Re: [ubuntu-uk] Special bugs, and Live CDs. Help with this Bug please? (Appended Note)
On 11/11/10 15:51, alan c wrote: [snip] I got burned by a nasty bug in the live CD of 10.10 which has the effect of wiping your whole hard drive if you should be so unlucky to choose a particular install option relating to choosing a *partition* (not the whole drive!). [snip] Bug #659106 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/659106 I have drafted a note which I am handing out along with any Ubuntu 10.10 Desktop CDs. (I have a display event tomorrow) === Ubuntu 10.10 Installer Bug Warning Most functions in this installer work fine, and are ok. However: One particular option button in this installer will cause data damage, you are advised to avoid it if you have data anywhere on the hard drive! During the Install Ubuntu process, and from the first of three installer options: 'Install alongside other operating systems'. You are then offered a facility to re-size a partition to allocate drive space. The re-size facility itself has no problems, if you wish to use it please do. However, two more choices are also shown in this display in a pair of buttons: 'Use Entire Partition' and 'Use Entire Disk' Warning: Both of these buttons do the same thing - they use the entire disk, and any other partitions on the disk will be lost. (Reference:Bug #659106) === hth -- alan cocks Ubuntu user -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Special bugs, and Live CDs. Help with this Bug please?
On Thu, 2010-11-11 at 15:51 +, alan c wrote: I got burned by a nasty bug in the live CD of 10.10 which has the effect of wiping your whole hard drive if you should be so unlucky to choose a particular install option relating to choosing a *partition* (not the whole drive!). Seen from a Developers point of view this 'frozen' bug is hardly relevant. Good job they aren't giving them out to friends then. I was lucky - because I've run from LiveCD often, I thought it was taking much too long to start the live demo, and cancelled. Then I got the message saying that the install hadn't finished! I've sent texts and emails to those who I have given a copy to - just glad I didn't give any out at the demo day. Yes, people should have backups - but that doesn't mean we can wipe their hard drives for them! Dianne -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Special bugs, and Live CDs. Help with this Bug please?
On 12 November 2010 09:22, Dianne Reuby pramc...@yahoo.co.uk wrote: On Thu, 2010-11-11 at 15:51 +, alan c wrote: I got burned by a nasty bug in the live CD of 10.10 which has the effect of wiping your whole hard drive if you should be so unlucky to choose a particular install option relating to choosing a *partition* (not the whole drive!). Seen from a Developers point of view this 'frozen' bug is hardly relevant. Good job they aren't giving them out to friends then. I was lucky - because I've run from LiveCD often, I thought it was taking much too long to start the live demo, and cancelled. Then I got the message saying that the install hadn't finished! I do not think there is any suggestion that just booting off the live CD will trash the disk. It is a particular sequence after starting installation that can go wrong. Colin -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Special bugs, and Live CDs. Help with this Bug please?
On Fri, Nov 12, 2010 at 9:35 AM, Colin Law clan...@googlemail.com wrote: On 12 November 2010 09:22, Dianne Reuby pramc...@yahoo.co.uk wrote: On Thu, 2010-11-11 at 15:51 +, alan c wrote: I got burned by a nasty bug in the live CD of 10.10 which has the effect of wiping your whole hard drive if you should be so unlucky to choose a particular install option relating to choosing a *partition* (not the whole drive!). Seen from a Developers point of view this 'frozen' bug is hardly relevant. Good job they aren't giving them out to friends then. I was lucky - because I've run from LiveCD often, I thought it was taking much too long to start the live demo, and cancelled. Then I got the message saying that the install hadn't finished! I do not think there is any suggestion that just booting off the live CD will trash the disk. It is a particular sequence after starting installation that can go wrong. Yes, but *what* particular sequence? Nobody has yet spelled it out, AFAICS. I'd like to know so I can avoid it! -- Liam Proven • Info profile: http://www.google.com/profiles/lproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AIM/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Special bugs, and Live CDs. Help with this Bug please?
On 12 November 2010 09:57, Liam Proven lpro...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, but *what* particular sequence? Nobody has yet spelled it out, AFAICS. I'd like to know so I can avoid it! It's detailed in the bug report linked to in the first mail. Al. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Special bugs, and Live CDs. Help with this Bug please?
I have to say that I installed Ubuntu 10.10 on a different partition on the same disk as Windows XP and all went very smoothly with no problems at all. I can only ascertain from this that only certain hardware is affected. Regards, Andy. On 12 November 2010 10:11, Alan Pope a...@popey.com wrote: On 12 November 2010 09:57, Liam Proven lpro...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, but *what* particular sequence? Nobody has yet spelled it out, AFAICS. I'd like to know so I can avoid it! It's detailed in the bug report linked to in the first mail. Al. -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Special bugs, and Live CDs. Help with this Bug please?
On 12/11/10 10:24, Andy Braben wrote: I have to say that I installed Ubuntu 10.10 on a different partition on the same disk as Windows XP and all went very smoothly with no problems at all. I can only ascertain from this that only certain hardware is affected. I do not believe it is related to hardware, but if it is, then more information would be most welcome. It is easily possible to install into a nominated partition using the Advanced options, perhaps that is what you chose? The bug report details exactly what you need to do to get the problems! -- alan cocks Ubuntu user -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Special bugs, and Live CDs. Help with this Bug please?
On Fri, Nov 12, 2010 at 10:11 AM, Alan Pope a...@popey.com wrote: On 12 November 2010 09:57, Liam Proven lpro...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, but *what* particular sequence? Nobody has yet spelled it out, AFAICS. I'd like to know so I can avoid it! It's detailed in the bug report linked to in the first mail. OK, read that now, but I don't see what the specific unusual event here was meant to be. The only thing that sounds odd in there are the 3 unlisted hidden partitions. MBR only allows for a total of 4 primary partitions, and 3 were listed there - Dell recovery, Windows the extended one. Adding 1 new ones would cause problems. I am not following what is meant to have gone wrong. When one chooses use entire partition, what do people /expect/ to happen if no specific partition is chosen? Is the setup program meant to be smart enough to automatically use the Linux FS and not the Windows one? That seems to me to be a terrifying assumption to make before installing an OS. I'd not be surprised if it chose the first. The only situations I'd consider safe to proceed would be: [a] I'd freed up some unpartitioned space and wanted it to use that, or [b] I only had 1 partition and told it to resize this, on the basis that there was nothing else to resize. Personally, this is why I always, *always* do it manually in expert mode. I would not trust any program to decide intelligently in such a critical situation. -- Liam Proven • Info profile: http://www.google.com/profiles/lproven Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk • GMail/GoogleTalk/Orkut: lpro...@gmail.com Tel: +44 20-8685-0498 • Cell: +44 7939-087884 • Fax: + 44 870-9151419 AIM/Yahoo/Skype: liamproven • MSN: lpro...@hotmail.com • ICQ: 73187508 -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Special bugs, and Live CDs. Help with this Bug please?
On 12 November 2010 11:33, Liam Proven lpro...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Nov 12, 2010 at 10:11 AM, Alan Pope a...@popey.com wrote: On 12 November 2010 09:57, Liam Proven lpro...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, but *what* particular sequence? Nobody has yet spelled it out, AFAICS. I'd like to know so I can avoid it! It's detailed in the bug report linked to in the first mail. OK, read that now, but I don't see what the specific unusual event here was meant to be. The only thing that sounds odd in there are the 3 unlisted hidden partitions. MBR only allows for a total of 4 primary partitions, and 3 were listed there - Dell recovery, Windows the extended one. Adding 1 new ones would cause problems. I am not following what is meant to have gone wrong. When one chooses use entire partition, what do people /expect/ to happen if no specific partition is chosen? Is the setup program meant to be smart enough to automatically use the Linux FS and not the Windows one? That seems to me to be a terrifying assumption to make before installing an OS. I'd not be surprised if it chose the first. If one says use entire partition when it is not obvious _which_ partition then an error should be displayed. In no circumstances would one expect it to overwrite _multiple_ partitions. That would be an option labeled use multiple partitions that you probably don't actually want trashed. Colin -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Special bugs, and Live CDs. Help with this Bug please?
I wasn't trying to install - I was just trying to run from LiveCD to check for hardware issues. Although I chose that option, it chuntered away for several minutes before I decided that it wasn't loading. When I chose Cancel, it told me the installation was still in progress. It left me thinking Whoops, could have been nasty! And for any first-timer, who wanted to try before installing, it would be a nerve-racking experience! Dianne -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Special bugs, and Live CDs. Help with this Bug please?
On 12 November 2010 13:18, Dianne Reuby pramc...@yahoo.co.uk wrote: I wasn't trying to install - I was just trying to run from LiveCD to check for hardware issues. Although I chose that option, it chuntered away for several minutes before I decided that it wasn't loading. When I chose Cancel, it told me the installation was still in progress. I suspect that was just a misleading message. I don't believe there is any way that it would start installing without asking first. It can take a good number of minutes to get going on the live CD, dependent on drive speed I suppose. Colin It left me thinking Whoops, could have been nasty! And for any first-timer, who wanted to try before installing, it would be a nerve-racking experience! Dianne -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/ -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Special bugs, and Live CDs. Help with this Bug please?
On 12/11/10 09:57, Liam Proven wrote: Yes, but *what* particular sequence? Nobody has yet spelled it out, AFAICS. I'd like to know so I can avoid it! It's listed in the bug in the original post. -- Glen Mehn glen.m...@oba.co.uk skype: glenmehn | blog: http://glen.mehn.net/mba UK: +44(0)7942 675 755 | US: +1 415 704 4737 -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
Re: [ubuntu-uk] Special bugs, and Live CDs. Help with this Bug please?
On 12/11/10 11:33, Liam Proven wrote: On Fri, Nov 12, 2010 at 10:11 AM, Alan Popea...@popey.com wrote: On 12 November 2010 09:57, Liam Provenlpro...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, but *what* particular sequence? Nobody has yet spelled it out, AFAICS. I'd like to know so I can avoid it! It's detailed in the bug report linked to in the first mail. OK, read that now, but I don't see what the specific unusual event here was meant to be. The only thing that sounds odd in there are the 3 unlisted hidden partitions. MBR only allows for a total of 4 primary partitions, and 3 were listed there - Dell recovery, Windows the extended one. Adding1 new ones would cause problems. Are you looking at a different bug? I do not see those words in bug #659106 (?) I am not following what is meant to have gone wrong. When one chooses use entire partition, what do people /expect/ to happen if no specific partition is chosen? The partition *is* in fact identified. It is identified by the installer during the early stages, although it is *not* nominated by the user. It is displayed as (for example) /dev/sda2 or whatever. The partition which is the current target for resizing (and more) is clearly indicated by the installer. It is displayed in the legend in the gui (centre screen) as you are taken into the resize (gui with slider) display. It is the partition which is about to be edited - resized, or whatever. And it is this same actual display which also includes the two buttons (whole partition button, and whole drive button). So the partitioner identifies a partition for amendment, in accord with users earlier choices. Note that in this installer, the user does *not* nominate the partition to be resized/used, the installer itself takes this decision. It seems to choose the largest partition as suitable, which makes good sense for many newcomers. The bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/659106 [extract] = (test) Use a single hard drive PC with disposable drive contents. I used an Ubuntu 10.10 Desktop Live CD (32 bit in my case) md5 checked and also CD self checked ok. I created two partitions on the drive, one NTFS and one ext4. It did not make much difference ultimately however I deliberately made one partition bigger than the other, using a number of size conditions. I began the install process, chose 'Install alongside other operating systems'. Then I chose the option button 'Use Entire Partition' (note: I carefully deliberately avoided 'the whole drive') I could see that the partitioner had identified a partition, and it was shown in the GUI display in a valid way (eg /dev/sda5) and I could also see the resizing option slider, which I did not use. I was confident that 'Use Entire Partition' meant what it said, I proceeded. === I would guess that it is simply a case that some code in this installer option is not quite fully functional. The bug originator looked into the partition table and saw anomalies, however as a less expert victim all I saw was a trashed DRIVE. Note: I confirm comments elsewhere that the other installer options seem to work perfectly well, including the partition resizing, which is of course the action which almost all newcomers will want to use. -- alan cocks Ubuntu user -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
[ubuntu-uk] Special bugs, and Live CDs. Help with this Bug please?
I use a lot of Live CDs, the Desktop editions. Mostly I distribute them in various ways. The quantities are sometimes quite large. Also I am active on various forums, acting in an outreach way, to give a profile to GNU/Linux, particularly Ubuntu. I am not a developer but I am an active advocate and helper and supporter of Ubuntu newcomers. I am retired, so this is close to a full time occupation. :-) Live CDs are frozen in time, a snapshot of the amazing forward speed of GNU/Linux development. While bugs in an installed system are likely to be washed away by the flux of updates, any bug in a Live CD is going to stay there, in the plastic disc, awaiting use, becoming irrelevant only when history decides. I got burned by a nasty bug in the live CD of 10.10 which has the effect of wiping your whole hard drive if you should be so unlucky to choose a particular install option relating to choosing a *partition* (not the whole drive!). Seen from a Developers point of view this 'frozen' bug is hardly relevant. I mentioned it in the Mint forums for their RC version, because unlike Ubuntu, Mint still have the opportunity to fix it before final release. The information received little attention, including one response that said such as 'the bug only affects two people, it is not so important, anyway people should have backups'. A bit harsh, I thought. I was using a machine specifically for tests. It had a couple of hard drives, and multibooted several versions of Ubuntu, and Windows. In a test machine data is not an issue, I just reinstall of course. Reinstalling Windows was a real pain. I did have an image, but would you like to guess where it was? in a *data* partition well away from the Windows partition, but on that drive. With macabre humour I could see that this might be one way to get rid of Windows.., ( :-) ) although I suspect it might muddy the Ubuntu waters and reputation a bit. This bug will 100 per cent affect anybody who choses the option I did. Your drive will be wiped. Data partitions, Windows if you use it, and other distributions co-existing. Gone. The blessing is that few people will choose that particular option. That is a good thing because I fear for the wider reputation of Ubuntu if it affected many people. It has in its title, Windows partitions, but it does not discriminate, it will wipe all partitions. How can we ensure this bug is fixed and not carried forward to the next release? If you think you can help, please see Bug #659106 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/659106 tia -- alan cocks Ubuntu user #10391 Linux user #360648 -- ubuntu-uk@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/
