[Bug 655351] Re: [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound
Um, light blue is line-in, not line-out. I'm not sure if I have ever seen a speaker out and if so, I don't remember what color it had. -- [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
Re: [Bug 655351] Re: [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound
I'm obviously confused about the jack colors ): However, examining general sound equipment usage: Line-out *shouldn't be amplified*. Speaker-out should. Line-out should be used by people who have dedicated amplifiers (ie, me: I should be using it, but I don't -- I haven't stumbled across not having a line-out on my current hardware because I like having the volume control just work. I do, however, remember jacking into the wrong port on a prior card (I think it was an SB) and getting a very low volume with no amp, finding out it was line-out and switching to speaker-out). Speaker-out should be used for simple speakers which require amplification or lazy people like me who like using software volume controls. So it wouldn't surprise me, since I've obviously gotten the colors wrong (or misread things) that most audio cards don't have a real line-out -- they just have a speaker-out. So, whilst I'm certainly not picking a fight with you (since this is apparently an upstream decision), I can still come back to my original points: 1) headphones muting the speakers used to work pre-9.04 (so we have an established user expectation even under Ubuntu) 2) headphones mute the built-in speakers of my laptop (windows and ubuntu) -- why the inconsistent behaviour for a desktop? Just because the speakers in the laptop are bolted into the frame of the machine? What an arbitrary 3) Windows gets it right: plugging in headphones mutes external speakers -- it's convenient. Though I think you can disable that feature if you want. I'm told by a person at work that his Mac does the same. 4) It seems to be the expectation of the user -- note the number of bug reports against this design choice. Again, I'm really not fighting with you on this -- picking a fight with you would be kinda pointless here (: However, I would like to ask you for some help: where would I lodge this as a request upstream? ALSA devs? It's easy to report an ubuntu bug/request with apport -- not so easy to know what to do if the problem isn't Ubuntu-specific. I don't mind taking this further -- there seems to be enough general confusion over the matter that there might actually be some consideration put into my request (or am I just being naive and optimistic?) Thanks -d On 7 October 2010 11:07, David Henningsson 655...@bugs.launchpad.netwrote: Um, light blue is line-in, not line-out. I'm not sure if I have ever seen a speaker out and if so, I don't remember what color it had. -- [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351 You received this bug notification because you are a direct subscriber of the bug. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- The competent programmer is fully aware of the limited size of his own skull. He therefore approaches his task with full humility, and avoids clever tricks like the plague. - Djikstra. -- [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 655351] Re: [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound
So it wouldn't surprise me, since I've obviously gotten the colors wrong (or misread things) that most audio cards don't have a real line-out -- they just have a speaker-out. I know for sure that most audio cards have either a headphone-out or a line-out (or both), and that speaker-outs are rare. Haven't seen one since the old SB16 days. However, I would like to ask you for some help: where would I lodge this as a request upstream? ALSA devs? Yes, I think it is in the alsa-devel mailing list, where the decisions like these are made. -- [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
Re: [Bug 655351] Re: [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound
Thanks, I've made a post there. Good luck to me (: -d On 7 October 2010 13:00, David Henningsson 655...@bugs.launchpad.netwrote: So it wouldn't surprise me, since I've obviously gotten the colors wrong (or misread things) that most audio cards don't have a real line-out -- they just have a speaker-out. I know for sure that most audio cards have either a headphone-out or a line-out (or both), and that speaker-outs are rare. Haven't seen one since the old SB16 days. However, I would like to ask you for some help: where would I lodge this as a request upstream? ALSA devs? Yes, I think it is in the alsa-devel mailing list, where the decisions like these are made. -- [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351 You received this bug notification because you are a direct subscriber of the bug. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- The competent programmer is fully aware of the limited size of his own skull. He therefore approaches his task with full humility, and avoids clever tricks like the plague. - Djikstra. -- [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 655351] Re: [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound
For reference, here's the thread (and not that it got many replies though) http://mailman.alsa-project.org/pipermail/alsa- devel/2010-August/030071.html -- [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
Re: [Bug 655351] Re: [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound
But you see now, that thread makes sense: the line-out shouldn't be muted. Speaker out should. The jack ports are: light-blue for line-out and green for speaker out. I'm using green ): Should I re-open this? I just had the correct behaviour under windows -- was playing Borderlands with headphones and only realised that my amp volume was still on when I rebooted and got Ubuntu event sounds. -d On 6 October 2010 20:26, David Henningsson 655...@bugs.launchpad.netwrote: devel/2010-August/030071.html -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- The competent programmer is fully aware of the limited size of his own skull. He therefore approaches his task with full humility, and avoids clever tricks like the plague. - Djikstra. -- [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 655351] Re: [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound
According to your BIOS, you don't have any internal speakers, only line- out. Is this correct? Headphones should only automute speakers, not line-outs. ** Summary changed: - [HDA-Intel - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound + [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound ** Changed in: alsa-driver (Ubuntu) Status: New = Incomplete -- [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
Re: [Bug 655351] Re: [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound
I'm not sure if I'm going to answer your question correctly, so here goes: I don't have internal speakers -- in that I don't have any speakers actually inside my machine. Not sure if that's what you're asking? I do use the pcm out (green jack) at the back of the machine to feed into powered creative 4.1 speakers (but I only use the first stereo jack -- the speaker set will automatically duplicate front to back when only given one input and I have never managed to reliably get 4.1 sound on things that support it as well as getting music apps (like audacious) to output to both the front and back speakers -- so I just leave it in stereo). Have I answered your question? -d On 6 October 2010 14:29, David Henningsson 655...@bugs.launchpad.netwrote: According to your BIOS, you don't have any internal speakers, only line- out. Is this correct? Headphones should only automute speakers, not line-outs. ** Summary changed: - [HDA-Intel - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound + [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound ** Changed in: alsa-driver (Ubuntu) Status: New = Incomplete -- [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351 You received this bug notification because you are a direct subscriber of the bug. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- The competent programmer is fully aware of the limited size of his own skull. He therefore approaches his task with full humility, and avoids clever tricks like the plague. - Djikstra. -- [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 655351] Re: [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound
Yes. This behaviour is by design. I asked upstream a while ago about exactly that. ** Changed in: alsa-driver (Ubuntu) Status: Incomplete = Invalid -- [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
Re: [Bug 655351] Re: [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound
It's weird that it's by design from a user perspective: 1) That Other OS (Windows) mutes the speaker output when jacking in headphones on the same machine 2) pre 9.04, so did Ubuntu. Now I have to make sure that I turn down the hardware volume on my plugged-in speakers whenever I jack in headphones -- what do people do when they don't have hardware volume controls on their cheap-ass external speakers? I'm not having a go at you -- I just don't understand the by design decision. I could get it if it was an option to allow this behaviour, but not the only way ): -d On 6 October 2010 15:24, David Henningsson 655...@bugs.launchpad.netwrote: Yes. This behaviour is by design. I asked upstream a while ago about exactly that. ** Changed in: alsa-driver (Ubuntu) Status: Incomplete = Invalid -- [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351 You received this bug notification because you are a direct subscriber of the bug. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- The competent programmer is fully aware of the limited size of his own skull. He therefore approaches his task with full humility, and avoids clever tricks like the plague. - Djikstra. -- [ALC888 - HDA ATI SB] Headphones don't mute master sound https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
