Re: [time-nuts] pi Day

[M. Warner Losh]

In message: <49ae3360.4000...@tiscali.co.uk>
Dave Ackrill  writes:
: Steve Rooke wrote:
: > 2009/3/4 Dave Ackrill :
: 
: >> When do we get to the 14th month?  ;-)
: > 
: > Don't have to, we can get to the 1st month, January.
: > 
: 
: OK, that gets us to 3/1 but where does the '4' come from?  If you want 
: to count 4am, then you have to ignore the leading zero, even allowing 
: for not using leading zeros in the day and month that doesn't feel quite 
: right.
: 
: At least with the American version you can have 3/14 15:00 before the 
: sequence breaks down...  Or, 3/14 20:00 if you decide to round up the 
: third decimal place.
: 
: I guess you could go to 3/1/4159 but that's a bit of a wait to have a pie.

Clearly people aren't seeing the on "universal" pi day of the year.
That would be DOY 314...

:)

Warner


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Re: [time-nuts] pi Day

[Hal Murray]

> I'm in California and 1:59 AM might be pushing closing time, but 1:59
> UTC would be 18:59 PDT and 21:59 EDT is workable too. I suggest that
> since it is just playing with the numbers everyone might try local
> time,  UTC, and AM or PM to find a celebration point that works for
> you. If  necessary, even go with 15:9:26.5 and the other options. 

I'm picturing a gong going off at the magic time.

Of course, time nuts would have to correct for the delay between the gong and 
the listeners ear.  That probably depends on temperature and/or the 
barometric pressure.  Then there is the filter delay in the ear...

-- 
These are my opinions, not necessarily my employer's.  I hate spam.




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Re: [time-nuts] pi Day

[Magnus Danielson]

Dave Ackrill skrev:
> Steve Rooke wrote:
>> Don't forget that some countries put the day in front of the month,
>> IE. it's 4th March here right now. This would mean that these days
>> would have to celebrated at different times in different countries.
> 
> When do we get to the 14th month?  ;-)

Any year now... :)

I am actually invited to a pi-day party again this year. I just 
discovered that I am also invited to a birthday party and also another 
friend invided me... if someone only partly invites me to a party I may 
have pi invitations on the pi day... or is that only half invitation if 
counted in radians? Hmm... seems like non-invitation (opposite direction 
of phasors) but that would invert the pi-day to start with...

Cheers,
Magnus

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Re: [time-nuts] pi Day

[Steve Rooke]

Well, that's my point entirely, we have already celebrated pi day here
at the beginning of January but it seems you Americans are late to
party, again :)

Ever had your leg pulled? :)

2009/3/4 Rex :
> Ahh, my bad. That keeps the slash at the decimal point too. I must note
> that our date convention gets a bit higher resolution from just the day.
>
> 3/1 4:15:9.265 could be done. You'll have to wait until next year.
> Actually we can celebrate earlier in March with the same scheme.
>
> I hope we can avoid an international committee to set a new standard. In
> my view, any or all honoring the series are valid but I think we should
> require beginning from the beginning to make the options somewhat
> finite. And someone else already decided 3/14 was "pi day". Changing it
> now would be like redefining "talk like a pirate day"
> (http://www.talklikeapirate.com/).
>
>
> Steve Rooke wrote:
>> But the 3rd of January does exist and it was first named by William
>> Jones in 1707 who was Welsh so perhaps the pi day should not be
>> claimed by the Americans after all.
>>
>> 73, Steve
>>
>> 2009/3/4 Rex :
>>
>>> I think you will need to stay with the American style dates for
>>> traditional pi day, no?
>>>
>>> According to my calendar 31/4 doesn't exist.
>>>
>>>
>>> Steve Rooke wrote:
>>>
 Don't forget that some countries put the day in front of the month,
 IE. it's 4th March here right now. This would mean that these days
 would have to celebrated at different times in different countries.

 2009/3/4 Rex :


> I don't recall this discussion here before, but it should be a good time
> sink.
>
>
>
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>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
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-- 
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Omnium finis imminet

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Re: [time-nuts] pi Day

[Steve Rooke]

2009/3/4 Magnus Danielson :
> Dave Ackrill skrev:
>> Steve Rooke wrote:
>>> Don't forget that some countries put the day in front of the month,
>>> IE. it's 4th March here right now. This would mean that these days
>>> would have to celebrated at different times in different countries.
>>
>> When do we get to the 14th month?  ;-)
>
> Any year now... :)
>
> I am actually invited to a pi-day party again this year. I just
> discovered that I am also invited to a birthday party and also another
> friend invided me... if someone only partly invites me to a party I may
> have pi invitations on the pi day... or is that only half invitation if
> counted in radians? Hmm... seems like non-invitation (opposite direction
> of phasors) but that would invert the pi-day to start with...

I'll buy you 0.1415926... of a pint if you come over here on that day.
That should make a complete pi of you.

73, Steve

>
> Cheers,
> Magnus
>
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-- 
Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
Omnium finis imminet

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[time-nuts] Big bang theory

[Jim Palfreyman]

Has anyone here watched Big Bang Theory?

I think it's one of the cleverest sitcoms ever to come out of the US.

The science in it is accurate - verified by a university professor.

I just love it.

Any other comments?

Jim
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Re: [time-nuts] Big bang theory

[Lux, James P]

A professor of what? Medieval literature
Well, you never know

-Original Message-
From: "Jim Palfreyman" 
To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" 
Sent: 3/4/09 04:38
Subject: [time-nuts] Big bang theory


Has anyone here watched Big Bang Theory?

I think it's one of the cleverest sitcoms ever to come out of the US.

The science in it is accurate - verified by a university professor.

I just love it.

Any other comments?

Jim
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Re: [time-nuts] Big bang theory

[Steve Rooke]

2009/3/4 Jim Palfreyman :
> Has anyone here watched Big Bang Theory?
>
> I think it's one of the cleverest sitcoms ever to come out of the US.
>
> The science in it is accurate - verified by a university professor.

But has it been peer reviewed...

>
> I just love it.
>
> Any other comments?
>
> Jim
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-- 
Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
Omnium finis imminet

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Re: [time-nuts] pi Day

[Rex]

Tom Van Baak wrote:
>> I was reminded tonight that "pi Day" is coming on 3/14. That's fine, but 
>> a little inaccurate for our kind.
>>
>> Suppose I want to gather with friends and buy a "round" or have a sector 
>> of pie to celebrate.  What's the appropriate time to honor?
>> Since 3/14 is not based on the value of pie but on its representational 
>> decimal numbers (I have no problem with that), then it seems the right 
>> time would be (to the tenth of a second) March 14 at 1:59:26.5 . Waddya 
>> think? Does that appropriately honor the irrational spirit of the number?
>> 
>
> Here one more alternative to your fine list of possibilities.
>
> If pi day is 3/14 then the "pi hour" of pi day could be
> 15.926535 o'clock, which is 15:55:35 (3:55:35 PM).
>
>   
TVB,
Signs of a serious time nut at work here. Thanks. Who'da thunk pi digits 
could turn into such a sweet decimal time number as 15:55:35? Your 
response was exceeding quick too. Was that just quick math on your part, 
or had you already been here for some reason?

With all the options, hard to decide when best to celebrate, but I do 
like the aesthetics of your numbers. (The deleted nanosecond part is 
good too.)



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Re: [time-nuts] pi Day

[Rex]

Steve
> I'll buy you 0.1415926... of a pint if you come over here on that day.
> That should make a complete pi of you.
>
> 73, Steve
>
>   
Surely you jest. Most of us wouldn't walk to the fridge for 0.1415926 of 
a pint. Maybe it is a decimal point problem. 31.4 pints would probably 
have anyone pi eyed. 3.14 pints is somewhere in the realm of celebrating 
pi whilst still probably getting home.



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Re: [time-nuts] Big bang theory

[Rex]

Jim Palfreyman wrote:
> Has anyone here watched Big Bang Theory?
>
> I think it's one of the cleverest sitcoms ever to come out of the US.
>
> The science in it is accurate - verified by a university professor.
>
> I just love it.
>
> Any other comments?
>
> Jim
>
>   

I don't know of it.

Is this US network TV or something else?


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[time-nuts] GPS Jamming Trials..

[Rob Kimberley]

Interesting article in GPS World on some jamming trials carried out in UK
last year.

http://tl.gpsworld.com/gpstl/Latest+News/Maritime-Jamming-Trial-Shows-GPS-Vu
lnerabilities/ArticleStandard/Article/detail/584318?contextCategoryId=1385

Rob Kimberley



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Re: [time-nuts] Big bang theory

[Jim Palfreyman]

To quote wikipedia:

David Saltzberg, a professor of
physicsand
astronomy  at the University of
California, Los
Angeles,
checks scripts and provides dialogue, math equations and diagrams used as
props.

After watching series 1 I've not been able to fault the physics - in fact
some of it I have to admit is above my head.

I just think folks on this list would *really* enjoy it.

Sheldon would be welcome on time-nuts.

2009/3/4 Lux, James P 

> A professor of what? Medieval literature
> Well, you never know
>
> -Original Message-
> From: "Jim Palfreyman" 
> To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" <
> time-nuts@febo.com>
> Sent: 3/4/09 04:38
> Subject: [time-nuts] Big bang theory
>
>
> Has anyone here watched Big Bang Theory?
>
> I think it's one of the cleverest sitcoms ever to come out of the US.
>
> The science in it is accurate - verified by a university professor.
>
> I just love it.
>
> Any other comments?
>
> Jim
> ___
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Re: [time-nuts] Big bang theory

[Jim Palfreyman]

Yep US tv sitcom on CBS. But I looked that up since I'm in Australia.

2009/3/4 Rex 

> Jim Palfreyman wrote:
> > Has anyone here watched Big Bang Theory?
> >
> > I think it's one of the cleverest sitcoms ever to come out of the US.
> >
> > The science in it is accurate - verified by a university professor.
> >
> > I just love it.
> >
> > Any other comments?
> >
> > Jim
> >
> >
>
> I don't know of it.
>
> Is this US network TV or something else?
>
>
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Re: [time-nuts] pi Day

[Steve Rooke]

2009/3/4 Rex :
> Steve
>> I'll buy you 0.1415926... of a pint if you come over here on that day.
>> That should make a complete pi of you.
>>
>> 73, Steve
>>
>>
> Surely you jest. Most of us wouldn't walk to the fridge for 0.1415926 of
> a pint. Maybe it is a decimal point problem. 31.4 pints would probably
> have anyone pi eyed. 3.14 pints is somewhere in the realm of celebrating
> pi whilst still probably getting home.

But Magnus already has 3 invites to pi day so just needed the balance :)

OK, call me a cheapskate but I'd really buy him a few more than that
if he came over here. Heck, I'd buy you all a drink if your ever down
this way. Brits need not apply, the beer down here is really terrible
guys, although, by the time you have drunk 31.4159... cans, you really
don't care what it tastes like :)

Oh, and they serve it up in litres down here too and at -something deg
C. Good job too, you really don't want to taste it. Rule #1, don't
drink warm NZ beer :)

73, Steve
-- 
Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
Omnium finis imminet

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Re: [time-nuts] Big bang theory

[swingbyte]

Jim Palfreyman wrote:
> To quote wikipedia:
>
> David Saltzberg, a professor of
> physicsand
> astronomy  at the University of
> California, Los
> Angeles,
> checks scripts and provides dialogue, math equations and diagrams used as
> props.
>
> After watching series 1 I've not been able to fault the physics - in fact
> some of it I have to admit is above my head.
>
> I just think folks on this list would *really* enjoy it.
>
> Sheldon would be welcome on time-nuts.
>
> 2009/3/4 Lux, James P 
>
>   
>> A professor of what? Medieval literature
>> Well, you never know
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: "Jim Palfreyman" 
>> To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" <
>> time-nuts@febo.com>
>> Sent: 3/4/09 04:38
>> Subject: [time-nuts] Big bang theory
>>
>>
>> Has anyone here watched Big Bang Theory?
>>
>> I think it's one of the cleverest sitcoms ever to come out of the US.
>>
>> The science in it is accurate - verified by a university professor.
>>
>> I just love it.
>>
>> Any other comments?
>>
>> Jim
>> ___
 Well yes you're not alone, its very popular at our house.  Its great 
cos my wife loves it too even though she didn't study physics!
I hope they continue it.   I have a few of those characters where I work 
- always make is interesting!  Though its a bit scary when yet another 
one comes in with their kid diagnosed with  Aspergers.

Tim

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[time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Steve Rooke]

Has anyone looked at locking an old mechanical clock to precise time?
What I'm thinking of is something like an old cuckoo clock. The rule
is that the clock remains basically standard and is only steered by
the external source, say, by a magnetic pulse to the pendulum, IE. no
physical connection. Obviously the correct period of the pulse would
have to fit the timing of the pendulum. OK, it seems pointless as you
can't read time with any real accuracy on something like a cuckoo
clock but I'm sure there is the likelihood of something like this
being done by someone like us.

73,
Steve
-- 
Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
Omnium finis imminet

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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Martin Richmond-Hardy]

Steve,See http://www.britishtelephones.com/clocks/exchange.htm and
http://www.britishtelephones.com/clocks/clock36.htmMight give you a few
construction ideas.

"Ah, they don't make them like this any more. It's the wood, you know, you
can't get the wood." H.Crun.

73 Martin G8BHC

2009/3/4 Steve Rooke 

> Has anyone looked at locking an old mechanical clock to precise time?
> What I'm thinking of is something like an old cuckoo clock. The rule
> is that the clock remains basically standard and is only steered by
> the external source, say, by a magnetic pulse to the pendulum, IE. no
> physical connection. Obviously the correct period of the pulse would
> have to fit the timing of the pendulum. OK, it seems pointless as you
> can't read time with any real accuracy on something like a cuckoo
> clock but I'm sure there is the likelihood of something like this
> being done by someone like us.
>
> 73,
> Steve
> --
> Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
> Omnium finis imminet
>
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-- 
Martin Richmond-Hardy
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[GandalfG8]

In a message dated 04/03/2009 12:12:26 GMT Standard Time,  
martinr...@googlemail.com writes:

"Ah,  they don't make them like this any more. It's the wood, you know, you
can't  get the wood." H.Crun.
-
 

One could always strip down an old  Bannister:-)
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Steve Rooke]

2009/3/5 Martin Richmond-Hardy :
> Steve,See http://www.britishtelephones.com/clocks/exchange.htm and
> http://www.britishtelephones.com/clocks/clock36.htmMight give you a few
> construction ideas.

Thanks. Now that would make an impressive item in the house. I do
remember the exchange slave clocks in the exchanges when I first
worked for BT way back at the beginning of the 70's. There was
probably one of the master units somewhere safe in the exchanges but I
can't remember seeing them.

As for accuracy, it's hardly time-nuts standard at "Clock No, 36 to
keep G.M.T. to an accuracy of 8 seconds variation per week"

> "Ah, they don't make them like this any more. It's the wood, you know, you
> can't get the wood." H.Crun.

And the brass, you can't get brass like that anymore :)

> 73 Martin G8BHC
>
> 2009/3/4 Steve Rooke 
>
>> Has anyone looked at locking an old mechanical clock to precise time?
>> What I'm thinking of is something like an old cuckoo clock. The rule
>> is that the clock remains basically standard and is only steered by
>> the external source, say, by a magnetic pulse to the pendulum, IE. no
>> physical connection. Obviously the correct period of the pulse would
>> have to fit the timing of the pendulum. OK, it seems pointless as you
>> can't read time with any real accuracy on something like a cuckoo
>> clock but I'm sure there is the likelihood of something like this
>> being done by someone like us.
>>
>> 73,
>> Steve
>> --
>> Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
>> Omnium finis imminet
>>
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>> and follow the instructions there.
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Martin Richmond-Hardy
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-- 
Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
Omnium finis imminet

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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Steve Rooke]

2009/3/5  :
> In a message dated 04/03/2009 12:12:26 GMT Standard Time,
> martinr...@googlemail.com writes:
>
> "Ah,  they don't make them like this any more. It's the wood, you know, you
> can't  get the wood." H.Crun.
> -
>
>
> One could always strip down an old  Bannister:-)

I read that wrong the fist time and could not for the life of me see
how this related to a naked ancient barrister :)

73, Steve
-- 
Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
Omnium finis imminet

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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[John Ackermann N8UR]

Steve Rooke wrote:

>> "Ah, they don't make them like this any more. It's the wood, you know, you
>> can't get the wood." H.Crun.
> 
> And the brass, you can't get brass like that anymore :)

And whatever happened to that good bacon we used to get before the war?

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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Steve Rooke]

2009/3/5 John Ackermann N8UR :
> Steve Rooke wrote:
>
>>> "Ah, they don't make them like this any more. It's the wood, you know, you
>>> can't get the wood." H.Crun.
>>
>> And the brass, you can't get brass like that anymore :)
>
> And whatever happened to that good bacon we used to get before the war?

Those Danes must be keeping it to themselves. I never trusted them
since they started raping and pillaging all over the place.

-- 
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Omnium finis imminet

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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[GandalfG8]

 
In a message dated 04/03/2009 12:49:38 GMT Standard Time,  sar10...@gmail.com 
writes:

I read  that wrong the fist time and could not for the life of me see
how this  related to a naked ancient barrister :)



LOL
 
Not the one living in a fountain in Trafalgar Square by any  chance?
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Rob Kimberley]

John Ackermann N8UR wrote:
> Steve Rooke wrote:
> 
>>> "Ah, they don't make them like this any more. It's the wood, you
>>> know, you can't get the wood." H.Crun.
>> 
>> And the brass, you can't get brass like that anymore :)
> 
> And whatever happened to that good bacon we used to get before the
> war? 
> 

I can get you some really nice dry cured bacon from Chatsworth Farm Shop if
you want...

Rob


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Re: [time-nuts] pi Day

[Eamon Skelton]

Rex wrote:
> I don't recall this discussion here before, but it should be a good time 
> sink.
> 
> I was reminded tonight that "pi Day" is coming on 3/14. That's fine, but 
> a little inaccurate for our kind.

We won't have it until the 31st of April on this side of the pond.






-- 
Linux 2.6.26

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[time-nuts] Wavetek 3010 Manual

[Robert Atkinson]

Hi,
Anyone got a PDF of the manual for this synthized 1GHz generator?
I picked on up but it's about 5 MHz off at 500MHZ and unlocked.

Regards,
Robert G8RPI.


  

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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Steve Rooke]

2009/3/5 Rob Kimberley :

> I can get you some really nice dry cured bacon from Chatsworth Farm Shop if
> you want...

Ah, that does sound good but I don't think you'll be able to sneak it
past MAF sadly. They don't take too highly to foodstuffs entering the
country via unlicensed means it seems. All the stuff over here is
saturated in water and really doesn't taste like the bacon over there.
What with the beer and the bacon, I wonder why I came here sometimes
:)

My apologies to all for this thread going completely off-topic.

73,
Steve
-- 
Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
Omnium finis imminet

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Re: [time-nuts] pi Day

[Steve Rooke]

2009/3/5 Eamon Skelton :
> Rex wrote:
>> I don't recall this discussion here before, but it should be a good time
>> sink.
>>
>> I was reminded tonight that "pi Day" is coming on 3/14. That's fine, but
>> a little inaccurate for our kind.
>
> We won't have it until the 31st of April on this side of the pond.

Doesn't sound like you'll be celebrating it anytime soon then but who knows!

73, Steve
-- 
Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
Omnium finis imminet

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Re: [time-nuts] Wavetek 3010 Manual

[GandalfG8]

 
In a message dated 04/03/2009 13:56:45 GMT Standard Time,  
robert8...@yahoo.co.uk writes:

Hi,
Anyone got a PDF of the manual for this synthized 1GHz  generator?
I picked on up but it's about 5 MHz off at 500MHZ and  unlocked.

Regards,
Robert G8RPI.



-
Hi Robert
 
I've got a copy, it's approx 7MB.
Let me know if your yahoo address will accept that size attachment, or give  
me another address that will, and I'll email it to you.
 
regards
 
Nigel
GM8PZR
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Ralph Smith]

I have two Western Union/Self-Winding Clock Company Clocks.  Some  
background info:

 (Brooke Clarke's site, a member of  
this list).

I synchronize mine using my NTP server built from a Soekris NET4501,  
driven by a Trimble Thunderbolt.  Not the same as retrofitting a clock  
not specifically meant for the purpose, but I like it.

Ralph

On Mar 4, 2009, at 6:52 AM, Steve Rooke wrote:

> Has anyone looked at locking an old mechanical clock to precise time?
> What I'm thinking of is something like an old cuckoo clock. The rule
> is that the clock remains basically standard and is only steered by
> the external source, say, by a magnetic pulse to the pendulum, IE. no
> physical connection. Obviously the correct period of the pulse would
> have to fit the timing of the pendulum. OK, it seems pointless as you
> can't read time with any real accuracy on something like a cuckoo
> clock but I'm sure there is the likelihood of something like this
> being done by someone like us.
>
> 73,
> Steve
> -- 
> Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
> Omnium finis imminet
>
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Re: [time-nuts] pi Day

[Jean-Louis Oneto]

I also suppose that the final announcement should appear on "Circular"-T?
Jean-Louis Oneto

- Original Message - 
From: "Rex" 
To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" 

Sent: Wednesday, March 04, 2009 5:47 AM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] pi Day


> Rex wrote:
>> I was reminded tonight that "pi Day" is coming on 3/14. That's fine, but
>> a little inaccurate for our kind.
>>
>>
>
> I forgot to mention that pi-Day aka 3/14 is also "ides of march eve".
>
> Therefore the soothsayer's classic warning becomes, "beware pi day +1."
>
>
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Hal Murray]

> Has anyone looked at locking an old mechanical clock to precise time?

The Amateur Scientist, Scientific American, Sep 1974, had an article on doing 
that to a pendulum clock.

They put a small magnet on the pendulum.  It was out on a stick so it could 
poke through a coil without the pendulum or arm getting in the way.

I asked about it on this list several years ago.  You might check the 
archives.  Somebody scanned in the article.  I have 2 pdfs.  One is 17 MB.  
The other is 300K but needs a newer pdf reader.  One or the other may be 
online someplace.

Google just found this:
  http://www.dealsdirect.com.au/p/wooden-wall-clock-pendulum-quartz-movement/
It's a pseudo old clock, but that probably solves all the mechanical issues.

PS: You get some weird stuff if you google for >pendulum quartz<.




-- 
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS Jamming Trials..

[Dave Ackrill]

Rob Kimberley wrote:
> Interesting article in GPS World on some jamming trials carried out in UK
> last year.
> 
> http://tl.gpsworld.com/gpstl/Latest+News/Maritime-Jamming-Trial-Shows-GPS-Vu
> lnerabilities/ArticleStandard/Article/detail/584318?contextCategoryId=1385

To help people with wrap round problems in their email clients, here is 
a TinyURL version of that URl...

http://tinyurl.com/bdpujw

Dave

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Re: [time-nuts] GPS Jamming Trials..

[Joseph M Gwinn]

The simpler way to prevent mangling of URLs is to put corner brackets < 
... > around the URL.  This lets the email reader know where the URL 
starts and ends.  So, for instance:

<
http://tl.gpsworld.com/gpstl/Latest+News/Maritime-Jamming-Trial-Shows-GPS-Vulnerabilities/ArticleStandard/Article/detail/584318?contextCategoryId=1385
>

Joe

time-nuts-boun...@febo.com wrote on 03/04/2009 01:20:52 PM:

> Rob Kimberley wrote:
> > Interesting article in GPS World on some jamming trials 
> carried out in UK
> > last year.
> > 
> > http://tl.gpsworld.com/gpstl/Latest+News/Maritime-Jamming-
> Trial-Shows-GPS-Vu
> > lnerabilities/ArticleStandard/Article/detail/584318?
> contextCategoryId=1385
> 
> To help people with wrap round problems in their email clients, here is 
> a TinyURL version of that URl...
> 
> http://tinyurl.com/bdpujw
> 
> Dave
> 
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Don Latham]

I've driven "quartz movement" clocks with one pps signals, bypassing the
"quartz" works. To synchronize pendula (?) is relatively simple, but best
done using a mechanical/magnetic impulse phase locked loop, considering
the pendulum as a VCO.
BTW, I recommend Stephenson's new effort, "Anathem" loosely based on the
clock of the Long Now Foundation, q.v.
Don Latham

Rob Kimberley
> John Ackermann N8UR wrote:
>> Steve Rooke wrote:
>>
 "Ah, they don't make them like this any more. It's the wood, you
 know, you can't get the wood." H.Crun.
>>>
>>> And the brass, you can't get brass like that anymore :)
>>
>> And whatever happened to that good bacon we used to get before the
>> war?
>>
>
> I can get you some really nice dry cured bacon from Chatsworth Farm Shop
> if
> you want...
>
> Rob
>
>
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>


-- 
Dr. Don Latham AJ7LL
Six Mile Systems LLP
17850 Six Mile Road
POB 134
Huson, MT, 59846
VOX 406-626-4304
www.lightningforensics.com
www.sixmilesystems.com


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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Ron Smith]

Hi Steve,

Have you thought about locking the "cuckoo" call to GPS? I don't know how 
that call is generated, but I guess it wouldn't be too difficult to control 
electronically.

Ron
G3SVW


- Original Message - 
From: "Steve Rooke" 
To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" 

Sent: Wednesday, March 04, 2009 11:52 AM
Subject: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks


> Has anyone looked at locking an old mechanical clock to precise time?
> What I'm thinking of is something like an old cuckoo clock. The rule
> is that the clock remains basically standard and is only steered by
> the external source, say, by a magnetic pulse to the pendulum, IE. no
> physical connection. Obviously the correct period of the pulse would
> have to fit the timing of the pendulum. OK, it seems pointless as you
> can't read time with any real accuracy on something like a cuckoo
> clock but I'm sure there is the likelihood of something like this
> being done by someone like us.
>
> 73,
> Steve
> -- 
> Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
> Omnium finis imminet
>
> ___
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> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there. 



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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Lux, James P]

> -Original Message-
> From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com 
> [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Steve Rooke
> Sent: Wednesday, March 04, 2009 5:44 AM
> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks
> 
> 2009/3/5 John Ackermann N8UR :
> > Steve Rooke wrote:
> >
> >>> "Ah, they don't make them like this any more. It's the wood, you 
> >>> know, you can't get the wood." H.Crun.
> >>
> >> And the brass, you can't get brass like that anymore :)
> >
> > And whatever happened to that good bacon we used to get 
> before the war?
> 
> Those Danes must be keeping it to themselves. I never trusted 
> them since they started raping and pillaging all over the place.
>

Isn't that why they built that wall? Just one of the many things that the 
Romans have done for us (after viticulture, sanitation, etc.)
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[time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Mark Sims]

I once GPS disciplined a friends grandfather clock from the mid 1700's.   Used 
an opto interrupter and solenoid to nudge the pendulum.  If I remember right I 
had to generate 24 pulses per minute.  It worked surprisingly well.   The next 
mod was to make it self winding,  but she moved away before that happened.   






_
Windows Live™: Life without walls.
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_allup_1a_explore_032009
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna installation problem

[Bill Hawkins]

Group,

Looks like this subject has ended, so I'll summarize:

Bruce Griffiths said the plastic has 12X the expansion coefficient of
copper, so cold alone shouldn't have pulled the center pin. Now I wonder
if the cold contraction pushed the insulation along the core wire and
then pulled the pin when it warmed up. He also mentioned that some ROHS
connections fail due to thermal cycling, but I used antique solder and
wrench-clamp connectors.

Tom Van Baak asked if the signal degraded or was cut off. I don't look
at it all the time, so my first clue was the Holdover light on the
receiver. GPScon gave me the holdover duration, accurate to 999 hours,
then 1000+.

Stan, W1LE, suggested a captive center pin connector, which I will try
in April or May when the snow goes away. Thanks.

Several people said 20 feet unsupported was too long, but I'm not gonna
fill a 10 foot, 6 inch diameter pipe with foam. I'll get some light
chain and individually tie the cables to the chain, then support the
chain above the point where the cables turn into the 2 foot arms. Metric
conversions are left as an exercise for the reader, as they are for me.

Speaking of conversions, I grew up (since 1938) with movie credits that
mentioned the Gaffer (head electrician). Last year I mentored students
building a robot for a FIRST Robotics competition. The carpet on the
field would be marked with red, black, and white gaffer's tape, which we
got in 2 inch width from a theater supply place. Gaffer's tape is
intended to hold down wires running across a set until the show closes.

Where did Gaffa tape come from?

Thanks to all who contributed.

Bill Hawkins

-Original Message-
From: Stan W1LE
Sent: Sunday, March 01, 2009 7:56 PM

a couple of suggestions:

1. Use a captive center pin on the N male connector.
for example, Kings Electronics Inc. N male, model # KN-59-176 for RG-214
coaxial cable, center pin is solder type and captive, will not move
axially. Wrench clamp on the shield.
Kings cage = 91836 
mil spec:  M39012/01-0005

a few bucks each

2. consider adding a foam in place insulation, inside the plastic pipe
to support the coaxial cable.
drill a 1/8" hole every few feet and squirt in the aerosol foam till it
comes out of the hole.
Go for the minimally expanding insulating foam you will find in Home
Depot or Lowes.

Stan, W1LEFn41srCape Cod


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Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna installation problem

[Chuck Harris]

Bill Hawkins wrote:
...
> Speaking of conversions, I grew up (since 1938) with movie credits that
> mentioned the Gaffer (head electrician). Last year I mentored students
> building a robot for a FIRST Robotics competition. The carpet on the
> field would be marked with red, black, and white gaffer's tape, which we
> got in 2 inch width from a theater supply place. Gaffer's tape is
> intended to hold down wires running across a set until the show closes.
> 
> Where did Gaffa tape come from?

Probably from the same place as Duck tape.

Human ears trying to make sense out of what they hear.

-Chuck Harris

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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Bill Hawkins]

Don and group,

I was about to write about the "pendulum as a VCO" concept. I've seen
articles in the NAWCC Horological Journal that describe ways to do it,
but have been hesitant to do anything to my grandfather's Seth Thomas
wall clock. It gets wound once a week, and generally doesn't need
setting.

One thing about an old clock, though. The minute hand can be off by a
minute on either side of vertical due to gravity and  wear of the gears.

"Anathem" surprises on many levels, especially the 'alien' encounter.
Excellent "elsewhere" read, far from the daily news.

Bill Hawkins


-Original Message-
From: Don Latham
Sent: Wednesday, March 04, 2009 1:22 PM

I've driven "quartz movement" clocks with one pps signals, bypassing the
"quartz" works. To synchronize pendula (?) is relatively simple, but
best done using a mechanical/magnetic impulse phase locked loop,
considering the pendulum as a VCO.
BTW, I recommend Stephenson's new effort, "Anathem" loosely based on the
clock of the Long Now Foundation, q.v.
Don Latham

-- 
Dr. Don Latham AJ7LL
Six Mile Systems LLP
17850 Six Mile Road
POB 134
Huson, MT, 59846
VOX 406-626-4304
www.lightningforensics.com
www.sixmilesystems.com



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Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna installation problem

[Stan W1LE]

Actually it is "duct"  tape.

Used to air seal the metal joints in a metal duct work system for heat 
and AC.

New building codes require a mastic paint be applied over all metal 
joints in the duct work system.
I guess it is an energy conservation issue, so the processed air does 
not leak into unintended spaces.

Stan,W1LE


Chuck Harris wrote:
> Bill Hawkins wrote:
> ...
>   
>> Speaking of conversions, I grew up (since 1938) with movie credits that
>> mentioned the Gaffer (head electrician). Last year I mentored students
>> building a robot for a FIRST Robotics competition. The carpet on the
>> field would be marked with red, black, and white gaffer's tape, which we
>> got in 2 inch width from a theater supply place. Gaffer's tape is
>> intended to hold down wires running across a set until the show closes.
>>
>> Where did Gaffa tape come from?
>> 
>
> Probably from the same place as Duck tape.
>
> Human ears trying to make sense out of what they hear.
>
> -Chuck Harris
>
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>   


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Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna installation problem

[Chuck Harris]

I know.  Did you read my post?

-Chuck Harris

Stan W1LE wrote:
> Actually it is "duct"  tape.
> 
> Used to air seal the metal joints in a metal duct work system for heat 
> and AC.
> 
> New building codes require a mastic paint be applied over all metal 
> joints in the duct work system.
> I guess it is an energy conservation issue, so the processed air does 
> not leak into unintended spaces.
> 
> Stan,W1LE
> 
> 
> Chuck Harris wrote:
>> Bill Hawkins wrote:
>> ...
>>   
>>> Speaking of conversions, I grew up (since 1938) with movie credits that
>>> mentioned the Gaffer (head electrician). Last year I mentored students
>>> building a robot for a FIRST Robotics competition. The carpet on the
>>> field would be marked with red, black, and white gaffer's tape, which we
>>> got in 2 inch width from a theater supply place. Gaffer's tape is
>>> intended to hold down wires running across a set until the show closes.
>>>
>>> Where did Gaffa tape come from?
>>> 
>> Probably from the same place as Duck tape.
>>
>> Human ears trying to make sense out of what they hear.
>>
>> -Chuck Harris
>>
>> ___
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>>
>>   
> 
> 
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna installation problem

[Poul-Henning Kamp]

In message <49aef43d.3010...@verizon.net>, Stan W1LE writes:


>Actually it is "duct"  tape.

No it is not.

Duct tape is made to stay stuck and tight on ventilation ducts in
a wide range of temperatures and humidities, it is not meant to
come off again, ever, and if you try, it will leave a sticky band
of adhesive on the substrate.  Secondary characteristics is that
it is nonedible for any insect or rodent and I belive: non-flammable.

Gaffer's tape is meant to stay in comparatively benign environmentals,
but only until you want it to come off again, at which time a gentle
but firm pull at the right angle will make it peel off, taking with
it all the adhesive material.  Gaffers tape will generally not work
near or below the freezing point, som variants are tolerant of high
temperatures (for spot-lights etc).

If you hold down cables with duct tape during a production in a
building which is a national heritage site, you will never be
allowed through the door again.

If you use gaffer's tape, they will have no reason for complaint.

And yes, it's much more expensive.

Poul-Henning

-- 
Poul-Henning Kamp   | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20
p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956
FreeBSD committer   | BSD since 4.3-tahoe
Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence.

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Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna installation problem

[Poul-Henning Kamp]

In message <48e1c1775b054c2e9d30e7782a40a...@cyrus>, "Bill Hawkins" writes:

>Several people said 20 feet unsupported was too long, but I'm not gonna
>fill a 10 foot, 6 inch diameter pipe with foam. I'll get some light
>chain [...]

Over here you can buy a clothes-line which is actually a nylon covered
un-spun steel-wire.  I use that for such cableruns because it is easy
to string it up and it stays taught all year.  Tie the coax to it with
nylon strips every feet.

-- 
Poul-Henning Kamp   | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20
p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956
FreeBSD committer   | BSD since 4.3-tahoe
Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence.

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Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna installation problem

[Michael Scheliga]

"Gaffa tape" is Gaffer's tape.  From the production electricians in film
and television studios.  It's usually fabric and flat colors to blend in
with sets and floors.  It is usually stronger than duct tape, tears
easier, and costs more.  The good stuff also leaves less residue behind
when removed, if not left on too long.

Mike


> -Original Message-
> From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com]
On
> Behalf Of Stan W1LE
> Sent: Wednesday, March 04, 2009 1:36 PM
> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna installation problem
> 
> Actually it is "duct"  tape.
> 
> Used to air seal the metal joints in a metal duct work system for heat
> and AC.
> 
> New building codes require a mastic paint be applied over all metal
> joints in the duct work system.
> I guess it is an energy conservation issue, so the processed air does
> not leak into unintended spaces.
> 
> Stan,W1LE
> 
> 
> Chuck Harris wrote:
> > Bill Hawkins wrote:
> > ...
> >
> >> Speaking of conversions, I grew up (since 1938) with movie credits
> that
> >> mentioned the Gaffer (head electrician). Last year I mentored
> students
> >> building a robot for a FIRST Robotics competition. The carpet on
the
> >> field would be marked with red, black, and white gaffer's tape,
> which we
> >> got in 2 inch width from a theater supply place. Gaffer's tape is
> >> intended to hold down wires running across a set until the show
> closes.
> >>
> >> Where did Gaffa tape come from?
> >>
> >
> > Probably from the same place as Duck tape.
> >
> > Human ears trying to make sense out of what they hear.
> >
> > -Chuck Harris
> >
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Steve Rooke]

2009/3/5 Lux, James P :

>> Those Danes must be keeping it to themselves. I never trusted
>> them since they started raping and pillaging all over the place.
>>
>
> Isn't that why they built that wall? Just one of the many things that the 
> Romans have done for us (after viticulture, sanitation, etc.)

That was to keep the Scots out. Even the Romans drew the line at
trying to conquer them.

-- 
Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
Omnium finis imminet

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Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna installation problem

[Neville Michie]

Another, maybe the original tape, was called 100 Miles per Hour Tape  
and was sold years after fabric
covered aircraft wings went out of style as it was so universally  
useful.
As the name suggests it was rated for repair of aircraft fabric to be  
used up to speeds of 100 MPH.
cheers, Neville Michie

PS. I have a type 36 post office clock running and it has a  
synchronising relay that forces the phase
of the 30 second output pulses to the nearest 2 seconds, by rotating  
the count wheel which has a cardioid cam.
At a fixed time every day this relay was energised from the central  
site to correct any phase creep in the
clocks in the regional post offices. I have occasionally thought of  
linking it to a GPS time source.
cheers, NM


On 05/03/2009, at 9:38 AM, Michael Scheliga wrote:

> "Gaffa tape" is Gaffer's tape.  From the production electricians in  
> film
> and television studios.  It's usually fabric and flat colors to  
> blend in
> with sets and floors.  It is usually stronger than duct tape, tears
> easier, and costs more.  The good stuff also leaves less residue  
> behind
> when removed, if not left on too long.
>
> Mike
>
>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com]
> On
>> Behalf Of Stan W1LE
>> Sent: Wednesday, March 04, 2009 1:36 PM
>> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
>> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna installation problem
>>
>> Actually it is "duct"  tape.
>>
>> Used to air seal the metal joints in a metal duct work system for  
>> heat
>> and AC.
>>
>> New building codes require a mastic paint be applied over all metal
>> joints in the duct work system.
>> I guess it is an energy conservation issue, so the processed air does
>> not leak into unintended spaces.
>>
>> Stan,W1LE
>>
>>
>> Chuck Harris wrote:
>>> Bill Hawkins wrote:
>>> ...
>>>
 Speaking of conversions, I grew up (since 1938) with movie credits
>> that
 mentioned the Gaffer (head electrician). Last year I mentored
>> students
 building a robot for a FIRST Robotics competition. The carpet on
> the
 field would be marked with red, black, and white gaffer's tape,
>> which we
 got in 2 inch width from a theater supply place. Gaffer's tape is
 intended to hold down wires running across a set until the show
>> closes.

 Where did Gaffa tape come from?

>>>
>>> Probably from the same place as Duck tape.
>>>
>>> Human ears trying to make sense out of what they hear.
>>>
>>> -Chuck Harris
>>>
>>> ___
>>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
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>> bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
>>> and follow the instructions there.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna installation problem

[Steve Rooke]

2009/3/5 Neville Michie :

> PS. I have a type 36 post office clock running and it has a
> synchronising relay that forces the phase
> of the 30 second output pulses to the nearest 2 seconds, by rotating
> the count wheel which has a cardioid cam.
> At a fixed time every day this relay was energised from the central
> site to correct any phase creep in the
> clocks in the regional post offices. I have occasionally thought of
> linking it to a GPS time source.

That's an interesting idea and I wonder if it's easier to correct the
clock at intervals than closely synchronise it. Food for thought,
thanks.

73, Steve
-- 
Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
Omnium finis imminet

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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Eric Williams]

Bryan Mumford (bmumford.com) did a lot of work developing pendulum clocks
that were driven by a Fedchenko electromagnetic drive.  The drive circuit
would both put energy into the pendulum and use the pulse to drive an
electric clock face to display the time.  He never got to the point of
disciplining the clock, but he did note that you could make fine adjustments
in the period by varying the drive current which changed the amplitude of
the pendulum swing and changed the period.  (Larger swings ran slower, as I
recall.)  You could theoretically discipline such a clock by varying the
current to lock the pendulum to a GPS source.  It wouldn't really be
mechanical, more of a hybrid, but I don't know how you'd discipline a
mechanical clock with a system that had to drive in parallel with the escape
mechanism, the two would fight each other.

On Wed, Mar 4, 2009 at 3:52 AM, Steve Rooke  wrote:

> Has anyone looked at locking an old mechanical clock to precise time?
> What I'm thinking of is something like an old cuckoo clock. The rule
> is that the clock remains basically standard and is only steered by
> the external source, say, by a magnetic pulse to the pendulum, IE. no
> physical connection. Obviously the correct period of the pulse would
> have to fit the timing of the pendulum. OK, it seems pointless as you
> can't read time with any real accuracy on something like a cuckoo
> clock but I'm sure there is the likelihood of something like this
> being done by someone like us.
>
> 73,
> Steve
> --
> Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
> Omnium finis imminet
>
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Neville Michie]

In the evolution of timekeepers the SHORTT CLOCK was one of the great  
milestones.

see   http://www.electric-clocks.nl/clocks/en/page10.htm

This clock used a pendulum running free to synchronise another  
pendulum that did all the housekeeping work.
The work pendulum was adjusted to be a little slow and a thin leaf  
spring was picked up by a relay if the phase was too
slow and added a slight gaining rate until the phase was restored.
A little like switching a tiny capacitor in and out connected to an TCXO
to keep it disciplined.
These clock kept very good time.
Cheers, Neville Michie




On 05/03/2009, at 3:11 PM, Eric Williams wrote:

> Bryan Mumford (bmumford.com) did a lot of work developing pendulum  
> clocks
> that were driven by a Fedchenko electromagnetic drive.  The drive  
> circuit
> would both put energy into the pendulum and use the pulse to drive an
> electric clock face to display the time.  He never got to the point of
> disciplining the clock, but he did note that you could make fine  
> adjustments
> in the period by varying the drive current which changed the  
> amplitude of
> the pendulum swing and changed the period.  (Larger swings ran  
> slower, as I
> recall.)  You could theoretically discipline such a clock by  
> varying the
> current to lock the pendulum to a GPS source.  It wouldn't really be
> mechanical, more of a hybrid, but I don't know how you'd discipline a
> mechanical clock with a system that had to drive in parallel with  
> the escape
> mechanism, the two would fight each other.
>
> On Wed, Mar 4, 2009 at 3:52 AM, Steve Rooke   
> wrote:
>
>> Has anyone looked at locking an old mechanical clock to precise time?
>> What I'm thinking of is something like an old cuckoo clock. The rule
>> is that the clock remains basically standard and is only steered by
>> the external source, say, by a magnetic pulse to the pendulum, IE. no
>> physical connection. Obviously the correct period of the pulse would
>> have to fit the timing of the pendulum. OK, it seems pointless as you
>> can't read time with any real accuracy on something like a cuckoo
>> clock but I'm sure there is the likelihood of something like this
>> being done by someone like us.
>>
>> 73,
>> Steve
>> --
>> Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
>> Omnium finis imminet
>>
>> ___
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>> and follow the instructions there.
>>
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Tom Van Baak]

> mechanical, more of a hybrid, but I don't know how you'd discipline a
> mechanical clock with a system that had to drive in parallel with the escape
> mechanism, the two would fight each other.

Eric,

Precision pendulum clocks, when mounted near each other,
have been known to eventually get into phase lock. So one
idea is to add a GPS 1PPS driven bass speaker or solenoid
or some sort of thumping contraption. Perhaps eventually the
pendulum clock would lock to the vibrations on the the wall.

/tvb



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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Tom Van Baak]

> In the evolution of timekeepers the SHORTT CLOCK was one of the great  
> milestones.
...
> These clock kept very good time.
> Cheers, Neville Michie

Yes, stability at 1 day was right around 1e-8 for a Shortt.

Stability (ADEV) of one Shortt pendulum clock:
http://www.leapsecond.com/museum/shortt/

For more details on Shortt and ADEV see:
http://www.leapsecond.com/hsn2006/ch2.pdf

/tvb


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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Jim Palfreyman]

So if I set my GPS locked 3325B to 1Hz (sine wave) and put that into my M&K
subwoofer and sat that next to my pendulum clock (with its ~1m long Reifler
pendulum) it should keep perfect time.

Beauty!



2009/3/5 Tom Van Baak 

> > mechanical, more of a hybrid, but I don't know how you'd discipline a
> > mechanical clock with a system that had to drive in parallel with the
> escape
> > mechanism, the two would fight each other.
>
> Eric,
>
> Precision pendulum clocks, when mounted near each other,
> have been known to eventually get into phase lock. So one
> idea is to add a GPS 1PPS driven bass speaker or solenoid
> or some sort of thumping contraption. Perhaps eventually the
> pendulum clock would lock to the vibrations on the the wall.
>
> /tvb
>
>
>
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Don Latham]

Actually, simply use a pendulum in a vacuum chamber, and pulse a LED shining 
toward the pendulum in the plane of rotation. Eventually, radiation pressure 
will synchronize it...
Don

- Original Message - 
From: "Jim Palfreyman" 
To: "Tom Van Baak" ; "Discussion of precise time and 
frequency measurement" 
Sent: Wednesday, March 04, 2009 11:22 PM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks


> So if I set my GPS locked 3325B to 1Hz (sine wave) and put that into my 
> M&K
> subwoofer and sat that next to my pendulum clock (with its ~1m long 
> Reifler
> pendulum) it should keep perfect time.
>
> Beauty!
>
>
>
> 2009/3/5 Tom Van Baak 
>
>> > mechanical, more of a hybrid, but I don't know how you'd discipline a
>> > mechanical clock with a system that had to drive in parallel with the
>> escape
>> > mechanism, the two would fight each other.
>>
>> Eric,
>>
>> Precision pendulum clocks, when mounted near each other,
>> have been known to eventually get into phase lock. So one
>> idea is to add a GPS 1PPS driven bass speaker or solenoid
>> or some sort of thumping contraption. Perhaps eventually the
>> pendulum clock would lock to the vibrations on the the wall.
>>
>> /tvb
>>
>>
>>
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Re: [time-nuts] GPS disciplined mechanical clocks

[Steve Rooke]

2009/3/5 Tom Van Baak :
>> In the evolution of timekeepers the SHORTT CLOCK was one of the great
>> milestones.
> ...
>> These clock kept very good time.
>> Cheers, Neville Michie
>
> Yes, stability at 1 day was right around 1e-8 for a Shortt.
>
> Stability (ADEV) of one Shortt pendulum clock:
> http://www.leapsecond.com/museum/shortt/
>
> For more details on Shortt and ADEV see:
> http://www.leapsecond.com/hsn2006/ch2.pdf

This is great stuff. Thanks Tom.

73, Steve
-- 
Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV & G8KVD & JAKDTTNW
Omnium finis imminet

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