Re: Good communication with upstream is good idea

2008-07-24 Thread Steve Langasek
Hi Neil,

On Sun, Jul 20, 2008 at 05:32:31PM +0100, Neil Williams wrote:
> I ask because emdebian-tools isn't intended for Ubuntu either. See [0] -
> emdebian-tools also depends on server resources provided only by Debian
> (in this case, the package repositories containing compatible packages
> which I can use to generate cross-dependencies).

That doesn't seem particularly Debian-specific, though?  It's not out of the
question that Ubuntu could have an armel port later, and that's the only
thing I can think of that /should/ cause emdebian-tools to be incompatible
with Ubuntu.

> "emdebian-tools is not intended for Ubuntu but I don't have a way of
> encoding that in the package. emdebian-tools is tightly integrated into
> Debian (and Debian unstable in particular) and is, naturally, a Debian
> native package (it was written to support Embedded Debian after all, not
> UbuntuMobile). It isn't intended to work on Ubuntu because Ubuntu does
> not provide the foreign packages needed for linking when cross building,
> those come exclusively from Debian.

So if an armel port of Ubuntu becomes available, is there anything else that
stops emdebian-tools from working with it?

> Same with apt-cross, it is exclusively designed for Debian, Debian mirrors
> and Debian buildd configurations.

How does apt-cross have anything to do with the Debian buildds, at all?
Surely you're not using this as a build-dependency to force Debian
cross-builds on the Debian buildds, are you?

Nor do I see how apt-cross would be affected by differences between a Debian
vs. an Ubuntu mirror.  (Ubuntu main is smaller than Debian main, but is
still self-contained, to be sure.)

> How is emdebian-tools meant to cross-build for ARM on Ubuntu when Ubuntu
> does not provide ARM packages and makes changes to the equivalent Debian
> packages?

Hrm, what changes are at issue here?  The Debian maintainers also make
changes to Debian packages, all the time.  In what way do the Ubuntu changes
differ that makes emdebian-tools incompatible with Ubuntu?

> To me it seems highly unlikely that
> cross versions of Debian packages would install over a Ubuntu base,
> especially when those packages are the typical debootstrap selection
> that have a variety of changes in Ubuntu. I don't run Ubuntu, I have no
> inclination to test for Ubuntu and as no-one else has offered, I cannot
> support Ubuntu."

While the current absence of any official Ubuntu armel port seems like a
pretty good reason to omit emdebian-tools from Ubuntu for the moment, the
fact that the Debian package maintainer or upstream author doesn't support
Ubuntu would not generally be a reason for Ubuntu not to include the
package.  Debian also has any number of upstreams who don't "support"
Debian, after all.

> How many packages could be in this situation? I don't expect it to be
> many. Some form of filter on the Ubuntu side may be necessary.

Yes, there is a blacklist in Ubuntu to prevent certain packages from being
synced from Debian.  Scott Kitterman has already started the process now of
getting emdebian-tools added to that list.

BTW, in your cited blog post, I noticed that you wrote:

> I really don't like Launchpad (I have quite enough web-logins thank you very
> much) or the PTS link that shows Ubuntu bugs that I cannot close from
> Debian.

You can close Launchpad bugs in Ubuntu packages from Debian.  The "LP: ##"
syntax lets bugs get autoclosed when your package is synced to Debian, or
when it's merged by an Ubuntu developer.

Cheers,
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Re: Good communication with upstream is good idea

2008-07-24 Thread Scott Kitterman
On Sunday 20 July 2008 12:05, Florian Weimer wrote:
> * Osamu Aoki:
> > I found some of my packages are offered as a part of Ubuntu archive.
>
> Same here.  In my case (debsecan), it's a bit irresponsible because the
> package doesn't really work on Ubuntu--but it's not readily apparent to
> potential users.  Furthermore, it uses server resources provided to
> Debian, and not to Ubuntu.
>
> What's the correct way to get it out of Unbuntu (universe)?  I don't
> want to relicense it, but if asking politely does not work, it seems to
> be my only choice.

The preferred way of 'asking politely' is a removal bug.  The process is 
described here:

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/PackageArchive?highlight=%28archive%29#head-6a4a4d2ad0cc004c6199f465539e3bbc2239291e

or if you don't want to unwrap the long URL:

http://preview.tinyurl.com/5ce4jk

Other than reading the pacakge description just now, I'm not familiar with the 
package.  Would it make more sense for someone in Ubuntu to adapt the package 
to work in the Ubuntu context than to remove it?  It looks like it would be 
useful there too.

Scott K

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Fwd: [Bug 192868] Re: missing file usr/sbin/argus_linux in i386 package

2008-07-24 Thread Sim
Dear Ubuntu MOTU Developers,
Can You fix this issue in argus-server packages?

Very very thanks!

Best regards

---
Sim


-- Forwarded message --
From: Ole Morten <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 2008/7/21
Subject: Re: [Bug 192868] Re: missing file usr/sbin/argus_linux in i386 package
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


Hi,
Using an older package works.  To fix the package you need to contact the
package maintainer.

Regards,
Ole


On Thu, Jun 26, 2008 at 3:11 PM, Sim <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Can you fix it?
> Thanks!
>
> --
> missing file usr/sbin/argus_linux in i386 package
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/192868
> You received this bug notification because you are a direct subscriber
> of the bug.
>
> Status in Source Package "argus" in Ubuntu: Confirmed
>
> Bug description:
> Binary package hint: argus-server
>
> The file  /usr/sbin/argus_server is a symlink to usr/sbin/argus_linux but
> the file is missing in the i386 package. The file is present in the amd64
> package.
>

--
missing file usr/sbin/argus_linux in i386 package
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/192868
You received this bug notification because you are a direct subscriber
of the bug.

Status in "argus" source package in Ubuntu: Confirmed

Bug description:
Binary package hint: argus-server

The file  /usr/sbin/argus_server is a symlink to usr/sbin/argus_linux
but the file is missing in the i386 package. The file is present in
the amd64 package.

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Re: New model for the mentoring program

2008-07-24 Thread Nicolas Valcarcel
That actually depends on the talker, we can't say them when to give
the sessions. Also keep in mind that work hours in my timezone may not
be at yours, so it's really difficult to manage.


On 7/15/08, Hanno Stock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> First let me tell you, that overall I think that the current proposal is
> a good idea.
>
> Cesare Tirabassi schrieb:
>> All participants in the Mentoring program will be expected to attend MOTU
>> School sessions, and those not in regular attendance may no longer be
>> eligible for Mentoring.
>
> I noticed that the MOTU school sessions often are during work hours (of
> course, since developers are scattered across all timezones). How are
> you about to address this problem?
>
> Greetings,
>
> Hanno
>
>
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Re: Good communication with upstream is good idea

2008-07-24 Thread Kartik Mistry
On Mon, Jul 21, 2008 at 2:13 AM, Steve Langasek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> You can close Launchpad bugs in Ubuntu packages from Debian.  The "LP: ##"
> syntax lets bugs get autoclosed when your package is synced to Debian, or
> when it's merged by an Ubuntu developer.

Thanks Steve, for this.
I can now close bugs without worrying and not having LP account!

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python-xml package changes in hardy

2008-07-24 Thread Révay Gergely
Hi,

sorry to bother you but we got a little confused after upgrading our 
computers to hardy. The thing is that we used the xml.xpath class from 
the python-xml package which worked just fine under gutsy. But after the 
upgrade we had to face that a few things had changed in the whole xml 
handling part of python in the packages of hardy. We found out that the 
python-xml package still has everything what we would need but since it 
is going to be removed it installs itself outside the sys.path. So we 
started to find a way which we could use instead of this. And there is 
the python-4suite-xml package which seems to have the same functionality 
but with an absolutely different structure so we would need to modify 
our codes.
The question I would like to ask whether there is a 'official', defined 
way to get rid of the python-xml package and use something else but 
without modifying the source? Or is there any documentation about these 
changes and the workaround?

Thanks for your help in advance.

Best regards,
Gergely



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Re: Good communication with upstream is good idea

2008-07-24 Thread Neil Williams
On Sun, 2008-07-20 at 12:16 -0400, Scott Kitterman wrote:
> On Sunday 20 July 2008 12:05, Florian Weimer wrote:
> > * Osamu Aoki:
> > > I found some of my packages are offered as a part of Ubuntu archive.
> >
> > Same here.  In my case (debsecan), it's a bit irresponsible because the
> > package doesn't really work on Ubuntu--but it's not readily apparent to
> > potential users.  Furthermore, it uses server resources provided to
> > Debian, and not to Ubuntu.
> >
> > What's the correct way to get it out of Unbuntu (universe)?  I don't
> > want to relicense it, but if asking politely does not work, it seems to
> > be my only choice.
> 
> The preferred way of 'asking politely' is a removal bug.  The process is 
> described here:

Which cannot be done without
yet-another-website-login-combo-to-use-once-and-lose-forevermore -
useless Ubuntu bug tracker. :-(

I do feed info upstream (via yet more website logins), I really can't
add yet another one.

That was the main point of my original blog entry linked from the
previous post. Having to ask the lazy web to sort out bugs in Ubuntu is
just daft, IMHO, but that's what LP requires. As I say, daft.

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Good communication with upstream is good idea

2008-07-24 Thread Osamu Aoki
Hi,

I found some of my packages are offered as a part of Ubuntu archive.
(Practically copied with minor adjustment.) That is good but I felt a
bit strange since I needed to use my time to find it out.

Then, I realized I am no better than the Ubuntu MOTU developers on how to
deal with upstream as Debian Developer.

I think we should encourage packager to contact upstream with simple
"hello!" message and he (or myself) should be part of active upstream ML.

After all, we all are human.  Friendly "hello" always helps people.

I know this is not something we need to have as policy but as a part of
best practice document, it is good to mention.  For Debian, "Developers
Reference".  If I miss it in "Developers Reference", I am sorry.

I also appreciate Ubuntu MOTU developers who port Debian packages to do
the same. (Or Ubuntu employees to encourage such action to their
volunteer.)

For Debian, please continue discussion on Debian list.  If you think
this is valid and have good English skill, please propose patch to
Developers reference.

For Ubuntu, please continue discussion on Ubuntu list while you may CC
me since I do not subscribe to it.

Please, do not flame.  That is not my intension of this posting.  Just a
thought and suggestion to improve human relations in general.

Osamu


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Re: New model for the mentoring program

2008-07-24 Thread Hanno Stock
Nicolas Valcarcel schrieb:
> That actually depends on the talker, we can't say them when to give
> the sessions. Also keep in mind that work hours in my timezone may not
> be at yours, so it's really difficult to manage.

I just mentioned it, because I thought that might need further
discussion, depending on how strictly the regular attendance is enforced.
Generally I think it is a good idea, to expect attendance to MOTU
school. However people willing to contribute despite having a day job
and/or other obligations should not be excepted from Mentoring.
I'd suggest some other way of showing the willingness to enhance one's
skills like doing a test or submitting some kind of "homework", in the
case attendance to school was not possible.

Greetings,

Hanno

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bug in devede -- needs update

2008-07-24 Thread Eric Anopolsky
Hi,

DeVeDe 3.6 sometimes produces DVDs that are not standards-compliant and
in set-top DVD players. According to the author, this has been fixed in
version 3.8.

This is my first message to the list. Is this the right place to request
that the package in 8.04 be updated?

Cheers,
Eric



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Re: Ubuntu (new upstream) rails 2.1.0-1ubuntu1

2008-07-24 Thread Ryan Niebur
The real maintainer uploaded a new package today that fixes the same things as 
my attempted NMU.
You should use his.

On Mon, Jul 21, 2008 at 09:43:31PM -, Ubuntu Merge-o-Matic wrote:
> This e-mail has been sent due to an upload to Ubuntu of a new upstream
> version which still contains Ubuntu changes.  It contains the difference
> between the Ubuntu version and the equivalent base version in Debian, note
> that this difference may include the upstream changes.
> Format: 1.7
> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 12:49:03 -0400
> Source: rails
> Binary: rails
> Architecture: source
> Version: 2.1.0-1ubuntu1
> Distribution: intrepid
> Urgency: low
> Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers 
> Changed-By: Scott Kitterman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Description: 
>  rails  - MVC ruby based framework geared for web application development
> Closes: 475288 484351 490419 491125
> Launchpad-Bugs-Fixed: 236966
> Changes: 
>  rails (2.1.0-1ubuntu1) intrepid; urgency=low
>  .
>[ Ryan Niebur ]
>* Non-maintainer upload.
>* NMU to fix RC bugs.
>* Build depend on rubygems (closes: #490419)
>* Depend on the rubygems package in sid or the one in lenny (closes: 
> #491125)
>  .
>[ Scott Kitterman ]
>* Update to rails 2.1 and grab proposed NMU for Ubuntu so it builds
>  (LP: #236966)
>  .
>  rails (2.1.0-1) unstable; urgency=low
>  .
>* New upstream release
>  + No longer breaks with ruby 1.8.7 (closes: #484351)
>* Use libjs-prototype prototype library instead of upstream
>  bundled (closes: #475288)
>* Added Vcs-* and Homepage data to debian/control
>* doc-base section changed to 'Programming'
> Files: 
>  ecbf24f293152cc67ab242c3e6edbb4b 873 web optional rails_2.1.0-1ubuntu1.dsc
>  c5137842a6132c8c492379d3ec2410f5 11549 web optional 
> rails_2.1.0-1ubuntu1.diff.gz
> Original-Maintainer: Adam Majer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

> diff -pruN 2.1.0-1/debian/changelog 2.1.0-1ubuntu1/debian/changelog
> --- 2.1.0-1/debian/changelog  2008-07-21 22:20:10.0 +0100
> +++ 2.1.0-1ubuntu1/debian/changelog   2008-07-21 22:17:30.0 +0100
> @@ -1,3 +1,17 @@
> +rails (2.1.0-1ubuntu1) intrepid; urgency=low
> +
> +  [ Ryan Niebur ]
> +  * Non-maintainer upload.
> +  * NMU to fix RC bugs.
> +  * Build depend on rubygems (closes: #490419)
> +  * Depend on the rubygems package in sid or the one in lenny (closes: 
> #491125)
> +
> +  [ Scott Kitterman ]
> +  * Update to rails 2.1 and grab proposed NMU for Ubuntu so it builds
> +(LP: #236966)
> +
> + -- Scott Kitterman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  Mon, 21 Jul 2008 12:49:03 -0400
> +
>  rails (2.1.0-1) unstable; urgency=low
>  
>* New upstream release
> diff -pruN 2.1.0-1/debian/control 2.1.0-1ubuntu1/debian/control
> --- 2.1.0-1/debian/control2008-07-21 22:20:10.0 +0100
> +++ 2.1.0-1ubuntu1/debian/control 2008-07-21 22:17:30.0 +0100
> @@ -1,8 +1,9 @@
>  Source: rails
>  Section: web
>  Priority: optional
> -Maintainer: Adam Majer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> -Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 4.0.0), rake (>>0.7.0), rdoc (>>1.8.2), 
> liberb-ruby
> +Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers 
> +XSBC-Original-Maintainer: Adam Majer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> +Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 4.0.0), rake (>>0.7.0), rdoc (>>1.8.2), 
> liberb-ruby, rubygems1.8 | rubygems
>  Standards-Version: 3.8.0
>  Vcs-Browser: http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/rails.git;a=summary
>  Vcs-Git: git://git.debian.org/git/collab-maint/rails.git
> @@ -11,7 +12,7 @@ Homepage: http://rubyonrails.com
>  Package: rails
>  Architecture: all
>  Pre-Depends: dpkg (>= 1.10.24)
> -Depends: ${misc:Depends}, ruby, ruby1.8 (>=1.8.2-3), rake (>>0.7.0), rdoc 
> (>>1.8.2), libsqlite3-ruby1.8 | libpgsql-ruby1.8 | libmysql-ruby1.8 | 
> libdbi-ruby1.8, libredcloth-ruby1.8, liberb-ruby, libruby1.8-extras, 
> rubygems, libjs-prototype
> +Depends: ${misc:Depends}, ruby, ruby1.8 (>=1.8.2-3), rake (>>0.7.0), rdoc 
> (>>1.8.2), libsqlite3-ruby1.8 | libpgsql-ruby1.8 | libmysql-ruby1.8 | 
> libdbi-ruby1.8, libredcloth-ruby1.8, liberb-ruby, libruby1.8-extras, 
> rubygems1.8 | rubygems, libjs-prototype
>  Recommends: irb (>>1.8), libmocha-ruby1.8
>  Conflicts: libdevel-logger-ruby1.8
>  Suggests: libapache2-mod-ruby | libapache-mod-ruby | libapache2-mod-fcgid, 
> libfcgi-ruby1.8


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plptools config error

2008-07-24 Thread Robert Kaiser
Hi,

not sure if this is the right place to post this ... is anyone here 
maintaining the plptools package? 

The plptools in ubuntu (hardy) are malconfigured. The problem manifests itself 
when using the plpprintd daemon. The daemon attempts to access files 
named "fontmap" and "prolog.ps" which it expects to find in 
directory "${prefix}/share/plptools". The correct directory name (for Ubuntu) 
would be "/usr/share/plptools", i.e. ${prefix} is included in a string 
unsubstituted. Rebuilding from source, i managed to work around the problem 
by hand-editing the autogenerated file "include/config.h", 
replacing "${prefix}" by "/usr", but there has got to be a better way to fix 
this in the distro.

Cheers

Rob

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Re: Good communication with upstream is good idea

2008-07-24 Thread Neil Williams
On Sun, 2008-07-20 at 18:05 +0200, Florian Weimer wrote:
> * Osamu Aoki:
> 
> > I found some of my packages are offered as a part of Ubuntu archive.

Have you found any that are not?

> Same here.  In my case (debsecan), it's a bit irresponsible because the
> package doesn't really work on Ubuntu--but it's not readily apparent to
> potential users.  Furthermore, it uses server resources provided to
> Debian, and not to Ubuntu.
> 
> What's the correct way to get it out of Unbuntu (universe)?  I don't
> want to relicense it, but if asking politely does not work, it seems to
> be my only choice.

How would you relicence it in a manner that prevents use in Ubuntu but
retains DFSG compatibility to remain in Debian main?

Trying to ban Ubuntu usage would, AFAICT, fall foul of "discrimination
against fields of endeavour".

I ask because emdebian-tools isn't intended for Ubuntu either. See [0] -
emdebian-tools also depends on server resources provided only by Debian
(in this case, the package repositories containing compatible packages
which I can use to generate cross-dependencies).

"emdebian-tools is not intended for Ubuntu but I don't have a way of
encoding that in the package. emdebian-tools is tightly integrated into
Debian (and Debian unstable in particular) and is, naturally, a Debian
native package (it was written to support Embedded Debian after all, not
UbuntuMobile). It isn't intended to work on Ubuntu because Ubuntu does
not provide the foreign packages needed for linking when cross building,
those come exclusively from Debian. Same with apt-cross, it is
exclusively designed for Debian, Debian mirrors and Debian buildd
configurations. How is emdebian-tools meant to cross-build for ARM on
Ubuntu when Ubuntu does not provide ARM packages and makes changes to
the equivalent Debian packages? To me it seems highly unlikely that
cross versions of Debian packages would install over a Ubuntu base,
especially when those packages are the typical debootstrap selection
that have a variety of changes in Ubuntu. I don't run Ubuntu, I have no
inclination to test for Ubuntu and as no-one else has offered, I cannot
support Ubuntu."

How many packages could be in this situation? I don't expect it to be
many. Some form of filter on the Ubuntu side may be necessary.
Alternatively, is there a package that I can list in Conflicts: that is
only present in Debian derivatives? Yes, any mechanism could be abused
but MOTU-people could always file bugs in the BTS about such usage.

[0] 
http://www.linux.codehelp.co.uk/serendipity/index.php?/archives/122-Migrating-Emdebian-changes-into-Debian,-not-Ubuntu.html

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Stepping down from MOTU & MOTU Release Team

2008-07-24 Thread Sarah Hobbs

Hey there,

Due to a number of factors, I've decided to step away from the MOTU team 
in general, and the MOTU Release Team.


I have been looking to cut down my Ubuntu activities for a few months 
now, and this is one of the areas that I feel needs the greatest time 
commitment to do properly.  It also requires extensive use of launchpad, 
with the constant UI changes, often making things take much longer to 
get done than they should.


I wish you all good luck in the Intrepid Ibex release, and subsequent 
releases.


Hobbsee



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Re: bug in devede -- needs update

2008-07-24 Thread Reinhard Tartler
Eric Anopolsky <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> DeVeDe 3.6 sometimes produces DVDs that are not standards-compliant and
> in set-top DVD players. According to the author, this has been fixed in
> version 3.8.
>
> This is my first message to the list. Is this the right place to request
> that the package in 8.04 be updated?

We have a requirement to first get the package fixed in the current
development release and then consider updated the package in a released
version of ubuntu later on, see [1] for details.

In any case, please file a bug in launchpad first so that this issue can
be properly tracked.

[1] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates

PS: I think a backport might be more appropriate for your request, though.

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Re: bug in devede -- needs update

2008-07-24 Thread Pedro Fragoso
Hey. Reinhard is right, but devede needs to be fixed on Intrepid first and
then backport it to Hardy.
Devede 3.9[1] is sitting on sponsor for a couple of days.


[1] https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/devede/+bug/242162

Best regards,
Pedro Fragoso

On Thu, Jul 24, 2008 at 2:31 PM, Reinhard Tartler <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> Eric Anopolsky <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > DeVeDe 3.6 sometimes produces DVDs that are not standards-compliant and
> > in set-top DVD players. According to the author, this has been fixed in
> > version 3.8.
> >
> > This is my first message to the list. Is this the right place to request
> > that the package in 8.04 be updated?
>
> We have a requirement to first get the package fixed in the current
> development release and then consider updated the package in a released
> version of ubuntu later on, see [1] for details.
>
> In any case, please file a bug in launchpad first so that this issue can
> be properly tracked.
>
> [1] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
>
> PS: I think a backport might be more appropriate for your request, though.
>
> --
> Gruesse/greetings,
> Reinhard Tartler, KeyID 945348A4
>
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Re: Stepping down from MOTU & MOTU Release Team

2008-07-24 Thread Scott Kitterman
On Thursday 24 July 2008 10:53, Sarah Hobbs wrote:
> Hey there,
>
> Due to a number of factors, I've decided to step away from the MOTU team
> in general, and the MOTU Release Team.

I'm sorry to hear this.  Your past contributions have been greatly 
appreciated.

> I have been looking to cut down my Ubuntu activities for a few months
> now, and this is one of the areas that I feel needs the greatest time
> commitment to do properly.  It also requires extensive use of launchpad,
> with the constant UI changes, often making things take much longer to
> get done than they should.

Agreed.  I find this new U/I very difficult and demotivating.  Given that it's 
apparently Launchpad policy not to care about affecting existing users[1], I 
am also really down about this.

> I wish you all good luck in the Intrepid Ibex release, and subsequent
> releases.
>
> Hobbsee

Thanks,

Scott K

[1] http://news.launchpad.net/cool-new-stuff/launchpads-new-look

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REMINDER: Ubuntu MOTU Meeting Friday, July 25th 2008, 20:00 UTC

2008-07-24 Thread Cody A.W. Somerville
Hello MOTU,

A friendly reminder of the fast approaching *Friday, July 25th 2008, 20:00
UTC* meeting.

The meeting agenda is currently empty but the canonical copy where additions
can be made is found at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Meetings

Cheers,

--
Cody A.W. Somerville
Software Engineer
Red Cow Marketing & Technologies, Inc.
Office: 506-458-1290
Toll Free: 1-877-733-2699
Fax: 506-453-9112
Cell: 506-449-5899
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.redcow.ca
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