Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
On Mon, 2018-08-13 at 05:06 +0200, hd-sca...@users.sf.net wrote: > So semi-nonfree like the same issues found from Qt5-WebEngine? PureOS > has > liberated Qt5-WebEngine and I have sources at home. Why should I believe that PureOS cleaned Qt5-WebEngine? I want to believe it, but PureOS has been sketchy from the start.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
I meant to reply to this. Trisquel doesn't support snaps. The facility was removed because making it only libre software snaps was too much work (if I understood the reason correctly). This should serve as a reminder that just because something works in Ubuntu doesn't necessarily mean it works on Trisquel the same way.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
> callousness of microsoft, > and callousness of systemd devs. I know that systemd is not your preferred init system, but do you really think Red Hat and Microsoft are comparable? Red Hat creates free software that not everybody likes. There is nothing unethical about not pleasing everybody. Microsoft on the other hand creates mostly proprietary software, much of which is malware. This is unethical. These two bug reports don't seem comparable either. The vscode bug has been ignored by the developers and left unfixed for over a year. It is still a problem. The systemd bug was fixed promptly. It stopped being a problem a long time ago. I'm glad that there are FSDG distros like Parabola and Hyperbola that support other init systems so that people who do not prefer systemd have these options, but this is not a freedom issue. If "init freedom" is having a choice between different init systems, then Hyperbola and Trisquel offer very little init freedom, as they each support only one init system. In both cases, however, the init system is free software, so this doesn't make Hyperbola and Trisquel less free than Parabola, which supports two init systems. Similarly, none of these distros have very much "kernel freedom" as they only support Linux-libre. However, Linux-libre is free software, so this does not make them less free than GuixSD, which has support for Hurd in development. Also similarly, Devuan reduced the number of choices of desktop environment by excluding GNOME, so it has less "desktop freedom" than Debian. However, as long as the desktop environments that it does include are free software, this does not make Devuan less free than Debian (although it may be less free for other reasons). Lack of support for certain software is not a freedom issue, as long as the software that is supported is free. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
This doesn't surprise me one bit.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Just so you know, I did make a joke, it was about callousness of microsoft, and callousness of systemd devs. and I should have been more clear, if you need to make fun of anti-systemd people rather than inits, which I am sure you do, there is no problem, ps, I have nothing against vegans. I really don't like people who say evil is good and good is evil. Those are the people I have the most trouble with. As for not quitting my day job, meh... weird rebuttal, but okay.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
> https://snapcraft.io/vscode Like the binary distributed by Micro$oft, this appears to be proprietary. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
> Removing systemd completely including library files is near impossible in debian. I don't know about that. But if so, it would only be because systemd is just so useful. > PS, what are the specfics of this? Take a look at the link MB gave: https://wiki.debian.org/Debate/initsystem/
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
The cons mentioned are either from the web links I mentioned, with one exception, Removing systemd completely including library files is near impossible in debian. Even if you are installing sysvinit or openrc combo in exchange. I think ubuntu choose systemd because debian did. "Lots. *Everything* about systemd is better than SysV-init, which is why no one ever planned on keeping the latter. The battle was between systemd and Upstart, and systemd won out because the Debian developer community decided that systemd was the better choice and as such, Ubuntu decided to switch to it too and abandon Upstart development." PS, what are the specfics of this? just wondering...
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
That's my only complaint with devuan to be honest.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Alright, I had no idea that the answer I looked up was wrong.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Wow, so some systemd haters are actually engaged in active quote-mining? I didn't expect it to be that bad.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
> what advantages does systemd have Lots. *Everything* about systemd is better than SysV-init, which is why no one ever planned on keeping the latter. The battle was between systemd and Upstart, and systemd won out because the Debian developer community decided that systemd was the better choice and as such, Ubuntu decided to switch to it too and abandon Upstart development. Of course systemd isn't used universally; for example GuixSD uses GNU Shepherd and Gentoo uses OpenRC. But systemd is very popular for Linux-based systems because it's very good at what it does. > I have seen more cons Such as? > it is a neverending project I should hope so! If it wasn't, that would make it unmaintained. Linux is a neverending project, that's the only reason it's safe to use.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Since Trisquel is based on Ubuntu, you can also install the Snap: https://snapcraft.io/vscode
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Okay, but what advantages does systemd have then that makes it worth changing to besides being easier on developers. I honestly don't see any so far, other than that its easier on the developers. I have seen more cons than pros personally. But actually I read devuan's position and without-systemd.org and nosystemd.org. I read something about how it is a neverending project. Poettering even said that according to wikipedia, and I am wondering what his goal is. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Systemd Tell me, is the accepted answer at this link correct? https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/5877/what-are-the-pros-cons-of-upstart-and-systemd/6190 It says it manages passwords even
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
> has devuan succeeded Devuan, unlike Debian before it, is not committed to freedom on principle. The release notes for Devuan 2.0 say, for example, "All Devuan 2.0 ASCII install media make non-free firmware packages available at install time". All Devuan install media contain nonfree packages: That doesn't look like a successful, freedom-promoting fork of Debian to me; other peoples' opinions may differ, of course.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
> I never, have said you cannot make fun of anti-systemd inits, just don't do it in anger. No. Not inits. You. You do realize that the systemd developers are people, right? > I just don't get why at the drop of a coin I make a joke about it, and you guys go to town on me. If I may be frank, you didn't make a joke. All you did was link to a thread which had nothing whatsoever to do with the topic at hand, and made a statement about it. Is this a good joke in that same context? "They took that issue about as seriously as these vegans took my rebuttals!" Or is this a form of targeted harassment toward the vegans I've linked to? > I do the same thing with my president, donald trump, I make jokes about him for amusement purposes. Don't quit your day job.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
> why has devuan succeeded in getting community support when fedora's and ubuntu's systemd-free forks failed? I can't say I know what you're talking about. It's been a long time since I looked, but when I did, Devuan was lagging severely behind Debian. Meanwhile, Debian continues forward exactly as before, and Fedora has been using systemd for years with no apparent drop in "community support".
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Conspiracy theories aside, I don't know if systemd is a backdoor or not, I just prefer not use it, but tell me, why has devuan succeeded in getting community support when fedora's and ubuntu's systemd-free forks failed? Just wondering what your thoughts are.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
I don't understand how this is wrong, I never, have said you cannot make fun of anti-systemd inits, just don't do it in anger. If you like systemd, good for you, I just don't get why at the drop of a coin I make a joke about it, and you guys go to town on me. You can do the same thing, just don't flame me over it that's all. I was not flaming nor shaming, I wasn't intending to make this into a big issue, I merely was saying, it doesn't look good when you lock a thread from everyone but people who agree with you. Poettering just as easily could have locked it fully. That's all. I don't create drama intentionally, you greatly misunderstand my purpose with this, I do the same thing with my president, donald trump, I make jokes about him for amusement purposes. Not drama. PS, This goes for magic banana too, I don't say you have to do things my way or else... and I don't say both of you have to agree with me, just be respectful, not angry. If you disagree, fine but people will talk if they disagree. You have the right to think what you want and say what you want and so do I.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Using a thread that has nothing to do with systemd to publicly shame a systemd developer doesn't strike me as a very nice thing to do. How would you like it if on some forum about, I don't know, turkey sausages, some random guy was linking to your posts on the Trisquel forums and making fun of you for them? Incidentally, that person would likely get a warning and have his post deleted; most forums have a policy against bringing in drama from other websites/forums.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Man, you need to chill out, I was only saying that they should have locked the thread or left it open to everyone. geez, and stop telling me what to do man, you are not my master. ps, in trisquel you are correct, no threads related to systemd problems, but in others you don't know for sure as they could have been immediately locked. I am only going to tell you this once, enjoy systemd if you like it, but stop flaming people who disagree with you. Such arrogance...
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
I was going to ignore the thumbs down, but I feel its important, to say why I put this post here, Anytime you lock a thread just because you don't want to hear something, you should lock it from everyone responding including yourself. You shouldn't block only people who might disagree with you. My point being, in the spirit of freedom all I was saying is that you either lock it completely or leave it open. That's it done and done.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
So definitely VScode is nonfree for sure, then you instead need free IDE's like Eclipse.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
So semi-nonfree like the same issues found from Qt5-WebEngine? PureOS has liberated Qt5-WebEngine and I have sources at home.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
"MICROSOFT NEVER GIVES SOMETHING FREE! Just always remember this." Funny, I swear I just saw a useful text editor released as MIT-licensed free software. Wait, nevermind. It's Microsoft who released it, the company which deserves the strongest hate for whatever it does, that's why it should be avoided. Since rational thinking of using free software is no match for the feelings directed towards this company. What data does it send exactly? I trust you have studied the sources (I never had time and patience to do so), so can you answer me and point to the code responsible for sending that particular data? So I can quickly replace it and send whatever I want to the next time I compile and use it. Thank you in advance.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
as far as VS code is concerned only the source code is free software flathub does contain propritatary software such as spotify and steam so unless you are running pureos an fsf approved distro you should not use flatpak
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Why you don't use powerful editors such as vim and emacs? vim and emacs has many great plugins for python development.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
VS Code is Microsoft's stuff. When you install it, it immediately starts to send your data to Microsoft, only after that is asks "Whould like to continue send data to Microsoft?" You should avoid Microsoft stuff as it was fire. MICROSOFT NEVER GIVES SOMETHING FREE! Just always remember this.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
That thread was given about as much respect as this one: https://github.com/systemd/systemd/issues/5644
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Oh, show me your Emacs config! :D :D :D
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
On Wed, 2018-08-01 at 02:13 +0200, inthefor...@autistici.org wrote: > I would feel awful even if I had a libre copy of vscode. $ sudo apt purge cups
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Hey forum, long time member/lurker, logged in just to add my $0.02 USD The Visual Studio Code binary from Microsoft is proprietary. It uses the MIT-licensed source code available at https://github.com/Microsoft/vscode as its base, however it contains changes that are not distributed. There is a Free build in Flathub which is also compiled from the MIT-licensed code and is released under a free license (GNU Affero General Public License v3). This free build is available here: https://github.com/flathub/com.visualstudio.code.oss This free version is also published in Flathub: https://flathub.org/apps/details/com.visualstudio.code.oss That one should be preferable, however, I don't know what is the situation regarding plugins, if it does anything to prevent the installation of non-free plugins, or if it allows plugins at all.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
> According to the FSF website it's free This is not true https://directory.fsf.org/wiki/Visual_Studio_Code It hasn't been approved yet, and I doubt it will be accepted.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Yes! What an awesome thing to look at 4:34 AM. It makes me want to make a cup of coffee or two.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
chaosmonk, I've just read it. Oh, what a shame. dcapeletti, I hope you have no more doubts ;)
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
The most recommended is that don't use the vs code. In his replacement always this emacs. And if you want a basic and pleasant configuration I have a basic personalization of emacs
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
> I believe that everyone should be very accurate when using anything > 'open-source'. See this bug.[1] Micro$oft doesn't just distribute a proprietary binary; they falsely tell users that it is free and open source on the download page[2] for the binary. The fix is simple: either (a) remove the phrase "Free. Open source." from the download page, or (b) replace the download link with one for an MIT-licensed binary, yet 18 months and 30 comments later the bug is still open. Clearly it is not an oversight but intentional deception. [1] https://github.com/Microsoft/vscode/issues/17996 [2] https://code.visualstudio.com/ signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
I think that the problem is that the majority of potential vscode users don't mind about freedom. So they will get proprietary software from Microsoft, which misleads them by calling it 'open-source', and uses the power of the community to make non-free software. I believe that everyone should be very accurate when using anything 'open-source'. Yes, what Microsoft is doing is evil, and it is not fine. I would feel awful even if I had a libre copy of vscode.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Apparently nobody had anything productive to say (or maybe these people are more "open-source-oriented" and don't care about software freedom, as long as unobfuscated code is available?). I have, however: It's up to the program authors to decide, what license do they release it under. They decided that the sources are libre, their binaries are their property. Where's the problem? They can't be compiled with libre software or something? The authors' vision is so evil that we should boycott them and not use their libre code? I just don't understand, I thought that as long as software is released under a libre license, it's absolutely fine to use it.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
It is interesting that the only one comment that raises the question of justice and freedom (maybe not as directly, as needed) doesn't get any reply. https://github.com/Microsoft/vscode/issues/60#issuecomment-295544710 He shouldn't have written "free of charge" too, but basically he thinks in the right direction.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
https://github.com/Microsoft/vscode/issues/60#issuecomment-161792005 Hopefully this explains everything. My opinion: don't give up, grab the code, compile it and enjoy an awesome libre IDE.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
VSCode is an Electron program. Electron includes a huge amount of code derived from Chromium, so it is in the same undetermined state as it. Therefore, many of us do not use Chromium, Etcher, Riot Desktop or VSCode.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
The continuation of the 4th restriction: - share, publish, or lend the software, or provide it as a hosted solution for others to use, or transfer the software or this agreement to any third party.
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
This is a part of the license that implies to the 'product'. The source code of the vscode with HUGE 'OPEN SOURCE' near it is under MIT license with Microsoft reserving all their rights. The software contains third party components licensed under open source licenses with source code availability obligations. Copies of those licenses are included in the ThirdPartyNotices file or accompanying credits file. You may obtain the complete corresponding source code from us if and as required under the relevant open source licenses by sending a money order or check for $5.00 to: Source Code Compliance Team, Microsoft Corporation, 1 Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052 USA. Please write “third party source code for Visual Studio Code” in the memo line of your payment. We may also make the source available at http://thirdpartysource.microsoft.com/. . . . SCOPE OF LICENSE. The software is licensed, not sold. This agreement only gives you some rights to use the software. Microsoft reserves all other rights. Unless applicable law gives you more rights despite this limitation, you may use the software only as expressly permitted in this agreement. In doing so, you must comply with any technical limitations in the software that only allow you to use it in certain ways. You may not - work around any technical limitations in the software; - reverse engineer, decompile or disassemble the software, or otherwise attempt to derive the source code for the software except, and solely to the extent: (i) permitted by applicable law, despite this limitation; or (ii) required to debug changes to any libraries licensed under the GNU Lesser General Public License which are included with and linked to by the software; - remove, minimize, block or modify any notices of Microsoft or its suppliers in the software; - use the software in any way that is against the law; or And this is their privacy statement which I am lazy to quote, but it as absurd, as above: https://privacy.microsoft.com/en-us/privacystatement I agree with CalmStrom
Re: [Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Do what stallman recommends, or use eclipse or idle3 or some other libre alternative.
[Trisquel-users] VS Code is free software?
Hi, there, I'm looking for an IDE for python. VS code is going very well and I want to have it in my system. According to the FSF website it's free, but I have my doubts. What do you think? https://directory.fsf.org/wiki?title=Visual_Studio_Code=36929 Thank you