Re: Windows Standalone Performance

[Pi Digital via use-livecode]

Hi Neville

From my stance I have never seen this behaviour for any version of LC from any 
stack ide or standalone on Mac, Windows XP/7/8/10 native or via 
ParallelsDesktop. Perhaps you could do a few screen recordings using an 
external device like your phone and show the task manager reporting drive 
activity and processor activity. This would give a better understanding or your 
case scenario. 

All the best.  

Sean Cole
Pi Digital Prod Ltd

> On 12 Dec 2019, at 00:33, Neville via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> This bug was reported some time ago 
> https://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=21305 
> 
> 
> Saving a 9 megabyte stack in Windows 10 can take 10 seconds or more.
> 
> It is not caused by Windows Defender or anti-virus software.
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AW: Re: OT: HTML img src and Windows problem

[Paul Dupuis via use-livecode]

On 12/11/2019 6:38 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode wrote:
This is not directly related to LiveCode. I amwriting a bunch of html 
from LiveCode to a local .html file. In it there are image tags to 
images in the same location as the .html file, so an image tag in the 
HTML might be:




Not matter what browser I open the HTML file in under Windows 10 
(Firefox or Chrome), the image links are broken. When I roll over one 
(such as the above) it shows


file:///C:/Users/paul/Desktop/help/img-500227-PDF.gif

My understanding of HTML src paths is that for just a file NAME, the 
browser should look in the same folder as the html page file?


Anyone know what you need to do to get relative image source paths to 
work in HTML written from LiveCode?




User error. The images were all "bad" because I was using export image 
.. to file tFile and forgetting the "as . I assumed that if you 
didn't specify the format, it would export in the format the image was 
in (i.e. gif to gif).


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Re: Windows Standalone Performance

[Neville via use-livecode]

This bug was reported some time ago 
https://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=21305 


Saving a 9 megabyte stack in Windows 10 can take 10 seconds or more.

It is not caused by Windows Defender or anti-virus software.
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Re: OT: HTML img src and Windows problem

[hh via use-livecode]

This is all OK assuming your html file is in
/Users/paul/Desktop/help/.

It works here with all modern browsers.

The error is caused somewhere else in your webpage.

Contains the char-attribute a gremlin or did you set
a conflicting base url?

You could use the WebInspector of the browser to see
what's going on.

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OT: HTML img src and Windows problem

[Paul Dupuis via use-livecode]

This is not directly related to LiveCode. I amwriting a bunch of html 
from LiveCode to a local .html file. In it there are image tags to 
images in the same location as the .html file, so an image tag in the 
HTML might be:




Not matter what browser I open the HTML file in under Windows 10 
(Firefox or Chrome), the image links are broken. When I roll over one 
(such as the above) it shows


file:///C:/Users/paul/Desktop/help/img-500227-PDF.gif

My understanding of HTML src paths is that for just a file NAME, the 
browser should look in the same folder as the html page file?


Anyone know what you need to do to get relative image source paths to 
work in HTML written from LiveCode?




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Re: Animated Gifs - Keep them Running

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I read and agree. I think certain tasks ought to have independent threads 
separate from the code engine. That shouldn't be too hard to implement, and 
those tasks would not need to communicate with the main thread, since they are 
essentially utilitarian in nature. 

Bob S


> On Dec 10, 2019, at 20:57 , Richard Gaskin via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami wrote:
> 
> > I switched from the mobileIndicator to installing an animated gif for
> > Loading. This way I have control over the load process and can let
> > users bail out.
> >
> > It is a lovely gif, but it "hangs" when the processor on phone is
> > doing something else. It there are way to keep it's frames "circling"
> > until get we get a good download and dismiss it / vis is false?
> 
> 
> http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-livecode/2019-December/257512.html
> 
> -- 
> Richard Gaskin
> Fourth World Systems
> Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web


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Re: Windows Standalone Performance

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

I like that. Looking on the bright side. :-) And of course you are right, 
saving multiple times is not a good thing, but I did this back when we had that 
bug where saving scripts actually didn't for whatever reason, and I had some 
crash to desktop issues as well, prompting me to insert an auto save whenever a 
stack was closed. 

We are past that now, so I am going through my code and removing all that, 
saving prefs when I close the app, and when making changes to the settings, and 
at no other time. 

Bob S


> On Dec 11, 2019, at 12:13 , Curry Kenworthy via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> > No one is going to turn off their file AV
> 
> LOL - yes, but that would be entirely your idea, not mine.
> 
> As I said, yet another reason to code with care.
> 
> Saving a stack multiple times while launching is not a good habit. Bad habits 
> add up to hurt Mac apps too.
> 
> The AV did you a favor with exaggerated symptoms to highlight that weakness 
> in your code. Not just a Windows problem. If you applied the fix for all 
> platforms, you now have better Mac code too.


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Re: Windows Standalone Performance

[Curry Kenworthy via use-livecode]

> No one is going to turn off their file AV

LOL - yes, but that would be entirely your idea, not mine.

As I said, yet another reason to code with care.

Saving a stack multiple times while launching is not a good habit. Bad 
habits add up to hurt Mac apps too.


The AV did you a favor with exaggerated symptoms to highlight that 
weakness in your code. Not just a Windows problem. If you applied the 
fix for all platforms, you now have better Mac code too.


Best wishes,

Curry Kenworthy

Custom Software Development
"Better Methods, Better Results"
LiveCode Training and Consulting
http://livecodeconsulting.com/

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Re: Groups in the message path: Trapping Mouseup

[Mark Wieder via use-livecode]

On 12/10/19 9:20 PM, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode wrote:

The Message Path discussion starts on p 101, with a pretty good diagram 
on p 102, including a distinction between Groups and Backgrounds.


OMG - there's documentation?  Admittedly I haven't looked at the User 
Guide in quite a while.
That is indeed a fair diagram of the message path, although yours is 
more up-to-date by including behaviors.


--
 Mark Wieder
 ahsoftw...@gmail.com

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Re: Groups in the message path: Trapping Mouseup

[Brian Milby via use-livecode]

The PDF files are generated from .md files.  The guides are split between
two locations:
https://github.com/livecode/livecode/tree/develop/docs/guides
https://github.com/livecode/livecode-ide/tree/develop/Documentation/guides

Thanks,
Brian

On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 12:21 AM Richard Gaskin via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

>
> PS: I was going to include a link to the Github repo for anyone who
> might want to help with errata or enhancements to the docs, but I
> couldn't find the PDF sources in the /docs folder.  What am I missing?
>
> --
>   Richard Gaskin
>   Fourth World Systems
>   Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
>   
>   ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com
>
>
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Re: Groups in the message path: Trapping Mouseup

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Richard, I'm not sure you were posting this to the right forum. You see, this 
is the Livecode forum. We don't need no stinking User Guides! :-)

Bob S


> On Dec 10, 2019, at 21:20 , Richard Gaskin via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Paul Dupuis wrote:
> > Richard Gaskin, at one point, had a really excellent diagram of the
> > LiveCode message hierarchy. If he sees this post and still has it
> > perhaps he could post a link to it.
> 
> Still there:
> https://www.fourthworld.com/embassy/articles/revolution_message_path.html
> 
> Since I made that back in the day (the file name hints at its age), I've 
> discovered a pretty great resource mysteriously unknown in our community, but 
> surprisingly comprehensive and includes a nearly identical diagram.
> 
> It has more than 650 pages of comprehensive info on using LiveCode, broken 
> down into well organized sections and subsections, often with illustrations 
> and screen shots, all put together in a well-indexed PDF.
> 
> They call it "LiveCode User Guide", and it's been secretly bundled with every 
> release of LiveCode for several years. :)
> 
> I'm having fun there, but seriously, the User Guide has been pretty good in 
> recent years. I'm often surprised at how the answers to many forum questions 
> are covered well in it, yet when I ask about it most people don't even notice 
> that it's there, the second-from-the-top item in LC's Help menu.
> 
> The Message Path discussion starts on p 101, with a pretty good diagram on p 
> 102, including a distinction between Groups and Backgrounds.
> 
> In fact, p 105 includes a discussion of that distinction far more concise yet 
> no less helpful than my longish post here the other day.
> 
> 
> PS: I was going to include a link to the Github repo for anyone who might 
> want to help with errata or enhancements to the docs, but I couldn't find the 
> PDF sources in the /docs folder.  What am I missing?
> 
> -- 
> Richard Gaskin


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Re: Windows Standalone Performance

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Easy enough to test. I'll do that later and get back with results. It's 
definitely worth exploring, but I can short cut that a bit by saying that since 
virtually everyone with any sense has some kind of protection, even if it's 
Windows Defender, but also other protection on top of that, the exercise is 
somewhat academic. No one is going to turn off their file AV and simply 
trusting the app may not be enough to disable file checking operations. 

Bob S


> On Dec 10, 2019, at 18:29 , Curry Kenworthy via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Bob:
> 
> > Since I do a lot of setup, I was saving the stack(s) multiple
> > times just launching the app! And it was killing the performance.
> 
> Behold the antivirus. One more reason to code with care
> 
> This time it did you a favor; these habits add up to hurt Mac apps too.
> 
> Best wishes,
> 
> Curry Kenworthy
> 
> Custom Software Development
> "Better Methods, Better Results"
> LiveCode Training and Consulting
> http://livecodeconsulting.com/
> 
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Re: Windows Standalone Performance

[Richard Gaskin via use-livecode]

Bob Sneidar wrote:

> Just wanted to give a heads up on what I think is the greatest Windows
> Standalone performance killer.
..
> On a Mac, for whatever reason, the performance hit was insignificant.
> On WINDOWS however, it became painfully clear to me that the
> performance penalty was VERY substantial! I can watch the folder
> containing the standalone stacks, see the temp files being created,
> one mississippi, two mississippi, three mississippi, around 4
> misssissippi the temp file goes away.

Assuming similar storage specs, it may be that Windows is inherently 
slower than Unix (possibly), or maybe LC less optimized there (likely).


But such a dramatic difference with that specific evidence merits 
another test.


Windows Explorer definitely has a longer default period between 
automatic directory listings than the macOS Finder.  You can see it in 
many contexts.


Maybe better would be to set the cursor to watch on save, and time that.

Better still might be to time the milliseconds from the beginning of the 
save until after the OS returns control to your script when it's done.


I suspect you'll still see a difference, but not nearly as dramatic as 
the slower refresh rates in the file manager UI.


--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World Systems
 Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
 
 ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com


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