Re: [ubuntu-uk] No, You Won't See Me on Facebook, Google Plus, nor Skype - Bradley M. Kuhn ( Brad ) ( bkuhn )
On 12/12/11 14:47, Avi Greenbury wrote: > alan c wrote: > >> On 12/12/11 09:13, mac wrote: >> > What do you reckon to Brad's argument?... >> > http://ebb.org/bkuhn/blog/2011/11/24/google-plus.html >> >> Excellent point. >> Using social media which itself undermines the main principle of the >> group you believe in is not sensible, and suggests that the specific >> groups are missing a fundamental point. >> >> It it testament to the skills of the companies concerned that their >> honey trap works so well that the victims do not notice. But that is >> what a honey trap actually is, isn't it? >> > > I've no idea what you're talking about; could you be a bit more > direct/literal please? :) The big social media sites such as facebook, google+ give you as a user, little or no control over your information. This is the opposite of the aims in the principles behind FLOSS. So to run a group, whatever, which has aims to support FLOSS or related ethical actions, using a facility which abuses your core ethical principles, or abuses your group's principles - for example, to run a group supporting FLOSS, say, on facebook, is not sensible in that respect. People will happily sacrifice their freedom for some compelling reason - a honey trap. they become locked in or enslaved. Test this by trying to leave the facility? A bit of research into why 'freedoms' are important can reveal shocking stuff. Not least because once freedom is lost it is very difficult indeed to get it back. It does not only apply to software. -- alan cocks FSF #9005 -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] No, You Won't See Me on Facebook, Google Plus, nor Skype - Bradley M. Kuhn ( Brad ) ( bkuhn )
alan c wrote: > On 12/12/11 09:13, mac wrote: > > What do you reckon to Brad's argument?... > > http://ebb.org/bkuhn/blog/2011/11/24/google-plus.html > > Excellent point. > Using social media which itself undermines the main principle of the > group you believe in is not sensible, and suggests that the specific > groups are missing a fundamental point. > > It it testament to the skills of the companies concerned that their > honey trap works so well that the victims do not notice. But that is > what a honey trap actually is, isn't it? > I've no idea what you're talking about; could you be a bit more direct/literal please? :) -- Avi -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] No, You Won't See Me on Facebook, Google Plus, nor Skype - Bradley M. Kuhn ( Brad ) ( bkuhn )
On 12 December 2011 09:13, mac wrote: > What do you reckon to Brad's argument?... > > http://ebb.org/bkuhn/blog/2011/11/24/google-plus.html > > mac > I wish I could agree 100% with Brad, but we live in the real world. The only app that I can use to make a full AV connection to someone using Windows is Skype. The Empathy guys don't seem to have got the NAT traversal sorted out so I cannot use MSN or Google Talk AV. Sadly, it also sometimes stops me from recommending Ubuntu to Windows users, unless they can use Skype instead of MSN to meet their grandchildren on-line. Tony PS if I'm wrong about Empathy not making AV connections, I would love to know about it. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] No, You Won't See Me on Facebook, Google Plus, nor Skype - Bradley M. Kuhn ( Brad ) ( bkuhn )
On 12/12/11 10:57, Kris Douglas wrote: > On 12 December 2011 10:09, Jon Spriggs wrote: >> (I'd have credited this comment, but I've not seen it in my mail >> stream aside from in someone else's reply, and I don't know who said >> it, as that person cropped the originators name out!) >>> What does "FaiF" stand for, if we are to get anywhere with promotion we >>> need to use PLAIN ENGLISH its fine putting in acronyms as long as they are >>> explained for example >> FaiF was the name of Bradley's podcast (hence, he may not have seen >> the need to explain it, as it will be clearly documented elsewhere on >> his site) and stands for "Free as in Freedom", referring to the >> complications around the word "Free" in the English language where >> Free could refer to Free of Cost or Freedom, meaning, he is interested >> in the Freedom aspect of the word Free. > I will be honest here, I feel that what this person is saying is a > teensy bit hypocritical. He is probably sitting on a PC that is, > electronically speaking, more proprietary than the software he's > using. You can't just expect people not to use proprietary software > because it's not "free", that's like going to a restaurant and > demanding the chef explain exactly how his meal was made and then to add a bit of humour to this, Unless that person is a gentoo user, so not only do you want to know what is in it, you ask for all the ingredients and want to cook it your self. :D > never going back because he refused due to it being a "secret recipe". > I understand that that analogy is a pretty poor one, and this has been > debated to no end for years, but I can't help but feel someone like > that is just closed minded. These companies have to make money, and if > there is a free alternative then yes, by all means use it, but on the > flip side, there's no point demanding other people move away from what > they like. People use Facebook, G+, etc... because they like them, not > because they are tied in with a contract. I think if they didn't like > it they may well move to another platform, and that platform may well > be FLOSS. > > Again, this is just my opinion, I did TL;DR the article because I'm at > work, but at the end of the day, nobody is free from proprietary > software (See what I did there?) and on the other side of it, everyone > at some point will use FLOSS software, to some extent. > I do agree with you, we need to educate users on freedom, the back end of Facebook is still free software eh, if users are educated on freedom they can be more aware of issues and hopefully demand proper respect for their privacy on line and if that fails demand laws that force people to protect privacy. Paul -- -- http://www.zleap.net Join the revolution, switch to Ubuntu http://www.ubuntu.com -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] No, You Won't See Me on Facebook, Google Plus, nor Skype - Bradley M. Kuhn ( Brad ) ( bkuhn )
On 12 December 2011 10:09, Jon Spriggs wrote: > (I'd have credited this comment, but I've not seen it in my mail > stream aside from in someone else's reply, and I don't know who said > it, as that person cropped the originators name out!) >> What does "FaiF" stand for, if we are to get anywhere with promotion we >> need to use PLAIN ENGLISH its fine putting in acronyms as long as they are >> explained for example > > FaiF was the name of Bradley's podcast (hence, he may not have seen > the need to explain it, as it will be clearly documented elsewhere on > his site) and stands for "Free as in Freedom", referring to the > complications around the word "Free" in the English language where > Free could refer to Free of Cost or Freedom, meaning, he is interested > in the Freedom aspect of the word Free. I will be honest here, I feel that what this person is saying is a teensy bit hypocritical. He is probably sitting on a PC that is, electronically speaking, more proprietary than the software he's using. You can't just expect people not to use proprietary software because it's not "free", that's like going to a restaurant and demanding the chef explain exactly how his meal was made and then never going back because he refused due to it being a "secret recipe". I understand that that analogy is a pretty poor one, and this has been debated to no end for years, but I can't help but feel someone like that is just closed minded. These companies have to make money, and if there is a free alternative then yes, by all means use it, but on the flip side, there's no point demanding other people move away from what they like. People use Facebook, G+, etc... because they like them, not because they are tied in with a contract. I think if they didn't like it they may well move to another platform, and that platform may well be FLOSS. Again, this is just my opinion, I did TL;DR the article because I'm at work, but at the end of the day, nobody is free from proprietary software (See what I did there?) and on the other side of it, everyone at some point will use FLOSS software, to some extent. -- Regards, Kris Douglas. www.krisd.eu -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] No, You Won't See Me on Facebook, Google Plus, nor Skype - Bradley M. Kuhn ( Brad ) ( bkuhn )
(I'd have credited this comment, but I've not seen it in my mail stream aside from in someone else's reply, and I don't know who said it, as that person cropped the originators name out!) > What does "FaiF" stand for, if we are to get anywhere with promotion we > need to use PLAIN ENGLISH its fine putting in acronyms as long as they are > explained for example FaiF was the name of Bradley's podcast (hence, he may not have seen the need to explain it, as it will be clearly documented elsewhere on his site) and stands for "Free as in Freedom", referring to the complications around the word "Free" in the English language where Free could refer to Free of Cost or Freedom, meaning, he is interested in the Freedom aspect of the word Free. All the best, -- Jon "The Nice Guy" Spriggs -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] No, You Won't See Me on Facebook, Google Plus, nor Skype - Bradley M. Kuhn ( Brad ) ( bkuhn )
On 12/12/11 09:13, mac wrote: > What do you reckon to Brad's argument?... > http://ebb.org/bkuhn/blog/2011/11/24/google-plus.html Excellent point. Using social media which itself undermines the main principle of the group you believe in is not sensible, and suggests that the specific groups are missing a fundamental point. It it testament to the skills of the companies concerned that their honey trap works so well that the victims do not notice. But that is what a honey trap actually is, isn't it? PS The next meetings of slimmers club will be held at McD's, Pizza world and The local Chinese all you can eat. :-L -- alan cocks -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] No, You Won't See Me on Facebook, Google Plus, nor Skype - Bradley M. Kuhn ( Brad ) ( bkuhn )
On 12/12/11 09:17, javadayaz wrote: > He has a point...but sometimes you have to just get with the > programme/program! > > On Mon, Dec 12, 2011 at 9:13 AM, mac wrote: > >> What do you reckon to Brad's argument?... >> >> http://ebb.org/bkuhn/blog/2011/11/24/google-plus.html >> >> mac >> >> >> -- >> ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com >> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk >> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ >> > What does "FaiF" stand for, if we are to get anywhere with promotion we need > to use PLAIN ENGLISH its fine putting in acronyms as long as they are > explained for example I use Free Libre open source software (FLOSS) after I have put the above (or similar) using FLOSS within the document is easier as I have said what it means. We talk about being OPEN surely this means when we shorten something not assuming someone understand it. Paul -- -- http://www.zleap.net Join the revolution, switch to Ubuntu http://www.ubuntu.com -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
[ubuntu-uk] Newcastle Happy Hour
If anyone is interested in meeting up in Newcastle. Or is already doing so. I would like to link-up and contribute. John -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] No, You Won't See Me on Facebook, Google Plus, nor Skype - Bradley M. Kuhn ( Brad ) ( bkuhn )
He has a point...but sometimes you have to just get with the programme/program! On Mon, Dec 12, 2011 at 9:13 AM, mac wrote: > What do you reckon to Brad's argument?... > > http://ebb.org/bkuhn/blog/2011/11/24/google-plus.html > > mac > > > -- > ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ > -- Regards Javad -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
[ubuntu-uk] No, You Won't See Me on Facebook, Google Plus, nor Skype - Bradley M. Kuhn ( Brad ) ( bkuhn )
What do you reckon to Brad's argument?... http://ebb.org/bkuhn/blog/2011/11/24/google-plus.html mac -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
