Re: Topband: VE6WZ at sunset in Ukraine

[Doug Renwick]

Nick,

All I hear is a strong 'UT7NY'. If you hear VE6WZ in that recording you have
exceptional hearing.

Doug, operating real ham radio


-Original Message-
From: uy0zg [mailto:uy...@mksat.net] 
Sent: December-05-19 11:36 PM
To: Doug Renwick
Cc: 'Topband'
Subject: Re: Topband: VE6WZ at sunset in Ukraine

Hi

Doug !

Jokes are good for health :-))


I don't have perfect hearing (I'm 62 years old), but I perfectly hear 
the VE6WZ signal on the recording.


See you at ARRL 160

---
Nick, UY0ZG
http://www.topband.in.ua

Doug Renwick писал 2019-12-06 01:02:
> Nick,
> Let me take a guess. It had to be one of those 'make believe' inaudible 
> FT8
> contacts. Am I right?
> 
> BTW I did work UR5AS with CW last evening our time.
> 
> Doug, operating real ham radio.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of 
> uy0zg
> Sent: December-05-19 12:35 PM
> To: Topband
> Subject: Topband: VE6WZ at sunset in Ukraine
> 
> Hi
> 
> Alex, UR5AS conducted the first QSO with VE / W at sunset ( December
> 4th).
> 
> How was heard :
> 
> http://www.topband.in.ua/2019/12/05/ve6wz-at-sunset-in-ukraine/
> 
> --
> Nick, UY0ZG
> http://www.topband.in.ua
> _
> Searchable Archives: http://www.contesting.com/_topband - Topband 
> Reflector

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Re: Topband: VE6WZ at sunset in Ukraine

[Doug Renwick]

Nick,
Let me take a guess. It had to be one of those 'make believe' inaudible FT8
contacts. Am I right?

BTW I did work UR5AS with CW last evening our time.

Doug, operating real ham radio.

-Original Message-
From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of uy0zg
Sent: December-05-19 12:35 PM
To: Topband
Subject: Topband: VE6WZ at sunset in Ukraine

Hi

Alex, UR5AS conducted the first QSO with VE / W at sunset ( December 
4th).

How was heard :

http://www.topband.in.ua/2019/12/05/ve6wz-at-sunset-in-ukraine/

-- 
Nick, UY0ZG
http://www.topband.in.ua
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Topband: ZD7W

[Doug Renwick]

Oliver, ZD7W had a great signal into the west last night. The man is
obviously a great CW operator. 

Doug

There is nothing so dangerous as speaking the truth.


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Topband: Topband Conditions

[Doug Renwick]

Fantastic conditions into Europe last night. Nick, UY0ZG, and I had a real
ham radio QSO. Was able to maneuver around the aurora oval.

Terrible QSB on some signals. I need to get a remote listening station on
the east coast. Or better yet a remote listening station in Europe. I was
told "GO WITH THE FLOW" or get out of the way. So I am going with the flow.
Anything to help me compete with small signal modes like FT8, etc.

Any suggestions on how I go about setting up the remote listening or who to
contact?

Doug

There is nothing so dangerous as speaking the truth



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Re: Topband: Why is ZONE 2 so Rare in JAPAN???

[Doug Renwick]

Nick you make a good point about weak people.

The statement "GO WITH THE FLOW" or get out of the way" is flawed. 
The nice thing about this hobby is one can focus on many different aspects.
You don't have to change to go with the flow. If playing with FT8 turns your
crank then enjoy your hobby.

But don't curse me for being traditional. Last checking I find that CW and
SSB, etc are still legal modes. FT8 is not going to force me to 'get out of
the way' and off the air.

BTW I have deleted all the stupid and hateful comments I have received
because I offered an opinion. I really was surprised at the lack of
character by some prominent individuals, unfortunately, mostly Canadian. I
could go on.

Then there were others who offered a rational discussion. Thank you for
standing above the whiners and the SJW.

Doug, operating real ham radio

"The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits."
Albert Einstein 
-Original Message-

Hi All

"As I noted to VE5RA - the world has changed.  Basically, it is fast 
becoming time to "GO WITH THE FLOW" or get out of the way."

The world has always changed..

Just weak people in our time is becoming more and more.

Very appropriate quote .. :

"The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its 
limits."
Albert Einstein

---
Nick, UY0ZG
http://www.topband.in.ua


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Topband: 160m Conditions Last Night

[Doug Renwick]

Very good over the pole real ham radio (cw) conditions from Northern Europe
last night in west NA. Some stations had amazing signals; a few of the
strongest were LY7M, YL2SM and LA1MFA.

Doug

Canada; the ship of fools where corruption and politics are synonymous

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Topband: A Bit of Zone 2 History Was Made Last Week

[Doug Renwick]

To all those who worship FT8 - Enjoy the decline.
Quote: " I agree Doug - as I said - FT8 is not real ham radio - but that is
where we are today."

Doug 

"The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits."
Albert Einstein 

-Original Message-

I congratulate you on your effort. However there are many of us who do not
consider FT8 as a 'legitimate' QSO.
Doug


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Re: Topband: A Bit of Zone 2 History Was Made Last Week

[Doug Renwick]

I congratulate you on your effort. However there are many of us who do not
consider FT8 as a 'legitimate' QSO.
Doug

"The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits."
Albert Einstein 

-Original Message-

08 Nov 2019


Hi Gang
Jeff and I just got back from a one week "mini dx'pedition" to ZONE 2. 
Three ferries and about a 2400km roundtrip drive to 50.112 North from PEI
was made with the express purpose of giving ZONE 2 to our JA 160m friends.
Prior to our trip, only one single JA station had ever managed a qso with
ZONE 2 on Topband and that was JA7HMZ about 35 years ago - so this zone was
much needed by most 160m JA dx'ers.  Quite of few of our 160m JA friends
have been stuck at 39 zones on 160m for many years - so this was our chance
to help them get ZONE 2 for #40.
So without too much bandwidth - here is our report:
QRV 31 October to 04 November 2019
Roughly 350 stations worked on Topband - in 42 DXCC countries (we could have
worked more but we took lots of time off in order to sleep and then get up
for the JA window from about 0715z - 1110z.)
We tried some CW but signals were very very weak and FT8 proved the only
possible way to complete contacts to JA.
It was pretty exciting to work these (6) JA friends:
JF8QNF
JA8EAT
JA7NI
JA1BK
JA8WKE
JA3FYC
We decoded no other JA signals on our side- but we know we were decoded by
these other JA stations:
JH7PFD (two decodes)
JE6KYA (one decode)
JA1EOD (several decodes).
Epilogue:
We think that each JA qso that was made completed WAZ 40 on Topband for
these JA friends. (meaning ZONE 2 was most likely their last one needed).
Steve VK6IR called us on ON4KST chat saying he had been chasing ZONE 2 on
80m for 5BWAZ for 45 years and asked if we could work him on 80m.  We did
not know about 80m since the antenna had not been tested  for that band but,
after checking it with my analyst, I found it resonated at about 3778kHz. 
Steve said he could not do SSB there - so I asked him if he could do
digital.  YES! was his reply and we managed a qso on FT8 a few minutes
later.
After we uploaded our LOG FILE to LOTW (completed on 06 November) - within
minutes there were 37 DXCC entities instantly confirmed via LOTW - including
VK6IR and all (6) lucky JA friends we had worked.
So we are happy we helped some of our JA friends with WAZ 40 - and, at the
same time, we are a bit  disappointed that we could not do more.  The A/K
were lousy on nights one and two - things got better on night 3 when we
worked the first 4 JA's - nights 5 and 6 produced one JA qso each - meaning
JA8WKE and JA3FYC.
One amusing final fact - it was roughly a 2400km trip to there and back - so
this works out to about 400km per JA qso.
KOWABUNGA!  but we had a great time trying this - and are pleased we had
some limited success in doing so.
We wish to mention our special thanks to Don Toman (K2KQ) and to Frank
Donovan (W3LPL) for their kind assistance with our antenna planning.  Their
input and suggestions were invaluable in making this happen!
73/88 de  Miriam (VY2NA) and Jeff VY2ZM
Email:   k...@aol.com
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Re: Topband: 160

[Doug Renwick]

So you would like to shut down all discussion because the 'science is
settled'. Good factual discussion is important, but you see it as not
getting along. I disagree.

Doug

"The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits."
Albert Einstein 

-Original Message-

Cheating is cheating.  How many people used remote stations, exceeded 
their power limits, etc.   Singling out a mode because you are upset 
that it has taken away activity in your  preferred mode is not helpful 
to the hobby.    Not everyone that use FT8 cheats.  Not everyone that 
uses a amp that exceeds their legal limit uses it in that fashion.

How can you guarantee that everyone on the "Honor Role" was 100 percent 
honorable or even anyone that got DXCC did it right?  You can't so 
please stop singling out a mode you don't care for.  We get it.  Move 
on.  It is here.  Just like the Reverse beacon, packet cluster, etc.

We are all hams enjoying many aspects of the hobby.  Can't we get along?

W0MU

On 8/2/2019 3:03 AM, Ross Johnson wrote:
> To Carl , my computer is not cleaver enough to work 60 countries FT8 
> on its own.
> I have to check grey line, put many hours in on band, check 
> DXpeditions  ETC
> Don’t forget hardware and radio gear.
>
> To Nick and George. K1JT has put out a list identifying call signs 
> they believe  are using automated stations, you cant tell me others 
> have not cheated. There was callsigns mentioned on these pages recently.
>
> To problem solver Kevin K3OX ,you  have helped some here by pointing 
> out Mix DXCC is not CW  DXCC or SSB DXCC
>
> Well done
>
> 73  Ross   ZL3RJ
> _
> Searchable Archives: http://www.contesting.com/_topband - Topband 
> Reflector



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Re: Topband: Unsubscribe

[Doug Renwick]

Why do people leaving a list always have to announce it? To make sure
everyone knows how good they are and how bad everyone else is that's left so
that we can all feel bad? Sorry I don't, had nothing to do with why you
left, your choice.
Why not just unsubscribe without announcing it?

Doug

"The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits."
Albert Einstein 

-Original Message-
From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Ralph
Bellas
Sent: July-16-19 8:01 PM
To: aa0rs; Topband@contesting.com
Subject: Re: Topband: Unsubscribe

Unsubscribe too.  I would rather hear about 160 than ticks.




From: Topband  on behalf of aa0rs

Sent: Tuesday, July 16, 2019 6:44:44 PM
To: topband@contesting.com
Subject: Topband: Unsubscribe

Unsubscribe



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Topband: XR0ZRC

[Doug Renwick]

My contact with XR0ZRC on 160m from the far north last night at 0448 has
been confirmed on the latest Club Log update.

Doug/VA5DX

"The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits."
Albert Einstein 


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Re: Topband: JA's came in droves today on 160

[Doug Renwick]

Ed,
I feel exactly the same way you do. Real DXing is operator (person) to
operator (person). FT8 is the same as using the internet to make a contact.
The end of amateur radio as it was intended.

Doug

"The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits."
Albert Einstein 

-Original Message-
From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Edward
Sawyer
Sent: January-31-19 12:27 PM
To: topband@contesting.com
Subject: Re: Topband: JA's came in droves today on 160

Such is the new trend.  No offense to KV4FZ whatsoever but if you provide
the easy path.most will take it.  The only way to affect the "easy way out"
is to not provide it.  

 

I remember year's ago doing CQ WW CW ABLP as C6ARS in 2001.  I ended the
contest on 15M running a couple of hundred JAs. I thought, this is amazing
because I am just as loud from W1 and I couldn't imagine having so many JA
stations call.  Clearly they are much more DXers than full contesters - most
of them.  Still feel that way today.  I have heard piles of JAs calling
right before a contest only to dry up in the contest.

 

Its fascinating that the above has now shifted to FT8 vs the more
traditional modes in just DXing.  Herb, it would be a very interesting
experiment to shift to CW mid pile-up and see if the group stays with you to
catch the DX opening or does it dwindle to nothing.  I am guessing it goes
to nothing despite the opening.  But would love to hear.

 

FT8 is changing the "easiness factor" in DXing.  And like technology
assisted driving, once that genie is out of the bottle it ain't never goin
back.  Just try and find an actual stick shift in a new car - almost
impossible.  Why?  It doesn't mesh with the computer driving the car.  

 

73

 

Ed  N1UR

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Re: Topband: VU2GSM webSDR use

[Doug Renwick]

The recent changes to DXing has belittled the efforts many of us have made
in the past. The honor of completing real contacts on challenging bands has
disappeared. Now there is little point on working hard to add countries from
ones needed list. It has gotten to the point that the award is closing in on
meaningless. Cheating has become so common that my interest in DXing and
contesting no longer exists. I have a friend who asked me to work Bouvet for
him. 
Over 40 years I have built a robust station which now attracts little
interest. I sit at the top of the DX honor roll but rankings within these
awards have become meaningless. The best are the memories of real 160m DXing
like during the last peak working EY8MM twice from SK.

I suggested this some time ago. Why not just do away with all this useless
DXing. Instead just exchange cards with a $5 or $10 bill and be done with
it. Why even bother making a FAKE QSO or a half QSO? Think of the time and
money that would be saved. You wouldn't need a rig or antenna. No more upset
neighbors. No more expensive DXpeditions. But then the ham radio industry
would disappear. I guess that is why there is little push back.

In closing, ham radio of the past was very exciting. Ham radio of the
present (internet radio) and the future is not for me.  

Doug/VA5DX

"Political correctness is a weapon used to silence people who tell the
truth" - Ayaan Hirsi Ali 

-Original Message-

I have been "sitting" on this for a few weeks wondering if I should share
this information, but after seeing some spots yesterday for VU2GSM on 160m,
I decided that others may appreciate it.
I know I would. 

If you have worked Kanti, VU2GSM recently on the low bands...40, 80 or 160
you should be aware that he was most likely RX using a NA webSDR. The links
below are PDF copies of email correspondence with Kanti confirming that this
is routine for him.The emails are between both VE5UA, myself and VU2GSM.
(Please read the email threads from the "bottom up" to be chronological.)

To be clear, I do not judge Kanti for his desire to augment his rx, and do
not think it is wrong. If he chooses to use Ham radio this way that is his
choice. However, I myself do not wish to include a "half" QSO toward my own
(personal) DXCC count, and perhaps others will feel the same hence this
email. I also don't judge others that are good with such webSDR QSOs since
each has his own goals and objectives.

Here is some background. I have been working VU2GSM frequently and with ease
on 40m in the morning and evening. He would respond almost immediately to my
calls which seemed odd. More typical is Rakash VU2RAK who has a great signal
but usually can't copy me, though we have QSOd a few times when conditions
are exceptional.
While at a local ham lunch, I mentioned this, and Don VE6JY said that Kanti
is often logged into his webSDR. The following week I copied VU2GSM on 80m
in the evening with very light copy with my 2el Yagi and 1000' beverage
(diversity rx with K3). He answered immediately and we had a QSO. I was
suspicious. I emailed Don VE6JY and he confirmed that at that time Kanti was
indeed logged into his SDR.
I deleted the QSO from my log.
This then precipitated the e-mail correspondence which I share on the
attached links.

There is little doubt this is going on all the time, and we will never know.
We can't undo the technology that makes webSDR possible.
There are those who who feel that this destroys the "integrity" of the DXCC.
However, not everyone cares about DXCC.
Kanti is not a villan. He is doing nothing wrong. He is not "cheating". In
his email correspondence he is very open and transparent and makes it clear
he doesn't chase DXCC, and could care less about it. Why should he?
>From Kanti's perspective, using a webSDR enhances his enjoyment of the hobby
living in RFI polluted Bangalore. For others, a "half-VU" QSO is better than
none and they are happy. 

Like others, I spend a great deal of effort optimizing both rx and tx and
someday when I do make the QSO with VU on 80 and hopefully 160, it will be a
true two-way contact. The "buzz" for me is not getting the country counter
in the log, its about knowing that my station made the contact via
radio..both ways.all the way.

The purpose of this email is simply to inform those who have worked Kanti
recently that it is possible/likely that your TX signal was not actually
heard in VU.

73, de Steve ve6wz


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Re: Topband: VE1ZZ Jack Leahy

[Doug Renwick]

At Clipperton 2000 FO0AAA I convinced the 160m leader to let me try SSB.
When I sat down and started calling CQ with no immediate response, I knew
the first contact would be Jack, VE1ZZ and he didn't disappoint me.

Doug VE5RA/VA5DX



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Re: Topband: NCCC Elmer of the Year for 2016, Jim Brown, K9YC

[Doug Renwick]

Jim calls it like he sees it. I have had my disagreements with Jim and his
habits, but he is willing to share his knowledge and insights. I can
overlook his uniqueness in exchange for his extensive input. I find for him
to be chastised here for his earlier post is troubling. Congratulations Jim
for the award and just ignore the whiners.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

>From the May 4, 2016 ARRL Contest Update

SIGHTS AND SOUNDS

NCCC Elmer of the Year for 2016, Jim Brown, K9YC.

"Jim Brown K9YC was honored with the Northern California Contest Club (NCCC)
"Elmer of the Year" award on April 23, 2016. Even if you're not part of
NCCC, you'll likely be familiar with Jim's extensive electronic presence on
various ham-related mailing lists, and through his contributions to various
publications. Jim keeps his own list of publications on his website."

Marsh, KA5M


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Re: Topband: VK0EK confirmation

[Doug Renwick]

>From time to time there are those on this list who believe that the regular
lynching of a member is required. These lynchers and SJW decided it was K9YC
s turn to be lynched because of his free speech. More signs of 'gentlemen's
band' decay.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

Jim,

This "referee" should act only if people start calling each other names or
call
for a public crucifiction or such.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and response.

You can personally filter-out or just neglect content from those you
consider
less relevant in your in-box.

On a forum like this there will always be the eccentrics, those who are at
the
'edge of the spectrum'.

Sure those are different from the general bubble, sometimes "lack tact" and
because of their nature, are not capable of submitting a "good natured
reply" as
you correctly named it.

Diplomacy is (scientifically) counter effective in their view. And some
shoot at
everything. 

And like Einstein, they are arguably not your cute looking next neighbor.

But very much like K9YC, from time to time they also share empirical
knowledge,
something which is a lot more useful than just repeating theoretic content
from
other writers books.

Also there one can argue to some extent, based on personal other results/
experiences on the topic and still be free to continue thinking otherwise.

The eccentrics (sometimes called Gurus) in our hobby offer plenty of
knowledge
on their websites too. We use that to read, try and learn by doing. Maybe to
find the content offers the same result at our QTH, maybe not. 

I cannot imagine we would want to avoid the K9YC's of this world. 

I hope they continue their act.

I also often skip their, and other peoples' content if I think it is not
relevant to me.


73
Mark, PA5MW



> Op 18 april 2016 om 20:35 schreef James Rodenkirch
:
> 
> I don't know who the "referee" is for this august reflector.BUT, read
> below, puleez,
> 
> by doing the following:
> 
> - find every spot where I annotated K9YC's acerbic and uncalled for
replies to
> SP6EQZ's initial
>  post by inserting "K9YC replied"
> 
> - label K9YC as an "ugly American" and, PULEZ, put him, FINALLY, on
notice
> to "clean up his act"
>  or disappear into the internet ether..
> 
> - send a personal e-mail to SP6EQZ and apologize for this exhibited
boorish
> behavior...PULZ!!!
> 
> How embarrassing!!! Sheesh
> 
> Aside note: I got pissed off enuff at K9YC for his acerbic replies to
several
> past posts of mine.and
> 
> enjoyed reading several private e-mails from other subscribers regarding
his
> lack of tact and ability
> 
> to submit a "good natured reply," vice the caustic, unfriendly notes he's
> noted for. BUT, this latest edition
> 
> makes his forays into my "backyard" pale by comparison!!
> 
> Run this dood out of town if it keeps up!!
> 
> 72 de Jim R. K9JWV
> 
> On Mon,4/18/2016 2:56 AM, Andrzej_SP6AEG wrote:
> 
> Courtesy of my friend Wlodzimierz Herej SP6EQZ paid a donation of $ 10 for
> VK0EK.
> 
> K9YC replied: Sounds like you're one of the last of the big spenders!
> 
> To this day I have not found confirmation of my QSO on LoTW?.
> I sent the payment on April 12, 2016
> Is the donation has been sent too late and the previous procedure does not
> work, can I do something wrong?.
> 
> K9YC replied: Did you not read the VK0EK website? Early LOTW confirmations
> would be sent to those who contributed BEFORE the expedition began. Like
you,
> I waited until I had worked them on the boat on their way to Heard to send
> them $300. That's much more than I usually contribute to DX trips, but
this
> was a VERY expensive one. I sent a check, and got a nice thank you note
from
> KK6EK's XYL. She said I'll get my LOTW when Bob returns home.
> 
> I guess I will have to again make fee to confirm my QSO using the form:
> https://shop.vk0ek.org/
> 
>
[https://shop.vk0ek.org/assets/HD_Mug_logo_GIF_512.gif]
> 
> VK0EK Shop - VK0EK OQRS page
> shop.vk0ek.org
> Bringing this expedition to reality has been a huge effort, extending over
3
> years. Besides the 14 men who travelled to Heard Island to operate the
radios,
> carry out ...
> 
> K9YC replied: It would be good for you to again make a contribution,
> increasing the size of your support. This was a VERY costly expedition.
> 
> Thank you very much for having responded to my call, and especially to 160
m
> what gave me 263 entities to 160 DXCC.
> 
> The way to say thank you is to send more money. :)
> 
> K9YC replied: European hams got 52.5% of VK0EK QSOs, NA got 19.4%. EU got
> 2,372 Topband Q's, NA got 293 (I got one of them). Many NA hams who DO
> contribute to these trips are getting more than a bit tired of hearing EU
> stations complaining about DXpeditions not working them but not sending
money
> to support the costs. Most NA hams are retired, so 

Topband: A35T

[Doug Renwick]

They hear well but their TX, 339, is weak.  Got a 1 minute opening
(seriously) around SR and made the contact.

Doug/VA5DX

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

I am listening this AM to both sides of the A35T Top Band operation.  The 
signal from the DXped continues to be up and down, never strong and fading 
completely at times on very short cycles.

The result, with A35T now hearing quite well, is MANY, MANY NA stations ARE 
BEING HEARD and responded to by A35T, with the NA station never hearing the 
A35T response.

During the last hour this scenario has occurred with perhaps a dozen 
stations.  It is a shame.  After A35T responds 3 times, or more, with the 
call sign and sig report, with no response from the calling station, A35T 
has no choice but to return to CQing.

On the other hand, a LOT of stations ARE going into the log this morning as 
the terminator works its way across the continent.  Congratulations to the 
Top Band operator at A35T, who is doing it correctly under the existing 
conditions.

73, es CU all in the CQ 160 SSB contest this weekend.

de Milt, N5IA 

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Re: Topband: Direct buy coax

[Doug Renwick]

Jeff,
I cleaned the gophers out a few years back and they haven't returned.  I do
get chew marks on the RG6 from I am not sure ... weasel, skunk, badger.  I
wrap the chewed area with electricians tape and am good to go again.
Sometimes the RG6 is chewed so bad that a small section needs to be cut out.
A couple of fittings on each end, a double female, fusion tape followed by
electricians tape and it is all fixed.  When a section gets too many fixes,
chuck it and replace with new.  At $25CAD/1000ft the cost is minimal.

Doug/VE5RA 

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

Hi Doug, You must have the gophers trained out there!Jeff VE3CV
 


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Re: Topband: direct buried beverage coaxial

[Doug Renwick]

Funny I have been using cheap flooded copper clad steel RG6 running thousand
feet to my DX Eng/homebrew 160m four square system for years.  I don't
understand the need to use high cost RG6.
Doug/VE5RA

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

I seem to remember that someone mentioned the availability of an all copper
buriable RG6 type. I have an application that I want to do just once and
not have it start deteriorating right away. Cost does not matter. I've had
it permanently with cheep and do-overs. Does anyone actually make such or
is that just one of those wish-it-were-true pseudo memories?

Does anyone know the brand, product identification, and seller of an RG6
form 75 ohm cable that is PE jacketed, double copper foil shielded, solid
copper center center conductor and flooded. Teflon dielectric would be a
plus.

Any leads that will get me in that direction greatly appreciated.

73, Guy K2AV

On Thursday, January 28, 2016, Craig Clark  wrote:

> I have been buying my coax from Satellite TV/Internet suppliers.
> The brands I have been buying have a solid copper center, not Cu clad
> steel,
>
> which is better when feeding voltage down the line.
> The outer cover is Polyethylene not PVC which is a softer plastic.
> It comes either as a single cable which I use to feed my Hi-Z array
> or dual which I have been using for My KD9SV bi-directional Beverages.
>
> 73 Craig K1QX
>
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Re: Topband: CQ 160 CW Contest

[Doug Renwick]

Can someone tell me how this rule is going to be policed?  Operator ethics
(becoming an oxymoron) doesn't count.
Doug/VE5RA

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

Hi Mike.

To clarify;

The rule for allowing remote receivers is for Single Op ASSISTED only.
It does not matter what power level you use.
Multi Ops CANNOT use remote receivers. Single operator Unassisted CANNOT
use remote receivers. Power levels do not matter.

There is no separate listing for LP or QRP in ASSISTED.
All power levels are listed together in the ASSISTED category.
If you use the DX Cluster, skimmers or any spotting assistance you are
ASSISTED (except Multi-ops). If you use a remote receiver you are ASSISTED.

73, Andy N2NT
Director CQ160 Contest


On Wed, Jan 27, 2016 at 3:41 PM,  wrote:

> Andy,
>
> It is not clear to me; can a low Power or QRP operator use a remote rx
> within 100km?
>
> Mike N2MS
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: Andy Blank 
> To: Jorge Diez - CX6VM 
> Cc: 160 
> Sent: Wed, 27 Jan 2016 19:37:47 - (UTC)
> Subject: Re: Topband: CQ 160 CW Contest
>
> Jorge, this new rule is for SINGLE OPERATOR ASSISTED ONLY.
>
> Multi ops, single ops are not allowed to use remote rx.
>
> For those of you that did not follow the thread, this was in response to
> some stations that requested a compromise.
> We decided to allow it only for assisted operation.
> This rule mirrors exactly the accomodation made for the Stew Perry
contest.
>
> To clarify, web SDRs are OK if they are in the 100km radius. One and only
> one receiver can be used.
> Anyone caught using receivers outside of these limits will be subject to
> disqualification.
>
> Reminder: Single Op Assisted is HIGH POWER only.
> Low power stations get listed together for this category only.
>
> Have fun in the contest, let's hope for some good conditions!
> BTW, the rule for 5 day submission of logs is not all that new.
> Please email your cabrillo logs ASAP after the contest.
>
> All the information can be found at CQ160.com.
>
>
> 73, Andy N2NT
> Director CQ160 Contest
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 27, 2016 at 2:27 PM, Jorge Diez - CX6VM  >
> wrote:
>
> > Hello,
> >
> > Just reading the rules, don`t like this, how they can control it?
> >
> > A new rule is added to allow the use of one and only one remote receiver
> > located within 100KM of the main transmitter site. WebSDRs are OK, but
> must
> > be located within the 100KM limit. The rule is designed to accommodate
> new
> > technology, and for those who experience high noise levels at the
> > transmitting site.
> >
> > Will not hurt nobody here, but for those that are playing for top scores
> > maybe is a problem
> >
> > 73,
> > Jorge
> > CX6VM/CW5W
> >
> >
> >
> > 2016-01-27 14:51 GMT-03:00 Tree :
> >
> > > Just a reminder that the biggest 160 meter contest is coming up this
> > > weekend.  It starts at 2200 UTC on Friday and runs for 48 hours.
> > >
> > > Full rules can be found at http://www.cq160.com/.  Exchange is RST and
> > > your
> > > QTH for US/VE stations.  For DX - it is RST + CQ zone.
> > >
> > > One fairly new rule is that logs need to be submitted within 5 days of
> > the
> > > end of the contest (unless you ask for a waiver).
> > >
> > > Hope conditions are good.  The VP8 operation will likely resume either
> > > during or after the contest.  I remember working VP8ORK during the
2011
> > CQ
> > > 160 contest - so it is possible to work DX during this contest.  ;-)
> > >
> > > 73 Tree N6TR/7
> > > Hillsboro, OR
> > > _
> > > Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > 73,
> > Jorge
> > CX6VM/CW5W
> > _
> > Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
> >
> _
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>
>
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Re: Topband: VP8STI 160 and 80

[Doug Renwick]

80m SSB conditions took a jump and peaked at 0550Z here near Saskatoon.  I
heard the op make the comment you posted and he added that he could 'see his
breath'.  So obviously it was cold in the operating tent.

Doug/VE5RA

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

I was lucky to work VP8STI on 160 CW and 80 SSB last night. A Few
observations:

There definitely was multi-path propagation on 160 and I think the signal
was arriving at a rather high angle. I can tell this by using my Hi-Z array
which has good directivity to for low angle signals and poor directivity for
higher angle signals.

Secondly, there was a lot of spotlight propagation earlier in the evening
until after about 0332Z when it seemed to broaden out. If you really want
this entity, you need to sit in front of your radio from sunset until their
sunrise because you never know when they will jump up out of the noise.

Third, propagation was great on 80M. My SSB Q was at 0552z, after their
sunrise.

Lastly, I second KV4FZ's comment. This team deserves your financial support.
The 80M op told me he was freezing his a** off in the tent.

73, Dennis W0JX
Milan, Ohio
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Re: Topband: predicting propagation

[Doug Renwick]

Remember one US cent is worth nearly 2 Canadian cents.  We'll monitor 80 and 
160 tonight as you suggest.  Thanks for the info.

Doug/VE5RA

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

My two cents (probably worth one cent):

You best shot to hear VP8 will be at their sunrise.  I think that is around
0600Z - so I think listening for an hour before that would be smart.  When
I worked ZD7 - I heard no thing except right at their sunrise.  My VP8SGP
QSO on 160 meters was on Jan 15th - at 0606Z.

I have never heard LP on 160 meters.  If it does happen - it is certainly
rare and I wouldn't expect it without very low sunspot numbers. So - I
would look for them to come in from the Southeast for you.

It sounds like they have been struggling with some issues - and getting on
160 meters will be low in the priority list compared to the other bands.
Hopefully - they will work through their issues and get on 160 meters.

Probably their signal will hang in longer after sunrise on 80 meters than
160 - but in general it will be similar.

Good luck!!

Tree N6TR/7
Oregon

On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 4:13 PM, Art Snapper  wrote:

> After several years on TB, I sort of understand that from my QTH in
> Michigan, the Caribbean, and Europe are best heard in the evening.
>
> The Pacific and Asia come in best in the morning.
>
> When will the VP8 DXpedition come in the best?
>
> Should I be looking at LP, SP, or no path?
>
> Are there similarities to 80 meter propagation?
>
> 73,
>
> Art NK8X
>
> ᐧ
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Topband: Tom RauchRE: W8JI is bailing out of this reflector?

[Doug Renwick]

I just don't understand it.  The lynch mob and the Social Justice Warriors
are back again!  What is with you folks that for what ever reason, you like
kicking folks in the balls.  It happens on this list over and over again.
It's time for you folks to grow up.
And for you folks who love to 'shoot first', and there are too many
subscribe here, you need to realize Tom isn't no saint.  Also he runs a RHR
and so any criticism about RHR is not going go over well with Tom.  Yes he
is doing it legally.  However there are times when something is legal but it
is not ethical as in the case of RHR for hire.
And folks that threaten to leave are black mailers.  Just leave without all
that whining.
There is enough expertise on this list to cover anyone who leaves.

Doug/VE5RA   

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

All I know is this - I just read the "lead up" to Tom's self-removal from
the group and it didn't take me long to identify a couple of asshats that
owe him an apology. Larry? Check. Misquoting is unethical and you knew it
when you did it. Roger? You betcha. A snarky "Bye, Tom" is all you had to
say? Probably just as well.

As a fairly new and "nobody" ham trying to learn about the supposed
"gentleman's band," I've found Tom's posts very educational. I've learned
more from Tom and his website than most others.  Do either of you have free
websites aimed at educating hams new and old?  Maybe Google is broken, but
I couldn't find them. Being prolific operators I'll concede in both cases,
but what're your contributions past that? If y'all are the "gentlemen" that
I'm supposed to be working on topband, I'll go cut the coax to my measly
160 antenna now, thanks.

Tom's loss will be felt far more than whatever you two may bring to the
table, I'm quite sure.

Shame on you both.

To the rest of the list - I apologize for my impertinent behavior. I've
spoken my peace. I'll reign it in.


73

Matt
KK4CPS


On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 5:57 PM, Mike Waters  wrote:

> I'm afraid so, Jim. :-(
>
> I almost sent an email to Tom asking him to reconsider, but then I figured
> that anything we said wouldn't bring him back. Not as long as ... well,
I'd
> rather not discuss this here anymore.
>
> You can read what led up to it at
> http://lists.contesting.com/_topband/2016-01/threads.html and search that
> page for "w8ji".
>
> 73, Mike
> www.w0btu.com
>
> On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 3:44 PM, James Rodenkirch 
> wrote:
>
> >
> > NowI just read a couple of posts on the K5P operation where it was
> > intimated that Tom, W8JI, was leaving this reflector!!
> >
> > Had that been confirmed??
> >
> > T bad - dang...technical prowess should be cultivated and
> > encouraged to keep posting away.friggin' shame if true!


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Re: Topband: K5P good job !

[Doug Renwick]

Reminds me of our 'catch and release' justice? system.

Doug/VE5RA

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

Good advice. I suggest taking it a step farther.

It is the rare ham who takes criticism, even constructive, well. So,...

Privately suggest to them how doing it differently will increase their fun,
will increase their chances of making the QSO. Suggest listening a bit.
Suggest timing. Etcetera. Help them be better and use the carrot of better
results and more fun.

Ham Exuberantly,

Hank, W6SX



On Mon, Jan 18, 2016 at 7:00 AM,  wrote:

>
> When someone is doing something wrong we should not "out" or embarrass
> them.
>
> You should try to settle the situation offline without leaving any bad
> feelings.
>
> If you know the offender you should discuss it with him (or her) person to
> person. Be diplomatic.
>
> Don't lecture to them, discuss it with them. You have noticed they are
> doing something which interferes with good operating practices and also
> mention that other listeners have noted the fact.
>
> If you cannot contact the person you can mention the offense on a
> contesting or DX'ing forum such as this
>
> I find it is better to show them the way.
>
> Mike N2MS
>
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Re: Topband: K5P good job !

[Doug Renwick]

Good point.  I use that same technique when the callers get out of sync.
What appears to be lids are actually folks who are out of sync.  I gave the
callsign twice on 160 phone from Clipperton to keep things under control.
I will admit that I have used the continuous calling technique when the DX
station was listening randomly without any pattern (i.e. crap shoot).  Also
I will call when I believe the DX has busted my call, which happens too
often.

Doug/VE5RA

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

I was holding back on posting a comment on this topic of continuous calling
(I actually typed out a response but deleted it twice yesterday) but
thought I would finally hit the send key in an attempt to should shed some
light on part of the problem as well as a partial solution (not a complete
solution as there are many different reasons for the problem which includes
deep fading, as well as just being totally clueless, desperate, etc).

As a W1AW/9 centennial station and operator (all CW), I found the biggest
cure for the problem was sending the call sign of the station I picked out
of the pile up 2 times.  My best guess was that operators that have longer
calls (like myself), and/or send slow, or run "semi break in" often don't
hear the DXpedition station respond to someone else because they are still
sending (or muted), and this gets worse when everyone gets out of sync
(they would really get out of sync from each other when I could not pick
out even a partial call the first time around and this caused stations to
start repeating their calls in hopes of being the "chosen one", etc.).  I
would not always use the "sending calls two times" technique, but when the
problem started to impact my receive capabilities (or just drove me nuts),
I would implement this technique with great success.

I've heard a few DXpedition operators on 160 meters use the "sending calls
two times" technique under certain conditions (but not often), and the
results are normally very impressive.  This technique is not often
discussed (as far as I know), and probably frowned upon by some who might
think it slows things down, but I certainly found this technique useful
(and often the most efficient method).

Just some thoughts from my end based on my experience last year.

73,
Don (wd8dsb)

On Mon, Jan 18, 2016 at 10:36 AM, Roger D Johnson 
wrote:

> The big problem is that this "system" works! It's simple statistics. The
> more times you
> send your call, the better chance of the DX picking it out of a pileup.
>
> I don't think the people that do this give a rats behind if they're
> calling on top of
> someone else. They are like people who cut in line ahead of you. It's all
> about them!
>
> 73, Roger
>
>
> On 1/18/2016 10:00 AM, mstang...@comcast.net wrote:
>
>>
>> When someone is doing something wrong we should not "out" or embarrass
>> them.
>>
>> You should try to settle the situation offline without leaving any bad
>> feelings.
>>
>> If you know the offender you should discuss it with him (or her) person
>> to person. Be diplomatic.
>>
>> Don't lecture to them, discuss it with them. You have noticed they are
>> doing something which interferes with good operating practices and also
>> mention that other listeners have noted the fact.
>>
>> If you cannot contact the person you can mention the offense on a
>> contesting or DX'ing forum such as this
>>
>> I find it is better to show them the way.
>>
>> Mike N2MS
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _
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>
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Re: Topband: Stew Beef

[Doug Renwick]

It's been a long time since I entered a contest seriously so I can't get
DQd.

 

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could. 

  _  

One really needs to look at the contest rules before deciding to not send
RST.  If it is the rules, please send it.

 

A few years ago, there was a bit of a blow up on the CQ Contest reflector
over this very issue.  A high scoring station decided to not send RST.  He
did this in order to shave a few seconds off his contest exchange, and some
folks cried fowl.  In the end, he decided to submit his log as a checklog.
So - instead of a big score, he scored zero...

 

So - do whatever you like.  SP does not require RST, so no problem there.
But - be aware that some contests require RST, and may lead to a DQ for not
following the rules...

 

Tom - VE3CX

 

 



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Re: Topband: Stew Beef

[Doug Renwick]

So for contesters the next logical step would be to eliminate the signal
report.
Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

Does anyone recall the signal reports provided by Shortwave Listeners?

It was SINFO, later SINPO.

Signal, interference, noise, propagation, and overall. - If I recall
correctly.

It gave a better picture of signal quality, but took time. SWL's have time,
Contesters do not.

My $0.02

Art - NK8X



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Re: Topband: Stew Beef

[Doug Renwick]

What I often do during a phone contest exchange is omit the signal report
and only give out the section, serial number, etc.  Very few operators
request the signal report and when they do I reply 'my report to you is
already in your logging program, there is no use in repeating it.'  I could
say a lot more but it would be deemed 'not politically correct.'  Have we
hit bottom yet?
Doug  

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

I completely agree with Don on this.  the incessant and utterly
meaningless "599" or "59" because it is programmed in and the operator
too lazy to think about a real signal report makes the minimal value
of contests sink to zero.

They have become nothing more than a vehicle to keep the ham radio
economy running and the "play" part, after consumer hams have done the
plugging.

73

Rob
K5UJ


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Re: Topband: RFI - and lots of it

[Doug Renwick]

My Icom radios come with the power cord fused for both negative and
positive.  From what you say, I should remove the negative fuse if I install
the radios in a vehicle.  Now when the radios are at the fixed station the
same power cord is used (both lines fused), I understand that the negative
line fuse should also be removed.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

Any good connection to the chassis anywhere on a unibody vehicle is far 
better than a connection to a battery negative. Motorola is smart enough to 
tell installers to ground to the chassis, not the battery. In the UK the 
directive is to use the chassis or a manufacturer supplied terminal, and it 
specifically prohibits connecting to the battery negative pole.

The negative fuse is just foolishness. If it opens, all the radio current 
goes through small wiring. If the fuse opens, there goes the radio or 
something connected to the radio via a port. All of the radio current will 
go through some small wire.

My shop bench radio has an open foil on the CW key line and the mic because 
of a fuse holder failure, and that isn't the first radio that has that 
happen.   :)

The entire problem centers around use of the battery pole or battery 
connector as a source, and this carries over into our station desks. There 
is a ground loop similar to that in a car created between the power line 
ground, the power supply case, the negative lead, and the radio chassis back

to ground. As in the car, if this stuff was built or wired correctly, the 
12V bus would only be grounded at one point and there would be no negative 
fuse.

In our houses, many of the problems blamed on RF feedback are actually 
ground loops caused by grounded cabinets common to negatives and voltage 
drops on negative leads.

At least some places in Europe got their together and banned battery 
negative connections because of the hazards.

73 Tom 



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Re: Topband: ADC Overload from MW transmitters

[Doug Renwick]

Ahhh, the social justice warriors (SJW) have arrived.  What do we do with
them?
Doug 

-Original Message-

Hear Hear!

Gary
KA1J

> I vote you take your contentious attitude somewhere else MIKE DURKIN
> 
> Cecil
> K5DL
> 
> Sent using recycled electrons.
> 
> > On Oct 20, 2015, at 1:07 AM, MIKE DURKIN  wrote:
> > 
> > Come on Bill ...  did i say you did ?
> >> also-- I did not put forth any opinion about ADC or SDR.
> > 
> > Now, you said that you always read well written info from Tom, I didn't
see that structure ... 
> > Id like to know what SDR was so poor.
> > 
> > SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM ... (with a guys voice trying to sound like a old
woman) Flying Circus any one?
> > 
> > 
> >> From: bayc...@mediacombb.net
> >> To: patriot...@msn.com; topband@contesting.com
> >> Subject: Re: Topband: ADC Overload from MW transmitters
> >> Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2015 00:52:15 -0500
> >> 
> >> Mike--
> >> It is obvious that you do not know who Tom is.
> >> and-- the word SPAM followed by six exclamation points IS an expletive.

> >> also-- I did not put forth any opinion about ADC or SDR.
> >> Bill--W4BSG
> >> 
> >> -Original Message- 
> >> From: MIKE DURKIN
> >> Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2015 12:07 AM
> >> To: topband@contesting.com
> >> Subject: Re: Topband: ADC Overload from MW transmitters
> >> 
> >> If i must 
> >> 
> >> Tom never mentioned what type of SDR would be wiped out by moderate
signals 
> >> ...
> >> 
> >> That in its self has three problems ...
> >> 
> >> NO filtering? (should this be called -- comparing apples to apples, not

> >> apples to turds)
> >> poor ADC (real cheap soundcard 8bit)?
> >> insanely bad phase error in the nearby transmitter OR the wonderfull
SDR 
> >> that he built.
> >> 
> >> Nearly the entire email was lamented as a setup for a flame war by
simply 
> >> omitting details ... that is not the actions of a good engineering
radio 
> >> operator ... hence ... SPAM. -- it was a showing off the effort put
into the 
> >> SDR i guess.
> >> 
> >> And i worry about you Bill  the word "SPAM" being an expletive in
your 
> >> vocabulary ...
> >> 
> >> I think of many responses on here to ADC overload as this -- 
> >> 
> >> When dealing with a computer .. the quality of work/info put into it
will 
> >> have the same ratio that you will get out of it -- qubed.
> >> 
> >> how many samples per second are true overload  and i mean overload
--  
> >> not phase error -- if you don't know the difference you really
shouldn't put 
> >> forth an opinion as truth.
> >> 
> >> That video that was posted in this discussion(awhile ago) did point out
the 
> >> difference quite well and understandable by almost anyone .. check it
out, 
> >> if not again.
> >> 
> >> Not sure if i should really send this .. but, what the hell.
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >>> From: bayc...@mediacombb.net
> >>> To: patriot...@msn.com; topband@contesting.com
> >>> Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2015 17:41:41 -0500
> >>> Subject: Re: Topband: ADC Overload from MW transmitters
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> -Original Message- 
> >>> From: MIKE DURKIN
> >>> Sent: Monday, October 19, 2015 10:47 AM
> >>> To: topband@contesting.com
> >>> Subject: Re: Topband: ADC Overload from MW transmitters
> >>> 
> >>> SPAM !!
> >>> 
> >>> Mike--
> >>> Can you explain this opinion?
> >>> In my experience, almost anything Tom takes the trouble to publish is
well
> >>> thought-out and worth reading. Your expletive puzzles me.
> >>> Bill--W4BSG
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> ---
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> >> 
> >> _
> >> Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband 
> >> 
> >> 
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Topband: The Remote Question

[Doug Renwick]

I consider it another form of cheating.  Regardless of what the ARRL says.
Since when has the ARRL - DXCC been a bastion of ethics?  IMO ARRL ethics is
an oxymoron.

Without inserting politics into the discussion, all one has to do is look at
what is going in the world around us and it is clear the ARRL has fallen
into the same game plan.  Me, me, me and mini me.

What amazes me is all these 'cheaters' or 'cheater cheerleaders' voluntarily
admitting to cheating.  The contest committees need to study this effect to
get contest cheaters to admit to cheating on their own volition. 

Doug   

Generation of idiots - smart phones and dumb people.


-Original Message-


 Original message 


I just did a quick perusal of the current DXCC rules. If I understand them 
correctly:

1. Another ham can operate my station, using my call, and the contacts count
towards my DXCC.

2. I can go to his station, sign my call, and the contacts count towards my
DXCC.

So...the station doesn't matter and the operator doesn't matter. What the
heck
matters anymore?

73, Roger


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Re: Topband: Fwd: ARRL Board meets next week - I'm looking for input

[Doug Renwick]

I am in complete agreement with Bob and Charlie.  The ARRL has dumbed down
the DXCC award to the point where it is nearly meaningless.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

Mike,

I also do not like the idea of remote station operation being acceptable for
DXCC.
(Charlie, you have one more year on me,   I was licensed in 1958 :-)
I have pursued the DXCC awards for all these years and now to allow remote
op to be granted
the same awards gives the DXCC awards almost zero value. Whether the remote
operation is 
rented or self owned it makes no difference.  I'm sure a lot of us have the
same thinking on this
but haven't had the opportunity to express our feelings.  Actually I believe
the majority of ARRL DXers feel this 
way.   I think the board needs to find a way to get input from the majority
!
Lastly,  One consideration for the board to look at is to have a separate
DXCC category for remote operation. Then
everyone is happy and there would be a level playing field for each
category, home station or remote.  (After all that is the 
crux of the issue)


73,
Bob
K6UJ



 On Jul 10, 2015, at 12:54 PM, Charles Cu nningham
charlie-cunning...@nc.rr.com wrote:
 
 Hi, Mike
 
 Well, I've been licensed and a DXer since February 1957.  In my opinion
 remote stations and operations should NOT be acceptable for DXCC. Perhaps
a
 special NEW DXCC could be established for those operations Most of us over
 the decades have worked diligently so improve our stations and antennas
 within the bounds available to us!  To have to compete with remote Super
 Stations that are sited to provide significant advantages on certain DX
 paths or bands REALLY spoils it for oo many of us, and establishes is as a
 Sport for the Rich like so many other things in our society!  I am
opposed
 to offering conventional DXCC credit for remote operations!
 
 73,
 Charlie, K4OTV
 
 
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Tony
 K1AMF
 Sent: Friday, July 10, 2015 10:10 AM
 To: topband@contesting.com
 Subject: Topband: Fwd: ARRL Board meets next week - I'm looking for input
 
 FYI, now's your chance to speak up if you haven't already.  Please e-mail
 N2YBB or other ARRL board members directly with any questions or comments.
 Not looking to rehash things here on the reflector.
 
  Original message 
 From: ARRL Members Only Web site memberl...@www.arrl.org
 Date: 07/09/2015  7:01 PM  (GMT-05:00)
 To: k1...@live.com
 Subject: ARRL Board meets next week - I'm looking for input
 
 Hello,
 
 Next week, the Board of Directors will be holding their second meeting of
 the year.  One of the topics up for discussion is the recent change in
DXCC
 rules, particularly as to the use of remote operations for DXCC credit.
 
 I would be interested in knowing what you, the ARRL member, feel about the
 rules for DXCC.  In particular, I would like to know what your opinion is
 regarding crediting (for awards) DX contacts made by remote control
 operations, be they through self owned or rented stations.
 
 I would be also be interested in your experiences if you have operated
 remotely in chasing DX for DXCC credit.
 
 If you have any other items of interest, please also let me know.
 
 Thank you.
 
 73 de Mike N2YBB
 
 
 ARRL Hudson Division
 Director: Mike Lisenco, N2YBB
 n2...@arrl.org
 
 
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Re: Topband: [Bulk] Improving low angle reception DX Eng 8 ele Circle RCV Array

[Doug Renwick]

Hmmm.  I have had excellent success with that DXE 4- quare system.  I use my
own verticals and the only problem is deer catching the top hat string and
bending the vertical.  70 ft baselines seems short as the recommended is 135
ft for 160m.  I find it very forgiving as the system works even if the
verticals are not tuned correctly.  Best receive system ever for me.
Sometimes too much directivity especially in a contest,  if there can ever
be too much.
Doug


-Original Message-

My 4 sq DXE exhibits similar no directivity at times.  I think it is 
high angle signals.  I did add three 20 foot radials to each antenna, I 
don't think it matters what the vertical element is, a little better 
grounding is good.  My soil is wet/swampy forest/grass mix and I don't 
think they made much difference.  I put the radials along the square 70' 
baselines and pointing outward outside the square to minimize any 
coupling to the feedlines to the switch box in the center of the array.

My BIG problem is an intermittent S9+40 noise generated within the 
array.  Comes and goes, so it is very hard to troubleshoot.  I've 
disconnected each antenna one by one, checked, cleaned and reseated 
every cable, varied the power supply voltage, had the DXE preamp in and 
out and not found it. VERY frustrating!!  I did find the antenna amp 
pcb's had not been flux cleaned and at each F female connector a lot of 
corrosion products had built up.  I think this is because of the 
sustained DC voltage on that connector.  Removing the white crystalline 
gunk that went from F center to the 4 soldered legs made no difference.  
My next step is to take apart the switch box and see what is going on 
inside it.  DXE won't provide schematics, but I did find the W8JI patent 
which I think is what DXE is selling.

It's a very good antenna IMO, but DXE needs to have better QC. Residual 
flux is bad and although the antenna enclosures are well made, they 
aren't water tight.  Probably the boards should be conformal coated 
given the WX exposure, but that makes them harder to fix.

Grant KZ1W


On 3/1/2015 10:52 AM, W0MU Mike Fatchett wrote:
 I just recently hooked up my 8 ele rcv array and I was not too sure if 
 it was working correctly.

 I will need to do some maintenance and checking when the snow is gone 
 to make sure each element is working right.

 I chose the 160/80/40m which is close to 50 ft radius circle.  I may 
 opt to make it bigger if the area I have will allow.

 Last night in the NA QP RTTY contest the array seemed to be working 
 fine and was quite directional on stateside signals on 40 and 80.  I 
 am seeing directivity on 160 with local broadcast stations.

 I was listening to the 3G0ZV station last night on 80 and he had a 
 good signal.  His signal did not seem to change much when I changed 
 directions on the array.  I was unable to work him though :(  But that 
 is an Xmit antenna issue.

 The array is placed over what it probably poor sandy soil.  W3LPL 
 mention in some of his talks that he was adding some radials to his 
 receive array.  His elements are a bit different than the DX Eng 
 antennas so I don't know if this would help the DXE elements.

 My feeling is that the array could use some improvement in the low 
 angle reception.  I feel that it should hear better to Europe and Africa

 When I had just the 4 SQ Array up in Montana it was like night and 
 day.  EU Signals that were not copyable on the 80 xmit antenna were 
 perfectly copyable on the 4 sq array.  I am not seeing that on the 8 
 ele array.

 Conditions are always different so maybe it is fine but condx have 
 been poor?

 Thanks for your suggestions in advance!


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Re: Topband: Inverted L height vs. length.

[Doug Renwick]

I can speculate that your mail box would be overflowing and you could retire
comfortably especially if you had a 160m station that worked.
Sri Tom, I couldn't resist having some fun. 
Doug 

-Original Message-

24 hours and even not one comment?

Maybe I really should've said I was renting the station out for hire to
offshore stns only, to be used to work rare countries, during contests for
DXCC credits to put them at the top of the honor roll...

VE9AA
 
Mike, Coreen  Corey

Keswick Ridge, NB


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Re: Topband: DXCC Program Integrity

[Doug Renwick]

Larry I admire your ability to see past the 'smoke and mirrors' and expose
the hypocrisy of the ARRL DXCC program.  What you have said is true.  The
ARRL speaks out of both corners of their mouth.  There will be others who
will object to you exposing the DXCC program and there will be others who
wish to change the subject.  Some will find the truth unacceptable.

Doug

-Original Message-

 The integrity of the program is irrelevant

This one interesting sentence, made in another thread, may be at the root of
much of the disagreement expressed in the last few days with regards to
DXCC. It does cause one to wonder why the award exists at all. If DXCC only
matters to the recipient, why wouldn't their logbook serve the same purpose?
For some, it does. What added gratification does that extra piece of paper
provide? It's not exactly free. What makes the DXCC countries list so
special -- why not use some other list? Why did ARRL go to great pains to
make LoTW more challenging than online banking? Why are individuals
disqualified from the program if the award only affects *them*? Why do we
have card checkers that look for that dot between the 1 and the 8 like
the guy looking for a hanging chad with a magnifying glass? Finally, what
does it mean for the League to call DXCC the premier operating award then
turn up their hands and basically say we can't enforce any of this it's
up to you guys?

Larry K5RK




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Re: Topband: Remote now DXCC??

[Doug Renwick]

Yes the DXCC award you have earned is yours.
But the problem is the publishing of the standings.  The cheaters,
commercial RHR users, ethical types are all grouped together.  If the
standings were not published, highlighted, promoted then it would be a
personal award.  But when ALL are grouped together in the standings by call
sign and totals, then it becomes an issue.

No, the ARRL recognizes they can't/don't want to control the cheaters and so
have abdicated their responsibility in setting ethical standards. 

Doug 

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

Why are we centered on remote operations dirtying up the DXCC program?  
DXCC is far from clean now and from the limited amount of reading 
available people have been scamming DXCC long before I was licensed in 1978.

The ARRL recognizes that this is a new and upcoming technology and the 
more and more people will be using it.

The DXCC program is based on YOUR moral and ethical fiber not to cheat.  
We through some card checking in there and catch a few problems here and 
there.

I was doing an audit of my award and found and number of typos that gave 
me credit for countries I never worked on certain bands.  I alerted the 
DXCC desk and they fixed them.  How many other people are going to take 
the time to do what I did and then willingly remove a confirmation.  I 
would hope most, but many don't care.

We know people have been using excessive and illegal power for years and 
years.

People have submitted QSL cards that have been altered or submitted 
cards that for countries they have never worked.

We know people said they want to places they did not.  How many did we 
catch vs how many that were not.  How many of you know things have never 
been reported.

Remote receivers.  Remote Xmitters.

The DXCC award that you earn is yours.   How you get there is up to you 
and your integrity, morals, ethics, etc.  The cheating has been going on 
for years and years and years.  Remote is just another avenue for  a 
cheater to use.

The issuing of a DXCC award to someone else has no bearing on your 
award.  Nothing changed.  You didn't drop a spot or gain a spot. Your 
standing is based on the number of countries you have worked and claimed.

If the ARRL did not make money selling plaques and certificates and LOTW 
credits do you really think they would be pushing it?  The Centennial 
QSO party was marketing genius.  They sold tons of LOTW credits and 
awards.  They are not making any money from my Life Membership that I 
paid for 30 years ago.

Ham radio is centered around the vast majority of people doing it right 
and they do.  For the most part we are a self policing group.

Just like packet, remote radio is here, has been here for a while and it 
is never going away.  Remote radio is not going affect your awards and 
you will probably never know if and when you work remote stations.

The only problems I see are perceived problems that might happen or that 
have been happening for years that most just never knew about. Running 
remote from W7 and not telling people that your Xmitter is in Virginia 
is just one bad apple.  He should do what is right.  How many slims have 
we all worked?  Plenty.  What was the result of that?  Go work the 
station again.


Mike W0MU



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Re: Topband: Question...

[Doug Renwick]

I believe I understand what you are saying ... if you can't control it then
legalize it.

Doug

-Original Message-

thrown out a hotel upper storey window. Question: can I link myself via the 
internet to some remote ...rent-a-station in, say, nearby Japan, and use 
that station to QSO them, all the while using my callsign of VE3CUI...?

 Like I said earlier, it's an ignorant question, from an ignorant Ham---but

 I would like to know the answer, just the same...!

 Many thanks, 

Eddy,

It is always good to figure out how the something we complained about 
actually works, and what the impact is. I see you still cling to the rental

myth that is used to stir people up.

The fact is, there are many dozens, if not hundreds, of completely free 
unmonitored stations on line right now.

My opinion is, if someone wanted to do what you describe, they would likely 
do it through one of the many free open access small stations all over the 
world, of which there are probably hundreds. They would be invisible and 
unrecorded.

It seems illogical to me that someone would join a club or group, become 
identified, and pay a deposit they lose if caught breaking terms, and a fee 
for a monitored and logged system when they can do it free and without 
logging.

I'm not sure how that could be controlled, because anyone who can download 
software and has the right equipment can connect.

This entire topic seems backwards to me, because the most vocal ranters 
appear to be the very people who don't understand the system, and who have 
not thought through the impact and how to solve or reduce problems.

For example, the ARRL is being blamed for profiting from DXCC, but they 
probably have no idea if DXCC is a net loss or net profit for the ARRL. I 
personally do not think it is a fund raiser for them, but that's my guess. I

would not publically rant about it one way or another without research.

We all know, factually, many years ago DXCC became a matter of the person 
and not the station or station location (other than  being within a 
country). Some people would like to see this to go back to the station or at

least worked within reasonable bounds of distance (I am one of them). Unlike

some, I don't think this is an ethical thing. I think a rule is a rule, and 
if we don't like the rule we carefully and thoughtfully change the rule. 
(I've never even applied for DXCC, but I do enjoy working countries for my 
own satisfaction. I do have RCC, but after the strange looks at show and 
tell in eighth grade I have kept that hidden.)

After thinking about this for a few years, I think there should be a 
requirement that no radio transmitter be openly accessible to the general 
public. To me, that is no different than having a running unmonitored 
transmitter on a table in a public shopping mall. I think anyone offering a 
transmitter (or receiver in real time, without induced latency) to the 
general population without reasonably secure user control is setting the 
world up for problems.

The really odd thing about this thread is some people dislike controlled 
systems and people who have or use controlled systems, but they have no 
comment on what amounts to hundreds of radios openly accessible with no 
controls, restrictions, and no monitoring. They have no problem with someone

driving to a station that isn't theirs and counting the country, but they 
have a problem if it is via a link.

W6YY used a remote link in 160 contests way back around 1963. John was my 
first or second California contact on 160. This has been going on quite a 
while.

73 Tom 

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Re: Topband: Remote now DXCC??

[Doug Renwick]

Response below ***

-Original Message-

Why does publishing the results change anything.  Is there a prize for 
being Honor Roll number 1?

*** yes

How do you account for all the other dirty contacts on the DXCC rolls?  
Those are just ignored and only remote contacts are the problem?

*** Read my post again: The cheaters, commercial RHR users, ethical types
are all grouped together.  You mention 'dirty contacts' ... care to explain?

Once again they publish where you stand.  If guess if you need to 
compare yourself to other people on the list so be it.  I have been 
working on and off for DXCC honor roll since 1978.  It is not a race for 
me.  Obtaining Honor Role takes time, skill and patience.  The more time 
people have to spend in front of their radio the more dx they work.

*** Fine, not a race for you but a race for others.

The guy that has 10 more countries than me is not necessarily any better 
at dxing than I am.  He might just have been on the radio more and was 
in an area that had better propagation.

You are trying to find reasons to discredit remote operations by filling 
holes in a DXCC program that is far from perfect.

*** Let me help out here.  I have gone on record in past postings that I
personally do NOT have a problem with remote operations in the vicinity of
their home station.  The problem is people using remotes in different
countries and on different sides of the continent to inflate their
standings.

Doug

Mike W0MU

On 2/27/2015 11:02 AM, Doug Renwick wrote:
 Yes the DXCC award you have earned is yours.
 But the problem is the publishing of the standings.  The cheaters,
 commercial RHR users, ethical types are all grouped together.  If the
 standings were not published, highlighted, promoted then it would be a
 personal award.  But when ALL are grouped together in the standings by
call
 sign and totals, then it becomes an issue.

 No, the ARRL recognizes they can't/don't want to control the cheaters and
so
 have abdicated their responsibility in setting ethical standards.

 Doug


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Re: Topband: Remote now DXCC??

[Doug Renwick]

Yes you are probably right that protesting won't change a thing.  But should
that mean that when something negative like this happens, that voicing an
objection is not considered?  Should we just shrug and say 'whatever'.  Some
do say whatever.  Yes cheating has been around for some time.  The question
is where do you set your standards?  High or low.  Yes it is just a hobby,
but how it plays affects us in other ways.
Doug 

-Original Message-

 *** Let me help out here.  I have gone on record in past postings that I
 personally do NOT have a problem with remote operations in the vicinity of
 their home station.  The problem is people using remotes in different
 countries and on different sides of the continent to inflate their
 standings.
 
 Doug

As to this specific thing; If someone is in another country close to 
rare DX, visits a ham and uses their station and then uses their own 
home call when making the easy Q, that's cheating. This kind of 
cheating has been possible all along, it may make it easier with 
today's technology. 

I never worked Don Miller but I did work Romeo, both DXers were 
notorious for supposedly claiming to be where they weren't  slews of 
people worked them feeling they worked a legit operation. I worked 
Romeo in 91 as XY0RR and got his QSL  it counted for DXCC. Once I 
heard the flap about his operation, I didn't feel I fairly worked 
Myanmar until I got confirmation from XZ1J for a Q in 2013.

People have been claiming DXCC credit unfairly and giving it for 
years. RHR will not make anything new happen. I just sent something 
offlist to one of us and I agree with what I said... As to people 
not doing the right thing with a tool, that's been happening since 
those apes hit each other with femurs in the opening scene in the 
movie 2001.

Or as the Who said in We won't get fooled again: Meet the new Boss, 
same as the old Boss.

People have been cooking the books for years  someone always will 
be; hasn't stopped me from having fun for 35+ years.

73,

Gary
KA1J


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Re: Topband: Brave New World

[Doug Renwick]

Herb,
I understand your frustration with your call sign screw ups.  I get the same
thing from time to time using a VA prefix.  I worked North Korea on both 10
and 15m, but the 15m contact was no where to be found, nothing even close.
That and other screw ups has taught me to make sure I am in the log, if I
really need that country or band, to make a duplicate contact.  I know some
will get all bent and twisted out of shape for that practice, but I am in
this game to win.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

Doug, How-long is now? There is nothing instant about working North 
Korea for DXCC.  It would take much time and meticulous planning.  And 
some places I worked have been for decades. Actually waiting for and 
working  BS7H and then got that dreaded message I was not in the 
log...I probably will never ever have another chance work this piece of 
rock in the South China Sea.  There are gunboats nearby to make sure of 
that. I do not feel entitled to work anything nor even find someone 
who has access to the BS7H logs and find my call there as/*K4VFZ */which 
so often occurs even though the op replied with KV4FZ TU How would I 
ever know what the op put down in the log until it was to late to do 
anything about it? BTW /*K4VFZ*/ has never been issued as a call but it 
has over 100 countries already without ever working any of them.

It continues to be a struggle and the techologocial advances like the 
internet, Remote Rig, automatically controlled amps, Steppers, skimmers 
and the like should never be considered a scourge on our hobby as some 
try to portray them.






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Re: Topband: *****SPAM***** Re: Brave New World

[Doug Renwick]

Don't feel sorry for me.  For while it lasted I have had loads of fun,
learned a lot, met many new friends, and travelled to places some can only
dream of; all because of amateur radio.
Yes I agree that the ARRL has 'sold it's soul to the devil'.  Money.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

I'm sorry for you!. I'm alive, we are alive. Ham Radio is more exciting and
alive than ever. 700.000 licensed in US only.

Don't look in the mirror, just do what works for you. Ham Radio is an option
and a hobby based on each one individual interest.

I just worked my country # 278 o 160m since 2006, my first DXCC on 160 from
Brazil started in 1972 and worked my #100 in 1992. Do I trade the first 20
years to work 100 with the last 9 that I worked #278. Definitively not.

What I don't like about HRH is the commercial aspect of it, U$ /min air
time. The legality of it depends on the money behind each side. We can lose
our privileges with this precedent. It depends in how much money will in the
table. Best strategy is do not play it,  if you don't want to live with the
doubt to lose it.

Regards
JC
N4IS


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Re: Topband: Brave New World

[Doug Renwick]

This is a good example of the entitlement crowd attitude.  They believe that
all the DXCC entities need to be available NOW, no waiting.  Reaching the
top of the honor roll was long term plan that kept us interested in DXing
for a lifetime.  Now some want it to be just like a mail order degree ... no
work and instant gratification.  Just like our schools ... no one fails ...
everyone passes.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.
-Original Message-


I really believe all this concern where the operator is actually seated 
will be somewhat lessened when someone is able to get a compact plug and 
play emote controlled briefcase size setup in P5. The operation would 
not require a visa and radio clubs could share in providing the 
operators. A 100 watt package with a 20-10 vertical placed in a utility 
room on the top floor of the 1082 foot high Ryugyong hotel in downtown 
Pyongyang for the cost of just having the hotel feature on the QSL card. 
Some of the QSL proceeds cold go to a help establish a radio club in 
PDRK and those techies there could probably end up securing a proper 
license for the system.  Just think of North Korean being on the air 
24/7 and everyone would have a chance to finally get this most rare an 
elusive country confirmed. the badmouthing of remote controlled stations 
would end.


Herb Schoenbohm, KV4FZ



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Re: Topband: Rules vs. Ethics (was Brave New World)

[Doug Renwick]

Good for you Larry to post this.  It is interesting how some folks come up
with all sorts of excuses to justify their unethical/immoral thoughts and
behavior.
The ARRL by fully putting the onus on the operator has abdicated the
leadership role in ethical behavior, which to me is the same as condoning
unethical behavior.

Doug
-Original Message-
 

Jim stated as much in the note to which you are replying. 
 
What is in play here is the difference between laws/rules and ethics. Just
because something is legal does not make it ethical.  Adultery is not a
crime in 29 states of the United States or most of the industrialized world.
Is it therefore ethical? Is it ethical to click between remotes on the east
and west coast because DXCC rules permit it? Throwing their hands up, the
League is leaving the answer to the last question up to the individual
operator. Why, if such operations are so ethically pure would one commercial
remote business advertise completely anonymous operation? The very nature
of the wording suggests their service is the ham radio version of the
No-Tell Motel.

With regards to the how I got my award shouldn't matter to anyone else,
I'd argue that the operator on the other end of an unethical contact can
be affected. There's a fair chance that he is pursuing an award as well. An
operator in EU pursuing WAS (or VUCC on 6m) may work a W7 who is using a
remote -- commercial or otherwise -- and does not indicate the location of
the actual transmitter. The EU op goes away thinking he worked Oregon. Lo
and behold the LoTW match or paper card shows up and confirms he did.
There are a couple of west coast stations who routinely use east coast
remotes to work EU on 6m and use their home state and grid square in the
exchange. A savvy op on the other end can often tell if the exchange is
legit, but there are strange spotlight openings on that band, just as there
are on Topband. These ethical lapses are not entirely victimless. 

Larry K5RK

 

 

 

 

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Re: Topband: Brave New World

[Doug Renwick]

Well the same thing is going on with the Olympics.  Steroids are supposedly
banned if you get caught.  New ways to hid the use of steroids continues.
Eventually the use of steroids will be accepted because the regulators fail.
Same thing with ham radio.  New ways to cheat are evolving, are being
accepted by some and will eventually become the norm.  I am not referring to
someone who has a remote a few miles from his home.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

I can understand why people are upset about this. But the reality is that
no matter how upset we decide to be about this sort of thing, it's simply
going to happen more and more.

There's some truth to the saying, Don't worry, be happy. :-)

The rest of us can operate our stations the right way. End of psychology
sermon.

73, Mike
www.w0btu.com


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Re: Topband: *****SPAM***** Re: Brave New World

[Doug Renwick]

Eddy, Ham Radio is dead, extinct.  It has been replaced with Internet Radio.
I once held an amateur radio licence; it now belongs in a museum.  Some how
good things don't last forever.  I have had a lot of fun when the hobby was
amateur radio.  I guess it is time to move on and find another fun hobby.
And to those who enjoy internet radio; try and have some fun knowing you
just killed amateur radio.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.
-Original Message-

Hi Guys,

Is the day very far off in the distant future when the physical human
element won't even be needed at a radio station on the eve of a contest...?

Just programme the event into the computer, hook it up to the rig...and then
go off to bed. The next day you meander down to the shack, coffee in hand 
rubbing the sleep out of your eyes, to learn that in your absence, your
station made some 5,000 QSOs, AND DXCC, twice over!

Remember Dr. DX of the 1980's...? Shades of days yet to come---if ,
indeed, those days are not here already.

At the risk of sounding like a dinosaur---on second thought, who cares? The
dinosaurs ruled the earth for untold millions of years, to man's single
million---just as insurance companies  lawyers are spelling the demise of
kids' playground toys and group get-togethers, computers will spell the end
of the very essence that makes Ham radio fun. At least to dinosaurs like
yours truly, anyway.

~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ


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Topband: Yikes

[Doug Renwick]

K1N club log is now up.  First QSO costs $6.00 USD.  That's got to be the
most expensive I have seen.  Anyone top that one.  I am not complaining!

Doug

There are some ideas so absurd that only an intellectual or lawyer could
believe them. - George Orwell, 1984



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Re: Topband: K1N DQRM Tracking Project

[Doug Renwick]

A poster on the cluster said it the best:
DQRM triangulation = nonsense idea!
There is no way this is going to identify the offending station(s).
IMO at best a bluff.  

Doug

-Original Message-

Is anyone using this DQRM Tracking Project report?  They want reports of
deliberate QRM like 'tuner uppers' and other types, but not QRMers like cops
or 'no splitters'.  I don't know how accurate they can be to identify the
guilty station on any band especially 160m with or without a directional
antenna.


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Re: Topband: Out-of-Turn Callers DX Expedition finances

[Doug Renwick]

The point that Garry is making, he did it very well, is that EU as a group
should contribute more than what they are presently doing.  And he is right.

Doug


-Original Message-

 Garry,
In the good old days when I was learning the art of ham radio from Don
Miller's DX and contest operations and my Dad UB5WF, I've got an idea of the
ham spirit that makes all of us equal under the Sun.
This is the corner stone of our hobby - the equality, no matter how much
one's paid for the hardware and antennae or has donated for a certain
expedition.
You presume that although we are equal, the country which paid more is more
equal then the others.
I think this is completely wrong.
In fact, how can you distinguish between those US hams who paid and those
who not? Does it mean that their countrymen, in accordance with your theory,
have paid for their free lunch?
I was fortunate to have them all before the era of unproportionally
expensive dxpeditions and accompanying aggressive fundraising has come.  

Пятница, 06 февраля 2015, 18:27 -08:00 от Garry Shapiro ga...@ni6t.com:
Dado,

When you go to see a film, do you expect your neighbor to buy your 
ticket? Do you complain when you do not like the film?

When you buy a car, do you expect your neighbor to pay the dealer? Do 
you complain when the car is not perfect?

When you go to a restaurant, do you expect your neighbor to buy you 
dinner? Do you complain if you do not like the food?

If you do, and get away with it, then you go right ahead and let your 
fellow hams pay for your DXing. You are obviously an important person 
and deserve such consideration. ;-)
It therefore must be a privilege for me to support your hobby for you, 
and thank you.

Back during the Arab oil embargo in 1973, there was a very popular 
bumper sticker in the US which said:

Gas, grass or a**: nobody rides free.  That is American slang, but I 
think you can figure it out.

Garry, NI6T



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Re: Topband: Out-of-Turn Callers DX Expedition finances

[Doug Renwick]

Tim those are kind thoughts.
But let me ask 'how much do you contribute in $.  As those who watch our
governments see it is easy for them to give away other people's money.
EU economic woes are self inflicted!  How many times does EU need to be
bailed out?  Forever?
I am not American but I appreciate a lot, not all, of the sacrifices they
have made.

Doug

-Original Message-

I turn on the news every day and hear about EU economic woes. What's wrong
with the Marshall Plan for DX? Just as NA (not just EU) benefited
economically from the real Marshall plan (I explain it to my kids using
their language as a kickstarter for EU-NA trade), NA guys benefit every
time an entity is activated even if they mostly work EU. Ham radio truly is
global, it is not a zero-sum game, we all get at least a couple Q's if not
all bands-all modes every time an entity is activated. And we should feel
good in our dumb-American smugness for donating the most (even though we
don't have to brag about it.)

Tim N3QE

On Sat, Feb 7, 2015 at 8:36 AM, Doug Renwick ve...@sasktel.net wrote:

 The point that Garry is making, he did it very well, is that EU as a group
 should contribute more than what they are presently doing.  And he is
 right.

 Doug


 -Original Message-

  Garry,
 In the good old days when I was learning the art of ham radio from Don
 Miller's DX and contest operations and my Dad UB5WF, I've got an idea of
 the
 ham spirit that makes all of us equal under the Sun.
 This is the corner stone of our hobby - the equality, no matter how much
 one's paid for the hardware and antennae or has donated for a certain
 expedition.
 You presume that although we are equal, the country which paid more is
more
 equal then the others.
 I think this is completely wrong.
 In fact, how can you distinguish between those US hams who paid and those
 who not? Does it mean that their countrymen, in accordance with your
 theory,
 have paid for their free lunch?
 I was fortunate to have them all before the era of unproportionally
 expensive dxpeditions and accompanying aggressive fundraising has come.

 Пятница, 06 февраля 2015, 18:27 -08:00 от Garry Shapiro ga...@ni6t.com:
 Dado,
 
 When you go to see a film, do you expect your neighbor to buy your
 ticket? Do you complain when you do not like the film?
 
 When you buy a car, do you expect your neighbor to pay the dealer? Do
 you complain when the car is not perfect?
 
 When you go to a restaurant, do you expect your neighbor to buy you
 dinner? Do you complain if you do not like the food?
 
 If you do, and get away with it, then you go right ahead and let your
 fellow hams pay for your DXing. You are obviously an important person
 and deserve such consideration. ;-)
 It therefore must be a privilege for me to support your hobby for you,
 and thank you.
 
 Back during the Arab oil embargo in 1973, there was a very popular
 bumper sticker in the US which said:
 
 Gas, grass or a**: nobody rides free.  That is American slang, but I
 think you can figure it out.
 
 Garry, NI6T


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Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log

[Doug Renwick]

I am surprised no one has replied.  Maybe they are all in shock with
disbelief.

No, the very sad thing is that someone would publically post such a
condescending remark about his fellow amateurs, calling them all stupid.

Doug

-Original Message-

The overreaction here on Topband was unbelievable. Very sad for a bunch 
of folks I used to think had some intelligence.

73,
Steve, N2IC



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Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log

[Doug Renwick]

From my experience including being part of dxpeditions, several things can
happen.  I have had cases where I clearly worked the station only to get a
NIL.  And that included P5.  If the contact is for a new band then I make
sure I am in the log.  With a good on line log it isn't necessary to doubt
the contact or make a duplicate.  Some dxpeditions even have real time on
line logs.
As far as making a second contact in 10 minutes, I can see some reasons.
The first contact was iffy.  Did he actually send my call sign, or I wasn't
able to copy clearly due to QRM or QRN.  Propagation has improved and I have
a better copy.  The dxpedition was sending cw so fast my brain couldn't
copy.
There are cases that I call 'once in a life time propagation'.  Propagation
to far away places on 160m that one will never witness it again.  Like
working EY8MM from VE5.
On the dxpedition side mistakes will happen.  The on the air contact is made
but something gets screwed up and the contact doesn't get logged or gets
accidentally deleted from the log.
I remember a case where my qso didn't appear in the on line log after the
dxpedition was over.  I emailed the qsl manager. They checked and found that
they had forgot to unload that log.
So I have my reasons, not excuses, for my operating practices, based on my
experience.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

The 160 operator last night was complaining about all of the dupes. He 
thought he had at least 50 dupe QSOs in the evening (this was about 9:30 
EST). Some people will just do dupes. In XV there were many that I worked 
that called me again in maybe 10 minutes (I was posting to LoTW and eQSL 
within 24 hours).

73, Larry  W6NWS



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Re: Topband: K1N On Line Log

[Doug Renwick]

I just checked the updated on line log and my first Q's on 80 and 160 (both
clearly made) are still missing.  So working them again was a good decision.

From their website If you don't see your Q's by this time tomorrow, it's
probably best to work us again.

Doug

-Original Message-

From my experience including being part of dxpeditions, several things can
happen.  I have had cases where I clearly worked the station only to get a
NIL.  And that included P5.  If the contact is for a new band then I make
sure I am in the log.  With a good on line log it isn't necessary to doubt
the contact or make a duplicate.  Some dxpeditions even have real time on
line logs.
As far as making a second contact in 10 minutes, I can see some reasons.
The first contact was iffy.  Did he actually send my call sign, or I wasn't
able to copy clearly due to QRM or QRN.  Propagation has improved and I have
a better copy.  The dxpedition was sending cw so fast my brain couldn't
copy.
There are cases that I call 'once in a life time propagation'.  Propagation
to far away places on 160m that one will never witness it again.  Like
working EY8MM from VE5.
On the dxpedition side mistakes will happen.  The on the air contact is made
but something gets screwed up and the contact doesn't get logged or gets
accidentally deleted from the log.
I remember a case where my qso didn't appear in the on line log after the
dxpedition was over.  I emailed the qsl manager. They checked and found that
they had forgot to unload that log.
So I have my reasons, not excuses, for my operating practices, based on my
experience.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.



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Re: Topband: Missing K1N 160m QSO records just uploaded to Clublog

[Doug Renwick]

Tree,

My 80 and 160m Feb 4 Q's are still not showing.
Best thing is to work them again following their advice.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

This is good news - but still not seeing my call or ZL3IX who worked
him just before me.

QSO was around 0930 on 4 Feb UTC.

Others???

Tree N6TR

On Fri, Feb 6, 2015 at 9:40 AM, Lloyd Berg  N9LB lloydb...@charter.net
wrote:
 All,

 They just uploaded the missing K1N 160m QSO records to Clublog site a few
 minutes ago. ~ 7000 entries!

 ... including my missing 160m QSO :-)

 73

 Lloyd - N9LB



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Re: Topband: Missing K1N 160m QSO records just uploaded to Clublog

[Doug Renwick]

Sri but the missing Qs are still missing.  The February 4th both 80 and 160m
Qs are missing.

Doug

-Original Message-

All,

They just uploaded the missing K1N 160m QSO records to Clublog site a 
few minutes ago. ~ 7000 entries!

... including my missing 160m QSO :-)

73

Lloyd - N9LB




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Topband: K1N On Line Log

[Doug Renwick]

Tonight the K1N on line log came back on.  For me I lost a bunch of Qs that
were there before, and some Qs I had made previously still didn't show.  So
I decided to work them again on 80 and 160 just to make sure.  I am not sure
what the problem is but a lot of folks are unhappy.  In time it will be
sorted out but in the meantime it does not cast a good light on an excellent
operation.

Doug 

There are some ideas so absurd that only an intellectual or lawyer could
believe them. - George Orwell, 1984



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Re: Topband: Foreign stns using NA remotes for K1N

[Doug Renwick]

And let me counter with another quote:

Edmund Burke said all that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good
men do nothing.

Doug

-Original Message-

What difference does it make? Who cares if someone else, rich or not,
cheats? 
We should encourage them to work K1N as quickly as possible and then go
away.

I leave you with a Shakespeare quote, It is a tale told by an idiot, full
of sound and fury, but signifying nothing.

Tod, K0TO

 On Feb 4, 2015, at 12:00 PM, Joel Harrison w...@w5zn.org wrote:
 
 
 Dave - you are correct. That very statement was rather boldly made by a
 prominent 160 meter person right here. At the time I thought about
 throwing the flag on that one but decided, then, not to. I know the remote
 folks can track ISP addresses of those connected but do not know how they
 can verify a station outside the country where the remote is located is
 identifying correctly and lawfully.
 
 So, I'll make a bold statement hereThe remote folks don't care and
 will not control it as long as the  are flowing in. Money talks and
 the rules can go to hell.
 
 Am I wrong?? Then prove me wrong and let's see some hammering down on this
 by the remote folks.
 
 73 Joel W5ZN
 
 
 I mentioned last week that we would be seeing over seas stations using US
 based remotes stations to work K1N.  It was mentioned here that this
won't
 happen, and that the US remote station operators monitor this activity
 carefully and do not permit it.  Well, it is happening.  I have
personally
 witnessed on IT9 station and one JA station using clearly NA based remote
 stations to work K1N on 160m.  That's probably just the tip of the
 iceberg.  It's rather obvious when they are on 160m and are 20 or 30 db
 stronger than the din of the DX stations calling.  There will be more.
 Incidentally, they were not signing at /W#, /K#, etc.  Realistically it's
 probably not preventable but saddening.
 
 In the meantime, I think the K1N ops are doing nothing short of a
fabulous
 job.  Excellent Q rates, good job managing the piles, deftly QSYing to
 dodge DQRM, all the while being quite cheerful and courteous.   Bravo!
 
 73. . . Dave, W0FLS


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Re: Topband: Out-of-Turn Callers

[Doug Renwick]

The irony in all this is compare the bird protection on Navassa to wind
farms stateside which are allowed to kill thousands of birds including your
golden eagle.
You just can't make this stupidity up.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

First of all, they haven't reported having their beverages installed.

The original plan submitted for approval was denied because the wires could
impact the birds in the island, final and approved plan was based on
vertical only for low bands and fiberglass protected wires  SteepIR. 

I am surprised they installed dipoles, they may get a last minute approval
but wires were not allowed by USFWS. 
That's why there are no beverages on K1N plan.

 http://www.navassadx.com/


Regards

JC
 
N4IS



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Re: Topband: Foreign stns using NA remotes for K1N

[Doug Renwick]

Here is one statement posted at a RHR website

◦100% anonymous operation

How is someone going to get around that?

Doug


-Original Message-

  RHR requires a log in name, password, and they watch IPs. After some
early abuse, they started checking to be sure the name and password come
from the same IP or IP pool as the user name and password combo. When it is
a foreign user, of which there are a limited number, the traffic is
watched.

Hi Tom

Yes. Everything is so clear and controlled by RHR that no one will use the
remote station to work  a new DXCC because they/he/she must use  /p or /W4 ,
That use of /remote call sign makes the QSO invalid for DXCC.

So, why not published the call sign of all RHR users and  send it to DXCC
desk! 

Let's make this clear and transparent. 

DXCC can create a new category for RHR DXCC users? 

Is this IT9 is a RHR customer?

Regards
JC
N4IS


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Re: Topband: Foreign stns using NA remotes for K1N

[Doug Renwick]

Yes I couldn't agree more.  Most interesting was seeing the call signs
belonging to the lynch mob posted here and in private mailings to me.  And
believe me, some were of well known DXers.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

snip

I don't like where this reflector has headed. I don't care what ZM appeared 
to have done, ripping someone apart here is just as tasteless as anything ZM

might have done.


73 Tom
 


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Re: Topband: Foreign stns using NA remotes for K1N

[Doug Renwick]

Well thanks Tom for adding another nail to the coffin.  I guess the old
saying if you can't beat them, then join them got to you.
You are right on one point.  The abolishment of the mileage limit helped
destroy the DXCC.

Doug

-Original Message-

I wouldn't know who their customers are, or how many customers they have.

I only care how someone can use my station.

I don't really understand the fuss. The last good DXCC's were when we had a 
mileage limit. Even then, someone could use a second site. It was actually 
common to use second sites. W1BU did it from a swamp, even W1BB had two 
stations. People used BC towers, it wasn't their stuff. One guy used a VOA 
antenna system. Everyone used to admire that. People would go to other 
stations as far back as I can remember.

People come here and operate all the time. They work new countries.

Now, suddenly, it is so unfair. How can we survive?

73 Tom



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Topband: K1N

[Doug Renwick]

I have worked K1N on all bands 10 - 160m (not bragging) from my home only
station (bragging) that I can easily see from my back yard.  And no I don't
live on the east coast but in the northern mid west.
Don't waste time commenting on this on topband.

Doug

There are some ideas so absurd that only an intellectual or lawyer could
believe them. - George Orwell, 1984



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Re: Topband: [Bulk] Re: Out-of-Turn Callers

[Doug Renwick]

The lynch mob is clearly out to get KK6ZM when he apparently did NOTHING
WRONG.  The mob is yelling 'crucify him', 'crucify him'.  It began with a
biased post that failed to see the whole picture and the mob ran with it.

Some of the posts have displayed a surprising level of ignorance to the
events.  Yet the mob wishes to ignore the facts.

One said I'm glad Milt posted what he did.  Wrong - that should NEVER have
been posted in it's form.

Another said This is not a capital offense  Wrong - In the situation
it was NOT an offence at all.

Another said He made a mistake.  Wrong - he did NOT make a mistake.  He
was following the operators implied instructions when calling for JA and
working stateside instead.

Another said no chance he'll make that mistake again. Wrong - he did NOT
make a mistake.

And this from someone who could be a mob leader as a matter of courtesy i
sent KK6ZM a personal email suggesting that his behavior was totally wrong
when calling K1N and that an apology on the topband reflector would be in
order.

I could go on but I have made my point.

Tom, like you, I find this whole mess unsportsmanlike.  People taking their
inner hate out on someone who did nothing wrong.  People's nature has not
changed in thousands of years.  All this in a hobby that is supposed to be
fun.  You mobsters make me sick.

Doug

-Original Message-

Calling out of turn not only is one of the least damaging things and most 
common things someone might do. As a matter of fact, assuming the DX 
stations has a reasonable bandwidth CW filter, out of turn calling is 
thousands of times less disruptive to others than transmitting on the DX 
station's frequency, or spreading a pile up over 15-20 kHz.

I doubt making a whipping boy out of someone in public will have any effect 
on the other 250,000 people who have done it at least once.

A simple email direct to the person would have been more reasonable than a 
public two day flogging.

Are we getting cranking and set in our ways, or what? :)

73 Tom




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Re: Topband: Foreign stns using NA remotes for K1N

[Doug Renwick]

I've said this before.  Let's just get rid of all this foolishness with RHR,
etc. and just send the dxpedition a couple hundred dollar bills for
confirmation on bands, all modes.  Essentially that is what DXing is
becoming for some.  Yes the 'Rise and Fall of DXCC' before our vary eyes.

Doug

-Original Message-

Here's are a couple of quotes from the Remote Ham Radio Newsletter that 
showed up in my mailbox today.

=   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =

As we write this newsletter the K1N team is on the air with a BIG 
signal. We are happy to announce that many have already snagged them on 
80M and 160M with ease using the RHR network. The experienced fifteen 
man team is planning a 14 day stay with around the clock operation, this 
will give operators plenty of time to get this ATNO before they depart. 
If you need NAVASSA, we have the tools to help you work them, RHR has a 
total of seventeen sites on the air with plenty of capacity to work this 
super rare DXpedition.

EP6T Iran DXpedition worked on 9 bands from RHR sites including the top 
band.

FT5ZM Amsterdam Island worked on 9 Bands from RHR sites including the 
top band.

=   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =   =

No need to build a station, just buy a K3/0 and rent one. Want a 160 or 
80M QSO? No problem -- rent a superstation in one of the southern states 
to work Navassa, South America, and entities in the South Atlantic, in 
Maine  for EU and EP6T.  Rent one on the west coast to work Oceania and 
Asia. This comes as close to a box-top operation as I've seen yet.  
Absolutely disgusting.

As I've posted here, I have NO problem with someone who is stuck with 
nasty RF noise and antenna restrictions building a remote station near 
his home QTH, or even using a single remote station close to his QTH, to 
chase awards and contest. But this is not what Remote Ham Radio is SELLING.

Anyone who doesn't think this is cheating doesn't have a clue about the 
true spirit of ham radio.  And I've been a ham long enough to remember 
what that was.

73, Jim K9YC




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Re: Topband: Out-of-Turn Callers

[Doug Renwick]

If the KK6ZM story is fact, then he did what I would have done based on the
operator at K1N's actions.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

This is not a defense of KK6ZM -- I don't even know the guy -- but I can
assure you, he was very much aware of what he was doing. Patrick was in the
Low Band Chat Room for the duration of this morning's opening. He heard and
understood the K1N request for JA only. He also heard ~20 JAs calling. After
a few K1N calls for JA, they went back to an out-of-turn caller, K4xxx.
After that, KK6ZM waited until he was sure K1N was not hearing the JAs
before he threw in his call. He took a lot of cluster heat, but some of the
Low Band Chat guys encouraged him to keep trying. (They also heard the JA
callers who K1N was apparently not hearing.)

As I said, I know very little about KK6ZM, but I DO know this... When I
still lived in CA, on 160, he out-heard me 10:1. This morning he was
hearing K1N and the JAs very well. He was not being a deliberate bozo. It
was not until K1N rewarded the K4 for out-of-turn calling that he tried his
luck.

Say what you want to about KK6ZM. In my opinion, K1N shot himself in the
foot when he didn't follow his own in instructions.

Now for my little vent... Nah, it ain't worth it! :o)

Jim, WS6X 



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Re: Topband: CQWW160 Remote receiver rule

[Doug Renwick]

Here is rule # 11

11.  Issues concerning remotely controlled operating and DXCC are best dealt
with by each individual carefully considering the ethical limits that he/she
will accept for his/her DXCC and other operating awards.  As the premier
operating award in Amateur Radio, DXCC draws intense scrutiny from its
participants.  As DX chasers climb up the Standings there will be increased
attention given to these achievements and the owner of these achievements
needs to be comfortable standing behind his/her award and numbers.  Peer
attention has always been a part of awards chasing, of course, but in these
times with so many awards and so many players it is more important than ever
to 'play the game' ethically.

ethical limits that he/she will accept ; more important than ever to play
the game ethically

It would appear to me that the ARRL has given up and now relies on, or
pleads with the operators to have 'ethical limits'.  Yes it is more
important than ever because the ARRL has little control over ethical limits.

So the ARRL is aware of the cheating that goes on and will continue to go
on.  That coupled with the decline in ethical values in our society
seriously affects the DXCC award.

People have different ethical limits.  Some could feel that breaking an
'unreasonable' rule falls within their ethical limits.  Yes it is left up to
the individual to decide.  But when all DXCC chasers are put in the same
game, i.e. posted standings, it only encourages the bending of the rules.

Doug


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Re: Topband: EP6 from the KH6 side

[Doug Renwick]

Well have the noise problems been taken care of ??  This morning some time
after 1400 UTC they showed up on 7.013 looking for NA.  The EP6T op spent
more time calling cq NA than he did listening.  There was a huge NA west
coast pileup calling him but less than a hand full made it.  Then he
switched to SSB and his signal disappeared.  I would have expected him to
rattle off 3 qsos per minute but instead maybe, maybe 1 qso every 5 minutes.
On top of it all he didn't say where he was listening.  Was it just a poor
op or did he have a high noise/qrm level?

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

Hi Merv and all,
According to their WEB site the noise problems have now been taken care of.
They had a very good run both on 80 and 160 last night. In Europe we do have
problems with deliberate QRM on 80 and 40, much less on 160. I must say the
Ops are doing a very good job. Most EU stations obey directions from EP6,
e.g qrx now for JA as an example.
73
Len/SM7BIC



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Re: Topband: RX Antenna Switch

[Doug Renwick]

I would not care if it was a business advertising.  No need to apologize.
If I didn't want to read it, I would use my Delete key.

Doug

I wasn't born in Saskatchewan, but I got here as soon as I could.

-Original Message-

I recently delivered several RAS-8x2 Receive Antenna Switch units to
customers and made some extras -- I have three units boxed and ready to
ship. Two with UHF connectors, the other with F connectors. E-mail me at:
gary(at)aytechnologies(dot)com 

And I am getting ready to make more of my past products and a few new ones.
I've been making a few all along by request, but not advertising. Not ready
with everything right now, but keep an eye on my web site
www.aytechnologies.com

I know this is a commercial message, but my 'manufacturing' isn't much of a
business -- it's tiny, specialized, and I do it mostly for fun! 

73, Gary
K9AY


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Re: Topband: New 3 el 160m yagi at 7J4AAL

[Doug Renwick]

When you have money, it's amazing what can be done.  I thought the consensus
now is yagi antennas on 160 don't perform well (i.e. OH8X) when compared to
vertical arrays.
 Doug

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.

-Original Message-

From the reflector of the Northern IL DX Association.

73, Jim N7US



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Re: Topband: Crimea DXCC status?

[Doug Renwick]

I  enjoy 'political statements' every once in a while ... keep them coming.

Doug

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.

-Original Message-

Amen!

I can't believe that K1ZZ can so blatantly ignore the DXCC Rules!

Section 1, Rule 7:
  7. Any Amateur Radio operation should take place only with the
  complete approval and understanding of appropriate administration
  officials. In countries where amateurs are licensed in the normal
  manner, credit may be claimed only for stations using regular
  government-assigned call signs or portable call signs where
  reciprocal agreements exist or the host government has so authorized
  portable operation.

As far as international norms of civilized nations - including the
US, all of the EU, UN and particularly the ITU - are concerned the
appropriate administration for Crimea is in Kiev not some goons in
Moscow issuing UA6S and UA6K callsigns.  UA6S and UA6K are *pirate*
operations and should be rejected by DXCC just as 7O calls issued
in Aden and other licenses issued by the wrong authorities have
been routinely rejected.

K1ZZ's decision to ignore the DXCC rules for political reasons (in
opposition to UN resolutions and US policy) is as bad as Baldwin's Reef
and makes it *impossible* for DXCC to fairly reject *any* DX operation
for improper documentation as long as the flouting of the DXCC rules
continues.

I wonder how K1ZZ would react if Havana were to start issuing licenses
to ethnic Cubans in Miami?  The proportion of the population in Miami
that are ethnic Cubans may be higher than that of ethnic Russians in
Crimea.

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 2014-05-22 10:28 PM, Yuri Blanarovich wrote:
  From the ARRL  Letter:ARRL Responds to Ukrainian Amateur Radio League
 Regarding DXCC Status of Crimea
 The ARRL has responded to an appeal from the Ukrainian Amateur Radio
 League (UARL) to consider the information regarding the status of
 Crimea as temporarily occupied territory. UARL President Vladimir
 Grishchenko, UT0FT, told the ARRL on May 3, that Russia's illegal
 annexation of Crimea does not change the status of this territory,
 which legally belongs to Ukraine. ARRL CEO David Sumner, K1ZZ, on May
 21 acknowledged the UARL's position and reiterated the ARRL Awards
 Committee's determination that the annexation did not lend Crimea status
 as a new DXCC entity.
 We appreciate the high regard you have expressed for the DXCC program,
 Sumner wrote. However, the list of DXCC entities is simply for the
 purpose of giving radio amateurs a consistent way to compare their DX
 achievements. It is not intended to express a position with respect to
 sovereignty and should not be regarded as such.
 The Awards Committee has concluded that a QSL with a call sign issued by
 Ukraine and showing the entity name as Ukraine counts as Ukraine, while
 a QSL with a call sign issued by Russia and showing the entity name as
 Russia counts as Russia. A QSL that satisfies neither condition does
 not count for either entity, the committee said.
 Grishchenko had pointed out that the UN does not recognize Crimea's
 annexation, and that the US government is currently working actively to
 preserve the territorial integrity of Ukraine. He further asserted
 that, according to the International Telecommunication Union (ITU),
 Ukraine is responsible for spectrum usage in Crimea, and that only
 Ukraine can issue licenses, despite what he called Crimea's temporary
 status as an occupied territory.
 Grishchenko had asked the ARRL to consider this information when
 determining the conditions of meeting award requirements, as well as in
 determining the winners of competitions held.
 Sumner told Grishchenko that the ARRL Awards Committee's determination
 is consistent with the treatment, for DXCC purposes, of other territory
 that may be described as either 'temporarily occupied' or disputed.
 We join the world community in the hope that the difficulties and
 uncertainties currently being faced by the people of Ukraine will be
 resolved peacefully and with full regard for human rights, Sumner
 concluded.
 (end of quote)


 Unprecedented, ARRL legitimizing Russian occupation of Ukrainian
territory.
 Now can South Korea issue licenses for North Korea too?
 Looks like Putin has some power over ARRL.
 Until situation is resolved politically, ARRL has no business
 legitimizing annexation of Crimea by masked thugs.

 Yuri, K3BU
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Re: Topband: Teflon Tubing

[Doug Renwick]

20 bucks to ship a few feet to Canada ... that's insane.
Doug


-Original Message-

If anyone is in need of some Teflon tubing, I have some # 11 gauge. It is
fine for # 12 AWG or smaller wire. 
I am not trying to make money on this. I will sell it for 0.75 US$ per foot.
I will ship world wide via USPS priority 
mail. Shipping cost will be $6.00 in the USA and US$20.00 worldwide. Please
note that the postal rates for shipping to 
outside the USA have gone up this year. 

73 de Price W0RI near St Louis, MO


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Re: Topband: Contest in progress - few signals

[Doug Renwick]

The last thing I would want is a pile up of USA calling me when I am
listening for a weak DX signal.  Answering one only encourages others to
call.  Ignoring them is not being rude or nasty.
Doug

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.
-Original Message-

I can't understand ignoring callers in an ARRL DX contest on 160, unless the

operator is working a run for DX. Generally stations are sitting there 
endlessly CQing over and over again with only sporadic contacts.

Seems to me it would just be a whole lot better, as long as there aren't DX 
callers, to just tell the person they don't count.

Also, if a person is trying to be helpful, even if they are mistaken and 
being a pest, I see little reason to be rude or nasty. We can't all be 
perfect, and most of us make mistakes at one time or another. This is not a 
busy contest (on 160) to an extent that occasional mistakes by people trying

to be helpful becomes an issue with score.

73 Tom 

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Re: Topband: Contest in progress - few signals

[Doug Renwick]

I tried sending in slow cw 'only dx'.  It didn't make any difference ...
they still kept calling.  Early in the contest I did log a few ... but after
a while it became irritating.  My logging program complains when I enter a
'non contest' qso.  So as to not screw things up when I am tired, I began to
ignore those callers.  It's not VEs calling me, it's USA stations.  I hear a
week signal ... I think it is dx ... I switch directions only to find out
it's a USA station ... frustrating.  Maybe next time I will just qsy to a
different frequency or go qrt.  I no longer have the patience to deal with
someone's ignorance of the contest rules.
Doug

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.

-Original Message-

I appreciate all the replies and helpful advice. Since there will always be
some that won't study the official rules (I promise I will from now on :-),
here's what I think is the best solution.

When a station calls CQ TEST and he hears another station in his country
answering him, simply call CQ TEST DX (or maybe CQ DX TEST). If that
doesn't get the point across, then nothing will. Besides, it serves notice
to anyone else listening that might be thinking about answering. I heard at
least one US station doing that.

I only called 3 stations in the 48 states before I caught on. Afterwards, I
worked a number of stations in the Caribbean and SA, including some new
ones. It was great fun, in spite of band conditions! This could very well
turn out to be my favorite contest.

Are there any other contests with zero-point scoring rules like this one?

73, Mike
www.w0btu.com


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Re: Topband: Contest in progress - few signals

[Doug Renwick]

I am not picking on any one operator.  But guys think about it.  If you all
start/continue working 0 point NA stations ... do you not think that it
encourages these stations to continue this behaviour?  It's becoming
everybody work everybody all the time.  If you are happy working these
stations ... that's your personal choice ... fine ... that's not my personal
choice.  Enough said by me.
Doug

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.



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Re: Topband: TO7CC

[Doug Renwick]

I haven't heard them or seen spots on 160 or 80 for the west coast around
1400 UTC give or take.
Doug
 
-Original Message-

 Try to focuse our work on top band each time as possible. Every nights ops
are there. At the end of FT5ZM QRG back quiet but dont Forget that another
guys still on fréquences for you. Finaly team stay on the Island untill
sunday morning. Dépending cndx Est coast stations Can be ear half and more
after SR. In FR time around  2H30 AM. Last night have strong noise even on
80 didn't log much qso in lows bands.   

TO7CC team
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Re: Topband: Yikes! Heavy snow, freezing fog and 23 degrees F in Raleigh, NC

[Doug Renwick]

It's really a shame what that freezing rain will do to an antenna farm.  I
wish that global warming was a reality in situations like this.  I
fortunately rarely get ice storms of this nature and I thank God for that.
To see all your hard work taken down by nature is heart breaking.
Doug

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.

-Original Message-


 We have about 3-4 in. of snow on the gnd, and just started to
 sleet, and maybe some rain, abt an hr ago. We are in the country

I have about a half inch of radial ice at the moment. The ropes for almost 
all of my wire antennas have snapped, and the Yagi's all look like noodles. 
It smells like Pinesol disinfectant outside from all the broken pine trees.

I'm not sure what is going to happen here. It is still raining and still at 
31F here.

We were predicted to be in the worse spot, but it looks like the worse ice 
spot in Georgia has moved to along the I-20 corridor out to Augusta.  I 
expect antennas in southern SC won't do so well. 



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Re: Topband: FT5ZM

[Doug Renwick]

They had a gud signal this Saturday morning here in SK around 1430Z and then
after a few minutes disappeared into the noise.  Yes they were hearing well.
After working them I didn't spend much time listening as I was putting them
into the log on 80m, where they had an outstanding signal.
Doug

-Original Message-


FT5ZM was QRV Wednesday evening for NA sunset.  They had the best signal
here in the Midwest (Iowa) on 160m to date and worked a significant number
of NA stations.  Their signal was weak but not copyable just prior to my SS
(2327z) with signals quickly building and peaking S3/S4 near their SR.  As
one would expect they first began working stations on the EC and then
progressing steadily westward.  I was fortunate to work them at 2336.  They
were also hearing well.  Good luck to all that need them!

73. . . Dave, W0FLS


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Re: Topband: Short receiving verticals question

[Doug Renwick]

I have used this same setup for my 4-square 160m receive array for years.
Since I have to take down and put up this array every spring/fall, I have to
re-tune each element for the 160m band.  I have found that the base loading
does not have to be exact for the system to 'work'.  Last year I decided to
make inductor substitution box for each element to easily tune each element
close to 1.830 MHz.  The biggest problem with the top hat is deer catching
the wire/string and bending the element or some rodent eating the string.
It's amazing how forgiving aluminum tubing is as I can straighten it many
times without breaking.  At the base I use a 2 ft ground rod and 4 short
radials.  I found the use of the ground rod makes a large change in the
tuning of the element.
Doug

-Original Message-

Jon,

The reason I use the hats and do everything I do in the elements is 
bandwidth. Even at my quiet rural location on the quietest hour of the 
quietest day, almost any element of reasonable height will have more than 
enough signal level. This is why I base load and use a large hat. While the 
large hat tends to keep current more uniform throughout the element 
independent of coil location, and while more uniform current  increases 
radiation resistance, that effect is meaningless to me. The entire goal for 
me is bandwidth, or a stable SWR vs. frequency.

Bandwidth is also why I load the element with a series resistance for 
matching, instead of a network. I want to swamp out or dilute the effects 
of resonance, minimizing element phase shift vs. frequency change at the 
element terminals and preventing drastic changes in element feedpoint 
impedance from mutual coupling between elements.

The hat is actually the bulk of the loading, and sets the current 
distribution. The coil just cancels reactance. Since it is a series network 
with the inductor forming a series tank with the termination reactance, the 
lower the reactance used (compared to termination resistance) the larger 
bandwidth becomes. You want the loading coil to be terminated in the lowest 
capacitive reactance possible, and that is at the antenna base.

Because voltage and current are out-of-phase above the coil, even with high 
current, the impedance increases. This means the tradeoff in a bottom 
inductance is increased voltage above the inductor. The antenna is more 
loss critical above the coil for anything coupled via the electric field, 
including a lossy dielectric.

This is a compromise of two things:

1.) Bandwidth

2.) Sensitivity to dielectrics around the element

Getting rid of the hat while the element is close to a tree does nothing but

bad things to both, but no one can say how much. The last resort for me 
would be no hats. Perhaps you can use T elements with loading wires away 
from foliage that might change tuning or losses?

73 Tom 

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Re: Topband: FT5ZM

[Doug Renwick]

I will have to get up earlier.  At your time the only good DX here was NH0Z
and V63DX.

Doug

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.

-Original Message-

He was first discernable here at 1350.  In the log at 1400.

It is now 1422 and he is fading with my sunrise.  The signals peaked at S3
on the Beverages for about 20 minutes, but was good copy on ALL 16
Beverages.  This indicates a VERY HIGH arrival angle here near the Amsterdam
antipode.  He was good copy (S1) on a full wavelength horizontal loop just
10 feet AGL.

He is now working northern Scandinavian station as well as NA west coast as
he fades away.  Still 449 at 1427.

73, and good luck to all.

de Milt, N5IA


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Topband: NH0Z on Topband

[Doug Renwick]

NH0Z appeared this morning partially covered by a west coast cq er.  He
wasn't strong but could hear well.

Doug

Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary
safety, deserve neither liberty or safety. - Ben Franklin 



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Re: Topband: Anyone purchased the ARRL book on Short Antennasfor160???

[Doug Renwick]

I posted this on TowerTalk and I got a couple of responses as to why the
ends of ground radials should not be grounded.
However no-one has guessed as to how many db I have supposedly lost with the
below scenario.

Why is this important?  My 60 radials per vertical in my 80m 4-square are
buried a couple of inches below the surface and I consider that grounded.
Also where the radials cross each other I did not bond them together.  So
how many db have I supposedly lost?

Doug

-Original Message-
It is important that the ends are not grounded.

Some would argue that putting ground rods at the end of radials doesn't
really help.  In most cases you can do well, perhaps better with #12 or
#14 THHN insulated wire laying on the ground.  You will only then need about
90-100 feet for each radial due to the velocity factor of the wire itself.
If you run out of space due to your lot size you can run the ends at right
angles. It is important that the ends are not grounded. 
IMHO what you are trying to do is cause the ground system currents to travel
in those wires rather than being dissipated in the earth thus 
improving the system efficiency.You can pin the wires down with 
large galvanized nails, , pounded into the ground after a single turn around
them. (U clips are also available by the hundred lot from
DX-Engineering) Normally after two weeks the sod will cover them and they
will be invisible and allow the lawn mower to pass over without a snag.

73,

Herb Schoenbohm, KV4FZ

-Original Message-

On Fri, Jan 24, 2014 at 7:07 AM, Richard Fry r...@adams.net wrote:

  But that wasn't necessary to make the point that the system with elevated
 radials installed over poor earth having no buried radials in it has
 essentially the same performance as the system using 120 x 1/4-wave
radials
 (only), buried in that same earth.


...essentially the same...

A scientific definition of that would be interesting. My impression is that
I am highly unappreciated by certain folks when I use such terms. An
additional half dB loss in the antenna system is a permanent 12% increase
in the power bill for the transmitter if one is required to maintain
specified field strength. To a station manager that's probably an entirely
unsatisfactory increase in moolah drain. With a 10 or 50 kW station, that's
a *killer* difference. He would not use the term essentially the same.

For some restricted ham situations being down only 1.5 dB from a commercial
method reference could easily be as good as is possible, and only 0.5 dB
would be wonderful. But for the science, 0.5 dB is simply 0.5 dB, and
worthy of accounting.  A 0.5 dB here and a 0.5 dB there, and 0.5 dB
elsewhere starts to add up to barely catching some DX otherwise not had.
And a confirmation is a confirmation.

Run the four elevated over the radial field. The buzz I hear on the
grapevine about 4 elevated is that's the remedy for a radial field gone
sour, of course leaving the old radials *retired in place*.

Trying to disprove experience in non-commercial small lot situations by
referring to NEC 4.x model runs from the the middle of the commercial MF BC
paradigm just won't cut it.  I have already stipulated many times that NEC
4 is calibrated for that paradigm and seemingly delivers well documented
good results. In the same manner, you can't prove distant low and sky-wave
patterns by measuring at the ground or only locally.

The small lot experience is that losses to ground are underestimated by NEC
4.x, the underestimation an opinion notably shared by Roy Lewallen, W7EL,
author of the respected EZNEC series of NEC shells, who has spent some
serious time chasing the issue.

I have gone to using .0002,1 (ghastly ground) as ground characteristics for
testing model changes for ground sensitivity, giving the worst possible
results for non-dense-radial counterpoise designs. This is used for
comparing a before model to an after model, with wire or counterpoise
changes. This accentuates changes in results due to the way ground is
induced. Picking solutions with the least sensitivity to ghastly earth,
again and again brings happy results in real world applications which are
borne out in RBN changes.

While one might think ghastly earth is too severe, difficult urban and
concrete-asphalt-ish small lot situations sometimes seem even worse,
pointing to some mechanism in play that is unbookept in NEC ground
treatment, or possibly undiscovered. Since the NEC ground method is both
monolithic characteristics and for essential reasons confined to ground
*approximations*, this is really not surprising.

73, Guy.
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Re: Topband: Grounding the ends of radials

[Doug Renwick]

If I lay my 1/4 wavelength bare radials several inches below ground; is that
not the same as if the radials were grounded along their length?

Doug

-Original Message-

True, I expect, Carl.  Just don't ground it! If you think about it, a
more-or-less ideal image - plane for the vertical would be a circular
metallic sheet  a 1/2 wave in diameter ( although infinite extent would be
better).

73,
Charlie, K4OTV

-Original Message-
From: ZR [mailto:z...@jeremy.mv.com] 
Sent: Saturday, January 25, 2014 4:43 PM
To: Charlie Cunningham; 'Bob Eldridge'; topband@contesting.com
Subject: Re: Topband: Grounding the ends of radials

OTOH connecting all the ends together with a wire that can handle the total 
current would help balance the field..Yes or no?

Carl
KM1H


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Re: Topband: 160M Contest

[Doug Renwick]

Sam you had no trouble working me on the first call.
Doug/VA5DX

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.

-Original Message-

Worked AZ (N7GP). Very easy! Randy K5ZD said VFB signal :) to me.
Called UT (W7CT), NM, NE, CO, MS, MO, CA (few), TX with no answer. USA's
running USA's. No listening to EU! (at all some) We'll see next night!

Sam LY5W @ LY7M (Multi Op.)



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Re: Topband: S21

[Doug Renwick]

Same here on 80m from VE5.  Good signal, listening for NA only, but copying
very, very few.

Doug

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.

-Original Message-

Very nice signals from S21 today on topband,  peaking 579 here
an hour before sunrise,   but alas they have bad receive conditions
it appears.Heard many calling from EU/Asia and they did not
answer.
Band has been extremely poor here this season over the pole
have tried several times with SM7BIC and no joy.   we usually have
many QSOs by this time of the year.
Either my antennas are not working this season, or this is the worst
season in some time.  At least here in KH6.
Putting up more beverages this next week,  but as it is now I can sure
hear more than I can work,  which I take as a good sign that at least
the RX is working.
73 Merv K9FD/KH6
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Topband Reflector

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Re: Topband: Don't give up AND log who worked the DX b4 and after!

[Doug Renwick]

Good that they followed Martti's one-off rule.  Some don't (JAXXX).  It's
refreshing to hear stories of this nature. 
 
Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.
-Original Message-

JUST received my PT0S QSL (St. Peter and St. Paul rocks) for QRP QSOs on 80
and 40 CW!

There is a story behind the 80 meter QSO I want to share...
The morning I worked them on 80 I had just had a quick QSO with KN7T about
10 minutes b4 PT0S came on the air.
When PT0S came on I callrd them quite a bit.  Then,  KN7T worked them and I
worked them right after him AND I wrote that info in my log...that KN7T
worked them just before me.
I then went to 40 meters and worked them as well.
When I checked their online log I saw the 40 meter QSO but no 80 meter!!  I
was bummedI sent an e-mail later to one of the team pilots - he checked
the log and replied, no K9JWV in the log. 
A month ago I was checking through my log and noticed that discrepancy and
though I'd try again.  I e-mailed the QSL manager (fella in Hungary) and one
of the team leads (fella in AZ).  I went through what happened and told them
about KN7T working them just b4 me.  They checked, confirmed the KN7T QSO
AND found an entry right after with K9JJV  They realized the op had made
an error and sent me a card for both QSOs!!!
So.for those rare ones where you may have only oneor two
QSOs...try to keep track of who worked them just prior to OR right
after...could make the difference between having the QSL card or not!
By the bye: the Operator at the time, a PY fella, sent me an e-mail
apologizing for the error...nice of him!
72, Jim Rodenkirch K9JWV

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Re: Topband: Don't give up AND log who worked the DX b4 and after!

[Doug Renwick]

I learned a lesson many years ago where I showed up on a needed band as a
NIL.  I have more than one callsign and if I need that band contact I will
try and work them with both callsigns now.  Mistakes happen on the DX end (I
know as having been a DXpedition operator) and the contact gets mistyped or
accidentally deleted.  Simply insurance.
Doug

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.

-Original Message-

Great information JimI wish I would have done that many years ago as 
I worked BS7H in 2007 on 20 CW May 5th, 2007 and the log search shows up 
nothing.  Apart from P5 and Eritrea this is one of three missing ones 
for DXCC I need.  If I had jotted down the proximate contacts I might 
have been able to have received some help.  I know KV4FZ is in the log 
somewhere but how can I ever get help finding it.  I all goes to prove 
that when working rare DX-peditions there are no rewards by poor record 
keeping. There hasn't been another operation to Scarborough Reef in 
nearly a decade and probably won't be for a long time especially with 
the political battle over disputed islands in the South China Sea.


Regards,   Herb Schoenbohm, KV4FZ

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Topband Reflector

Topband: K9W on Top BAnd

[Doug Renwick]

Yes K9W had an excellent, easy to work, signal into Saskatchewan this
morning.

Doug

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.

-Original Message-

Good signal tonight
http://youtu.be/5tpoCRuXdu0

-- 
Vlad/RA4LW

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Re: Topband: Idiom Press

[Doug Renwick]

I checked my email records and see the same story back in year 2008.  Some
things never change.  I hope this time Rob gets his act together for good.

Doug

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.

-Original Message-

This is Rob Locher W7GH.  Idiom Press was started by my father Bob Locher  
W9KNI.  A few years ago he brought me on board, and then later retired,  
leaving me in charge.  I'd had no business experience before running Idiom  
Press.

Recently I've had several unanticipated challenges that I've had to deal  
with.  The challenges have led to an order backlog, which has multiplied  
my workload.  I've dropped the ball in keeping up with emails and phone  
calls.  My father, and also friends and other concerned people, have  
reminded me that the most important thing to any business is contact with  
the customer.

To the people I've inconvenienced, I'm sorry, and I apologize.  I am  
learning as I go.  I have a plan to get caught up with orders as quickly  
as possible.  Most importantly, I've personally refocused on customer  
contact.  I'll be contacting everyone with an outstanding order.  I must,  
however, ask customers for a little patience for the next month or so.

73,
- Rob Locher W7GH
Idiom Press
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Re: Topband: Tree losses....

[Doug Renwick]

The only way to say which location is better is to do a side by side
comparison which didn't happen.  You are making assumptions which may be
wrong or may be right.  Blaming it on trees is a guess.  There are many
other factors to consider.
Doug

-Original Message-

It's hard to quantify all that, but operationally
there is no question which installation gave the better results on
Topband, by a fair margin.
73,
Steve, AB4I

_
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Re: Topband: Measured RG-6 Loss: Solid Copper vs. Copper Clad center conductor

[Doug Renwick]

I successfully use 100s and 100s of feet of copper clad steel RG-6 in my
160m 4-square receive setup with a pre-amp at the station.  Copper clad
steel works for me.

Doug 

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.

-Original Message-

Today I measured the difference in loss (dB per 100 ft) between solid copper
(SC) center conductor RG-6 vs. copper clad steel (CCS) Quad-Core RG-6
coaxial cable.  The difference is not significant until cable lengths exceed
350 feet.  You can see the affect of the steel core at 7 MHz and below in
this table.

The cables were manufactured by two different companies, but the relative
measurements should be valid.

   Solid   Copper  Cable length in
Freq   Copper  Cladfeet for a 1 dB
MHzLossLossloss difference

1.80.3 0.6  350
3.50.4 0.6  500
7.00.6 0.8  500
10 0.7 0.85 650
14 0.750.9  650
21 0.9 1.0 1000
28 1.0 1.1 1000

73
Frank
W3LPL
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Re: Topband: A 160 Meter antenne puzzle

[Doug Renwick]

Hi,

Is it really necessary to isolate the vertical from the pressure treated 4 x
4 with PVC tubing and is it really necessary to install a 1:1 balun between
the antenna and feedline in this 4-square receiving array?

Doug

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.
-Original Message-


Hi everybody and happy new year .
I have what I think is an interesting  antenna riddle . I have some receive
antenna verticals (4) that are selected by relays in pair and the pair is
fed back to the shack to a phasing boxing .Each antenna is AL tubing about
30 feet tall, base loaded with an inductor and a resistor very much like
ON4UN has for his 4 square receive  array .There is a 1 to 1 balun between
the antenna and the feed line . The tubing is insulated  with an eight inch
length of pvc pipe from  the 4x4 that supports it .The overlap between the
tubing and the 4x4 is about eight inches as well . I was doing some testing
today and discovered that touching the 4x4 at the top caused the swr to
increase from about 1.2 to 1 to 1.7 to 1 . The lower on the 4x4 I touch the
less the effect . I am only moving my finger a fraction of an inch and my
hand not at all when this happens .The feed lines are disconnected when this
is going on .There is no dc continuity between the antenna and any mounting
hardware or th
 e post .I disconnected the base loading and put  the analyzer on it and it
is resonant at about 8 mhz and touching the post causes no change with this
setup . There are eight 30 foot radials laying on the ground and a 2 inch
wide copper strap about 3 foot long  in the hole that the 4x4 is in .
What is going on here and should I make an effort to limit the coupling
between the 4x4 and the antenna?


73 , Glenn WW4B

_
Topband Reflector

Re: Topband: GAP Vertical Question

[Doug Renwick]

How long did the KLM last before the light boom folded, or the element to
boom brackets failed or the linear loaded insulator let go?  One good wind
storm?

Doug

Think of all the ways you can hurt yourself laughing.

-Original Message-

A 4el 40M KLM at 120' fixed that.

Carl
KM1H


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Re: Topband: GAP VERTICAL QUESTION

[Doug Renwick]

The GAP Voyager is not much better than a dummy load on 160m.  On 80m and
40m it received fairly well compared to my other 80 and 40 antennas.

Doug

Original Message-

With the prospect of downsizing and moving into senior housing in the future
I am starting to look at vertical antennas that will allow me to continue
this wonderful hobby.  I have heard some good things about the GAP series
of antennas but the company says they do not need radials on most of them
and that worries me.  Over the years I have become very skeptical about
claims and the other BS put out by most companies ( maybe it is a function
of age I dunno) so I wonder if these antennas really work.  The two antennas
that I am interested are the Voyager DX for 160/80/40  and the Eagle DX for
the rest of the bands. 



So my question is does anyone have actual experience with these antennas
(especially the voyager) as compared to other antennas for a specific
frequency.  Now guys .. I know you cant really compare a 6 element beam to a
vertical of this kind but I am talking about a comparison that is
realistic.. like how does it hear, tune, match  get out compared to
something like another vertical or a dipole up some reasonable distance. 



I sure hope this has not opend another can of worms.. some how I seem to do
that .. private emails are ok..especially it the topic gets out of hand and
we get a large volume of comments (Tree please dont shoot me before
Christmas my wife will miss me.) 



Jim WA3MEJ 


Long Live Seal Team VI 

http://www.qsl.net/wa3mej/index.htm 
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Re: Topband: Patience in ARRL 160 Contest -- copying weak ones

[Doug Renwick]

George, IMO you have solved the problem ... mental.  Your last sentence
describes the condition exactly ... your brain goes blank or slows as a
defence mechanism from all the noise/signals on the band.

Doug

-Original Message-

After spending 12 nights-in-a-row straining to hear and 
assemble thousands of weak calls, I would cautiously agree 
with Herb: if the DX clearly has the prefix, just send the 
missing letters.

Maybe it is mental, maybe something else, but time and 
again I heard clearly (almost loud) the caller's prefix 
and number, just to experience the rest kind of fizzle 
into something weak and incoherent ... This happened so 
many times that I was ready for it, focusing only on the 
suffix, and still many times I could not copy it, while 
the prefix came through (almost) loud and clear. It must 
be that you can hear what you know or expect, while it 
is much harder to hear and decode something random. But 
that does not explain the whole thing. How does one get 
the prefix so many times correctly when the suffix just 
fizzles into nothing. I have checked with the other 
operators on PT0S and they had similar experiences.

Perhaps there is some hearing mechanism at work, similar 
to vision; where acuity diminishes with usage...

73,

George


On Tue, 04 Dec 2012 17:54:26 -0400
  Herb Schoenbohm he...@vitelcom.net wrote:
 Doung,  So many times I just hear the prefix and the 
suffix drops out or is covered by noise.  It maybe a 
mental thing as I have no other explanation where the 
prefix comes through time and time but the suffix is 
lost.  Since I know what the correct suffix is, sending 
only the missing information make so much sense and saves 
valuable time.  In such cases sending only the missing 
data is what I would recommend for stations struggling to 
get in the log as the prefix is already confirmed to both 
of the stations.  So many times DX-peditions will not get 
my call correctly and butcher a portion of it...like 
KV4Z ur 5NN to which I immediately reply FZ...FZ...FZ 
KV4FZ K   This procedure works every time especially 
layers deep in piles up.
 
 Thanks for your remarks,
 
 
 Herb, KV4FZ
 
 
 On 12/4/2012 9:51 AM, Doug Renwick wrote:
 When a cw station asks for a fill I send my COMPLETE 
callsign.  Why?

 a) My memory keyer or logging program has my full 
callsign, no partial
 callsign.  I don't use the hand keyer just in case I 
have 'dead' fingers and
 make a mistake.

 b) It allows the other station to focus on my signal 
when other stations are
 calling at the same time near or on my frequency.

 c) It makes sure that the correct suffix is added to the 
prefix.

 d) It confirms my prefix if part of it is copied 
incorrectly.

 Patience is  needed when ones signal is subject to 160m 
QSB.  Sri Herb, I
 fully disagree.

 Doug


 -Original Message-

 I worked a whole bunch of Europeans in the 160 meter 
contest along with
 UA9's and even 4Z1UF who had a good signal. My pet peeve 
is that when I
 hear only a weaker stations prefix but miss the suffix 
and ask for a
 repeat and request for example HB9 ?  AGN  all I hear 
is the prefix
 before the suffix is in the noise.  The station knows i 
have the correct
 prefix and number but how do I get them just to send the 
missing portion
 which is crucial to completing the QSO?  Even if I send 
HB9??? they
 return with de HB9### and the process repeats.  If in 
such circumstances
 once the calling station realizes I have the correct 
prefix all they
 need do is send the two or three letters of the suffix 
several times.
 Resending the prefix is not helpful in high noise or qrm 
situation.  I
 have tried SFX? SFX? but many stations are confused by 
that and keep
 sending their whole call. So here is my advice in just 
difficult
 circumstance:

 Do *not* repeat your whole call if the other station has 
the correct
 prefix and all they need is the remaining portion.  I 
just wish more
 stations on TB would do this as it would enable them 
getting in the log
 correctly and save time.  Time length of an opening to 
some parts of the
 world is everything in a crowded contest.  Why waste it?

 73,

 Herb Schoenbohm, KV4FZ

 ___
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Re: Topband: Patience in ARRL 160 Contest -- copying weak ones

[Doug Renwick]

Thanks Herb,

That certainly removes the operator condition from the explanation.  It will
be interesting to discover why the transmissions tail off.  Is it
repeatable?  For example if the same station keeps sending their call
between your HB9? does it consistently tail off each time they transmit
between your transmissions?

Doug

-Original Message-

Then my digital recording (Adobe Audition) possesses a similar mental 
capacity?  No!  I edit out the prefix and create a loop after deleting 
the prefix from the recording.  There is a noticeable disappearance into 
the noise after stations, and I have check over 50 so far, have sent 
there call signs.  It is not a mental condition at all.  I don't know 
what causes the phenomenon and once thought that power amplifiers lost 
efficiency after a few characters were sent, especially with stations 
without rally stiff power supplies on their PA's losing a bit of a kick 
they seem to get when first sending their call .  it sometimes seems to 
me the longer they keep sending the weaker they get.  Most amps today 
use voltage double supplies and the voltage regulation has a swing of 
300 to 400 volts.  however, I don't see how that can make up for 3db or 
more of signal drop.

Also let me assure you that George AA7JV has some of the best trained 
and keenest ears in the business of weak signal low band reception.  So 
I am looking for other reasons.  The solution: when in doubt please send 
the missing information, first and repeat the whole call in conclusion 
when in doubt.


Thanks,

Herb Schoenbohm, KV4FZ



On 12/5/2012 1:45 PM, Doug Renwick wrote:
 George, IMO you have solved the problem ... mental.  Your last sentence
 describes the condition exactly ... your brain goes blank or slows as a
 defence mechanism from all the noise/signals on the band.

 Doug

 -Original Message-

 After spending 12 nights-in-a-row straining to hear and
 assemble thousands of weak calls, I would cautiously agree
 with Herb: if the DX clearly has the prefix, just send the
 missing letters.

 Maybe it is mental, maybe something else, but time and
 again I heard clearly (almost loud) the caller's prefix
 and number, just to experience the rest kind of fizzle
 into something weak and incoherent ... This happened so
 many times that I was ready for it, focusing only on the
 suffix, and still many times I could not copy it, while
 the prefix came through (almost) loud and clear. It must
 be that you can hear what you know or expect, while it
 is much harder to hear and decode something random. But
 that does not explain the whole thing. How does one get
 the prefix so many times correctly when the suffix just
 fizzles into nothing. I have checked with the other
 operators on PT0S and they had similar experiences.

 Perhaps there is some hearing mechanism at work, similar
 to vision; where acuity diminishes with usage...

 73,

 George


 On Tue, 04 Dec 2012 17:54:26 -0400
Herb Schoenbohm he...@vitelcom.net wrote:
 Doug,  So many times I just hear the prefix and the
 suffix drops out or is covered by noise.  It maybe a
 mental thing as I have no other explanation where the
 prefix comes through time and time but the suffix is
 lost.  Since I know what the correct suffix is, sending
 only the missing information make so much sense and saves
 valuable time.  In such cases sending only the missing
 data is what I would recommend for stations struggling to
 get in the log as the prefix is already confirmed to both
 of the stations.  So many times DX-peditions will not get
 my call correctly and butcher a portion of it...like
 KV4Z ur 5NN to which I immediately reply FZ...FZ...FZ
 KV4FZ K   This procedure works every time especially
 layers deep in piles up.

 Thanks for your remarks,


 Herb, KV4FZ


 On 12/4/2012 9:51 AM, Doug Renwick wrote:
 When a cw station asks for a fill I send my COMPLETE
 callsign.  Why?

 a) My memory keyer or logging program has my full
 callsign, no partial
 callsign.  I don't use the hand keyer just in case I
 have 'dead' fingers and
 make a mistake.

 b) It allows the other station to focus on my signal
 when other stations are
 calling at the same time near or on my frequency.

 c) It makes sure that the correct suffix is added to the
 prefix.

 d) It confirms my prefix if part of it is copied
 incorrectly.

 Patience is  needed when ones signal is subject to 160m
 QSB.  Sri Herb, I
 fully disagree.

 Doug


 -Original Message-

 I worked a whole bunch of Europeans in the 160 meter
 contest along with
 UA9's and even 4Z1UF who had a good signal. My pet peeve
 is that when I
 hear only a weaker stations prefix but miss the suffix
 and ask for a
 repeat and request for example HB9 ?  AGN  all I hear
 is the prefix
 before the suffix is in the noise.  The station knows i
 have the correct
 prefix and number but how do I get them just to send the
 missing portion
 which is crucial to completing the QSO?  Even if I send
 HB9

Re: Topband: Patience in ARRL 160 Contest

[Doug Renwick]

When a cw station asks for a fill I send my COMPLETE callsign.  Why?

a) My memory keyer or logging program has my full callsign, no partial
callsign.  I don't use the hand keyer just in case I have 'dead' fingers and
make a mistake.

b) It allows the other station to focus on my signal when other stations are
calling at the same time near or on my frequency.

c) It makes sure that the correct suffix is added to the prefix.

d) It confirms my prefix if part of it is copied incorrectly. 

Patience is  needed when ones signal is subject to 160m QSB.  Sri Herb, I
fully disagree.

Doug


-Original Message-

I worked a whole bunch of Europeans in the 160 meter contest along with 
UA9's and even 4Z1UF who had a good signal. My pet peeve is that when I 
hear only a weaker stations prefix but miss the suffix and ask for a 
repeat and request for example HB9 ?  AGN  all I hear is the prefix 
before the suffix is in the noise.  The station knows i have the correct 
prefix and number but how do I get them just to send the missing portion 
which is crucial to completing the QSO?  Even if I send HB9??? they 
return with de HB9### and the process repeats.  If in such circumstances 
once the calling station realizes I have the correct prefix all they 
need do is send the two or three letters of the suffix several times.  
Resending the prefix is not helpful in high noise or qrm situation.  I 
have tried SFX? SFX? but many stations are confused by that and keep 
sending their whole call. So here is my advice in just difficult 
circumstance:

Do *not* repeat your whole call if the other station has the correct 
prefix and all they need is the remaining portion.  I just wish more 
stations on TB would do this as it would enable them getting in the log 
correctly and save time.  Time length of an opening to some parts of the 
world is everything in a crowded contest.  Why waste it?

73,

Herb Schoenbohm, KV4FZ

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Re: Topband: DX WINDOW

[Doug Renwick]

Sam, remember the opposite can and is true.  I called you near the beginning
of this contest and you didn't hear me.

Doug/VA5DX

-Original Message-

Spent whole night 2200z-0600z with 49 QSO's in the LOG.
Find one moment free frequence to call CQ. 1 call back to me from VE.
That's all. Full band 1800 KHz - 1880 kHz full of W/VE station's
making QSO's each-other, they are very LOUD, but don't hear EU :(
Maybe next night would be much more better!?

Sam LY5W will be ready at 2130z
49 QSO, 23 section's, long list of station's called but not worked,
called dozen of W5/W0 too with no luck

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Re: Topband: Outing the Scofflaws

[Doug Renwick]

Last night on 80m it was kind of funny as I was spotted at least twice while
I was calling PT0S.  Must have had a big signal but no QSO.

Doug

I'll run the race, and I will never be the same again. 

-Original Message-

On 11/12/2012 1:48 PM, Mike(W5UC)  Kathy (K5MWH) wrote:
 I just tell my system not to spot anything from W3LPL. 

I don't understand the objection to W3LPL spots.  As I understand it, 
Frank is aggregating spots from a lot of skimmers and weeding out the 
bad one -- blown callsigns, flaky frequencies) and posting only clean 
spots.  What's the problem with that? I have VE7CC filters set to accept 
spots from W6, W7, VE7, VE6, plus CO and NM, and I purposely include PA 
in my accept spots list to get them, so that I know what the East 
Coast is hearing as a preview of what I might hear later. I also look 
at KH6 spots for the same reason.

73, Jim K9YC

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Re: Topband: PT0S

[Doug Renwick]

Last QSOs in the Database: 0927 UTC 10 November 2012
There are 533 QSOs in the Database

Doug

I'll run the race, and I will never be the same again. 

-Original Message-

I spoke too fast, I'm not in their log for 
160 or the 80 Q So I'm guessing there's 
pirates out there and this is most 
unpleasant.

Back to zero...
 
Gary
KA1J

 An ATNO!
 
 No question on line logs are a benefit to 
 the chase, definitely saves the need for 
 insurance QSOs and the resultant QRM and 
 loss of needed contacts by those QRMed out 
 of the game.
 
 There was a large amount of QRN tonight 
 when I worked PT0S and and with that, 
 it'll be nice to see the on-line log just 
 to be sure.
 
 Gary
 KA1J
 
  They are reporting very limited i-net access, so it could be awhile
  .
  
  -Original Message-
  From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of
  John Harden Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2012 1:37 PM To:
  topband@contesting.com Subject: Topband: PT0S
  
  Does anyone have info on when the PT0S logs will be up on the
  internet? ___ Topband
  reflector - topband@contesting.com - No virus found in this
  message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2221 / Virus
  Database: 2441/5388 - Release Date: 11/11/12
  
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Topband reflector - topband@contesting.com

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Topband reflector - topband@contesting.com

Topband: YB8Y 160m Equipment

[Doug Renwick]

From the YB8Y website.  The transmitting antenna is wire dipole hang on a
coconut tree. The receiving antenna is a DHDL (TX3A Double Half-Delta Loop).
This band is lead and equipped by YB0LOW with an Electcraft K3 + Emtron DX3.

Doug


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UR RST IS ... ... ..9 QSB QSB - hw? BK

Re: Topband: Interference on 160

[Doug Renwick]

Great if you can do it.  But on the flip side it condones and encourages bad
behaviour which may be part of the problem.  In any sport there is a referee
who catches and penalizes bad behaviour.  Otherwise the game may get out of
control.  You are the referee.

Doug

-Original Message-

I remember operating portable 9K2 while deployed to the combat theater
in 2002. The Russian  European QRM was unbelieveable, and almost
intolerable at times. However I politely told them to stand by for USA
and didn't get upset at all. I did not put anyone on a no QSL list. In
fact, when I returned stateside, I send every USA station a card at my
own expense. I didn't care how many times they called on top of the
station I was trying to work.

73,

John, W4NU
(K4JAG 1959 to 1998)

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UR RST IS ... ... ..9 QSB QSB - hw? BK