Re:[tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
Stuart McKelvie writes: Here is a more critical assessment of the consumerism of which Steve Jobs is a part. The writer is Rabbi Jonathan Sacks. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2063546/Chief-Rabbi-blasts-late-Apple-boss-Steve-Jobs-helping-create-selfish-consumer-society.html The writer of the rather sensationally presented article in the Daily Mail is not (as Stuart I'm sure appreciated) by Rabbi Sacks, but a report of a talk he gave. A more balanced and detailed account of what he said is here: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/steve-jobs/8899737/Chief-Rabbi-blames-Apple-for-helping-create-selfish-society.html Incidentally, both newspapers erroneously state that the Chief Rabbi represents Britain's 300,000 Jews. According to Wikipedia references, as Chief Rabbi of Central Orthodox Jews, he actually represents just over 50% of those affiliated to various strands of Judaism. Given that an appreciable proportion of British Jews are secular, this means that the Chief Rabbi represents somewhat less than half of British Jews. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Jews Allen Esterson Former lecturer, Science Department Southwark College, London allenester...@compuserve.com http://www.esterson.org -- From: Stuart McKelvie smcke...@ubishops.ca Subject:RE: Re:Thank you Steve Jobs,but ... Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2011 16:30:10 -0500 Dear Tipsters, Here is a more critical assessment of the consumerism of which Steve Jobs is a part. The writer is Rabbi Jonathan Sacks. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2063546/Chief-Rabbi-blasts-late-Apple-boss-Steve-Jobs-helping-create-selfish-consumer-society.html And a follow-up clarification. http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/149901#.TtvlqXrfW1g Sincerely, Stuart --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=14647 or send a blank email to leave-14647-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
RE: Re:[tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
Dear Tipsters, Thanks, Alan, for correcting my error that the newspaper story was about Rabbi Sacks. The other account that you post is indeed more balanced and includes the fact that the good Rabbi himself owns iGadgets. Nevertheless, I think that his point about mindless consumerism is a valid one. To go one step further, and to show that Steve Jobs is only part of a bigger picture, here is ar newspaper story that takes a shot at advertising itself: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/oct/24/advertising-poison-hooked I know that companies wish to inform people about their product, but we may have become slaves to advertising. I wish to link this directly to the teaching of psychology by saying that a discussion of advertising could be a very useful part of topics such as learning and persuasion. I have to say that the reference in this story to mindless repetition rings true for me. Ebbinghaus drew our attention to this principle and we are annoyed by it (or at least I am) whenever we watch or listen to a commercially-supported TV or radio programme. Sincerely, Stuart _ Sent via Web Access Floreat Labore Recti cultus pectora roborant Stuart J. McKelvie, Ph.D., Phone: 819 822 9600 x 2402 Department of Psychology, Fax: 819 822 9661 Bishop's University, 2600 rue College, Sherbrooke, Québec J1M 1Z7, Canada. E-mail: stuart.mckel...@ubishops.ca (or smcke...@ubishops.ca) Bishop's University Psychology Department Web Page: http://www.ubishops.ca/ccc/div/soc/psy Floreat Labore ___ --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=14649 or send a blank email to leave-14649-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re:[tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
Hi In the interest of science, I'm a PC user who hasn't written negatively about Jobs ... now to fill in the remaining cells. Take care Jim James M. Clark Professor of Psychology 204-786-9757 204-774-4134 Fax j.cl...@uwinnipeg.ca Dr. Bob Wildblood drb...@rcn.com 05-Dec-11 7:01:34 AM Hypothesis: People who write critically about Steve Jobs are PC users . Robert W. Wildblood, PhD Adjunct Psychology Faculty Germanna Community College drb...@rcn.com --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: j.cl...@uwinnipeg.ca. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13251.645f86b5cec4da0a56ffea7a891720c9n=Tl=tipso=14650 or send a blank email to leave-14650-13251.645f86b5cec4da0a56ffea7a89172...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=14651 or send a blank email to leave-14651-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
Hmmm... I was looking for a teaching psychology discussion group, but apparently I've stumbled into a Mac vs PC zealotry battle over the corpse of Steve Jobs and his oil and water mix of Buddhism and marketing. Weird. Can anyone direct me to the correct room for teaching psychology discussions? Thanks! Paul (Mac zealot since 1987) On Dec 5, 2011, at 8:04 AM, Jim Clark wrote: Hi In the interest of science, I'm a PC user who hasn't written negatively about Jobs ... now to fill in the remaining cells. Take care Jim James M. Clark Professor of Psychology 204-786-9757 204-774-4134 Fax j.cl...@uwinnipeg.ca Dr. Bob Wildblood drb...@rcn.com 05-Dec-11 7:01:34 AM Hypothesis: People who write critically about Steve Jobs are PC users . Robert W. Wildblood, PhD Adjunct Psychology Faculty Germanna Community College drb...@rcn.com --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: j.cl...@uwinnipeg.ca. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13251.645f86b5cec4da0a56ffea7a891720c9n=Tl=tipso=14650 or send a blank email to leave-14650-13251.645f86b5cec4da0a56ffea7a89172...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: pcbernha...@frostburg.edu. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13441.4e79e96ebb5671bdb50111f18f263003n=Tl=tipso=14651 or send a blank email to leave-14651-13441.4e79e96ebb5671bdb50111f18f263...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=14653 or send a blank email to leave-14653-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
Or Woz fans. On Dec 5, 2011, at 7:01 AM, Dr. Bob Wildblood wrote: Hypothesis: People who write critically about Steve Jobs are PC users --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=14660 or send a blank email to leave-14660-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
Warning: message contains what could be construed as immodest boasting (is there any other kind?) On Dec 5, 2011, at 7:01 AM, Dr. Bob Wildblood wrote: Hypothesis: People who write critically about Steve Jobs are PC users I subscribe to the contrarian philosophy of stock market investing, i.e. that the time to buy is when all others are running the other way. Like all such philosophies it's undoubtedly a delusion, and I have the experiences to prove it (like Nortel, for example). But it worked once, big time, for me. That was with Apple. I have a PC. But I still appreciate Steve Jobs. Stephen Stephen L. Black, Ph.D. Professor of Psychology, Emeritus Bishop's University Sherbrooke, Quebec, Canada e-mail: sblack at ubishops.ca - --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=14661 or send a blank email to leave-14661-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
On Dec 5, 2011, at 6:39 AM, Paul C Bernhardt wrote: Hmmm... I was looking for a teaching psychology discussion group, but apparently I've stumbled into a Mac vs PC zealotry battle over the corpse of Steve Jobs and his oil and water mix of Buddhism and marketing. I've just glanced at this 'online 'article'. It looks like it may be an undergraduate research-methods project, But it does suggest that, with enough ingenuity, we can have a psychology of... just about anything. Bagley, M., Moulton, S., Rubin, E., and Ward. D. (u.d.). Are you a Mac or PC? Relationships between personality, computer stereotypes and preference. Retrieved from http://www.deborahelaine.net/documents/macorpc.pdf -- - Jeffry Ricker, Ph.D. SCC: Professor of Psychology MCCCD: General Studies Faculty Representative PSY 101 Website: http://sccpsy101.wordpress.com/ - Scottsdale Community College 9000 E. Chaparral Road Scottsdale, AZ 85256-2626 Office: SB-123 Phone: (480) 423-6213 Fax: (480) 423-6298 --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=14665 or send a blank email to leave-14665-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re:[tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
I guess the easiest way to deal with the contribution of Steve Jobs is just to quote this passage from his biographer, Walter Isaacson: The saga of Steve Jobs is the Silicon Valley creation myth write large: launching a startup in his parent's garage and building it into the world's most valuable company. He didn't invent many things outright, but he was a master at putting together ideas, art and technology in ways that invented the future. He designed the Mac after appreciating the power of graphical interfaces in a way that Xerox was unable to do, and he created the iPod after grasping the joy of having a thousand songs in your pocket in a way that Sony, which had all the assets and heritage, never could accomplish. Some leaders push innovation by being good at the big picture. Others do so by mastering details. Jobs did both, relentlessly. As a result, he launched a series of products over three decades that transformed whole industries: 1) The Apple II, which took Wosniak's circuit board and turned it into the first personal computer that was not just for hobbyists. 2) The Macintosh, which begat the home computer revolution and popularized graphic user interfaces. 3) Toy Story and other Pixar blockbusters, which opened up the miracle of digital imagination. 4) Apple stores, which reinvented the role of a store in defining a brand. 5) The iPod, which changed the way we consume music. 6) The iTunes Store, which saved the music industry 7) The iPhone, which turned mobile phones into music, photography, video, email and web devices. 8) The iPad, which launched tablet computing and offered a platform for digital newspapers, magazines, books, and videos. 9) iCloud, which demoted the computer from its central role in managing our content and let all our devices sync seamlessly. 10) And Apple itself, which Jobs considered his greatest creation, a place where imagination was nurtured, applied and executed in ways so creative that it became the most valuable company on earth. No, Steve Jobs did not invent the MP3 format. However, without the IPod, the MP3 format would have languished in the bowels of brain-dead MP3 players and the music industry would have been dead after a few years of rampant piracy. Steve Jobs brought his imagination to all these products. Without his imagination and incredible drive to change the world, we would likely still be using brain-dead products like CP/M. MSDOS, Wordstar, dBase-II, Sony Walkmans and Windows. Systat was the first stats package to try a GUI. The interface for SPSS is just plain brain dead: Legacy Menus? Steve Jobs also brought a philosophy of product development that proved incredibly successful. The software and hardware must be united. If you design using an open architecture, you design for a common element and not excellence. Bill Gates could never yell at the engineers at IBM, Dell or Gateway to make the hardware match his software. As a result, Windows was designed for the common medium, the mediocre. Jobs could demand that Bill Attkinson figure out how to layer the windows for a 9in Mac screen because all they had was 128K RAM to work with. Bill never had that control and Microsoft produced a brain-dead interface when he knew Windows could be better if he had Job's level of control. The legacy of Steve Jobs is independence, imagination and the reality distortion field. If we don't distort reality from time to time, we will remain stuck in a world of crappy, brain-dead products and systems. Mike Williams --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=14626 or send a blank email to leave-14626-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
RE: Re:[tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
Dear Tipsters, Here is a more critical assessment of the consumerism of which Steve Jobs is a part. The writer is Rabbi Jonathan Sacks. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2063546/Chief-Rabbi-blasts-late-Apple-boss-Steve-Jobs-helping-create-selfish-consumer-society.html And a follow-up clarification. http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/149901#.TtvlqXrfW1g Sincerely, Stuart _ Sent via Web Access Floreat Labore Recti cultus pectora roborant Stuart J. McKelvie, Ph.D., Phone: 819 822 9600 x 2402 Department of Psychology, Fax: 819 822 9661 Bishop's University, 2600 rue College, Sherbrooke, Québec J1M 1Z7, Canada. E-mail: stuart.mckel...@ubishops.ca (or smcke...@ubishops.ca) Bishop's University Psychology Department Web Page: http://www.ubishops.ca/ccc/div/soc/psy Floreat Labore ___ From: Mike Wiliams [jmicha5...@aol.com] Sent: 04 December 2011 16:01 To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: Re:[tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ... I guess the easiest way to deal with the contribution of Steve Jobs is just to quote this passage from his biographer, Walter Isaacson: The saga of Steve Jobs is the Silicon Valley creation myth write large: launching a startup in his parent's garage and building it into the world's most valuable company. He didn't invent many things outright, but he was a master at putting together ideas, art and technology in ways that invented the future. He designed the Mac after appreciating the power of graphical interfaces in a way that Xerox was unable to do, and he created the iPod after grasping the joy of having a thousand songs in your pocket in a way that Sony, which had all the assets and heritage, never could accomplish. Some leaders push innovation by being good at the big picture. Others do so by mastering details. Jobs did both, relentlessly. As a result, he launched a series of products over three decades that transformed whole industries: 1) The Apple II, which took Wosniak's circuit board and turned it into the first personal computer that was not just for hobbyists. 2) The Macintosh, which begat the home computer revolution and popularized graphic user interfaces. 3) Toy Story and other Pixar blockbusters, which opened up the miracle of digital imagination. 4) Apple stores, which reinvented the role of a store in defining a brand. 5) The iPod, which changed the way we consume music. 6) The iTunes Store, which saved the music industry 7) The iPhone, which turned mobile phones into music, photography, video, email and web devices. 8) The iPad, which launched tablet computing and offered a platform for digital newspapers, magazines, books, and videos. 9) iCloud, which demoted the computer from its central role in managing our content and let all our devices sync seamlessly. 10) And Apple itself, which Jobs considered his greatest creation, a place where imagination was nurtured, applied and executed in ways so creative that it became the most valuable company on earth. No, Steve Jobs did not invent the MP3 format. However, without the IPod, the MP3 format would have languished in the bowels of brain-dead MP3 players and the music industry would have been dead after a few years of rampant piracy. Steve Jobs brought his imagination to all these products. Without his imagination and incredible drive to change the world, we would likely still be using brain-dead products like CP/M. MSDOS, Wordstar, dBase-II, Sony Walkmans and Windows. Systat was the first stats package to try a GUI. The interface for SPSS is just plain brain dead: Legacy Menus? Steve Jobs also brought a philosophy of product development that proved incredibly successful. The software and hardware must be united. If you design using an open architecture, you design for a common element and not excellence. Bill Gates could never yell at the engineers at IBM, Dell or Gateway to make the hardware match his software. As a result, Windows was designed for the common medium, the mediocre. Jobs could demand that Bill Attkinson figure out how to layer the windows for a 9in Mac screen because all they had was 128K RAM to work with. Bill never had that control and Microsoft produced a brain-dead interface when he knew Windows could be better if he had Job's level of control. The legacy of Steve Jobs is independence, imagination and the reality distortion field. If we don't distort reality from time to time, we will remain stuck in a world of crappy, brain-dead products and systems. Mike Williams --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: smcke...@ubishops.ca. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13510.2cc18398df2e6692fffc29a610cb72e3n=Tl=tipso=14626 or send a blank email
Re:[tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
While those Tipsters who care can puzzle out the koan what was Steve Jobs original contribution (something that Jobs, the Zen Buddhist might have appreciated; for Jobs' Buddhism see: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/lama-surya-das/the-zen-of-steve-jobs-rig_b_1100107.html But I have to say that Jobs probably could have written a book titled Zen and the Art of Marketing and not appreciate the irony), it is useful to keep in mind where Jobs and Apple fall in the history of personal computing. Wikipedia has a nice little entry on the long history of personal computer (yadda-yadda) and it might be useful to remember that Apple was just one part of the Trinity of the late 1970s, no matter how much others might try to make Jobs out to be JC; see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_personal_computers It is somewhat surprising to find out that the first personal computer was available in 1950 and that other personal computers were subsequently available, both in kit form and complete products such as Olivetti's Programma 101 (which was shown in the 1965 World's Fair in NYC); see: http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/wsj/access/168968782.html?FMT=ABSFMTS=ABS:AIdate=Oct+15%2C+1965author=By+a+WALL+STREET+JOURNAL+Staff+Reporterpub=Wall+Street+Journal+%281923+-+Current+file%29edition=startpage=3type=historicdesc=Desk-Top+Size+Computer+Is+Being+Sold+by+Olivetti+For+First+Time+in+U.S. or http://tinyurl.com/olivettiPC -Mike Palij New York University m...@nyu.edu P.S. Consider the Jobs koan to be a variation of an older one as illustrated in the following quote: |The realization of the true nature of mind might result from the Chan |practice of the encounter dialogue, or gongan (Japanese, koan) study. |Two men came to be known as famous practitioners of this technique: |Shitou Xiqian (710-790) and Mazu Daoyi (709-788), and they would |later be recognized as the founders of two schools of Chan, Linji |(Rinzai in Japan) and Caodong (Japanese, Soto). The best known of |all encounter teachers is Linji Yixuan (d. 867), whose phrase, |If you meet the Buddha, kill him! is a familiar Chan saying. Some of |the gongan include short questions, such as, What is the sound of one |hand clapping? What was your original face before you were born? |or Does a dog have Buddha-nature? http://www.patheos.com/Library/Zen/Origins/Scriptures.html --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=14630 or send a blank email to leave-14630-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
Mike-- There's a difference between available and affordable. There were certainly 'personal' (in the sense of used by one person as opposed to a multiuser mainframe) before the Trinity. Steve Wozniak made two crucial contributions: First, a motherboard made from cheap components, with an easily usable bus. Second, a compact BASIC available in ROM (after the first machines) designed to make game programming easy. When schools started buying computers to teach basic programming, the Apple had an advantage. Apple, Commodore and Radio Shack (affectionately known as the Trash 80) made affordable and ac acessible computers. The mass market began. On Dec 4, 2011, at 7:41 PM, Mike Palij wrote: While those Tipsters who care can puzzle out the koan what was Steve Jobs original contribution (something that Jobs, the Zen Buddhist might have appreciated; for Jobs' Buddhism see: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/lama-surya-das/the-zen-of-steve-jobs-rig_b_1100107.html But I have to say that Jobs probably could have written a book titled Zen and the Art of Marketing and not appreciate the irony), it is useful to keep in mind where Jobs and Apple fall in the history of personal computing. Wikipedia has a nice little entry on the long history of personal computer (yadda-yadda) and it might be useful to remember that Apple was just one part of the Trinity of the late 1970s, no matter how much others might try to make Jobs out to be JC; see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_personal_computers It is somewhat surprising to find out that the first personal computer was available in 1950 and that other personal computers were subsequently available, both in kit form and complete products such as Olivetti's Programma 101 (which was shown in the 1965 World's Fair in NYC); see: http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/wsj/access/168968782.html?FMT=ABSFMTS=ABS:AIdate=Oct+15%2C+1965author=By+a+WALL+STREET+JOURNAL+Staff+Reporterpub=Wall+Street+Journal+%281923+-+Current+file%29edition=startpage=3type=historicdesc=Desk-Top+Size+Computer+Is+Being+Sold+by+Olivetti+For+First+Time+in+U.S. or http://tinyurl.com/olivettiPC --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=14633 or send a blank email to leave-14633-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
Yeah, and you know what else? Twitmyer demonstrated classical conditioning before Pavlov. But Pavlov, like Jobs, recognized what he had. Michael T. Scoles, Ph.D. Associate Professor of Psychology Counseling University of Central Arkansas Conway, AR 72035 501-450-5418 Mike Palij m...@nyu.edu 10/7/2011 8:25 AM On Thu, 06 Oct 2011 14:29:22 -0700. Michael Sylvester wrote: As the only mobile DJ on Tips(now performing) at Marcos El Bistro in Daytona Beach,Steve has made my job easier.The old days of carrying boxes of vinyl records to play on the the beach during Spring break took a toll on my turntables and other equipment.Even when cds emerged,it became a pain to ensure that there would be no skipping.But in this digital era,I can now store in computer files,then click and play.As facilitative playing music has become for DJ. Professor Sylvester, I have no idea what you think Steve Jobs did in terms of actual contributions to information technology (however, for a glimpse of his bullying administrative style, see this NY Times article on his style as a Boss; see: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/07/technology/steve-jobs-defended-his-work-with-a-barbed-tongue.html?nl=todaysheadlinesemc=tha26 ). If you think that Jobs was somehow influential in the development of digitally recorded music, you should clear up such misperceptions by taking a look at the Wikipedia entry (yadda-yadda) on the development of the mp3 format; see: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/07/technology/steve-jobs-defended-his-work-with-a-barbed-tongue.html?nl=todaysheadlinesemc=tha26 Jobs and Apple are conspicuous by their absence. Note that digital music in form of mp3 and other formats were widely available on the internet during the 1990s, often free (i.e., no royalties were paid to the artists or copyright holders) and Jobs just developed systems that would monetize this situation and simplify the collection of royalties as well as limit the use of the music (through the use of digital rights management or DRM). For more on the history of the iPod see the Wiki entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ipod And for DRM, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Rights_Management Again, I don't think that Jobs did not do anything technically to earn respect, he was just an overseer and marketer. Although people make a lot of noise about the Apple II, few appear to remember that that there were other systems available before Apple, notably computers running the CP/M operating system -- for those unfamiliar with CP/M, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cp/mhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cp/m Bill Gates Co would use ideas present in CP/M in their development of MS-DOS. CP/M allowed the use of serious software such as the wordprocessing program Wordstar, the spreadsheet Muliplan, Turbo Pascal, dbase II and so on. To get the Apple II to do serious work, one had to get a special processing card for it that would allow one to run CP/M on the Apple in order to use Wordstar, Multiplan, dbase II, etc. Other computers and systems at the time included the Commodore system, the Radio Shack TRS-Dos, etc. My first personal computer was a KayPro with a full software package (Wordstar, dbase, etc.) which made it a much better value than the Apple computers or even the early MS-DOS machines. As for the remarkable Macintosh, all one had to do was compare it next to an IBM PS/2 running the operating system OS/2 which was a powerful windowing system which even ran a windows version of SPSS that had all of the capabilities of mainframe versions (such as that on the VAX and Wylbur -- the MS-DOS SPSS-PC was a joke in comparison to OS/2 SPSS). For more background on OS/2 see Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OS/2 OS/2 is still around but in specialized application like ATM machines. Like Betamax in videotape, OS/2 did not catch on in popularity. Dr.Mike,I think though, that Steve has killed Classic rock.In fact he probably killed other music too.I do not think that there is any substitute for the old vinyl versions of classic rock-the art work on the album covers,the musicians contributing to the songs,and reading a short bio of theartist and songs. I doubt that these young kids downloading today the Eagles,the London sessions of Led Zepellin, or Traffic (Live at the canteen) or Jimi Hendrix can read about the historical background when downloading to iTunes.Some kids still believe that Woodstock was a dope and for unlawful carnal knowledge party. I really have no idea what you're talking about here. All the kool kids can get their tunes from a variety of sources, especially after the hackers and the crackers break the DRM. I may be wrong but I don't think Jobs contributed much in the way of new technology, theory, or equipment. I do believe he was an expert marketer who, like his The Big Chill (it's a movie, rent it) contemporaries, sold out his ideals for a little bit of heaven on earth for him and his own. I think he
re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
I have to agree with Michael Scoles comment: Yeah, and you know what else? Twitmyer demonstrated classical conditioning before Pavlov. But Pavlov, like Jobs, recognized what he had. Even though the first computer I worked on was an Apple II, the first I owned was an Epson QX10 running ValDocs (valuable documents) and 256K memory which I bought for $3000. Sounded like a coffee grinder, but got me through writing 2 teacher's manuals. . Robert W. Wildblood, PhD Adjunct Psychology Faculty Germanna Community College drb...@rcn.com --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=14586 or send a blank email to leave-14586-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
Re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
Wrote the first draft of my dissertation in '84-85 in a QX10, my first computer . I loved its keyboard! Prior to that in '79 -'82 , I had used Rutgers' Tandy Model IIs with the huge floppy disks (I still have a couple of them). These were eventually replaced with IBM PCs and some Apples IIs. Memories ... Miguel - Original Message - From: Dr. Bob Wildblood drb...@rcn.com To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) tips@fsulist.frostburg.edu Sent: Friday, December 2, 2011 8:15:57 PM Subject: re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ... I have to agree with Michael Scoles comment: Yeah, and you know what else? Twitmyer demonstrated classical conditioning before Pavlov. But Pavlov, like Jobs, recognized what he had. Even though the first computer I worked on was an Apple II, the first I owned was an Epson QX10 running ValDocs (valuable documents) and 256K memory which I bought for $3000. Sounded like a coffee grinder, but got me through writing 2 teacher's manuals. . Robert W. Wildblood, PhD Adjunct Psychology Faculty Germanna Community College drb...@rcn.com --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: roig-rear...@comcast.net. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13482.917fac06d4daae681dabfe964ca8c74en=Tl=tipso=14586 or send a blank email to leave-14586-13482.917fac06d4daae681dabfe964ca8c...@fsulist.frostburg.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=14587 or send a blank email to leave-14587-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
On Fri, 02 Dec 2011 16:56:57 -0800, Michael Scoles wrote: Yeah, and you know what else? Twitmyer demonstrated classical conditioning before Pavlov. But Pavlov, like Jobs, recognized what he had. First, see: Windholz, George (1986). A comparative analysis of the conditional reflex discoveries of pavlov and Twitmyer, and the birth of a paradigm. Integrative Physiological and Behavioral Science, 21(4), 141-147. Doi: 10.1007/BF02734512 Abstract: Research on conditional reflex (CR) in Pavlov's Physiological Laboratory has preceded Twitmyer's work on conditioning at the University of Pennsylvania by 3 or 4 years. The events in Pavlov's laboratory lead toward the postulation of a new paradigm that rejected the Cartesians conceptualization of the reflex as a mechanistic response to stimuli by replacing it with the Darwinian notion of the organism's adaptation to the environmental conditions. The Pavlovian paradigm rejected the Wundtian method in favor of the objective, conditional reflex method. NOTE: Pavlov gets the credit but, as Rosenzweig points out in his 1959 American Journal of Psychology article, they were many who preceded him with similar ideas. Rosenzweig's article precedes Dallenbach's in that issue which claims priority for Twitmyer. Second, complete the analogy: Twitmyer : Pavlov :: Jobs : ? What exactly is it that Jobs was supposedly first at? My guess would be self-promotion but that doesn't answer the question of what exactly he did that was so significant. If one examines the Wikipedia entry on Apple (yadda-yadda), I think one would have to admit that his biggest contributions occurred when he came back to Apple in 1996 but that was in consumer electronics and not computers. . And just one quote from the Wikipedia entry: |Steve Jobs began working on the Apple Lisa in 1978 but in 1982 |he was pushed from the Lisa team due to infighting, and took over |Jef Raskin's low-cost-computer project, the Macintosh. A turf war |broke out between Lisa's corporate shirts and Jobs' pirates over |which product would ship first and save Apple. Lisa won the race |in 1983 and became the first personal computer sold to the public |with a GUI, but was a commercial failure due to its high price tag |and limited software titles.[37] So, what was Jobs first at in terms of computers? -Mike Palij New York University m...@nyu.edu Mike Palij m...@nyu.edu 10/7/2011 8:25 AM On Thu, 06 Oct 2011 14:29:22 -0700. Michael Sylvester wrote: As the only mobile DJ on Tips(now performing) at Marcos El Bistro in Daytona Beach,Steve has made my job easier.The old days of carrying boxes of vinyl records to play on the the beach during Spring break took a toll on my turntables and other equipment.Even when cds emerged,it became a pain to ensure that there would be no skipping.But in this digital era,I can now store in computer files,then click and play.As facilitative playing music has become for DJ. Professor Sylvester, I have no idea what you think Steve Jobs did in terms of actual contributions to information technology (however, for a glimpse of his bullying administrative style, see this NY Times article on his style as a Boss; see: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/07/technology/steve-jobs-defended-his-work-with-a-barbed-tongue.html?nl=todaysheadlinesemc=tha26 ). If you think that Jobs was somehow influential in the development of digitally recorded music, you should clear up such misperceptions by taking a look at the Wikipedia entry (yadda-yadda) on the development of the mp3 format; see: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/07/technology/steve-jobs-defended-his-work-with-a-barbed-tongue.html?nl=todaysheadlinesemc=tha26 Jobs and Apple are conspicuous by their absence. Note that digital music in form of mp3 and other formats were widely available on the internet during the 1990s, often free (i.e., no royalties were paid to the artists or copyright holders) and Jobs just developed systems that would monetize this situation and simplify the collection of royalties as well as limit the use of the music (through the use of digital rights management or DRM). For more on the history of the iPod see the Wiki entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ipod And for DRM, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Rights_Management Again, I don't think that Jobs did not do anything technically to earn respect, he was just an overseer and marketer. Although people make a lot of noise about the Apple II, few appear to remember that that there were other systems available before Apple, notably computers running the CP/M operating system -- for those unfamiliar with CP/M, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cp/mhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cp/m Bill Gates Co would use ideas present in CP/M in their development of MS-DOS. CP/M allowed the use of serious software such as the wordprocessing program Wordstar, the spreadsheet Muliplan, Turbo Pascal, dbase II and so on. To get the Apple II to do serious work, one had
re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
On Thu, 06 Oct 2011 14:29:22 -0700. Michael Sylvester wrote: As the only mobile DJ on Tips(now performing) at Marcos El Bistro in Daytona Beach,Steve has made my job easier.The old days of carrying boxes of vinyl records to play on the the beach during Spring break took a toll on my turntables and other equipment.Even when cds emerged,it became a pain to ensure that there would be no skipping.But in this digital era,I can now store in computer files,then click and play.As facilitative playing music has become for DJ. Professor Sylvester, I have no idea what you think Steve Jobs did in terms of actual contributions to information technology (however, for a glimpse of his bullying administrative style, see this NY Times article on his style as a Boss; see: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/07/technology/steve-jobs-defended-his-work-with-a-barbed-tongue.html?nl=todaysheadlinesemc=tha26 ). If you think that Jobs was somehow influential in the development of digitally recorded music, you should clear up such misperceptions by taking a look at the Wikipedia entry (yadda-yadda) on the development of the mp3 format; see: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/07/technology/steve-jobs-defended-his-work-with-a-barbed-tongue.html?nl=todaysheadlinesemc=tha26 Jobs and Apple are conspicuous by their absence. Note that digital music in form of mp3 and other formats were widely available on the internet during the 1990s, often free (i.e., no royalties were paid to the artists or copyright holders) and Jobs just developed systems that would monetize this situation and simplify the collection of royalties as well as limit the use of the music (through the use of digital rights management or DRM). For more on the history of the iPod see the Wiki entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ipod And for DRM, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Rights_Management Again, I don't think that Jobs did not do anything technically to earn respect, he was just an overseer and marketer. Although people make a lot of noise about the Apple II, few appear to remember that that there were other systems available before Apple, notably computers running the CP/M operating system -- for those unfamiliar with CP/M, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cp/mhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cp/m Bill Gates Co would use ideas present in CP/M in their development of MS-DOS. CP/M allowed the use of serious software such as the wordprocessing program Wordstar, the spreadsheet Muliplan, Turbo Pascal, dbase II and so on. To get the Apple II to do serious work, one had to get a special processing card for it that would allow one to run CP/M on the Apple in order to use Wordstar, Multiplan, dbase II, etc. Other computers and systems at the time included the Commodore system, the Radio Shack TRS-Dos, etc. My first personal computer was a KayPro with a full software package (Wordstar, dbase, etc.) which made it a much better value than the Apple computers or even the early MS-DOS machines. As for the remarkable Macintosh, all one had to do was compare it next to an IBM PS/2 running the operating system OS/2 which was a powerful windowing system which even ran a windows version of SPSS that had all of the capabilities of mainframe versions (such as that on the VAX and Wylbur -- the MS-DOS SPSS-PC was a joke in comparison to OS/2 SPSS). For more background on OS/2 see Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OS/2 OS/2 is still around but in specialized application like ATM machines. Like Betamax in videotape, OS/2 did not catch on in popularity. Dr.Mike,I think though, that Steve has killed Classic rock.In fact he probably killed other music too.I do not think that there is any substitute for the old vinyl versions of classic rock-the art work on the album covers,the musicians contributing to the songs,and reading a short bio of theartist and songs. I doubt that these young kids downloading today the Eagles,the London sessions of Led Zepellin, or Traffic (Live at the canteen) or Jimi Hendrix can read about the historical background when downloading to iTunes.Some kids still believe that Woodstock was a dope and for unlawful carnal knowledge party. I really have no idea what you're talking about here. All the kool kids can get their tunes from a variety of sources, especially after the hackers and the crackers break the DRM. I may be wrong but I don't think Jobs contributed much in the way of new technology, theory, or equipment. I do believe he was an expert marketer who, like his The Big Chill (it's a movie, rent it) contemporaries, sold out his ideals for a little bit of heaven on earth for him and his own. I think he accomplished this by making products for people who have too much discretionary income and felt the need to buy toys that they really didn't need. For these reasons, when I think of Jobs and Apple Culture I am reminded of Neil Postman's book Amusing Ourselves To Death. For those unfamiliar with Postman, see the Wiki
Re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
Actually, M. Sylvester does have a point. Steve Jobs was not a technical innovator -- he was a promoter. I remember CPM and other microcomputer systems; my first computer was an AIM-65. What was different about the Apple was that: 1. It was not a kit; you unpacked it and fired it up. I got to the point that I could unpack one and get it working in five minutes. 2. It was marketed to homes, schools and businesses (the Apple III was ahead of its time here). 3. Mass marketing (plus Woz's genius at using cheap off the shelf parts) made it affordable. Again, it was not that digital music was unique. The internet in the 90's was a hobbyist thing, and downloading music didn't become a threat to the record companies for another decade. Again, what Jobs did was take a hobbyist gimmick and turn it into a mass market. So yes, it is unlikely that Michael S. would have an affordable consumer technology without Steve Jobs. Arthur C. Clarke's dictum is relevant here: 'Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.' Digital audio and video is now magic as far as consumers are concerned. On Oct 7, 2011, at 8:25 AM, Mike Palij wrote: On Thu, 06 Oct 2011 14:29:22 -0700. Michael Sylvester wrote: As the only mobile DJ on Tips(now performing) at Marcos El Bistro in Daytona Beach,Steve has made my job easier.The old days of carrying boxes of vinyl records to play on the the beach during Spring break took a toll on my turntables and other equipment.Even when cds emerged,it became a pain to ensure that there would be no skipping.But in this digital era,I can now store in computer files,then click and play.As facilitative playing music has become for DJ. Professor Sylvester, I have no idea what you think Steve Jobs did in terms of actual contributions to information technology (however, for a glimpse of his bullying administrative style, see this NY Times article on his style as a Boss; see: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/07/technology/steve-jobs-defended-his-work-with-a-barbed-tongue.html?nl=todaysheadlinesemc=tha26 ). If you think that Jobs was somehow influential in the development of digitally recorded music, you should clear up such misperceptions by taking a look at the Wikipedia entry (yadda-yadda) on the development of the mp3 format; see: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/07/technology/steve-jobs-defended-his-work-with-a-barbed-tongue.html?nl=todaysheadlinesemc=tha26 Jobs and Apple are conspicuous by their absence. Note that digital music in form of mp3 and other formats were widely available on the internet during the 1990s, often free (i.e., no royalties were paid to the artists or copyright holders) and Jobs just developed systems that would monetize this situation and simplify the collection of royalties as well as limit the use of the music (through the use of digital rights management or DRM). For more on the history of the iPod see the Wiki entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ipod And for DRM, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Rights_Management Again, I don't think that Jobs did not do anything technically to earn respect, he was just an overseer and marketer. Although people make a lot of noise about the Apple II, few appear to remember that that there were other systems available before Apple, notably computers running the CP/M operating system -- for those unfamiliar with CP/M, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cp/mhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cp/m Bill Gates Co would use ideas present in CP/M in their development of MS-DOS. CP/M allowed the use of serious software such as the wordprocessing program Wordstar, the spreadsheet Muliplan, Turbo Pascal, dbase II and so on. To get the Apple II to do serious work, one had to get a special processing card for it that would allow one to run CP/M on the Apple in order to use Wordstar, Multiplan, dbase II, etc. Other computers and systems at the time included the Commodore system, the Radio Shack TRS-Dos, etc. My first personal computer was a KayPro with a full software package (Wordstar, dbase, etc.) which made it a much better value than the Apple computers or even the early MS-DOS machines. As for the remarkable Macintosh, all one had to do was compare it next to an IBM PS/2 running the operating system OS/2 which was a powerful windowing system which even ran a windows version of SPSS that had all of the capabilities of mainframe versions (such as that on the VAX and Wylbur -- the MS-DOS SPSS-PC was a joke in comparison to OS/2 SPSS). For more background on OS/2 see Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OS/2 OS/2 is still around but in specialized application like ATM machines. Like Betamax in videotape, OS/2 did not catch on in popularity. Dr.Mike,I think though, that Steve has killed Classic rock.In fact he probably killed other music too.I do not think that there is any substitute for the old vinyl versions of classic
RE: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
My father gave my husband and me an Osbourne computer for a wedding present in 1982. It ran straight out of the box, was self contained, portable, (my husband took it to the law library on a regular basis), was a CPM system, ran word star, a spread sheet, and I don't recall what else. We used it until it ate my Master's thesis twice. My older brother still has it in his attic and if the floppies haven't completely fallen apart, my guess is that it would still run- although the tiny 6 inch or so screen would make us all crazy (or maybe not-bigger than an IPOD touch)! Leah Leah Adams-Curtis Director of Assessment Knox College 2 East South Street Galesburg, IL 61401-4999 309-341-7260 -Original Message- From: Brandon, Paul K [mailto:paul.bran...@mnsu.edu] Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 9:44 AM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: Re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ... Actually, M. Sylvester does have a point. Steve Jobs was not a technical innovator -- he was a promoter. I remember CPM and other microcomputer systems; my first computer was an AIM-65. What was different about the Apple was that: 1. It was not a kit; you unpacked it and fired it up. I got to the point that I could unpack one and get it working in five minutes. 2. It was marketed to homes, schools and businesses (the Apple III was ahead of its time here). 3. Mass marketing (plus Woz's genius at using cheap off the shelf parts) made it affordable. Again, it was not that digital music was unique. The internet in the 90's was a hobbyist thing, and downloading music didn't become a threat to the record companies for another decade. Again, what Jobs did was take a hobbyist gimmick and turn it into a mass market. So yes, it is unlikely that Michael S. would have an affordable consumer technology without Steve Jobs. Arthur C. Clarke's dictum is relevant here: 'Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.' Digital audio and video is now magic as far as consumers are concerned. On Oct 7, 2011, at 8:25 AM, Mike Palij wrote: On Thu, 06 Oct 2011 14:29:22 -0700. Michael Sylvester wrote: As the only mobile DJ on Tips(now performing) at Marcos El Bistro in Daytona Beach,Steve has made my job easier.The old days of carrying boxes of vinyl records to play on the the beach during Spring break took a toll on my turntables and other equipment.Even when cds emerged,it became a pain to ensure that there would be no skipping.But in this digital era,I can now store in computer files,then click and play.As facilitative playing music has become for DJ. Professor Sylvester, I have no idea what you think Steve Jobs did in terms of actual contributions to information technology (however, for a glimpse of his bullying administrative style, see this NY Times article on his style as a Boss; see: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/07/technology/steve-jobs-defended-his-work- with-a-barbed-tongue.html?nl=todaysheadlinesemc=tha26 ). If you think that Jobs was somehow influential in the development of digitally recorded music, you should clear up such misperceptions by taking a look at the Wikipedia entry (yadda-yadda) on the development of the mp3 format; see: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/07/technology/steve-jobs-defended-his-work- with-a-barbed-tongue.html?nl=todaysheadlinesemc=tha26 Jobs and Apple are conspicuous by their absence. Note that digital music in form of mp3 and other formats were widely available on the internet during the 1990s, often free (i.e., no royalties were paid to the artists or copyright holders) and Jobs just developed systems that would monetize this situation and simplify the collection of royalties as well as limit the use of the music (through the use of digital rights management or DRM). For more on the history of the iPod see the Wiki entry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ipod And for DRM, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Rights_Management Again, I don't think that Jobs did not do anything technically to earn respect, he was just an overseer and marketer. Although people make a lot of noise about the Apple II, few appear to remember that that there were other systems available before Apple, notably computers running the CP/M operating system -- for those unfamiliar with CP/M, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cp/mhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cp/m Bill Gates Co would use ideas present in CP/M in their development of MS-DOS. CP/M allowed the use of serious software such as the wordprocessing program Wordstar, the spreadsheet Muliplan, Turbo Pascal, dbase II and so on. To get the Apple II to do serious work, one had to get a special processing card for it that would allow one to run CP/M on the Apple in order to use Wordstar, Multiplan, dbase II, etc. Other computers and systems at the time included the Commodore system, the Radio Shack TRS-Dos, etc. My first personal computer was a KayPro with a full
RE: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
For me it's about design. From the start (well, mostly from the start) Apple make working with technology a different experience; it was more than a mere tool. It was pretty. As psychologists I wonder if we aren't minimizing the import of what it means to work with a beige box and bad graphics (if any graphics at all) versus working with an interesting interface in an elegant machine that's just, well, *pretty*. I just think there's something that Apple (and Jobs) recognized from the start: people have a relationship to their tools, and a good-looking, slick tool is more fun to work with than something that looks like a packing crate. I know this is true of me and my cooking tools. I enjoy chopping vegetables because I have a fine set of knives: aside from the fact that they work exceedingly well, they're elegant and nice to look at, nice to hold. I have a different relationship with those knives than I do with, say, my flatware. I wonder if Jobs wasn't onto the idea that people can have more than working relationships with their tools, but rather can have an emotional connection to them. m PS That said, I'm a Linux guy and work now with black boxes that I make myself. PPS But I do have an iPhone. -- Marc Carter, PhD Associate Professor of Psychology Chair, Department of Behavioral and Health Sciences College of Arts Sciences Baker University -- -Original Message- From: Leah Adams-Curtis [mailto:lcur...@knox.edu] Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 11:06 AM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: RE: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ... My father gave my husband and me an Osbourne computer for a wedding present in 1982. It ran straight out of the box, was self contained, portable, (my husband took it to the law library on a regular basis), was a CPM system, ran word star, a spread sheet, and I don't recall what else. We used it until it ate my Master's thesis twice. My older brother still has it in his attic and if the floppies haven't completely fallen apart, my guess is that it would still run- although the tiny 6 inch or so screen would make us all crazy (or maybe not-bigger than an IPOD touch)! Leah Leah Adams-Curtis Director of Assessment Knox College 2 East South Street Galesburg, IL 61401-4999 309-341-7260 -Original Message- From: Brandon, Paul K [mailto:paul.bran...@mnsu.edu] Sent: Friday, October 07, 2011 9:44 AM To: Teaching in the Psychological Sciences (TIPS) Subject: Re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ... Actually, M. Sylvester does have a point. Steve Jobs was not a technical innovator -- he was a promoter. I remember CPM and other microcomputer systems; my first computer was an AIM-65. What was different about the Apple was that: 1. It was not a kit; you unpacked it and fired it up. I got to the point that I could unpack one and get it working in five minutes. 2. It was marketed to homes, schools and businesses (the Apple III was ahead of its time here). 3. Mass marketing (plus Woz's genius at using cheap off the shelf parts) made it affordable. Again, it was not that digital music was unique. The internet in the 90's was a hobbyist thing, and downloading music didn't become a threat to the record companies for another decade. Again, what Jobs did was take a hobbyist gimmick and turn it into a mass market. So yes, it is unlikely that Michael S. would have an affordable consumer technology without Steve Jobs. Arthur C. Clarke's dictum is relevant here: 'Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.' Digital audio and video is now magic as far as consumers are concerned. On Oct 7, 2011, at 8:25 AM, Mike Palij wrote: On Thu, 06 Oct 2011 14:29:22 -0700. Michael Sylvester wrote: As the only mobile DJ on Tips(now performing) at Marcos El Bistro in Daytona Beach,Steve has made my job easier.The old days of carrying boxes of vinyl records to play on the the beach during Spring break took a toll on my turntables and other equipment.Even when cds emerged,it became a pain to ensure that there would be no skipping.But in this digital era,I can now store in computer files,then click and play.As facilitative playing music has become for DJ. Professor Sylvester, I have no idea what you think Steve Jobs did in terms of actual contributions to information technology (however, for a glimpse of his bullying administrative style, see this NY Times article on his style as a Boss; see: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/07/technology/steve-jobs-defended-his- work- with-a-barbed-tongue.html?nl=todaysheadlinesemc=tha26 ). If you think that Jobs was somehow influential in the development of digitally recorded music, you should clear up such misperceptions by taking a look at the Wikipedia entry (yadda-yadda) on the development of the mp3 format; see: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/07/technology/steve
Re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
Mike-- I wouldn't disagree with your characterization of Jobs -- I was always a Woz fan. And I never said that microcomputer systems were not commercially _available_. My point is that they were not widely marketed. The two prices I see in your post are $30,000 and $10,000; quite a bit more than the Apple ][! There was a low price competitor; the Commodore computers (I had a Commodore 64). However, it was not nearly as well marketed as the Apple, and dropped out of the race. What's missing in your number are sales figures. On Oct 7, 2011, at 11:48 AM, Mike Palij wrote: Fri, 07 Oct 2011 07:43:52 -0700, Paul K Brandon wrote: Actually, M. Sylvester does have a point. Steve Jobs was not a technical innovator -- he was a promoter. Yes, just like P.T. Barnum. I remember CPM and other microcomputer systems; my first computer was an AIM-65. What was different about the Apple was that: [snip] It might be useful to review the history of the development of the microcomputer and who did what when. One sources in the following: http://pctimeline.info/ The key points to note are that there were commercially available microcomputer systems available as early as November 1971. Quoting from the website: |November | |In major trade publications including Electronic News, Intel officially |introduces the MCS-4 (Microcomputer System 4-bit) microcomputer |system. It is comprised of the 4001 ROM chip, 4002 RAM chip, |4003 shift register chip, and the 4004 microprocessor. Clock speed |of the CPU is 108 kHz. Performance is 60,000 operations per second. |It uses 2300 transistors, based on 10-micron technology. It can address |4 kB memory via a 4-bit bus. Initial price is US$200. Documentation |manuals were written by Adam Osborne. The die for the chip measures |3x4 mm. [9] [62] [176.74] [202.165] [266.14] [296] [393.6] [556.11] |[900] [953.28] [1254.78] [1280.41] (108 kHz [1233.135]) (1972 [339.86]) NOTE: I believe that the Adam Osborne named above is the same Osborne who in the 1980s released one of the first suitcase size luggable microcomputers which Compaq would go on to perfect for the business market. KayPro computers were competitors. Although Bill Gates Co were busy at this time in this area, so were many others, including hobbyists who were forming clubs to build microcomputers, as shown in the following quote: [March 5, 1975] |Fred Moore and Gordon French hold the first meeting of a new |microcomputer hobbyist's club in French's garage, in Menlo Park, |California. 32 people meet, including Bob Albrect, Steve Dompier, |Lee Felsenstein, Bob Marsh, Tom Pittman, Marty Spergel, Alan Baum, |and Steven Wozniak*. Bob Albrect shows off an Altair, |and Steve Dompier reports on MITS, and how they had 4000 orders |for the Altair. (After a few meetings, the club is given the nickname |Homebrew Computer Club.) [185.110] [266.104] [301.55] |[346.18] [353.200] [346.257] [930.31] [1149.98] [1298.187] |[1299.80] [2322] [2605.4] (April [208.67] [266.39]) NOTE: Emphasis added for The Woz. In 1976 Wozniak and Jobs finally complete work on the Apple I which was available in kit form: Quoting: [July 1976] |The Apple I computer board is sold in kit form, and delivered to stores |by Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak. Price: US$666.66. [46] [218] [593.350] Later in 1976: |Steve Jobs shows the Apple II prototype to Commodore Business |Machines representatives, offers to sell company for $100,000 cash, |stock, and $36,000 per year salaries for himself and Steve Wozniak. No |deal can be reached. [2605.9] However, it might be useful to keep the following in mind: [May 1976] |In Japan, IBM Japan announces the IBM 5100 desktop system, with |5-inch monochrome display. Price is about US$10,000. [902.146] and [June 1976] |Wang Laboratories announces a word-processing system using advanced |computer technology, rather than traditional electromechanical devices. |The price is US$30,000, more than twice that of the most expensive |competitor's word-processor. [716.175] NOTE: IBM would create a similar word-processing only system to market against Wang but which would become obsolete with IBM PCs become available at a much lower price with much greater processing capabilities. [snip] The internet in the 90's was a hobbyist thing, and downloading music didn't become a threat to the record companies for another decade. I don't follow you here. People with access to the internet (i.e., undergraduates mostly at universities with Arpanet connections) freely exchanged all sort of digital material. With the creation of Usenet binary files containing program code, pictures, sound, music, etc., were readily available on a worldwide basis; all one had to do was have an internet account, a usenet reader program, and find for the alt.binaries.* groups (private networks like Prodigy, compuserve,
Re: [tips] Thank you Steve Jobs,but ...........
On Fri, 07 Oct 2011 09:57:37 -0700, Paul K Brandon wrote: Mike-- I wouldn't disagree with your characterization of Jobs -- I was always a Woz fan. But only Jobs is now seen as the Grand Creator. And I never said that microcomputer systems were not commercially _available_. My point is that they were not widely marketed. The two prices I see in your post are $30,000 and $10,000; quite a bit more than the Apple ][! These were systems for businesses. Wang might sound unfamiliar now but it was one of the BIG providers of word processing systems to professionals like lawyers, accountants, corporations, etc. back in the day. A law firm would have looked pretty ridiculous with an Apple II on a desk (even if they had the 80 column CP/M card in it). There was a low price competitor; the Commodore computers (I had a Commodore 64). There were many other systems available back then -- it's times like this that make me wish I hadn't thrown away by decades of Byte magazine -- but here is a good listing of what was available back then: http://www.classiccmp.org/dunfield/index.htm Even the old Timex Sinclair (which I owned) is there! Check it out! However, it was not nearly as well marketed as the Apple, and dropped out of the race. What's missing in your number are sales figures. I don't have the sales figures but by the mid-1980s IBM was crushing the competition with PC/MS-DOS and the PS/1 systems. Macintoshs always ran a distant second because businesses simply didn't buy them (remember that Apple almost died in 1990s until Jobs came back and changed it from a computer company to a consumer electronics and entertainment company). -Mike Palij New York University m...@nyu.edu --- You are currently subscribed to tips as: arch...@jab.org. To unsubscribe click here: http://fsulist.frostburg.edu/u?id=13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df5d5n=Tl=tipso=13220 or send a blank email to leave-13220-13090.68da6e6e5325aa33287ff385b70df...@fsulist.frostburg.edu
