Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
This is so stupid. If you not call it Gnu/Linux you will burn in hell forever. Am I the only one (plus spooky) to see the pathetic of this debate? All the rest say "Amen"??? I ask a question and somebody comes with a note: "it is not Linux is Gnu/Linux!!!" And that somebody doesn't answer the question being made! It is Gnu/linux and not linux -> correct 100%. But I want to call it just Linux (yes because of this silly discussion!). I am not a preacher, I am not a missionary, I don't have to call the OS Gnu/linux if I don't want to! If I in my conscience support the movement from time to time (because I want). Nobody will tell me what to say. now that is bee free, isn't it? This sect-like reaction is purely and simply pathetic and I do not agree with it nor I will ever agree. Now give me that minus signs if I care!
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
whether or not he specified GNU everyone knew what he was talking about. It in no way relates to the question he asked. OP didn't ask about philosophy. if linux is a detriment to GNU ditch it and find a better kernel. the attitude of the community is one of many reasons people don't take linux, and gnu by extension, seriously. gnu/linux and linux is 10% coders and 90% people who want others to think they're cool for using "linux." there are very low standards for code and the GPL is anything but "free." its kids stuff, sad to say. and it doesn't look like its going to ever mature into anything more.
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
Theres a better time and place to make that distinction. Or better yet, make that point while offering useful help that pertains to the original question. This is the kind of crap that keeps "linux" and "gnu/linux" relegated to a toy, a joke, just for fun computer toy with users who are rude and pedantic. I'm beginning to remember why I ran BSD for the last decade
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
"I think there is supposed to be a gnu in there somewhere... https://www.gnu.org/gnu/linux-and-gnu.html"; This isn't helpful and it doesn't address the original question. This isn't the place to make the distinction between the linux kernel and gnu/linux os. If you told your mechanic you needed new brakes for your Corvette and he said, "Actually it's a Chevrolet Corvette" and then turned around and walked off, what impression would you have of him and the company he associates himself with? You likely would not find it helpful and perhaps even condescending. I don't think this kind of interaction is good for the linux community, and especially not for a small libre project. We ought to strive be supportive to other members of our user base regardless of their experience level. We don't have to hold hands and coddle everyone, but lets at least be friendly and tactful when we deal eachother. I'm stepping off my soap box now
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
Curious I started with C programming and right now I am studying lisp-scheme by that book that I gave the link above.
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
I started in C and have started learning LISP, Takumi. I don't know much about being a sysadmin, but I suspect if you build a small home network to experiment with and manage you will learn a great deal. I have a strong BSD background and the basic principles of computer networks and how they function, dns, dhcp, wpa, etc... that I learned there translates to other systems as well. I guess I'm trying to say that experience is sometimes the best teacher and hacking is all about being curious. I also highly suggest pretty much anything published by O'Reilly.
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
If someone already said this, please accept my apologies, but I must say it again just in case: When people hear you saying "GNU with Linux" or "GNU plus Linux" or "GNU slash Linux", you're atleast trying to call things by the right name and giving proper credit. Please be careful not to say "GNU Linux" since Linux isn't a GNU project. Note: Of course you can write "GNU/Linux" or "GNU+Linux", but not "GNU Linux" too. Personally, I like to say "GNU with Linux" and write "GNU+Linux". When the people near you say "Linux", you must try to educate them by briefly explaining the differences in the names that we already know. I have used this method ever since I started my activism (around the end of 2015) and it's working like a charm, however, you must insist (be a bit more stubborn, like how we do here sometimes). You might be asking: "If everyone asks me if I use 'Linux', wouldn't it be better to simply agree?". The answer is: Not entirely, besides, Linux is a sitting penguin without an operating system, that is, in this case, the GNU operating system. This combination forms the **base** for alot of system distributions (be them free or not). Then you might ask: "What about calling it only as 'GNU'? Or calling only the free system distributions as 'GNU'?". In this case, this creates another unwanted probleme: lack of credit to the other part. Besides, not all free/libre system distributions are GNU ones, see Replicant as an example. Also, as you might also have read here, not every base that uses GNU also uses Linux (e.g.: there are projects which use GNU+Hurd; and even GNU+kWindows). Again, one must not that very few of these projects are free/libre. This message isn't meant to recommend usage/installation/teaching/sharing/selling of such non-(free/libre) system distributions, since doing such things would raise immediate moral dilemmas, or even ethical dilemmas.
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
M$ has obviously understood that free software is a force to contend with. "First they ignore you, then they fight you, then you win." (--attributed to Gandhi) And they've picked up their weapon of choice, FUD, like so often before. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fear,_uncertainty_and_doubt#Microsoft So they indeed do get much better along with "Linux" and "open source" than GNU/Linux and free software and spread disinformation to keep the more potent stuff hidden away from the masses. This is why it is so important that we who know use the proper language and try to educate others.
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
Thought so once, decided to call this operating system just "GNU". But then I remembered it can be used with a different kernel (I tried it with Hurd once, and Arch Linux can use even a third kernel, the one from FreeBSD). So, it made more sense to me to name it system/kernel: GNU/Linux, GNU/Hurd, and so on.
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
It is like "Microsoft loves Linux", Microsoft can not see diferrences between a kernel and an OS. And the first time I used GNU/Linux, it was Ubuntu, and I though that time that it was just "Linux", while not knowing nothing about GNU, FSF and RMS.
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
->Most people know nothing about RMS and GNU, while using Ubuntu Linux. That is true I go to a ubuntu meeting every month here in Portugal, and they don't know nothing about RMS and GNU, they only use Ubuntu not knowing that some programs in Ubuntu don't respect their freedom. I think we are on the same page on that. But I read GNU and RMS FSF site and the other day he was here in Portugal, and I'd go to is conference, a really nice one about surveillance and Democracy. I am with you on that one!
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
Yes i do speak because it is my native language. Interesting ->Portuga-a-programar? exactly my words and feelings! I subscribe them! Obrigado pelas dicas vou ver isso então!
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
You have the point. I learned something from your explanation, thanks.
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
That site it is not some creed or religion. It's simple, "Linux" is kernel, one component or part of an operating system, not necessary GNU, Linux it is not part of GNU project. Linux is Linus Torvald's kernel. GNU is operating system. "An operating system (OS) is system software that manages computer hardware and software resources and provides common services for computer programs. All computer programs, excluding firmware, require an operating system to function." So operating system itself is an collection of programs, user uses those programs, but user supposed not to using kernel, operating system uses kernel and not user. So, why calling Linux to everything? you can install GNU+Hurd, or kernel you want (if you adapt to GNU). Will you call GNU+Hurd as Linux too? I saw horrorific things like "Linux's kernel" or "kernel of Linux", in a thing called "Linux Mint"(yes, it's a GNU+Linux distro). WTF? why a kernel needs kernel? So, when you trying to refer to GNU+Linux saying "Linux", it confuse us. We don't know if you talk about Linus Torvald's kernel, or about GNU, or about whole GNU+Linux system.
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
->Firstly, out of curiosity, is there any particular reason you find "Linux" easier to say than "GNU/Linux"? It's obviously one syllable shorter (two if you break the gn), but I find it interesting that you find it harder to say. R.:I could start saying GNU/Linux, I admit is the real correct term. But every time I used it they go like: "what/Linux!? I understood Linux, is that Linux that you use?" and to simplify I say "yes, Linux". And we go from there...Linux is better known, is a fact. Now in relation to the debate above: The question here was that the note was made like (At least I felt it that way, I could be wrong): "You have made a sacrilege, you have to redeem yourself". And that's the kind of behaviour I had saw in other forums that I intentionally left from. Is like some guys (I am talking of that other forum that I left not from here!!!) have the truth and the new ones have to be submissive, and that annoys me. It's a pattern that repeats itself and don't have to. But maybe it's a trauma of mine...
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
I think the same: Everybody right now, can call Android as only "Linux", ahhh, and of course, it's fine call "Linux" everything that contains it. I just can not understand, why people call Android as "Android", and not "Linux", while calling the whole GNU+Linux system as "Linux". Most people know nothing about RMS and GNU, while using Ubuntu Linux.
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
Ok I'll frame my position in relation to programming and Sysadmin: In the long run I would like (if I remain persistent like I am) to change my job. I am not in tech area. I've learned C programming a 2 year ago and indeed had good score on that course I'made. but apart from exercises and some little programs that I do in C4droid in my smartphone I never really saw when to use C in a consistent way. Well, then I knew in Gnu/linux one really could apply C programming particularly in networking (another one of too many areas that I like) and even by learning some other languages (python/scheme, bashShell) I could became something and pretend - who knows - change my job. That with my love to freedom, free software, knowledge, real democracy, etc, etc. brings me to were I am know: in this beautiful forum, in the world of GNU/linux. I hope it's not too much that I want to move to a better job, after all, we all want a better position in life, right? About the links you gave: Now that's a good list! That's what I am asking about! terrific! Hugs p.s. Do you speak portuguese? se sim, espectaculo!
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
Nice, thanks :) To be honest, I don't know much about Stallman, I suggested Lisp just because recently I learned about tutorials directly accessible from Emacs (using Lisp I think, but being a wider intro to programming). But Lisp still looks like a good first language from what I've heard, though Python (and later C) as suggested by Alimiracle look like one interesting path.
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
Hello! "I want to became more pro in linux, linux Sysadmin, programmer and so on" i have bookmarked some sites long ago and saved it. I have several links that can help you what you want, as well i kept it to myself because i am interested in starting to learn programming. I didn't before because it was not the right time to do so. So like you i am finding what is best to me to start with. But before that "what forums do you use? what do you recommend?" to me the best forum is trisquel because community is very active. I tried other forums like debian in portuguese but well... several of them can recommend proprietary things to install and/or they are very inactive and you need to wait long time to get your answer... Now, let's go start with the request of programming. As you don't specified what "programming language" you wanted i will put all i have here. So far the links i have or would like to learn are: http://www.ftacademy.org/courses https://www.w3.org/2002/03/tutorials.html https://training.linuxfoundation.org/ http://www.tldp.org/LDP/nag2/index.html http://www.tldp.org/guides.html http://www.openculture.com/freeonlinecourses http://www.academictutorials.com/w3c/ http://www.oreilly.com/ http://linux-training.be/ https://www.edx.org/ Of course... some sites are more useful than others but anyway i placed here. Next: https://wiki.debian.org/ProgrammingLanguage https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/eintr/index.html https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/index.html https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Non-Programmer's_Tutorial_for_Python_3/Print_version#What_you_should_know http://www.revista-programar.info/ And now several posts about programming in trisquel: https://trisquel.info/en/forum/which-language-should-i-learn-1st https://trisquel.info/en/forum/which-programming-language-should-i-learn https://trisquel.info/en/forum/%C2%BFcu%C3%A1l-lenguaje-de-programaci%C3%B3n-recomendar%C3%ADan https://trisquel.info/en/forum/would-anyone-know-any-online-classes-i-could-learn-more-about-linux https://trisquel.info/en/forum/want-free-net-programming-book https://trisquel.info/en/forum/html-editors-trisquel https://trisquel.info/en/forum/programs-teach-coding-similar-tuxtype Well this is good for me because i can keep all the things here in case i lost my papers ahaha I hope that something here can at least be helpful. Best regards
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
I can understand your anger, Takumi13. Personally, although there are a few points where I feel inclined to disagree with you, I honestly also feel like your frustration may be one that many GNU/Linux users-to-be share and consequently drives them out. However, please also note I do not wish to imply suspicion of malice. Particularly given the fact that we have to half-compete half-co-operate with true Open Source fans, it can become very tempting to try and protect against dilution of the movement, hence (in my opinion) the tendency for such notes to be applied consistently. Firstly, out of curiosity, is there any particular reason you find "Linux" easier to say than "GNU/Linux"? It's obviously one syllable shorter (two if you break the gn), but I find it interesting that you find it harder to say. Secondly, please be aware "GNU/Linux" is no more correct in the technical sense than "Linux" for the system. Whilst it is a fairer and more descriptive name, and so I strongly encourage you to use it in communications with others, both are equally good at communicating the intended meaning and equally vague for stating which OS you use. Please (unless you're discussing the whole family of OSes) avoid my pet peeve and give a name when you only mean one distro. When discussing the actual kernel though, as I'm sure you know, "GNU/Linux" is blatantly incorrect. Finally, in regards to fora, I can't give you much advice. The above suggestion to read the documentation for BASH and other key utilities is a good one, although it is rather opaque and obviously not a forum. For programming, naming a specific language would probably be of great assistance. Also, once again in the wrong format (sorry!), the "Linux" (their words) system administrator's guide book, released under the GDFL, seems quite good. I got a copy with a magazine a while ago, and haven't read it, but I suppose it can't be terrible if it's distributed with a popular "Linux" (once again, not my words) magazine. It's available online here: http://www.tldp.org/LDP/sag/html/index.html
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
Thanks... Lisp I remenber Dr. Stallman wrote something about Lisp being is prefered language. I reciprocate and give you the link for this book http://web.mit.edu/alexmv/6.S184/sicp.pdf. It's one that I begin to read yesterday an highly regarded book about scheme (a Lisp variant). One note: amazon ans others are is selling this book when this book is at the same time have some sort of free license there... Anyway is an highly regarded book.
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
Is this a religious site or what? have I committed some sort of sacrilege? this is ridiculous... Dude, if I go out there and an acquaintance of mine ask me about what is that strange OS that you use, it is more simple to me that respond: "It's linux" rather than Gnu/linux. If he some day want to install linux I suggest mint because it's more easy. Then some day I talk him about totally free software and Gnu. That's what I normally do. And no, your friend didn't answer the question being made just wrote a clever annotation. One that I already knew.
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
In defense of my friend Jxself You asked for technical resources: 1.- Calling things by its name is really important for a technical person. From doctors, to mathematicians, to sysadmins. It is important for all of them to use proper technical names in order for them to express the exact thing they want to say. 2.- The article was written by Richard M. Stallman, probably the most important person on the GNU/Linux community, both technical,(as he decided a lot of important stuff of how the GNU system works), and morally (as his opinions matter a lot for the community). 3.- The article speaks of technical matters, as it explains the difference between a Full Operating System and a Kernel. 4.- That website is full of technical resources that will help you to improve your knowledge of topics of the GNU System, like the sometimes wrongly called linux terminal, that in reality is GNU Bash, (just type help on your terminal and see the input). See: https://www.gnu.org/software/bash/ 5.- That same website is full of resources that will help you to understand the legal aspects of free software licenses, that by your line of work, you will probably need at least have some understanding of them. See https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/categories.html#TheGNUsystem and also see https://www.gnu.org/copyleft/copyleft.html So I think Jxself was trying to help you rather than "just saying that", and he gave you actually a really good answer. But I do think is bad for you to say just "linux", if you want to improve your technical knowledge of a system is important to at minimum know its name.
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
Sysadmin and programming? Iwouldn't choose a forum, but more like wikis, books, anything like that. I could have recommended things like codecademy but javascript and stuff. But I'm aware of an intro for LISP (for example) on the emacs documentation. I like Archwiki, For IT, I think there's some good stuff on Youtube (can't remember the names).
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
Do you Sir reply just to say That? I know is Gnu/linux, it was not on purpose when I forgot to use the GNU. Is it to bad just to say linux instead of Gnu/Linux? I think if you reply only to make that annotation, and don't give a answer to the question baing made... well... I don't see the point of it! But sure is Gnu/Linux not just linux. You have reason on that, my fault!
Re: [Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
I think there is supposed to be a gnu in there somewhere... https://www.gnu.org/gnu/linux-and-gnu.html
[Trisquel-users] What other forums so you use and recommend?
Hello forum. That's my question as in the title. Imagine that I want to became more pro in linux, linux Sysadmin, programmer and so on... what forums do you use? what do you recommend? note: more like technical linux forums not chats, I don't have much time to waist. Best regards to all Hugs.
