Re: Topband: Radial wire
On 9/4/2018 8:53 PM, K9FD wrote: Beware .. in some soils the aluminum wire disappears in a short time, In ILL had aluminum wire down and it just corroded away and left nothing Agreed, but if your soil permits, it works. YMMV. I did try to obtain insulated aluminum wire but could not obtain it except in very large gauges. 73 Rick N6RK _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: RE topband Leaving
Okay, bear with me... Perhaps we here ought to have a Code Of Conduct. Something along the lines as this one: https://stackoverflow.com/help/behavior https://stackoverflow.com/conduct I am one of the three moderators on ham.stackexchange.com. Now, that site is not a forum or a reflector, but I gar-run-tee you that none of this bickering and (fill in your own definition of inappropriate behavior here) is tolerated there. Here's the gist of that Code of Conduct: *Unacceptable Behavior* *No subtle put-downs or unfriendly language.* Even if you don’t intend it, this can have a negative impact on others. *No name-calling or personal attacks*. Focus on the content, not the person. This includes terms that feel personal even when they're applied to content (e.g. “lazy”). *No bigotry*. We don’t tolerate any language likely to offend or alienate people based on race, gender, sexual orientation, or religion — and those are just a few examples. When in doubt, just don’t. *No harassment*. This includes, but isn’t limited to: bullying, intimidation, vulgar language, direct or indirect threats, sexually suggestive remarks, patterns of inappropriate social contact, and sustained disruptions of discussion. *Enforcement* We take your reports seriously. Those who don’t follow the Code of Conduct in good faith may face repercussions deemed appropriate by our moderation team. This is how moderators generally handle misconduct: *1. Warning* For most first-time misconduct, moderators will remove offending content and send a warning. Most issues are resolved here. *2. Account Suspension* For repetitive misconduct or behavior containing harassment, bigotry, or abuse, moderators will impose a temporary suspension (one day or more, depending on the violation). *3. Account Expulsion* For very rare cases, moderators will expel people who display a pattern of harmful destructive behavior toward our community. All actions will be taken on a case-by-case basis at the discretion of our moderators. ... We created this Code of Conduct because it reinforces the respect that we, as a community, expect from one another. Having a code also provides us with clear avenues to correct our culture should it stray off-course. *Why shouldn't we have something like that here, my friends?* - Actually, Dennis, I miss Tom. I learned an awful lot from him. He founded Ameritron, helped to design the MFJ-259B antenna analyzer and a lot of other items in the MFJ catalog. I agree with what you say, but he calmed down a lot before he left One of the hams that used to constantly pick and argue with Tom actually made a point of hunting him down for the sole purpose of getting him upset. (!) He took some kind of sadistic pleasure in doing it! I know for an absolute fact that is true, because when I emailed this person politely asking him about it, he plainly told me this. (Any questions about this person's identity will be immediately trashed). With an ENFORCED "be nice" policy here *with consequences for the kind of behavior we see here*, Tom would probably still be here. I am *not* campaigning to be moderator here. Make your own judgements, and decide for yourselves whether these suggestions would make this Topband Reflector a better place or not. 73 SK CL, Mike www.w0btu.com ham.stackexchange.com moderator On Tue, Sep 4, 2018, 2:31 PM Dennis OConnor via Topband < topband@contesting.com> wrote: > Well, I have been gone a few years (spent time partially paralyzed and few > other minor impediments) but when I come back nothing has changed. > Yeah, Tom headed off into the distance. He sure did like to argue. What > made those arguing with him go ballistic is he is often/mostly right on > technical subjects. He just did not have the ability to shrug, decide the > other guy was an idiot and let it go. > What I do notice about leavers is they seem to feel sorry for themselves, > feel they are abused, yadda yadda. Unless you have the stature of a Tom you > won't even be mentioned by two weeks from now so feeling Noble is a waste > of emotion. > I participate in a few forums, ham antennas, contesting, boating, > aircraft, photography, farming, astronomy, etc. I have lots of hobbies - > remember, he who dies with the most wins.. I can tell you from long long > experience that to be in any hobby forum you need to grow a thick skin. If > someone really irritates you, don't read him. > > If you have had your say and he keeps coming back at you and digging, just > drop it. Refuse to post any further on the topic. If you can't control > yourself then block the thread. Let him declare victory, hold a parade, and > sail for home. That is how the self declared winners of any war end it.In > my case I don't know what the hoo-haa over millennials (whatever the hell > they are) is about, don't care, don't want to know, and not gonna look up > the thread. See, I don't have any stress > (I cause it) > > To the OP on this
Re: Topband: Radial wire
Beware .. in some soils the aluminum wire disappears in a short time, In ILL had aluminum wire down and it just corroded away and left nothing but lot of noise as the "joints" went bad. Merv K9FD On 9/4/2018 4:36 PM, Jeff Draughn wrote: I’m looking for suggestions for radial wire that will lay as flat as possible. I realize that’s probably what everyone is looking for, however See: http://www.alcotec.com/us/en/products/tie-wire.cfm Rick N6RK _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: Radial wire
On 9/4/2018 4:36 PM, Jeff Draughn wrote: I’m looking for suggestions for radial wire that will lay as flat as possible. I realize that’s probably what everyone is looking for, however See: http://www.alcotec.com/us/en/products/tie-wire.cfm Rick N6RK _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: Radial wire
On 9/4/2018 4:36 PM, Jeff Draughn wrote: I’m looking for suggestions for radial wire that will lay as flat as possible. I realize that’s probably what everyone is looking for, however I once ordered some dead soft pure aluminum wire and it was as soft as "butter" :-) Even softer than solder. The alloy was something like 1100. Unfortunately, I don't have the vendor info handy. You sometimes see this wire used to strap toys to a cardboard display box. It is called "tie wire" for obvious reasons. Wasn't expensive either, like a penny a foot. It was way more limp than aluminum electric fence wire as found at any farm supply. Hope that helps. 73 Rick N6RK _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: Radial wire
I used 6300' of radial wire from DX Engineering. The great thing about it is that it lays flat on top of the ground without snarling upno need to stretch it...just roll it out. Don’t take it sideways off the reel...unroll the reel. I scalped the grass around the vertical and then used lawn staples from DXE to be sure they stayed down while the grass grew over them. They have been out there for 8 years and I mow over them with no problem. Stranded copper with some sort of tough UV resistant insulation. 73 David Harmon K6XYZ Sperry, OK -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Draughn Sent: Tuesday, September 4, 2018 6:37 PM To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Topband: Radial wire I’m looking for suggestions for radial wire that will lay as flat as possible. I realize that’s probably what everyone is looking for, however I have used the wire from the big box stores THHN etc. and it always has that permanent curl to it or permanent for a good long while. Anyone know of anything that is very flexible right out of the gate test lead wire comes to mind but probably too expensive. Thanks Jeff, N0OST _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: Radial wire
On Tue, 4 Sep 2018 18:36:54 -0500 Jeff Draughn wrote: > I’m looking for suggestions for radial wire that will lay as flat as > possible. I realize that’s probably what everyone is looking for, > however I have used the wire from the big box stores THHN etc. and it > always has that permanent curl to it or permanent for a good long > while. > > Anyone know of anything that is very flexible right out of the gate > test lead wire comes to mind but probably too expensive. > Thanks > Jeff, N0OST > _ > Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband Hi Jeff There are many, it all depends on what you want to do and how much of a radial system you want. The easy one that comes to mind is https://tinyurl.com/y7ydu5wj I have used aluminum siding in the past works well, takes time and work to connect it together. There are many others that have done this with their 3 or 4 etc squares antennae too. Cheers AJ___ VE3HJ _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: Radial wire
Hi Jeff, I use 14 AWG THHN stranded wire for temporary radials laying on the ground. Its lays flat. www.wireandcableyourway.com/14-awg-thhn-stranded-building-wire-500ft-or-2500ft-spool.html 73 Frank W3LPL - Original Message - From: "Jeff Draughn" To: topband@contesting.com Sent: Tuesday, September 4, 2018 11:36:54 PM Subject: Topband: Radial wire I’m looking for suggestions for radial wire that will lay as flat as possible. I realize that’s probably what everyone is looking for, however I have used the wire from the big box stores THHN etc. and it always has that permanent curl to it or permanent for a good long while. Anyone know of anything that is very flexible right out of the gate test lead wire comes to mind but probably too expensive. Thanks Jeff, N0OST _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Topband: Radial wire
I’m looking for suggestions for radial wire that will lay as flat as possible. I realize that’s probably what everyone is looking for, however I have used the wire from the big box stores THHN etc. and it always has that permanent curl to it or permanent for a good long while. Anyone know of anything that is very flexible right out of the gate test lead wire comes to mind but probably too expensive. Thanks Jeff, N0OST _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: Leaving
On Sun, 2 Sep 2018 23:09:21 -0400 Nick Maslon - K1NZ wrote: > Hi all, > > While I have enjoyed many of the technical topics of the list, I have > become rather annoyed by the blame that has repeatedly come across the > reflector. From the FT8 arguments in addition to the "millennials > causing the WWV shutdown" argument, it appears that the parts of the > hobby that I enjoy do not cross paths with those on the topband > reflector. Although I wish you all many CW DX, it appears that I am > no longer welcome and that I must take my leave. I just wish that you > guys would realize that your sandbox is everyone's sandbox and that > there is room for everyone in the hobby and not just the "good ole > boys" who have been around for 40+ years. 73 from a 27 year old ham, > DE K1NZ > Hi Nick Hope you have not left yet, have a read. Just an example of people as they can be. All organizations grow; as this happens some individuals want to control, take credit for, manage, meddle, moderate people, interfere, direct their agenda, guide, regulate, police you and me, you name it. This is happening behind your proverbium backs. They are so good at manipulating people that it takes time for us to see it. ( sometime a very long time) Hence forth personalities clash and some leave in total disgust, some people are asked to take sides; then some wait to see the progression! Personally I’d say change is inevitable and good in most cases... Problem is when some individuals decide to tell a person that has spent their hard earned money to setup a system and then told that they are not going to get paid after they where promised to be paid. ( oh we will decide what we will pay you.) And then take it upon themselves to persuade people and ask them to rescind a decision that was made by unanimous vote; that is so wrong on so many accounts. This just an example of how some people operate sad to say, they will pit friend against friend and foe against foe. . . .etc etc etc. Here's the way around it, reply not to those that upset you if you can. Ignore the manipulators. And follow where you enjoy and the disarrangement can be left to disregard. There are many other aspects that could be added in but I figured this covers most of them. This may or may not show up in the post since it has nothing to do with TOP BAND directly but does totally indirectly. I hope you decide to stay in the fraternity, there is so much technology to learn. I have been around a long time and still learning. There are some very smart people on here. As a further note most advancement have come from disagreements and conflict of value. So try and disseminate the facts from fiction; sometimes it is very very hard for literal people to do this. Sincerely___Andrew_S._Jancik (orig~1968edit) IIRC this is edit 27 since I needed to blow off some steam. I truly hope this was what you are doing. My peace thanks. . . No I am not looking for a pen pal, my beautiful wife keeps me very busy. _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: RE topband Leaving
My 2 cents on the issue and nobody is going to give me that much for my thoughts, is... When someone leaves in anger, rejection, assertiveness, (Fit in your favorite adjective), There are two winners and two losers: One wins because they left on their terms, the other wins because "Thank God they're gone". One loses because they will no longer learn from the others and the other because they loose future food for thought. So to me, & back to my two worthless pence, it is a wash as to win or lose when someone leaves, but nobody gains and therein is to me, the loss of value to the whole thing. 73, Gary KA1J _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: Air wound coil
Joe and others, Thanks for your helpful information. So, this will not be a
difficult project at all. I have a pretty decent start on my radial system -
only need to put down 10 more or so. I am kind of fired up about getting back
on 160. It’s been a long time (40 years) since I was on the band. I am a little
concerned that the only time there is solid activity these days is during the
major contests. But, I can always fire up JT-8 if no activity or too much QRN.
Thanks again for all the assistance! Dick W5AK
> On Sep 4, 2018, at 2:00 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:
>
>
> > On 2018-09-04 1:18 PM, Richard Beerman wrote:
>> Rick and Bob, Thanks for such swift replies. Looks like I should try to
>> reinforce the 3/8” tubing (it’s pretty short) with a wood dowel or
>> perhaps with smaller or larger aluminum tubing.
> Unless you want to redesign the antenna's taper schedule, I would simply
> get a piece of 1/4" tubing and place inside the entire length of the
> 3/8" tip section. Then I would use 3, 4 or 6 top wires - make them 18
> or 20 gauge for strength. Arrange them equally around the vertical and
> clamp them to the tip section with a SS band ("worm") clamp.
>
> Since the 3/8" section is only 36" long (only 24" exposed), I would
> strongly consider attaching the top wires at the junction between
> the 1/2" and 3/8" sections ... at worst the top wires will be 24"
> longer than they would had they been at the very top.
>
> 73,
>
> ... Joe, W4TV
>
>
> On 2018-09-04 1:18 PM, Richard Beerman wrote:
>> Rick and Bob, Thanks for such swift replies. Looks like I should try to
>> reinforce the 3/8” tubing (it’s pretty short) with a wood dowel or perhaps
>> with smaller or larger aluminum tubing. Then the fishing line method should
>> be a perfect solution using 24 or 26 gauge wire. Using this method, I think
>> a hairpin loop at the base of the vertical will help me achieve resonance.
>> Thanks again. Dick W5AK
>
>
_
Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: RE topband Leaving
Hi:) I don't comment much but I would like to relate a lesson from early in my life. The kid across the street would bring his ball and bat over to our farm and we (I am in a *large* family) played baseball all summer. There was no such thing as softball even though thats what we used. The neighbor boy decided that since it was his ball and bat he should be allowed some indefinite number of strikes. Oy. We refused. He told us "Okay then I am taking *my* ball and bat and going home." He stormed out of our back yard. Next day we were out there playing with our own ball and bat. It took him about five minutes to come over and ask if he could play with us :) Nobody ever mentioned his attitude from the previous day. I think we all learned something from that. It applies to this very day. Dennis hit it pretty close on this one. Nobody with an attitude is going to punish us by taking their ball and bat home with them. It just won't play out that way. 73, Bill KU8H On 09/04/2018 03:30 PM, Dennis OConnor via Topband wrote: Well, I have been gone a few years (spent time partially paralyzed and few other minor impediments) but when I come back nothing has changed. Yeah, Tom headed off into the distance. He sure did like to argue. What made those arguing with him go ballistic is he is often/mostly right on technical subjects. He just did not have the ability to shrug, decide the other guy was an idiot and let it go. What I do notice about leavers is they seem to feel sorry for themselves, feel they are abused, yadda yadda. Unless you have the stature of a Tom you won't even be mentioned by two weeks from now so feeling Noble is a waste of emotion. I participate in a few forums, ham antennas, contesting, boating, aircraft, photography, farming, astronomy, etc. I have lots of hobbies - remember, he who dies with the most wins.. I can tell you from long long experience that to be in any hobby forum you need to grow a thick skin. If someone really irritates you, don't read him. If you have had your say and he keeps coming back at you and digging, just drop it. Refuse to post any further on the topic. If you can't control yourself then block the thread. Let him declare victory, hold a parade, and sail for home. That is how the self declared winners of any war end it.In my case I don't know what the hoo-haa over millennials (whatever the hell they are) is about, don't care, don't want to know, and not gonna look up the thread. See, I don't have any stress (I cause it) To the OP on this issue, I urge you to stick around because I like to see any and all opinions - but if not, don't let the door knob do ya.And NO, I will not be looking back at this thread to see a reply. I have had my say and that's it. Ciao,Look for me on topband in 4 to 6 weeks when I get the soybeans combined and the broken antenna junk patched up (wow is it wrecked after 8 years) I'm CW though. k8do _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband -- bark less - wag more _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Topband: RE topband Leaving
Well, I have been gone a few years (spent time partially paralyzed and few other minor impediments) but when I come back nothing has changed. Yeah, Tom headed off into the distance. He sure did like to argue. What made those arguing with him go ballistic is he is often/mostly right on technical subjects. He just did not have the ability to shrug, decide the other guy was an idiot and let it go. What I do notice about leavers is they seem to feel sorry for themselves, feel they are abused, yadda yadda. Unless you have the stature of a Tom you won't even be mentioned by two weeks from now so feeling Noble is a waste of emotion. I participate in a few forums, ham antennas, contesting, boating, aircraft, photography, farming, astronomy, etc. I have lots of hobbies - remember, he who dies with the most wins.. I can tell you from long long experience that to be in any hobby forum you need to grow a thick skin. If someone really irritates you, don't read him. If you have had your say and he keeps coming back at you and digging, just drop it. Refuse to post any further on the topic. If you can't control yourself then block the thread. Let him declare victory, hold a parade, and sail for home. That is how the self declared winners of any war end it.In my case I don't know what the hoo-haa over millennials (whatever the hell they are) is about, don't care, don't want to know, and not gonna look up the thread. See, I don't have any stress (I cause it) To the OP on this issue, I urge you to stick around because I like to see any and all opinions - but if not, don't let the door knob do ya.And NO, I will not be looking back at this thread to see a reply. I have had my say and that's it. Ciao,Look for me on topband in 4 to 6 weeks when I get the soybeans combined and the broken antenna junk patched up (wow is it wrecked after 8 years) I'm CW though. k8do _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: Air wound coil
> On 2018-09-04 1:18 PM, Richard Beerman wrote:
Rick and Bob, Thanks for such swift replies. Looks like I should try
to reinforce the 3/8” tubing (it’s pretty short) with a wood dowel or
perhaps with smaller or larger aluminum tubing.
Unless you want to redesign the antenna's taper schedule, I would simply
get a piece of 1/4" tubing and place inside the entire length of the
3/8" tip section. Then I would use 3, 4 or 6 top wires - make them 18
or 20 gauge for strength. Arrange them equally around the vertical and
clamp them to the tip section with a SS band ("worm") clamp.
Since the 3/8" section is only 36" long (only 24" exposed), I would
strongly consider attaching the top wires at the junction between
the 1/2" and 3/8" sections ... at worst the top wires will be 24"
longer than they would had they been at the very top.
73,
... Joe, W4TV
On 2018-09-04 1:18 PM, Richard Beerman wrote:
Rick and Bob, Thanks for such swift replies. Looks like I should try to
reinforce the 3/8” tubing (it’s pretty short) with a wood dowel or perhaps with
smaller or larger aluminum tubing. Then the fishing line method should be a
perfect solution using 24 or 26 gauge wire. Using this method, I think a
hairpin loop at the base of the vertical will help me achieve resonance. Thanks
again. Dick W5AK
_
Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: Inv L with FCP Tuning
Jim, Did you build the isolation transformer exactly as described in K2AV's article?? By exactly I mean using "teflon sleeved double polyimide insulated" wire. I'm not planning on using it with more than 100W... 73,Julio VE3FH Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android over Bell Mobility Network. On Tue, 4 Sep 2018 at 12:44, James Denneny<57jndenn...@comcast.net> wrote: Gary, I use an inv L with K2AV FCP and matching balun. I purchased a RigExpert AA-30 to tune out the reactance. It worked great. No tuning cap or inductor were needed. It took just a couple cuts to dial it in. My L is now 126 ft long with a 65 ft vertical leg standing a few feet off a tree trunk. The SWR is now much sharper as it should be. We live on a small lakefront lot and there was not sufficient room for a decent TB ground radial system. Our location is semi-rural. So, man-made noise is not a frequent issue. The FCP and trimming of the antenna has produced a major improvement in the L’s performance. It enabled me to reach TB DXCC this past season. Best Luck Jim K7EG Sent from Mail for Windows 10 _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: Air wound coil
Beware not putting the top yard inside small Teflon tubing. You will have an infinitely high Z at the top and potentially lots of KV. It will burn through the support line. 73 Clive GM3POI -Original Message- From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Richard Beerman Sent: 04 September 2018 17:18 To: Joe Subich, W4TV Cc: topband@contesting.com Subject: Re: Topband: Air wound coil Rick and Bob, Thanks for such swift replies. Looks like I should try to reinforce the 3/8” tubing (it’s pretty short) with a wood dowel or perhaps with smaller or larger aluminum tubing. Then the fishing line method should be a perfect solution using 24 or 26 gauge wire. Using this method, I think a hairpin loop at the base of the vertical will help me achieve resonance. Thanks again. Dick W5AK > On Sep 4, 2018, at 11:36 AM, Richard Beerman wrote: > > Top Banders, This discussion has been tremendously helpful to me as I also > am going to put a DX Engineering 68’ vertical when the QRN subsides here in > South Texas. Initially, I planned to install a large inductor (looks like it > came from a BC transmitter) that I found at a local hamfest. My calculation > is that this inductor has around 43 micro henries. According to various > contributors, this is not a good solution. I actually did the same back > around 1972 with a Hytower on 160 meters! It did work with a pathetic ground > system and 40-50 watts from a Ranger II. > > Anyway, here is my question…. my vertical has 3/8” tubing at the top. Pretty > flimsy to connect top loading wires except maybe small gauge wire. I am not > sure how well small gauge wire will handle voltages that may appear at the > top of a 68’ vertical. So, as an alternative, much like the Hytower does > today, what would happen if I installed top loading wires of a larger gauge > lower on the antenna where the tubing is more substantial? Any suggestions > regarding where the top loading could be connected on the vertical and > approximate length of the top loading wires? > > Thanks, Dick W5AK > >> On Sep 3, 2018, at 1:41 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: >> >> >>> Getting to six would result in a smaller top hat but may not be >>> worth the mechanical hassle. >> If the mast has traditional three way guying, the mechanical hassle >> for a six wire top hat may not be that much greater than a four wire >> top hat. >> >> If the top hat wires slope downward, keeping them to the minimum >> length will result in maximum efficiency (and minimum "shielding" of >> the top of the vertical element). >> >> 73, >> >> ... Joe, W4TV >> >> >> On 2018-09-03 7:20 AM, Paul Christensen wrote: >>> I ran the same model in 4Nec2 as below but changed the hat from the >>> traditional two wires to four, spaced 90 degs. Complex base Z is near >>> 16+j0. Even though two symmetrical top-hat wires produce little radiation, >>> four wires result in wires that are only 24 ft long to achieve resonance -- >>> versus 41 ft with only two wires. Getting to six would result in a smaller >>> top hat but may not be worth the mechanical hassle. "4Nec2 shows that with a 68 ft. thin radiator, resonance can be achieved with wires roughly 41 ft. per side. With a ground field of 60 radials, 90 ft long on sandy ground, 4Nec2 reports a base impedance of 15.4+j2.5." >>> Paul, W9AC >> >> >> _ >> Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband > > _ > Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: Air wound coil
Rick and Bob, Thanks for such swift replies. Looks like I should try to reinforce the 3/8” tubing (it’s pretty short) with a wood dowel or perhaps with smaller or larger aluminum tubing. Then the fishing line method should be a perfect solution using 24 or 26 gauge wire. Using this method, I think a hairpin loop at the base of the vertical will help me achieve resonance. Thanks again. Dick W5AK > On Sep 4, 2018, at 11:36 AM, Richard Beerman wrote: > > Top Banders, This discussion has been tremendously helpful to me as I also > am going to put a DX Engineering 68’ vertical when the QRN subsides here in > South Texas. Initially, I planned to install a large inductor (looks like it > came from a BC transmitter) that I found at a local hamfest. My calculation > is that this inductor has around 43 micro henries. According to various > contributors, this is not a good solution. I actually did the same back > around 1972 with a Hytower on 160 meters! It did work with a pathetic ground > system and 40-50 watts from a Ranger II. > > Anyway, here is my question…. my vertical has 3/8” tubing at the top. Pretty > flimsy to connect top loading wires except maybe small gauge wire. I am not > sure how well small gauge wire will handle voltages that may appear at the > top of a 68’ vertical. So, as an alternative, much like the Hytower does > today, what would happen if I installed top loading wires of a larger gauge > lower on the antenna where the tubing is more substantial? Any suggestions > regarding where the top loading could be connected on the vertical and > approximate length of the top loading wires? > > Thanks, Dick W5AK > >> On Sep 3, 2018, at 1:41 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: >> >> >>> Getting to six would result in a smaller top hat but may not be worth >>> the mechanical hassle. >> If the mast has traditional three way guying, the mechanical hassle for >> a six wire top hat may not be that much greater than a four wire top >> hat. >> >> If the top hat wires slope downward, keeping them to the minimum length >> will result in maximum efficiency (and minimum "shielding" of the top >> of the vertical element). >> >> 73, >> >> ... Joe, W4TV >> >> >> On 2018-09-03 7:20 AM, Paul Christensen wrote: >>> I ran the same model in 4Nec2 as below but changed the hat from the >>> traditional two wires to four, spaced 90 degs. Complex base Z is near >>> 16+j0. Even though two symmetrical top-hat wires produce little radiation, >>> four wires result in wires that are only 24 ft long to achieve resonance -- >>> versus 41 ft with only two wires. Getting to six would result in a smaller >>> top hat but may not be worth the mechanical hassle. "4Nec2 shows that with a 68 ft. thin radiator, resonance can be achieved with wires roughly 41 ft. per side. With a ground field of 60 radials, 90 ft long on sandy ground, 4Nec2 reports a base impedance of 15.4+j2.5." >>> Paul, W9AC >> >> >> _ >> Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband > > _ > Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: Air wound coil
On 9/4/2018 9:36 AM, Richard Beerman wrote: Anyway, here is my question…. my vertical has 3/8” tubing at the top. Pretty flimsy to connect top loading wires except maybe small gauge wire. I am not sure how well small gauge wire will handle voltages that may appear at the top of a 68’ vertical. So, as an alternative, much like the Hytower does today, what would happen if I installed top loading wires of a larger gauge lower There is no electrical reason why you can't use fine gauge wire. There is very little current in the top loading wires and the presence of them reduces the voltage at their ends. Mechanically, you can use fishing line as a messenger line by taping the magnet wire to the fishing line (or attach using heat shrink tubing). Dyneema fishing line has the greatest strength vs diameter. You want small diameter to prevent the wind from yanking around the 3/8 inch tubing. If you connect the wires below the top, the section above the junction with the wires becomes inoperative, so that isn't the solution. 73 Rick N6RK _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Topband: Inv L with FCP Tuning
Gary, I use an inv L with K2AV FCP and matching balun. I purchased a RigExpert AA-30 to tune out the reactance. It worked great. No tuning cap or inductor were needed. It took just a couple cuts to dial it in. My L is now 126 ft long with a 65 ft vertical leg standing a few feet off a tree trunk. The SWR is now much sharper as it should be. We live on a small lakefront lot and there was not sufficient room for a decent TB ground radial system. Our location is semi-rural. So, man-made noise is not a frequent issue. The FCP and trimming of the antenna has produced a major improvement in the L’s performance. It enabled me to reach TB DXCC this past season. Best Luck Jim K7EG Sent from Mail for Windows 10 _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: Air wound coil
Top Banders, This discussion has been tremendously helpful to me as I also am going to put a DX Engineering 68’ vertical when the QRN subsides here in South Texas. Initially, I planned to install a large inductor (looks like it came from a BC transmitter) that I found at a local hamfest. My calculation is that this inductor has around 43 micro henries. According to various contributors, this is not a good solution. I actually did the same back around 1972 with a Hytower on 160 meters! It did work with a pathetic ground system and 40-50 watts from a Ranger II. Anyway, here is my question…. my vertical has 3/8” tubing at the top. Pretty flimsy to connect top loading wires except maybe small gauge wire. I am not sure how well small gauge wire will handle voltages that may appear at the top of a 68’ vertical. So, as an alternative, much like the Hytower does today, what would happen if I installed top loading wires of a larger gauge lower on the antenna where the tubing is more substantial? Any suggestions regarding where the top loading could be connected on the vertical and approximate length of the top loading wires? Thanks, Dick W5AK > On Sep 3, 2018, at 1:41 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: > > >> Getting to six would result in a smaller top hat but may not be worth >> the mechanical hassle. > If the mast has traditional three way guying, the mechanical hassle for > a six wire top hat may not be that much greater than a four wire top > hat. > > If the top hat wires slope downward, keeping them to the minimum length > will result in maximum efficiency (and minimum "shielding" of the top > of the vertical element). > > 73, > > ... Joe, W4TV > > > On 2018-09-03 7:20 AM, Paul Christensen wrote: >> I ran the same model in 4Nec2 as below but changed the hat from the >> traditional two wires to four, spaced 90 degs. Complex base Z is near >> 16+j0. Even though two symmetrical top-hat wires produce little radiation, >> four wires result in wires that are only 24 ft long to achieve resonance -- >> versus 41 ft with only two wires. Getting to six would result in a smaller >> top hat but may not be worth the mechanical hassle. >>> "4Nec2 shows that with a 68 ft. thin radiator, resonance can be achieved >>> with wires roughly 41 ft. per side. With a ground field of 60 radials, 90 >>> ft long on sandy ground, 4Nec2 reports a base impedance of 15.4+j2.5." >> Paul, W9AC > > > _ > Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
