Re: [time-nuts] Good (cheap) PIC chip choice for project?
Well, its a matter of opinions I guess. The RPi has one UART which is also the console port, so so much for that, and 17 IOs in total from the link in the message below. On the other hand, the BeagleBone Black has 96 IOs including several UARTs. I have one of each at the moment, and it seems like the Pi is a better toy if one wants to hook up a keyboard and monitor, but the BBB is a better tool for embedded systems. I am also bothered by the closed nature of the RPi while the BBB is completely open. The RPi has sold many times more units, so there is more info and more resources also on the net. For a beginner wanting to learn, the RPi is probably a better choice. Didier == Didier, It's easy to use the UART on the RPi for other work, e.g. GPS NMEA, as shown in the descriptions I've previously referenced. Edit a couple of files. Using SSH you can easily access the RPi over the network for test and, if you need it, graphics. I don't think that my latest two have ever had a keyboard or monitor attached. Of course there /are/ differences, and one would choose the device most suited to the task in use. Cheers, David -- SatSignal Software - Quality software written to your requirements Web: http://www.satsignal.eu Email: david-tay...@blueyonder.co.uk ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Selecting a Microcontroller
On Sun, May 26, 2013 at 11:38:35AM -0600, Brent Gordon wrote: The two threads here, Good (cheap) PIC chip choice for project? and Follow-up question re: microcontroller families have a lot of good information. A more organized approach is available at the Digi-Key/Design News Continuing Education Center which has several free courses on microcontroller basics and selecting a microcontroller. You download a Powerpoint presentation and follow along to an audio stream. Does it require registration or am I just not seeing the downloads on the linked pages? thanks, Herbert For example: Microcontrollers, Basics; Microcontrollers, Advanced; and Hands-On Analysis of Five MCU Development Kits at http://www.designnews.com/lecture-calendar.asp?p_l_ed=CEC_Semester_One_2012 ARM Cortex-M0 at http://www.designnews.com/lecture-calendar.asp?p_l_ed=CEC_Semester_Two_2012 How to Choose a Microcontroller Architecture at http://www.designnews.com/lecture-calendar.asp?p_l_ed=CEC_Semester_Three_2013 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 9390 GPS RX
Hi Ed, All looking good with EFC reconnected. I will chuck it on time-lab shortly. Except the output frequency is -0.05Hz out. Do you think the 9390 EFC will pull it in O/K? -marki -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Ed Palmer Sent: Monday, 27 May 2013 1:33 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 9390 GPS RX On 5/26/2013 8:24 PM, Mark C. Stephens wrote: Ed, I'd unplugged the Rb from the counter and into the timer for measurement. During this time it had dropped out of lock again. That's why the Allan Deviation is so bad, it was sweeping. But I didn't realise as there was no counter attached! I need to connect something up to the 'lock' pin for a visual indication of lock to avoid further embarrassments.. I've got manuals for both the FRK and the 'FRK (H or L)'. The FRK says that the lock input can handle up to 70V @ 50 ma. The other one doesn't say. You should be able to run an LED with a dropping resistor from the +24 supply. I have cracked it open again and revisited the crystal board. I found that the centre frequency was a tad low so I upped C12 to 27pf (from 22pf) With 6v EFC and the trimmer cap in mid position its dead on 10Mhz. Remember that it doesn't have to be dead center. After all, that's why the thing sweeps in the first place. It's looking for the signal and it will find it if it's anywhere in the sweep range. And I slowed down and waited (thanks Ed..) overnight to see if it drifted off anywhere else. But at 10Mhz it has stayed. Very nice! :) More thought, less action. Move as though you're defusing a bomb. Ideally, you know what you want to do, why (with at least two seperate tests to confirm your reasoning), and what should happen when you make the change. Adjustments are bad enough, be triple sure before you touch the soldering iron. Yes, it's overkill for most situations, but if major dollars or an irreplaceable device are at stake, it will pay dividends in the long term. I will reconnect EFC later on today (being a work day) when I get some time to move. Work? What is this Work thing you speak of? Oh, yes, I think I do have some vague recollection from years past. I think I tried it but didn't care for it. :) I also have the sneaking suspicion the external adjustments have been 'got at' Looking at the trimmer pot through my mag lamp for c-field adjust, I can see a lot of scratches and wear. I wouldn't be surprised to find that someone played with the external adjustment in a misguided attempt to compensate for the crystal drift. Totally ineffective. The C-field is at the wrong end of the system. Hopefully the Oscillator current capacitor C11 and the temperature adjustment hasn't been touched. You mean for the lamp? They're pretty hard to get at. I had to adjust the lamp temperature on one unit and had a devil of a time finding a screwdriver that could reach it. The reading on the lamp voltage monitor will tell you if those adjustments are correct. Remember, move slowly and carefully. :) Anyway, Wish me luck ;) Always :), Ed ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 9390 GPS RX
Hi The C field adjustment on the Rb should have a range of +/- 0.003 Hz a 10 MHz. It is unlikely that you can pull the Rb 0.05 Hz. The EFC on the OC-VCXO should have a range of 30 Hz. You should be able to bump the EFC 0.05 Hz. All that is based (of course) on already having something that is good to 0.0002 Hz to compare things to. If you don't have that, just watch it as it locks. If it does not have enough range it should rail when in FFL mode. Bob On May 27, 2013, at 5:13 AM, Mark C. Stephens ma...@non-stop.com.au wrote: Hi Ed, All looking good with EFC reconnected. I will chuck it on time-lab shortly. Except the output frequency is -0.05Hz out. Do you think the 9390 EFC will pull it in O/K? -marki -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Ed Palmer Sent: Monday, 27 May 2013 1:33 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 9390 GPS RX On 5/26/2013 8:24 PM, Mark C. Stephens wrote: Ed, I'd unplugged the Rb from the counter and into the timer for measurement. During this time it had dropped out of lock again. That's why the Allan Deviation is so bad, it was sweeping. But I didn't realise as there was no counter attached! I need to connect something up to the 'lock' pin for a visual indication of lock to avoid further embarrassments.. I've got manuals for both the FRK and the 'FRK (H or L)'. The FRK says that the lock input can handle up to 70V @ 50 ma. The other one doesn't say. You should be able to run an LED with a dropping resistor from the +24 supply. I have cracked it open again and revisited the crystal board. I found that the centre frequency was a tad low so I upped C12 to 27pf (from 22pf) With 6v EFC and the trimmer cap in mid position its dead on 10Mhz. Remember that it doesn't have to be dead center. After all, that's why the thing sweeps in the first place. It's looking for the signal and it will find it if it's anywhere in the sweep range. And I slowed down and waited (thanks Ed..) overnight to see if it drifted off anywhere else. But at 10Mhz it has stayed. Very nice! :) More thought, less action. Move as though you're defusing a bomb. Ideally, you know what you want to do, why (with at least two seperate tests to confirm your reasoning), and what should happen when you make the change. Adjustments are bad enough, be triple sure before you touch the soldering iron. Yes, it's overkill for most situations, but if major dollars or an irreplaceable device are at stake, it will pay dividends in the long term. I will reconnect EFC later on today (being a work day) when I get some time to move. Work? What is this Work thing you speak of? Oh, yes, I think I do have some vague recollection from years past. I think I tried it but didn't care for it. :) I also have the sneaking suspicion the external adjustments have been 'got at' Looking at the trimmer pot through my mag lamp for c-field adjust, I can see a lot of scratches and wear. I wouldn't be surprised to find that someone played with the external adjustment in a misguided attempt to compensate for the crystal drift. Totally ineffective. The C-field is at the wrong end of the system. Hopefully the Oscillator current capacitor C11 and the temperature adjustment hasn't been touched. You mean for the lamp? They're pretty hard to get at. I had to adjust the lamp temperature on one unit and had a devil of a time finding a screwdriver that could reach it. The reading on the lamp voltage monitor will tell you if those adjustments are correct. Remember, move slowly and carefully. :) Anyway, Wish me luck ;) Always :), Ed ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
Hi! I was wondering if anyone knows about a not so expensive wall digital clock that gets its time from an NTP server... TIA, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 9390 GPS RX
The first thing I'd do is let it cook for a few days. Monitor it carefully to see if it's drifting and in which direction. If it's moving, just leave it alone and see how far it will go. Be sure to document things so you know if it's gradually slowing down. Once it really is stable, you can take stock of where you are. Unfortunately, when you're playing with errors this small, it takes a long time to make measurements that you can have confidence in. You might have to look for a drift in the order of 1e-10 per day. It shouldn't be drifting, but I wouldn't put much faith in it until I'd tested it. This is one of the times that you want to check two or three ways to make sure that the frequency really is .05 Hz low. You mentioned that your counter reads .07 Hz high so you're getting near the resolution limit of your counter. A .05 Hz error is an error of 5e-9 which is huge for a Rb standard. Is it giving you a locked indication? Is your house standard a GPSDO or another Rb? If so, and if you haven't already done so, use your 5370 in time interval mode to compare the frequency of the FRK against your house standard. This will (relatively) quickly confirm the direction and size of the frequency error. I'm not familiar with the 9390, but it wouldn't hurt to plug the FRK back in and see what happens. Obviously, nothing's going to break. If the 9390 complains, that will be more confirmation that the FRK still has a problem. Once you're sure that the unit is stable, if the frequency is still off, take a look at the C-field coil. The range of the C-field adjustment is 2e-9 which is comparable to the error you measured. According to the manual, more C-field current gives you a higher output frequency. They actually mention that the most common C-field fault is an open coil. This would cause the frequency to be low, but the manual doesn't say by how much. Check the C-field circuit to see if it's working properly. The manual tells you how. Did you notice that taking the thing apart was the LAST thing I suggested if nothing else worked? :) Ed On 5/27/2013 3:13 AM, Mark C. Stephens wrote: Hi Ed, All looking good with EFC reconnected. I will chuck it on time-lab shortly. Except the output frequency is -0.05Hz out. Do you think the 9390 EFC will pull it in O/K? -marki -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Ed Palmer Sent: Monday, 27 May 2013 1:33 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 9390 GPS RX On 5/26/2013 8:24 PM, Mark C. Stephens wrote: Ed, I'd unplugged the Rb from the counter and into the timer for measurement. During this time it had dropped out of lock again. That's why the Allan Deviation is so bad, it was sweeping. But I didn't realise as there was no counter attached! I need to connect something up to the 'lock' pin for a visual indication of lock to avoid further embarrassments.. I've got manuals for both the FRK and the 'FRK (H or L)'. The FRK says that the lock input can handle up to 70V @ 50 ma. The other one doesn't say. You should be able to run an LED with a dropping resistor from the +24 supply. I have cracked it open again and revisited the crystal board. I found that the centre frequency was a tad low so I upped C12 to 27pf (from 22pf) With 6v EFC and the trimmer cap in mid position its dead on 10Mhz. Remember that it doesn't have to be dead center. After all, that's why the thing sweeps in the first place. It's looking for the signal and it will find it if it's anywhere in the sweep range. And I slowed down and waited (thanks Ed..) overnight to see if it drifted off anywhere else. But at 10Mhz it has stayed. Very nice! :) More thought, less action. Move as though you're defusing a bomb. Ideally, you know what you want to do, why (with at least two seperate tests to confirm your reasoning), and what should happen when you make the change. Adjustments are bad enough, be triple sure before you touch the soldering iron. Yes, it's overkill for most situations, but if major dollars or an irreplaceable device are at stake, it will pay dividends in the long term. I will reconnect EFC later on today (being a work day) when I get some time to move. Work? What is this Work thing you speak of? Oh, yes, I think I do have some vague recollection from years past. I think I tried it but didn't care for it. :) I also have the sneaking suspicion the external adjustments have been 'got at' Looking at the trimmer pot through my mag lamp for c-field adjust, I can see a lot of scratches and wear. I wouldn't be surprised to find that someone played with the external adjustment in a misguided attempt to compensate for the crystal drift. Totally ineffective. The C-field is at the wrong end of the system. Hopefully the Oscillator current capacitor C11 and the temperature adjustment hasn't
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
Hi Correct answer: I don't think there is such a beast. Once you get away from the radio controlled (WWVB etc) clocks the cost goes up quickly. Also correct, but a bit of a joke answer: Raspberry PI driving your television set. Alternatively make the Pi feed control signals to a hacked normal clock. Bob On May 27, 2013, at 9:29 AM, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves m...@mbg.pt wrote: Hi! I was wondering if anyone knows about a not so expensive wall digital clock that gets its time from an NTP server... TIA, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
I've seen LLCD computer monitors used as clocks. Seems this would be the perfect use for a Rasbury Pi. and a cheap monitor. $100 or maybe a low-end Android tablet. The way it is more commonly done is you have you computer that is using NTP produce an IRIG time code. Then there are any number of commercial clocks and large digital LED displays that will use IRIG. IRIG displays are not cheap but they sure are easy to find. On Mon, May 27, 2013 at 6:29 AM, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves m...@mbg.pt wrote: Hi! I was wondering if anyone knows about a not so expensive wall digital clock that gets its time from an NTP server... TIA, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
Hi Bob! On 27 May 2013 14:56, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote: Hi Correct answer: I don't think there is such a beast. Once you get away from the radio controlled (WWVB etc) clocks the cost goes up quickly. I don't understand why a microprocessor with an Ethernet controller and a 7 segment display would cost so much to manufacture... I think I'll build my own. Also correct, but a bit of a joke answer: Raspberry PI driving your television set. Alternatively make the Pi feed control signals to a hacked normal clock. Good joke :-) I imagine the electricity bill at the end of the month. I would like to have a clock sync with my super precise stratum 1 servers :-) what's the point in having them if I can see the time anywhere? :-) Cheers, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
Hi On May 27, 2013, at 10:56 AM, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves m...@mbg.pt wrote: Hi Bob! On 27 May 2013 14:56, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote: Hi Correct answer: I don't think there is such a beast. Once you get away from the radio controlled (WWVB etc) clocks the cost goes up quickly. I don't understand why a microprocessor with an Ethernet controller and a 7 segment display would cost so much to manufacture... I think I'll build my own. … and that's really my point. You can build one easier than you can buy one. Also correct, but a bit of a joke answer: Raspberry PI driving your television set. Alternatively make the Pi feed control signals to a hacked normal clock. Good joke :-) I imagine the electricity bill at the end of the month. The Pi isn't all that power hungry. The TV set - yes it's going to be a bit of a hog. Even with the Pi's i/o limitations you should be able to get it to run some sort of low power external display. Bob I would like to have a clock sync with my super precise stratum 1 servers :-) what's the point in having them if I can see the time anywhere? :-) Cheers, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
On Mon, May 27, 2013 at 7:56 AM, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves m...@mbg.pt wrote: Good joke :-) I imagine the electricity bill at the end of the month. I would like to have a clock sync with my super precise stratum 1 servers :-) what's the point in having them if I can see the time anywhere? :-) Don't know about you but I'm always in from of a computer and the time is one the screen in the upper right corner. Yes the TV uses a bit of power but you could use a screen that draws less current and the Pi or other ARM powered computer uses very little power. But seriously, IRIG is the standard for local time distribution it does not have the delay and gitter that NTP over Ethernet has It is send via audio frequency so any only twisted pair phone cable woorks although I've mostly seen then use coax. NTP requires a Posix-like OS which means a fairly powerful CPU while time code can be processed limey with old 74lsxx logic or a tiny $2 uP. I believe there is a time code generator included in the standard NTP source distribution in /utils. The time code software sends the signal out the audio device at 8KHz sample rate and should be good at the millisecond level. In terms of both the amount f power used and accuracy IRIG is better for this then NTP. -- Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
If you want a project, you should be able to get an older Android tablet or a Chumby 8 for $100 or less and hack it to do what you want. Hard to beat the price for the hardware you get. I'm happy with my OnTime dial clock. On Mon, May 27, 2013 at 8:14 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote: Hi On May 27, 2013, at 10:56 AM, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves m...@mbg.pt wrote: Hi Bob! On 27 May 2013 14:56, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote: Hi Correct answer: I don't think there is such a beast. Once you get away from the radio controlled (WWVB etc) clocks the cost goes up quickly. I don't understand why a microprocessor with an Ethernet controller and a 7 segment display would cost so much to manufacture... I think I'll build my own. … and that's really my point. You can build one easier than you can buy one. Also correct, but a bit of a joke answer: Raspberry PI driving your television set. Alternatively make the Pi feed control signals to a hacked normal clock. Good joke :-) I imagine the electricity bill at the end of the month. The Pi isn't all that power hungry. The TV set - yes it's going to be a bit of a hog. Even with the Pi's i/o limitations you should be able to get it to run some sort of low power external display. Bob I would like to have a clock sync with my super precise stratum 1 servers :-) what's the point in having them if I can see the time anywhere? :-) Cheers, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
On 27 May 2013 16:22, Chris Albertson albertson.ch...@gmail.com wrote: On Mon, May 27, 2013 at 7:56 AM, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves m...@mbg.pt wrote: Good joke :-) I imagine the electricity bill at the end of the month. I would like to have a clock sync with my super precise stratum 1 servers :-) what's the point in having them if I can see the time anywhere? :-) Don't know about you but I'm always in from of a computer and the time is one the screen in the upper right corner. Just checked the Windows taskbar clock and it has a 1 second delay... At work I use Windows but use Mac OS X at home... but I am looking for a solution for the Windows platform. TIA, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
On Mon, 27 May 2013 14:29:11 +0100, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves wrote: Hi! I was wondering if anyone knows about a not so expensive wall digital clock that gets its time from an NTP server... TIA, Miguel This was posted to the group @21-05 http://www.symmetricom.com/lp/gbu/email/time-display-promo-landing-page/? emailid=GBU078_NTD_Promo_ProdPglead_source=Web http://tinyurl.com/ptopb86 But it's funny ... I think there was a price on that page earlier ... CFO ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP on RaspberryPi
In 3 weeks I have 2 connected to a GPS with PPS, I'll publish the results here. It is great stuff, these RPIs. On Sun, May 26, 2013 at 09:30:47AM -0700, Chris Albertson wrote: NTP does not really sync to a server. What it does is use the set of reference clocks that pas the clock selection criteria. THere is an algorithm that determines if a reference clock is reasonable or not.A reference clock can be a GPS or another NTP server or a cell phone service or any of a dozen other things but GPS and other servers are by far the most common. Your RPI is three leves removed from a GPS. It is operating as stratum 3 the second RPI is stratum 2. Both are doing really good for using a networked ref. clock. I would not blain the RPI. If you are doing better than a millisecond with no local PPS it is good. On Sun, May 26, 2013 at 9:15 AM, folkert folk...@vanheusden.com wrote: Besides I got them to run NTP and they're too jittery for my taste. How good/bad were they? What were you using for a time source? Does it have PPS support? Here's ntpq -c pv for one of my RPIs after 25 days of uptime: associd=0 status=0615 leap_none, sync_ntp, 1 event, clock_sync, version=ntpd 4.2.6p5@1.2349-o Fri May 18 20:30:57 UTC 2012 (1), processor=armv6l, system=Linux/3.8.10+, leap=00, stratum=3, precision=-20, rootdelay=25.184, rootdisp=73.646, refid=83.98.201.134, reftime=d54cac1f.18aa9126 Sun, May 26 2013 17:43:27.096, clock=d54cb273.b755933f Sun, May 26 2013 18:10:27.716, peer=34195, tc=10, mintc=3, offset=0.182, frequency=-47.006, sys_jitter=0.377, clk_jitter=0.558, clk_wander=0.051 Hmmm found out that it syncs to random hosts on the internet. Ok an other one which syncs against an other pc with PPS (and a few others): folkert@weerpi ~ $ ntpq -c rv associd=0 status=0615 leap_none, sync_ntp, 1 event, clock_sync, version=ntpd 4.2.6p5@1.2349-o Fri May 18 20:30:57 UTC 2012 (1), processor=armv6l, system=Linux/3.8.10+, leap=00, stratum=2, precision=-20, rootdelay=0.807, rootdisp=7.669, refid=192.168.64.100, reftime=d54cb1e1.9d6e8f07 Sun, May 26 2013 18:08:01.614, clock=d54cb2e4.7d1cdae3 Sun, May 26 2013 18:12:20.488, peer=41936, tc=9, mintc=3, offset=0.220, frequency=-31.405, sys_jitter=0.647, clk_jitter=0.074, clk_wander=0.003 folkert@weerpi ~ $ uptime 18:12:25 up 15 days, 3:48, 1 user, load average: 0.12, 0.17, 0.15 Folkert van Heusden -- Multitail est un outil permettant la visualisation de fichiers de journalisation et/ou le suivi de l'exécution de commandes. Filtrage, mise en couleur de mot-clé, fusions, visualisation de différences (diff-view), etc. http://www.vanheusden.com/multitail/ -- Phone: +31-6-41278122, PGP-key: 1F28D8AE, www.vanheusden.com ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. Folkert van Heusden -- www.TrustedTimestamping.com is a service that enables you to show that at a certain point in time, you had access to a hash-value reflecting the contents of a file (this file can be a word document, a jpeg image, everything). -- Phone: +31-6-41278122, PGP-key: 1F28D8AE, www.vanheusden.com ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Selecting a Microcontroller
Registration is required; that's the price you pay for a free course. Once registered, you click on the title of each day's class to go to that class. Near the top of the page is a heading Special Educational Materials with a link to Today's Slide Deck underneath. Click the link to download the presentation, open the presentation, then start the audio player on the class page. Some of the classes are really good, Jon Titus for example. Brent On 5/27/2013 1:52 AM, Herbert Poetzl wrote: On Sun, May 26, 2013 at 11:38:35AM -0600, Brent Gordon wrote: The two threads here, Good (cheap) PIC chip choice for project? and Follow-up question re: microcontroller families have a lot of good information. A more organized approach is available at the Digi-Key/Design News Continuing Education Center which has several free courses on microcontroller basics and selecting a microcontroller. You download a Powerpoint presentation and follow along to an audio stream. Does it require registration or am I just not seeing the downloads on the linked pages? thanks, Herbert For example: Microcontrollers, Basics; Microcontrollers, Advanced; and Hands-On Analysis of Five MCU Development Kits at http://www.designnews.com/lecture-calendar.asp?p_l_ed=CEC_Semester_One_2012 ARM Cortex-M0 at http://www.designnews.com/lecture-calendar.asp?p_l_ed=CEC_Semester_Two_2012 How to Choose a Microcontroller Architecture at http://www.designnews.com/lecture-calendar.asp?p_l_ed=CEC_Semester_Three_2013 ___ ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
Hi If you are doing this from scratch today, would you go IRIG or would you go RS-485 for a wall clock? Both will drive more cable than you are likely to have in a house. Both are reasonably noise immune. With RS-485 there's less to do. It's a serial stream like any other bunch of stuff into a UART. Some math: YYMMDDHHMMSSCR = 13 ASCII characters. With one check byte it would be 14. A baud rate of 115.4K isn't stretching things on RS-485 or on most UART's these days. Sent it at 7N1 you have 9 bits per character, 126 bits in the message. Message takes a bit over 1 ms. Time it to anywhere in the string and the clock should be within +/- 2 ms. That's better than I can see on a clock. Better yet, time it to the first (or last) character in the string. More or less a 10X improvement. You could also drop the year / month / day if the clock isn't going to use them. Take any of the Arduino (or what ever) LED display boards and drive them with something cheap. I doubt the clock end plus the drivers would be over $30. I suspect IRIG would cost a bit more once you got it all worked out. Bob On May 27, 2013, at 11:03 AM, Chris Albertson albertson.ch...@gmail.com wrote: I've seen LLCD computer monitors used as clocks. Seems this would be the perfect use for a Rasbury Pi. and a cheap monitor. $100 or maybe a low-end Android tablet. The way it is more commonly done is you have you computer that is using NTP produce an IRIG time code. Then there are any number of commercial clocks and large digital LED displays that will use IRIG. IRIG displays are not cheap but they sure are easy to find. On Mon, May 27, 2013 at 6:29 AM, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves m...@mbg.pt wrote: Hi! I was wondering if anyone knows about a not so expensive wall digital clock that gets its time from an NTP server... TIA, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
From: Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves [] Just checked the Windows taskbar clock and it has a 1 second delay... At work I use Windows but use Mac OS X at home... but I am looking for a solution for the Windows platform. TIA, Miguel === Both analogue and digital display, screen or taskbar (or both), UTC options, and should not have a 1-second delay: http://www.satsignal.eu/software/disk.html#TinyBen Cheers, David -- SatSignal Software - Quality software written to your requirements Web: http://www.satsignal.eu Email: david-tay...@blueyonder.co.uk ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
Le 27 mai 2013 à 16:56, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves a écrit : I don't understand why a microprocessor with an Ethernet controller and a 7 segment display would cost so much to manufacture... I think I'll build my own. One advantage of having an OS and NTP client on board is that you get automatic TZ and DST offsets if you want. A Pi also works fine with a USB WiFi dongle so no ugly CAT5 wiring required. One of the Pi s I2C buses could be used to drive a 7 seg display controller such as those from Adafruit. As you would have the full TCP stack you could configure it over the same wiFi . It's not Windows but doesn't need much power so long as you don't want to drive giant LEDs. Good joke :-) I imagine the electricity bill at the end of the month. I would like to have a clock sync with my super precise stratum 1 servers :-) what's the point in having them if I can see the time anywhere? :-) Cheers, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
Hi If you go with the Pi's I2C port, it's strictly a 3.3 volt port. Some (but not all) of the display boards are 5V gizmos. If you go with a WiFi approach, be careful about latency. NTP only understands symmetric delays. Of course if you are on a cable modem there's noting in the WiFi that's worse than what you already have. Bob On May 27, 2013, at 1:25 PM, mike cook mc235...@gmail.com wrote: Le 27 mai 2013 à 16:56, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves a écrit : I don't understand why a microprocessor with an Ethernet controller and a 7 segment display would cost so much to manufacture... I think I'll build my own. One advantage of having an OS and NTP client on board is that you get automatic TZ and DST offsets if you want. A Pi also works fine with a USB WiFi dongle so no ugly CAT5 wiring required. One of the Pi s I2C buses could be used to drive a 7 seg display controller such as those from Adafruit. As you would have the full TCP stack you could configure it over the same wiFi . It's not Windows but doesn't need much power so long as you don't want to drive giant LEDs. Good joke :-) I imagine the electricity bill at the end of the month. I would like to have a clock sync with my super precise stratum 1 servers :-) what's the point in having them if I can see the time anywhere? :-) Cheers, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
One more idea: Buy one of those Atomic Clocks that run off WWVB. Then use time code to modulate a very low power 60KHz radio transmitter. The clocks will pick up your signal and sync to it.The clocks run on battery power and you don't need wires. But then I did notice you can buy exactly what you asked for $99. /DS%5FTimeDisplays.pdfhttp://www.symmetricom.com/media/files/downloads/product-datasheets/DS%5FTimeDisplays.pdf On Mon, May 27, 2013 at 9:40 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote: Hi If you are doing this from scratch today, would you go IRIG or would you go RS-485 for a wall clock? Both will drive more cable than you are likely to have in a house. Both are reasonably noise immune. With RS-485 there's less to do. It's a serial stream like any other bunch of stuff into a UART. Some math: YYMMDDHHMMSSCR = 13 ASCII characters. With one check byte it would be 14. A baud rate of 115.4K isn't stretching things on RS-485 or on most UART's these days. Sent it at 7N1 you have 9 bits per character, 126 bits in the message. Message takes a bit over 1 ms. Time it to anywhere in the string and the clock should be within +/- 2 ms. That's better than I can see on a clock. Better yet, time it to the first (or last) character in the string. More or less a 10X improvement. You could also drop the year / month / day if the clock isn't going to use them. Take any of the Arduino (or what ever) LED display boards and drive them with something cheap. I doubt the clock end plus the drivers would be over $30. I suspect IRIG would cost a bit more once you got it all worked out. Bob On May 27, 2013, at 11:03 AM, Chris Albertson albertson.ch...@gmail.com wrote: I've seen LLCD computer monitors used as clocks. Seems this would be the perfect use for a Rasbury Pi. and a cheap monitor. $100 or maybe a low-end Android tablet. The way it is more commonly done is you have you computer that is using NTP produce an IRIG time code. Then there are any number of commercial clocks and large digital LED displays that will use IRIG. IRIG displays are not cheap but they sure are easy to find. On Mon, May 27, 2013 at 6:29 AM, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves m...@mbg.pt wrote: Hi! I was wondering if anyone knows about a not so expensive wall digital clock that gets its time from an NTP server... TIA, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
Hi Is there a price shown somewhere on that sheet? Bob On May 27, 2013, at 2:23 PM, Chris Albertson albertson.ch...@gmail.com wrote: One more idea: Buy one of those Atomic Clocks that run off WWVB. Then use time code to modulate a very low power 60KHz radio transmitter. The clocks will pick up your signal and sync to it.The clocks run on battery power and you don't need wires. But then I did notice you can buy exactly what you asked for $99. /DS%5FTimeDisplays.pdfhttp://www.symmetricom.com/media/files/downloads/product-datasheets/DS%5FTimeDisplays.pdf On Mon, May 27, 2013 at 9:40 AM, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote: Hi If you are doing this from scratch today, would you go IRIG or would you go RS-485 for a wall clock? Both will drive more cable than you are likely to have in a house. Both are reasonably noise immune. With RS-485 there's less to do. It's a serial stream like any other bunch of stuff into a UART. Some math: YYMMDDHHMMSSCR = 13 ASCII characters. With one check byte it would be 14. A baud rate of 115.4K isn't stretching things on RS-485 or on most UART's these days. Sent it at 7N1 you have 9 bits per character, 126 bits in the message. Message takes a bit over 1 ms. Time it to anywhere in the string and the clock should be within +/- 2 ms. That's better than I can see on a clock. Better yet, time it to the first (or last) character in the string. More or less a 10X improvement. You could also drop the year / month / day if the clock isn't going to use them. Take any of the Arduino (or what ever) LED display boards and drive them with something cheap. I doubt the clock end plus the drivers would be over $30. I suspect IRIG would cost a bit more once you got it all worked out. Bob On May 27, 2013, at 11:03 AM, Chris Albertson albertson.ch...@gmail.com wrote: I've seen LLCD computer monitors used as clocks. Seems this would be the perfect use for a Rasbury Pi. and a cheap monitor. $100 or maybe a low-end Android tablet. The way it is more commonly done is you have you computer that is using NTP produce an IRIG time code. Then there are any number of commercial clocks and large digital LED displays that will use IRIG. IRIG displays are not cheap but they sure are easy to find. On Mon, May 27, 2013 at 6:29 AM, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves m...@mbg.pt wrote: Hi! I was wondering if anyone knows about a not so expensive wall digital clock that gets its time from an NTP server... TIA, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
On Mon, May 27, 2013 at 9:29 AM, Miguel wrote: I was wondering if anyone knows about a not so expensive wall digital clock that gets its time from an NTP server... I wrote Symmetricom about their $99 deal but I didn't hear back. Of course the wall mount digital is kind of long. The analog version is considered aesthetically acceptable. On Mon, 27 May 2013 16:04:10 + (UTC) cfo wrote: But it's funny ... I think there was a price on that page earlier ... It still says ONLY $99 for Select Network Time Displays ... synchronized to NTP or time codes. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
Miguel: If you are going to build your own, I would recommend you start with something like the Microchip PIC32 Ethernet Starter Kit. Comes with a free GCC C/C++ compiler and an Ethernet stack. I happened to have one for another project, that already had a four line serial LCD display hooked to it, as well as a serial port command line interface running Since I was already familiar with the Ethernet Stack that comes with the Starter Kit, all it took was turning on the SNTP function in the stack, and writing about ten lines of C code to get it running. One update of NTP sourced UTC Hours-Minutes-Seconds time on the display per command line request. (Anything more complicated is left as an exercise for the student.) That was after about an hour's research to find out the time format that NTP uses (seconds since Jan 1, 1900) and the (different) time format that UNIX uses (seconds since Jan 1, 1970). And how they both deal with leap-seconds since their epoch started. Another hour of time figuring out how to convert that to today's Hours, minutes, and seconds. But that is easy, once it (finally) sinks in how to work with an epoch. Now, the real fun begins when you decide that you might want to convert NTP or UNIX time to Day of Week, Month, Calendar Year, Day of Year, Week of year, and adjustments for local time zone, with daylight savings time. That was worth about four hours research and going to bed with a head-ache. Learned all about Julian Day and Modified Julian Day, which it turns out has nothing to do with the Julian Calendar. (Did you know that time started at high noon on January 1, 4713 BC. ?) Finally discovered a code snippet in Tom Van Baak's C code repository that will do the conversion. (Thanks, Tom.) A pox upon leap years, un-leap centuries, re-leap 4th centuries, Roman Numerals, modulus 7 weeks that do not align with the year boundary, months with no regular modulus structure, and no year 0. Who sold us this? Makes you appreciate the decimal time Star Date system used on Startrek. --- Graham == On 5/27/2013 9:56 AM, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves wrote: Hi Bob! On 27 May 2013 14:56, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote: Hi Correct answer: I don't think there is such a beast. Once you get away from the radio controlled (WWVB etc) clocks the cost goes up quickly. I don't understand why a microprocessor with an Ethernet controller and a 7 segment display would cost so much to manufacture... I think I'll build my own. Also correct, but a bit of a joke answer: Raspberry PI driving your television set. Alternatively make the Pi feed control signals to a hacked normal clock. Good joke :-) I imagine the electricity bill at the end of the month. I would like to have a clock sync with my super precise stratum 1 servers :-) what's the point in having them if I can see the time anywhere? :-) Cheers, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
Hi SNTP probably is ok if you are running against an NTP server hardwired on a local LAN. Running it through a home modem and out onto the internet likely isn't going to be as good as a full blown NTP stack. You could quite easily get enough lag / delay to get into the ~ 100 to 200 ms region that you can see on a clock. Bob On May 27, 2013, at 2:33 PM, Graham / KE9H time...@austin.rr.com wrote: Miguel: If you are going to build your own, I would recommend you start with something like the Microchip PIC32 Ethernet Starter Kit. Comes with a free GCC C/C++ compiler and an Ethernet stack. I happened to have one for another project, that already had a four line serial LCD display hooked to it, as well as a serial port command line interface running Since I was already familiar with the Ethernet Stack that comes with the Starter Kit, all it took was turning on the SNTP function in the stack, and writing about ten lines of C code to get it running. One update of NTP sourced UTC Hours-Minutes-Seconds time on the display per command line request. (Anything more complicated is left as an exercise for the student.) That was after about an hour's research to find out the time format that NTP uses (seconds since Jan 1, 1900) and the (different) time format that UNIX uses (seconds since Jan 1, 1970). And how they both deal with leap-seconds since their epoch started. Another hour of time figuring out how to convert that to today's Hours, minutes, and seconds. But that is easy, once it (finally) sinks in how to work with an epoch. Now, the real fun begins when you decide that you might want to convert NTP or UNIX time to Day of Week, Month, Calendar Year, Day of Year, Week of year, and adjustments for local time zone, with daylight savings time. That was worth about four hours research and going to bed with a head-ache. Learned all about Julian Day and Modified Julian Day, which it turns out has nothing to do with the Julian Calendar. (Did you know that time started at high noon on January 1, 4713 BC. ?) Finally discovered a code snippet in Tom Van Baak's C code repository that will do the conversion. (Thanks, Tom.) A pox upon leap years, un-leap centuries, re-leap 4th centuries, Roman Numerals, modulus 7 weeks that do not align with the year boundary, months with no regular modulus structure, and no year 0. Who sold us this? Makes you appreciate the decimal time Star Date system used on Startrek. --- Graham == On 5/27/2013 9:56 AM, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves wrote: Hi Bob! On 27 May 2013 14:56, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote: Hi Correct answer: I don't think there is such a beast. Once you get away from the radio controlled (WWVB etc) clocks the cost goes up quickly. I don't understand why a microprocessor with an Ethernet controller and a 7 segment display would cost so much to manufacture... I think I'll build my own. Also correct, but a bit of a joke answer: Raspberry PI driving your television set. Alternatively make the Pi feed control signals to a hacked normal clock. Good joke :-) I imagine the electricity bill at the end of the month. I would like to have a clock sync with my super precise stratum 1 servers :-) what's the point in having them if I can see the time anywhere? :-) Cheers, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
li...@rtty.us said: Is there a price shown somewhere on that sheet? I didn't see any prices on the data sheet, but there was a previous message that said: xne...@luna.dyndns.dk said: This was posted to the group @21-05 http://www.symmetricom.com/lp/gbu/email/time-display-promo-landing-page/? emailid=GBU078_NTD_Promo_ProdPglead_source=Web http://tinyurl.com/ptopb86 But it's funny ... I think there was a price on that page earlier ... When I go to that web page, it says at the top ONLY $99 for Select Network Time Displays I assume they are normally more. -- These are my opinions. I hate spam. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
And don't get me started on Unix timekeeping... Dave -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Graham / KE9H Sent: Monday, May 27, 2013 11:34 To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions? Miguel: If you are going to build your own, I would recommend you start with something like the Microchip PIC32 Ethernet Starter Kit. Comes with a free GCC C/C++ compiler and an Ethernet stack. I happened to have one for another project, that already had a four line serial LCD display hooked to it, as well as a serial port command line interface running Since I was already familiar with the Ethernet Stack that comes with the Starter Kit, all it took was turning on the SNTP function in the stack, and writing about ten lines of C code to get it running. One update of NTP sourced UTC Hours-Minutes-Seconds time on the display per command line request. (Anything more complicated is left as an exercise for the student.) That was after about an hour's research to find out the time format that NTP uses (seconds since Jan 1, 1900) and the (different) time format that UNIX uses (seconds since Jan 1, 1970). And how they both deal with leap-seconds since their epoch started. Another hour of time figuring out how to convert that to today's Hours, minutes, and seconds. But that is easy, once it (finally) sinks in how to work with an epoch. Now, the real fun begins when you decide that you might want to convert NTP or UNIX time to Day of Week, Month, Calendar Year, Day of Year, Week of year, and adjustments for local time zone, with daylight savings time. That was worth about four hours research and going to bed with a head-ache. Learned all about Julian Day and Modified Julian Day, which it turns out has nothing to do with the Julian Calendar. (Did you know that time started at high noon on January 1, 4713 BC. ?) Finally discovered a code snippet in Tom Van Baak's C code repository that will do the conversion. (Thanks, Tom.) A pox upon leap years, un-leap centuries, re-leap 4th centuries, Roman Numerals, modulus 7 weeks that do not align with the year boundary, months with no regular modulus structure, and no year 0. Who sold us this? Makes you appreciate the decimal time Star Date system used on Startrek. --- Graham == On 5/27/2013 9:56 AM, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves wrote: Hi Bob! On 27 May 2013 14:56, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote: Hi Correct answer: I don't think there is such a beast. Once you get away from the radio controlled (WWVB etc) clocks the cost goes up quickly. I don't understand why a microprocessor with an Ethernet controller and a 7 segment display would cost so much to manufacture... I think I'll build my own. Also correct, but a bit of a joke answer: Raspberry PI driving your television set. Alternatively make the Pi feed control signals to a hacked normal clock. Good joke :-) I imagine the electricity bill at the end of the month. I would like to have a clock sync with my super precise stratum 1 servers :-) what's the point in having them if I can see the time anywhere? :-) Cheers, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
A useful reference to own: http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/0521702380/ref=mw_dp_sim_ss1?pi=SL500_SY125 -- Kenton A. Hoover ken...@nemersonhoover.org +14158305843 On Monday, May 27, 2013 at 11:59, DaveH wrote: And don't get me started on Unix timekeeping... Dave -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Graham / KE9H Sent: Monday, May 27, 2013 11:34 To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions? Miguel: If you are going to build your own, I would recommend you start with something like the Microchip PIC32 Ethernet Starter Kit. Comes with a free GCC C/C++ compiler and an Ethernet stack. I happened to have one for another project, that already had a four line serial LCD display hooked to it, as well as a serial port command line interface running Since I was already familiar with the Ethernet Stack that comes with the Starter Kit, all it took was turning on the SNTP function in the stack, and writing about ten lines of C code to get it running. One update of NTP sourced UTC Hours-Minutes-Seconds time on the display per command line request. (Anything more complicated is left as an exercise for the student.) That was after about an hour's research to find out the time format that NTP uses (seconds since Jan 1, 1900) and the (different) time format that UNIX uses (seconds since Jan 1, 1970). And how they both deal with leap-seconds since their epoch started. Another hour of time figuring out how to convert that to today's Hours, minutes, and seconds. But that is easy, once it (finally) sinks in how to work with an epoch. Now, the real fun begins when you decide that you might want to convert NTP or UNIX time to Day of Week, Month, Calendar Year, Day of Year, Week of year, and adjustments for local time zone, with daylight savings time. That was worth about four hours research and going to bed with a head-ache. Learned all about Julian Day and Modified Julian Day, which it turns out has nothing to do with the Julian Calendar. (Did you know that time started at high noon on January 1, 4713 BC. ?) Finally discovered a code snippet in Tom Van Baak's C code repository that will do the conversion. (Thanks, Tom.) A pox upon leap years, un-leap centuries, re-leap 4th centuries, Roman Numerals, modulus 7 weeks that do not align with the year boundary, months with no regular modulus structure, and no year 0. Who sold us this? Makes you appreciate the decimal time Star Date system used on Startrek. --- Graham == On 5/27/2013 9:56 AM, Miguel Barbosa Gonçalves wrote: Hi Bob! On 27 May 2013 14:56, Bob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote: Hi Correct answer: I don't think there is such a beast. Once you get away from the radio controlled (WWVB etc) clocks the cost goes up quickly. I don't understand why a microprocessor with an Ethernet controller and a 7 segment display would cost so much to manufacture... I think I'll build my own. Also correct, but a bit of a joke answer: Raspberry PI driving your television set. Alternatively make the Pi feed control signals to a hacked normal clock. Good joke :-) I imagine the electricity bill at the end of the month. I would like to have a clock sync with my super precise stratum 1 servers :-) what's the point in having them if I can see the time anywhere? :-) Cheers, Miguel ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] DMTD questions
Some time back I purchased from Stanley Reynolds the necessary boards for the Riley DMTD. I'm now looking at what's necessary to build out these boards and the Mini Circuits parts are far and away the most expensive parts, due principally to the 10 part minimum on several of the items. I'm wondering if there are any others on the list who are contemplating the Riley DMTD and might wish to split a Mini Circuits parts order to ease the pain? I guess I should also ask if an alternate DMTD in the works and if so, where does it stand at this time? Thanks, Bob Darby ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FLUKE PM6680B Counter Time View software for the PC
As you can read here: http://www.ke5fx.com/timelab/readme.htm on version 1.010 as of March 2012 the support for the PM6680 was added, so you don't need to use talk-only mode. On Sat, May 25, 2013 at 9:17 PM, Tom Van Baak t...@leapsecond.com wrote: Can anyone point me to a source for the subject software ? Stan, The source code is not available as far as I know. The binary is shipped if you order that option with your counter from Fluke or Pendulum. It's key'ed so it can't be shared or re-sold. It's a reasonable tool, works with native USB, but I'd suggest using TimeLab over serial or GPIB instead give the 1.#INF cost and feature ratio. /tvb ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Symmetricom TimeSource 3500
Fellow Time Techies, I just put a 'Tech Special' Symmetricom TimeSource 3500 up on That E-Place site. Item 151053082201 I hope one of the list members gets it. It needs more TLC than I can spare. Keep the peace(es). -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Bruce Lane, Owner Head Hardware Heavy, Blue Feather Technologies -- http://www.bluefeathertech.com kyrrin (at) bluefeathertech do/t c=o=m Quid Malmborg in Plano... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
On 5/27/2013 2:40 PM, Kenton A. Hoover wrote: A useful reference to own: http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/0521702380/ref=mw_dp_sim_ss1?pi=SL500_SY125 -- Kenton A. Hoover ken...@nemersonhoover.org +14158305843 Kenton: Thanks. I ordered from Amazon. --- Graham == ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] NTP Clock suggestions?
Hi I was trying to avoid the whole give them your life's history thing to look at a price sheet. Often I find that the $99 special is something like a CD with the standard NTP distribution on it …. Bob On May 27, 2013, at 3:02 PM, Hal Murray hmur...@megapathdsl.net wrote: li...@rtty.us said: Is there a price shown somewhere on that sheet? I didn't see any prices on the data sheet, but there was a previous message that said: xne...@luna.dyndns.dk said: This was posted to the group @21-05 http://www.symmetricom.com/lp/gbu/email/time-display-promo-landing-page/? emailid=GBU078_NTD_Promo_ProdPglead_source=Web http://tinyurl.com/ptopb86 But it's funny ... I think there was a price on that page earlier ... When I go to that web page, it says at the top ONLY $99 for Select Network Time Displays I assume they are normally more. -- These are my opinions. I hate spam. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] PICAXE, anyone? - [was: Good (cheap) PIC]
I am planning to use a PICAXE 14M2 to replace about four ICs and about a dozen passive components in a time related project, but I am having problems even getting started with the programming part, since I haven't done much programming since the CDP1802 and Cosmac VIP days. Anyone on the list with hands-on experience with this chip willing to help me get over the initial steep part of the learning curve, please contact me off-list. Thanks - Flemming Larsen ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICAXE, anyone? - [was: Good (cheap) PIC]
The first step is NOT to try and write the final program. Get the picaxe to blink an LED first. Use a solderless breadboard to hold the LED and related parts. On Mon, May 27, 2013 at 7:44 PM, Flemming Larsen oz...@yahoo.dk wrote: I am planning to use a PICAXE 14M2 to replace about four ICs and about a dozen passive components in a time related project, but I am having problems even getting started with the programming part, since I haven't done much programming since the CDP1802 and Cosmac VIP days. Anyone on the list with hands-on experience with this chip willing to help me get over the initial steep part of the learning curve, please contact me off-list. Thanks - Flemming Larsen ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Looking for datasheet for Oscilloquartz 8602
Moin, On Sun, 26 May 2013 18:15:22 +0200 Magnus Danielson mag...@rubidium.dyndns.org wrote: The OSA 8602 is a variant of the OSA 8600 and 8601. These variants is mainly on the connection on the front. I don't have a 8602 datasheet as such, but I have some 8602 related specs as found in the extended OSA 3000 manual. It is essentially the same AT-cut oscillator that you can expect from the 8600 base. Hmm.. IIRC AT cut oscillators have the problem of frequency jumps on slight temperature changes. Using an AT cut oscillator thus kind of defeats the effort of doing a BVA. What information are you really seeking? What such an oscillator would be worth :-) You might be aware that there is one 8602 on sale on ebay for 4500USD. I asked Oscilloquartz about that and from what i gathered, it's definitly not worth that money. For slightly more you can get a new 8607 already. The 8602 worth is probably around 150 to 200USD. Attila Kinali -- The people on 4chan are like brilliant psychologists who also happen to be insane and gross. -- unknown ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
