Re: [time-nuts] pointers to information on ways to collect data, 5335, etc.

2012-03-09 Thread Magnus Danielson

Hi Jim,

On 03/09/2012 10:27 PM, Jim Lux wrote:

I've got a student intern (Undergrad Senior) who's doing a project for
me where he's trying to synchronize (and syntonize) two 1 pps ticks,
generated from different oscillators using some modules in an FPGA.
One oscillator is a run of the mill 66 MHz clock oscillator the other is
a 49.x MHz TCXO. (and, of course, because he's working in a breadboard,
I can swap in a signal generator for either.. I've got a stack of 3325Bs
and 8663s, etc.)

The objective is to get two signals that are 1 pps (or 10 pps) ticks
(each derived from a different oscillator) that align

I'm looking for info to point him to on evaluating the performance of
his implementation.

I've got a HP 5335 (which works quite nicely with a Prologix and John
Miles's tools... thanks John!). I've got oscilloscopes. I've got access
to more exotic stuff if need be (although, since my intern budget is
skinny, stuff I happen to have in the lab, like my uncalibrated 5335, is
better)


For the application, the 5335 will be more than adequate.


I also have a bunch of Wenzel 10 MHz OCXOs sitting around (although for
this, why not use one of the instrument's internal oscillator and
distribute it around)

I do have a hydrogen maser derived reference in the lab, but I'm more
interested in him measuring the two oscillators against each other.
(that is, measuring the performance of the TCXO, by itself, isn't
particularly interesting)


What he needs is some suggestions on things that he can measure that
would be meaningful figures of merit for the application.


He should measure:

- Lock-in transient
- Lock-in time/time-constant
- Lock-in overshot
- Estimate control loop bandwidth and Q-value/resonance

He should then also have a "lock" detector, possibly several lock levels 
and illustrate them in the transient waveform.


Then, he should measure the lock-in deviation pattern and measure bias 
and RMS noise. Maybe even do a nice ADEV/TDEV set of plots. MTIE plots 
is always nice as well.


Showing good control of model parameters and actual performance remains 
a good thing. It is usually good to attempt to improve things.


A good exercise is trying to figure out ways to get quick and dead safe 
lock-in while also get good in-lock performance. :)


I strongly recommend having a digital scope in parallel with the counter.


He's not doing a PhD dissertation, though.. And he has to be done before
the end of the spring semester. No million second Allan Deviation
measurements.


Should be a good project for him. Keep me posted on the progress.

Cheers,
Magnus

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[time-nuts] pointers to information on ways to collect data, 5335, etc.

2012-03-09 Thread Jim Lux
I've got a student intern (Undergrad Senior) who's doing a project for 
me where he's trying to synchronize (and syntonize) two 1 pps ticks, 
generated from different oscillators using some modules in an FPGA.
One oscillator is a run of the mill 66 MHz clock oscillator the other is 
a 49.x MHz TCXO. (and, of course, because he's working in a breadboard, 
I can swap in a signal generator for either.. I've got a stack of 3325Bs 
and 8663s, etc.)


The objective is to get two signals that are 1 pps  (or 10 pps) ticks 
(each derived from a different oscillator) that align


I'm looking for info to point him to on evaluating the performance of 
his implementation.


I've got a HP 5335 (which works quite nicely with a Prologix and John 
Miles's tools... thanks John!).  I've got oscilloscopes.  I've got 
access to more exotic stuff if need be (although, since my intern budget 
is skinny, stuff I happen to have in the lab, like my uncalibrated 5335, 
is better)


I also have a bunch of Wenzel 10 MHz OCXOs sitting around (although for 
this, why not use one of the instrument's internal oscillator and 
distribute it around)


I do have a hydrogen maser derived reference in the lab, but I'm more 
interested in him measuring the two oscillators against each other. 
(that is, measuring the performance of the TCXO, by itself, isn't 
particularly interesting)



What he needs is some suggestions on things that he can measure that 
would be meaningful figures of merit for the application.


He's not doing a PhD dissertation, though.. And he has to be done before 
the end of the spring semester.  No million second Allan Deviation 
measurements.


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