Re: [Tutor] Fwd: : Turtle

[Joaquin Alzola]

I tested with 2.6 and it works.

>/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5/bin/python2.5 
>"/Users/Hershel/PycharmProjects/Project 1/practicefornotturtle.py"
>Traceback (most recent call last):
 > File "/Users/Hershel/PycharmProjects/Project 1/practicefornotturtle.py", 
 > line 2, in 
 >  turtle.pendown()
>AttributeError: 'module' object has no attribute 'pendown'

Cannot access the documentation of the 2.5 to check if the pendown() is there.
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Re: [Tutor] Fwd: : Turtle

[Steven D'Aprano]

On Thu, Jun 23, 2016 at 02:13:56PM -0700, Hershel Millman wrote:
> What I typed was:
> 
> import turtle
> turtle.pendown()

What do you get if you print turtle.__file__?

> (And pendown was highlighted in pycharm, indicating that it was not a valid 
> command.)
> 
> The error message I received was:
> 
> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5/bin/python2.5 

Look at the version number: you are running Python 2.5. 

Now look at the result you got earlier:

> >> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.6/lib/python2.6/lib-tk/turtle.py

Look at the version number: you are running Python 2.6.

So you have AT LEAST two different Python versions on your computer. 
That's fine, I have *nine* versions on mine. But it does mean you have 
to be a little more careful to ensure you are using the right one.

My *guess* is that your Mac has pre-installed version 2.5 with the 
operating system, and you have installed version 2.6 next to it, and now 
you sometimes get 2.5 and sometimes 2.6 depending on which icon you 
double-click. Or something like that. Or maybe PyCharm let's you pick a 
different version, and you haven't noticed.

You can check the version from inside Python:

import sys
print sys.version

My prediction is:

* when you run Python 2.6, turtle will work fine, including the pendown 
command (but remember to use round brackets/parentheses):

turtle.pendown()  # okay in 2.6

* when you run Python 2.5, turtle will import, but there is no 
turtle.pendown command. Instead, it is called turtle.down.

Documentation for 2.5:

https://docs.python.org/release/2.5.4/lib/module-turtle.html

Documentation for 2.6:

https://docs.python.org/release/2.6/library/turtle.html



-- 
Steve
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Re: [Tutor] Fwd: : Turtle

[Alan Gauld via Tutor]

On 23/06/16 22:13, Hershel Millman wrote:
> What I typed was:
> 
> import turtle
> turtle.pendown()
> 
> (And pendown was highlighted in pycharm, indicating that it was not a valid 
> command.)

Don't use pycharm. We need to eliminate as many variables as possible.
Start python in a Terminal and just type the commands into the raw
Python interpreter. Send a paste of the transcript.
I expect to see something like:

agauld@ubuntu:~$ python2
Python 2.7.6 (default, Jun 22 2015, 17:58:13)
[GCC 4.8.2] on linux2
Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>> import turtle
>>> turtle.__file__
'/usr/lib/python2.7/lib-tk/turtle.pyc'
>>> turtle.pendown

>>> turtle.pendown()
>>>

Can you reproduce that on your Mac? (Except maybe with an
error message somewhere along the line?)

> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5/bin/python2.5 
> "/Users/Hershel/PycharmProjects/Project 1/practicefornotturtle.py"
> Traceback (most recent call last):
>   File "/Users/Hershel/PycharmProjects/Project 1/practicefornotturtle.py", 
> line 2, in 
> turtle.pendown()
> AttributeError: 'module' object has no attribute 'pendown'

I notice that this says you are using Python 2.5 but your
last message suggested the module was in 2.6.

I don't think that should make a difference for the turtle
module but it might be significant... Lets see your
transcript first.

-- 
Alan G
Author of the Learn to Program web site
http://www.alan-g.me.uk/
http://www.amazon.com/author/alan_gauld
Follow my photo-blog on Flickr at:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/alangauldphotos


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[Tutor] Fwd: : Turtle

[Hershel Millman]

What I typed was:

import turtle
turtle.pendown()

(And pendown was highlighted in pycharm, indicating that it was not a valid 
command.)

The error message I received was:

/System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5/bin/python2.5 
"/Users/Hershel/PycharmProjects/Project 1/practicefornotturtle.py"
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/Users/Hershel/PycharmProjects/Project 1/practicefornotturtle.py", line 
2, in 
turtle.pendown()
AttributeError: 'module' object has no attribute 'pendown'

Process finished with exit code 1


Thank you,

Hershel


Begin forwarded message:

> From: Alan Gauld via Tutor 
> Date: June 23, 2016 12:12:39 AM MST
> To: tutor@python.org
> Subject: Re: [Tutor] : Turtle
> Reply-To: Alan Gauld 
> 
> On 23/06/16 01:52, Hershel Millman wrote:
>> I found the turtle module on my computer.
>> 
> import turtle
> print(turtle.__file__)
>> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.6/lib/python2.6/lib-tk/turtle.py
> 
> That's the right turtle module do not rename it.
> 
 I entered "import turtle" instead of "from turtle import * ", but it 
 looks as if it did not import the pendown command. Why is that?
> 
> If that's the module you are importing it should work.
> 
> What happens if you try:
> 
 import turtle
 turtle.pendown()
> 
> Do you still get the error?
> 
> If so can you cut n paste the entire session, including the initial
> python startup message and the error message, into a mail for us?
> 
> 
> -- 
> Alan G
> Author of the Learn to Program web site
> http://www.alan-g.me.uk/
> http://www.amazon.com/author/alan_gauld
> Follow my photo-blog on Flickr at:
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/alangauldphotos
> 
> 
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Re: [Tutor] Fwd: Turtle

[Steven D'Aprano]

On Sat, Jun 18, 2016 at 08:46:53PM -0700, Hershel Millman wrote:

> > I followed your instruction and typed "import turtle" into the terminal on 
> > my mac, and nothing happened.

If you're talking about the Python prompt, that's good. That means 
turtle is installed. Importing a module either succeeds, or gives a 
traceback. Compare the difference between these two imports:

py> import turtle
py> import octopus
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "", line 1, in 
ImportError: No module named 'octopus'


[...]
> > In pycharm, when I enter the following, it replies with the 
> > following error message:
> > 
> > from turtle import *
> > 
> > def drawSquare(size=100):
> >turtle.pendown()
[...]

> > Traceback (most recent call last):
> >  File "/Users/Hershel/PycharmProjects/Project 1/practicefornotturtle.py", 
> > line 14, in 
> >drawSquare(50)
> >  File "/Users/Hershel/PycharmProjects/Project 1/practicefornotturtle.py", 
> > line 4, in drawSquare
> >turtle.pendown()
> > NameError: global name 'turtle' is not defined

This is the difference between plain "import" and "from ... import".

Here is a simplified example that hopefully will be clear:


py> import math
py> math.pi
3.141592653589793
py> pi
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "", line 1, in 
NameError: name 'pi' is not defined



With a regular import, the math module is loaded and made available 
using the module name. To see inside the module, you have to use the dot 
operator (it's not really an operator, but I'll call it that) to get 
access to functions and variables inside the math module. Hence you must 
say "math.pi".

If you say "pi" on its own, Python looks for a variable called pi, 
doesn't find one, and complains.


If I quit out of Python and start again, in a fresh session:

py> from math import pi
py> math.pi
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "", line 1, in 
NameError: name 'math' is not defined
py> pi
3.141592653589793


"from ... import" works the opposite way. It still loads the math 
module, but this time it DOESN'T make it available under that name, so 
"math.pi" fails. Instead, it cretaes a new variable called pi, set to 
math.pi.


Finally:

from math import *

doesn't just import pi, but ALL the functions and variables from the 
math module. That is generally not a good idea. There are very 
occasional times were it is useful, but in general you should only 
import what you need:

from math import pi, sin, cos

or import the entire module:

import math




-- 
Steve
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Re: [Tutor] Fwd: Turtle

[Alan Gauld via Tutor]

On 19/06/16 04:46, Hershel Millman wrote:

>> In pycharm, when I enter the following, it replies with the following error 
>> message:
>>
>> from turtle import *
>>

Change that to

import turtle

and it should work.



>> def drawSquare(size=100):
>>turtle.pendown()
>>turtle.forward(size)
>>turtle.left(90)
>>turtle.forward(size)
>>turtle.left(90)
>>turtle.forward(size)
>>turtle.left(90)
>>turtle.forward(size)
>>turtle.left(90)
>>
>> drawSquare(50)
>>
>> input ()


-- 
Alan G
Author of the Learn to Program web site
http://www.alan-g.me.uk/
http://www.amazon.com/author/alan_gauld
Follow my photo-blog on Flickr at:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/alangauldphotos


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[Tutor] Fwd: Turtle

[Hershel Millman]

Begin forwarded message:

> From: Hershel Millman 
> Date: June 18, 2016 2:39:21 PM MST
> To: Steven D'Aprano 
> Subject: Re: [Tutor] Turtle
> 
> Steven,
> 
> I followed your instruction and typed "import turtle" into the terminal on my 
> mac, and nothing happened.
> 
> When I entered the following, a new window was created in which the turtle 
> behaved exactly like it was supposed to.
> 
> for i in range(4):
> ...turtle.right(90)
> ...turtle.forward(200)
> 
> In pycharm, when I enter the following, it replies with the following error 
> message:
> 
> from turtle import *
> 
> def drawSquare(size=100):
>turtle.pendown()
>turtle.forward(size)
>turtle.left(90)
>turtle.forward(size)
>turtle.left(90)
>turtle.forward(size)
>turtle.left(90)
>turtle.forward(size)
>turtle.left(90)
> 
> drawSquare(50)
> 
> input ()
> 
> Traceback (most recent call last):
>  File "/Users/Hershel/PycharmProjects/Project 1/practicefornotturtle.py", 
> line 14, in 
>drawSquare(50)
>  File "/Users/Hershel/PycharmProjects/Project 1/practicefornotturtle.py", 
> line 4, in drawSquare
>turtle.pendown()
> NameError: global name 'turtle' is not defined
> 
> Process finished with exit code 1
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Hershel
> 
> On Jun 18, 2016, at 2:00 AM, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> 
>> On Fri, Jun 17, 2016 at 11:25:40PM -0700, Hershel Millman wrote:
>>> Hello tutors,
>>> 
>>> I have been learning basic python on my Macintosh computer and 
>>> everything I have tried so far has worked, except when I tried to use 
>>> the turtle module. I then used my Linux computer and the turtle module 
>>> still did not work.
>> 
>> What does "did not work" mean?
>> 
>> Did you get an error message? Blue Screen Of Death? Computer caught 
>> fire?
>> 
>> I see later on that you are running PyCharm. Let's try this with the 
>> default Python interpreter. Open a terminal window. You should see a 
>> prompt ending with a dollar sign $ e.g. on my computer I see:
>> 
>> [steve@ando ~]$
>> 
>> Type the command "python" without quotes, and hit Enter. You should get 
>> a message about the version of Python you are running, and a >>> prompt. 
>> This is the Python interpreter. Now enter:
>> 
>> import turtle
>> 
>> What happens? Do you get an error?
>> 
>> If not, what happens if you enter these lines?
>> 
>> turtle.shape('turtle')
>> for i in range(4):
>>   turtle.right(90)
>>   turtle.forward(200)
>> 
>> (Hit the TAB key at the beginning of the last two lines to get the 
>> indent. When you have finished typing, you will need to enter one extra 
>> time to have Python run the code.)
>> 
>> Describe what happens. Do you get an error? If you do, copy and paste 
>> the ENTIRE error message, starting with the line "Traceback".
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> I tried to use the command line and type "sudo dnf 
>>> install turtle", "sudo pip install turtle", and it told me "no package 
>>> turtle available".
>> 
>> That's because turtle is part of the standard library. It's already 
>> installed. If you run:
>> 
>> locate turtle.py
>> 
>> from your Linux or Mac OS X shell (not from Python!) you should see a 
>> list of at least one turtle.py files.
>> 
>> 
>>> I tried to install Python-tk and python3-tk, and I 
>>> was told that no packages by those names were available. I also tried 
>>> reinstalling python 2 and python 3, to no avail.
>> 
>> Reinstalling Python should be the *last* resort, not the first, or 
>> second.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> Steve
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