Re: Coordinating work around newer upstream Nvidia drivers for users
Hey Jorge, Nice idea, if any help is needed ill throw my hat in the ring for it too, I think its a pretty important cause to push gaming as much as we can. Some things to note, so this is an Nvidia only thing going by what you are saying, could we have a split for AMD users too? Also I know there are a few PPAs out there like ( https://launchpad.net/~oibaf/+archive/ubuntu/graphics-drivers) for the latest bleeding edge open source graphic stack which would be cool if we could bless one of those as well. Also I'm sure AMD can send out some cards for people if needed to test the AMD stack in such an effort, I have a contact if anyone wants to ask them directly. Also what about tweaks like setting the CPU usage to performance mode, it has a slight bump at least for my machine in frame rates. (cpupower frequency-set performance) The biggest question I have is the future of the effort given the move away from apt to Snappy eventually. Can someone elaborate on what the idea for the future of PPAs after Snappy comes to the desktop, I'm presuming it will be the default eventually. Could we conceivably have a Snap that would be just for gaming? One last thing but aside from the topic slightly, the Steam package in Ubuntu is semi-broken for certain systems because the installer doesn't have the newest Steam runtime so it just straight up breaks on 15.04. The workaround is to either disable the runtime or delete the bundled libs for libgcc, libstdc++ and libxcb. Could we get that updated or just do a script that wget's the one from Valve instead and installs that instead of the one in the repo? It is a massive annoyance and it might confuse some users who don't know how to get around. Regards, Shane On Tue, 11 Aug 2015 at 00:07 Jorge O. Castro wrote: > ... or, how I wanted to kill Orcs all weekend, but instead I was > wrestling with my operating system. > > So, Shadow of Mordor was recently released on Linux so I happened to > have some spare parts, rebuilt a computer, and then ended up not > playing because our Nvidia driver story in Trusty isn't ideal. It's > not terrible, it worked, but I think we can do better. After some > googling I found two people who are doing amazing work: > > The first is Michael Marley: > https://launchpad.net/~mamarley/+archive/ubuntu/nvidia > And the 2nd is Jason DeRose from system-76: > https://launchpad.net/~system76-dev/+archive/ubuntu/stable > > So, I approached both Will Cooke and Alberto Milone on how we could do > a better job of getting all this goodness to users with the least > amount of breakage. > > Will responded with "Talk to the right people, get some +1's and tell > me how I can help". That's this email. :) > Alberto responded with "We spend a bunch of time testing drivers, > which is why we look slow, as long as we don't break that..." > > I just got off the phone with Michael and Jason, and I'd like to start > this discussion. First off: > > ## Why? > > - The amount of Linux games being released is ever increasing; the > demand for fresh drivers in a fast developing market is becoming hard > to ignore, users are going to want the latest upstream has to offer, > and historically that's why we're here; we should strive to deliver > the best experience. > > - With Windows 10 Nvidia is now directly publishing their drivers into > Windows update. That means they can deliver a kickass experience with > almost no effort from the user. Until we can convince Nvidia to do the > same with Ubuntu we're going to have to pick up the slack. > > ## What I propose > > Jason and Michael have done a ton of work to deliver these goodies in > PPAs, here's where I think we should go: > > - Let's not break distro, SRUs and existing distro policies exist for > a reason; breaking my dad's computer isn't worth it, so > > - Let's do a "blessed" PPA with the latest drivers, so that people can > just get those drivers without resorting to xorg-edgers and bleeding. > > - This PPA can have a "give be the latest bling" section, which is > basically automated builds of the latest drivers; and a "stable" > section that is basically a few days behind for people who want the > latest, but don't want to be beta testers. > > - Lets work to ensure that there's a nice way to get back to the > stable drivers in distro and that for users opting in won't be stuck > in a weird broken state. > > - Lets add a hook to the graphical driver installer for "Pure upstream > nvidia driver", which would enable this PPA. (Actually the entire > wording of the drivers in that capplet is horrible, but let's save > that for another day). > > - We should ensure that there is an understanding of support; we're > going to give you the latest driver from Nvidia, and if it breaks, you > get to keep both pieces. :) Last thing we want is people reporting > bugs on binary drivers that we can't fix. > > - I would like to dip into the community fund to provide Michael and > Jason with hardware for development and testing. C
Re: Improving the out of the box game controller experience
Hey Jorge, I tested out the xbox controller with steam and big picture about a month ago and found an interesting bug. The controller worked fine with both big picture and the games themselves but if you use the controller with a game that was launched from big picture it crashed X11 im pretty sure. So there is some weird interaction there. Could you (or anyone else for that matter) reproduce that bug? Im running the xorg edgers ppa in 13.04 and xpad. Regards, Shane On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 6:18 PM, Jorge O. Castro wrote: > Hi everyone, > > With Steam bringing in the game devs I've been working on a dedicated > game machine. Since there's some new attention in this area I thought > I'd bring the experience to the list. I was thinking that we could > probably do a better job supporting game controllers out of the box: > > > http://askubuntu.com/questions/165210/how-do-i-get-an-xbox-360-controller-working > https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Sixaxis > > The Xbox controller was relatively straightforward (I can't comment on > the PS3 as I don't have the hardware), but it's still not usable to > normal people. I was wondering if someone would be interested in > working on software-properties-gtk to make it so when someone plugs in > either controller the user is prompted to install the right software > and it all just works. > > As it happens I have a spare Xbox controller and cable that I can mail > to someone. There are some other minor issues as well, like > blacklisting xpad and xboxdrv needs an upstart job, but it doesn't > seem overly complex. > > I'm sure we can drum up some support for getting a developer a PS3 > controller if they're interested in fixing those controllers too. > > -- > Jorge Castro > Canonical Ltd. > http://juju.ubuntu.com/charm-championship - Share your infrastructure, > win a prize! > > -- > ubuntu-desktop mailing list > ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop > -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: EOL for couchdb and desktopcouch
> That would be a very good reason to keep it in beta. It is usually a good > idea to test things before you release them to the public. By announcing > Ubuntu One as stable, reliable and available, they've fooled people into > spending time and money on something that isn't real. It was working to the point where it couldnt really be called beta software. It always had the odd sticky issue but they spent hard earned time and money making it get to the point where it was pretty stable. The issue is scalability and that is a flaw that can only be discovered when you hit the ceiling and you have to fight to either keep the thing going and maintaining the service or replace it. > Would I tear down an infrastructure that I had convinced a lot of people to > rely on before I had something to replace it with? Absolutely not. Not in my > wildest dreams. They show a level of respect that would fit between the > strings of the worlds smallest violin. Think of it like a bridge if there was a bridge that was built for 200 cars to go across and you hit 200 pretty consistently and you forecast that its only going to get worse you would upgrade and build a stronger one by replacing it or strengthening it. Strengthening it only takes it so far maybe up to 500 but what happens after that? Couchdb was never tested on the level that its at currently and its struggling what happens when you get to the 200 million Mark said he wants? It wouldn't be feasible to keep it going. So by replacing it now before it gets to the point where too many people are relying on it they are saving a good lot of hassle in the future. Oh and im not arguing about the deleting of databases I don't really know what the story is on that or if its possible to migrate it over or if it would be better just to start clean. > Are you saying that DesktopCouch is fundamentally flawed, or are you saying > that Ubuntu One is fundamentally flawed? Because those are different things. > You talk about natural deprecation of old technologies. But you are > describing something entirely different than the actual situation. In your > scenario, you're replacing a technology to provide a feature with something > else. That's not the case here. They're removing the feature altogether, > deleting databases. Some time in the future, we might see a replacement, > though the claim seems completely unreasonable to me -- irrational, even. > They claim that they can't make CouchDB in Ubuntu scale, so they need to > replace it with something that will handle all platforms and all databases, > which obviously includes CouchDB. Seems to me that they're saying it was too > difficult to learn how to ride a bicycle with training wheels, so now > they're joining the Tour de France. Im saying couchdb is fundamentally flawed by the fact that there are problems with how scalable it is. That warrants changing it because at the numbers that are needed to sustain much more people wouldn't work. And im pretty sure you didn't read all of that email they are making something similar to replace it here is the quote just for clarification. "Because we still believe there is a lot of value to our users in the service we wanted to offer based on CouchDB, we're building something new, based on what we've learned. It's very small, merely a layer of abstraction and the definition of an API that will allow us and others to build what is needed ontop of existing tools. We're calling it U1DB for now, until it comes of age. If you're interested and techincally inclined you can follow our progress on lp:u1db; unfortunately our timing and resources are such that we can only promise the reference python implementation will be ready in time for 12.04, and thus 12.04 will ship without Ubuntu One having a solid story around synchronizing arbitrary structured data." So you aren't getting left high and dry. Shane -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: EOL for couchdb and desktopcouch
> I'm rather dismayed by this, I have to say. First you convince developers to > rely on your infrastructure for their apps, and then, out of the blue, you > remove key parts of it? It's not the first time, either. One thing is > removing it from Ubuntu One. If you can't manage the large amounts of users > and data, then that means U1 shouldn't have been taken out of beta and that > it in no way is ready for general use. This is another example of Canonical > showing poor judgement in its communication. In fairness to the original idea of using couchdb it is a great idea and showed a lot of promise and it was a fair amount of time ago that the choice was made to use it and between that time they got it to a state where it was doing more or less what they had envisioned. The problem here is there is no other company using couchdb at this scale and there is a point where its not quite feasible to keep it going. This isn't canonical flip flopping between technologies on a whim its the scales of feasibility tipping to the wrong side. > However, removing support for tools that apps depend upon to store and > retrieve data locally is something else entirely. It is incomprehensible to > me that you would even consider this. If you want to attract developers, > then you simply cannot just remove tools that developers depend upon. > Storage infrastructure is a fairly critical part of most computer systems. > If you can't rely on that, then how on earth can you expect people to invest > time and money in developing for Ubuntu? I've spent months on my app, and > now it's lost most of it's value, if not all. I'll have to re-write it from > scratch. Should I add support for Unity at all, or might that also suddenly > be dropped? This is not the way to create enthusiasm. Except for SSO, the > database functionality was the one big USP that Ubuntu One had. Speaking of > SSO... We can't know what's going on internally in Canonical, but we know > for a fact that it is willing to drop support without warning. This is a > very good reason not to rely on Ubuntu SSO for anything. After all, who > knows if it'll be there tomorrow? It is really sad to see myself writing > something like that. It's what Windows users use as an argument for sticking > to Windows. I know what you mean here there are a few apps using it but if you think about it wouldn't you cause inconvenience to a small minority (and yes it is a bit of a minority using desktopcouch at the moment) to improve the scalability and sustainability and pick or make something that is a lot more suited to the task. That is the choice that they had to make. Personally I had nothing to do with the decision and im not even going to pretend that but its really important to read the EOL email with care and see it from the business point of view that they had to make a choice and do it before they ran into serious issues. > You're not only making fools of developers, however. You're also making > fools out of advocates. As late as yesterday, I wrote about Ubuntu becoming > a very attracting platform with focus on phones, tablets, etc. One of the > things I wrote about, was the ability to sync databases between your > devices, enabling you to keep working even when you're offline. Yesterday, > that symbolised the strength and potential of Ubuntu. Today, the same thing > symbolises uncertainty and unreliability. > > I'm flabbergasted. This is not a wise decision. Deprecating things is a natural process of development. Out with the old and in with the more suited until something different comes along that is better its a cycle. It might seem rash and I know the disappointment but still its something natural that happens to systems over time things have to change before you hit the wall and you run into an issue when thousands of programs depend on a library that is fundamentally flawed and you have to ship it rather than break too many things. The truth is the sooner the better that they pushed out couchdb. Regards Shane -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: [Desktop12.04-Topic] Video playback?
Hey Didier, > People trying to use video have the same critics that when > they don't look the audio support: slow to start, confusing interface and so > on. Well there is a bit of an interesting give and take here and it should be talked about. The people who complain about a player being slow to load are not the people that are really in the target any more its people who want more features but dont care if it takes 2-20 seconds to open. Also along that line if it has a confusing interface that should also be looked at and also wouldnt having 1 media player be helpful because at least they would have a consistant interface for everything? For every argument against banshee as the one and only player you could argue a good few positives to switching in my opinion. The biggest positive I see and maybe not everyone would view it this way is just the library support, I know totem supports playlists but it isnt really the same. In many ways using totem is really just using nautilus in banshee you could have it pulling in all of your music and video and bypass the file browser which is a huge win for users. I would support having a simplified version maybe for when video is being played but I really dont know if it would be that much of a performance gain or a user interface gain. Id say that should be discussed if we do end up going this way. Anyway id hate to start a huge debate on shipping a simpler video player vs a more complicated one but I think we should be thinking about it. Shane -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: [Desktop12.04-Topic] Desktop sound theme,effects?
On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 7:43 PM, Sebastien Bacher wrote: > Hey, > > That's a small topic, but the current sound theme and effects are not > great, the "sound effect" configuration tab doesn't make lot of sense > either. Would somebody be interested to pick up on that and improvement > it next cycle? We were also speaking about disabling the startup sound > so it would be nice to have an easy way to turn it back on for those who > like it ;-) > > Cheers, > Sebastien Bacher Hey Seb, To be honest id love if we got a completely new sound theme that is more discrete and reflects the style of the clean and modern style of the desktop currently. I think its something that should definitely be talked about. Shane -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: [Oneiric-Topic] Default Browser
Hi Chris, Maybe I was presuming a bit of things :) >> Firefox I don't think ever fit in because of XUL. > > I'd like to know why you think Firefox won't ever fit in because of XUL? > After all, it's just another toolkit (like QT is just another toolkit, > or perhaps you think that QT wouldn't fit in too?), and Firefox does > actually render platform native widgets in most cases. In any case, I > think Firefox fits in pretty well in Natty, and I'd be interested to > know what you think currently stands out. Well what I mean but it will never fit in is its not really like using GTK and having all those looks for free. I didn't say that Firefox doesn't look great in natty but when you go down past the main interface to the preferences or the history it doesn't really look or behave like a native app. As for Qt it does actually fit in quite well at the moment if you compare apps side by side in terms of look with the same content on each window. They are just toolkits but there is a difference between each of them and it is noticeable in the finer details but I suppose for the regular user they wouldn't notice it too much so ill withdraw that point. >> It takes a lot of work every release to get the plugin going to make Firefox >> act in some >> way like a regular addition to the desktop. > > As the Firefox maintainer in Ubuntu, this is news to me - perhaps I'm > missing something? Ok I admit I was putting words in your mouth there but what I meant was it would be a lot more effort maintaining the big plugin release to release rather than if we could send a patch to epiphany for instance and that would be in the upstream. (Im just presuming some stuff here though and you said its not a big thing to maintain so its cool :) ) > >> Also on integration issue >> it also isn't integrated with unity with quicklists and all that kind >> of thing. > > Well, it's already integrated with the global menu. In addition to this, > I'm going to be doing work on integrating it with the launcher in Unity > next cycle. However, a spec or some suggestions of useful things I could > do with quicklists would be welcome. Cool look forward to giving it a try next release. > What else is missing? > > >> Maintaining the plugin for >> Firefox and adding more bits to it every time and working around >> compatibility stuff and having to keep the 2 packages going is a lot >> more effort than just patching something once and shipping it. > > Same response as the one to your similar comment above ;) So good to get proven wrong about some of the stuff but still I don't withdraw the suggestion about Epiphany. And I think my point above about the look still stands up a bit if you compare the preferences window for firefox and for any other application shipped in Ubuntu today. --fagan -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: [Oneiric-Topic] Default Browser
>> Please note, I was suggesting not having Firefox or Chromium as the >> default, but a webkit based browser with a normal release cycle like >> Epiphany (which uses webkitgtk :)). Hey all, Well there are two ways you can look at this. 1. Recognized brands like Chrome and Firefox which most people would have heard of that users would know. 2. Other smaller browsers that you can brand as just web browser in the interface and as long as its working with flash and other things like that users would be happy. >From the default users standpoint I don't think there is much difference between most of the browsers so we should just choose the best in terms of interface, integration into the platform and also maintainability. So what I think about the state of things at the moment is we cant use Chromium because it doesn't fit in well as that it doesn't fit into the default feel of Unity because it has 1 big menu and the fact it doesn't match the default theme by default but we can fix that easy enough. Also at the moment it doesn't use any of unity's features but that can also be fixed pretty easy. Firefox I don't think ever fit in because of XUL. It takes a lot of work every release to get the plugin going to make Firefox act in some way like a regular addition to the desktop. Also on integration issue it also isn't integrated with unity with quicklists and all that kind of thing. NOTE: If we change to Thunderbird as the default email id say we should stick with Firefox since it would save space while still keeping the level of application high. Epiphany, ok here is where things get interesting. I think if we were thinking in the most integrated way we could ship Epiphany and brand it as Web Browser and have a nice icon and change the default interface a little to make it nicer to use. Its already integrated in the look and a lot of nice things in Gnome (keyring, GTK, theming..etc) and Unity(menu bars, the new scroll bars probably and wouldn't take much to integrate and patch for the missing bits). I don't know about how responsive the upstream developers are to patches but we could fork it and maintain it a lot easier than the way we are maintaining Firefox at the moment. Maintaining the plugin for Firefox and adding more bits to it every time and working around compatibility stuff and having to keep the 2 packages going is a lot more effort than just patching something once and shipping it. I think using Epiphany would be best long term since we can mold the pieces in and make it feel great to use with Unity with quick lists, progress bars for downloads, maybe a web lense, maybe making a nice all in one download manager like what was talked about at the last UDS. It would be something we can have a lot more control over to make the best overall experience for users and since the web is an important part of the desktop for the majority of users we should be really aiming for that. The downside of Epiphany and it is a big one is the extensions compared for Firefox and Chromium are almost non existent and id bet that wont change in the future very soon. Also if a user wants to use a bigger name browser it does add that extra step to their install process but maybe we could have an optional screen in the installer for to auto install the preferred browser for the user? Hope that big long rant helps :) --fagan -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: OpenShot instead of PiTiVi
Hey Jono, I think someone mentioned it before but at the time it looked really bad and its a lot bigger than pitivi if I remember correctly since pitivi only needs a few libs on top of what we already have so on the disk its tiny. I suppose we could switch to openshot but since space is starting to dry up fast and we are trying to keep things small so we can fit Qt on the disk I dont know. --fagan On Mon, 2011-02-14 at 17:26 -0800, Jono Bacon wrote: > Hi All, > > Recently I have been using OpenShot with some good success. While there > are some crasher issues, it seems the app demonstrates a great feature > set and good meet the needs of our users well. It currently has 4/5 in > the Ubuntu Software Center. > > I wanted to check in and see if there has been any assessment of whether > OpenShot would be a better choice than PiTiVi for the CD? I suspect the > dependency chain is greater, which may cause disk space issues, but I > wasn't sure if anyone has had this discussion (maybe at a UDS?) before? > > Jono > > -- > Jono Bacon > Ubuntu Community Manager > jono(at)ubuntu(dot)com > www.ubuntu.com : www.jonobacon.org > www.twitter.com/jonobacon : www.identi.ca/jonobacon > > -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: LibreOffice project: request for contributors and mentoring
Hey David, Im sure there would be volunteers from the ubuntu-art team you should forward it over there. https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-art --fagan On Wed, 2010-11-10 at 16:35 +0800, David Nelson wrote: > Hi, :-) > > I'm a member of the LibreOffice community. LibreOffice (LibO) is the > office suite project of The Document Foundation (TDF), the > community-driven organization that recently forked from the > Oracle-managed OpenOffice.org project. > > TDF/LibO is currently working on its branding and on its artwork for > the LibreOffice distribution. We are currently very short of GRAPHIC > ARTISTS. > > Notably, right now, we urgently need creative talent to help us design > artwork for our websites. We need to develop a logo, and - hopefully - > a MASCOT along the lines of Linux's Tux, to act as a "living" > ambassador that achieves lasting recognition of our brand and products > in people's minds. > > But we also need talent to work on icon sets and other artwork on an > ongoing basis. > > A number of Linux distributions have announced their intention to ship > LibreOffice with their future releases. We know that they frequently > do re-branding work to integrate their chosen office suite in lines > with their project's thinking. > > So we are keen to involve you in our project branding and development, > so that we ship releases that better fit your needs. > > LibreOffice and The Document Foundation could also benefit from > MENTORING and from close and ongoing involvement from established > Linux projects, especially in these early days when we are developing > our infrastructure and organization. > > Like you, we passionately value and believe in Free Open Source > software (FOSS). > > We very much ask you to get involved in our project and influence our > development. We seek your comments and advice and contributions. For > this, below you will find a number of links as a starting point: > > Useful links > === > > LibreOffice marketing mailing list: marketing+subscr...@libreoffice.org > > The Document Foundation general discussions mailing list: > discuss+subscr...@documentfoundation.org > > LibreOffice developers mailing list: > http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice > > TDF steering committee discussions mailing list: > steering-discuss+subscr...@documentfoundation.org > > LibreOffice user support mailing list: users+subscr...@libreoffice.org > > Our Nabble gateway for easy mailing list browsing: > http://www.documentfoundation.org/nabble/ > > The Document Foundation contacts page: > http://www.documentfoundation.org/contact/ > > Mail address distributing to all TDF press and media contacts: > i...@documentfoundation.org > > LibreOffice dedicated IRC channel: #libreoffice at irc.freenode.net > > TDF dedicated IRC channel: #documentfoundation at irc.freenode.net > > Follow TDF via @docufoundation on Twitter: http://twitter.com/docufoundation > > Follow TDF via @docufoundation on identi.ca: http://identi.ca/docufoundation > > Visit the TDF website: http://www.documentfoundation.org > > > Pages showing our work in progress > = > > http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Branding > > http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Ideas > > > Plus, of course, if necessary, you can contact me, too, at the address > from which this mail was sent, or via this mailing list. > > Thank you for your time reading this message. Thank you, also, for > your own valuable work in bringing the world Open Source software. > > David Nelson > -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: Tweet Deck in the repo?
Hm whats the process to get into the partner repo (just out of interest)? On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 3:53 PM, Rick Spencer wrote: > On Thu, 2010-08-19 at 15:47 +0100, Shane Fagan wrote: > > Interesting I knew the Air installer would have to be packaged like > > Flash is installed. > > On the Tweetdeck what repo would it fit into or would it fit into that > > new cool apps repo(or whatever they are calling it)? > If it's not FLOSS, then it has to come through partner. > > Cheers, Rick > > > > > > > --fagan > > > > On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 3:30 PM, Jeremy Bicha > > wrote: > > Well you'd first need to get Adobe Air into the partner > > repository. > > But I don't believe TweetDeck is open source either so it > > couldn't be > > in the normal repos either. > > > > Jeremy Bicha > > > > > > On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 4:53 PM, Shane Fagan > > wrote: > > > Hey all, > > > I was wondering if there is any way we can package Tweet > > Deck or any other > > > adobe air application for the repo? > > > Im just wondering if there is any licencing problems with > > having it in > > > there. > > > (It would be a really good addition IMO) > > > --fagan > > > > > -- > > > ubuntu-desktop mailing list > > > ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com > > > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: Tweet Deck in the repo?
Interesting I knew the Air installer would have to be packaged like Flash is installed. On the Tweetdeck what repo would it fit into or would it fit into that new cool apps repo(or whatever they are calling it)? --fagan On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 3:30 PM, Jeremy Bicha wrote: > Well you'd first need to get Adobe Air into the partner repository. > But I don't believe TweetDeck is open source either so it couldn't be > in the normal repos either. > > Jeremy Bicha > > On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 4:53 PM, Shane Fagan > wrote: > > Hey all, > > I was wondering if there is any way we can package Tweet Deck or any > other > > adobe air application for the repo? > > Im just wondering if there is any licencing problems with having it in > > there. > > (It would be a really good addition IMO) > > --fagan > > -- > > ubuntu-desktop mailing list > > ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com > > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop > > > > > -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Tweet Deck in the repo?
Hey all, I was wondering if there is any way we can package Tweet Deck or any other adobe air application for the repo? Im just wondering if there is any licencing problems with having it in there. (It would be a really good addition IMO) --fagan -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: I want to contribute
Hey Henrik, Well there is a few things you can do if you can do UI and stuff id recommend you look at ubuntu's launchpad bugs[0] or Gnome bugzilla[1] and submit patches to fix bugs that you think you can fix. --fagan [0] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu [1] https://bugzilla.gnome.org On Sat, 2010-07-17 at 10:40 +, Henrik null wrote: > Hi! > > My name is Henrik. I have almost two years of experience of > object-oriented programming and feel comfortable with Java, C#/C++, > Python, MATLAB, GTK and Java Swing. Next month I will start my > education to Master of Science in Engeneering at the Royal Institute > of Technology in Sweden. > > I would like to contribute as a developer/programmer by writing code > for a Ubuntu Desktop project. I could do anything from building a GUI > to writing a class for a specific problem. I am hoping joining a > Ubuntu Desktop project as a developer will improve my programming > skills. > > Have I posted in the right mailing list? > Are there any projects I can join? > Are there any tasks for me? > > Yours sincerely > Henrik > sp...@hotmail.com > > > > __ > > Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service. Get it now. -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: Rhythmbox question.
Hey, You would have to ask on the rhythmbox list http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/rhythmbox-devel The lossless wma files is a gstreamer thing but I thought it already works but I dont use those files so I wouldnt know myself. --fagan On Fri, 2010-06-25 at 14:00 -0400, adr...@eastseventh.com wrote: > Hi, > > I wanted to say huge thanks for building the Rhythmbox, the best player > I've ever used, honestly. I just wanted to ask if there is a way to play > lossless wma files, and also if an equalizer will be implemented any > time soon. > > Thanks a lot for your time. > > > > Adrian. > > -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: WebM in Maverick?
On Thu, 2010-05-20 at 09:20 +0200, Sebastian Dröge wrote: > On Thu, 2010-05-20 at 01:21 +0100, Shane Fagan wrote: > > Hey all, > > > > Can we include WebM the new codec from Google in Maverick? I presume > > there would be lots of interest coming for this and integration in the > > desktop and the browser would be great. The Firefox, Chromium and > > gstreamer (ffmpeg) trunks have landed with code by now. The main benefit > > from including this would be Youtube without flash. I really hope we can > > land it as soon as we can. > > FWIW, packages for lucid are here: > https://launchpad.net/~gstreamer-developers/+archive/ppa/+packages?field.name_filter=&field.status_filter=published&field.series_filter=lucid > > These are/will be uploaded to Debian soonish too (libvpx is waiting in > Debian's NEW queue). Oh sorry for posting twice I closed evolution halfway through sending it :) What I meant was can we ship it in the default codec pack with theora, FLAC, vorbis...etc? It seems Google picked a BSD style licence for the spec http://webmproject.org/license/software/ Its still in heavy development but I would like if we can get it in Maverick as soon as soon as it hits the Debian repo. --fagan -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
WebM in Maverick?
Hey all, Can we include WebM the new codec from Google in Maverick? I presume there would be lots of interest coming for this and integration in the desktop and the browser would be great. The Firefox, Chromium and gstreamer (ffmpeg) trunks have landed with code by now. The main benefit from including this would be Youtube without flash. I really hope we can land it as soon as we can. --fagan -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
WebM in Maverick?
Hey all, Can we include WebM the new codec from Google in Maverick? I presume there would be lots of interest coming for this and it is going to be added to gstreamer (if it hasnt been already). --fagan -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: Should gnome-panels enable_animations key be true by default?
On Thu, 2010-04-22 at 00:49 +0200, Jo-Erlend Schinstad wrote: > Why are we animating everything? Does it make Ubuntu look cool and > professional when the panels slide into the screen at login? I don't > think so. I think it looks cheap, especially since it doesn't always > work as intended. It also makes our desktop less useful for > terminalserver environments, which I think is a very important stage > for Ubuntu to shine. My question is written in the subject. My > personal opinion is that no, > /apps/panel/toplevels/panelname/enable_animations should be false by > default. > > What do you think? > > Jo-Erlend Schinstad > Hey Jo, Good point but really I dont think anyone would feel strongly about it. Plus its a little late in the release to be changing things even as small as this. So maybe (if the panel is still there) we could talk about setting it to false in 10.10, so talk about it when that cycle has started. -fagan -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Flash 10 prerelease in lucid
Hey all, I know its a little late but I was wondering if we could package Adobe Flash 10 in lucid. Its in RC at the moment but it fixes the old issue for 64bit[1]. I think its worth pushing to get it in Lucid and ive tested it and its quite stable and it is a lot better than using the 32bit flash in 64bit. Anyhow im not pushing it but it would be nice. Regards Shane Fagan [1] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nspluginwrapper/+bug/141613 -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: 10.10 plans for gnome-panel rollback
Hey Rick, Well ill be missing this UDS because of college tests but ill more than likely be listening in so ill chat about it then. Oh and on the Shell appropriateness I think it will be ready in time but I dont expect it to be perfect but I still think it would be the right time to include it even if serious testing is needed. Anyhow I just thought id mention it anyway, cheers and congrats on 10.04 to all :) --fagan On Fri, 2010-04-02 at 14:30 -0700, Rick Spencer wrote: > Shane, > > This is a discussion we will have at UDS. At the moment, looking at the > Shell release schedule, and current state, I am doubtful that it will be > appropriate for use as a default in 10.10. Of course, we will continue > to deliver shell as an option, as we we have since 9.10. > > However, that is only my view and my view at this time. This is > fundamentally a discussion for UDS. > > Cheers, Rick > > > On Fri, 2010-04-02 at 22:18 +0100, Shane Fagan wrote: > > Hi all, > > > > I was wondering if we are going to ship Gnome Shell as the default > > desktop UI what will we do for people who havent the hardware to run > > Shell. Going by my quick tests of Shell so far you need a computer at > > most 4 years old to run it. > > So for people who have 4 years+ could we put a Gnome-Panel-Session > > package in the archive for a rollback? (I know its a little early to be > > talking about 10.10 but I thought id share the idea before I forgot > > it :) ) > > > > Regards > > Shane Fagan > > > > > > -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
10.10 plans for gnome-panel rollback
Hi all, I was wondering if we are going to ship Gnome Shell as the default desktop UI what will we do for people who havent the hardware to run Shell. Going by my quick tests of Shell so far you need a computer at most 4 years old to run it. So for people who have 4 years+ could we put a Gnome-Panel-Session package in the archive for a rollback? (I know its a little early to be talking about 10.10 but I thought id share the idea before I forgot it :) ) Regards Shane Fagan -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: Review of featured applications
On Fri, 2010-03-26 at 03:27 +, Arand Nash wrote: > On Fri, Mar 26, 2010 at 2:44 AM, Krzysztof Klimonda > wrote: > > > > On Fri, 2010-03-26 at 02:16 +, Arand Nash wrote: > > > I've tested both openarena and nexuiz. > > What about Warsow? I've found it the most compelling from all three > > games. It has a nice graphics and some nice concepts. I'm not sure if it > > has bots though. > > > > Tested Warsow just now, and it does indeed have boots, however in the > starting screen of "local game" you will have to put in the number of > bots in the settings yourself. > Also, the single-player is mainly Skirmish (pick a level, pick some > bots), so I would assume not as straightforward as that of OA or NX. > It has a very nice audio/demo tutorial though. > I dont think we can suggest Warsow because its non free software. I think we should look at everything else first then if all the rest have been ruled out then we can look at Warsow. -Fagan -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: Review of featured applications
On Fri, 2010-03-26 at 14:22 +1100, Robert Ancell wrote: > On 26/03/10 14:05, Shane Fagan wrote: > >> - Remove Eclipse > >> - Huge download > >> - Only supports Java out of the box > >> - The Eclipse brand is strong enough that it doesn't need promoting > >> > > Im going to go out on the limb and suggest we replace it with > > Monodevelop it supports mono,java,python,valaetc although require > > the user to install the support for each language. > > > My review of all the supplied IDEs showed MonoDevelop to appear to be > the easiest to use, but: > - I've never used an IDE for any significant period of time > - I didn't use any of the proposed IDEs to do more that write a hello > world program. > > We need to consider what sort of user clicks on featured applications > and which users would benefit from the suggested IDE. > My experience of IDE users is: > - They're generally passionate users who have a preferred IDE (much > like text editors for non-IDE programmers). So by suggesting an IDE > we're targeting people who haven't already chosen an IDE. > - IDEs tend be a part of a developer package. If we suggest > MonoDevelop will users link well to documentation and the developer > community? Or will it just be a fancy text editor/compiler? > > Saying it in a simpler way: > - Will an IDE encourage people to learn programming? > - Will opportunistic developers be able to use it to complete their > desired project? > - Will experienced developers find the suggested IDE helpful or will > they already use their existing IDE/do the research themselves? > > Well no it wouldnt encourage people to learn programming. Hmmm I dont think there is any good python IDE for the opportunistic developer. I dont think many experienced developers use IDEs too much. The ones I know in development companies use eclipse (or different flavors of eclipse) or text editors. I use netbeans in college but for python I use gedit. -Fagan -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: Review of featured applications
Makes sense Rick, I agree with that. Hmmm maybe for lucid+1 we might be able to detect if they have installed development tools before and suggest some in featured applications. -Fagan On Thu, 2010-03-25 at 20:18 -0700, Rick Spencer wrote: > Shane, good thought, but I don't think any developer tools are > interesting for featured applications. The Featured section is not > geared to a developer user, so I think we should just pull out Eclipse > and leave it at that. > > Cheers, Rick > > On Fri, 2010-03-26 at 03:05 +, Shane Fagan wrote: > > > - Remove Eclipse > > >- Huge download > > >- Only supports Java out of the box > > >- The Eclipse brand is strong enough that it doesn't need promoting > > Im going to go out on the limb and suggest we replace it with > > Monodevelop it supports mono,java,python,valaetc although require > > the user to install the support for each language. > > > > -Fagan > > > > > > -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: Review of featured applications
> - Remove Eclipse >- Huge download >- Only supports Java out of the box >- The Eclipse brand is strong enough that it doesn't need promoting Im going to go out on the limb and suggest we replace it with Monodevelop it supports mono,java,python,valaetc although require the user to install the support for each language. -Fagan -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: Review of featured applications
> I've tested both openarena and nexuiz. Nexuiz is dying upstream from what I hear so I wouldnt feature it myself. The development team had a big split recently and a lot of the developers are making forks of it. So id say Open Arena would be a lot more suitable long term. Id love to get a rating system (like 18+ for games with gore or shooting) for games I think that would be a good work item for lucid+1. It would be cool if we could list the game content too like how they do it on commercial games so like here http://www.esrb.org/ratings/ratings_guide.jsp Just a thought :) Shane Fagan -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: Google Chromium In Lucid
> Chrome [maximized] is designed to work well when there is no panel at > the top. Seems it was designed keeping in mind only Windows and > ChromeOS. > > When there is no top panel the user can hit the top edge of the > screen[event though there is gap of a few pixels above the tabs] and > change tabs, this is a good design when considered for Windows and > ChromeOS. > But this is obviously not possible in Linux since we use a panel at the > top. > You are able to use the default top panels, its just turned off by default. Shane -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: Google Chromium In Lucid
> I do agree that it would be pretty rash to jump on this for Lucid+1, > unless something amazing happens, because Chromium is really very new. > Development on Lucid+2 would begin a bit after ChromeOS's official > appearance in the real world. At that point Chromium would be thoroughly > tested and debugged. We could confidently expect Google's ongoing > commitment to the browser's Linux version, in particular, as a stable > product. > > I think it would be worthwhile if there was a commitment to properly > discuss the default browser choice awhile planning Lucid+2, or something > along those lines. It could act as strong incentive for Mozilla to do > better where Firefox currently loses to Chromium in Linux. With that, > the geniuses at Mozilla could pull a rabbit out of a hat, returning > their browser to its rightful place in my heart :) I disagree because gnome 3 is coming in lucid+1 (probably) I think the opportune time would be then. We should redesign in one swoop and I think because Chrome OS is coming I think the browser will have a lot of eyes on the code. So development would be swift and bug fixes will come with that. The release after an LTS should be a major feature release because lots of new stable releases are being brought in anyway so why not go all out and include some innovation. I think Firefox is awesome but Chrome uses better technology (webkit is far better than gecko) and it has not one major company looking at it, it has hundreds from google, apple, acer, dell..etc. So testing and innovation wont be a problem. Id like to revisit this conversation when Google releases a stable release of chrome on the platforms ubuntu supports. There is no point asking for it in this release of ubuntu its not ready, there is no point talking about it until the next UDS. Ill gladly support its inclusion then. Regards Shane Fagan -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: Google Chromium In Lucid
I would agree but this should be a lucid+1 discussion because chrome isnt even out for linux yet. Im all for chromes inclusion though because its simply faster than firefox and most things work already. Also we have the added advantage of webkit desktop applications too which would be a nice addition. Shane Fagan On Sat, 2009-12-12 at 18:31 -0500, John Baer wrote: > I've been a loyal Firefox user for many years and until I tested the > new Google Chrome browser everything paled in comparison. > > > IMO Ubuntu should adopt Chrome as the default browser. > > > The general adoption of Chrome will be quick as Google has a vested > interest in it's success. I blogged on this topic at projBlog but here > are the high points. > * Google is big and Google is pro open source. Supporting this > effort provides value to Ubuntu > * Chrome runs well on Ubuntu > * Chrome will be well supported > This time next year it is very likely Google will be well established > in the Net Book Cloud Computing market which IMO will grow Ubuntu in > the desktop market. > > > Cheers -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: Call for Lucid testing: GTK enhancements
I upgraded to lucid again to get some tracebacks and logs for the errors so if I have a few to show. Most programs are crashing with the same error after installing the ppa with the UI enhancements. Gdk-ERROR **: The program 'totem' received an X Window System error. This probably reflects a bug in the program. The error was 'BadMatch (invalid parameter attributes)'. (Details: serial 1067 error_code 8 request_code 1 minor_code 0) (Note to programmers: normally, X errors are reported asynchronously; that is, you will receive the error a while after causing it. To debug your program, run it with the --sync command line option to change this behavior. You can then get a meaningful backtrace from your debugger if you break on the gdk_x_error() function.) aborting... Trace/breakpoint trap Thats the main error im getting at the moment. If someone could tell me what else to look for id be happy to give some more info. On Sat, 2009-12-12 at 01:18 +0100, Kenneth Wimer wrote: > On Friday 11 December 2009 11:57:06 pm Adam Petaccia wrote: > > On Tue, 2009-12-08 at 13:44 -0500, Ken VanDine wrote: > > > Hello Desktoppers! > > > > > > The Ayatana team has been working on some GTK enhancements for Lucid. > > > Adding support for Client Side window decorations and enabling RGBA > > > color maps by default. We have uploaded a patched version of gtk which > > > adds these features to the ~ubuntu-desktop team PPA (along with a needed > > > fix for nautilus to go along with it). > > > > > > The new decorations feature requires explicit support from a theme > > > before it becomes active (it defaults to being disabled). However, RGBA > > > support is enabled by default and there is a chance for some fallout > > > from this being added. > > > > Can you provide the names or links to these themes? I know murrine > > (murrine-themes) provides some RGBA support, but I don't know which > > which themes necessarily enable it by default. But I don't know anything > > about this decorations feature. > > We haven't gotten that far yet! The initial rgba code was for testing and I > think we've received a good response so far. The real changes are in gtk, not > in the theme engine itself (outside of the extra definitions which become > possible through these changes). The murrine rgba support is amazing, but > something completely different than what we are discussing here. This change > enables us to offer rgba support per widget class, something completely new > and > different. > > Understand that this effort is not about expanding a theme engine but about > changing gtk itself (which changes what theme engines can offer). It is a > much > more substantial effort than one would assume. > > I've been running this stuff on my laptop and have noticed problems with > nautilus but I don't think it is anything we cannot fix. Wide-spread testing > has identified some other issues which need to be fixed but all in all I > think > that we are progressing well. > > We need to make sure it works without the rgba bits turned on beforehand - so > far that testing is going well :) Consider this the pre-alpha release of some > code we really need to test quickly and thoroughly at a very pre-release > level. > > Adding the important bits to the theme is simple, once we decide how :p > > -- > Kenneth > -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
Re: Call for Lucid testing: GTK enhancements
Hey desktop team, I dont know if it was the nvidia drivers breaking in lucid or the GTK enhancements but I had some major problems after I installed the desktop team's ppa. So many things went wrong at once I couldnt get any tracebacks or logs ill try the new decorations in jaunty and see if it breaks. Regards Shane Fagan On Sat, 2009-12-12 at 01:18 +0100, Kenneth Wimer wrote: > On Friday 11 December 2009 11:57:06 pm Adam Petaccia wrote: > > On Tue, 2009-12-08 at 13:44 -0500, Ken VanDine wrote: > > > Hello Desktoppers! > > > > > > The Ayatana team has been working on some GTK enhancements for Lucid. > > > Adding support for Client Side window decorations and enabling RGBA > > > color maps by default. We have uploaded a patched version of gtk which > > > adds these features to the ~ubuntu-desktop team PPA (along with a needed > > > fix for nautilus to go along with it). > > > > > > The new decorations feature requires explicit support from a theme > > > before it becomes active (it defaults to being disabled). However, RGBA > > > support is enabled by default and there is a chance for some fallout > > > from this being added. > > > > Can you provide the names or links to these themes? I know murrine > > (murrine-themes) provides some RGBA support, but I don't know which > > which themes necessarily enable it by default. But I don't know anything > > about this decorations feature. > > We haven't gotten that far yet! The initial rgba code was for testing and I > think we've received a good response so far. The real changes are in gtk, not > in the theme engine itself (outside of the extra definitions which become > possible through these changes). The murrine rgba support is amazing, but > something completely different than what we are discussing here. This change > enables us to offer rgba support per widget class, something completely new > and > different. > > Understand that this effort is not about expanding a theme engine but about > changing gtk itself (which changes what theme engines can offer). It is a > much > more substantial effort than one would assume. > > I've been running this stuff on my laptop and have noticed problems with > nautilus but I don't think it is anything we cannot fix. Wide-spread testing > has identified some other issues which need to be fixed but all in all I > think > that we are progressing well. > > We need to make sure it works without the rgba bits turned on beforehand - so > far that testing is going well :) Consider this the pre-alpha release of some > code we really need to test quickly and thoroughly at a very pre-release > level. > > Adding the important bits to the theme is simple, once we decide how :p > > -- > Kenneth > -- ubuntu-desktop mailing list ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
