[time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer, HP 8405A or TAPR TIC
Yo Bubba Dudes!, I've been following the discussion of the FSA3011 with great interest. Now I'm not in the upper levels of TN esoteric knowledge or have a burning desire to ever get there. After seeing some small reference somewhere I looked at the HP 8405A on ebay and the price range seemed comparable to the FSA3011. Now the HP 8405 is a huge beast but i was thinking that it might be easier for me to use. I'm interested in just 5 and 10 MHz oscillator comparison. I know nothing about computer programs or writing any code. I also looked at the TAPR TIC. So my conclusion are: The FSA3011 may be technically the best BUT it seems to be having some teething problems and I don't really know about what programs it runs or needs. The HP 8405A is a big beast, but it maybe simpler for me to run and get the results I want which is stopping around 10 to ^12th. But I may have to watch it for a long time. The TAPR TIC is small (needed) cheaper (also a plus) and seems to run available software. but needs a dedicated laptop, which is not a real problem. I also have several extra HP 18011's available. Your opinions are gratefully solicited, Regards, Perrier Perrier If I can just download programs AFAIK I could use the TAPR TIC as I have a spare laptop that I could dedicate for its use. The two advantaages ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer, HP 8405A or TAPR TIC
Hi Perrier, The HP8405A is an analog vector analyzer that allows you to make phase measurements like the oscilloscope with Lissajous shapes. This method is the simplest one but allows quite approximate measurements and does not give you a complete view of stability (Allan Deviation). The TICC and the FSA3011 are more advanced systems that both require a laptop and a TIMELAB sw (free) but give you a complete view of the stability parameters both in the short and long term. To use TICC you need an additional 10/5 MHz to 1PPS divider like the TADD-2, mini PPS divider. https://tapr.org/kits_t2-mini.html The TICC is in the order of 205 $ the FSA3011 is around 470 $. The performance difference seem to be the Test Set noise floor. The FSA3011 seem to be ten time better but I am not sure, for this reason I am asking more info about this new unit. Luciano www.timeok.it Da "time-nuts" time-nuts-boun...@lists.febo.com A time-nuts@lists.febo.com Cc "Perry Sandeen" sandee...@yahoo.com Data Tue, 30 Jul 2019 06:04:34 + (UTC) Oggetto [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer, HP 8405A or TAPR TIC Yo Bubba Dudes!, I've been following the discussion of the FSA3011 with great interest. Now I'm not in the upper levels of TN esoteric knowledge or have a burning desire to ever get there. After seeing some small reference somewhere I looked at the HP 8405A on ebay and the price range seemed comparable to the FSA3011. Now the HP 8405 is a huge beast but i was thinking that it might be easier for me to use. I'm interested in just 5 and 10 MHz oscillator comparison. I know nothing about computer programs or writing any code. I also looked at the TAPR TIC. So my conclusion are: The FSA3011 may be technically the best BUT it seems to be having some teething problems and I don't really know about what programs it runs or needs. The HP 8405A is a big beast, but it maybe simpler for me to run and get the results I want which is stopping around 10 to ^12th. But I may have to watch it for a long time. The TAPR TIC is small (needed) cheaper (also a plus) and seems to run available software. but needs a dedicated laptop, which is not a real problem. I also have several extra HP 18011's available. Your opinions are gratefully solicited, Regards, Perrier Perrier If I can just download programs AFAIK I could use the TAPR TIC as I have a spare laptop that I could dedicate for its use. The two advantaages ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer, HP 8405A or TAPR TIC
Hi The 8405 is a fine device and with working probes can be very useful to have around. Without the probes .. not so much. Since they have been around since the 1960’s, the probes may have seen quite a bit of wear and tear. For comparing standards, an RPD-1 and a DVM will kind of / sort of do the same thing. A pair of RPD-1’s and a quadrature hybrid into a pair of DVM’s (or ADC’s) will very much do the same thing. Bob > On Jul 30, 2019, at 2:04 AM, Perry Sandeen via time-nuts > wrote: > > Yo Bubba Dudes!, > I've been following the discussion of the FSA3011 with great interest. > Now I'm not in the upper levels of TN esoteric knowledge or have a burning > desire to ever get there. After seeing some small reference somewhere I > looked at the HP 8405A on ebay and the price range seemed comparable to the > FSA3011. Now the HP 8405 is a huge beast but i was thinking that it might be > easier for me to use. I'm interested in just 5 and 10 MHz oscillator > comparison. I know nothing about computer programs or writing any code. > I also looked at the TAPR TIC. > So my conclusion are: > The FSA3011 may be technically the best BUT it seems to be having some > teething problems and I don't really know about what programs it runs or > needs. > The HP 8405A is a big beast, but it maybe simpler for me to run and get the > results I want which is stopping around 10 to ^12th. But I may have to watch > it for a long time. > The TAPR TIC is small (needed) cheaper (also a plus) and seems to run > available software. but needs a dedicated laptop, which is not a real > problem. I also have several extra HP 18011's available. > > Your opinions are gratefully solicited, > Regards, > Perrier > > Perrier > > If I can just download programs AFAIK I could use the TAPR TIC as I have a > spare laptop that I could dedicate for its use. The two advantaages > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Control and monitor program for Spectracom 8195B
Yes, I noticed there was an instructions on setting the range of OCXO's high and low, so it falls within "correctable" range of the PLL. I bet many GPSDO has something like this - just not explained so explicitly in manuals. Can we try sending the .exe again? I think if you zip up the below picture and .exe together, it should work. (that's how it was working before) --- (Mr.) Taka Kamiya KB4EMF / ex JF2DKG On Tuesday, July 30, 2019, 12:00:33 AM EDT, Mark Sims wrote: I got in an 8195A and managed to get Heather working with the wonky, very much not computer friendly, Spectracom interface and command set. When you send a command to the device it echoes back the characters. This is very useful for telling what command the device is responding to. But, about half the time, the echoed characters were garbled. Also several response messages came back corrupted. Oh, and occasionally the unit would lock up and require a power cycle to recover. The problem turned out to be that you can't send command strings to the device at computer friendly speeds. You need several milliseconds of delay between each character you send! Anyway, Heather now work with the Spectracom "ageless" oscillators. BTW, for an "ageless" oscillator, these units have a procedure for correcting oscillator aging ;-) --- > The problem with the 8195 is that the serial port software interface was > designed for human interaction with very little regard paid to supporting a > computer monitoring program.___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer, HP 8405A or TAPR TIC
I have an 8405, fortunately in excellent condition, along with the BNC adapters, the resistive splitter and the 50-ohm line samplers. The probe tips are very delicate and are probably unobtainium these days. The electronics in the probes can be repaired. I've been careful with mine and had no failures, but I did repair another one many years ago. (See: http://www.peakbagging.com/Electronic/HP8405A%20repair.pdf) One can digitize the analog outputs which I did for some test or another about 40 years ago. Wes N7WS On 7/30/2019 5:30 AM, Bob kb8tq wrote: Hi The 8405 is a fine device and with working probes can be very useful to have around. Without the probes .. not so much. Since they have been around since the 1960’s, the probes may have seen quite a bit of wear and tear. For comparing standards, an RPD-1 and a DVM will kind of / sort of do the same thing. A pair of RPD-1’s and a quadrature hybrid into a pair of DVM’s (or ADC’s) will very much do the same thing. Bob On Jul 30, 2019, at 2:04 AM, Perry Sandeen via time-nuts wrote: Yo Bubba Dudes!, I've been following the discussion of the FSA3011 with great interest. Now I'm not in the upper levels of TN esoteric knowledge or have a burning desire to ever get there. After seeing some small reference somewhere I looked at the HP 8405A on ebay and the price range seemed comparable to the FSA3011. Now the HP 8405 is a huge beast but i was thinking that it might be easier for me to use. I'm interested in just 5 and 10 MHz oscillator comparison. I know nothing about computer programs or writing any code. I also looked at the TAPR TIC. So my conclusion are: The FSA3011 may be technically the best BUT it seems to be having some teething problems and I don't really know about what programs it runs or needs. The HP 8405A is a big beast, but it maybe simpler for me to run and get the results I want which is stopping around 10 to ^12th. But I may have to watch it for a long time. The TAPR TIC is small (needed) cheaper (also a plus) and seems to run available software. but needs a dedicated laptop, which is not a real problem. I also have several extra HP 18011's available. Your opinions are gratefully solicited, Regards, Perrier Perrier If I can just download programs AFAIK I could use the TAPR TIC as I have a spare laptop that I could dedicate for its use. The two advantaages ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer, HP 8405A or TAPR TIC
Hi, If you sample continously and decimate the data properly you avoid the dead-time issues and get results which is translates well into ADEV measures. Cheers, Magnus On 2019-07-30 14:30, Bob kb8tq wrote: > Hi > > The 8405 is a fine device and with working probes can be very useful to have > around. Without the > probes .. not so much. Since they have been around since the 1960’s, the > probes may have seen > quite a bit of wear and tear. > > For comparing standards, an RPD-1 and a DVM will kind of / sort of do the > same thing. A pair > of RPD-1’s and a quadrature hybrid into a pair of DVM’s (or ADC’s) will very > much do the same thing. > > Bob > >> On Jul 30, 2019, at 2:04 AM, Perry Sandeen via time-nuts >> wrote: >> >> Yo Bubba Dudes!, >> I've been following the discussion of the FSA3011 with great interest. >> Now I'm not in the upper levels of TN esoteric knowledge or have a burning >> desire to ever get there. After seeing some small reference somewhere I >> looked at the HP 8405A on ebay and the price range seemed comparable to the >> FSA3011. Now the HP 8405 is a huge beast but i was thinking that it might be >> easier for me to use. I'm interested in just 5 and 10 MHz oscillator >> comparison. I know nothing about computer programs or writing any code. >> I also looked at the TAPR TIC. >> So my conclusion are: >> The FSA3011 may be technically the best BUT it seems to be having some >> teething problems and I don't really know about what programs it runs or >> needs. >> The HP 8405A is a big beast, but it maybe simpler for me to run and get the >> results I want which is stopping around 10 to ^12th. But I may have to watch >> it for a long time. >> The TAPR TIC is small (needed) cheaper (also a plus) and seems to run >> available software. but needs a dedicated laptop, which is not a real >> problem. I also have several extra HP 18011's available. >> >> Your opinions are gratefully solicited, >> Regards, >> Perrier >> >> Perrier >> >> If I can just download programs AFAIK I could use the TAPR TIC as I have a >> spare laptop that I could dedicate for its use. The two advantaages >> ___ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to >> http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com >> and follow the instructions there. > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HP5370A vs B version
There was an informative thread back in 2005 on the topic of hp 5370A vs. 5370B: https://www.febo.com/pipermail/time-nuts/2005-April/018053.html It's worth reading the entire thread, or at least, read the reply by JJ (from Agilent T&F): https://www.febo.com/pipermail/time-nuts/2005-April/018057.html /tvb On 7/19/2019 11:00 AM, Taka Kamiya via time-nuts wrote: What are the differences between HP5370A and 5370B version? I have been told A's input ports are rather delicate and it has been better protected on B version. I found notes on A and B and looked a them side by side but honestly, they are difficult to compare. Anyone on list who had both and can tell from experience? --- (Mr.) Taka Kamiya KB4EMF / ex JF2DKG ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP5370A vs B version
Once upon a time, I looked into the front ends of the 5370 counters (mostly 5370A) and found that it was practical to build a replacement using modern chips. I then lost interest in the project when I found an Ebay seller with a lot of 10 pieces of the 5370A chip for dirt cheap (sorry, all are now gone). ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
