RE: [U2] Univere Login Security

2004-08-05 Thread Ross Ferris
How are you connecting ?

If via dialup/ras, you should be able to assign a fixed IP for the connection. Ditto 
if you are using a VPN over the net.

If it IS dialup, you could always install a modem with dial back security that calls 
to YOUR house (which may also cut down telecom costs :-)

Hopefully you are NOT using Telnet via the net, and have at least SSH

Ross Ferris
Stamina Software
Visage  an Evolution in Software Development


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-u2-
[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Schasny
Sent: Thursday, 5 August 2004 3:01 AM
To: U2 Group
Subject: RE: [U2] Univere Login Security

Telnet to a machine with a static IP and then telnet to his machine

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Hi all,
A buddy of mine wants me to be able to login to his computer on a routine
basis to give him a hand with some development.  Currently, he has a
process that matches the ip address to the username and if it does not
match, the user gets booted.  The problem that I have is that my ip address
is dynamic.  Given the fact that this is a unix machine that I will be
logging into, I assume that I cannot use a mac address or anything like
that,  Can someone out there give me a simple and effective solution for
this?


Thanks,

Scott


Jeff Schasny | Denver, Colorado, USA | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: Unclassified RE: [U2] UniObjects for .NET (UO.NET)

2004-08-05 Thread Simon Lewington
HENDERSON MICHAEL MR [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

 Great stuff, but reading it I'm a little disappointed that there is no
 mention of Connection Pooling.  One of the previously advertised
 benefits of UO.NET was that it would include a connection pooling
 mechanism.  Has this 'fallen off' or is it documented somewhere else?

http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/en-us/cpref/html/frlrfSystemEnterpriseServicesServicedComponentClassTopic.asp

Simon
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RE: [U2] UniObjects on Server 2003

2004-08-05 Thread djordan
With Windows 2003 as part of the new security direction of Microsoft,
everything is switched off or closed, and you need to switch on the items
you want.  Check that the unirpc port you use for uniobjects does not have
the port closed.  Check the port number used for RPC in the Unidata
Administration menu and check that it is not closed in the firewall or IRC,
etc.

I have not had any problems with Universe Objects on Windows 2003.

Regards

David Jordan
Managing Consultant
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Dacono Holdings Pty Ltd
Business  Technology Consulting
PO Box 909
Lane Cove 
NSW 2066
Australia
Ph 61 2 9418 8329
Fax 61 2 9427 2371
www.dacono.com.au 



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Darren Tauer
Sent: Thursday, 5 August 2004 1:01 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [U2] UniObjects on Server 2003


Using .net we have an asp application connecting to a Unidata 6.08 database.

The following code works fine on 2000, but not on Windows 2003 server. It
errors out with a library not registered error. Do we need a different
version of uniobjects in order to run this on Windows 2003 server or is
there a different way to create the objects on 2003? I tried several
different approaches and got different errors ranging from library not
registered to invalid cast exception.  Is there a different com object for
2003 or a different object library we should be using?


 Dim UDSession As New UNIOBJECTSLib.UnioaifCtrl
UDSession.UserName = dsiroot
UDSession.Password = x
UDSession.accountpath = /info/TCF
UDSession.HOSTNAME = beaker
UDSession.connect()

Anyone else have this experience with moving to Windows 2003 server?

Thanks,
Darren Tauer
TCF Leasing, Inc.
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RE: [U2] Memresize memory parameter PDF in error?

2004-08-05 Thread alfkec
As the on-line help says - I think it's in K. I use 256000 to 512000 all of
the time without trouble and it does speed up things. You will get an error
if you don't have enough memory though.

-- 
Colin Alfke
Calgary, Alberta Canada

Just because something isn't broken doesn't mean that you can't fix it

Stu Pickles


-Original Message-
From: Jeremy Thomson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

[snip] 

Is the memory parameter in bytes or K?
Dont want to get this one wrong, I might have a memory buffer 
1000 times too small or big.

Later in the same PDF there is an example.

:!memresize INVENTORY MEMORY 12000 KEYDATA PARTTBL /home/terric/parttbl
Resize INVENTORY mod(,sep) = 0(,-1) type = -1 memory = 12000 
(k) dynamic
...

Hmmm, I guess I'll trust the paramter to be in K and the above 
1200 to be a typo?

regards,
Jeremy Thomson
applications programmer
Fliway International (NZ) Ltd
+64 9 279 5200
+64 9 275 7861 (fax)
www.fliway.com
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RE: [U2] Pyramid HR

2004-08-05 Thread David Wolverton
It's actually HRPyramid!! From F.W.Davison and Company... 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Steve Kunzman
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 8:07 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [U2] Pyramid HR

Has anyone worked on a package called Pyramid HR?  It uses Unidata for its
database. Any details would be appreciated.

TIA

Steve Kunzman
Minneapolis, MN
(612)750-3899 cellular
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[U2] Pyramid HR

2004-08-05 Thread Steve Kunzman
Has anyone worked on a package called Pyramid HR?  It uses Unidata for its
database. Any details would be appreciated.

TIA

Steve Kunzman
Minneapolis, MN
(612)750-3899 cellular
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Re: [U2] Pyramid HR [AD]

2004-08-05 Thread Susan Lynch
Steve,

I work for the company that developed and sells HR Pyramid in the Tech
Support department.  Please feel free to contact me for information on the
product!

Susan M. Lynch
F.W. Davison  Company, Inc.
(781) 340-9255

DON'T MISS THE 5TH ANNUAL HRPYRAMID USER CONFERENCE!
September 15-16, 2004 - Register now at
http://www.fwdco.com/services/uconf04/default.shtm

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE:
This e-mail message, and any accompanying documents, is for the sole use of
the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged
information.  Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure, distribution or
copying is prohibited.  If you are not the intended recipient, please
contact our office by email or by telephone at (508) 747-7261 and
immediately destroy all copies of the original message.

- Original Message -
From: Steve Kunzman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 9:06 AM
Subject: [U2] Pyramid HR


 Has anyone worked on a package called Pyramid HR?  It uses Unidata for its
 database. Any details would be appreciated.

 TIA

 Steve Kunzman
 Minneapolis, MN
 (612)750-3899 cellular
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RE: [U2] hello ?

2004-08-05 Thread Larry Hiscock
It would appear not 

-Original Message-
Subject: [U2] hello ?

am i off the list again ?
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Re: [U2] Pyramid HR

2004-08-05 Thread Dave S
We use HR Pyramid. It used to be called ScorPEO.

Steve Kunzman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Has anyone worked on a package called Pyramid 
HR? It uses Unidata for its
database. Any details would be appreciated.

TIA

Steve Kunzman
Minneapolis, MN
(612)750-3899 cellular
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Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish.
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Re: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors

2004-08-05 Thread Richard A. Wilson
no you dont need to change existing records, however I would suspect 
that some program is already writing to what you think are new locations.

Basically the dict items were never defined.
create an I-type
REC.LNG
001 I
002 COUNT(@RECORD,@AM) + (@RECORD NE )
etc
THEN
SORT file BY-DSND REC.LNG REC.LNG
to see the records with the maximum number of attributes.
this isnt 100% full proof since there may be some program out there that 
does write beyond the max # of attributes, however the logic in the 
program hasnt been triggered yet

Rich
Brutzman, Bill wrote:
At the bottom of a data dictionary having a few dozen D-Fields, I added a
few more D-Fields.
Inside a UniBasic application, end-users are able to read and write data to
these fields.
Sometimes though, when listing results, some flaky data shows up.
I am writing to inquire...is there now a requirement to normalize all
records such that there are blanks specified in the newly defined
fields...for all records ?
In other words, is it not ok to have a mix of records...some with 71
fields...others with 75 fields?
--Bill 
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--
Richard A. Wilson
Lakeside Systems
Smithfield, RI, USA
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Re: [U2] Pyramid HR

2004-08-05 Thread Don Verhagen
It's HRPyramind. We have use this since 1998 for our core inhouse
payroll about (200-600 employees) and we used it briefly for our PEO
business but we sold that division off.

I have nothing but praise for the software and the company and it's
well supported.

It's put out by a company FW Davison. Website: www.fwdco.com 

If you would like to discuss offline please email or call me directly
at the numbers in my signature.

Thanks,


--
Donald Verhagen  
Application Development Manager
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tandem Staffing Solutions, Inc.
1690 S Congress Avenue, Suite 210
Delray Beach, FL 33445  USA
Voice Phone: 561.454.3592 Fax Phone: 561.454.3640 

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 9:06:55 AM 08/05/2004 
Has anyone worked on a package called Pyramid HR?  It uses Unidata for
its
database. Any details would be appreciated.

TIA

Steve Kunzman
Minneapolis, MN
(612)750-3899 cellular
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[U2] UniVerse Basic Status command 5 Permission's

2004-08-05 Thread Paul Boroditsch
When doing a status on a file in a program, attribute 5 gives the
permission's in decimal format so 33277 in decimal returns 100775 in octal.
Why doesn't it just return the 775 value and or what is the significance of
the 100?

thanks
paul



Paul Boroditsch
Computer Sciences Corporation
[EMAIL PROTECTED]




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RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors

2004-08-05 Thread Mike Randall
The records can have varying numbers of fields.   From your comment about
flaky data, my guess would be that you are using fields that are being
written to someplace else other than what you added.   

Dictionaries have no impact on what Basic programs do.  Fields may be
written to a particular file and there doesn't have to be any dictionary
present or the dict says the fields hold something totally different.  The
dictionary is only used for reporting and selection functions.   As such,
looking at the dictionary is not a reliable or even valid way of determining
field usage.   

Mike 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brutzman, Bill
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 10:22 AM
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
Subject: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors

At the bottom of a data dictionary having a few dozen D-Fields, I added a
few more D-Fields.

Inside a UniBasic application, end-users are able to read and write data to
these fields.

Sometimes though, when listing results, some flaky data shows up.

I am writing to inquire...is there now a requirement to normalize all
records such that there are blanks specified in the newly defined
fields...for all records ?

In other words, is it not ok to have a mix of records...some with 71
fields...others with 75 fields?

--Bill 
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Re: [U2] UniVerse Basic Status command 5 Permission's

2004-08-05 Thread Glenn Herbert
Easy.  Check out your /usr/include/sys/stat.h file (usually in that 
location).  The information you return and convert to octal contains 
information other than permissions.   Within the stat.h file, are defined a 
number of S_IFxxx macros, one of which is S_IFREG.  The value of this is 
010 (octal #), so when you see 100775 what you should actually read 
that as is: This is a regular file whose permissions are 775.  If for 
instance your value was 120775, then you would have A link whose 
permissions are 775.  The value that universe returns in status5 is the 
raw value so you have to pick off the parts you want.

If you simply want the permissions (lowest 3 bits) from this value, use
PERMS = BITAND(status5, 511)
which will return you simply 775 (in your instance).  Using the #define 
values in stat.h you could create BITAND code to determine if you are 
looking at a link, a directory, a file, a character block device, etc.

Hope this helps!!
Glenn
At 12:30 PM 8/5/2004, you wrote:
When doing a status on a file in a program, attribute 5 gives the
permission's in decimal format so 33277 in decimal returns 100775 in octal.
Why doesn't it just return the 775 value and or what is the significance of
the 100?
thanks
paul

Paul Boroditsch
Computer Sciences Corporation
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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In the end, it all boils down to a big mess of 1's and 0's...  - unknown
Glenn M. Herbert - Development Engineer, DSEngine / Connectivity Group
[EMAIL PROTECTED], Westboro, Ma. 01581 (508) 599-7281
Ascential Software - Profit from Intelligent Information  
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RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors

2004-08-05 Thread Donald Kibbey
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 08/05/04 12:37PM 
 The disconnect of the dictionary from the actual data stored in a U2 file.   

Feature or Flaw??


Sharp knife.  Use wisely!


Don Kibbey
Financial Systems Manager
Finnegan, Henderson, Farabow, Garrett  Dunner LLP
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RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors

2004-08-05 Thread Glenn Herbert
Feature to me.  YOu can readily associate any dictionary with any data such 
that you can change your view:

LIST myFile USING DICT otherFile
At 12:37 PM 8/5/2004, you wrote:
There's food for a good debate.   The disconnect of the dictionary from the
actual data stored in a U2 file.   That seems to be one of the key
differences between our world and the SQL databases.
Feature or Flaw??
Mike
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kevin King
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 11:11 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors
In other words, is it not ok to have a mix of records...some with 71
fields...others with 75 fields?
Such a thing is not only perfectly acceptable, it's an immense benefit
to using U2 over other 'normal' dbs.
-Kevin
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.PrecisOnline.com
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RE: [U2] UniVerse Basic Status command 5 Permission's

2004-08-05 Thread Kevin King
Directory, or possibly sticky bit?  Just guessing here. 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Paul
Boroditsch
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 10:30 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [U2] UniVerse Basic Status command 5 Permission's

When doing a status on a file in a program, attribute 5 gives the
permission's in decimal format so 33277 in decimal returns 100775 in
octal.
Why doesn't it just return the 775 value and or what is the
significance of the 100?

thanks
paul



Paul Boroditsch
Computer Sciences Corporation
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


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RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors

2004-08-05 Thread Jeff Schasny
I think I'd call it more of a difference in philosophy than a feature or flaw.  A 
basic tenent of the SQLian religion is that any operation which affects the database 
is performed through a single interface, that being SQL.  Pickians on the other hand 
want to use anything that is efficient for a particular application to perform 
database operation so we've got your direct read/writes as well as SQL so we can 
pick/choose/combine at will. 


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

There's food for a good debate.   The disconnect of the dictionary from the
actual data stored in a U2 file.   That seems to be one of the key
differences between our world and the SQL databases.

Feature or Flaw??

Mike



Jeff Schasny | Denver, Colorado, USA | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [U2] hello ?

2004-08-05 Thread u2ug
so it seems - didn't receive anything for a few hours which seemed unusual.
i got delisted a few weeks back for some reason thought maybe it had
happened again


- Original Message - 
From: Larry Hiscock [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 12:10 pm
Subject: RE: [U2] hello ?


 It would appear not

 -Original Message-
 Subject: [U2] hello ?

 am i off the list again ?
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Re: [U2] -UNIBASIC - MULTIPLE SAVEDLIST

2004-08-05 Thread Glenn Herbert
Replace the first GETLIST ... SETTING with
EXECUTE GET.LIST name SETTING X.CTR RTNLIST MAINLIST CAPTURING JUNK
IF X.CTR THEN
and change its READNEXT to
READNEXT X.ID FROM MAINLIST THEN
You can leave the secondary GETLIST /READNEXT alone.
At 12:52 PM 8/5/2004, you wrote:
We are writing  unibasic programs to create extract files for pivotlink
and very new to unidata
environment.
 Is there anyway to have two or more active savedlist at any one time
keeping the readnext pointers in sync?
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[U2] [UV] record locking

2004-08-05 Thread Dianne Ackerman
I know that when a user locks a record, that user can still readu that 
record from within the same session.  Does anyone know if there is some 
kind of setting to change that?
Thanks
-Dianne
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RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors

2004-08-05 Thread Mike Randall
Double-edged sword IMO, I'm sure you've ran into that system you're
investigating and discover that there are no dictionaries or the mappings
are incorrect.

As I get more and more involved in the SQL databases, that reliable
definition of record layouts comes up as a key advantage.The U2/Pick
world's greatest strength is their flexibility.   The U2/Pick world's
greatest weakness is their flexibility.

I guess it all depends on who's at the controls...

Mike Randall

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Schasny
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 12:09 PM
To: U2 Group
Subject: RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors

I think I'd call it more of a difference in philosophy than a feature or
flaw.  A basic tenent of the SQLian religion is that any operation which
affects the database is performed through a single interface, that being
SQL.  Pickians on the other hand want to use anything that is efficient for
a particular application to perform database operation so we've got your
direct read/writes as well as SQL so we can pick/choose/combine at will. 
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RE: [U2] Univere Login Security

2004-08-05 Thread iggchamp
Ross,

I have a cable modem connection.  The IP address no longer looks like it will be an 
issue.  A buddy of mine here at work uses comcast for his provider and says that 
although it is a dynamic ip, it hasn't changed at his house for 16 months.  I was 
planning on using telnet but several people on the list have stated that the minimum 
they would use would be ssh.  Just in case you haven't already figured it out - I have 
very little experience with connectivity issues.  Is SSH just encrypted telnet?  Does 
it still use the telnet port?  Is there anything on the *nix box that needs to be 
setup?  Is there any cheap/free SSH software I can get to get started?

Thanks for your help,

Scott

-- Original message -- 

 How are you connecting ? 
 
 If via dialup/ras, you should be able to assign a fixed IP for the connection. 
 Ditto if you are using a VPN over the net. 
 
 If it IS dialup, you could always install a modem with dial back security that 
 calls to YOUR house (which may also cut down telecom costs :-) 
 
 Hopefully you are NOT using Telnet via the net, and have at least SSH 
 
 Ross Ferris 
 Stamina Software 
 Visage  an Evolution in Software Development 
 
 
 -Original Message- 
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-u2- 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Schasny 
 Sent: Thursday, 5 August 2004 3:01 AM 
 To: U2 Group 
 Subject: RE: [U2] Univere Login Security 
  
 Telnet to a machine with a static IP and then telnet to his machine 
  
 -Original Message- 
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  
 Hi all, 
 A buddy of mine wants me to be able to login to his computer on a routine 
 basis to give him a hand with some development. Currently, he has a 
 process that matches the ip address to the username and if it does not 
 match, the user gets booted. The problem that I have is that my ip address 
 is dynamic. Given the fact that this is a unix machine that I will be 
 logging into, I assume that I cannot use a mac address or anything like 
 that, Can someone out there give me a simple and effective solution for 
 this? 
  
  
 Thanks, 
  
 Scott 
  
  
 Jeff Schasny | Denver, Colorado, USA | [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
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RE: [U2] -UNIBASIC - MULTIPLE SAVEDLIST

2004-08-05 Thread Grant.Boice
Barbara,

Here are a couple things you can do...

First, in your GETLIST command, add the TO in your command.  For example,

 GETLIST SL.HRPER.PLINK TO 1 SETTING X.CTR THEN , where 1 is a list number.

Then, in the corresponding READNEXT statement, add FROM.  For example,

 READNEXT X.ID FROM 1 THEN

You might want UniBasic Command Reference manual for other neat tricks.  Also, see 
what I have done to enhance your code.

If you need additional help, you can contact me directly.

Good Luck!

Sincerely,

Grant W. Boice, Jr.
Systems Administrator
Benchmark Electronics, Inc.
Manassas Division
8500 Phoenix Drive
Manassas, VA  20110
 
Phone:  (703) 334-0156
Email:   [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Web:www.bench.com http://www.bench.com 

  MODIFIED CODE:   
** 

GETLIST SL.HRPER.PLINK SETTING TO 1 X.CTR THEN
  FOR ENTRY = 1 TO X.CTR
READNEXT X.ID FROM 1 THEN
READ r.hrper FROM f.hrper, X.ID THEN
  ..
  GOSUB GET.LAST.PAY.DATE
 NEXT ENTRY
 END ELSE
  ERR.MSG = No Records Selected from HRPER
  CRT ERR.MSG
  RETURN
 END

GET.LAST.PAY.DATE:
 EXECUTE SELECT PAYPRDS
 EXECUTE SAVE.LIST SL.PAYPRDS.PLINK

GETLIST SL.PAYPRDS SETTING TO 2 X.MAX.REC THEN
FOR X.CTR1 = 1 TO X.MAX.REC
   READNEXT X.PAYPRD.ID FROM 2THEN
 X.PAY.PERIOD.DATE = FIELD(X.PAYPRD.ID, *, 1,1)
IF X.PAY.PERIOD.DATE  X.OUT.LAST.PAY.DAY THEN
   X.OUT.LAST.PAY.DAY = X.PAY.PERIOD.DATE
END
 ...
 ...
 NEXT XCTR.1
  END ELSE
 ERR.MSG = No Records Selected from  PAYPRDS
CRT ERR.MSG
 RETURN



-Original Message-
From: Riffel-Darter, Barbara [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 12:53 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [U2] -UNIBASIC - MULTIPLE SAVEDLIST


We are writing  unibasic programs to create extract files for pivotlink
and very new to unidata
environment.

 Is there anyway to have two or more active savedlist at any one time
keeping the readnext pointers in sync?

We realize once you execute a second save.list the first one is gone. So
what technique would
we use to save off multiple selectlist. Would a Readlist do the trick?
What would be the most
efficient way to handle  this?

In the code below once we execute the second save.list and return to the
first paragraph we have lost SL.HRPER.PLINK our primary driver file.

GET.HR.INFO:
 EXECUTE SELECT HRPER
 EXECUTE SAVE.LIST SL.HRPER.PLINK

 GETLIST SL.HRPER.PLINK SETTING X.CTR THEN
  FOR ENTRY = 1 TO X.CTR
READNEXT X.ID THEN
READ r.hrper FROM f.hrper, X.ID THEN
  ..
  GOSUB GET.LAST.PAY.DATE
 NEXT ENTRY
 END ELSE
  ERR.MSG = No Records Selected from HRPER
  CRT ERR.MSG
  RETURN
 END

GET.LAST.PAY.DATE:
 EXECUTE SELECT PAYPRDS
 EXECUTE SAVE.LIST SL.PAYPRDS.PLINK

GETLIST SL.PAYPRDS SETTING X.MAX.REC THEN
FOR X.CTR1 = 1 TO X.MAX.REC
   READNEXT X.PAYPRD.ID THEN
 X.PAY.PERIOD.DATE = FIELD(X.PAYPRD.ID, *, 1,1)
IF X.PAY.PERIOD.DATE  X.OUT.LAST.PAY.DAY THEN
   X.OUT.LAST.PAY.DAY = X.PAY.PERIOD.DATE
END
 ...
 ...
 NEXT XCTR.1
  END ELSE
 ERR.MSG = No Records Selected from  PAYPRDS
CRT ERR.MSG
 RETURN

Thanks Barb
Barbara Riffel-Darter,Programmer/Analyst
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RE: [U2] -UNIBASIC - MULTIPLE SAVEDLIST

2004-08-05 Thread Kevin King
 Is there anyway to have two or more 
 active savedlist at any one time 
 keeping the readnext pointers in sync?

$BASICTYPE U (Unidata) will allow you to have multiple active
(numbered) saved lists.

READNEXT variable FROM listnumber { THEN | ELSE } ...

-Kevin
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.PrecisOnline.com
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RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors

2004-08-05 Thread Moderator
All,
 This sounds like a good conversation for the u2-community list.

- Charles Barouch, Moderator

-- Original Message -
Subject: RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors
Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 11:08:44 -0600 (GMT-06:00)
From: Jeff Schasny [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: U2 Group [EMAIL PROTECTED]


I think I'd call it more of a difference in philosophy than a feature or flaw.  A 
basic tenent of the SQLian religion is that any operation which affects the database 
is performed through a single interface, that being SQL.  Pickians on the other hand 
want to use anything that is efficient for a particular application to perform 
database operation so we've got your direct read/writes as well as SQL so we can 
pick/choose/combine at will. 

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RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors

2004-08-05 Thread Brutzman, Bill
From the responses, it appears that there is a bug in the UniBasic program
when end-users are entering transaction data.

Thanks to all those responding.

--Bill
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RE: [U2] -UNIBASIC - MULTIPLE SAVEDLIST

2004-08-05 Thread Grant.Boice
Thanks, Kevin!

I completely forgot about this!

Grant

-Original Message-
From: Kevin King [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 1:43 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [U2] -UNIBASIC - MULTIPLE SAVEDLIST


 Is there anyway to have two or more 
 active savedlist at any one time 
 keeping the readnext pointers in sync?

$BASICTYPE U (Unidata) will allow you to have multiple active
(numbered) saved lists.

READNEXT variable FROM listnumber { THEN | ELSE } ...

-Kevin
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.PrecisOnline.com
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RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors

2004-08-05 Thread Brutzman, Bill
What is the u2-community list ?

--Bill

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Moderator
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 2:11 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; U2 Group
Subject: RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors


All,
 This sounds like a good conversation for the u2-community list.

- Charles Barouch, Moderator

-- Original Message -
Subject: RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors
Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 11:08:44 -0600 (GMT-06:00)
From: Jeff Schasny [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: U2 Group [EMAIL PROTECTED]


I think I'd call it more of a difference in philosophy than a feature or
flaw.  A basic tenent of the SQLian religion is that any operation which
affects the database is performed through a single interface, that being
SQL.  Pickians on the other hand want to use anything that is efficient for
a particular application to perform database operation so we've got your
direct read/writes as well as SQL so we can pick/choose/combine at will. 

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[U2] [OT] Sarbanes-Oxley

2004-08-05 Thread Gordon Glorfield
I know this is not a technical issue but I think it is germane.

I was just wondering what lengths other departments/companies are doing to
satisfy the requirements imposed by the Sarbanes-Oxley act?  How much of an
impact is it on your operations?

Our department has gone Sarbanes-Oxley mad here.  What used to take 5
minutes worth of effort before now requires an additional 30 minutes of
paperwork to document the change.

Gordon J. Glorfield
Sr. Applications Developer
MAMSI (A UnitedHealth Company)
301-360-8839 


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RE: [U2] Univere Login Security

2004-08-05 Thread George Gallen
I have found when your MAC changes with comcast, your IP will change.
Depending on which computer I hook up to my cable modem, I will have
a different IP address, and of course when the router is hooked up,
it's different as well.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 1:38 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [U2] Univere Login Security


Ross,

I have a cable modem connection.  The IP address no longer
looks like it will be an issue.  A buddy of mine here at work
uses comcast for his provider and says that although it is a
dynamic ip, it hasn't changed at his house for 16 months.  I
was planning on using telnet but several people on the list
have stated that the minimum they would use would be ssh.
Just in case you haven't already figured it out - I have very
little experience with connectivity issues.  Is SSH just
encrypted telnet?  Does it still use the telnet port?  Is
there anything on the *nix box that needs to be setup?  Is
there any cheap/free SSH software I can get to get started?

Thanks for your help,

Scott

-- Original message --

 How are you connecting ?

 If via dialup/ras, you should be able to assign a fixed IP
for the connection.
 Ditto if you are using a VPN over the net.

 If it IS dialup, you could always install a modem with dial
back security that
 calls to YOUR house (which may also cut down telecom costs :-)

 Hopefully you are NOT using Telnet via the net, and have at
least SSH

 Ross Ferris
 Stamina Software
 Visage  an Evolution in Software Development


 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-u2-
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Schasny
 Sent: Thursday, 5 August 2004 3:01 AM
 To: U2 Group
 Subject: RE: [U2] Univere Login Security
 
 Telnet to a machine with a static IP and then telnet to his machine
 
 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
 Hi all,
 A buddy of mine wants me to be able to login to his
computer on a routine
 basis to give him a hand with some development. Currently, he has a
 process that matches the ip address to the username and if
it does not
 match, the user gets booted. The problem that I have is
that my ip address
 is dynamic. Given the fact that this is a unix machine that
I will be
 logging into, I assume that I cannot use a mac address or
anything like
 that, Can someone out there give me a simple and effective
solution for
 this?
 
 
 Thanks,
 
 Scott
 
 
 Jeff Schasny | Denver, Colorado, USA | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors

2004-08-05 Thread Richard A. Wilson
Bill, I dont think we was speaking of your original question (which was 
technical in nature). Its when responses shifted towards the sql/pick 
good/bad debate

Brutzman, Bill wrote:
What is the u2-community list ?
--Bill
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Moderator
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 2:11 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; U2 Group
Subject: RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors
All,
 This sounds like a good conversation for the u2-community list.
- Charles Barouch, Moderator
-- Original Message -
Subject: RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors
Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 11:08:44 -0600 (GMT-06:00)
From: Jeff Schasny [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: U2 Group [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I think I'd call it more of a difference in philosophy than a feature or
flaw.  A basic tenent of the SQLian religion is that any operation which
affects the database is performed through a single interface, that being
SQL.  Pickians on the other hand want to use anything that is efficient for
a particular application to perform database operation so we've got your
direct read/writes as well as SQL so we can pick/choose/combine at will. 

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--
Richard A. Wilson
Lakeside Systems
Smithfield, RI, USA
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Re: [U2] [OT] Sarbanes-Oxley

2004-08-05 Thread vance . alspach
Same here.  We have established a fairly extensive Change Control Tracking
system with approval tracking at every stage.

Change Request - Approval
Modification - Approval
Testing - Approval
Move to production - Approval
Final - Approval



Vance Alspach
J  L Industrial Supply



I was just wondering what lengths other departments/companies are doing to
satisfy the requirements imposed by the Sarbanes-Oxley act?  How much of an
impact is it on your operations?

Gordon J. Glorfield
Sr. Applications Developer
MAMSI (A UnitedHealth Company)
301-360-8839

[demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/gif which had a name of graycol.gif]
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RE: [U2] [OT] Sarbanes-Oxley

2004-08-05 Thread Jefferson, Jim
snip
Our department has gone Sarbanes-Oxley mad here.
/snip

Same thing where my wife works.  Not here as we're privately held.  We've discussed 
this at length between ourselves and determined the least-cost route is to buy back 
all your stock and go private grin.

Jim
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Re: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors

2004-08-05 Thread Jerry Banker
You subscribe to it just like you did to this list.
Email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
and insert the following:

subscribe u2-community

- Original Message - 
From: Brutzman, Bill [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 1:25 PM
Subject: RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors


What is the u2-community list ?

--Bill

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Moderator
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 2:11 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; U2 Group
Subject: RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors


All,
 This sounds like a good conversation for the u2-community list.

- Charles Barouch, Moderator

-- Original Message -
Subject: RE: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors
Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 11:08:44 -0600 (GMT-06:00)
From: Jeff Schasny [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: U2 Group [EMAIL PROTECTED]


I think I'd call it more of a difference in philosophy than a feature or
flaw.  A basic tenent of the SQLian religion is that any operation which
affects the database is performed through a single interface, that being
SQL.  Pickians on the other hand want to use anything that is efficient for
a particular application to perform database operation so we've got your
direct read/writes as well as SQL so we can pick/choose/combine at will. 

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Fw: [U2] Adding D-Descriptors

2004-08-05 Thread Jerry Banker
Sorry had a typo

Email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
and insert the following:

subscribe u2-community
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RE: [U2] [OT] Sarbanes-Oxley

2004-08-05 Thread Amy Cook
We're close to the same... 

Change Request via module-specific superuser.
Write up a proposal that includes description of problem, what the mod
will do to fix the problem, and any ongoing maintenance that will be
required as a result of the mod. Sign off from the requestor,
requestor's department manager, and IT manager.
Do the mod. Programmer signs off that it's finished.
IT manager delivers change to pilot, signs off.
Superuser tests in pilot, signs off.
IT manager delivers change to live, signs off.

Amazing that the process to get a mod in place sometimes takes lots
longer than the mod itselfweek or two ago, I just needed to change
the length of a field...uugghhh!

But that's the part where we've felt the most pain. Most of the other
points we had to meet were minor changes.  


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 12:24 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [U2] [OT] Sarbanes-Oxley

Same here.  We have established a fairly extensive Change Control
Tracking
system with approval tracking at every stage.

Change Request - Approval
Modification - Approval
Testing - Approval
Move to production - Approval
Final - Approval



Vance Alspach
J  L Industrial Supply



I was just wondering what lengths other departments/companies are doing
to
satisfy the requirements imposed by the Sarbanes-Oxley act?  How much of
an
impact is it on your operations?

Gordon J. Glorfield
Sr. Applications Developer
MAMSI (A UnitedHealth Company)
301-360-8839

[demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/gif which had a name
of graycol.gif]
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Re: [U2] Universe View

2004-08-05 Thread Ray Wurlod
UniVerse views (Type 41 files) can only be created in an account that is a UniVerse 
SQL schema.

 On Aug 1, 2004, at 6:53, David Ward wrote:
 
  Is it possible to create a sql type view in Universe, without creating 
  a
  schema? If so, could someone point me to the correct document for
  obtaining this information?
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RE: [U2] [OT] Sarbanes-Oxley

2004-08-05 Thread Kevin King
I just re-read Susan's excellent article, and it strikes me as odd
that the definition of world class (reducing overhead, et al.) seems
to run counter to the way folks are approaching SOA compliance.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Clifton
Oliver
Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 2:47 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [U2] [OT] Sarbanes-Oxley

You may want to check out the May-Jun 2004 issue of Spectrum Magazine.

Susan Joslyn has an article starting on page 29 about the
Sarbanes-Oxley Act. See

  http://www.intl-spectrum.com/mayjun04mag.html

for a free PDF download.

-- 

Regards,

Clif

~~~
W. Clifton Oliver, CCP
CLIFTON OLIVER  ASSOCIATES
Tel: +1 619 460 5678Web: www.oliver.com
~~~


On Aug 5, 2004, at 11:50, Gordon Glorfield wrote:

 BTW My apologies to our non-USA list members as this is only
pertinent 
 to US operations.  Sometimes I forget we are not all in the USA.

 Gordon J. Glorfield  --(Part time ugly American) Sr.
Applications 
 Developer MAMSI (A UnitedHealth Company)
 301-360-8839
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RE: [U2] [OT] Sarbanes-Oxley

2004-08-05 Thread Tony Gravagno
Gordon Glorfield wrote:
 BTW My apologies to our non-USA list members as this is only
 pertinent to US operations.  Sometimes I forget we are not all in the
 USA. 

Actually Gordon, while the legal responsibilities of compliance with USA
regulations only apply to USA companies, I can easily see initiatives for
SOA compliance driving non-USA companies that do business with USA public
companies.

I'm no expert on the matter, but it seems to me that change will be (or
should be) driven from the top-downward to ensure compliance, and that means
vendors, partners, and even some customers of these public companies may be
requested or mandated to make changes in IT and/or manual procedures.  So
all of you foreigners and grinning private companies out there better look
out.  ;)

I've seen a couple comments here that tell me that some people have a
different understanding of SOA than I do - I have no idea who's right.  I'm
under the impression that SOA doesn't just mean approvals need to be
recorded, but that much stricter auditing need to be done of any physical
process or policy which affect the bottom line.  That means creating lots of
cross-index files, periodic balancing of summary to detail, and some decent
drill-down/reporting into all of this data.  When someone asks where that
bottom line came from, it's management's neck on the line if they can't
click a few times to show the detail.  The terms data warehouse, cube, ETL,
and BI come to mind.  Which is what we/MV are very good at once we write the
code.

We'll see how far it goes when management types actually do their reading
and then get serious.  I don't think we (consulting community and IT staff)
have been asked by our clients/managers to make driving changes yet, simply
because there are lot of CxO types still ignoring SOA or still trying to
figure out how deep it really goes.  Perhaps the thing to do is to contact
the CxO's with whom you have influence and ask them if there is anything you
can or should be doing to help them get through this.

I hope our resident expert, Susan Joslyn, can provide some insight.

Tony
Nebula RD
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RE: [U2] Univere Login Security

2004-08-05 Thread Logan, David (SST - Adelaide)
Hi,

You should use ssh because it is encrypted during the
handshakes/authentication phase etc. ssh uses port 22. I use Putty as a
client as this works as a telnet/ssh or other type client and is free.

Download the latest version at
http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/putty/download.html

The machine you are connecting to will have to have an ssh daemon
running in order to connect. If it is a unix based system, there are a
few out there. Just hunt them down on Google, Windows is something I
prefer to have no idea about 8-)

Regards

David Logan
Database Administrator
HP Managed Services
139 Frome Street,
Adelaide 5000
Australia

+61 8 8408 4273 - Work
+61 417 268 665 - Mobile
+61 8 8408 4259 - Fax



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, 6 August 2004 3:08 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [U2] Univere Login Security


Ross,

I have a cable modem connection.  The IP address no longer looks like it
will be an issue.  A buddy of mine here at work uses comcast for his
provider and says that although it is a dynamic ip, it hasn't changed at
his house for 16 months.  I was planning on using telnet but several
people on the list have stated that the minimum they would use would be
ssh.  Just in case you haven't already figured it out - I have very
little experience with connectivity issues.  Is SSH just encrypted
telnet?  Does it still use the telnet port?  Is there anything on the
*nix box that needs to be setup?  Is there any cheap/free SSH software I
can get to get started?

Thanks for your help,

Scott

-- Original message -- 

 How are you connecting ? 
 
 If via dialup/ras, you should be able to assign a fixed IP for the
connection. 
 Ditto if you are using a VPN over the net. 
 
 If it IS dialup, you could always install a modem with dial back
security that 
 calls to YOUR house (which may also cut down telecom costs :-) 
 
 Hopefully you are NOT using Telnet via the net, and have at least SSH 
 
 Ross Ferris 
 Stamina Software 
 Visage  an Evolution in Software Development 
 
 
 -Original Message- 
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-u2- 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Schasny 
 Sent: Thursday, 5 August 2004 3:01 AM 
 To: U2 Group 
 Subject: RE: [U2] Univere Login Security 
  
 Telnet to a machine with a static IP and then telnet to his machine 
  
 -Original Message- 
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  
 Hi all, 
 A buddy of mine wants me to be able to login to his computer on a
routine 
 basis to give him a hand with some development. Currently, he has a 
 process that matches the ip address to the username and if it does
not 
 match, the user gets booted. The problem that I have is that my ip
address 
 is dynamic. Given the fact that this is a unix machine that I will be

 logging into, I assume that I cannot use a mac address or anything
like 
 that, Can someone out there give me a simple and effective solution
for 
 this? 
  
  
 Thanks, 
  
 Scott 
  
  
 Jeff Schasny | Denver, Colorado, USA | [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
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RE: [U2] Univere Login Security

2004-08-05 Thread Ross Ferris
Yes, there is setup (most likely) required on the Unix server.

No, SSH uses port 22, not 23 (Telnet)

In terms of software to use, assuming YOUR machine is windows based, your TE may 
already support SSH (I use AccuTerm, and it does) and/or, if you establish a VPN 
connection, traffic will be encrypted and you can still use telnet.

May help to get advice from someone local who can set up a secure connection 4U both

Ross Ferris
Stamina Software
Visage  an Evolution in Software Development

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-u2-
[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, 6 August 2004 3:38 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [U2] Univere Login Security

Ross,

I have a cable modem connection.  The IP address no longer looks like it
will be an issue.  A buddy of mine here at work uses comcast for his
provider and says that although it is a dynamic ip, it hasn't changed at
his house for 16 months.  I was planning on using telnet but several people
on the list have stated that the minimum they would use would be ssh.  Just
in case you haven't already figured it out - I have very little experience
with connectivity issues.  Is SSH just encrypted telnet?  Does it still use
the telnet port?  Is there anything on the *nix box that needs to be setup?
Is there any cheap/free SSH software I can get to get started?

Thanks for your help,

Scott

-- Original message --

 How are you connecting ?

 If via dialup/ras, you should be able to assign a fixed IP for the
connection.
 Ditto if you are using a VPN over the net.

 If it IS dialup, you could always install a modem with dial back security
that
 calls to YOUR house (which may also cut down telecom costs :-)

 Hopefully you are NOT using Telnet via the net, and have at least SSH

 Ross Ferris
 Stamina Software
 Visage  an Evolution in Software Development


 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-u2-
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Schasny
 Sent: Thursday, 5 August 2004 3:01 AM
 To: U2 Group
 Subject: RE: [U2] Univere Login Security
 
 Telnet to a machine with a static IP and then telnet to his machine
 
 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
 Hi all,
 A buddy of mine wants me to be able to login to his computer on a
routine
 basis to give him a hand with some development. Currently, he has a
 process that matches the ip address to the username and if it does not
 match, the user gets booted. The problem that I have is that my ip
address
 is dynamic. Given the fact that this is a unix machine that I will be
 logging into, I assume that I cannot use a mac address or anything like
 that, Can someone out there give me a simple and effective solution for
 this?
 
 
 Thanks,
 
 Scott
 
 
 Jeff Schasny | Denver, Colorado, USA | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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 To unsubscribe please visit http://listserver.u2ug.org/
 
 
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RE: Unclassified RE: [U2] UniObjects for .NET (UO.NET)

2004-08-05 Thread Anthony Corrente
Hello Michael,

I heard that connection pooling was mentioned in the TOI, but I believe that
it was mentioned that it was under consideration.

I don't know anymore than that.

Hope this helps,
Anthony.

 --- HENDERSON MICHAEL MR [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
 Sorry, Simon, but I fail to see the relevance of that MSDN article.
 
 Under
 ms-help://MS.MSDNQTR.2004JUL.1033/dnbda/html/daag.htm#daag_managingdata
 baseconnections in the July 04 MSDN DVD, there is a section that deals
 with connection pooling and says
 ADO.NET data providers provide transparent connection pooling, the
 exact mechanics of which vary for each provider. This section discusses
 connection pooling in relation to: 
   The SQL Server .NET Data Provider 
   The Oracle .NET Data Provider 
   The OLE DB .NET Data Provider 
   The ODBC .NET Data Provider 
 
 I was hoping that the UO.NET Developer's Guide would contain similar
 information in respect to UO.NET.
 
 
 The presentation at last year's IBM DB2 Data management conference
 included (at slide 21) this feature list
 UniObjects For .NET ...
 *  100% Managed Code, written in C#
 *  Connection pooling for UO.NET provides good scalability
 *  Modeled [sic] after UniObjects For Java with vast improvement
 *  Performance monitor for Connection Pooling
 *  Standard Logging/Tracing for better troubleshooting
 
 The UO.NET Developer's Guide addresses the first, third and fifth
 points, but does not seem to mention the second and fourth at all.
 
 Hope this clarifies my point.
 
 Mike
 
 
 
 
 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Simon Lewington
 Sent: Thursday, 5 August 2004 20:12
 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Subject: Re: Unclassified RE: [U2] UniObjects for .NET (UO.NET)
 
 HENDERSON MICHAEL MR [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in message
 news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 ..
 
  Great stuff, but reading it I'm a little disappointed that there is no
 
  mention of Connection Pooling.  One of the previously advertised 
  benefits of UO.NET was that it would include a connection pooling 
  mechanism.  Has this 'fallen off' or is it documented somewhere else?
 
 http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/en-us/cpref/html/frlrfSystemEnterprise
 ServicesServicedComponentClassTopic.asp
 
 Simon
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 If you are not the intended recipient you must not use, disclose, copy or 
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 If you have received this message in error, please Email or telephone
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RE: [U2] [OT] Sarbanes-Oxley

2004-08-05 Thread Susan Joslyn
Kevin's observation is sadly true. 

 

We don't have any managers or accountants in here do we? (you may want to
leave now grin)

 

See the thing is, we're letting the auditors drive this thing.  Don't get me
wrong, they have to, to a certain extent.  The Sarbanes-Oxley Act of 2002
(available in its entirety at Sarbanes-oxley.com) isn't really very specific
about HOW the numbers are verified.  Only, in a nutshell, that the CFO and
CEO sign off saying I KNOW that the numbers on our financial statement are
correct.  Now because they can go to jail if it turns out they aren't they
are in a bit of a panic. And they haven't a clue what to do about it.  But
they want to make sure that its CLEAR AND OBVIOUS that they've 'done
diligence'.  In step the auditors.  Now the auditors - for the most part,
let's be fair - don't know all that much about the inner workings of a large
company's IT department and the mechanics and shenanigans that put that
final number on the 10K.  So they come up with a lot of (sometimes
unnecessary) hoops for us to jump through. 

 

What can we do about it?  Well, first, we have to realize that we've got
this powerful, flexible environment which has nurtured a seat-of-the pants
attitude.   Not a bad thing, I mean we can produce amazing results on the
fly. We've learned to depend on ourselves that way.  But it might look a
little scary to an outsider contemplating jail time.  So we might have to
suck it up just a little and say okay, we're going to be slowed down a bit
by this.  

 

And then the next thing we do is realize that the slow-down should truly be
temporary.  While we work out procedures that work and get used to them its
going to slow us down.  But believe it or not over time the fire-fighting
will slow down and we'll get time back.  I promise.

 

Then - it would be a really powerful thing if we educated ourselves a bit
(see this months article in Spectrum on CobIT) and took the reins.  Make
sure some if this gi-hyoogic investment is going to give Us something WE
want.  If we come to management with a clear picture of how we can comply we
can set aside some of the hoops.

 

I have one colleague whose auditors are demanding a full table/chart of all
access to all files by all programs.  Hey that would be a cool thing to
have.  But trust me, its not required for SOX compliance.  Its just the
auditors trying to come up with ways that look nice and black-and-white
and legitimate and . compliant.  If somebody over there had proposed the -
realistic steps - that needed to be taken first, this would never have
happened.  If someone would do a little reading and then stand up and say
here's a plan the requirement in question would be scrapped in a
heartbeat.

 

This is what I do for a living. I'd love to help any of you. Either with my
tools and services (hey, it is my living) or with a little advice and
direction.  You can't FIGHT this stuff . but remember when you were taught
that if you capsized in a strong current not to swim against it but to angle
toward the shore and let the current take you there?  

 

What SOX really is?  A giant budget-boost for IT and a guaranteed
tech-onomic recovery.  And incidentally an opportunity for us to raise the
bar on our software quality.  Gosh, possibly even legitimize Multivalue once
and for all!

 

Ever the optimist,.

 

Susan Joslyn

PRC - Real software configuration management for U2/Multivalue

http://sjplus.com

 

 

 

Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 15:44:14 -0600

From: Kevin King [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Subject: RE: [U2] [OT] Sarbanes-Oxley

 

I just re-read Susan's excellent article, and it strikes me as odd

that the definition of world class (reducing overhead, et al.) seems

to run counter to the way folks are approaching SOA compliance.
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RE: [U2] [OT] SOA Acronym (was Sarbanes-Oxley)

2004-08-05 Thread Dawn M. Wolthuis
Susan referred to it as SOX too -- I like that better (has a Dr. Suess ring
to it) and I can go back to a single meaning for SOA.  Thanks.  --dawn

Dawn M. Wolthuis
Tincat Group, Inc.
www.tincat-group.com

Take and give some delight today.


 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-u2-
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 9:01 PM
 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Subject: RE: [U2] [OT] SOA Acronym (was Sarbanes-Oxley)
 
 'I read something that had the acronym SOA in it and I
 thought the writer seemed to have no understanding of a Service-oriented
 Architecture at all!'
 
 We refer to is as SOX and next week we are sending a group over  to the UK
 to train them on our 'new' approval and tracking systems.
 
 Vance Alspach
 J  L Industrial Supply
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RE: [U2] [OT] Sarbanes-Oxley

2004-08-05 Thread Bill H.
Susan:

 See the thing is, we're letting the auditors drive this thing.

Auditors don't drive this.  Auditing is basic procedures plus statistical
sampling of transactions to validate these basic procedures.

Politics drive this.  As Thomas Sowell often notes: politics does what feels
good at the moment and mostly has _NO_ connection to results.

 Don't get me wrong, they have to, to a certain extent.
 The Sarbanes-Oxley Act of 2002 (available in its entirety at
 Sarbanes-oxley.com) isn't really very specific
 about HOW the numbers are verified.  Only, in a nutshell,
 that the CFO and CEO sign off saying I KNOW that the numbers
 on our financial statement are correct.  Now because they
 can go to jail if it turns out they aren't they are in a
 bit of a panic. And they haven't a clue what to do about it.

It has always surprised me that corporate management could delegate their
authority over corporate financial reporting to outside auditors.  But
then Congress does it every day.  Heck, they don't even know how much they
spend and what they spend it on.  :-)

 But they want to make sure that its CLEAR AND OBVIOUS that
 they've 'done diligence'.  In step the auditors.  Now the
 auditors - for the most part, let's be fair - don't know all
 that much about the inner workings of a large
 company's IT department and the mechanics and shenanigans
 that put that final number on the 10K.  So they come up with
 a lot of (sometimes unnecessary) hoops for us to jump through.

I'd suggest there are other forces at work here.  For instance, if IT knows
so little about business reporting, just as Finance knows so little about
IT, is it any wonder what gets reported can be suspect?

My point is there are more powerful arguments for structural ineffectiveness
rather than some surreptitious human behavior.  Besides, one controls human
behavior by instituting institutional structural controls.  :-)

 What can we do about it?  Well, first, we have to realize
 that we've got this powerful, flexible environment which has
 nurtured a seat-of-the pants attitude.   Not a bad thing,
 I mean we can produce amazing results on the fly. We've
 learned to depend on ourselves that way.  But it might look
 a little scary to an outsider contemplating jail time.  So
 we might have to suck it up just a little and say okay,
 we're going to be slowed down a bit by this.

Perhape a realization that strict financial controls shouldn't be ignored
because: a) noone knows how, b) IT controls the systems and doesn't
understand the problem, or c) Finance understands the problem and can't
control the systems.

 And then the next thing we do is realize that the slow-down
 should truly be temporary.  While we work out procedures
 that work and get used to them its going to slow us down.
 But believe it or not over time the fire-fighting will
 slow down and we'll get time back.  I promise.

I suspect this is good for those companies who don't do this now.  For those
that implement proper controls there shouldn't be much change, except when
the lawyers get involved.

 Then - it would be a really powerful thing if we educated
 ourselves a bit (see this months article in Spectrum on
 CobIT) and took the reins.  Make sure some if this gi-hyoogic
 investment is going to give Us something WE want.  If we
 come to management with a clear picture of how we can comply
 we can set aside some of the hoops.

Kind of like the blind leading the blind.  :-)

 I have one colleague whose auditors are demanding a full
 table/chart of all access to all files by all programs.
 Hey that would be a cool thing to have.  But trust me,
 its not required for SOX compliance.  Its just the
 auditors trying to come up with ways that look nice and
 black-and-white and legitimate and compliant.  If
 somebody over there had proposed the - realistic steps -
 that needed to be taken first, this would never have
 happened.  If someone would do a little reading and then
 stand up and say here's a plan the requirement in
 question would be scrapped in a heartbeat.

The management, who are putting their necks on the line, so to speak, should
be able to do what they think is necessary.  The real difficulty is
management are being hired who don't know how to judge the quality their
business operations and activities.  This is a primary cause of what you are
seeing.  The consequences of this are far reaching, economincally speaking
of course.

[snipped]

 What SOX really is?  A giant budget-boost for IT and a
 guaranteed tech-onomic recovery.  And incidentally an
 opportunity for us to raise the bar on our software
 quality.  Gosh, possibly even legitimize Multivalue once
 and for all!

 Ever the optimist,.

As Bill and Ted always saidexcellent!  :-)

Bill
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RE: [U2] [OT] Sarbanes-Oxley

2004-08-05 Thread Tony Gravagno
My friend, we rarely disagree, even on these points.  I've made no such
assumptions about rationality, actual vs intended effects, nor the
competence of those sponsoring laws.  I only stated the possible effect the
new laws will have on people worldwide.  Are you responding to someone
else's comments??  If my intent wasn't clear, please let me know.  Nothing
worse than being admonished for thinking something that never occurred to
you.  :)

Tony

Bill H. wrote:

 Tony:
 You make large assumptions:
 1) Congressional lawmaking is rational
 2) Laws passed don't have the opposite effect from intended
 3) Those sponsoring laws have a clue what they're doing.
 When it comes to Congress, the less they do the better.  :-)

Tony Gravagno wrote nothing of the sort:
[snip - go check]
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