Fixing Modem Manager in 10.04

[Chandru]

Hi,

I use a Huawei E1260 USB modem (provided by Tata Photon+).  This does not
work out of the box with a stock 10.04 install.  However after installing an
updated version (0.3-0ubuntu4) of modemmanager from
http://ppa.launchpad.net/hardik-dalwadi/ppa/ubuntu, it started working fine.

Is it possible to integrate whatever fix is need from this ppa into the main
repository in a future update to Lucid?

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Re: Remove OO Draw from the default install

[Chandru]

Of all the tools available by default it is the best at
handling diagramming.  Since most of openoffice is included, it shouldn't
add much to the space on the CD.

Unless an equivalent or better diagramming tool is included it is not a good
idea to remove it from the default install.

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On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 4:57 PM, Shane Fagan
wrote:

> Hey all,
>
> I forgot to mention this at the session for default app selection but
> can we remove Open Office Draw from the default ubuntu install? The
> reasons are quite obvious it just isnt any good and I dont think any of
> the regular users actually use it.
>
> --fagan
>
>
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Re: Including a system-wide pulseaudio equalizer

[Chandru]

My suggestion was to just get the app into the official repos initially.
 Based on Daniel's reply I've sent a mail to the developer suggesting him to
submit the application.

If users find it useful they'd at least be able to install and use it
easily.
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On Tue, May 11, 2010 at 1:50 PM, Luke Yelavich  wrote:

> On Tue, May 11, 2010 at 08:15:30AM CEST, Chandru wrote:
> > The default media players in Ubuntu, though quite capable do not have
> > graphical equalizers.  Rather than including an equalizer in every
> > application, having a system wide equalizer can be very handy especially
> > when playing online videos.
>
> I personally think that users will get confused with an EQ. If they find
> it, adjust something, and find sound is not as good, they will file bugs
> regarding sound problems that they have caused.
>
> I personally think we need to think very very carefully about how we
> implement EQ, and whether it is needed by the vast majority of people.
>
> Luke
>
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Including a system-wide pulseaudio equalizer

[Chandru]

The default media players in Ubuntu, though quite capable do not have
graphical equalizers.  Rather than including an equalizer in every
application, having a system wide equalizer can be very handy especially
when playing online videos.

I've been using
https://code.launchpad.net/~psyke83/+junk/pulseaudio-equalizer with Lucid
and found it sufficiently capable.  It will be really nice if this can be
included in universe for Maverick and gradually made available as part of
the default installation in future releases once it gets further polished
with community's feedback.

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Re: Why and why.

[Chandru]

All icons of default applications are moved from notification area to
indicator applet.  This applet ensures that you don't perform any action on
the icon other than clicking it.

It is proposed that from 11.04 the notification area (which allows actions
like opening the window with single click and pausing with middle click)
will be replaced entirely with indicator applet .  So just get used to
clicking more if you continue to use Ubuntu.

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On Sat, May 1, 2010 at 12:08 AM, George Farris wrote:

> HI all,
>
> I just upgraded to 10.04 and Rhythmbox is all messed up.  Why oh why
> when it was working perfectly does some one who presumable never used it
> messes it all up.
>
> First you can no longer click on the icon in the panel and have the app
> toggle to window mode and then back to an icon.  Also one can no longer
> middle click and have it stop playing.
>
> A total removal of features and for what...extra mouse clicks..how
> annoying is that.
>
> I find this type of thing absolutely amazing.
>
> Hope to have this functionality returned soon but.
>
> Was this a mistake or?
>
> Yes much of 10.04 is better but this is just plain weird.
>
> Disgusted.
>
>
>
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Removal of notification area

[Chandru]

If notification area is going to be removed as mentioned in this post,
http://design.canonical.com/2010/04/notification-area/, how will
applications which do not target Ubuntu alone and are not maintained by
Ubuntu developers work?

For example, Skype currently places its icon on the notification area.
 There are also a couple of open-source applications (Exaile for example)
which use the notification area.  Given the fact that these are written for
Linux in general and don't target just Ubuntu, why would they adopt the
Ubuntu way of placing icons, when it won't work on any other distribution?

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Re: A bug of Linux in Ubuntu 10.04

[Chandru]

You seem to have been bitten by this Virtualbox bug.
http://www.virtualbox.org/ticket/6100


The fix is available in the Lucid's Virtualbox .

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On Fri, Mar 26, 2010 at 6:02 PM, Bill Lee  wrote:

> First of all, as a foreign English speaker, I may not be able to express
> myself complete. If you have difficult understand this mail, I feel sorry.
> I ran Ubuntu 10.04 on Virtual Box OSE, and find that the ACPI part of
> Linux Ubuntu 10.04 cannot work with Virtual Box OSE.
> System will hold up when loading Linux kernel. But if I send parameter
> 'acpi=off' to the kernel or disable the ACPI support of the virtual
> machine, the system will work.
> The version of Linux is '2.6.32-16-generic #25-Ubuntu SMP Tue Mar 9
> 16:33:52 UTC 2010'.
> The Virtual Box OSE is running in Ubuntu 9.10 and its version is
> '3.0.8_OSE r53138'.
> Ubuntu 9.10 can work with this version of Virtual Box. So I think this
> problem can be sovled. I wish Lucid LTS will become better.
>
> Best wishes,
> Bill Lee
>
>
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Re: Making notifications close-able

[Chandru]

Empathy does have an option to disable notifications when away or busy.  I'm
wondering about those cases where you do need new message notifications but
would like to close some of them immediately to hide them from the eyes of
someone near you.

Some sort of keyboard shortcut to close currently visible notification
should help.

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On Fri, Mar 26, 2010 at 5:39 PM, Mohammed Bassit wrote:

>
>
>
> > On Fri, Mar 26, 2010 at 07:44, Chandru  wrote:
> > > I understand that notifications are not manually close-able to avoid
> making
> > > the user take a conscious decision about notifications.  However, there
> are
> > > certain cases where user might want to immediately close the
> notification
> > > without waiting for it to time-out (certain chat messages, for
> example).
> >
> > Indeed, I can imagine a case of private messages popping up when
> > you're doing a presentation. It should be possible to quickly get rid
> > of them in such a case.
> >
> > > To handle these cases, can't we allow manual closing of the
> notifications
> > > (say by clicking it) while still retaining the time-out based closing
> to
> > > ensure that the user can still ignore it without any difference?
> >
>
>
>
> > This doesn't work, because part of the design is that you must be able
> > to click behind the notification. A better solution would be to
> > instantly remove the notification if you closed the chat window or the
> > application, or changed your status to busy/invisible/offline.
>
> I know that pidgin has a way to disable notifications when your status
> is not set to available. And it integrates very well with notify-osd.
> Maybe something like that in empathy as well would solve your problem.
>
>
> --
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>
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Making notifications close-able

[Chandru]

I understand that notifications are not manually close-able to avoid making
the user take a conscious decision about notifications.  However, there are
certain cases where user might want to immediately close the notification
without waiting for it to time-out (certain chat messages, for example).

To handle these cases, can't we allow manual closing of the notifications
(say by clicking it) while still retaining the time-out based closing to
ensure that the user can still ignore it without any difference?

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Re: Go-OOO.org?

[Chandru]

Politically, I wonder what is so wrong with JCA.  Apache software foundation
mandates a similar action too.

Technically, Oo.o 3 starts faster than go-oo.  I cannot comment on Excel
formulae.  But I doubt whether switching would really provide any benefit to
Ubuntu, which is worth the effort involved.

On Tue, Dec 30, 2008 at 7:21 AM, John Moser  wrote:

> On Mon, Dec 29, 2008 at 7:29 PM, Andrew Sayers
>  wrote:
> > Speaking as someone with a strictly armchair interest in this topic, I'd
> > like to make a few observations here -
> >
> > The way (non-Sun) people talk about OO.o reminds me of the way people
> > used to talk about the pre-Firefox Mozilla project - worthy and
> > important, but with low developer morale due to an ugly, hostile
> > codebase.  A certain amount of mud will always get slung at a project of
> > OO.o's size, and Sun often have valid excuses for the mud that gets
> > thrown their way, but I've never heard a community member stand up and
> > defend Sun's behaviour, or give examples of how Sun went the extra mile
> > to help them out.  That silence speaks more to me than the noise on the
> > other side.
>
> Political argument.
>
> On that field, are you suggesting +1 for sun's side "This has happened
> before, it's not a disaster, it'll iron itself out;" or -1 for sun's
> side "this happens, but they are handling it particularly bad and
> digging their own grave"?
>
> > Developing a good vocabulary of actions will be important in order to
> > improve the development process without suffering the upheaval that
> > would come from an x.org-style fork.
>
> If it's going the way of X, the better action once it's clear that
> this either can't be reversed or would take far too much effort to do
> so, would be to fork, and (from the sidelines) to encourage or "push"
> a fork.  It's entirely up to each distribution how they decide to play
> politics in this case (see Debian/Iceweasel vs Ubuntu/Firefox, neither
> is "correct" in how they're handling it, it's just the distro
> maintainers' opinions), but they do have that weight and their visible
> actions cause those kinds of shifts.
>
> Up until that point, obviously, we either A) expect that things will
> get better; or B) expect such a shift will be more damaging (to
> reputations, to development of the new fork, to the community, etc)
> than helpful right now.
>
> >
> > Towards the subtle end of the scale, Go-oo makes it possible to start
> > referring to the Sun codebase as "Sun's tree" rather than "upstream",
> > forcing Sun to earn their reputation as the "true" version of OO.o.
> > Towards the drastic end of the scale, Go-oo could request that Sun pull
> > the patches they're interested in, rather than getting patches pushed at
> > them with whatever extra paperwork they request, putting the cost of
> > Sun's bureaucracy back on Sun's balance sheet.
>
> Interesting strategy; however Sun has shown either A) they don't care
> enough to integrate feature X; or B) they do, but since you won't
> dual-license it and sign an agreement transferring copyright to them,
> they'll just expend their resources writing their own.  Forcing Sun to
> pull would, in essence, be an attempt to force them to abandon their
> practice of having contributors sign a JCA, as anyone dissenting
> against this can contribute to the fork (Go-OO), effectively forcing
> most developers away and creating a bigger community draw to the fork,
> stagnating OOo or forcing them (as I said) to simply abandon the core
> goals of the JCA and pull, pull, pull...
>
> In other words, the "Pull" strategy WILL hurt Sun, and WILL take OOo
> out of their hands; the workload to reproduce significant features
> submitted to Go-OO would pile up too fast, and the project will become
> more and more feature-complete over time.  With the ability to pull
> from Sun's tree without consequence, Sun simply can't catch up to
> this, and can only shut down open source OOo development.  Eliminating
> their JCA would prevent them from shipping Star Office as-is,
> presumably; although Go-OO is LGPL and Sun could get away with using
> modules without LGPL-ing their code if they integrated such code.
>
> That, of course, would be the action of Go-OO or such a fork (though
> Go-OO is probably the largest; OxygenOffice and a few others are based
> on it).  If it does happen, be very worried for Sun's continued
> control over OOo, as it'll be in jeopardy as soon as that fork gains
> momentum.
>
> >
> > So what does this mean for Ubuntu?  Mainly that we need to weigh our
> > actions not only in terms of what produces the best short-term results
> > for users, but also whether the message it sends will improve the
> > process in the long-term.
>
> True.  Again, my interest is in understanding the current situation
> and figuring out what'll happen in the long term; although I wouldn't
> mind getting there faster...
>
> >  As Joe said, publicly ditching the upstream
> > OO.o would send far too negative a

Re: PulseAudio integration with OpenAL

[Chandru]

I have reported the bug at
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/openal-soft/+bug/304255

On Tue, Dec 2, 2008 at 7:34 AM, Luke Yelavich <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> On Tue, Dec 02, 2008 at 12:23:00PM EST, Chandru wrote:
> > Ever since I upgraded to Intrepid, I have been facing an issue with the
> > sound system, which I have discussed here
> > http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=994172
> >
> > As stated there, I have managed to find the solution with help from guys
> at
> > LQ.  Now I'm wondering why this was not the default setting in stock
> Ubuntu
> > install?  Is this an overlooked part of OpenAL - PulseAduio integration?
> > Can a bug be raised against this?  If yes then against which package
> should
> > it be raised?  OpenAL or PulseAudio?
>
> Firstly, the bug should be filed against openal-soft, as thats where the
> change needs to be made.
>
> However, there is a problem with making this change. The pulse device for
> alsa is only available when the pulseaudio alsa plugin is used to send audio
> from alsa applications through pulseaudio.
> Things are set such that if the pulseaudio sound server is not running, the
> pulse device is not available. Without having confirmed it yet myself, I
> dare say that the applicatino using openal would
> stop working or carsh, if alsa says a device does not exist.
>
> If the application does crash, then this change cannot be made, because not
> all flavours of Ubuntu use pulseaudio, Xubuntu and Kubuntu come to mind
> here, and we want to make sure that any uses of
> sound on those flavours are not broken.
>
> If openal is behaving differently when using the default output as opposed
> to using a specific output, then there is something wrong with openal's alsa
> code, so far as I understand things anyway.
>
> I will do some testing myself to confirm all of this, and look into taking
> appropriate action to fix this for jaunty, and where possible, intrepid.
>
> If you could file a bug against openal-soft to make sure this is documented
> somewhere other than a mailing list, that would be great.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Luke
>
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> MNUAoKhI0kKV4TZu0cL7tqb6i/VpQoQw
> =j+qG
> -END PGP SIGNATURE-
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PulseAudio integration with OpenAL

[Chandru]

Hi,

Ever since I upgraded to Intrepid, I have been facing an issue with the
sound system, which I have discussed here
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=994172

As stated there, I have managed to find the solution with help from guys at
LQ.  Now I'm wondering why this was not the default setting in stock Ubuntu
install?  Is this an overlooked part of OpenAL - PulseAduio integration?
Can a bug be raised against this?  If yes then against which package should
it be raised?  OpenAL or PulseAudio?

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Re: Inclusion of a mobile management tool

[Chandru]

One very common use of a mobile management app is backup of contacts.  Apart
from that if need be (not exactly too common), back up text messages.

But beyond that Wammu provides capabilities to manage mobile's calendar, To
Do, etc, etc which can come handy at times.

As I stated it need not be on CD, but moving at least one mobile management
to "main" (please point if it is already there) will provide regular updates
for a pretty useful application.

On Mon, Nov 3, 2008 at 10:51 PM, Martin Owens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> What does the mobile manager do? what does is manage?
>
> There has been a lot of discussion and debate about Hardware Management
> vs Device Capability. Should the manager provide functional access then
> it might work via hal capabilities, if it's configuration or some other
> kind of hardware management then an app might be useful.
>
> Regards, Martin
>
> On Mon, 2008-11-03 at 22:29 +0530, Chandru wrote:
> > Wammu
>
>


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Inclusion of a mobile management tool

[Chandru]

Hi,

Now that almost everyone has got a mobile and most of them connect it to
their PCs, wouldn't it be a good idea to include a decent mobile management
tool like Wammu (there may me better ones but this is what I use)?  Even if
it is not going to be included in the Live CD due to lack of CD space, at
least it could be moved to main so that regular updates are made available.

Now since Wammu is not in main, Intrepid ships with 0.27 which was released
in May, though 0.28 (with quite a few bug fixes) were released in June.

Note: If there already is a Gnome mobile manager in main please let me know.

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Has the Window decoration for Intrepid (Gnome) been finalized?

[Chandru]

Hi,

The window decoration available in Alpha 5 of Intredpid, feels like a step
backward compared to the Window decoration of Hardy.  Has the Window
Decoration to be used finalized for Intrepid?

Is it only me who feels this way or do others feel the same too?

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Intrepid theme

[Chandru]

Hi,

Has the default color scheme for intrepid finalized.  The one used in
Alpha-1 pretty much hurts the eyes and looks very unpolished compared to any
other desktop available today. :(

IS it just me or others feel the same too?

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We choose the brand of our Mobile Phone, Motorbike, Car, Shirt, Shoe, Bread,
etc. Then why not the brand of our OS too?

Pre-loading and forcing Vista on new laptops kills consumers' choice. Fight
for choice of OS just as there is for the Hard Disk capacity in new laptops.
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Re: sound from multiple apps

[Chandru]

I had experienced the exact same problem.  When Rhythmbox is playing a song,
no sound output came from Firefox (Youtube or any Flash site).  Also, AFAIK
GMail uses Flash for audio alerts (not for other parts).

I guess the problem is due to lack of integration of Flash Player with
Pulseaudio (not an Ubuntu fault).  The workaround is very simple.  In System
->Preferences -> Sound choose ALSA for all options (except may be for
"Device" under "Default Mixer Tracks").  This fixed it for me.  Hope it
fixes it for you too.  Ho[e some developer can comment on whether the
problem is due to non-integration of Flash player with Pulseaudio.

On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 7:38 PM, Mackenzie Morgan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> On Thu, Jun 12, 2008 at 3:40 AM, Luke Yelavich <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
>> What does Google Chat use? Flash? Java?
>>
>
> Boring old Javascript.
>
> --
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> apt-get moo
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We choose the brand of our Mobile Phone, Motorbike, Car, Shirt, Shoe, Bread,
etc. Then why not the brand of our OS too?

Pre-loading and forcing Vista on new laptops kills consumers' choice. Fight
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Re: making deals with M$

[Chandru]

This is what I call very good openness.  Hope this continues and a fix to
bug #1 is found soon.  :)

On Mon, Jun 9, 2008 at 10:36 PM, Mark Shuttleworth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>  Mark Fink wrote:
>
> I just read this article:
> http://boycottnovell.com/2008/06/07/ubuntu-remix-codecs/
>
> I hope this is wrong or I will have to stop using ubuntu and find
> another distro to use. Such a shame...
>
>  Mark, Remco
>
> There is (again) absolutely no truth to the rumour that Canonical has done
> a deal with Microsoft for access to codecs - either in return for money, or
> for some other quid-pro-quo.
>
> The recently-announced netbook remix is a prototype of the sort of platform
> that Canonical is working on with OEM's. Those OEM's almost always want to
> make sure that media is *legally* playable by the users who purchase their
> devices, and Canonical will gladly work with companies like Real Media or
> Fluendo to make sure that is possible. If you are an OEM you should be able
> to ship machines based on Ubuntu and not break the law, and if you are an
> individual user you should be able to purchase media codecs and not break
> the law. Those codecs include things like Flash, MP3-4, WMV, QuickTime and
> so on.
>
> That said, I will defend (again) the importance of being willing to work
> with Microsoft, under reasonable and transparent conditions, to further
> goals that we share, if the opportunity arises.
>
> I'm entirely against the idea that any company is "untouchable" - we have
> our values, they have theirs, and it's important to remember that we might
> actually have many things in common. For example, we both have an interest
> in making sure that countries have open and competitive internet access,
> because both Ubuntu and Windows depend on having fast internet access for
> updates. We might well work together to encourage good telecommunications
> policy. To reject that sort of collaboration is, in my mind, just as
> self-defeating as it was for Microsoft to call the GPL "a cancer". The
> reality is that the world is a heterogenous place, and Windows and Linux are
> both real forces that need to be accommodated. That does not mean we need to
> sell out on fundamental principles, as we think some distributions have
> done, but it does mean we need to stay open to the possibility of
> collaboration on terms that we are comfortable with. It's not working with
> Microsoft that would be wrong, it's working with Microsoft in a way that
> undermines free software. And Canonical has not and will not do that.
>
> There is nothing new in what is being done with the netbook remix. It is
> not an edition of Ubuntu. It is not even a real "finished product" - what
> you have are a set of packages that can be used together with Ubuntu to make
> the starting point of an image for an OEM. There is no intentions to put
> proprietary codecs into standard Ubuntu - that would be against our stated
> principles. You are welcome to download and modify any of the pieces
> Canonical has put together for that remix. The remix is more of a statement
> of intent to the OEM industry - that there is an easy to use, classy,
> effective starting point for their devices that is intrinsically Ubuntu
> while still being friendly for "newbie netbook users".
>
> OEM's have always - as long as I have been around - wanted to help users
> with the codec problem. Dell very kindly underwrites the cost of DVD
> playback for people who purchase a machine from them with Ubuntu
> pre-installed, using legal codecs and players. You might well question the
> wisdom of the law that makes it necessary for that to be proprietary, but I
> think Dell deserves praise and thanks for their willingness to help their
> customers make DVD playback work. The more people are using Linux, the more
> awareness there is of free software issues, the more likely it is that laws
> are not written which make it impossible to do things in a free software
> way. I'm proud to be part of the process of bringing free software to a
> wider audience, and don't believe that working with OEM's to make it
> possible for products - or end users - of Ubuntu to achieve their goals
> legally is a setback in that regard.
>
> While I appreciate the vigilance of folks who have expressed concerns on
> this thread, and understand that the role of Canonical within Ubuntu is such
> that we *must* have constant scrutiny of Canonical's decisions by the
> broader community, I would ask that this scrutiny itself be held to a high
> standard. This rumour and thread sprung up with no evidence of a breach of
> trust on the part of Canonical, and escalated into ad hominem attacks that
> are not in keeping with the Ubuntu code of conduct. I encourage people to
> ask questions of their leaders in the community, but not to slander them
> without evidence.
>
> Mark
>
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Re: Banshee by default in Intrepid

[Chandru]

No Banshee by default please.  Apart from Mono dependencies, its memory
consumption is much higher than Rhythmbox and Audio players are always run
in the background when the user is actually doing some other work on the
system.  Wasting RAM on media player is not a good idea.

Apart from that, RB is a great player in itself.  Only thing which is
missing from it is an equalizer by default.  But last time I checked banshee
did not have one too.

- Show quoted text -
On Mon, Jun 9, 2008 at 12:32 AM, Evan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> - Show quoted text -
> On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 2:43 PM, Darren Albers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> 5) Built-in support for last.fm
>
>
> There is a rhythmbox plugin for this included in the default Hardy install.
> If rhythmbox is kept, perhaps there should be a look at enabling it by
> default.
>
> Evan
>
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>


-- 
Chandra Sekar.S
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Re: making deals with M$

[Chandru]

I guess Novell has some sort of protection through the deal.  Because from
what I had read somewhere, there was no mention of Mono in deals wiht others
like Linspire and Xandros but the Novell deal did mention it.

And I have the same doubt as you.  Especially the non-ecma parts like Mono's
implementation of ADO.NET which also is bundled by default in Ubuntu CDs .

On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 11:24 PM, Milosz Derezynski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> Sorry for dropping in.
>
> Has there been any mention of Microsoft that they will never, ever sue
> anyone who uses Mono nor the Mono developers themselves, or is this all
> under the Novell/Microsoft convenant? If they never made such a statement,
> on what else than pure hope that they will never litigate can something like
> Mono be built?
>
> -- Milosz
>
> 2008/6/8 Chandru <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>> Yup much better!!  But it is more than an year.  :D
>>
>> Also, Java has a much more evolved open-source ecosystem around it.  All
>> those extremely high quality Apache projects.  Of course, Java tops among
>> Sourceforge projects too.  It is really unfortunate that Hardy is not
>> shipping with Java.  But yes I can see the CD space constraints coming in.
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 10:36 PM, Mackenzie Morgan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>  On Sun, 2008-06-08 at 22:31 +0530, Chandru wrote:
>>> > No Java is not in the same boat as .Net.  There is no open-source
>>> > version of .Net released by Microsoft.
>>>
>>> OK, fine, it's in the same boat that Java was in a year ago.  Better?
>>>
>>> --
>>> Mackenzie Morgan
>>> http://ubuntulinuxtipstricks.blogspot.com
>>> apt-get moo
>>>
>>> --
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>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Chandra Sekar.S
>>
>> e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Blog: http://tuxychandru.blogspot.com/
>>
>> We choose the brand of our Mobile Phone, Motorbike, Car, Shirt, Shoe,
>> Bread, etc. Then why not the brand of our OS too?
>>
>> Pre-loading and forcing Vista on new laptops kills consumers' choice.
>> Fight for choice of OS just as there is for the Hard Disk capacity in new
>> laptops.
>>
>> --
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>>
>
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-- 
Chandra Sekar.S

e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Blog: http://tuxychandru.blogspot.com/

We choose the brand of our Mobile Phone, Motorbike, Car, Shirt, Shoe, Bread,
etc. Then why not the brand of our OS too?

Pre-loading and forcing Vista on new laptops kills consumers' choice. Fight
for choice of OS just as there is for the Hard Disk capacity in new laptops.
-- 
Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list
Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: 
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Re: making deals with M$

[Chandru]

Yup much better!!  But it is more than an year.  :D

Also, Java has a much more evolved open-source ecosystem around it.  All
those extremely high quality Apache projects.  Of course, Java tops among
Sourceforge projects too.  It is really unfortunate that Hardy is not
shipping with Java.  But yes I can see the CD space constraints coming in.

On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 10:36 PM, Mackenzie Morgan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> On Sun, 2008-06-08 at 22:31 +0530, Chandru wrote:
> > No Java is not in the same boat as .Net.  There is no open-source
> > version of .Net released by Microsoft.
>
> OK, fine, it's in the same boat that Java was in a year ago.  Better?
>
> --
> Mackenzie Morgan
> http://ubuntulinuxtipstricks.blogspot.com
> apt-get moo
>
> --
> Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list
> Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com
> Modify settings or unsubscribe at:
> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
>
>


-- 
Chandra Sekar.S

e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Blog: http://tuxychandru.blogspot.com/

We choose the brand of our Mobile Phone, Motorbike, Car, Shirt, Shoe, Bread,
etc. Then why not the brand of our OS too?

Pre-loading and forcing Vista on new laptops kills consumers' choice. Fight
for choice of OS just as there is for the Hard Disk capacity in new laptops.
-- 
Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list
Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: 
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Re: making deals with M$

[Chandru]

No Java is not in the same boat as .Net.  There is no open-source version of
.Net released by Microsoft.  .Net as a framework is still a proprietary
product of Microsoft.  They are letting Mono survive only because of their
Embrace, Extend and Extinguish scheme.

Not so with Java.  There is an officially GPLed version of Java out there.
You can be 100% sure that Sun is not going to get you into trouble for using
it.  Java is as open as any other open-source language today.  Not so with
.Net and Mono is just an implementation of an older version of .Net.  Mono
can never compete head-on with .Net as it can never implement latest version
of .Net which Microsoft releases.  They always have to play catch up.  If
FOSS has to succeed it must exceed the capabilities of its proprietary
counter-parts.  A good example for us is in Firefox, not in Mono.

On Sun, Jun 8, 2008 at 9:14 PM, Mackenzie Morgan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
> I'm personally not a fan of Mono's dependence on Microsoft's whims, but
> then Java's in pretty much the same boat with Sun, and it's still the
> language I use the most.
>
> --
> Mackenzie Morgan
> http://ubuntulinuxtipstricks.blogspot.com
> apt-get moo
>
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>


-- 
Chandra Sekar.S

e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Blog: http://tuxychandru.blogspot.com/

We choose the brand of our Mobile Phone, Motorbike, Car, Shirt, Shoe, Bread,
etc. Then why not the brand of our OS too?

Pre-loading and forcing Vista on new laptops kills consumers' choice. Fight
for choice of OS just as there is for the Hard Disk capacity in new laptops.
-- 
Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list
Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: 
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss