Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems Administratorposition - Bayesian Filter detected spam
Just drop support and hire an ex-Eclipse employee to do the programming. Quicken and Activant reduced development and support staff so there are people out there. And you say they are a client ... do you program for them? Email me off-line for more info Garry L. Smith Dir Info Systems Charles McMurray Company V# 559-292-5782 F# 559-346-6169 -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of David Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2011 11:03 AM To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: Re: [U2]Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems Administratorposition - Bayesian Filter detected spam Hey Guys, Have a client who has been on Eclipse since 2000. They are sick to death with the nickle and dime (read eye gouge) tactics by Activant and want out. Do you think Open Bravo or any of the other Open source ERP products could replace it. Obviously with a lot of customization. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems Administratorposition
Also ask whether your client owns the source code. If not, things get trickier when dealing with Activant/Epicor. Fortunately, we did own our own source code, so there wasn't much they could do, when we decided to move away from them. On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 2:20 PM, John Thompson wrote: > They would probably do QM or some other flavor too, but, for an extra fee. > It all depends on, if its been done before, etc. etc., and how much new > engineering has to be done. > > > On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 2:18 PM, John Thompson wrote: > >> You might want to check these guys out. >> >> Not sure if they deal with Eclipse (or if I understand what Eclipse really >> is- too many buzzwords to keep up with), but, they have done plenty of >> Ultimate Plus to Universe/Unidata conversions and moved people away from >> Activant, while keeping the old PICK/MV apps in place. >> >> http://www.s7.com/s7migrationservices.html >> >> A gentleman by the name of Bruce Decker helped us out a great deal. >> >> If that is not relevant, forgive my ignorance on the understanding of what >> Eclipse is. I was just assuming that it was some type of MV system, or you >> would not have posted here... >> >> >> On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 2:03 PM, David wrote: >> >>> Hey Guys, >>> Have a client who has been on Eclipse since 2000. They are sick to death >>> with >>> the nickle and dime (read eye gouge) tactics by Activant and want out. >>> >>> Do you think Open Bravo or any of the other Open source ERP products >>> could >>> replace it. Obviously with a lot of customization. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ___ >>> U2-Users mailing list >>> U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org >>> http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> John Thompson >> > > > > -- > John Thompson > -- John Thompson ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems Administratorposition
They would probably do QM or some other flavor too, but, for an extra fee. It all depends on, if its been done before, etc. etc., and how much new engineering has to be done. On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 2:18 PM, John Thompson wrote: > You might want to check these guys out. > > Not sure if they deal with Eclipse (or if I understand what Eclipse really > is- too many buzzwords to keep up with), but, they have done plenty of > Ultimate Plus to Universe/Unidata conversions and moved people away from > Activant, while keeping the old PICK/MV apps in place. > > http://www.s7.com/s7migrationservices.html > > A gentleman by the name of Bruce Decker helped us out a great deal. > > If that is not relevant, forgive my ignorance on the understanding of what > Eclipse is. I was just assuming that it was some type of MV system, or you > would not have posted here... > > > On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 2:03 PM, David wrote: > >> Hey Guys, >> Have a client who has been on Eclipse since 2000. They are sick to death >> with >> the nickle and dime (read eye gouge) tactics by Activant and want out. >> >> Do you think Open Bravo or any of the other Open source ERP products could >> replace it. Obviously with a lot of customization. >> >> >> >> >> ___ >> U2-Users mailing list >> U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org >> http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users >> > > > > -- > John Thompson > -- John Thompson ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems Administratorposition
You might want to check these guys out. Not sure if they deal with Eclipse (or if I understand what Eclipse really is- too many buzzwords to keep up with), but, they have done plenty of Ultimate Plus to Universe/Unidata conversions and moved people away from Activant, while keeping the old PICK/MV apps in place. http://www.s7.com/s7migrationservices.html A gentleman by the name of Bruce Decker helped us out a great deal. If that is not relevant, forgive my ignorance on the understanding of what Eclipse is. I was just assuming that it was some type of MV system, or you would not have posted here... On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 2:03 PM, David wrote: > Hey Guys, > Have a client who has been on Eclipse since 2000. They are sick to death > with > the nickle and dime (read eye gouge) tactics by Activant and want out. > > Do you think Open Bravo or any of the other Open source ERP products could > replace it. Obviously with a lot of customization. > > > > > ___ > U2-Users mailing list > U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org > http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users > -- John Thompson ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems Administratorposition
Hey Guys, Have a client who has been on Eclipse since 2000. They are sick to death with the nickle and dime (read eye gouge) tactics by Activant and want out. Do you think Open Bravo or any of the other Open source ERP products could replace it. Obviously with a lot of customization. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems Administratorposition
John: Don't let weisenheimers scare you away. Most of us appreciate thoughtful contributions; of which, yours was one. :-) Bill - Original Message - *From:* jcar...@impactbuscon.com *To:* 'U2 Users List' *Date:* 4/6/2011 1:07 PM *Subject:* Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re:PICKSystems Administratorposition I'm no shill for Epicor, they usually regard me as competition for their consulting and project management services. I just thought that I would contribute about a topic that I was pretty familiar with. I thought that was part of value of this forum. Pardon me for interrupting. -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Mecki Foerthmann Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2011 1:01 PM To: U2 Users List Subject: Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems Administratorposition You forgot the [AD] in the subject line g. Sound like an Epicor sales pitch to me. On 06/04/2011 19:34, John Carter wrote: I don't usually contribute much to this forum - but I appreciate the chance to stay connected via the great posts here. In this case however, I do have some specific experience relative to this thread that might be beneficial to some. I've worked as a user, Epicor project manager/consultant, and independent ERP consultant since 1985 on several Dataworks/Interactive/Platinum/Epicor products including: DataFlo, Infoflo, and Avante (I've worked with Avante from the original release to the current version), and now Epicor 9. Relative to the Progress/SQL conversations: Epicor 9 can run on SQL or Progress, but our benchmark testing indicated much slower performance on a very beefy SQL machine. Processes, forms and reports were timed at 1/2 to 1/4 the speed that they run on an average Progress server. Additionally, Epicor wasted much of my customer's time claiming that the transition would be simple (it wasn't), and that SQL would be faster, or equal to Progress (it definitely wasn't). We gave up and stayed on Progress - but use SQL for our Replication Server. Regarding functionality - in my opinion Avante and DataFlo can still run circles around Epicor 9 in many applications - the E9 design and functionality is not as deep or well developed yet. However, it is getting most of Epicor's development resources and attention these days and is getting better quickly. I wouldn't advise most of my customers to make the leap yet (but maybe in a couple of years) from Avante/DataFlo to E9, but it was a natural evolution for my customer that was previously using Vista 8. In my opinion, the central benefit to E9 over Avante though is the ability to modify the functionality of the software without modifying the source code. They do this via Business Process Methods (BPM's) and Personalizations. Screen layout and fields are also very easy to modify. Extracting and presenting data is very straightforward and interfaces to MS products pretty seamlessly, in most cases users can perform extracts to Excel out of the box - no IT interface required. Sophisticated reports can be quickly and easily developed using E9's Business Activity Queries (BAQ's) and Dashboards. Both of which can be learned and used by anyone that could in the past use MS Access or some of Excel's advanced functions. This limits IT involvement to only very complex report solutions (which can also be done using BAQ's and Dashboards, but may take a little more time to develop). The most obvious advantage comparing Epicor 9 to Avante for the customers that I have worked with is that making changes to process functionality using Business Process Methods (BPM's) does not inhibit the company from taking EVERY patch or upgrade that is offered. NO KNITTING. The BPM's, BAQ's and Dashboards (custom reports) are easily moved from the previously installed version to the next. So, every time a new release comes out, IT does a quick 1-2 set-up and test, training is developed and implemented for new product functionality associated with the new release (usually less than one week), critical users exercise and test the new version in the Pilot account, then the upgrade/patch is rolled out. We can take advantage of new functionality and bug fixes almost immediately (usually within 2-5 business days of roll-out) without worrying about which modifications might be stepped on or deleted. Sometimes the Epicor 9 experience can be very frustrating, but we believe that Epicor is going in the right direction and within a couple of years E9 will probably match Avante and DataFlo in functionality. In spite of some of the pain associated with being part of the rollout of a new(ish) product, the IT departments at my customers are GLAD that they are on Epi
Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems Administratorposition
So am I. ;-) Spoiling Epicor's easy profit making scheme that is. Before I started my current job the company I work for was spending tens if not hundreds of thousands of Pounds on Epicor consulting and project management services every year. Now Epicor don't get a penny and even lost the revenue from UD support! They were stupid enough to tell management they would stop development of Avante after release 9.5 trying to sell them on Vantage. The result being that the company is now switching to an Oracle based ERP system from another vendor because Vantage didn't cut to the chase then and as you admitted yourself neither does E9. The main division is still running on Avante 9.2, though! Who needs Epicor R&D or consultants costing £1000 a day if one decent in house MV developer can modify a SB+ based package quickly and at low cost to whatever the company needs? BTW I use IBM Cognos for dashboards, KPIs and reporting these days. Not just with data from Avante but also from Oracle and SQL Server. Exporting data to Excel is child's play with SB+ too and even the guys on the shop floor are doing it without the help from IT. And the best thing is it's not relational but U2! On 06/04/2011 21:07, John Carter wrote: > I'm no shill for Epicor, they usually regard me as competition for their > consulting and project management services. > > I just thought that I would contribute about a topic that I was pretty > familiar with. I thought that was part of value of this forum. > > Pardon me for interrupting. > > > -Original Message- > From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org > [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Mecki Foerthmann > Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2011 1:01 PM > To: U2 Users List > Subject: Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems Administratorposition > > You forgot the [AD] in the subject line g. > Sound like an Epicor sales pitch to me. > > > On 06/04/2011 19:34, John Carter wrote: >> I don't usually contribute much to this forum - but I appreciate the chance >> to stay connected via the great posts here. In this case however, I do have >> some specific experience relative to this thread that might be beneficial to >> some. >> >> I've worked as a user, Epicor project manager/consultant, and independent >> ERP consultant since 1985 on several Dataworks/Interactive/Platinum/Epicor >> products including: DataFlo, Infoflo, and Avante (I've worked with Avante >> from the original release to the current version), and now Epicor 9. >> >> Relative to the Progress/SQL conversations: Epicor 9 can run on SQL or >> Progress, but our benchmark testing indicated much slower performance on a >> very beefy SQL machine. Processes, forms and reports were timed at 1/2 to >> 1/4 the speed that they run on an average Progress server. Additionally, >> Epicor wasted much of my customer's time claiming that the transition would >> be simple (it wasn't), and that SQL would be faster, or equal to Progress >> (it definitely wasn't). We gave up and stayed on Progress - but use SQL for >> our Replication Server. >> >> Regarding functionality - in my opinion Avante and DataFlo can still run >> circles around Epicor 9 in many applications - the E9 design and >> functionality is not as deep or well developed yet. However, it is getting >> most of Epicor's development resources and attention these days and is >> getting better quickly. I wouldn't advise most of my customers to make the >> leap yet (but maybe in a couple of years) from Avante/DataFlo to E9, but it >> was a natural evolution for my customer that was previously using Vista 8. >> >> In my opinion, the central benefit to E9 over Avante though is the ability >> to modify the functionality of the software without modifying the source >> code. They do this via Business Process Methods (BPM's) and >> Personalizations. Screen layout and fields are also very easy to modify. >> Extracting and presenting data is very straightforward and interfaces to MS >> products pretty seamlessly, in most cases users can perform extracts to >> Excel out of the box - no IT interface required. Sophisticated reports can >> be quickly and easily developed using E9's Business Activity Queries (BAQ's) >> and Dashboards. Both of which can be learned and used by anyone that could >> in the past use MS Access or some of Excel's advanced functions. This limits >> IT involvement to only very complex report solutions (which can also be done >> using BAQ's and Dashboards, but may take a little more time to develop). >> >> The mo
Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems Administratorposition
Your contribution is welcome and valued! Brenda L Price UniVerse Lead Programmer Rapid Response Team Market America, Inc. Greensboro, NC U2 User Group Board Member - u2ug.org > -Original Message- > From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users- > boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of John Carter > Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2011 4:08 PM > To: 'U2 Users List' > Subject: Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems > Administratorposition > > I'm no shill for Epicor, they usually regard me as competition for > their consulting and project management services. > > I just thought that I would contribute about a topic that I was pretty > familiar with. I thought that was part of value of this forum. > > Pardon me for interrupting. > > > -Original Message- > From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users- > boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Mecki Foerthmann > Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2011 1:01 PM > To: U2 Users List > Subject: Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems > Administratorposition > > You forgot the [AD] in the subject line g. > Sound like an Epicor sales pitch to me. > > > On 06/04/2011 19:34, John Carter wrote: > > I don't usually contribute much to this forum - but I appreciate the > chance to stay connected via the great posts here. In this case however, > I do have some specific experience relative to this thread that might > be beneficial to some. > > > > I've worked as a user, Epicor project manager/consultant, and > independent ERP consultant since 1985 on several > Dataworks/Interactive/Platinum/Epicor products including: DataFlo, > Infoflo, and Avante (I've worked with Avante from the original release > to the current version), and now Epicor 9. > > > > Relative to the Progress/SQL conversations: Epicor 9 can run on SQL > or Progress, but our benchmark testing indicated much slower > performance on a very beefy SQL machine. Processes, forms and reports > were timed at 1/2 to 1/4 the speed that they run on an average Progress > server. Additionally, Epicor wasted much of my customer's time claiming > that the transition would be simple (it wasn't), and that SQL would be > faster, or equal to Progress (it definitely wasn't). We gave up and > stayed on Progress - but use SQL for our Replication Server. > > > > Regarding functionality - in my opinion Avante and DataFlo can still > run circles around Epicor 9 in many applications - the E9 design and > functionality is not as deep or well developed yet. However, it is > getting most of Epicor's development resources and attention these days > and is getting better quickly. I wouldn't advise most of my customers > to make the leap yet (but maybe in a couple of years) from > Avante/DataFlo to E9, but it was a natural evolution for my customer > that was previously using Vista 8. > > > > In my opinion, the central benefit to E9 over Avante though is the > ability to modify the functionality of the software without modifying > the source code. They do this via Business Process Methods (BPM's) and > Personalizations. Screen layout and fields are also very easy to modify. > Extracting and presenting data is very straightforward and interfaces > to MS products pretty seamlessly, in most cases users can perform > extracts to Excel out of the box - no IT interface required. > Sophisticated reports can be quickly and easily developed using E9's > Business Activity Queries (BAQ's) and Dashboards. Both of which can be > learned and used by anyone that could in the past use MS Access or some > of Excel's advanced functions. This limits IT involvement to only very > complex report solutions (which can also be done using BAQ's and > Dashboards, but may take a little more time to develop). > > > > The most obvious advantage comparing Epicor 9 to Avante for the > customers that I have worked with is that making changes to process > functionality using Business Process Methods (BPM's) does not inhibit > the company from taking EVERY patch or upgrade that is offered. NO > KNITTING. The BPM's, BAQ's and Dashboards (custom reports) are easily > moved from the previously installed version to the next. So, every time > a new release comes out, IT does a quick 1-2 set-up and test, training > is developed and implemented for new product functionality associated > with the new release (usually less than one week), critical users > exercise and test the new version in the Pilot account, then the > upgrade/patch is rolled out. We can take advantage of new functionality > and bug fixes almost immediately (usually withi
Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems Administratorposition
I'm no shill for Epicor, they usually regard me as competition for their consulting and project management services. I just thought that I would contribute about a topic that I was pretty familiar with. I thought that was part of value of this forum. Pardon me for interrupting. -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Mecki Foerthmann Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2011 1:01 PM To: U2 Users List Subject: Re: [U2] Epicor and Eclipse Was Re: PICKSystems Administratorposition You forgot the [AD] in the subject line g. Sound like an Epicor sales pitch to me. On 06/04/2011 19:34, John Carter wrote: > I don't usually contribute much to this forum - but I appreciate the chance > to stay connected via the great posts here. In this case however, I do have > some specific experience relative to this thread that might be beneficial to > some. > > I've worked as a user, Epicor project manager/consultant, and independent ERP > consultant since 1985 on several Dataworks/Interactive/Platinum/Epicor > products including: DataFlo, Infoflo, and Avante (I've worked with Avante > from the original release to the current version), and now Epicor 9. > > Relative to the Progress/SQL conversations: Epicor 9 can run on SQL or > Progress, but our benchmark testing indicated much slower performance on a > very beefy SQL machine. Processes, forms and reports were timed at 1/2 to 1/4 > the speed that they run on an average Progress server. Additionally, Epicor > wasted much of my customer's time claiming that the transition would be > simple (it wasn't), and that SQL would be faster, or equal to Progress (it > definitely wasn't). We gave up and stayed on Progress - but use SQL for our > Replication Server. > > Regarding functionality - in my opinion Avante and DataFlo can still run > circles around Epicor 9 in many applications - the E9 design and > functionality is not as deep or well developed yet. However, it is getting > most of Epicor's development resources and attention these days and is > getting better quickly. I wouldn't advise most of my customers to make the > leap yet (but maybe in a couple of years) from Avante/DataFlo to E9, but it > was a natural evolution for my customer that was previously using Vista 8. > > In my opinion, the central benefit to E9 over Avante though is the ability to > modify the functionality of the software without modifying the source code. > They do this via Business Process Methods (BPM's) and Personalizations. > Screen layout and fields are also very easy to modify. Extracting and > presenting data is very straightforward and interfaces to MS products pretty > seamlessly, in most cases users can perform extracts to Excel out of the box > - no IT interface required. Sophisticated reports can be quickly and easily > developed using E9's Business Activity Queries (BAQ's) and Dashboards. Both > of which can be learned and used by anyone that could in the past use MS > Access or some of Excel's advanced functions. This limits IT involvement to > only very complex report solutions (which can also be done using BAQ's and > Dashboards, but may take a little more time to develop). > > The most obvious advantage comparing Epicor 9 to Avante for the customers > that I have worked with is that making changes to process functionality using > Business Process Methods (BPM's) does not inhibit the company from taking > EVERY patch or upgrade that is offered. NO KNITTING. The BPM's, BAQ's and > Dashboards (custom reports) are easily moved from the previously installed > version to the next. So, every time a new release comes out, IT does a quick > 1-2 set-up and test, training is developed and implemented for new product > functionality associated with the new release (usually less than one week), > critical users exercise and test the new version in the Pilot account, then > the upgrade/patch is rolled out. We can take advantage of new functionality > and bug fixes almost immediately (usually within 2-5 business days of > roll-out) without worrying about which modifications might be stepped on or > deleted. > > Sometimes the Epicor 9 experience can be very frustrating, but we believe > that Epicor is going in the right direction and within a couple of years E9 > will probably match Avante and DataFlo in functionality. > > In spite of some of the pain associated with being part of the rollout of a > new(ish) product, the IT departments at my customers are GLAD that they are > on Epicor 9. > > John H Carter III > Impact Business Consulting Corporation > Cell (760) 497-5545 > "Unlock
