Re: [time-nuts] A Leap Second is coming
Here's mine on my Casio F-91W http://imgur.com/yjbhXh6 On Sun, Jan 1, 2017 at 4:09 AM Nick Sayer via time-nuts wrote: > Here's what I got: > > https://youtu.be/nGMFzhNFrb4 > > It worked as I expected. 4:00:00 PM was two seconds long. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Dec 30, 2016, at 11:49 AM, Nick Sayer via time-nuts < > time-nuts@febo.com> wrote: > > > > I'm going to definitely observe my GPS clock to check its behavior. It > *should* repeat second zero (in my case of 4PM PST). Not the most > exactingly accurate depiction, but it's the best I can do with the > architecture. > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > >> On Dec 29, 2016, at 12:22 AM, David J Taylor < > david-tay...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote: > >> > >> Is everybody setup to watch it and collect lots of data? > >> > >> Anybody have a list of tools/toys for collecting data? > >> > >> An old favorite: > >> www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~mgk25/time/leap/test/timelog.c > >> = > >> > >> Some tools here, to see which NTP servers are announcing the event: > >> > >> http://www.satsignal.eu/software/net.htm#NTPLeapTrace > >> > >> Perhaps they may be of use to someone? > >> > >> Cheers, > >> David > >> -- > >> SatSignal Software - Quality software written to your requirements > >> Web: http://www.satsignal.eu > >> Email: david-tay...@blueyonder.co.uk > >> Twitter: @gm8arv > >> ___ > >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > >> To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > >> and follow the instructions there. > > > > ___ > > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > > and follow the instructions there. > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Line Voltage [Was: Anyone (ideally in the UK) ...]
On 01/01/2017 12:07 AM, Chris Albertson wrote: Just a comment for anyone who wants to log line voltage v. time. If you have an APC "Smart UPS" battery backup unit these will log voltage and frequency to a file. The unit connects to a computer via USB (and an AC power cable). As a more professional alternative, I suggest installing a power quality analyzer, particularly the Dranetz 658, which can be had for a modest amount off eBay. If I remember correctly it is from the late 80s era, but nevertheless is very feature-filled---modular (mainframe with cards for: 4 channels for v, V, i, I, and f [incl. harmonic distortion analysis to the 50th. harmonic]; environmental monitoring [T, RH, radiated RF, conducted RF]; etc.), physically robust (but not rackmountable, I believe), is networkable with another such unit and of course interfaceable with a server via RS-232, and has a human interface right on the unit (incl. an entire miniature keyboard, floppy drive for memory expansion, and even a built-in thermal printer!) When I was doing research, I could not find any other power quality analyzer that is physically robust, not to mention cheap, and those IT environmental monitors were underwhelming (no modularity, no RF probing, etc.), so I opted for this model for monitoring home metrology and METI lab and datacenter conditions, incl. the solar generation subsystem. -Ruslan ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Leap-second capture on laptop
On Sun, Jan 1, 2017 at 9:00 AM, Magnus Danielson wrote: > While not fancy by any means, my laptop captured the leap-second being > inserted by this message in the /var/log/syslog: > Jan 1 00:59:59 greytop kernel: [78458.839942] Clock: inserting leap > second 23:59:60 UTC > On my Ubuntu desktop, 17.04 -dev, this is the systemd journal: Jan 01 07:59:59 X201wily kernel: Clock: inserting leap second 23:59:60 UTC Jan 01 07:59:59 X201wily systemd[1484]: Time has been changed Jan 01 07:59:59 X201wily systemd[1]: Time has been changed No NTP was running. -- Sanjeev Gupta +65 98551208 http://www.linkedin.com/in/ghane ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Line Voltage [Was: Anyone (ideally in the UK) ...]
Another option is to belong to the FNET/GridEye group operated by the University of Tennessee (http://fnetpublic.utk.edu/index.html). They have placed frequency/voltage monitors all over the United States; they also list sites out side USA but I don't know if those are their devices. The monitors use GPS for time and location information and send the data over an ethernet link to your router and hence to U of Tenn via the Internet. If you look at the "Table Display" page in their web site, I am Unit #853 in the Western Interconnection. Jeremy On 12/31/2016 9:07 PM, Chris Albertson wrote: Just a comment for anyone who wants to log line voltage v. time. If you have an APC "Smart UPS" battery backup unit these will log voltage and frequency to a file. The unit connects to a computer via USB (and an AC power cable). You can collect data over a wide area using these power supplies, logging data can be pushed over a network. I would not buy an UPS just to log power statistics but many people already have these So you might wonder what is the line voltage in your lab. If you have computer "server" of some kind you might also have an UPS and then you might already have logs of voltage and frequency going back for years. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Line Voltage [Was: Anyone (ideally in the UK) ...]
[Sorry for the blank post earlier—TVB reminded me posts have to be plain text. My post was sent from my new-to-me iPad, probably in HTML. Have to learn how to turn that off!] I too am concerned about high power-line voltage harming my collection of new and old electronics. A couple years ago I spent a lot of time documenting the line voltage at our home in northern California. The utility was consistently in excess of their 125 VAC specification. It took weeks of data before I got them to bring a recorder to my home and make their own measurement; once that was done they bumped the voltage down a little. The frequency also wanders but averages out to 60 Hertz, more or less (not Time-Nuts quality). Jeremy On 12/31/2016 11:57 AM, Tom Miller wrote: - Original Message - From: "Dr. David Kirkby (Kirkby Microwave Ltd)" To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 11:01 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Anyone (ideally in the UK) got a spare rotary knob for the 5370B TI counter? On 31 December 2016 at 13:03, EB4APL wrote: Hi, I'm not totally sure about the limits, but I have read several times that in the UK the nominal supply voltage is 230 V +10%/−6% to accommodate the fact that most supplies are in fact still 240 V. The context was that a lot of test equipment failed when operated at around 250 V and many input capacitors (particularly the ones inside a know brand IEC socket - filter) caught fire. Wikipedia says that several areas in UK still have 250 V because this value is withing the current limits. I think that the governing document is British Standard BS 7697: Nominal voltages for low voltage public electricity supply systems — (Implementation of HD 472 S1). Regards, Ignacio, EB4APL Hi, I have just been on to the phone of a friend of mine who spent much of his like working in the electricity generating industry. Working at both Darlington (coal) and Bradwell (nuclear) power stations in the UK. Among many other things he said * He did not know the current specifications limits for certain, but he said easy to check. (What you say - 230 -6%/+10% does seem to be quoted in many places, but I guess I should check it out.) * Supply voltage is likely to be highest about at 2-3 am in Summer * Supply voltage is likely to be lowest on a cold Winter's afternoon. * Voltages in use around the county include at the least 11, 22, 33, 66, 132, 275 and 400 kV. * There's not much standardization of generator voltage - Bradwell nuclear power station was 11.1 kV. * There are taps on the 275 kV transformers to keep the 132 kV close to 132 kV * There are 6 taps on the 11 kV transformers feeding my house to adjust the voltage. Those can only be adjusted with the 11 kV off - they can't be done with it online. Essentially this means to change the taps, an area would need to be powered off. * If voltage is out of spec, it should be possible to get something done about it. * The electricity board can install monitor equipment. * Since I am right by the 11 kV transformer, and other places further away, dropping the voltage at my place might put other places too low. I think short-term I will put the auto transformer in line. I will monitor the mains, and report it in the summer, when I'm told it is likely to go higher. It hit 250.04 V in the last hour or so, but I have not seen the magic figure of 253 V. I'll get my 3457A calibrated by Keysight, then look to measure this and if appropriate make a formal request to have the voltage checked, and hopefully the problems would occur during the time it was monitored. Dave ___ There are some devices that benefit from the higher voltage. Motors usually run cooler and last longer due to the lower I2R losses. Maybe just use a buck transformer in your lab for the (older) test equipment. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Line Voltage [Was: Anyone (ideally in the UK) ...]
Just a comment for anyone who wants to log line voltage v. time. If you have an APC "Smart UPS" battery backup unit these will log voltage and frequency to a file. The unit connects to a computer via USB (and an AC power cable). You can collect data over a wide area using these power supplies, logging data can be pushed over a network. I would not buy an UPS just to log power statistics but many people already have these So you might wonder what is the line voltage in your lab. If you have computer "server" of some kind you might also have an UPS and then you might already have logs of voltage and frequency going back for years. On Sat, Dec 31, 2016 at 6:14 PM, Jeremy Nichols wrote: > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. -- Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Resolution T temperature shift at leap second?
Your Res-T is running on GPS time which has no leap-seconds. My bet is the temperature drop was due to your environment and not leap second processing. But those first-gen Res-T's are a bit quirky... -- >I was running my resolution T at the leap second but LH 5.0 did not capture the blessed event! So I don't know how it was reported. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Line Voltage [Was: Anyone (ideally in the UK) ...]
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[time-nuts] Resolution T temperature shift at leap second?
I was running my resolution T at the leap second but LH 5.0 did not capture the blessed event! So I don't know how it was reported. Then I noticed that the temperature took a dive afterwards. That seems odd. I have only been running this a few weeks and may not have noticed such occurrences. Also I notice a tight correlation between the temperature and the rate in the graph. I can't tell which is the cause and which is the effect.When I first noticed this I put the Res T in a small cardboard box to insure that air currents weren't effecting it. There was no change in the behavior and no change in the temperature excursions. What could this be? I have attached a screen shot that shows the temperature dive. Pete. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] A Leap Second is coming
Here's what I got: https://youtu.be/nGMFzhNFrb4 It worked as I expected. 4:00:00 PM was two seconds long. Sent from my iPhone > On Dec 30, 2016, at 11:49 AM, Nick Sayer via time-nuts > wrote: > > I'm going to definitely observe my GPS clock to check its behavior. It > *should* repeat second zero (in my case of 4PM PST). Not the most exactingly > accurate depiction, but it's the best I can do with the architecture. > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Dec 29, 2016, at 12:22 AM, David J Taylor >> wrote: >> >> Is everybody setup to watch it and collect lots of data? >> >> Anybody have a list of tools/toys for collecting data? >> >> An old favorite: >> www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~mgk25/time/leap/test/timelog.c >> = >> >> Some tools here, to see which NTP servers are announcing the event: >> >> http://www.satsignal.eu/software/net.htm#NTPLeapTrace >> >> Perhaps they may be of use to someone? >> >> Cheers, >> David >> -- >> SatSignal Software - Quality software written to your requirements >> Web: http://www.satsignal.eu >> Email: david-tay...@blueyonder.co.uk >> Twitter: @gm8arv >> ___ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Leap-second capture for chronyd NTP
Here is my observation for NTP 'chronyd'. The NTP setup is based on 1PPS (from Trimble TB) and kernel extension (pps_core) As leap second event happens, I noticed the "system clock" (NTP machine) was one second behind. Then it took around 16 minutes for 'chronyd' to gradually align system clock to match the time. Now everything ticking in tact. Here is par of 'chronyd' log. I noticed four column changed from "+" to "N" 2016-12-31 23:41:24 72.38.129.202 + 2 111 111 10 10 1.00 -2.252e-03 1.788e-02 1.063e-06 2.440e-02 2.791e-02 2016-12-31 23:46:37 206.108.0.132 + 2 111 111 10 9 0.08 3.681e-03 1.391e-02 1.126e-06 7.019e-04 5.044e-01 2016-12-31 23:49:17 192.95.25.79+ 3 111 111 10 60 0.83 -4.016e-03 1.607e-02 1.607e-06 1.222e-02 3.143e-02 2016-12-31 23:55:43 132.163.4.102 + 1 111 111 10 10 0.99 2.366e-03 4.196e-02 1.073e-06 0.000e+00 0.000e+00 Date (UTC) Time IP Address L St 123 567 ABCD LP RP Score Offset Peer del. Peer disp. Root del. Root disp. 2016-12-31 23:58:43 72.38.129.202 + 2 111 111 10 10 1.00 -3.424e-03 1.650e-02 1.062e-06 2.440e-02 4.349e-02 2017-01-01 00:03:57 206.108.0.132 N 2 111 111 10 10 0.33 2.033e-03 1.051e-02 1.124e-06 7.019e-04 5.200e-01 2017-01-01 00:06:38 192.95.25.79N 3 111 111 10 60 0.78 -3.597e-03 1.616e-02 2.116e-06 1.222e-02 2.022e-02 2017-01-01 00:13:08 132.163.4.102 N 1 111 111 10 10 1.00 2.218e-03 4.040e-02 1.059e-06 0.000e+00 0.000e+00 2017-01-01 00:15:58 72.38.129.202 N 2 111 111 10 10 1.00 -1.609e-03 2.219e-02 1.063e-06 2.483e-02 3.131e-02 For the LH 5.0 - it took the snapshot. http://www.patoka.ca/OCXO/leap_sec.gif Alsom I noticed that LH 5.0 watch is little bit behind of the 'xclok' watch translated from NTP (and from this link https://uhr.ptb.de/). Regards, Vlad On 2016-12-31 20:55, Magnus Danielson wrote: Good evening David, On 01/01/2017 02:27 AM, Dr. David Kirkby (Kirkby Microwave Ltd) wrote: On 1 January 2017 at 01:00, Magnus Danielson wrote: Fellow time-nuts, While not fancy by any means, my laptop captured the leap-second being inserted by this message in the /var/log/syslog: Jan 1 00:59:59 greytop kernel: [78458.839942] Clock: inserting leap second 23:59:60 UTC Noting reported on my Sun Ultra 27 running OpenSolaris. Dec 31 23:55:02 hawk sendmail[4016]: [ID 801593 mail.info] uBVNt2jv004015: to=, ctladdr= (0/0), delay=00:00:00, xdelay=00:00:00, mailer=local, pri=30730, relay=local, dsn=2.0.0, stat=Sent Jan 1 00:00:02 hawk sendmail[4055]: [ID 801593 mail.info] v01002rm004055: from=root, size=319, class=0, nrcpts=1, msgid=<20170101.v01002rm004055@hawk.local>, relay=root@localhost What NTP is this? There is security patches to be made to older NTPs. I had to shut down xntpd on several solaris machines to make them safe, as there was no way of configure them to become safe. That was a couple of years ago. This OS has not been updated for years drkirkby@hawk:~$ cat /etc/release OpenSolaris Development snv_134 X86 Copyright 2010 Sun Microsystems, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Use is subject to license terms. Assembled 01 March 2010 Ehm. While off-topic, let me tell you that we had to shut down the last Solaris machine we had on the computer club because we concluded that there where tools designed to target that generation of Solaris machines and take them over. It should not see public internet if powered on. The network is increasingly hostile, so patch your machines, and don't let any machines sit on public network unless you can patch them regularly and also do that. Cheers, Magnus ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- WBW, V.P. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Leap second - MSF time signal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpBxB2Yqh-U Time signal - 0011223344556 0123456789012345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890 Starting at 23:58:00 - A 1000101101001011000111010001110110010110 B 10001000 Starting at 23:59:00 - A 1101111010110 B 11100 So the new DUT1 was transmitted starting at 23:59:01, but the year 2017, which is normally transmitted starting at 17s, was transmitted starting at 18s. So it appears that the leap second was actually inserted at 23:59:17? ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] DirecTV question in regards to leap second
Hi, I noticed something interesting tonight. Right after I took the leap second photos out in my workshop I came inside to show the photos to my wife and son. My wife was in the living room yelling at the TV, apparently the hockey game she was watching was messing up and the audio was dropping out repeatedly every second or two. The words we were hearing didn't match the commentators lips. Resetting the DirecTV receiver power fixed the problem, but she said it happened about the same time I was out watching my Thunderbolt laptop. Maybe the leap second affected our receiver? Did anyone else happen to notice this? Thanks. Chris KD4PBJ ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Leap-second capture on laptop
Good evening David, On 01/01/2017 02:27 AM, Dr. David Kirkby (Kirkby Microwave Ltd) wrote: On 1 January 2017 at 01:00, Magnus Danielson wrote: Fellow time-nuts, While not fancy by any means, my laptop captured the leap-second being inserted by this message in the /var/log/syslog: Jan 1 00:59:59 greytop kernel: [78458.839942] Clock: inserting leap second 23:59:60 UTC Noting reported on my Sun Ultra 27 running OpenSolaris. Dec 31 23:55:02 hawk sendmail[4016]: [ID 801593 mail.info] uBVNt2jv004015: to=, ctladdr= (0/0), delay=00:00:00, xdelay=00:00:00, mailer=local, pri=30730, relay=local, dsn=2.0.0, stat=Sent Jan 1 00:00:02 hawk sendmail[4055]: [ID 801593 mail.info] v01002rm004055: from=root, size=319, class=0, nrcpts=1, msgid=<20170101.v01002rm004055@hawk.local>, relay=root@localhost What NTP is this? There is security patches to be made to older NTPs. I had to shut down xntpd on several solaris machines to make them safe, as there was no way of configure them to become safe. That was a couple of years ago. This OS has not been updated for years drkirkby@hawk:~$ cat /etc/release OpenSolaris Development snv_134 X86 Copyright 2010 Sun Microsystems, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Use is subject to license terms. Assembled 01 March 2010 Ehm. While off-topic, let me tell you that we had to shut down the last Solaris machine we had on the computer club because we concluded that there where tools designed to target that generation of Solaris machines and take them over. It should not see public internet if powered on. The network is increasingly hostile, so patch your machines, and don't let any machines sit on public network unless you can patch them regularly and also do that. Cheers, Magnus ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Leap second results
I ran Heather on 9 different receivers. Only three did the leap-second "right" with a time of 23:59:60 (which unfortunately shows up on the screen as 00:00:60)... long story... sorry... The Trimble Thunderbolt, Venus 8 timing receiver, and the Z3811A (which the automatic screen capture got the previous second on one system and the correct second on another (X11 display buffering differences?). All the other receivers reported the leap second as a duplicate 00:00:00... Ublox M8N, Sirf III, Z3801A. I've attached the Venus timing receiver dump from a Raspberry PI 2B with the 800x480 touchscreen. The Oscilloquartz Star-4 duplicated the 00:00:01 time stamp! The NEC GPDDO got really confused! It reported the date as 2016-11-30 a couple of times and went into holdover mode. Log snippet attached. These GPSDOs came out of a Japan WiMax system... I wonder if those systems crashed? Earlier in the day my Z3801A started reporting the date as 2017-01-00 (in the F2 time format TCODE message) Switching it to the F1 format gave the correct date, but since the F1 format is epoch based, it has no way for showing a :60 second, the bast it can do is a duplicate :00. After the leapsecond, I switched the Z3801A back to F2 format and it is now working properly. nec.log Description: nec.log ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Capture of leapsecond on HP 58503A time and frequency reference receiver
Reposting the output in a fixed width font. It looked fixed on my other client. I note the clock says "Time _ +1 leap second pending" at 23:59:60, which one can argue is wrong. *Status reports a couple of times before the leap second. * scpi > SYSTEM:STATUS? --- Receiver Status --- SYNCHRONIZATION . [ Outputs Valid ] SmartClock Mode ___ Reference Outputs ___ >> Locked to GPS TFOM 3 FFOM 0 Recovery 1PPS TI +8.7 ns relative to GPS Holdover HOLD THR 1.000 us Power-up Holdover Uncertainty Predict 11.1 us/initial 24 hrs ACQUISITION [ GPS 1PPS Valid ] Tracking: 6 Not Tracking: 2 Time _ +1 leap second pending PRN El Az SS PRN El AzUTC 23:56:00 31 Dec 2016 16 12 287 45 2 12 37GPS 1PPS Synchronized to UTC 21 28 171 6623 11 323ANT DLY 0 ns 25 44 106 101 Position 26 40 290 123 MODE Hold 29 73 68 114 31 61 236 85 LAT N 51:39:04.132 LON E 0:46:36.343 ELEV MASK 10 deg HGT +44.72 m (MSL) HEALTH MONITOR . [ OK ] Self Test: OKInt Pwr: OK Oven Pwr: OK OCXO: OK EFC: OK GPS Rcv: OK scpi > SYSTEM:STATUS? --- Receiver Status --- SYNCHRONIZATION . [ Outputs Valid ] SmartClock Mode ___ Reference Outputs ___ >> Locked to GPS TFOM 3 FFOM 0 Recovery 1PPS TI +11.4 ns relative to GPS Holdover HOLD THR 1.000 us Power-up Holdover Uncertainty Predict 11.1 us/initial 24 hrs ACQUISITION [ GPS 1PPS Valid ] Tracking: 6 Not Tracking: 2 Time _ +1 leap second pending PRN El Az SS PRN El AzUTC 23:59:00 31 Dec 2016 16 13 288 37 2 11 37GPS 1PPS Synchronized to UTC 21 29 171 9523 11 322ANT DLY 0 ns 25 42 107 110 Position 26 41 290 85 MODE Hold 29 72 67 120 31 61 234 101 LAT N 51:39:04.132 LON E 0:46:36.343 ELEV MASK 10 deg HGT +44.72 m (MSL) HEALTH MONITOR . [ OK ] Self Test: OKInt Pwr: OK Oven Pwr: OK OCXO: OK EFC: OK GPS Rcv: OK *Here's the actual leap second. * scpi > SYSTEM:STATUS? --- Receiver Status --- SYNCHRONIZATION . [ Outputs Valid ] SmartClock Mode ___ Reference Outputs ___ >> Locked to GPS TFOM 3 FFOM 0 Recovery 1PPS TI -3.3 ns relative to GPS Holdover HOLD THR 1.000 us Power-up Holdover Uncertainty Predict 11.1 us/initial 24 hrs ACQUISITION [ GPS 1PPS Valid ] Tracking: 6 Not Tracking: 2 Time _ +1 leap second pending PRN El Az SS PRN El AzUTC 23:59:60 31 Dec 2016 16 14 288 51 2 11 37GPS 1PPS Synchronized to UTC 21 30 171 5423 11 322ANT DLY 0 ns 25 42 107 95 Position 26 42 291 73 MODE Hold 29 72 66 124 31 60 233 120 LAT N 51:39:04.132 LON E 0:46:36.343 ELEV MASK 10 deg HGT +44.72 m (MSL) HEALTH MONITOR . [ OK ] Self Test: OKInt Pwr: OK Oven Pwr: OK OCXO: OK EFC: OK GPS Rcv: OK *Now one after the leap second. The notice about a
Re: [time-nuts] Version 5 wrong leap second
> I had LH on a ks24361. I think it displayed :00 for 2 seconds (my attempt to > record it failed). The autocapture (attached) was a little too early. I > guess this is because LH is polling the receiver every second and the actual > content depends on what the receiver replies and when it does it ? I had a dumb script talking to a KS. It sent a 235960 First column is MJD, second column is seconds this day from Linux posix time. 57753 86391.053576 T22016123123595230+003E 57753 86392.053570 T22016123123595330+003F 57753 86393.061001 T22016123123595430+0040 57753 86394.053578 T22016123123595530+0041 57753 86395.055427 T22016123123595630+0042 57753 86396.053579 T22016123123595730+0043 57753 86397.053566 T22016123123595830+0044 57753 86398.053572 T22016123123595930+0045 57753 86399.053575 T22016123123596030+003D 57753 86399.053576 T2201701010030+0020 57754 0.055842 T22017010101326 57754 1.053575 T22017010102327 57754 2.053574 T22017010103328 57754 3.053570 T22017010104329 57754 4.053976 T2201701010532A 57754 5.053943 T2201701010632B 57754 6.053574 T2201701010732C 57754 7.053567 T2201701010832D 57754 8.053568 T2201701010932E 57754 9.053566 T22017010110326 Dec 31 15:59:59 deb kernel: [4246279.248005] Clock: inserting leap second 23:59:60 UTC -- These are my opinions. I hate spam. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Leapsecond on Apple iOS
Fellow time-nuts, Several friends observed that their Apple devices, laptop and phones, did not handle the leap second timely. One recorded the UTC+1h time with the sequence 00:59:57 00:59:58 00:59:59 01:00:00 01:00:01 01:00:01 <- leap second inserted 01:00:02 01:00:03 The other dug up that Cocoa claims that using NTP prohibits it from implementing it correctly, which doesn't match my laptops observation being fed only from NTP. Anyone else saw something similar? The hurdles of precision time in a POSIX-damaged world... Cheers, Magnus ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Version 5 wrong leap second
Mine showed 01:00:60 but it is configured to Madrid LT, so it means 00:00:60 UTC also. My receiver is a Trimble NTGS50AA, close cousin of a Tbolt. Ignacio, EBA4PL El 01/01/2017 a las 1:33, Pete Stephenson escribió: On Sun, Jan 1, 2017 at 1:28 AM, Bill Beam wrote: My LH v5.00 showed leap second as 00:00:60 on a Tbolt. Not good Previous June 2015 LH v3.10 correctly showed 23:59:60 If interested, I have screen captures. Now that you mention it, so did mine... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Leap-second capture on laptop
On 1 January 2017 at 01:00, Magnus Danielson wrote: > Fellow time-nuts, > > While not fancy by any means, my laptop captured the leap-second being > inserted by this message in the /var/log/syslog: > Jan 1 00:59:59 greytop kernel: [78458.839942] Clock: inserting leap > second 23:59:60 UTC > Noting reported on my Sun Ultra 27 running OpenSolaris. Dec 31 23:55:02 hawk sendmail[4016]: [ID 801593 mail.info] uBVNt2jv004015: to=, ctladdr= (0/0), delay=00:00:00, xdelay=00:00:00, mailer=local, pri=30730, relay=local, dsn=2.0.0, stat=Sent Jan 1 00:00:02 hawk sendmail[4055]: [ID 801593 mail.info] v01002rm004055: from=root, size=319, class=0, nrcpts=1, msgid=<20170101.v01002rm004055@hawk.local>, relay=root@localhost This OS has not been updated for years drkirkby@hawk:~$ cat /etc/release OpenSolaris Development snv_134 X86 Copyright 2010 Sun Microsystems, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Use is subject to license terms. Assembled 01 March 2010 Dave ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Leap second on LEA-6T
Bob, I use the AID-HUI message to get the time of the next leapsecond. I use the utcWNF and utcDN to get the day number of the next leap second. Since it always happens at the end of the UTC day, this gives you the time. utcLS and utcLSF give you the the before/after offsets. Yes, it doesn't change often, but it doesn't need to. Philip On 31/12/2016 19:28, Bob Stewart wrote: Here's the leap second as my GPSDOs saw it. But, I'm still in the dark about how Ublox does their pending leap second notification. There are very few messages that have any leap second info, and I had hoped that the aiding message AID-HUI would do something at the leap second. But, the message doesn't seem to update more than once a day and there's no direct way to tell when the leap second will happen from the AID-HUI message that I can see. So, does anyone have a good grasp on how to get the pending leap second info from a Ublox receiver? I'm missing something that's probably intuitively obvious to everyone else. 20161231235959|P|250|500|000|3233|0539|3272|11|09|0.33|096.6| 001.1|G-04.595|105.54|9681|7A236|07| 50820161231235960|P|250|500|000|1063|0540|3271|11|09|0.33|010.2| 001.1|G 09.106|105.54|967F|7A235|07| 507 2017010100|P|250|500|000|0642|0540|3271|11|09|0.33|001.9|-000.2|G 02.113|105.54|9680|7A234|07| 507 2017010101|P|250|500|000|3230|0540|3271|11|09|0.33|096.4| 000.2|G-03.822|105.54|9681|7A235|07| 508 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Leap-second capture on laptop
Fellow time-nuts, While not fancy by any means, my laptop captured the leap-second being inserted by this message in the /var/log/syslog: Jan 1 00:59:59 greytop kernel: [78458.839942] Clock: inserting leap second 23:59:60 UTC Gently pointing out it had registered a leap second and inserted it. This from using NTP servers, nothing fancy. Happy New Year and a Happy Leap-second! Cheers, Magnus ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Version 5 wrong leap second
I had LH on a ks24361. I think it displayed :00 for 2 seconds (my attempt to record it failed). The autocapture (attached) was a little too early. I guess this is because LH is polling the receiver every second and the actual content depends on what the receiver replies and when it does it ? I was also running LH with a resolution-T, but in GPS clock mode instead of UTC. Unsurprisingly, this didn't show the leapsecond, neither did LH capture a .gif. One of the LHs also played the leapsec.wav file : this appeared to be white noise, but I probably missed something clever :) On Sun, Jan 1, 2017 at 12:33 AM, Pete Stephenson wrote: > On Sun, Jan 1, 2017 at 1:28 AM, Bill Beam wrote: > > My LH v5.00 showed leap second as 00:00:60 on a Tbolt. Not good > > > > Previous June 2015 LH v3.10 correctly showed 23:59:60 > > > > If interested, I have screen captures. > > Now that you mention it, so did mine... > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/ > mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Leap second on LEA-6T
Here's the leap second as my GPSDOs saw it. But, I'm still in the dark about how Ublox does their pending leap second notification. There are very few messages that have any leap second info, and I had hoped that the aiding message AID-HUI would do something at the leap second. But, the message doesn't seem to update more than once a day and there's no direct way to tell when the leap second will happen from the AID-HUI message that I can see. So, does anyone have a good grasp on how to get the pending leap second info from a Ublox receiver? I'm missing something that's probably intuitively obvious to everyone else. 20161231235959|P|250|500|000|3233|0539|3272|11|09|0.33|096.6| 001.1|G-04.595|105.54|9681|7A236|07| 50820161231235960|P|250|500|000|1063|0540|3271|11|09|0.33|010.2| 001.1|G 09.106|105.54|967F|7A235|07| 507 2017010100|P|250|500|000|0642|0540|3271|11|09|0.33|001.9|-000.2|G 02.113|105.54|9680|7A234|07| 507 2017010101|P|250|500|000|3230|0540|3271|11|09|0.33|096.4| 000.2|G-03.822|105.54|9681|7A235|07| 508 Bob ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Version 5 wrong leap second
On Sun, Jan 1, 2017 at 1:28 AM, Bill Beam wrote: > My LH v5.00 showed leap second as 00:00:60 on a Tbolt. Not good > > Previous June 2015 LH v3.10 correctly showed 23:59:60 > > If interested, I have screen captures. Now that you mention it, so did mine... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Version 5 wrong leap second
My LH v5.00 showed leap second as 00:00:60 on a Tbolt. Not good Previous June 2015 LH v3.10 correctly showed 23:59:60 If interested, I have screen captures. Bill Beam NL7F ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] My analog clock capturing the leap second
https://goo.gl/photos/RZKqsgZqv2mH5UYK6 This is a video of my cheapo clock (which is NTP synchronized via an ESP8266 module running LUA). Actually synched to a local NTP/PTP server using GPS. OT When the leap second happened, the kids complained that Netflix stopped working! Coincidence? Philip ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] WWVB leap
Decent signal tonight. Looks like they got the DUT1 bits (from -0.4 to +0.6 s), the leap year bits, and the leap second bits switched over on schedule, too. Sat Dec 31 23:59:00 2016 | | X Sat Dec 31 23:59:01 2016 | | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:02 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:03 2016 | | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:04 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:05 2016 | - | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:06 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:07 2016 | ---| 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:08 2016 | | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:09 2016 | ---| X Sat Dec 31 23:59:10 2016 | ---| 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:11 2016 | ---| 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:12 2016 | - | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:13 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:14 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:15 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:16 2016 | - | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:17 2016 | - | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:18 2016 | | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:19 2016 | ---| X Sat Dec 31 23:59:20 2016 | --| 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:21 2016 | - | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:22 2016 | - | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:23 2016 | - | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:24 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:25 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:26 2016 | - | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:27 2016 | - | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:28 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:29 2016 | ---| X Sat Dec 31 23:59:30 2016 | - | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:31 2016 | - | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:32 2016 | - | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:33 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:34 2016 | - | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:35 2016 | ---| 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:36 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:37 2016 | - | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:38 2016 | - | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:39 2016 | --- | X Sat Dec 31 23:59:40 2016 | ---| 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:41 2016 | | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:42 2016 | --| 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:43 2016 | ---| 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:44 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:45 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:46 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:47 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:48 2016 | - | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:49 2016 | | X Sat Dec 31 23:59:50 2016 | - | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:51 2016 | - | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:52 2016 | - | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:53 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:54 2016 | -- | 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:55 2016 | - | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:56 2016 | | 1 Sat Dec 31 23:59:57 2016 | --| 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:58 2016 | ---| 0 Sat Dec 31 23:59:59 2016 | --- | X Sun Jan 1 00:00:00 2017 | ---| X Sun Jan 1 00:00:00
[time-nuts] Capture of leapsecond on HP 58503A time and frequency reference receiver
This was a bit hit and miss. I sent 'SYSTEM:STATUS?' by hand, when I thought it was the right time. I got lucky. There are a couple of outputs before the leapsecond, and one or two after it. I did an audio recording on my Virgin mobile phone. I'll upload that later, after some sleep. Dave scpi > SYSTEM:STATUS? --- Receiver Status --- SYNCHRONIZATION . [ Outputs Valid ] SmartClock Mode ___ Reference Outputs ___ >> Locked to GPS TFOM 3 FFOM 0 Recovery 1PPS TI +8.7 ns relative to GPS Holdover HOLD THR 1.000 us Power-up Holdover Uncertainty Predict 11.1 us/initial 24 hrs ACQUISITION [ GPS 1PPS Valid ] Tracking: 6 Not Tracking: 2 Time _ +1 leap second pending PRN El Az SS PRN El AzUTC 23:56:00 31 Dec 2016 16 12 287 45 2 12 37GPS 1PPS Synchronized to UTC 21 28 171 6623 11 323ANT DLY 0 ns 25 44 106 101 Position 26 40 290 123 MODE Hold 29 73 68 114 31 61 236 85 LAT N 51:39:04.132 LON E 0:46:36.343 ELEV MASK 10 deg HGT +44.72 m (MSL) HEALTH MONITOR . [ OK ] Self Test: OKInt Pwr: OK Oven Pwr: OK OCXO: OK EFC: OK GPS Rcv: OK scpi > SYSTEM:STATUS? --- Receiver Status --- SYNCHRONIZATION . [ Outputs Valid ] SmartClock Mode ___ Reference Outputs ___ >> Locked to GPS TFOM 3 FFOM 0 Recovery 1PPS TI +11.4 ns relative to GPS Holdover HOLD THR 1.000 us Power-up Holdover Uncertainty Predict 11.1 us/initial 24 hrs ACQUISITION [ GPS 1PPS Valid ] Tracking: 6 Not Tracking: 2 Time _ +1 leap second pending PRN El Az SS PRN El AzUTC 23:59:00 31 Dec 2016 16 13 288 37 2 11 37GPS 1PPS Synchronized to UTC 21 29 171 9523 11 322ANT DLY 0 ns 25 42 107 110 Position 26 41 290 85 MODE Hold 29 72 67 120 31 61 234 101 LAT N 51:39:04.132 LON E 0:46:36.343 ELEV MASK 10 deg HGT +44.72 m (MSL) HEALTH MONITOR . [ OK ] Self Test: OKInt Pwr: OK Oven Pwr: OK OCXO: OK EFC: OK GPS Rcv: OK scpi > SYSTEM:STATUS? --- Receiver Status --- SYNCHRONIZATION . [ Outputs Valid ] SmartClock Mode ___ Reference Outputs ___ >> Locked to GPS TFOM 3 FFOM 0 Recovery 1PPS TI -3.3 ns relative to GPS Holdover HOLD THR 1.000 us Power-up Holdover Uncertainty Predict 11.1 us/initial 24 hrs ACQUISITION [ GPS 1PPS Valid ] Tracking: 6 Not Tracking: 2 Time _ +1 leap second pending PRN El Az SS PRN El AzUTC 23:59:60 31 Dec 2016 16 14 288 51 2 11 37GPS 1PPS Synchronized to UTC 21 30 171 5423 11 322ANT DLY 0 ns 25 42 107 95 Position 26 42 291 73 MODE Hold 29 72 66 124 31 60 233 120 LAT N 51:39:04.132 LON E 0:46:36.343 ELEV MASK 10 deg HGT +44.72 m (MSL) HEALTH MONITOR . [ OK ] Self Test: OKInt Pwr: OK Oven Pwr: OK OCXO: OK EFC: OK GPS Rcv: OK scpi > SYSTEM:STATUS? ---
[time-nuts] HP 4352A/B with different signal generator
There was a thread about using a different SG with the 4352A/B about seven years ago. I happened upon the answer today. Set the SG type from the LO menu. Type 1: 8664A/B Type 2: 8657B Type 3: 8648B/C, E8241A, E8244A, E8251A, E8255A Type 4: User defined. To define your own, use the GPIB "SGCMD" command. Details are in the 4352B manual, available on exodus.poly.edu. Bob, who knows how he's spending the time waiting for the leap second... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Anyone (ideally in the UK) got a spare rotary knob for the 5370B TI counter?
David, You're a volt-nut too, aren't you ? Maybe motorise the variac and keep your lab at 240V +/- almost-nothing ? On Sat, Dec 31, 2016 at 7:57 PM, Tom Miller wrote: > > - Original Message - From: "Dr. David Kirkby (Kirkby Microwave > Ltd)" > To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" < > time-nuts@febo.com> > Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 11:01 AM > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Anyone (ideally in the UK) got a spare rotary > knob for the 5370B TI counter? > > > > On 31 December 2016 at 13:03, EB4APL wrote: >> >> Hi, >>> >>> I'm not totally sure about the limits, but I have read several times that >>> in the UK the nominal supply voltage is 230 V +10%/−6% to accommodate the >>> fact that most supplies are in fact still 240 V. The context was that a >>> lot >>> of test equipment failed when operated at around 250 V and many input >>> capacitors (particularly the ones inside a know brand IEC socket - >>> filter) >>> caught fire. >>> >>> Wikipedia says that several areas in UK still have 250 V because this >>> value is withing the current limits. >>> >>> I think that the governing document is British Standard BS 7697: Nominal >>> voltages for low voltage public electricity supply systems — >>> (Implementation of HD 472 S1). >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Ignacio, EB4APL >>> >> >> >> >> Hi, >> I have just been on to the phone of a friend of mine who spent much of his >> like working in the electricity generating industry. Working at both >> Darlington (coal) and Bradwell (nuclear) power stations in the UK. Among >> many other things he said >> >> * He did not know the current specifications limits for certain, but he >> said easy to check. (What you say - 230 -6%/+10% does seem to be quoted in >> many places, but I guess I should check it out.) >> * Supply voltage is likely to be highest about at 2-3 am in Summer >> * Supply voltage is likely to be lowest on a cold Winter's afternoon. >> * Voltages in use around the county include at the least 11, 22, 33, 66, >> 132, 275 and 400 kV. >> * There's not much standardization of generator voltage - Bradwell nuclear >> power station was 11.1 kV. >> * There are taps on the 275 kV transformers to keep the 132 kV close to >> 132 >> kV >> * There are 6 taps on the 11 kV transformers feeding my house to adjust >> the >> voltage. Those can only be adjusted with the 11 kV off - they can't be >> done >> with it online. Essentially this means to change the taps, an area would >> need to be powered off. >> * If voltage is out of spec, it should be possible to get something done >> about it. >> * The electricity board can install monitor equipment. >> * Since I am right by the 11 kV transformer, and other places further >> away, >> dropping the voltage at my place might put other places too low. >> >> I think short-term I will put the auto transformer in line. I will monitor >> the mains, and report it in the summer, when I'm told it is likely to go >> higher. >> >> It hit 250.04 V in the last hour or so, but I have not seen the magic >> figure of 253 V. >> >> I'll get my 3457A calibrated by Keysight, then look to measure this and if >> appropriate make a formal request to have the voltage checked, and >> hopefully the problems would occur during the time it was monitored. >> >> Dave >> ___ >> > > There are some devices that benefit from the higher voltage. Motors > usually run cooler and last longer due to the lower I2R losses. > Maybe just use a buck transformer in your lab for the (older) test > equipment. > > > > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/m > ailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Anyone (ideally in the UK) got a spare rotary knob for the 5370B TI counter?
- Original Message - From: "Dr. David Kirkby (Kirkby Microwave Ltd)" To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 11:01 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Anyone (ideally in the UK) got a spare rotary knob for the 5370B TI counter? On 31 December 2016 at 13:03, EB4APL wrote: Hi, I'm not totally sure about the limits, but I have read several times that in the UK the nominal supply voltage is 230 V +10%/−6% to accommodate the fact that most supplies are in fact still 240 V. The context was that a lot of test equipment failed when operated at around 250 V and many input capacitors (particularly the ones inside a know brand IEC socket - filter) caught fire. Wikipedia says that several areas in UK still have 250 V because this value is withing the current limits. I think that the governing document is British Standard BS 7697: Nominal voltages for low voltage public electricity supply systems — (Implementation of HD 472 S1). Regards, Ignacio, EB4APL Hi, I have just been on to the phone of a friend of mine who spent much of his like working in the electricity generating industry. Working at both Darlington (coal) and Bradwell (nuclear) power stations in the UK. Among many other things he said * He did not know the current specifications limits for certain, but he said easy to check. (What you say - 230 -6%/+10% does seem to be quoted in many places, but I guess I should check it out.) * Supply voltage is likely to be highest about at 2-3 am in Summer * Supply voltage is likely to be lowest on a cold Winter's afternoon. * Voltages in use around the county include at the least 11, 22, 33, 66, 132, 275 and 400 kV. * There's not much standardization of generator voltage - Bradwell nuclear power station was 11.1 kV. * There are taps on the 275 kV transformers to keep the 132 kV close to 132 kV * There are 6 taps on the 11 kV transformers feeding my house to adjust the voltage. Those can only be adjusted with the 11 kV off - they can't be done with it online. Essentially this means to change the taps, an area would need to be powered off. * If voltage is out of spec, it should be possible to get something done about it. * The electricity board can install monitor equipment. * Since I am right by the 11 kV transformer, and other places further away, dropping the voltage at my place might put other places too low. I think short-term I will put the auto transformer in line. I will monitor the mains, and report it in the summer, when I'm told it is likely to go higher. It hit 250.04 V in the last hour or so, but I have not seen the magic figure of 253 V. I'll get my 3457A calibrated by Keysight, then look to measure this and if appropriate make a formal request to have the voltage checked, and hopefully the problems would occur during the time it was monitored. Dave ___ There are some devices that benefit from the higher voltage. Motors usually run cooler and last longer due to the lower I2R losses. Maybe just use a buck transformer in your lab for the (older) test equipment. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Leap Second Smear Monitoring
Hi, Thought I just remind people that an alternative is to provide UT1 time, as Judah Levine had been doing on a NIST NTP server as a test of concept. Then again, do regular testing of systems to see how they handle leap seconds and fix things until it works is also a quite workable solution. That's what we done for our products and not been able to detect any issues with leap seconds per se. Cheers, Magnus On 12/31/2016 09:34 PM, Tom Van Baak wrote: Scott -- Thanks very much for doing this, and doing it live. List -- For some background, see these two papers by Martin Burnicki: https://www.meinberg.de/download/burnicki/ntp_leap_smearing_test_results.pdf https://www.meinbergglobal.com/download/burnicki/Leap%20Second%20Smearing%20With%20NTP.pdf /tvb - Original Message - From: "Scott Newell" To: Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 9:53 AM Subject: [time-nuts] Leap Second Smear Monitoring I'm trying to watch the google NTP server leap second smear. This page should update once/minute with my latest data. http://www.n5tnl.com/time/leap_2016/index.html Sorry about the coarse resolution--I've set another monitor station to poll more often and I'll try and append that graph shortly. -- newell N5TNL ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Leap Second Smear Monitoring
Scott -- Thanks very much for doing this, and doing it live. List -- For some background, see these two papers by Martin Burnicki: https://www.meinberg.de/download/burnicki/ntp_leap_smearing_test_results.pdf https://www.meinbergglobal.com/download/burnicki/Leap%20Second%20Smearing%20With%20NTP.pdf /tvb - Original Message - From: "Scott Newell" To: Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2016 9:53 AM Subject: [time-nuts] Leap Second Smear Monitoring > I'm trying to watch the google NTP server leap second smear. This > page should update once/minute with my latest data. > > http://www.n5tnl.com/time/leap_2016/index.html > > Sorry about the coarse resolution--I've set another monitor station > to poll more often and I'll try and append that graph shortly. > > -- > newell N5TNL ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Z3801A sending invalid date
My Z3801A just started sending an invalid date in the "T2" format time code message (which is its default format). It says the date is 2017/01/00 and Lady Heather rejects the data and the clock stops updating. My receiver went into rollover last August and I manually set the date which cured the rollover. Not sure if that is what is causing the problem... probably not since the "F1" time code format works. If you just started seeing the problem, a way around it is to switch the time code to "F1" format. From Lady Heather type in "!u" (without the quotes) This will prompt you for a user command to send to the receiver (you can also do this from a terminal program or Lady Heather's built in terminal emulator). Next enter the command (without the quotes): ":PTIM:TCOD:FORM F1" ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Anyone (ideally in the UK) got a spare rotary knob for the 5370B TI counter?
On 31 December 2016 at 13:03, EB4APL wrote: > Hi, > > I'm not totally sure about the limits, but I have read several times that > in the UK the nominal supply voltage is 230 V +10%/−6% to accommodate the > fact that most supplies are in fact still 240 V. The context was that a lot > of test equipment failed when operated at around 250 V and many input > capacitors (particularly the ones inside a know brand IEC socket - filter) > caught fire. > > Wikipedia says that several areas in UK still have 250 V because this > value is withing the current limits. > > I think that the governing document is British Standard BS 7697: Nominal > voltages for low voltage public electricity supply systems — > (Implementation of HD 472 S1). > > Regards, > > Ignacio, EB4APL Hi, I have just been on to the phone of a friend of mine who spent much of his like working in the electricity generating industry. Working at both Darlington (coal) and Bradwell (nuclear) power stations in the UK. Among many other things he said * He did not know the current specifications limits for certain, but he said easy to check. (What you say - 230 -6%/+10% does seem to be quoted in many places, but I guess I should check it out.) * Supply voltage is likely to be highest about at 2-3 am in Summer * Supply voltage is likely to be lowest on a cold Winter's afternoon. * Voltages in use around the county include at the least 11, 22, 33, 66, 132, 275 and 400 kV. * There's not much standardization of generator voltage - Bradwell nuclear power station was 11.1 kV. * There are taps on the 275 kV transformers to keep the 132 kV close to 132 kV * There are 6 taps on the 11 kV transformers feeding my house to adjust the voltage. Those can only be adjusted with the 11 kV off - they can't be done with it online. Essentially this means to change the taps, an area would need to be powered off. * If voltage is out of spec, it should be possible to get something done about it. * The electricity board can install monitor equipment. * Since I am right by the 11 kV transformer, and other places further away, dropping the voltage at my place might put other places too low. I think short-term I will put the auto transformer in line. I will monitor the mains, and report it in the summer, when I'm told it is likely to go higher. It hit 250.04 V in the last hour or so, but I have not seen the magic figure of 253 V. I'll get my 3457A calibrated by Keysight, then look to measure this and if appropriate make a formal request to have the voltage checked, and hopefully the problems would occur during the time it was monitored. Dave ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Leap Second Smear Monitoring
I'm trying to watch the google NTP server leap second smear. This page should update once/minute with my latest data. http://www.n5tnl.com/time/leap_2016/index.html Sorry about the coarse resolution--I've set another monitor station to poll more often and I'll try and append that graph shortly. -- newell N5TNL ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] TS2100: Upgrading oscillator?
Bruce, Based on information previously posted here I was able to do this earlier this year. I wrote it up: https://aerographic.tumblr.com/post/139872571444/datumsymmetricom-ts2100-irig-ocxo-heol-n024-gps You're looking for a low profile MTI 240 OCXO. That would be easiest, but many others will work. Let me know if you have any questions. Cheers, --msa ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] FE-5650A option 58 tuning word for 10 MHz output
Hello guys I'm new to this list. I got myself a FE-5650A Rubidium Standard off of ebay. It's the "option 58" 1 pps output variant, hence I have to modify the tuning word used in the DDS phase accumulator to get 10 MHz out. I found a vast amount of awesome descriptions on how to do that on the web and in particular on this list. One write-up that stood out was this one by Mark Sims: http://www.mail-archive.com/time-nuts@febo.com/msg13486.html I think I can pull this off since everything is documented so nicely. However, I'm having trouble calculating the right tuning word and this is why: Mark notes that the reference frequency reported by the unit is the one with the C-field pot at the lowest frequency position. He gives a number of suggestions on how to deal with that. Since I didn't get that hydrogen maser for Christmas, the best approach seems to be "to calculate the true reference frequency from the saved (minimum C-field) R=reference frequency and F=divisor word and use that value to calculate divisor words." I don't understand how the saved minimum C-field reference ties into this calculation. My approach would have been to calculate the true reference frequency from the saved divisor alone, ignoring the minimum C-field calculation. I don't see how the minimum C-field reference frequency would help me since the C-field pot is not in the min position anymore due to factory tweaking. To be specific, this is what I would do: The unit returns the following string upon 'S': OK50255055.760840Hz F=2ABB5046B34A2E00 Now based on this, the tuning word should be coded in the first 8 characters, of F, i.e. '2ABB5046'. I'm a bit confused about the remaining characters being non-zero. Any documentation I came across has a number that ends in 8 zeroes... In any case, 0x2ABB5046 is 716918854 in decimal and the resolution would therefore be 2^23 / 716918854 = approx. 0.0117 Hz which makes sense. The physics package would then output a frequency of f_ref = (2^23 / 716918854) * 2^32 = approx. 50255055.809934 Hz This is higher than the reference given in the 'S' output, which is in line with what Mark wrote. However, scaling this with the average correction factor he gave yields f_ref * 1.2150 = approx. 50255055.917982 Hz Which is higher than what I would expect. Then again I'm not entirely sure what I would expect because various errors add up in the above calculation. I'd be interested in what people with more experience think about those results. I would then use M = 1000/(2^23/716918854) = approx. 854633872.509003 to find the 10 MHz tuning word, which I would then round up (unfortunately it's smack in the middle between two integers...) and convert to hex, yielding 0x32F0AD91. This does in fact result in a 10.000 MHz output waveform but I have no means to check its accuracy (yet?). I'd appreciate any hints about where things could have potentially gone wrong, especially with respect to the minimum C-field reference frequency that I ended up not using. On a slightly related note, I have cooked up a small PCB with a local 5 V regulator and status LEDs that mates with the amphenol connector used on this standard. I have to complete the write-up on it and will probably put up a video about the mod on my youtube channel; once this is done I'll be sitting on 9 spare boards since I got 10 boards done. If there is interest, I could send off the spares without profit, i.e. for about 5 bucks or so. I imagine this could be of use to those who have the same standard. The board doesn't do anything funky, it is just neat. In any case I'd like to ask if it would be OK to formally place this offer on the list once I got everything ready. Thanks a lot and best regards! Matt ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Anyone (ideally in the UK) got a spare rotary knob for the 5370B TI counter?
Hi, I'm not totally sure about the limits, but I have read several times that in the UK the nominal supply voltage is 230 V +10%/−6% to accommodate the fact that most supplies are in fact still 240 V. The context was that a lot of test equipment failed when operated at around 250 V and many input capacitors (particularly the ones inside a know brand IEC socket - filter) caught fire. Wikipedia says that several areas in UK still have 250 V because this value is withing the current limits. I think that the governing document is British Standard BS 7697: Nominal voltages for low voltage public electricity supply systems — (Implementation of HD 472 S1). Regards, Ignacio, EB4APL El 31/12/2016 a las 11:25, Dr. David Kirkby (Kirkby Microwave Ltd) escribió: On 31 Dec 2016 02:03, "Bob Stewart" wrote: If you can touch the heat sink for 2 seconds, you're made of sterner stuff than I am! They run very hot. It's a good idea to get a GPIB extender so your GPIB cable can clear the heat sink. Somebody, can't remember who, worked up a nice looking conversion to a pair of switching supplies. SMPSs tend to be less clean than a linear supply. I would be somewhat reluctant to take that route on test equipment. But I will search for the conversion. I have a 13 A variac sitting around that's not been used in the last 25 years. I think as a short term measure I will drop the voltage to a few bits of the equipment with linear power supplies. The spectrum analyzer has linear supplies and puts out a lot of heat. As someone else said, a 20 V transformer would work. Adding the variac will take me 5 minutes to do, which has an advantage over anything I need to build. I will also log the mains voltage over a period of a few weeks and see if it high enough to ask the electricity supply company to do something about it. I do know someone that measured his voltage and found it was outside the legal limits. He advised the electricity supplier, they agreed, but said that they were not going to do anything about it. He wired his whole house on an auto transformer. I would be speaking to my Membrr of Parliament (MP) if it was outside the legal limits. I don't know what legal limits exist in the UK for voltage, but I can find out. It is unusual in the UK for a domestic property to have a phase supply, but mine does. I don't know whether any one phase is consistently lower than any other. If so phases could be switched. But given my close promptly to the 11 kV transformer, I doubt it. I know at one point I had a dispute with the electricity supply company as the 415 V overhead power lines used to be regularly hit by farm vehicles down a private road where my property is. This would pull the cables away from my house and make a mess of the house. The electricity supplier would always repair the damage, but after this happened a few times I complained. I was initially told they would do nothing as it is not a road. But I discovered that the cables needed to be a minimum height if there was vehicular access. So whether the electricity supplier considered it a road or not was irrelevant. Eventually they extended a pole and raised the cables up, which appears to have solved the problem. Whether I can convince them to move the transformer taps is another matter. I suspect that it might be hard if my supply is consistently high, but not outside the legal limits. Dave ___ ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Anyone (ideally in the UK) got a spare rotary knob for the 5370B TI counter?
230VAC +10% -6%, so 253 is the upper limit. 248V is not unusual as for historic reasons some parts of UK still actually supply 250V ... When we "harmonized" our mains with the EU, we changed the specification from 240V +/- 5% (I think) and didn't actually change any equipment. Happy New Year Dave ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Anyone (ideally in the UK) got a spare rotary knob for the 5370B TI counter?
On 31 Dec 2016 02:03, "Bob Stewart" wrote: > > If you can touch the heat sink for 2 seconds, you're made of sterner stuff than I am! They run very hot. It's a good idea to get a GPIB extender so your GPIB cable can clear the heat sink. Somebody, can't remember who, worked up a nice looking conversion to a pair of switching supplies. SMPSs tend to be less clean than a linear supply. I would be somewhat reluctant to take that route on test equipment. But I will search for the conversion. I have a 13 A variac sitting around that's not been used in the last 25 years. I think as a short term measure I will drop the voltage to a few bits of the equipment with linear power supplies. The spectrum analyzer has linear supplies and puts out a lot of heat. As someone else said, a 20 V transformer would work. Adding the variac will take me 5 minutes to do, which has an advantage over anything I need to build. I will also log the mains voltage over a period of a few weeks and see if it high enough to ask the electricity supply company to do something about it. I do know someone that measured his voltage and found it was outside the legal limits. He advised the electricity supplier, they agreed, but said that they were not going to do anything about it. He wired his whole house on an auto transformer. I would be speaking to my Membrr of Parliament (MP) if it was outside the legal limits. I don't know what legal limits exist in the UK for voltage, but I can find out. It is unusual in the UK for a domestic property to have a phase supply, but mine does. I don't know whether any one phase is consistently lower than any other. If so phases could be switched. But given my close promptly to the 11 kV transformer, I doubt it. I know at one point I had a dispute with the electricity supply company as the 415 V overhead power lines used to be regularly hit by farm vehicles down a private road where my property is. This would pull the cables away from my house and make a mess of the house. The electricity supplier would always repair the damage, but after this happened a few times I complained. I was initially told they would do nothing as it is not a road. But I discovered that the cables needed to be a minimum height if there was vehicular access. So whether the electricity supplier considered it a road or not was irrelevant. Eventually they extended a pole and raised the cables up, which appears to have solved the problem. Whether I can convince them to move the transformer taps is another matter. I suspect that it might be hard if my supply is consistently high, but not outside the legal limits. Dave ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
