Re: [tips] Would You Take S#!t From Anybody?
When I was an undergrad at Gannon U in Erie,Pa,my Psych prof,John J. Fleming,used to surprise the class by writing sh t on the board as an example of perceptual defense. I also noted that in an intro text,Robert Ornstein,states that the hypothalamus controls the 4 Fs; feeding fighting fleeing and sexual behavior michael --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=23109 or send a blank email to leave-23109-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] Would You Take S#!t From Anybody?
Mike, I know it's pretty hard to resist the temptation to make scatological jokes about this, but believe me, people with severe Crohn's and ulcerative colitis who are undergoing this treatment get very tired of it. Also, you misread the cause of the illness: it's not always a result of taking antibiotics but from *Clostridium difficile* infections that aren't cured by antibiotics. If you are terribly sick all the time, wasting away, occasionally having accidents in public and feel you'd rather die than continue to live like that, you'll try anything rather than endure a helpless and hopeless chronic inflammatory disease. As disgusting as it may sound to the uninitiated, it's beginning to get a decent track record, as the article stated. Proctologists and gastroenterologists endure a lifetime of childish jokes like this, but point out that the gut is a fascinating thing to study and marvel at it. I suggest that on a professional website like ours, we don't need to make juvenile jokes about this, and might consider empathy for people who will potentially profit from this treatment. Beth Benoit Granite State College Plymouth State University New Hampshire On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 8:43 AM, Mike Palij m...@nyu.edu wrote: Some new medical research shows that for people with gastrointestinal illness arising from the use of antibiotics appear to do much better after a fecal transplant. I kid you not. The NY Times has an article that provides a popular media account of the research and can be accessed here: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/**01/17/health/disgusting-maybe-** but-treatment-works-study-**finds.html?_r=0pagewanted=allhttp://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/17/health/disgusting-maybe-but-treatment-works-study-finds.html?_r=0pagewanted=all There are various ways that the transplant can be done, including an old Chinese method. All I'm saying is that at lunch, avoid the yellow soup and the chocolate milk. The research article was published in the New England Journal of Medicine and the publisher has made access to the article free; see: http://www.nejm.org/doi/pdf/**10.1056/NEJMoa1205037http://www.nejm.org/doi/pdf/10.1056/NEJMoa1205037 As with most medical procedures, don't try this at home unless you're under medical supervision. -Mike Palij New York University m...@nyu.edu P.S. For some reason this reminds me of the British movie Layer Cake in which Daniel Craig starred before he became the new James Bond. There's a scene between Craig and Michael Gambon (who played Dumbledore in the Harry Potter movies) where Gambon explain the facts of life to Craig (well, the facts of life as a senior gangster see them and tries to impress them into a younger gangster). Recent Ph.D.s desiring an academic career might benefit from viewing this scene (the movie is actually quite good for a British crime/drug deal gone wrong genre piece). --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: beth.ben...@gmail.com. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/**u?id=13105.** b9b37cdd198e940b73969ea6ba7aaf**72n=Tl=tipso=23104http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13105.b9b37cdd198e940b73969ea6ba7aaf72n=Tl=tipso=23104 or send a blank email to leave-23104-13105.** b9b37cdd198e940b73969ea6ba7aaf**7...@fsulist.frostburg.eduleave-23104-13105.b9b37cdd198e940b73969ea6ba7aa...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=23111 or send a blank email to leave-23111-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] Would You Take S#!t From Anybody?
Dear Beth, *Mea Culpa mode on* I want to say to Beth and anyone else that I may have offended with my post on Taking S#!t from others, I am sincerely sorry that I have offended you and will endeavor in the future to more tightly monitor my behavior/writing and edit out anything that anyone could possibly find offensive. I hope that you can find it within yourselves to accept my apologies. I would just like to note that the main point of the post was that Taking S#!t from others appears to be a good thing though some people might find Taking S#!t offensive and/or juvenile. In which case, don't take any s#!t from anyone. *Mea Culpa mode off* So, I think I will go away now, pick up a copy of one of Albert Ellis' books and try to find out why I am responsible for other people's feeling and how to deal with folks who need a humor implant. -Mike Palij New York University m...@nyu.edu P.S. To Prof. Sylvester: life is unfair, and then you live in Daytona Beach. -- Original Message - On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 07:12:48 -0800, Beth Benoit wrote: Mike, I know it's pretty hard to resist the temptation to make scatological jokes about this, but believe me, people with severe Crohn's and ulcerative colitis who are undergoing this treatment get very tired of it. Also, you misread the cause of the illness: it's not always a result of taking antibiotics but from *Clostridium difficile* infections that aren't cured by antibiotics. If you are terribly sick all the time, wasting away, occasionally having accidents in public and feel you'd rather die than continue to live like that, you'll try anything rather than endure a helpless and hopeless chronic inflammatory disease. As disgusting as it may sound to the uninitiated, it's beginning to get a decent track record, as the article stated. Proctologists and gastroenterologists endure a lifetime of childish jokes like this, but point out that the gut is a fascinating thing to study and marvel at it. I suggest that on a professional website like ours, we don't need to make juvenile jokes about this, and might consider empathy for people who will potentially profit from this treatment. Beth Benoit Granite State College Plymouth State University New Hampshire On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 8:43 AM, Mike Palij m...@nyu.edu wrote: Some new medical research shows that for people with gastrointestinal illness arising from the use of antibiotics appear to do much better after a fecal transplant. I kid you not. The NY Times has an article that provides a popular media account of the research and can be accessed here: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/**01/17/health/disgusting-maybe-** but-treatment-works-study-**finds.html?_r=0pagewanted=allhttp://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/17/health/disgusting-maybe-but-treatment-works-study-finds.html?_r=0pagewanted=all There are various ways that the transplant can be done, including an old Chinese method. All I'm saying is that at lunch, avoid the yellow soup and the chocolate milk. The research article was published in the New England Journal of Medicine and the publisher has made access to the article free; see: http://www.nejm.org/doi/pdf/**10.1056/NEJMoa1205037http://www.nejm.org/doi/pdf/10.1056/NEJMoa1205037 As with most medical procedures, don't try this at home unless you're under medical supervision. -Mike Palij New York University m...@nyu.edu P.S. For some reason this reminds me of the British movie Layer Cake in which Daniel Craig starred before he became the new James Bond. There's a scene between Craig and Michael Gambon (who played Dumbledore in the Harry Potter movies) where Gambon explain the facts of life to Craig (well, the facts of life as a senior gangster see them and tries to impress them into a younger gangster). Recent Ph.D.s desiring an academic career might benefit from viewing this scene (the movie is actually quite good for a British crime/drug deal gone wrong genre piece). --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=23114 or send a blank email to leave-23114-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
RE: [tips] Would You Take S#!t From Anybody?
I'm bothered by this thread but not for the reasons expressed by Beth or Mike but by the fact that TIPS appears to have no stomach (yes, I said that on purpose) for discussing issues related to psychology and science. I was not offended by Mike's post (I thought the yellow soup/chocolate milk line was over the top) but it didn't stop me from reading the NY Times link (and eventually the the journal article). I'm troubled that the supposed offense and the supposed apology have distracted the group from discussing the types of things I came to expect TIPS to discuss. Here are the types of responses I had hoped to read in response to this post. 1) I think the use of three groups was a good example of multiple control groups to ensure that improvement was not from the preparation process (flushing/rinsing the intestine prior to treatment). I might just use it in research methods class. It also presents an interesting point to open discussion on the ethics since the researches discontinued the study because the of the ethical concern that the control group was potentially being harmed. 2) Isn't it interesting how our concept of feces as dirty inhibits, and in fact triggers a disgust response, to the point where people might resist a treatment with now published efficacy results. Is feces really all that different from blood simply because of cultural associations? Will the pharmaceutical industry develop a name that hides what it is in the medicine and at that point will people be lining up for treatment. 3) Wow, 14,000 people per year die from gastrointestinal bacteria! 4) I started thinking about my old dog, who on occasion ate other dog's poop. I use to think he was a stupid dog, but now I wonder if he wasn't just settling his gut, because as I think about it it most offen occurred after a bout of throwing up and the sickness ended. Smart dog after all. A long time reader (and seldom a contributor) who wants the TIPS of old where we can discuss issues and make jokes at the same time. Doug Doug Peterson, PhD Associate Professor of Psychology The University of South Dakota Vermillion SD 57069 605.677.5295 From: Mike Palij [m...@nyu.edu] Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2013 11:17 AM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Cc: Michael Palij Subject: Re: [tips] Would You Take S#!t From Anybody? Dear Beth, *Mea Culpa mode on* I want to say to Beth and anyone else that I may have offended with my post on Taking S#!t from others, I am sincerely sorry that I have offended you and will endeavor in the future to more tightly monitor my behavior/writing and edit out anything that anyone could possibly find offensive. I hope that you can find it within yourselves to accept my apologies. I would just like to note that the main point of the post was that Taking S#!t from others appears to be a good thing though some people might find Taking S#!t offensive and/or juvenile. In which case, don't take any s#!t from anyone. *Mea Culpa mode off* So, I think I will go away now, pick up a copy of one of Albert Ellis' books and try to find out why I am responsible for other people's feeling and how to deal with folks who need a humor implant. -Mike Palij New York University m...@nyu.edu P.S. To Prof. Sylvester: life is unfair, and then you live in Daytona Beach. -- Original Message - On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 07:12:48 -0800, Beth Benoit wrote: Mike, I know it's pretty hard to resist the temptation to make scatological jokes about this, but believe me, people with severe Crohn's and ulcerative colitis who are undergoing this treatment get very tired of it. Also, you misread the cause of the illness: it's not always a result of taking antibiotics but from *Clostridium difficile* infections that aren't cured by antibiotics. If you are terribly sick all the time, wasting away, occasionally having accidents in public and feel you'd rather die than continue to live like that, you'll try anything rather than endure a helpless and hopeless chronic inflammatory disease. As disgusting as it may sound to the uninitiated, it's beginning to get a decent track record, as the article stated. Proctologists and gastroenterologists endure a lifetime of childish jokes like this, but point out that the gut is a fascinating thing to study and marvel at it. I suggest that on a professional website like ours, we don't need to make juvenile jokes about this, and might consider empathy for people who will potentially profit from this treatment. Beth Benoit Granite State College Plymouth State University New Hampshire On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 8:43 AM, Mike Palij m...@nyu.edu wrote: Some new medical research shows that for people with gastrointestinal illness arising from the use of antibiotics appear to do much better after a fecal transplant. I kid you not. The NY Times has an article that provides a popular media account
Re: [tips] Would You Take S#!t From Anybody?
This actually came at a good time. I am introducing my Brain and Behavior students to the concept of critical thinking. I was able to mention this article because, although it sounds repulsive, as Beth notes, many people are desperate for a cure--especially c. diff sufferers (a number that will likely grow), and may in fact hold promise. I was able to contrast this with why the Willowbrook study was unethical along with suggestions that we look at what we find online (e.g., peroxide drips or urine therapy) with a very critical--but unbiased eye. Without passing any sort of judgment on an article that I have not fully read, it provided a great example for critical thinking. Carol On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 11:17 AM, Mike Palij m...@nyu.edu wrote: Dear Beth, *Mea Culpa mode on* I want to say to Beth and anyone else that I may have offended with my post on Taking S#!t from others, I am sincerely sorry that I have offended you and will endeavor in the future to more tightly monitor my behavior/writing and edit out anything that anyone could possibly find offensive. I hope that you can find it within yourselves to accept my apologies. I would just like to note that the main point of the post was that Taking S#!t from others appears to be a good thing though some people might find Taking S#!t offensive and/or juvenile. In which case, don't take any s#!t from anyone. *Mea Culpa mode off* So, I think I will go away now, pick up a copy of one of Albert Ellis' books and try to find out why I am responsible for other people's feeling and how to deal with folks who need a humor implant. -Mike Palij New York University m...@nyu.edu P.S. To Prof. Sylvester: life is unfair, and then you live in Daytona Beach. -- Original Message - On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 07:12:48 -0800, Beth Benoit wrote: Mike, I know it's pretty hard to resist the temptation to make scatological jokes about this, but believe me, people with severe Crohn's and ulcerative colitis who are undergoing this treatment get very tired of it. Also, you misread the cause of the illness: it's not always a result of taking antibiotics but from *Clostridium difficile* infections that aren't cured by antibiotics. If you are terribly sick all the time, wasting away, occasionally having accidents in public and feel you'd rather die than continue to live like that, you'll try anything rather than endure a helpless and hopeless chronic inflammatory disease. As disgusting as it may sound to the uninitiated, it's beginning to get a decent track record, as the article stated. Proctologists and gastroenterologists endure a lifetime of childish jokes like this, but point out that the gut is a fascinating thing to study and marvel at it. I suggest that on a professional website like ours, we don't need to make juvenile jokes about this, and might consider empathy for people who will potentially profit from this treatment. Beth Benoit Granite State College Plymouth State University New Hampshire On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 8:43 AM, Mike Palij m...@nyu.edu wrote: Some new medical research shows that for people with gastrointestinal illness arising from the use of antibiotics appear to do much better after a fecal transplant. I kid you not. The NY Times has an article that provides a popular media account of the research and can be accessed here: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/17/health/disgusting-maybe-http://www.nytimes.com/2013/**01/17/health/disgusting-maybe-** but-treatment-works-study-finds.html?_r=0pagewanted=**all http://www.nytimes.com/**2013/01/17/health/disgusting-** maybe-but-treatment-works-**study-finds.html?_r=0**pagewanted=allhttp://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/17/health/disgusting-maybe-but-treatment-works-study-finds.html?_r=0pagewanted=all There are various ways that the transplant can be done, including an old Chinese method. All I'm saying is that at lunch, avoid the yellow soup and the chocolate milk. The research article was published in the New England Journal of Medicine and the publisher has made access to the article free; see: http://www.nejm.org/doi/pdf/10.1056/NEJMoa1205037http://www.nejm.org/doi/pdf/**10.1056/NEJMoa1205037 http://**www.nejm.org/doi/pdf/10.1056/**NEJMoa1205037http://www.nejm.org/doi/pdf/10.1056/NEJMoa1205037 As with most medical procedures, don't try this at home unless you're under medical supervision. -Mike Palij New York University m...@nyu.edu P.S. For some reason this reminds me of the British movie Layer Cake in which Daniel Craig starred before he became the new James Bond. There's a scene between Craig and Michael Gambon (who played Dumbledore in the Harry Potter movies) where Gambon explain the facts of life to Craig (well, the facts of life as a senior gangster see them and tries to impress them into a younger gangster). Recent Ph.D.s desiring an academic career might benefit from viewing this
RE: [tips] Would You Take S#!t From Anybody?
I just want to make a simple point: If one had read the NY Times article, then my comment about yellow soup and chocolate milk might have seen less over the top because: (1) Quoting the NYT article: |Fecal therapy has often been used to cure gut trouble in cows |and horses. Books on traditional Chinese medicine mention |giving it to people by mouth to cure diarrhea in the fourth century; |one book called it yellow soup. I'm not sure why someone would see this as over the top given the context of the article instead of as a warning to people who use traditional Chinese medicine and alternative and complimentary medicine -- make sure you know what you're ingesting and agree to it. Consider what is one of the main components of the Chinese delicacy Bird's nest soup. For the curious, see: http://www.livescience.com/21534-edible-birds-nests-health.html (2) Quoting the NYT article: |The researchers studied adults who had been suffering from |C. difficile for months and had had at least one relapse after |antibiotics. They were picked at random to be in one of three |groups. Only one group, 16 people, had the transplant: they |took the antibiotic vancomycin for four days, had their intestines |rinsed and then had the fecal solution pumped into their small |intestines through a nose tube. A second group, 13 people, |had the intestinal wash and 14 days of vancomycin; a third group, |also 13 people, had only vancomycin. | |The donors were tested for an array of diseases to make sure |they did not infect the patients. Their specimens were mixed |with saline in a blender and strained, to produce a solution that |Dr. Keller said resembled chocolate milk. In other words, the treatment was via a nose tube and if the tube was clear, the material would have looked like chocolate milk. After reading the above passages, I think a person could have two reactions: (a) they associate disgust with yellow soup and chocolate milk or (b) they have less disgust associated with the notion of a fecal transplant, especially if one likes chocolate milk (i.e., the positive aspect of one's representation of chocolate milk dominates the negative aspects of ingesting feces). So, would one not view yellow soup and chocolate milk differently after reading those passages? -Mike Palij New York University m...@nyu.edu - Original Message --- On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 09:56:19 -0800, Douglas Peterson wrote: I'm bothered by this thread but not for the reasons expressed by Beth or Mike but by the fact that TIPS appears to have no stomach (yes, I said that on purpose) for discussing issues related to psychology and science. I was not offended by Mike's post (I thought the yellow soup/chocolate milk line was over the top) but it didn't stop me from reading the NY Times link (and eventually the the journal article). I'm troubled that the supposed offense and the supposed apology have distracted the group from discussing the types of things I came to expect TIPS to discuss. Here are the types of responses I had hoped to read in response to this post. 1) I think the use of three groups was a good example of multiple control groups to ensure that improvement was not from the preparation process (flushing/rinsing the intestine prior to treatment). I might just use it in research methods class. It also presents an interesting point to open discussion on the ethics since the researches discontinued the study because the of the ethical concern that the control group was potentially being harmed. 2) Isn't it interesting how our concept of feces as dirty inhibits, and in fact triggers a disgust response, to the point where people might resist a treatment with now published efficacy results. Is feces really all that different from blood simply because of cultural associations? Will the pharmaceutical industry develop a name that hides what it is in the medicine and at that point will people be lining up for treatment. 3) Wow, 14,000 people per year die from gastrointestinal bacteria! 4) I started thinking about my old dog, who on occasion ate other dog's poop. I use to think he was a stupid dog, but now I wonder if he wasn't just settling his gut, because as I think about it it most offen occurred after a bout of throwing up and the sickness ended. Smart dog after all. A long time reader (and seldom a contributor) who wants the TIPS of old where we can discuss issues and make jokes at the same time. --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=23122 or send a blank email to leave-23122-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
