Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
there will always be people who immediately oppose any change. this sort of criticism is essential to make a superior final product. i would definitely say that this is a good direction. i am not a fan of the color scheme currently used - i think the colors are too dull for a theme which demands sharper colors. and it is true that it does look too dark for mainstream. but i am guessing that can be changed easily. I love the window decoration and the right amount of roundedness (for me). On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 9:37 AM, Salane Ashcraft [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey Everyone... What's up with this? http://digg.com/linux_unix/Ubuntu_8_10_Intrepid_Ibex_Alpha_1_Screenshots See the complaints? We cannot let this happen. This theme is even worse then the default of Hardy Salane [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- d-_-b -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
Have you actually used the theme? Your initial disgust at the colour scheme may subside if you actually used it and saw it in action, I know I love the theme. If the colour scheme isn't for you there will doubtless be many rehashes of this theme in lighter colour schemes. There is alot more to a theme than the colour scheme, People are always insisting that OSX is gorgeous, well I personally think the grey is too dark, the blue highlights are just garish and the close ,minimize, and maximize buttons in the window border are tacky and not as functional as the standard _ [] X. To me this is the best looking theme I have ever seen a linux distribution ship with and the digg naysayers are probably not ubuntu users anyway. In summary if you havent at least tried the theme out you should not even be posting your opinion on the mailing list. Add this to your sources.list and upgrade your packages. deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/kwwii/ubuntu hardy main Mick 2008/6/30 Bharat Varma [EMAIL PROTECTED]: there will always be people who immediately oppose any change. this sort of criticism is essential to make a superior final product. i would definitely say that this is a good direction. i am not a fan of the color scheme currently used - i think the colors are too dull for a theme which demands sharper colors. and it is true that it does look too dark for mainstream. but i am guessing that can be changed easily. I love the window decoration and the right amount of roundedness (for me). On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 9:37 AM, Salane Ashcraft [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey Everyone... What's up with this? http://digg.com/linux_unix/Ubuntu_8_10_Intrepid_Ibex_Alpha_1_Screenshots See the complaints? We cannot let this happen. This theme is even worse then the default of Hardy Salane [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- d-_-b -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
Hi I would like to suggest that a new screensaver is included in Ubuntu. Check it out here: http://thelinuxmovement.blogspot.com/2007/08/cool-ubuntu-screen-saver.html //MadsRH BNBDzszBBNNN NNzhBNN Nz(=szzs+DBN B+=zs=BN NNNBBhzzhDBBh+zsz=BN Bz~~~--~~-h+szzsBN NNN=~-~~((~~D=sszsshzsBN NBNs-~(~sz=zszzzshBN NNND~NB~~(((Ds=szzssBNN NND~--zBz~((~DhsszhBNNN ND~~(~(BB~((~(sDDDzsNNN B~-(~(-sNh-~(((~~(~~sNN ~~~BN~~(((hN NNNz-(~~~(~-=NB=zDBBBDz(~((B NNB~~(~(~BNBz~(z NNs-~((~=BNNND~BNNN NN(~((~+NND~hNNN ND-BNNNz=NNN Bz=shB-(~zN+BNN NNNB+D~(BNz(=((DNN NNB((s(((~+D~+NNB(s=(zNN NNzDzNNNs(~=~~=(zNN NB==(=(zsDNNNNNN NN=((=(zs~(((BBB NNs(s=(z+DNNNz=zzDNN NND~===z~sNNB==zzsss=hNN NNNz+(==~+z((+NNh+szshNN NNNBhz==zh(~(~BBs+sssBNN NNBBND-(((=BNNND+ssszzzssBNN NB(sNNBs+szzhNNN NNs~zBs+szssBNNN NNB((BNBh=+sszszzzszBNNN NNNs-(~(~~(~=BBzhBBNBBhssszss=B ~(~~~((DBs+++===++=ssszz=zB B~-(~~~zNB+zzzhs===s=zBN Nh~~(~(BB=+sszszzhzzsBNN NNh~-~hBD+zss=hDs=shBNNN NNND~+BB=szsszzz=D=~sNNN BBNh=zzzszzszz~((~~~-hNN NNNz=sszszh=h(~((~~~-NN Dsszh(((~~BN NBBDhhhBD~BN B(((~BN Nz~(~zNN NB=-sNNN NNNzs==h -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
..on or around Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 12:14:41PM +0530 Bharat Varma wrote: there will always be people who immediately oppose any change. this sort of criticism is essential to make a superior final product. i would definitely say that this is a good direction. i am not a fan of the color scheme currently used - i think the colors are too dull for a theme which demands sharper colors. and it is true that it does look too dark for mainstream. but i am guessing that can be changed easily. it's not a case of it being too dark, so much as it evidencing far too much washed-out-flat-grey. frankly, i agree with those responses, it's pretty horrible alright: http://phorolinux.com/images/u810a1/ubuntu810-nautilus.jpg i believe dark colours in a theme /can/ work very well but to do this requires some actual talent and care in making it work. dark colours can themselves be a highlight. alternatively they can be deployed to leverage other colours into having more presence in the canvas (as you suggest). the above example does the opposite of either. to start with, the impact that dark-backgrounds have on existing icons, text and dialogs needs to be given some actual consideration. in the above case you can see they've spent almost no time refactoring to these ends, merely inverting the text-colour. the result is a theme that actively works against vibrancy. can you imagine using this theme on a low-contrast display? for instance, why does 'dark' imply 'dark grey'? it appears there's a little brown in the grey they've chosen but barely enough to unify it with the other predominant colour in the desktop. if we must go with brown (by way of law) then why not swing toward a dark brown rather than the mix of white and black? I love the window decoration and the right amount of roundedness (for me). that's about the only good to come out of that theme so far. the rest is pretty devoid of inspiration and thought. i really do think Mark needs to consult someone with provable understanding in colour-theory and design to ensure the next release actually looks good. it would seem no-one that can actually make a theme is near enough to someone that understands this stuff to pull off a good result for Ubuntu. i suggested it a couple of years ago on this list: in the absence of actual designers, perhaps a graphic design school could 'audit' the default theme as part of a class project, coming up with a few mockups within the scope of what's doable in GTK? at the least we could give them existing screenshots and have them manipulate the colour field until better results are found.. cheers, -- julian oliver http://julianoliver.com http://selectparks.net messages containing HTML will not be read. On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 9:37 AM, Salane Ashcraft [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey Everyone... What's up with this? http://digg.com/linux_unix/Ubuntu_8_10_Intrepid_Ibex_Alpha_1_Screenshots See the complaints? We cannot let this happen. This theme is even worse then the default of Hardy Salane [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- d-_-b -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
On Monday 30 June 2008 06:07:29 Salane Ashcraft wrote: Hey Everyone... What's up with this? This is the dark theme that we have put in for testing. It is in no way finished, ie the testing. http://digg.com/linux_unix/Ubuntu_8_10_Intrepid_Ibex_Alpha_1_Screenshots See the complaints? We cannot let this happen. This theme is even worse then the default of Hardy I appreciate that you do now want this to happen. My suggestion would be to work on something that you think is better. Ken -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
On Mon, 2008-06-30 at 11:15 +0200, Kenneth Wimer wrote: On Monday 30 June 2008 06:07:29 Salane Ashcraft wrote: Hey Everyone... What's up with this? This is the dark theme that we have put in for testing. It is in no way finished, ie the testing. http://digg.com/linux_unix/Ubuntu_8_10_Intrepid_Ibex_Alpha_1_Screenshots See the complaints? We cannot let this happen. This theme is even worse then the default of Hardy I appreciate that you do now want this to happen. My suggestion would be to work on something that you think is better. Ken Rather than necessarily set up opposing 'camps' (not intrinsically a bad thing, but it can be), is it possible for people to get involved in the development of this theme? - to improve the entirely-to-be-expected early flaws. It doesn't appear to have a statement of concept on the wiki with screenshots for people to comment on. I know it's possible for people to submit bugs against it, but I think it would be useful if it were on the wiki as well. The statement of concept is very important, because when someone says they don't like it, you can simply point them to the concept so they can understand why YOU like it and think it is the right direction to go in. You can also explain who the audience is (i.e. it may not be designed for the kind of people who are criticising it, if it is then that's when you know you need to reconsider aspects of your design). IMO the wiki allows designer(s) and critics/audience to respond in a much less clinical/technical way to a design than does launchpad. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
[ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
I've added kwii's repo and installed the themes. They are faster than the older human theme. The black theme is OK for me altought it needs work(is an alpha afterall) i.e. in firefox. The white theme is also great and the window decoration (the thin brown bar is a nice idea too). -- José Luis Ricón [EMAIL PROTECTED] signature.asc Description: Esta parte del mensaje está firmada digitalmente -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
On Monday 30 June 2008 12:29:29 Nick Russell wrote: snip Rather than necessarily set up opposing 'camps' (not intrinsically a bad thing, but it can be), is it possible for people to get involved in the development of this theme? - to improve the entirely-to-be-expected early flaws. Yes, it is possible for others to get involved with this. It doesn't appear to have a statement of concept on the wiki with screenshots for people to comment on. I know it's possible for people to submit bugs against it, but I think it would be useful if it were on the wiki as well. The statement of concept is very important, because when someone says they don't like it, you can simply point them to the concept so they can understand why YOU like it and think it is the right direction to go in. You can also explain who the audience is (i.e. it may not be designed for the kind of people who are criticising it, if it is then that's when you know you need to reconsider aspects of your design). Actually, this is the first update for intrepid of the long term work we started during the hardy cycle. The wiki page just needs to be updated :-) IMO the wiki allows designer(s) and critics/audience to respond in a much less clinical/technical way to a design than does launchpad. I am unsure what you mean by a much less clinical/technical way as anyone who wants to work on this needs to have the technical skills to do so and/or go through a more elaborate process of submitting their ideas. -- Ken -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
On Monday 30 June 2008 13:53:40 Nick Russell wrote: On Mon, 2008-06-30 at 13:35 +0200, Kenneth Wimer wrote: On Monday 30 June 2008 12:29:29 Nick Russell wrote: snip Rather than necessarily set up opposing 'camps' (not intrinsically a bad thing, but it can be), is it possible for people to get involved in the development of this theme? - to improve the entirely-to-be-expected early flaws. Yes, it is possible for others to get involved with this. Ah that came out wrong, I wasn't meaning to criticise you, I was suggesting to the critics that they do something about the theme (get involved!) rather than just criticise. No worries, I didn't take it poorly. Naturally we'd like any and all help we can get, no matter which theme. It doesn't appear to have a statement of concept on the wiki with screenshots for people to comment on. I know it's possible for people to submit bugs against it, but I think it would be useful if it were on the wiki as well. The statement of concept is very important, because when someone says they don't like it, you can simply point them to the concept so they can understand why YOU like it and think it is the right direction to go in. You can also explain who the audience is (i.e. it may not be designed for the kind of people who are criticising it, if it is then that's when you know you need to reconsider aspects of your design). Actually, this is the first update for intrepid of the long term work we started during the hardy cycle. The wiki page just needs to be updated :-) Cool. Is the Hardy page about the work done so far still available? I didn't find it on my (admittedly brief) look. :-) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/HardyDesign was the original page. In the meantime it is very out of date as the orange parts are now all gone :p I'll update the page sometime today (when I am done working on the theme itself for today). IMO the wiki allows designer(s) and critics/audience to respond in a much less clinical/technical way to a design than does launchpad. I am unsure what you mean by a much less clinical/technical way as anyone who wants to work on this needs to have the technical skills to do so and/or go through a more elaborate process of submitting their ideas. Sorry that wasn't very clear. I completely agree that the people involved in the actual development need to be technically skilled. I was referring to the wiki (and indeed the forums) as a good place for the community to respond with more general comments about the theme (i.e. I like this, I don't like this, why I feel that way). What I'm getting at I suppose is that whilst obviously there will be technical/accessibility issues which are best reported on launchpad, there will also be more abstract/vague art-critic/audience-critic responses which would be best place somewhere else (forums/wiki/individuals blogs)? It would probably be best if such responses went to the forum. Any real problems with specific apps should be reported as bugs. I know this means that we will have lots of bugs but it is the only way I know of to get a good idea of which apps have problems using a dark theme. Ken -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
This is not a progression. It isn't even that different. The problem with Ubuntu isn't the color, which has been made worse with this Alpha. Its the widget style, which is flat and outdated. Its the fonts, which need to be updated and can be done so with open source fonts. Its the icons, which look like something designed for Playskool OS. Its the presentation. I will never stop using Ubuntu, but really, if we want this to be Linux for Humans, shouldn't we make it look as best as possible? I am getting involved. I am learning all I can to bring my theme to life, but it will change yet again. I am going with a lighter color than its current golden brown, perhaps something whiter. Could someone explain to me how pixmap themes work? Salane -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
On Mon, 2008-06-30 at 07:32 -0500, Salane Ashcraft wrote: This is not a progression. It isn't even that different. The problem with Ubuntu isn't the color, which has been made worse with this Alpha. Its the widget style, which is flat and outdated. Its the fonts, which need to be updated and can be done so with open source fonts. Its the icons, which look like something designed for Playskool OS. Its the presentation. I will never stop using Ubuntu, but really, if we want this to be Linux for Humans, shouldn't we make it look as best as possible? I think you are being a bit harsh considering this is a very early version of the theme. I don't particularly like it as it is now either, but there is plenty of time for it to improve! Personally I like the current icons. With the exception of the folder icons which i've always felt seem a bit too shiny compared to all the other icons. I am getting involved. I am learning all I can to bring my theme to life, but it will change yet again. I am going with a lighter color than its current golden brown, perhaps something whiter. Could someone explain to me how pixmap themes work? Salane -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
On Monday 30 June 2008 14:32:19 Salane Ashcraft wrote: This is not a progression. It isn't even that different. The problem with Ubuntu isn't the color, which has been made worse with this Alpha. Its the widget style, which is flat and outdated. Its the fonts, which need to be updated and can be done so with open source fonts. Its the icons, which look like something designed for Playskool OS. Its the presentation. I will never stop using Ubuntu, but really, if we want this to be Linux for Humans, shouldn't we make it look as best as possible? I am getting involved. I am learning all I can to bring my theme to life, but it will change yet again. I am going with a lighter color than its current golden brown, perhaps something whiter. I would disagree with the idea that this is not a progression as it uses the murrine theme which we have been working on including since a couple of releases. Indeed there are many things that need improvement but this is a good start. The fonts are open source (and include symbols for most languages, something that cannot be said for every oss font). We might want to switch to liberation though. The icons could use an update but that is a lot of work which takes time. All in all, I think that this is a good start. How it progresses is still to be seen. We included a dark theme because we are interested in it and want to test it. Remember that Intrepid is only now in the alpha phase so there is plenty of time for improvement :-) Could someone explain to me how pixmap themes work? While I have little direct experience with using the pixmap engine I would imagine it is exactly as named; based on small pixmaps which define the different elements. Ken -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
The fonts are open source (and include symbols for most languages, something that cannot be said for every oss font). We might want to switch to liberation though. The Liberation font license issue has changed, right? For the better I have read. I've been changing all Sans to Liberation Sans, etc. for a while now whenever I set up my desktop. I really enjoy the look, especially within Firefox, where the Liberation fonts (to me) vastly improve the experience. Can Ubuntu use these as defaults now? Ashton On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 7:11 AM, Kenneth Wimer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Monday 30 June 2008 14:32:19 Salane Ashcraft wrote: This is not a progression. It isn't even that different. The problem with Ubuntu isn't the color, which has been made worse with this Alpha. Its the widget style, which is flat and outdated. Its the fonts, which need to be updated and can be done so with open source fonts. Its the icons, which look like something designed for Playskool OS. Its the presentation. I will never stop using Ubuntu, but really, if we want this to be Linux for Humans, shouldn't we make it look as best as possible? I am getting involved. I am learning all I can to bring my theme to life, but it will change yet again. I am going with a lighter color than its current golden brown, perhaps something whiter. I would disagree with the idea that this is not a progression as it uses the murrine theme which we have been working on including since a couple of releases. Indeed there are many things that need improvement but this is a good start. The fonts are open source (and include symbols for most languages, something that cannot be said for every oss font). We might want to switch to liberation though. The icons could use an update but that is a lot of work which takes time. All in all, I think that this is a good start. How it progresses is still to be seen. We included a dark theme because we are interested in it and want to test it. Remember that Intrepid is only now in the alpha phase so there is plenty of time for improvement :-) Could someone explain to me how pixmap themes work? While I have little direct experience with using the pixmap engine I would imagine it is exactly as named; based on small pixmaps which define the different elements. Ken -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- Dan Quayle - It's time for the human race to enter the solar system. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
On Monday 30 June 2008 15:56:48 Ashton wrote: The fonts are open source (and include symbols for most languages, something that cannot be said for every oss font). We might want to switch to liberation though. The Liberation font license issue has changed, right? For the better I have read. I've been changing all Sans to Liberation Sans, etc. for a while now whenever I set up my desktop. I really enjoy the look, especially within Firefox, where the Liberation fonts (to me) vastly improve the experience. Can Ubuntu use these as defaults now? Yes, I think they can. I am in the process of clearing this up. In any case, the fonts are in Intrepid (there were also package for Hardy) so they can be tested...depending on the outcome I'll set them as default. -- Ken -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
[ubuntu-art] Can I get the source for the intrepid ibex alpha one theme?
Looks pretty cool and fun to play around with. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
[ubuntu-art] dark theme for alpha
Good work on getting the dark theme in place for Alpha 1. It is a very exciting event. Just to confirm, the current plan is for the dark theme to exist during the alpha stages in order to generate bug reports on incompatible apps and to become aware of any usability issues, right? If so, we should alert Steve Langasek the Ubuntu release manager so that he can ensure the release notes for the alpha releases indicate this clearly to avoid too many, I don't like the dark theme complaints. Although there should be an appropriate way for the community to voice their opinion on the matter (I'd just prefer it not to be the bug tracker since I get plenty of bug mail already). -- Matthew Nuzum newz2000 on freenode -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
I don't mind the dark theme not that I've been using it for a while. But there are issues with things like Compiz Config Settings, where the app uses blue text, and it is mostly unreadable against the dark background. I don't know why it uses this blue in some places and not others. screenshot - http://picasaweb.google.com/cogneato/UbuntuRelated/photo#5217703878919813170 Ashton On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 8:01 AM, Kenneth Wimer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Monday 30 June 2008 15:56:48 Ashton wrote: The fonts are open source (and include symbols for most languages, something that cannot be said for every oss font). We might want to switch to liberation though. The Liberation font license issue has changed, right? For the better I have read. I've been changing all Sans to Liberation Sans, etc. for a while now whenever I set up my desktop. I really enjoy the look, especially within Firefox, where the Liberation fonts (to me) vastly improve the experience. Can Ubuntu use these as defaults now? Yes, I think they can. I am in the process of clearing this up. In any case, the fonts are in Intrepid (there were also package for Hardy) so they can be tested...depending on the outcome I'll set them as default. -- Ken -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- Dan Quayle - It's time for the human race to enter the solar system. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
OK so I vote to use the Liberation fonts at least no matter what theme, and improve the icons significantly no matter what theme. Also, I think we should maybe have some sort of voting system and a better way to get the opinions of the Ubuntu Community in general. Who votes for Liberation fonts? Salane -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
Salane Ashcraft wrote: OK so I vote to use the Liberation fonts at least no matter what theme, and improve the icons significantly no matter what theme. This can't happen as the license doesn't pass the Debian free software guidelines test. Last I saw anyway. DejaVu would work also. Ubuntu Studio uses them. Also, I think we should maybe have some sort of voting system and a better way to get the opinions of the Ubuntu Community in general. Voting on things like this never works. Art is too subjective. -Cory -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
This can't happen as the license doesn't pass the Debian free software guidelines test. Last I saw anyway. That has changed: http://www.quantenblog.net/free-software/liberation-fonts But after a long wait and the persistent work by several people these issues have finally been settled and the Liberation fonts have been accepted into the Debian archive http://packages.debian.org/sid/ttf-liberation. Other distros are expected to follow suit soon. Ashton On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 10:38 AM, Cory K. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Salane Ashcraft wrote: OK so I vote to use the Liberation fonts at least no matter what theme, and improve the icons significantly no matter what theme. This can't happen as the license doesn't pass the Debian free software guidelines test. Last I saw anyway. DejaVu would work also. Ubuntu Studio uses them. Also, I think we should maybe have some sort of voting system and a better way to get the opinions of the Ubuntu Community in general. Voting on things like this never works. Art is too subjective. -Cory -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- Steven Wright - A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
[ubuntu-art] Liberation Fonts
On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 11:31 AM, Salane Ashcraft [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK so I vote to use the Liberation fonts at least no matter what theme, and improve the icons significantly no matter what theme. Also, I think we should maybe have some sort of voting system and a better way to get the opinions of the Ubuntu Community in general. Who votes for Liberation fonts? As I understand it, Liberation was not meant to be the best font in the world and is not our best choice. Liberation was meant as a free option for people who want the best interoperability with MS Office users. That means with Liberation, if you receive an office document it's lines will wrap in the same places for you as it did for the author. This is a good thing the liberation font team has done but our themes are not Word documents and therefore don't need to use Liberation. -- Matthew Nuzum newz2000 on freenode -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Liberation Fonts
Have you tried Liberation Sans? I think it's a great choice. As I mentioned earlier, Firefox in particular, when changed from within preferences, looks much more crisp and clean. I don't have much experience with the other Liberation fonts, though. Ashton On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 10:52 AM, Matthew Nuzum [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 11:31 AM, Salane Ashcraft [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK so I vote to use the Liberation fonts at least no matter what theme, and improve the icons significantly no matter what theme. Also, I think we should maybe have some sort of voting system and a better way to get the opinions of the Ubuntu Community in general. Who votes for Liberation fonts? As I understand it, Liberation was not meant to be the best font in the world and is not our best choice. Liberation was meant as a free option for people who want the best interoperability with MS Office users. That means with Liberation, if you receive an office document it's lines will wrap in the same places for you as it did for the author. This is a good thing the liberation font team has done but our themes are not Word documents and therefore don't need to use Liberation. -- Matthew Nuzum newz2000 on freenode -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- Dan Quayle - It's time for the human race to enter the solar system. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] dark theme for alpha
..on or around Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 10:27:52AM -0500 Matthew Nuzum wrote: Good work on getting the dark theme in place for Alpha 1. It is a very exciting event. Just to confirm, the current plan is for the dark theme to exist during the alpha stages in order to generate bug reports on incompatible apps and to become aware of any usability issues, right? If so, we should alert Steve Langasek the Ubuntu release manager so that he can ensure the release notes for the alpha releases indicate this clearly to avoid too many, I don't like the dark theme complaints. Although there should be an appropriate way for the community to voice their opinion on the matter (I'd just prefer it not to be the bug tracker since I get plenty of bug mail already). maybe it'd be wise to have one of the Ubuntu Forums make a sticky thread: Comment here on the Dark Theme for Intrepid. he could put a link to the thread in the release notes, or just direct them to the top level of the forums. we could read their complaints/suggestions here. that said, this strategy would only cover the English Ubuntu users.. cheers, -- julian oliver http://julianoliver.com http://selectparks.net messages containing HTML will not be read. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Liberation Fonts
On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 6:08 PM, Ashton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you tried Liberation Sans? I think it's a great choice. As I mentioned earlier, Firefox in particular, when changed from within preferences, looks much more crisp and clean. I don't have much experience with the other Liberation fonts, though. Unfortunately I don't think it's a great choice as a system default. To my mind (and it's a simplification), Bitstream Vera Sans (a.k.a. Sans) = Tahoma, while Liberation Sans = Arial. The Liberation font are excellently suited for Word documents, but the Sans variety in particular is not suited as a font for applications. This is especially noticeable if you use Slight hinting (which I believe may become the default hinting method for Intrepid). Purely IMHO, of course. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Liberation Fonts
I just looked at them... not so good for a system font. Any suggestions then? I think something open source that looks like Segoe UI or Myriad Pro would be great... On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 12:25 PM, Conn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 6:08 PM, Ashton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you tried Liberation Sans? I think it's a great choice. As I mentioned earlier, Firefox in particular, when changed from within preferences, looks much more crisp and clean. I don't have much experience with the other Liberation fonts, though. Unfortunately I don't think it's a great choice as a system default. To my mind (and it's a simplification), Bitstream Vera Sans (a.k.a. Sans) = Tahoma, while Liberation Sans = Arial. The Liberation font are excellently suited for Word documents, but the Sans variety in particular is not suited as a font for applications. This is especially noticeable if you use Slight hinting (which I believe may become the default hinting method for Intrepid). Purely IMHO, of course. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Liberation Fonts
I just looked at them... HA! Maybe look at them first, then call the vote next time, eh? O_o I don't understand this system fonts objection. I think I need more details other than it is not a system font from people in order to understand. Also, I don't know what my settings are, but changing to DejaVu gives me awful results. Maybe my eyes are screwy. I do use full hinting...I switch from a 14 laptop to a 22 lcd at my home...Lib looks good on either...I'm completely open to alternatives, but not seeing any others being proposed. If there is an OSS Segoe (cough...Frutiger) or Myriad Pro choice out there, then sure, why the heck not? I think one will have to get to work on that though. Ashton On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 11:39 AM, Salane Ashcraft [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I just looked at them... not so good for a system font. Any suggestions then? I think something open source that looks like Segoe UI or Myriad Pro would be great... On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 12:25 PM, Conn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 6:08 PM, Ashton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you tried Liberation Sans? I think it's a great choice. As I mentioned earlier, Firefox in particular, when changed from within preferences, looks much more crisp and clean. I don't have much experience with the other Liberation fonts, though. Unfortunately I don't think it's a great choice as a system default. To my mind (and it's a simplification), Bitstream Vera Sans (a.k.a. Sans) = Tahoma, while Liberation Sans = Arial. The Liberation font are excellently suited for Word documents, but the Sans variety in particular is not suited as a font for applications. This is especially noticeable if you use Slight hinting (which I believe may become the default hinting method for Intrepid). Purely IMHO, of course. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- Dan Quayle - It's time for the human race to enter the solar system. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Liberation Fonts
On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 7:24 PM, Ashton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't understand this system fonts objection. I think I need more details other than it is not a system font from people in order to understand. Also, I don't know what my settings are, but changing to DejaVu gives me awful results. Maybe my eyes are screwy. I do use full hinting...I switch from a 14 laptop to a 22 lcd at my home...Lib looks good on either...I'm completely open to alternatives, but not seeing any others being proposed. As many would say on this list, art is too subjective to vote by committee, and to compound this problem, many people have no formal training with regards to art, interface design, etc. On the topic of fonts, it's even more difficult to get a valid opinion due to a) the unavoidable technical factors that influence font preferences (the type of screen you own and its native subpixel order, the resolution you choose, whether you have a preference for the equivalent of ClearType smoothing or if you prefer sharp text, if you have astygmatism, nearsightedness or farsightedness), and b) I would imagine not many people on this list are typography experts. Let me clarify my earlier statements: I actually like the Liberation fonts and they would be welcome on my system (especially for use in OpenOffice.org, and I like the Liberation Mono font for use in terminals), but I would *not* like to see the generic Sans (Bitstream Vera Sans) font replaced by Liberation Sans. From my perspective as a user, I find Sans more pleasant to use as an application font. I'm afraid I can't explain my rationale very well, just as I can't explain why I much prefer the application font to be Tahoma over Arial in Windows... -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Liberation Fonts
I've loaded up Segoe and other fonts in the past. They look great, of course, but there are some areas where I try to stick with open, and um, tolerable solutions...When I first subbed Lib sans for Sans, I felt it was an improvement. I realize everyone is going to prefer one over another, though, and have no problem setting it up myself, until something better comes along. I believe Linux Mint uses Lib Sans as default sys font...or did at one point. Haven't checked Mint out in a long time. A bit hypocritical since I use plenty of other non-free solutions for various things...but yeah, who knows why we do the tings we do? Máirín Duffy, art dev at Fedora, has a study of fonts and licensing that someone might find interesting:http://duffy.fedorapeople.org/fonts/ I don't know what Fedora Sulphur is using as default sys font, though. Is it Liberation? Ashton On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 1:23 PM, Salane Ashcraft [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I will suggest using specifically any Humanist Sans Serif font for the system theme. I will be on the look out for an open source font that follows this description. Example: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Frutiger.svg http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/48/Myriadsp.svg -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- Will Rogers - I don't make jokes. I just watch the government and report the facts. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
I will have to say that is a superb background. Thanks. It is my attempt at duplicating the style I used with the heron (fela kuti) for hardy. It's up at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/AbstractIbex as a 1280x800 png. I can make some bigger if needed. I was waiting for feedback, but seeing someone else use it is good feedback! :) It allows for choosing which colors you want from the appearance menu, or a gradient. That way you can make it darker or lighter to match your preference. I think I need to tweak the transparent parts though. Ashton On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 1:24 PM, Salane Ashcraft [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I will have to say that is a superb background. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Hello
On Sun, Jun 29, 2008 at 12:37 PM, JMMING Hackers [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As I climb the drawings I've done for the distro code name ibex intrepid? I made several drawings that are striking. atte. Cristian Merlos -- JMMING Hackers de El Salvador We don't need no education We dont need no thought control No dark sarcasm in the classroom Teachers leave them kids alone Hey! Teachers! Leave them kids alone! All in all it's just another brick in the wall. All in all you're just another brick in the wall. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art as i climb the drawings? can you please use babelfish to translate that message into english please? -- Ronald Reagan - Recession is when a neighbour loses his job. Depression is when you lose yours. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 10:31 PM, Ashton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I will have to say that is a superb background. Thanks. It is my attempt at duplicating the style I used with the heron (fela kuti) for hardy. It's up at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/AbstractIbexas a 1280x800 png. I can make some bigger if needed. I was waiting for feedback, but seeing someone else use it is good feedback! :) Fantastic! I have a suggestion... and I'm not kid-ding (hilarious, I know)... try to make the eyes look more authentic. Ibexes are mountain goats, and as far as I know the eyes look no different to those of a typical goat - with a pale iris and horizontal slit-shaped pupils. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
- with a pale iris and horizontal slit-shaped pupils. I will do so. I noticed this trait in all the pics I looked at, and failed to carry it over. On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 4:25 PM, Conn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 10:31 PM, Ashton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I will have to say that is a superb background. Thanks. It is my attempt at duplicating the style I used with the heron (fela kuti) for hardy. It's up at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/AbstractIbexas a 1280x800 png. I can make some bigger if needed. I was waiting for feedback, but seeing someone else use it is good feedback! :) Fantastic! I have a suggestion... and I'm not kid-ding (hilarious, I know)... try to make the eyes look more authentic. Ibexes are mountain goats, and as far as I know the eyes look no different to those of a typical goat - with a pale iris and horizontal slit-shaped pupils. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- Dan Quayle - It's time for the human race to enter the solar system. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This?
On Tuesday 01 July 2008 01:27:46 Ashton wrote: - with a pale iris and horizontal slit-shaped pupils. I will do so. I noticed this trait in all the pics I looked at, and failed to carry it over. Not sure if this will help or not, but here is the eye that I was working on. -- Ken attachment: ibex_eye.svg-- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
[ubuntu-art] Unsubscribing?
Hey everyone I love Ubuntu and its art but can someone please tell me how to unsubscribe to this page now? Thanks -- Affliction comes to us, not to make us sad but sober; not to make us sorry but wise. -- H. G. Wells The book of nature is written in mathematical characters. -- Galileo --- On Mon, 6/30/08, Ashton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: Ashton [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This? To: Discussion on Ubuntu artwork ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com Date: Monday, June 30, 2008, 4:27 PM - with a pale iris and horizontal slit-shaped pupils. I will do so. I noticed this trait in all the pics I looked at, and failed to carry it over. On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 4:25 PM, Conn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 10:31 PM, Ashton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I will have to say that is a superb background. Thanks. It is my attempt at duplicating the style I used with the heron (fela kuti) for hardy. It's up at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/AbstractIbex as a 1280x800 png. I can make some bigger if needed. I was waiting for feedback, but seeing someone else use it is good feedback! :) Fantastic! I have a suggestion... and I'm not kid-ding (hilarious, I know)... try to make the eyes look more authentic. Ibexes are mountain goats, and as far as I know the eyes look no different to those of a typical goat - with a pale iris and horizontal slit-shaped pupils. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- Dan Quayle - It's time for the human race to enter the solar system. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Unsubscribing?
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art You can unsubscribe or change any options using this website. On Mon, 2008-06-30 at 17:27 -0700, matt palsson wrote: Hey everyone I love Ubuntu and its art but can someone please tell me how to unsubscribe to this page now? Thanks -- Affliction comes to us, not to make us sad but sober; not to make us sorry but wise. -- H. G. Wells The book of nature is written in mathematical characters. -- Galileo --- On Mon, 6/30/08, Ashton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: Ashton [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [ubuntu-art] Whats Up with This? To: Discussion on Ubuntu artwork ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com Date: Monday, June 30, 2008, 4:27 PM - with a pale iris and horizontal slit-shaped pupils. I will do so. I noticed this trait in all the pics I looked at, and failed to carry it over. On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 4:25 PM, Conn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 10:31 PM, Ashton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I will have to say that is a superb background. Thanks. It is my attempt at duplicating the style I used with the heron (fela kuti) for hardy. It's up at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/AbstractIbex as a 1280x800 png. I can make some bigger if needed. I was waiting for feedback, but seeing someone else use it is good feedback! :) Fantastic! I have a suggestion... and I'm not kid-ding (hilarious, I know)... try to make the eyes look more authentic. Ibexes are mountain goats, and as far as I know the eyes look no different to those of a typical goat - with a pale iris and horizontal slit-shaped pupils. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- Dan Quayle - It's time for the human race to enter the solar system. -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art -- Alan Munson [EMAIL PROTECTED] signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
Re: [ubuntu-art] Elegant Brit
On Sun, Jun 29, 2008 at 6:18 PM, fruchtschwert [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Am Mittwoch, den 18.06.2008, 01:28 +0100 schrieb Who: On Mon, Jun 16, 2008 at 7:42 PM, Conn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sun, Jun 15, 2008 at 11:24 PM, Who [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: * Distinctive: No other OS looks like this BUT it doesn't break usability I.E it's unique and usable... All elements (with the possible exception of the menus that really need an outline if you want to use them without a shadow-porviding WM) If by usability you mean the ability to use, I'll have to disagree. There is no way a mainstream distribution should sacrifice basic accessibility for aesthetics. In case you didn't get what I'm hinting at, it's the razor-thin scrollbars and scale sliders. My bad, you're right about these. Hey, I wanted to propose a very flexible and amazing launcher for intrepid, GNOME Do! http://do.davebsd.com/ I like the idea. When I used KDE, I was a big fan of Katapult. One thing we might want if this was included is some sort of Tracker integration (I didn't see it mentioned on the website/plugins list) -- ubuntu-art mailing list ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art
