming. Kind regards. Joan Jani On 15/6/20 11:05 π.μ., Mojca Miklavec wrote: Hi, Off-list. Claudio Beccari already wrote a good answer. We don't really have a team actively working on creating new patterns for new languages, but there are a bunch of experts (Claudio being among them). We are mostly collecting existing patterns and making sure that they stay in consistent shape. So by far the best way to get the patterns working would be to try to create them yourself, or find someone to help you. This may include people on the list, but you need to provide some faithful sources, grammar rules, dictionaries etc. There are two orthogonal ways to achieve the goal: - assemble a list of hyphenated words from a dictionary and run patgen (or one of its rewrites, we can help you with that) - come up with a set of clear rules for hyphenation (like: always hyphenate after letter 'a', never hyphenate between these letter pairs, ...) and write hyphenation patterns manually I would suggest you to read https://tug.org/docs/liang/liang-thesis.pdf Mojca PS: Please don't expect an answer to a private mail, I've been struggling recently to find time to answer emails. But you can continue the discussion on the list, you just need to provide more information, try to understand how hyphenation patterns work (read the above or maybe find some BachoTeX talks from Arthur Reutenauer). On Sat, 13 Jun 2020 at 19:22, Joan Jani wrote: Hello to all, I am a latex user for more than 15 years (I wrote my first lab report in latex back in 2004). Since there is no hyphenation patterns for Albanian i get always the message bellow: -- No hyphenation patterns were preloaded for (babel) the language 'Albanian' into the format. I want to participate in your group helping to create this hyphenation pattern. Kind regards, Joan Jani
Re: [tex-hyphen] Hyphenation in Albanian
I would like to thank Claudio, Mojca and Arthur for their replies. I apologies but I had been not subscribed at the mailing list so I did not receive Claudio's email yesterday. Now everything is ok and for sure I will continue to work in this issue for the coming days. My to-do list for coming days will be: 1. Find a detailed grammatically theory of hyphenation in Albania. Since I am not a linguist, I have to ask help from a friend of mine, who is an expert in this filed. 2. Translate the rules in english and put the document at public domain using github. 3. Read the documentation wich Claudio, Mojca and Arthur recomend. 4. Create some patterns and test if are working correctly. I hope that this would be the begging of adding something that later My personal email is igi...@hotmail.com. I would like to thank you all again for your warm welcoming. Kind regards. Joan Jani On 15/6/20 11:05 π.μ., Mojca Miklavec wrote: Hi, Off-list. Claudio Beccari already wrote a good answer. We don't really have a team actively working on creating new patterns for new languages, but there are a bunch of experts (Claudio being among them). We are mostly collecting existing patterns and making sure that they stay in consistent shape. So by far the best way to get the patterns working would be to try to create them yourself, or find someone to help you. This may include people on the list, but you need to provide some faithful sources, grammar rules, dictionaries etc. There are two orthogonal ways to achieve the goal: - assemble a list of hyphenated words from a dictionary and run patgen (or one of its rewrites, we can help you with that) - come up with a set of clear rules for hyphenation (like: always hyphenate after letter 'a', never hyphenate between these letter pairs, ...) and write hyphenation patterns manually I would suggest you to read https://tug.org/docs/liang/liang-thesis.pdf Mojca PS: Please don't expect an answer to a private mail, I've been struggling recently to find time to answer emails. But you can continue the discussion on the list, you just need to provide more information, try to understand how hyphenation patterns work (read the above or maybe find some BachoTeX talks from Arthur Reutenauer). On Sat, 13 Jun 2020 at 19:22, Joan Jani wrote: Hello to all, I am a latex user for more than 15 years (I wrote my first lab report in latex back in 2004). Since there is no hyphenation patterns for Albanian i get always the message bellow: -- No hyphenation patterns were preloaded for (babel) the language 'Albanian' into the format. I want to participate in your group helping to create this hyphenation pattern. Kind regards, Joan Jani
Re: [tex-hyphen] Hyphenation in Albanian
Hi Claudio, On Sun, Jun 14, 2020 at 12:05:19AM +0200, Claudio Beccari wrote: > Recently I assisted an Albanian student getting her degree in Italy, who > wrote her thesi in Italian, bu with many stretches of text in Albanian; > these parts where hyphenated by hand, because she could not use LaTeX, but > the final printing was done from a LaTeX generated pdf file; the supervisors > were very happy to see a well typeset thesis, that in humanities apparently > is pretty uncommon. If that thesis is available somewhere, it would be very useful to be able to look at it :-) Best, Arthur
Re: [tex-hyphen] Fwd: Hyphenation in Albanian
Dear Joan, You’ve come to the right place :-) I suggest you subscribe to this list (https://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/tex-hyphen), as you’ve already received two replies that were, however, not sent to your personal address. I can help you make hyphenation patterns for Albanian and add them to TeX distributions. The easiest in your case is probably to start by designing some simple rules and use them to hyphenate word lists; then improve the rules progressively. Do you know of any good word lists for Albanian? It can also help to have examples of properly typeset books. We can hold the discussion on this list, that has a public archive, so that the information won’t risk getting lost in the future. Best, Arthur
Re: [tex-hyphen] Finnish basic hyphenation rules
On Wed, May 20, 2020 at 04:08:04PM +0300, Teemu Likonen wrote: > Arthur Reutenauer [2020-05-18T22:51:44+02] wrote: > >> I wanted to reply earlier but was busy with other things. Sorry >> about that, and also for announcing that there will be more delay >> because I’m still busy with yet other things, I’m getting married on >> Saturday :-) I will reply for real some time next week. > > It's great to hear from you and congratulations! I'm sure you have now > better things to do. :-) Thanks all for your good wishes :-) I’d like to resume the conversation now. We left off at the choice of a name for the new patterns. I’m still not convinced by the label “basic”, because it cannot be used either as a description or a reference. I suggested something derived from “one-consonant rule”, because that’s what the patterns implement, much more closely than the original patterns for Finnish, that hyphenate for example “de-mo-kraat-ti”, “kon-kreet-ti-nen”, and -- at least on principle -- try to break at word boundary in compounds. But we can also choose another name. You write that these rules are taught in school in Finland. What about “school”? Best, Arthur
