policy for membership in MOTU key teams

[Stefan Potyra]

Hi,

as evolved by the discussion for motu-sru members, I guess it might make sense 
to have a good general policy.

First off, what key teams do we have?

- motu-sru
- motu-release
- motu-council*

what else?

[*]: There already is a policy. What is good, what is bad about it?

Policy proposals:
- what worked good so far
- what needs improvement
- any good idea?

Please discuss ;).

Cheers,
   Stefan.


signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
-- 
Ubuntu-motu mailing list
Ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: 
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-motu

Re: wanted: motu-sru members

[Stefan Potyra]

Hi,

Am Freitag 23 Mai 2008 18:53:25 schrieb Scott Kitterman:
> > Emilio Pozuelo Monfort wrote:
> >> What is the benefit of 2) ? Can't the MOTU team do the selection in the
> >> voting?
> >> If there's some people motu-sru would remove, I would hope for the MOTU
> >> team to
> >> remove them too in the voting.
> >
> > The large benefit of allowing the existing members of motu-sru to
> > select amoung the volunteers is to ensure that the team works well
> > together.  If there is a removal with which MOTU disagree, such
> > objection ought be raised in response to the motu-sru publication of
> > the candidates.

heh, yeah... and since my request is for additional members to an existing 
team, I guess it's polite to ask them.

> >
> > While I can't be entirely sure, I suspect there will be time
> > between the publication of the slate of candidates and MOTU Council
> > configuring the appropriate polls for selection.
>
> I am strongly opposed to pre-selection.  We have had cases in the past
> where a non-transparent pre-selection process resulted in a very limited
> and from the perspective of at least a significant slice of the community
> very unsuitable set of choices.

Ok, let me make s.th. clear: My proposal so far is aimed at *one* particular 
goal. To get motu-sru back to full strength *now*.

It is *not* meant as a general policy for handling membership for motu 
key-teams. As Emilio noted in the gobby document, we need a good general 
policy, and I fully support this idea.

However for this particular case (and that's why I didn't write s.th. about a 
MOTU vote in my initial mail), I just don't expect that there will be much to 
discuss. So far, only Stephan volunteered (thanks!), so unless more people 
will also volunteer, there won't be even much to vote about ;).

So maybe we can agree to the following:
- everyone volunteering to back up motu-sru please reply in this thread
- in one week (Friday, 30th of May), we'll see how many applicants we have
- and then we'll decide how to proceed, and if s.th. is worthwhile to vote on 
(which I really don't expect so far, but I hope you all prove me wrong by 
volunteering for motu-sru ;)).

And for the general discussion about membership in key teams: I'll start a new 
thread about that, so please use that thread instead. (hah, so at least I 
invented a new tongue twister *g*.)

Cheers,
Stefan.


signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
-- 
Ubuntu-motu mailing list
Ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: 
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-motu

Re: wanted: motu-sru members

[Scott Kitterman]

> Emilio Pozuelo Monfort wrote:
>> What is the benefit of 2) ? Can't the MOTU team do the selection in the
>> voting?
>> If there's some people motu-sru would remove, I would hope for the MOTU
>> team to
>> remove them too in the voting.
>
> The large benefit of allowing the existing members of motu-sru to
> select amoung the volunteers is to ensure that the team works well
> together.  If there is a removal with which MOTU disagree, such
> objection ought be raised in response to the motu-sru publication of
> the candidates.
>
> While I can't be entirely sure, I suspect there will be time
> between the publication of the slate of candidates and MOTU Council
> configuring the appropriate polls for selection.

I am strongly opposed to pre-selection.  We have had cases in the past
where a non-transparent pre-selection process resulted in a very limited
and from the perspective of at least a significant slice of the community
very unsuitable set of choices.

As an organization consisting largely of volunteers, the legitimacy of our
management teams comes from the fact that MOTU have selected them.  Once
there is a pre-selection, this legitimacy is lost.  If someone volunteers
that might be problematic, I think that we should trust the MOTU to do the
right thing.  Personally, I'm not at all opposed to MOTU discussing the
advantages and disadvantages of various candidates.  That would, of
course, include the current motu-sru.  I believe that whatever concerns
there may be that consider motu-sru to want pre-selection, I think that
with some constructive discussion as we move to a vote the can be managed
transparently in an effective way.

Scott K

-- 
Ubuntu-motu mailing list
Ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: 
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-motu

Re: wanted: motu-sru members

[Emmet Hikory]

Emilio Pozuelo Monfort wrote:
> What is the benefit of 2) ? Can't the MOTU team do the selection in the 
> voting?
> If there's some people motu-sru would remove, I would hope for the MOTU team 
> to
> remove them too in the voting.

The large benefit of allowing the existing members of motu-sru to
select amoung the volunteers is to ensure that the team works well
together.  If there is a removal with which MOTU disagree, such
objection ought be raised in response to the motu-sru publication of
the candidates.

While I can't be entirely sure, I suspect there will be time
between the publication of the slate of candidates and MOTU Council
configuring the appropriate polls for selection.

-- 
Emmet HIKORY

-- 
Ubuntu-motu mailing list
Ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: 
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-motu

Re: wanted: motu-sru members

[Emilio Pozuelo Monfort]

Stefan Potyra wrote:
> How about the following:
> 1) applicants reply in this thread
> 2) motu-sru does a preselection
> 3) we'll vote on the result

What is the benefit of 2) ? Can't the MOTU team do the selection in the voting?
If there's some people motu-sru would remove, I would hope for the MOTU team to
remove them too in the voting.

Cheers,
Emilio



signature.asc
Description: OpenPGP digital signature
-- 
Ubuntu-motu mailing list
Ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: 
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-motu

Re: wanted: motu-sru members

[Stefan Potyra]

Hi,

Am Freitag 23 Mai 2008 16:11:30 schrieb Scott Kitterman:
> > Stefan Potyra wrote:
> >> @motu-sru: Once we have a number of applicants, can you select whom
> >> you'd like
> >> to see in your team?
> >
> > Shouldn't that be voted by the entire MOTU team? We need a clear process
> > about
> > this... (/me goes and adds it to the motu-processes Gobby document)
>
> I agree.  That's how we've been appointing members lately.  I vote is
> needed.

To be honest, I don't mind too much how it is done, as long as it is done 
soon.

How about the following:
1) applicants reply in this thread
2) motu-sru does a preselection
3) we'll vote on the result

Regardless of all, 1) needs to happen anyways, so please don't hesitate to 
reply if you are volunteering.

Cheers,
Stefan.


signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
-- 
Ubuntu-motu mailing list
Ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: 
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-motu

Re: wanted: motu-sru members

[Scott Kitterman]

> Stefan Potyra wrote:
>> @motu-sru: Once we have a number of applicants, can you select whom
>> you'd like
>> to see in your team?
>
> Shouldn't that be voted by the entire MOTU team? We need a clear process
> about
> this... (/me goes and adds it to the motu-processes Gobby document)

I agree.  That's how we've been appointing members lately.  I vote is needed.

Scott K


-- 
Ubuntu-motu mailing list
Ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: 
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-motu

Re: wanted: motu-sru members

[Stephan Hermann]

Well,

On Fri, 23 May 2008 15:20:05 +0200
Stefan Potyra <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> I'd like to call for volunteers to supplement the motu-sru team (see
> [1]).
> 
> Requirements:
> * have a good understanding of the SRU process
> * being able to work together with current team members
> * ability to read and judge patches
> 
> If you're up for it, please reply to this thread.
> 
> @motu-sru: Once we have a number of applicants, can you select whom
> you'd like to see in your team?
> 

Count me as candidate...

\sh

-- 
Ubuntu-motu mailing list
Ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: 
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-motu

Re: wanted: motu-sru members

[Emilio Pozuelo Monfort]

Stefan Potyra wrote:
> @motu-sru: Once we have a number of applicants, can you select whom you'd 
> like 
> to see in your team?

Shouldn't that be voted by the entire MOTU team? We need a clear process about
this... (/me goes and adds it to the motu-processes Gobby document)

Cheers,
Emilio



signature.asc
Description: OpenPGP digital signature
-- 
Ubuntu-motu mailing list
Ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: 
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-motu

wanted: motu-sru members

[Stefan Potyra]

Hi,

I'd like to call for volunteers to supplement the motu-sru team (see [1]).

Requirements:
* have a good understanding of the SRU process
* being able to work together with current team members
* ability to read and judge patches

If you're up for it, please reply to this thread.

@motu-sru: Once we have a number of applicants, can you select whom you'd like 
to see in your team?

Cheers,
   Stefan.
--
[1]: 


signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
-- 
Ubuntu-motu mailing list
Ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: 
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-motu

Triaging xine-lib bugs

[Reinhard Tartler]

The following message is a courtesy copy of an article
that has been posted to gmane.linux.ubuntu.bugsquad as well.


In order to deal with the bugs in the xine-lib package, I did write some
guidelines how to triage the crashers bug in a wiki page. I would really
appreciate if the bugsquad people could look at these notes, clean it up
and properly integrate them with the official debugging procedures.

Please note that it is xine-lib specific, I think the instruction could
be worded in a more general way, so that it applies to our other media
packages, including mplayer, vlc, ffmpeg and nearly anything that
uses ffmpeg to play a movie.

Source can be found
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReinhardTartler/DebuggingXineLib, included
inline here for easy commenting (sorry for the long lines):

= Dealing with Xine-Lib Bugs =

Currently on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xine-lib/+bugs, many of the 
bugs are actually crasher bugs, that are pretty difficult to deal with. In 
order to be able to deal with them, we need pretty precise information on the 
cause of the bug.

In previous ubuntu releases, we have been providing debug symbols only using 
ddebs. These ddebs are not availble in PPA archives, so that we cannot produce 
the same meaningful backtraces with backported test packages. In order to fix 
that, the packages in intrepid (and its backports) provide debug symbols 
themselves.

= How can triagers help =

Dear triagers, if you notice a crasher bug, please make sure that the bug is 
complete. Please set the bug to incomplete until the following pieces of 
information are provided:

  * example file that causes the crash
  * exact versions used
  * a backtrace using the latest packages from the motumedia PPA.

= Stock Response for xine-lib bugs =

Thanks for taking your time to report this bug. You have reported a crash in 
the xine-lib library. In order to be able to actually fix this bug, we must be 
able to

  * reproduce it
  * check if it happens with the latest version 
  * understand where it actually crashes

You can help with the first point by attaching an example file to this bug 
report. Please note that a proper attachment is preferred over a link to some 
remote site. Remote side that are password protected or otherwise restriced 
(like services like rapidshare.com and similar) are absolutely not acceptable.

For the 2nd point, the MOTUMedia team provide updated packages for xine-lib and 
ffmpeg in their PPA for past ubuntu releases. See 
http://launchpad.net/~motumedia/+archive for instructions how to enable that 
archive. Please add this repository to your /etc/apt/sources.list, update your 
system and make sure, that you have both packages 'ffmpeg-dbg' and 
'libxine1-dbg' installed (use 'sudo apt-get dist-upgrade && sudo apt-get 
install libxine1-dbg ffmpeg-dbg'). This way, you can produce meaningful 
backtraces that help us with point 3. You can read 
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Backtrace about how to create proper backtraces that 
help developers identifying the exact location of the crash.

Thank you for your cooperation.

-- 
Gruesse/greetings,
Reinhard Tartler, KeyID 945348A4

-- 
Ubuntu-motu mailing list
Ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com
Modify settings or unsubscribe at: 
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-motu