Re: [Tex-music] little things
Thank you Don, for giving all this information. I knew that no 4. was something i overlooked, but i did not found how to solve. I never thought it was that simple. Andre -Oorspronkelijk bericht- From: Don Simons Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 8:17 PM To: 'Werner Icking Music Archive' Subject: Re: [Tex-music] little things It's been interesting and a little frustrating looking into the 4 "features" Andre identified. Most of the frustration is from a combination of my fading memory and insufficient commenting in the PMX code, making it very difficult to reconstruct PMX's internal logic. But here's where I stand on the 4 issues: 1. It's true that midi-only accidentals on chord notes can cause unneeded space. But in this case the midi-only accidentals are unnecessary; PMX does enforce "inherited" accidentals from earlier in the bar. So the solution here is to remove the midi-only accidentals. At the moment I don't plan any code changes. 2. The 'Cb' was entered in voice 1, while the sixteenths that cause the crowding are in voice 2. Long ago I decided never to automagically add any extra space in one voice due to crashes with anything in the other voice...the coding is just too complicated. The solution here is either to manually enter the space as Andre did, or to enter the 16ths in voice 1 (with forced up-beams) and put the dotted quarters in voice 2 (with forced down-stems). 3. In bar 9, PMX uses \lpz and \lst, because dots and tenutos on upstemmed notes by default go below the note. But to avoid crashes with staff or ledger lines, these commands will not allow ornaments at certain heights within or above the staff. Some day I may introduce some PMX logic to get around this restriction in cases like this, but for now I suggest simply using inline TeX to emplace the dot with \upz, or the tenuto with \lst, or both (and as always with inline TeX, use numerical arguments for the pitches). 4. Doesn't "f4x3d f f" do what you want? --Don -Original Message- From: TeX-Music [mailto:tex-music-boun...@tug.org] On Behalf Of Andre Van Ryckeghem Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2017 2:29 AM To: Werner Icking Music Archive Subject: [Tex-music] little things Sorry to be here again, people will think i am searching for odds but this is not true, I simply type a lot of songs. The example shows little odds that can be corrected, but perhaps there are people who want to know. 1. In the first bar, the hidden accidentals reserve space. This is corrected in the second bar by using 'zcf<0 ' In bar 3 and 4 it does not work because 'af<0i' gives an error. 2. In line 2 i have to make room for a 'Cb'. To see what i ment, remove 'X2 XS- 2' 3. in bar 8 the dot and undercore have a good distance. In bar 9 i cannot bring them closer to each other. 4. Triplet with dotted first note. I try to make the first trio, but there is no easy way to do it (here i think overlook something). === 1 1 6 8 6 8 0 0 1 3 20 0 t ./ Apb r8+6 a8n+ o.+5 o_ zff zefi ffi zefi zcf efi zcfi zaf cfi zafi zff afi r8+zffi ze / r8+6 a8n+ o.+6 o_+1 zff zefi ffi zefi %void space made by efi zcf<0 efi zcfi zaf cfi zafi zff afi zffi ze / % r8 b8++f o> zdf- zbf [l-1 b4+fix3nf-2 zdfi- zbfi afi zdf za+fi ffi zdfi zff- ] r %cannot use 'af<0i' r8 b8+f o> zdf- zbf [l-1 b4+fix3nf-2 zdfi- zbfi af<0 zdf<0 za+f<0 ff zdf<0 zff- ] r / L2 f4+fd end Cb XS1 e2--d XS1 bd zb+ // f1+f af df afi dfi afi en gn cn g c %making room for Cb X2 XS-2 g e1-- b+ e f g b d b a b a f b- d f a b d f d b d b a / L3 a4n o.+9 o_+10 ff o.+10 o_+12 d o.+12 o_+14 %cannot get the dot close to the tenuto, as in 1st bar cf+ o.+9 o_+11 a o.+10 o_+12 ffi o.+12 o_+14 / %try to make 'f4Fx3 f f' is made by [m1 f4Fx4n f f ] f4Fx4 f f f4x3 f f / === --- TeX-music@tug.org mailing list If you want to unsubscribe or look at the archives, go to http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/tex-music --- TeX-music@tug.org mailing list If you want to unsubscribe or look at the archives, go to http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/tex-music --- TeX-music@tug.org mailing list If you want to unsubscribe or look at the archives, go to http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/tex-music
Re: [Tex-music] little things
I wrote >... Some day I may introduce some PMX logic to get around this > restriction in cases like this, but for now I suggest simply using inline TeX to > emplace the dot with \upz, or the tenuto with \lst... Of course I should have written \ust . --Don --- TeX-music@tug.org mailing list If you want to unsubscribe or look at the archives, go to http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/tex-music
Re: [Tex-music] little things
It's been interesting and a little frustrating looking into the 4 "features" Andre identified. Most of the frustration is from a combination of my fading memory and insufficient commenting in the PMX code, making it very difficult to reconstruct PMX's internal logic. But here's where I stand on the 4 issues: 1. It's true that midi-only accidentals on chord notes can cause unneeded space. But in this case the midi-only accidentals are unnecessary; PMX does enforce "inherited" accidentals from earlier in the bar. So the solution here is to remove the midi-only accidentals. At the moment I don't plan any code changes. 2. The 'Cb' was entered in voice 1, while the sixteenths that cause the crowding are in voice 2. Long ago I decided never to automagically add any extra space in one voice due to crashes with anything in the other voice...the coding is just too complicated. The solution here is either to manually enter the space as Andre did, or to enter the 16ths in voice 1 (with forced up-beams) and put the dotted quarters in voice 2 (with forced down-stems). 3. In bar 9, PMX uses \lpz and \lst, because dots and tenutos on upstemmed notes by default go below the note. But to avoid crashes with staff or ledger lines, these commands will not allow ornaments at certain heights within or above the staff. Some day I may introduce some PMX logic to get around this restriction in cases like this, but for now I suggest simply using inline TeX to emplace the dot with \upz, or the tenuto with \lst, or both (and as always with inline TeX, use numerical arguments for the pitches). 4. Doesn't "f4x3d f f" do what you want? --Don > -Original Message- > From: TeX-Music [mailto:tex-music-boun...@tug.org] On Behalf Of Andre > Van Ryckeghem > Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2017 2:29 AM > To: Werner Icking Music Archive > Subject: [Tex-music] little things > > Sorry to be here again, people will think i am searching for odds but this is not > true, I simply type a lot of songs. > The example shows little odds that can be corrected, but perhaps there are > people who want to know. > > 1. In the first bar, the hidden accidentals reserve space. This is corrected in > the second bar by using 'zcf<0 ' > In bar 3 and 4 it does not work because 'af<0i' gives an error. > > 2. In line 2 i have to make room for a 'Cb'. To see what i ment, remove 'X2 XS- > 2' > > 3. in bar 8 the dot and undercore have a good distance. In bar 9 i cannot bring > them closer to each other. > > 4. Triplet with dotted first note. I try to make the first trio, but there is no > easy way to do it (here i think overlook something). > > === > 1 1 6 8 6 8 0 0 1 3 20 0 > > t > ./ > Apb > r8+6 a8n+ o.+5 o_ zff zefi ffi zefi zcf efi zcfi zaf cfi zafi zff afi > r8+zffi > ze / > r8+6 a8n+ o.+6 o_+1 zff zefi ffi zefi > %void space made by efi > zcf<0 > efi zcfi zaf cfi zafi zff afi zffi ze / > % > r8 b8++f o> zdf- zbf [l-1 b4+fix3nf-2 zdfi- zbfi afi zdf za+fi ffi zdfi > zff- ] r > %cannot use 'af<0i' > r8 b8+f o> zdf- zbf [l-1 b4+fix3nf-2 zdfi- zbfi af<0 zdf<0 za+f<0 ff zdf<0 > zff- ] r / > > L2 > > f4+fd end Cb XS1 e2--d XS1 bd zb+ // > f1+f af df afi dfi afi en gn cn g c > %making room for Cb > X2 XS-2 g > e1-- b+ e f g b d b a b a f b- d f a b d f d b d b a / > L3 > a4n o.+9 o_+10 ff o.+10 o_+12 d o.+12 o_+14 %cannot get the dot close to > the tenuto, as in 1st bar > cf+ o.+9 o_+11 a o.+10 o_+12 ffi o.+12 o_+14 / > > %try to make 'f4Fx3 f f' is made by > [m1 f4Fx4n f f ] > f4Fx4 f f > f4x3 f f > / > === > > --- > TeX-music@tug.org mailing list > If you want to unsubscribe or look at the archives, go to > http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/tex-music --- TeX-music@tug.org mailing list If you want to unsubscribe or look at the archives, go to http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/tex-music
Re: [Tex-music] little things
It is curious, The first line i got back from the archive was (broken but still working): r8+6 a8n+ o.+5 o_ zff zefi ffi zefi zcf efi zcfi zaf cfi zafi zff afi zffi ze / Andre -Oorspronkelijk bericht- From: Don Simons Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2017 8:53 PM To: 'Werner Icking Music Archive' Subject: Re: [Tex-music] little things Andre, you have nothing to be sorry about. All of these items are news to me, and could be fixed by better coding inside PMX. I'll be looking into them. But I am curious how you got your source compiled with "r8+zffi" in the first bar...I just removed it. --Don -Original Message- From: TeX-Music [mailto:tex-music-boun...@tug.org] On Behalf Of Andre Van Ryckeghem Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2017 2:29 AM To: Werner Icking Music Archive Subject: [Tex-music] little things Sorry to be here again, people will think i am searching for odds but this is not true, I simply type a lot of songs. The example shows little odds that can be corrected, but perhaps there are people who want to know. 1. In the first bar, the hidden accidentals reserve space. This is corrected in the second bar by using 'zcf<0 ' In bar 3 and 4 it does not work because 'af<0i' gives an error. 2. In line 2 i have to make room for a 'Cb'. To see what i ment, remove 'X2 XS- 2' 3. in bar 8 the dot and undercore have a good distance. In bar 9 i cannot bring them closer to each other. 4. Triplet with dotted first note. I try to make the first trio, but there is no easy way to do it (here i think overlook something). === 1 1 6 8 6 8 0 0 1 3 20 0 t ./ Apb r8+6 a8n+ o.+5 o_ zff zefi ffi zefi zcf efi zcfi zaf cfi zafi zff afi r8+zffi ze / r8+6 a8n+ o.+6 o_+1 zff zefi ffi zefi %void space made by efi zcf<0 efi zcfi zaf cfi zafi zff afi zffi ze / % r8 b8++f o> zdf- zbf [l-1 b4+fix3nf-2 zdfi- zbfi afi zdf za+fi ffi zdfi zff- ] r %cannot use 'af<0i' r8 b8+f o> zdf- zbf [l-1 b4+fix3nf-2 zdfi- zbfi af<0 zdf<0 za+f<0 ff zdf<0 zff- ] r / L2 f4+fd end Cb XS1 e2--d XS1 bd zb+ // f1+f af df afi dfi afi en gn cn g c %making room for Cb X2 XS-2 g e1-- b+ e f g b d b a b a f b- d f a b d f d b d b a / L3 a4n o.+9 o_+10 ff o.+10 o_+12 d o.+12 o_+14 %cannot get the dot close to the tenuto, as in 1st bar cf+ o.+9 o_+11 a o.+10 o_+12 ffi o.+12 o_+14 / %try to make 'f4Fx3 f f' is made by [m1 f4Fx4n f f ] f4Fx4 f f f4x3 f f / === --- TeX-music@tug.org mailing list If you want to unsubscribe or look at the archives, go to http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/tex-music --- TeX-music@tug.org mailing list If you want to unsubscribe or look at the archives, go to http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/tex-music --- TeX-music@tug.org mailing list If you want to unsubscribe or look at the archives, go to http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/tex-music
Re: [Tex-music] little things
Andre, you have nothing to be sorry about. All of these items are news to me, and could be fixed by better coding inside PMX. I'll be looking into them. But I am curious how you got your source compiled with "r8+zffi" in the first bar...I just removed it. --Don > -Original Message- > From: TeX-Music [mailto:tex-music-boun...@tug.org] On Behalf Of Andre > Van Ryckeghem > Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2017 2:29 AM > To: Werner Icking Music Archive > Subject: [Tex-music] little things > > Sorry to be here again, people will think i am searching for odds but this is not > true, I simply type a lot of songs. > The example shows little odds that can be corrected, but perhaps there are > people who want to know. > > 1. In the first bar, the hidden accidentals reserve space. This is corrected in > the second bar by using 'zcf<0 ' > In bar 3 and 4 it does not work because 'af<0i' gives an error. > > 2. In line 2 i have to make room for a 'Cb'. To see what i ment, remove 'X2 XS- > 2' > > 3. in bar 8 the dot and undercore have a good distance. In bar 9 i cannot bring > them closer to each other. > > 4. Triplet with dotted first note. I try to make the first trio, but there is no > easy way to do it (here i think overlook something). > > === > 1 1 6 8 6 8 0 0 1 3 20 0 > > t > ./ > Apb > r8+6 a8n+ o.+5 o_ zff zefi ffi zefi zcf efi zcfi zaf cfi zafi zff afi > r8+zffi > ze / > r8+6 a8n+ o.+6 o_+1 zff zefi ffi zefi > %void space made by efi > zcf<0 > efi zcfi zaf cfi zafi zff afi zffi ze / > % > r8 b8++f o> zdf- zbf [l-1 b4+fix3nf-2 zdfi- zbfi afi zdf za+fi ffi zdfi > zff- ] r > %cannot use 'af<0i' > r8 b8+f o> zdf- zbf [l-1 b4+fix3nf-2 zdfi- zbfi af<0 zdf<0 za+f<0 ff zdf<0 > zff- ] r / > > L2 > > f4+fd end Cb XS1 e2--d XS1 bd zb+ // > f1+f af df afi dfi afi en gn cn g c > %making room for Cb > X2 XS-2 g > e1-- b+ e f g b d b a b a f b- d f a b d f d b d b a / > L3 > a4n o.+9 o_+10 ff o.+10 o_+12 d o.+12 o_+14 %cannot get the dot close to > the tenuto, as in 1st bar > cf+ o.+9 o_+11 a o.+10 o_+12 ffi o.+12 o_+14 / > > %try to make 'f4Fx3 f f' is made by > [m1 f4Fx4n f f ] > f4Fx4 f f > f4x3 f f > / > === > > --- > TeX-music@tug.org mailing list > If you want to unsubscribe or look at the archives, go to > http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/tex-music --- TeX-music@tug.org mailing list If you want to unsubscribe or look at the archives, go to http://tug.org/mailman/listinfo/tex-music