Another end-user view of showstoppers etc
Hi folks, First of all - I am your putative end-user. I bought my Thinkpad R61i from Linux Emporium with standard 8.04 Desktop preinstalled (off Canonical's repos - not a downstream version like Mint or Dell's own), and only use software out of Canonical's official repos. I'm also going to be VERY nervous when it comes to a major version upgrade, to the point where I might end up buying a new laptop if replacing the OS didn't go swimmingly. In fact, during a phone conversation with LE, they generally recommend clean reinstalls for major OS upgrades. It's therefore obvious that I'm an LTS-LTS user, and would be too scared to step away from that - although some laptops in LE's range have had to have the most recent regular release put on them as earlier versions wouldn't start or notice all the hardware. Ubuntu is becoming more known by the mainstream - we end-users just want machines that *work*. Might some slight changes into how certain enhancements are introduced be an idea? For example - is new hardware support regularly SRU'd back into the current LTS release, after decent QA? Or is it the case that if there was hardware that was newer than the release level (eg if I bought a new lappie and managed to get a restricted level of functionality with Hardy..) I would have to wait a year for a new component to start working? But it's scary to see showstoppers (or what we users would see as showstoppers) going into a Gold release, rather than spinning a revised RC. The last thing Canonical needs is for Karmic to be its KDE 4.0, considering all the bad press that caused. Maybe the idea of the 6-month releases being advertised as major development milestones is one to consider. All I am saying is please don't let Lucid break my machine when I come to upgrade to it around July next year... Just thoughts from one of your user community. Alex Cockell -- Alex Cockell Reading, Berks, UK alcock...@eclipse.co.uk -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Another end-user view of showstoppers etc
On Thu, Oct 29, 2009 at 2:14 AM, Alex Cockell alcock...@eclipse.co.uk wrote: Hi folks, First of all - I am your putative end-user. I bought my Thinkpad R61i from Linux Emporium with standard 8.04 Desktop preinstalled (off Canonical's repos - not a downstream version like Mint or Dell's own), and only use software out of Canonical's official repos. I'm also going to be VERY nervous when it comes to a major version upgrade, to the point where I might end up buying a new laptop if replacing the OS didn't go swimmingly. In fact, during a phone conversation with LE, they generally recommend clean reinstalls for major OS upgrades. It's therefore obvious that I'm an LTS-LTS user, and would be too scared to step away from that - although some laptops in LE's range have had to have the most recent regular release put on them as earlier versions wouldn't start or notice all the hardware. Ubuntu is becoming more known by the mainstream - we end-users just want machines that *work*. Might some slight changes into how certain enhancements are introduced be an idea? For example - is new hardware support regularly SRU'd back into the current LTS release, after decent QA? Or is it the case that if there was hardware that was newer than the release level (eg if I bought a new lappie and managed to get a restricted level of functionality with Hardy..) I would have to wait a year for a new component to start working? But it's scary to see showstoppers (or what we users would see as showstoppers) going into a Gold release, rather than spinning a revised RC. The last thing Canonical needs is for Karmic to be its KDE 4.0, considering all the bad press that caused. Maybe the idea of the 6-month releases being advertised as major development milestones is one to consider. All I am saying is please don't let Lucid break my machine when I come to upgrade to it around July next year... Just thoughts from one of your user community. Alex Cockell -- Alex Cockell Reading, Berks, UK alcock...@eclipse.co.uk -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss I suggested at least a year ago that modifications be made to the development and maintenance schedule for releases, such as 6 month lifetimes for non-LTS releases, and using LTS-1 releases as the base for LTS instead of syncing with Debian-Unstable. I do truly hope that the next 'new-feature-packed' Ubuntu release is Manic Manatee, as Lucid should be a stabilization period. That said, LTS's do have two beta releases and fewer alphas, which mean longer freeze times and bug fixes instead of frantically uploading the latest daily tar.gz of any given piece of software. In theory. Your point about SRU'ing hardware support to LTS is well taken by me, but I don't understand. Are you implying something is wrong with Karmic, or are you simply stating your dissatisfaction with hardware support in Hardy? -- Luke L. -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Another end-user view of showstoppers etc
As it is kinda issue I have always raised, I think biggest problem is inconsistent hardware support. Not poor, but inconsistent. Hardware section is where most regressions shows their ugly heads. But this require bigger, more coordinated effort between distros and kernel developers. It is also bad that if you check hardware which worked before, and it doesn't work for example in Karmic, you have really small changes that it will work. Unfortunately kernel is slow and hardware check at least for selected general devices should be done on regular basis. Cheers, Peter. 2009/10/29 Alex Cockell alcock...@eclipse.co.uk: Hi folks, First of all - I am your putative end-user. I bought my Thinkpad R61i from Linux Emporium with standard 8.04 Desktop preinstalled (off Canonical's repos - not a downstream version like Mint or Dell's own), and only use software out of Canonical's official repos. I'm also going to be VERY nervous when it comes to a major version upgrade, to the point where I might end up buying a new laptop if replacing the OS didn't go swimmingly. In fact, during a phone conversation with LE, they generally recommend clean reinstalls for major OS upgrades. It's therefore obvious that I'm an LTS-LTS user, and would be too scared to step away from that - although some laptops in LE's range have had to have the most recent regular release put on them as earlier versions wouldn't start or notice all the hardware. Ubuntu is becoming more known by the mainstream - we end-users just want machines that *work*. Might some slight changes into how certain enhancements are introduced be an idea? For example - is new hardware support regularly SRU'd back into the current LTS release, after decent QA? Or is it the case that if there was hardware that was newer than the release level (eg if I bought a new lappie and managed to get a restricted level of functionality with Hardy..) I would have to wait a year for a new component to start working? But it's scary to see showstoppers (or what we users would see as showstoppers) going into a Gold release, rather than spinning a revised RC. The last thing Canonical needs is for Karmic to be its KDE 4.0, considering all the bad press that caused. Maybe the idea of the 6-month releases being advertised as major development milestones is one to consider. All I am saying is please don't let Lucid break my machine when I come to upgrade to it around July next year... Just thoughts from one of your user community. Alex Cockell -- Alex Cockell Reading, Berks, UK alcock...@eclipse.co.uk -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss -- mortigi tempo Pēteris Krišjānis -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
File system has incompatible feature enabled....
Compatible features are has_journal, dir_index, filetype, sparse_super and large_file. Use tune2fs or debugfs to remove features. I don't see in the mkfs.ext3 man page why any existing features should be incompatible. Where's the list of what's compatible? Why doesn't the installer say which feature is incompatible? Why doesn't it say which filesystem has the incompatible feature? I suppose this happens because I preformat prior to installation: mkfs.ext3 -b1024 -I128 -J size=400 -Lkubuntu -m1 /dev/sda12 tune2fs lists these existing features: has_journal ext_attr resize_inode dir_index filetype sparse_super. Size is 3582463 blocks. Last several attempts to install Jaunty Karmic (from netboot mini) results in this stoppage. What's the best procedure to solve it, other than maybe not formatting in advance? I tried: # tune2fs -O ^ext_attr /dev/sda12 tune2fs 1.41.9 (22-Aut-2009) Clearing filesystem feature 'ext_attr' not supported. after which e2fsck, but it didn't help. tune2fs -l afterward still reports ext_attr enabled. I tried mkfs.ext3 -b1024 -I128 -J size=400 -Lkubuntu -m1 /dev/sda12 from tty2, but the same set of features results, including the ext_attr which is not in the supported features list. I finally got around this by setting no partitions for mounting except sda6 swap and sda12 /. Those I unset were sda15 for /home, sda5 for /disks/hda/boot and sdb6 as swap. -- A patriot without religion . . . is as great a paradox, as an honest man without the fear of God. . . . 2nd U.S. President, John Adams Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Is Ubuntu adapted to screen resolution 1024x768?
In this resolution icons of main menus items have sizes bigger than I want. This sizes hard coded in Human theme as gtk-icon-sizes = panel-menu=24,24:gtk-button=16,16. To change this behavior I must edit Human theme. Is this Ubuntu way? -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Herculean setup time waster
I installed to sda12 from the kubuntu alternate karmicRC CD, installed mc, then did apt-get update;apt-get upgrade. The upgrade installed roughly 160 packages. Most of the time spent doing that upgrade, an absurd length, was displaying messages about finding other distributions on other partitions. Why is it that when: 1-Neither Grub nor Lilo is installed to MBR (MBR contains generic boot code) 2-Active partition on first disk is type 0x0A (IBM Boot Manager) 3-*buntu / is installed to a logical partition the installation configurator and apt-get upgrade find it necessary to configure Grub to boot anything other than the *buntu version it is installing or upgrading? My /boot/grub/grub.cfg file is an insane 19,985 bytes! http://fm.no-ip.com/tmp/Linux/grub-karmic-gx150.cfg BTW is my post-upgrade version. Neither apparently get used. Booting from IBM BM to the Kubuntu sda12 / partition just gives a Grub prompt. To actually boot Kubuntu I have to set root, kernel and initrd from the Grub prompt each time. -- A patriot without religion . . . is as great a paradox, as an honest man without the fear of God. . . . 2nd U.S. President, John Adams Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://fm.no-ip.com/ -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Another end-user view of showstoppers etc
Hi Luke, and list... On Thu, 2009-10-29 at 03:04 -0500, Luke L wrote: I suggested at least a year ago that modifications be made to the development and maintenance schedule for releases, such as 6 month lifetimes for non-LTS releases, and using LTS-1 releases as the base for LTS instead of syncing with Debian-Unstable. I do truly hope that the next 'new-feature-packed' Ubuntu release is Manic Manatee, as Lucid should be a stabilization period. Sounds wise to me. That said, LTS's do have two beta releases and fewer alphas, which mean longer freeze times and bug fixes instead of frantically uploading the latest daily tar.gz of any given piece of software. In theory. Your point about SRU'ing hardware support to LTS is well taken by me, but I don't understand. Are you implying something is wrong with Karmic, or are you simply stating your dissatisfaction with hardware support in Hardy? Not my issue personally, but one thing my vendor mentioned. One of the guys at LE mentioned that laptop hardware changes so quickly that sometimes older versions can't be booted on them... while buying turnkey kit allows for the more recent versions to be rolled out - it can mean that people who don't buy when an LTS is rolled can be left with shorter periods before the support finishes. Also - thinking of one of the other responses... I'm an end-user, so would be rather worried about switching on Backports. What I meant by full support is similar to what was done with the Intel display driver around 8.04.2, where the newer driver was released to everyone after EXTREMELY thorough testing. As an end-user, I have -security and -updates enabled, and would not want ot go anywhere near -proposed or -backports - I'm not a tester. I rely on Release Management to do that for me... Just MHO... As long as the next LTS is nice and bulletproof and doesn't have nasty regressions... Thanks for all you're doing.. -- Alex Cockell Reading, Berks, UK alcock...@eclipse.co.uk -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
configuration utility for compiz
I as many users want to try different compiz effects (e.g. 3D desktop). Why wouldn't include configuration utility for this in Ubuntu distribution? I prefer to use compizconfig-settings-manager, but it may be something else. -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
