Re: [time-nuts] WWVB Translation

[paul swed]

Andy agreed I wrote about the requirements for stability when I built mine
up.
I did not need to add a amplifier I simply attenuated the output of the
tristate gate to get to the 1000uv level then filtered and split to 6
outputs. One drives the antenna the others drive coax's to truetime and
symetricom clocks. They really look nice. Silly but what the heck.
I agree if I need more power a FET stage is the way to go. Just don't so
far.
Hmmm maybe mid next year I can build a 100 watt amp to cover our town. Not
really. The antenna would be quite a challenge. But I hear I can pick a few
towers up for shipping costs real soon now. Even with matching networks.
Regards
Paul
WB8TSL

On Sat, Oct 27, 2018 at 8:55 PM Andy Backus  wrote:

> I should have credited the loop idea as you did, Paul.  I don't know who
> it was, but thank you.
>
>
> I would leave my translator on all the time if it weren't for my La Crosse
> -- whose reception would be ruined.
>
>
> In my system, BTW, a resonant tank precedes a FET amplifier, which
> provides the antenna current.  I have found, as others have, that the
> frequency must be good to several Hertz.  So I use a crystal controlled
> CMOS gate oscillator to generate the RF.
>
>
> Andy Backus
>
> WA2TND
>
>
> 
> From: time-nuts  on behalf of paul swed
> 
> Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2018 4:01 PM
> To: Time-nuts
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] WWVB Translation
>
> Andy pretty much what I did also. A loop in the basement as suggested by a
> time-nut.
> Radiations quite low depending on the floor of the house and walls its
> 100uv to 30 uv.
> Did resonate it with a cap that seemed to improve things. But no matter it
> works for what I need and the clocks are happy.
> I leave the simulator on all of the time now as no matter the time of the
> day or battery change the clocks lock in the 3 or so minutes.
> Since I don't own an official lacrosse no issue here though perhaps mid
> January I will pick one up cheap... Chuckle.
> If I do I guess l'll have to build a BPSK version. Oh hang on there thats
> what the de-psk-r is. Just add 60 KHz. Actually depending on the clocks
> cost as they get dropped maybe not a bad idea. Have fun with your system.
> Regards
> Paul
> WB8TSL
>
> On Sat, Oct 27, 2018 at 6:04 PM Andy Backus  wrote:
>
> > For those still interested in GPS to WWVB simulation -- after trying a
> few
> > antenna designs I found that a 50-foot loop of #26 enameled wire stapled
> to
> > the rafters in the basement works quite well.  Putting 35 ma (rms) of 60
> > kHz WWVB signal through it lights up the house quite nicely.  I don't
> know
> > yet if it also lights up the neighbor's house.  I think I will
> investigate
> > that question when (and if) they pull the plug in Colorado.  But I am
> > prepared.
> >
> >
> > Not so much for my La Crosse Technology WWVB BPSK clock.  I think it will
> > get swamped out.  Can't have everything, I guess.
> >
> >
> > Andy Backus
> > ___
> > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com
> > To unsubscribe, go to
> > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com
> time-nuts Info Page - lists.febo.com<
> http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com>
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> time-nuts is a low volume, high SNR list for the discussion of precise
> time and frequency measurement and related topics. To see the collection of
> prior postings to the list, visit the time-nuts Archives.. Using time-nuts
>
>
>
> > and follow the instructions there.
> >
> ___
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Re: [time-nuts] WWVB Translation

[Andy Backus]

I should have credited the loop idea as you did, Paul.  I don't know who it 
was, but thank you.


I would leave my translator on all the time if it weren't for my La Crosse -- 
whose reception would be ruined.


In my system, BTW, a resonant tank precedes a FET amplifier, which provides the 
antenna current.  I have found, as others have, that the frequency must be good 
to several Hertz.  So I use a crystal controlled CMOS gate oscillator to 
generate the RF.


Andy Backus

WA2TND



From: time-nuts  on behalf of paul swed 

Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2018 4:01 PM
To: Time-nuts
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] WWVB Translation

Andy pretty much what I did also. A loop in the basement as suggested by a
time-nut.
Radiations quite low depending on the floor of the house and walls its
100uv to 30 uv.
Did resonate it with a cap that seemed to improve things. But no matter it
works for what I need and the clocks are happy.
I leave the simulator on all of the time now as no matter the time of the
day or battery change the clocks lock in the 3 or so minutes.
Since I don't own an official lacrosse no issue here though perhaps mid
January I will pick one up cheap... Chuckle.
If I do I guess l'll have to build a BPSK version. Oh hang on there thats
what the de-psk-r is. Just add 60 KHz. Actually depending on the clocks
cost as they get dropped maybe not a bad idea. Have fun with your system.
Regards
Paul
WB8TSL

On Sat, Oct 27, 2018 at 6:04 PM Andy Backus  wrote:

> For those still interested in GPS to WWVB simulation -- after trying a few
> antenna designs I found that a 50-foot loop of #26 enameled wire stapled to
> the rafters in the basement works quite well.  Putting 35 ma (rms) of 60
> kHz WWVB signal through it lights up the house quite nicely.  I don't know
> yet if it also lights up the neighbor's house.  I think I will investigate
> that question when (and if) they pull the plug in Colorado.  But I am
> prepared.
>
>
> Not so much for my La Crosse Technology WWVB BPSK clock.  I think it will
> get swamped out.  Can't have everything, I guess.
>
>
> Andy Backus
> ___
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to
> http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com
time-nuts Info Page - 
lists.febo.com<http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com>
lists.febo.com
time-nuts is a low volume, high SNR list for the discussion of precise time and 
frequency measurement and related topics. To see the collection of prior 
postings to the list, visit the time-nuts Archives.. Using time-nuts



> and follow the instructions there.
>
___
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To unsubscribe, go to 
http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com
and follow the instructions there.
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and follow the instructions there.

Re: [time-nuts] WWVB Translation

[paul swed]

Andy pretty much what I did also. A loop in the basement as suggested by a
time-nut.
Radiations quite low depending on the floor of the house and walls its
100uv to 30 uv.
Did resonate it with a cap that seemed to improve things. But no matter it
works for what I need and the clocks are happy.
I leave the simulator on all of the time now as no matter the time of the
day or battery change the clocks lock in the 3 or so minutes.
Since I don't own an official lacrosse no issue here though perhaps mid
January I will pick one up cheap... Chuckle.
If I do I guess l'll have to build a BPSK version. Oh hang on there thats
what the de-psk-r is. Just add 60 KHz. Actually depending on the clocks
cost as they get dropped maybe not a bad idea. Have fun with your system.
Regards
Paul
WB8TSL

On Sat, Oct 27, 2018 at 6:04 PM Andy Backus  wrote:

> For those still interested in GPS to WWVB simulation -- after trying a few
> antenna designs I found that a 50-foot loop of #26 enameled wire stapled to
> the rafters in the basement works quite well.  Putting 35 ma (rms) of 60
> kHz WWVB signal through it lights up the house quite nicely.  I don't know
> yet if it also lights up the neighbor's house.  I think I will investigate
> that question when (and if) they pull the plug in Colorado.  But I am
> prepared.
>
>
> Not so much for my La Crosse Technology WWVB BPSK clock.  I think it will
> get swamped out.  Can't have everything, I guess.
>
>
> Andy Backus
> ___
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to
> http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com
> and follow the instructions there.
>
___
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To unsubscribe, go to 
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and follow the instructions there.

Re: [time-nuts] WWVB Translation/Simulation from GPS Data

[Adrian Godwin]

Could you couple the 60kHz signal into the power line ?
It should conveniently pass around most of the house and some ferrite rings
on the incoming mains minimise what goes outside your premises.


On Wed, Sep 5, 2018 at 5:38 PM, Andy Backus  wrote:

> I have taken a similar approach to Wayne's.
>
>
> When WWVB blinks off my plan is to have a single GPS receiver in the house
> with a good antenna and to distribute from it a digital signal that will
> key little 60 kHz units for each clock.
>
>
> Attached is source code (well commented) for an Adafruit GPS module and
> Arduino processor to do that.
>
>
> The protocol for bits 57 and 58 is this: 57 goes on 24 hours before DST
> comes on and 58 goes on at  hrs (GMT) on the day of the change.  They
> both stay on until DST is to go off, then 57 goes off 24 hours before the
> change and 58 goes off on the day of.
>
>
> Andy Backus
>
>
> 
> From: time-nuts  on behalf of Wayne
> Holder 
> Sent: Wednesday, September 5, 2018 3:01 AM
> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] WWVB Signal Generator
>
> I've reworked my WWVB Simulator so it can now run on a slightly modified,
> 328-based Arduino (swapped in a 16.36 MHz crystal for the standard 16 MHz.)
>  The new code is also now using a GPS module to set the time from the
> GPS $GPRMC message and my BALDR clock just syncs up nicely.  I used a
> GlobalTopGPS module (similar to the one used in this Adafruit GPS module
> ) but, with minor changes, it should
>
> work with any GPS module.  The main change needed is configuring the
> message used to set the module to only send $GPRMC messages (at a 1 second
> interval) and suppress the others NMEA messages.
>
> The last step is to to set the DST status bits (57 and 58) in the WWVB
> message, but I'm little bit confused as to when to precisely set these
> bits.  For reference, the the Java code (below) that I used to prototype
> and test the algorithms before converting to C.  The code computes the
> starting day of year and ending day of year and the idea is to use these
> two DOY values to control to setting bits 57 and 58.  But, it's unclear to
> me if I should set starting and ending state (code 2 and 1, respectively)
> on the Sunday of the change or on the days before and after this date?  Or,
>  are the starting and ending states set on Sunday and the other states on
> the following Mondays?  I'm confused.
>
> Wayne
>
> public class DaylightSavings {
>   private static final int daysToMonth[][] = {
> { 0, 31, 59, 90, 120, 151, 181, 212, 243, 273, 304, 334 },
> { 0, 31, 60, 91, 121, 152, 182, 213, 244, 274, 305, 335 },
>   };
>   private static final int MARCH = 3;
>   private static final int NOVEMBER = 11;
>
>   /*
>*  Compute state and end of Daylight Savings time for specified 4 digit
> year
>*DST Starts the 2nd Sunday of March at 2:00 AM
>*DST Ends the first Sunday of November at 1:00 AM
>*/
>
>   public static void main (String[] args) {
> int year = 2018;
> int start = getNthSundayOfMonth(2, MARCH, year);  //
> Get 2nd Sunday of March
> int end = getNthSundayOfMonth(1, NOVEMBER, year); //
> Get 1st Sunday of November
> int startDoy = getDayOfYear(start, MARCH, isLeapYear(year));
> int endDoy = getDayOfYear(end, NOVEMBER, isLeapYear(year));
> System.out.println("DST starts: " + MARCH + "/" + start + "/" +
> year + " (Day of Year: " + startDoy + ") ");
> System.out.println("DST ends:   " + NOVEMBER +  "/" + end + "/" +
> year + " (Day of Year: " + endDoy + ")");
>   }
>
>   private static int getNthSundayOfMonth (int sundays, int month, int
> year) {
> for (int day = 1; day < 15; day++) {
>   if (getDayOfWeek(month, day, year) == 2) {
> if (--sundays == 0) {
>   return day;
> }
>   }
> }
> // Should never get here
> return 0;
>   }
>
>   private static int getDayOfYear (int day, int month, boolean leapYear) {
> return daysToMonth[leapYear ? 1 : 0][month - 1] + day;
>   }
>
>   private static boolean isLeapYear (int year) {
> return year % 4 == 0 && (year % 100 != 0 || year % 400 == 0);
>   }
>
>   /**
>* Compute Day Of Week (1-7) using Zeller's Method
>* @param month (1-12)
>* @param day (1-n)
>* @param year 4 digit year
>* @return day of week (1 = Sat, 2 = Su, 3 = Mon, 4 = Tue, 5 = Wed,
> 6 = Thr, 7 = Fri
>*/
>   private static int getDayOfWeek ( int month, int day, int year) {
> int cen = year / 100;
> year = year % 100;
> if (month == 1) {
>   month = 13;
>   year--;
> } else if (month == 2) {
>   month = 14;
>   year--;
> }
> return (day + 13 * (month + 1) / 5 + year + year / 4 + cen / 4 + 5
> * cen) % 7 + 1;
>   }
> }
>
>
> On Sat, Sep 1, 2018 at 5:14 PM Wayne Holder 
> wrote:
>
> > My 15.36 MHz crystals arrived and using one to replace the 8