[TYPO3-english] Re: Re: Searching and TYPO3 6.2 - again
Hi Georg, Quote: Georg Ringer wrote on Wed, 12 February 2014 10:12 Hi, Am 12.02.2014 09:47, schrieb Thomas Skierlo: Talking to myself - I've got no answers, except 2 private emails with a message similar to Don't bother with 6.2.0 - you'll lose all of your hair maybe the topic has been broad up a bit often by you already? This post is even a new thread which doesn't help at all. A sentence like does not work is also not helpful. Is the content indexed? You are right. I opened at least 6 threads related to searching and TYPO3. By the way, are you counting threads with answers? I've opened the first one after my migration from 6.0 to 6.1, when IS failed for the first time since 4.2. Filed 3 issues on Forge, 2 with ready-made solutions. One of them was opened last week, short after it's birthday, and now I was asked to review it - but I can't, since the plugin has vanished after beta3. Anyhow being readonly at your threads I still wonder which setup to you got because you run into problems I never have seen. Same at forge in your recently submitted report [1] Does this translate to I, Georg, have no issues with IS on current master? Did you never see the problems I'm currently facing, because you use a better solution as IS? Or does it mean: I'm not using IS and therefore IS has no issues? Georg. You are aware that THIS thread sublimes in only one simple question? Can anyone confirm IS working on a fresh installation of 6.2 ? I think, I perfectly explained why I asked this question. If only I have this issue, it's probably something rotten in my configuration, otherwise it might be a problem of the product OR the core. Knowing is the very first step for any cure. And the best place to find out is a product related discussion forum. And believe me, it's very hard to debug something that's just not there any more. It's 5 a.m. now and I did analyze every single change to IS since 6.1.6 within the last 20 hours. To make it short, all of them look reasonable, and no change would explain why the plugin is not showing up any more. So probably, my recent death of IS is core related like the other issue we discussed yesterday. Setup - in this case - plays a minor role, since setup is enforced by ext_typoscript_setup.txt (which is no good idea at all). So even in case you do nothing except placing the plugin you should get a reaction from it, and be it a fatal. So the first thing I did after hitting the shit was disabling all my custom setup. Up to 6.2.0beta3 the next thing I saw always was the table based markup of the most basic template IS has to offer. That is expected behavior, including those funny Search Rules. Even switching to the experimental plugin brought some (strange) results at least if you fix some naming problems in the Fluid-Templates (which I also filed to Forge about a year ago). IS issues on Forge just keep untouched, since all people knowing more seem to use 4.5 with Solr. This might work for them, but it will kill the whole product in the end. You sound like indexed_search is the most awesome search experience you can have! That is certainly not true. There are alternatives which can hardly be reached by indexed_search. The reason is simply because the alternative is made for search and uses something really useful. No, IS is far away from being awesome, but it did it's job for small projects since 4.2, and for a very long time it was the only search solution TYPO3 had to offer. It's core land - until the time being. Und es ist uneingeschränkte Open Source. I'd wish you guys would be able to take the position of a newcomer to TYPO3. Imagine how it feels when nothing works as it should. Chance for deep frustration is much bigger today than it was 6 years ago, when there was one tutorial per product, and each of them was matching the version. Yes indexed_search could be improved a lot but in the end, it still won't be a competitor to solr co. I'm perfectly aware of that, but it is no excuse for IS not working. It seems that nobody except me is early-adopting 6.2.0 in a production-like environment not true. Prove it. Test IS on recent master and share the result. Without early adopters we will get what we deserve. A non working time bomb - with unit tests showing green. are there any unit tests for indexed search? I doubt. Try to get the message. It translates to something like if you change a part of the engine, check if it still runs afterwards Getting tired to burn my time any further. For the first time in 6 years I checked recent Drupal specs, since I can't afford to use a CMS which is incapable of searching. If any product fits better for your needs, please use it! Good to know. However solr is an awesome tool (not only the extension itself but the product I am talking about) which can be used to fulfill things you will *never* get with
[TYPO3-english] Re: Re: Searching and TYPO3 6.2 - again
Hi Jigal, Quote: Jigal van Hemert wrote on Wed, 12 February 2014 10:53 Hi, On 12-2-2014 9:47, Thomas Skierlo wrote: Quote: Thomas Skierlo (tsknl) wrote on Mon, 10 February 2014 17:33 Can anyone confirm indexed_search working on a fresh install of 6.2.0? It would help me a lot to know, because in this case I have to look for an error in my configuration. Talking to myself - I've got no answers, except 2 private emails with a message similar to Don't bother with 6.2.0 - you'll lose all of your hair Since you mentioned in your original post that EXT:solr wasn't working with TYPO3 6.2 you already got a reply from Olivier Dobberkau that the current git version of solr is working with 6.2. They will probably release a new community version around the time TYPO3 CMS 6.2 is released. Yes, I'm perfectly informed in terms of Solr. Well, I'm already past that point, and, to be honest, I didn't have any serious problems with community extensions. My only personal blocker is core stuff: Indexd Search. IS issues on Forge just keep untouched, since all people knowing more seem to use 4.5 with Solr. This might work for them, but it will kill the whole product in the end. Indexed Search issues should be fixed, but that is also the case for a lot of other issues. In a community where most stuff is done voluntarily (and unpaid) many devs scratch their own itches. Yes. The only hard reason for my early use of TYPO3 6.2 was a new extension, which was finished for 6.1 in late december. It is ment for 6.0, so I wanted to test it on 6.2 as early as possible, and finalize the docs in latest standards. Since this extension needs a fully fledged website, I must fix all issues of my most basic setup and services first, including ANY search solution. It's simple as that. Couldn't do my job yet. And if I'm facing an issue, I'm getting tough on it. I don't move on until it's solved, or substituted. Tried substitution first, with no success (by now), so currently all I can do is fix IS, which was working well (never good) for a very long time. Or, to be more precise, I wanna fix it, if it's broken - or fix other things related. Every search solution has its pros and cons, but in many cases solr may very well prove to be better than Indexed Search. The reasons are quite simple that the engine (the solr server part) is the work of a large community of search specialists. The indexing solution is often slightly better than the concept used by IS. I see only one major pro for IS. It can be used without any additional application servers. It's slow, some filtering is weird, but it does the job for all sites up to 200-300 pages. Works (worked) in multidomain as well as multilingual environments, and it respects access rights. Lucene, Solr, Google. Sure, all are better than IS. But it might be of bigger importance to get IS ready for 6.2, since it is integral part of the suite. With a hard dependency on Solr TYPO3 would get into trouble, since most recent features of Solr depend on some kind of payment (which is perfectly ok - as long as there is any working alternative) IS could be enough for a small site. If you have troubles setting it up an article by Xavier Perseguers [1] will be helpful. Yes, I know the article. Excellent. Red it when it was published and after using IS for a couple of years on all versions from 4.2 up to 6.2.0beta3. From the following daily head on it made puff, and the plugin was gone. I'd love to debug something which is there, but I don't know how to debug something which is missing. If you find problems with IS, please see if there is already a forge issue for it; if not please file one. I already did, and if you blow away the dust, you'll see most of them red. My current favorite is another one: #52364 (or one of his many duplicates). ext_typoscript_setup.txt is hell. Claus is perfectly right. This method is absolutely beyond any control, and overrides all static templates. But even this monster is part of IS since aeons. Possibly inclusion behaviour might have been changed. My second assumption is, that something has been removed from Core, which was related to FE rendering or template inclusion. Or some former core stuff has moved into an extension, like with statictemplates, and no-one changed dependencies. Did not find any lethal changes in IS code recently, so i expect it to be core-change related. Create some buzz for the specific problems you encounter, ask people to vote for the issues that are blocking for you. This makes it more likely that devs will take a look at the issue. That's why I'm here Regards, Thomas ___ TYPO3-english mailing list TYPO3-english@lists.typo3.org http://lists.typo3.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/typo3-english
