Re: [Bug 36189] Re: Applets do not scale well with changing resolution

[Vincenzo Ciancia]

Il giorno lun, 27/04/2009 alle 22.21 +, John Haitas ha scritto:
> 
> Categorizing this issue as "seriously trivial" is underestimating it.
> 
> This is the sort of issue Linux users face, but Windows and Mac users
> are
> never bothered with. I would be happy to patch this.

I am not an ubuntu developer, and "seriously trivial" means that it is
serious even if a patch *should* be trivial. So the idea is, if some of
us non-ubuntu-developers-non-gnome-developers could develop the patch it
would be good. BTW also KDE users are not affected by this problem
AFAIK. It is gnome specific.

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Re: [Bug 36189] Re: Applets do not scale well with changing resolution

[John Haitas]

Thank you Sandro, I appreciate your reply. I realized that late last night
(failed to report).

Jaunty source:
$ apt-get source gnome-panel

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Re: [Bug 36189] Re: Applets do not scale well with changing resolution

[John Haitas]

Ok so I think I was wrong on the last post... the relevant package seems to
be 'screen-resolution-extra'  Don't take my word on this, I am just
trying to get to the bottom of this problem...

The Jaunty source:
$ apt-get source screen-resolution-extra

The Ubuntu trunk:
$ bzr get
http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~albertomilone/screen-resolution-extra/main

Please correct me if I am wrong.

On Mon, Apr 27, 2009 at 9:01 PM, John Haitas  wrote:

> So here are the ways to get the source.
>
> The git repository:
> $ git clone git://git.gnome.org/gnome-control-center
>
> The Jaunty source:
> $ apt-get source gnome-control-center
>
> The Ubuntu trunk:
> $ bzr get
> http://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-control-center/ubuntu
>
> Those who know better - please correct me.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 27, 2009 at 5:21 PM, John Haitas  wrote:
>
>> Categorizing this issue as "seriously trivial" is underestimating it.
>>
>> This is the sort of issue Linux users face, but Windows and Mac users are
>> never bothered with. I would be happy to patch this.
>>
>> Where can I obtain the Ubuntu branch of the code that changes the screen
>> resolution.
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 27, 2009 at 3:04 PM, Vincenzo Ciancia 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Il giorno lun, 27/04/2009 alle 18.23 +, John Haitas ha scritto:
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > It seems as if the Gnome team do not take this bug very seriously.
>>> > Would it
>>> > be inappropriate to develop a patch for Ubuntu that may or may not be
>>> > pushed
>>> > upstream in the future?
>>>
>>> To develop any patch you need some manpower. This seems to me a
>>> "seriously trivial" issue however I myself did never found an empty
>>> afternoon to take a look at this (and maybe conclude it's too
>>> difficult).
>>>
>>> If any of us developed a reasonable¹ patch, then I am sure upstream
>>> would be glad to acccept it.
>>>
>>> [1] The trick, here, is in the addition of "reasonable"
>>>
>>> --
>>> Applets do not scale well with changing resolution
>>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/36189
>>> You received this bug notification because you are a direct subscriber
>>> of the bug.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> John Haitas
>> jhai...@gmail.com
>>
>
>
>
> --
> John Haitas
> jhai...@gmail.com
>


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Re: [Bug 36189] Re: Applets do not scale well with changing resolution

[John Haitas]

So here are the ways to get the source.

The git repository:
$ git clone git://git.gnome.org/gnome-control-center

The Jaunty source:
$ apt-get source gnome-control-center

The Ubuntu trunk:
$ bzr get
http://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-control-center/ubuntu

Those who know better - please correct me.


On Mon, Apr 27, 2009 at 5:21 PM, John Haitas  wrote:

> Categorizing this issue as "seriously trivial" is underestimating it.
>
> This is the sort of issue Linux users face, but Windows and Mac users are
> never bothered with. I would be happy to patch this.
>
> Where can I obtain the Ubuntu branch of the code that changes the screen
> resolution.
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 27, 2009 at 3:04 PM, Vincenzo Ciancia wrote:
>
>> Il giorno lun, 27/04/2009 alle 18.23 +, John Haitas ha scritto:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > It seems as if the Gnome team do not take this bug very seriously.
>> > Would it
>> > be inappropriate to develop a patch for Ubuntu that may or may not be
>> > pushed
>> > upstream in the future?
>>
>> To develop any patch you need some manpower. This seems to me a
>> "seriously trivial" issue however I myself did never found an empty
>> afternoon to take a look at this (and maybe conclude it's too
>> difficult).
>>
>> If any of us developed a reasonable¹ patch, then I am sure upstream
>> would be glad to acccept it.
>>
>> [1] The trick, here, is in the addition of "reasonable"
>>
>> --
>> Applets do not scale well with changing resolution
>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/36189
>> You received this bug notification because you are a direct subscriber
>> of the bug.
>>
>
>
>
> --
> John Haitas
> jhai...@gmail.com
>


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Re: [Bug 36189] Re: Applets do not scale well with changing resolution

[John Haitas]

Categorizing this issue as "seriously trivial" is underestimating it.

This is the sort of issue Linux users face, but Windows and Mac users are
never bothered with. I would be happy to patch this.

Where can I obtain the Ubuntu branch of the code that changes the screen
resolution.

On Mon, Apr 27, 2009 at 3:04 PM, Vincenzo Ciancia
wrote:

> Il giorno lun, 27/04/2009 alle 18.23 +, John Haitas ha scritto:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > It seems as if the Gnome team do not take this bug very seriously.
> > Would it
> > be inappropriate to develop a patch for Ubuntu that may or may not be
> > pushed
> > upstream in the future?
>
> To develop any patch you need some manpower. This seems to me a
> "seriously trivial" issue however I myself did never found an empty
> afternoon to take a look at this (and maybe conclude it's too
> difficult).
>
> If any of us developed a reasonable¹ patch, then I am sure upstream
> would be glad to acccept it.
>
> [1] The trick, here, is in the addition of "reasonable"
>
> --
> Applets do not scale well with changing resolution
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/36189
> You received this bug notification because you are a direct subscriber
> of the bug.
>


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Re: [Bug 36189] Re: Applets do not scale well with changing resolution

[Vincenzo Ciancia]

Il giorno lun, 27/04/2009 alle 18.23 +, John Haitas ha scritto:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It seems as if the Gnome team do not take this bug very seriously.
> Would it
> be inappropriate to develop a patch for Ubuntu that may or may not be
> pushed
> upstream in the future?

To develop any patch you need some manpower. This seems to me a
"seriously trivial" issue however I myself did never found an empty
afternoon to take a look at this (and maybe conclude it's too
difficult). 

If any of us developed a reasonable¹ patch, then I am sure upstream
would be glad to acccept it.

[1] The trick, here, is in the addition of "reasonable"

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Re: [Bug 36189] Re: Applets do not scale well with changing resolution

[John Haitas]

It seems as if the Gnome team do not take this bug very seriously. Would it
be inappropriate to develop a patch for Ubuntu that may or may not be pushed
upstream in the future?

On Mon, Apr 27, 2009 at 12:54 PM, Sandro Mani
wrote:

> Here: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=137473 (you can find it
> at the top of the page, under "assigned to")
>
> --
> Applets do not scale well with changing resolution
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/36189
> You received this bug notification because you are a direct subscriber
> of the bug.
>


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Re: [Bug 36189] Re: Applets do not scale well with changing resolution

[John Haitas]

@SebastianCould you provide a relevant link to bugzilla where this
discussion can be carried on?

On Mon, Apr 27, 2009 at 10:00 AM, Jo-Erlend Schinstad <
joerlend.schins...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I'll take it to bugzilla. I still think this bug should have a high
> priority here though. Just to clarify; you're right, people wouldn't
> trust Ubuntu just because the applets stayed at the same places.
> However, trust and distrust are two very different things. Distrust
> comes much more easily than trust. If the system feels unfinished, then
> the new user might begin to wonder what else is unfinished. It's easy to
> forget how scary it can be, to alot of people, changing OS. I don't
> think this should be underestimated. But there are other, more potent
> arguments of course; it breaks muscle memory for instance.
>
> --
> Applets do not scale well with changing resolution
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/36189
> You received this bug notification because you are a direct subscriber
> of the bug.
>


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Re: [Bug 36189] Re: Applets do not scale well with changing resolution

[Vincenzo Ciancia]

Il giorno lun, 27/04/2009 alle 05.43 +, John Haitas ha scritto:
> 
> We need to consider the appeal of Ubuntu to ordinary users depends on
> consistent behaviour. There is a mandate to my the interface as user
> friendly as Mac OS X.

Yes and in fact this problem affects one of the most problematic areas
of the ubuntu user experience: using an external monitor. For example,
this will be very frequent on netbooks. Now on these machines the
resolution of the screen will typically be smaller than the external
monitor. My girlfriend for example has this problem on her eeepc. Using
an external monitor is very unconvenient for this reason. 

V.

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Re: [Bug 36189] Re: Applets do not scale well with changing resolution

[David Fokkema]

On Mon, 2009-04-27 at 05:43 +, John Haitas wrote:
> The fact is that this is not something an average user should worry about.
> Most people don't care about the placement of these objects and applets.

In fact, I think average users do worry about buttons and icons which
end up in strange places. Average users that use external monitors from
time to time, that is.

> I advocate tracking down apps that modify any gconf entries in the
> '/apps/panel/' schema. A good first step would be to look at the 'Display
> Preferences' code or any code that adjusts screen resolution and be sure
> that it is considerate of this issue (not modifying 'right stick' or
> 'position' values of any objects or applets).

Exactly my point. Apps should not modify these values.

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Re: [Bug 36189] Re: Applets do not scale well with changing resolution

[John Haitas]

The fact is that this is not something an average user should worry about.
Most people don't care about the placement of these objects and applets.

The fact that these settings can be changed by anything other than direct
user intervention (ie: screen resolution) should be fixed.

After many times of unlocking, repositioning, and locking objects and
applets I became fed-up. I wrote a Python script to set the panel layout the
way I like it.

We need to consider the appeal of Ubuntu to ordinary users depends on
consistent behaviour. There is a mandate to my the interface as user
friendly as Mac OS X.

With regards to this bug, even Windows is a better experience.

I think a GUI to address this only further complicates matters.

I advocate tracking down apps that modify any gconf entries in the
'/apps/panel/' schema. A good first step would be to look at the 'Display
Preferences' code or any code that adjusts screen resolution and be sure
that it is considerate of this issue (not modifying 'right stick' or
'position' values of any objects or applets).

Does this sound reasonable?

Can someone point me to the source code responsible for changing screen
resolution?



On Fri, Apr 24, 2009 at 3:48 AM, David Fokkema  wrote:

> @Sandro:
> I agree with Aidan. It's not only when adding applets. However, I just now
> only managed to break things when switching to lower resolution, log off,
> log in, switching to higher resolution. Without the log off, log in, I tried
> to restart the panel between, before and after switching resolutions, but
> nothing broke. It did, however, after log off, log in. I don't know why.
> Maybe the problem is not even in the gnome-panel code directly.
>
> It would be really, really nice to get a list of which code touches the
> gconf settings, and when.
>
> @Aidan: Thanks! I agree with both your points.
>
> --
> Applets do not scale well with changing resolution
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/36189
> You received this bug notification because you are a direct subscriber
> of the bug.
>


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Re: [Bug 36189] Re: Applets do not scale well with changing resolution

[Vincenzo Ciancia]

Il giorno lun, 06/10/2008 alle 11.00 +, Franck ha scritto:
> 
> 
> well, that is what I was trying to say : I was on the way to try the
> workaround, but I did _nothing_, it was working already.

I don't know how but the mess happens at next login, not immediately. In
any case I saw this on intrepid too, so it's not fixed yet.

Vincenzo

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